inetprogood morning05:52
Kiloshi all14:10
* inetpro thinking about web developer access to web server file systems14:59
inetprosince FTP should die, how do you handle access to web server resources for web developers?14:59
tumbleweedsftp (i.e. ssh)15:08
tumbleweedor webdav, possibly. More stuff supports it15:08
inetprotumbleweed: samba?15:35
tumbleweedI wouldn't be too comfortable with running a samba on the public internet15:35
inetprotumbleweed: no, not on the public side15:36
tumbleweedthat's fine then15:37
tumbleweedof course you may be happier with a deployment system where they don't have direct access to the webroots, but rather have to commit to a repo15:37
inetprotumbleweed: now that sounds like the right thing to do15:38
inetprobut web devs want immediate results15:38
tumbleweedgive them a staging server too :)15:39
tumbleweedwhere all their commits are published immediately15:39
inetprotumbleweed: how?15:39
tumbleweedcronjob that pulls from the repo?15:40
tumbleweedyou can achieve almost-immediately with a commit hook15:40
inetprook, when you say commit, what would you use for that?15:41
tumbleweeda VCS15:41
inetprohmm... 15:42
inetprolet me ponder about this15:42
inetproour web devs are still on Windows15:43
tumbleweedalmost all the populer VCSs work perfectly on windows (even if windows is a horrible environment for development :P )15:43
inetprook, and what VCS would you suggest?15:44
tumbleweedone they can get along with. These days that's probably svn or git15:44
tumbleweedI'd avoid svn and go for something distributed, but that can be more copmlex to use15:44
tumbleweedinetpro: but you need to spend some time getting familiar with VCSs before you can make other people use them :)15:45
inetprotumbleweed: I have used cvs, svn and a bit of bzr15:47
inetprojust the users have never used it, at least not that I know of15:47
tumbleweedaah, that's not so bad then15:48
inetprothe reason I'm pondering about it is because I need to think about allowing more than a single developer on sites like drupal15:49
inetprowant to work out a practicable solution that will keep us going for some time15:51
inetprotraditionally we've had a lot of sites with simple static info, which is easy to manage15:51
superflygit is overcomplicated15:58
inetprook let's think for the moment about the production side first, assume that the dev environment is sorted and version controlled16:00
inetprowould you use rsync to sync it all?16:00
inetproto sync to production*16:01
inetprowould you agree that production does not need a VCS16:03
superflyinetpro: we actually just do an update from svn16:06
inetprosuperfly: please explain16:06
superflyinetpro: we type in "svn up"16:07
inetprosuperfly: you mean directly to a production system?16:07
marcogis it a critical production system?16:08
superflywe have a VCS and deployment strategy in place to prevent untested code from getting onto the live servers16:09
marcogi'm thinking more of an update failing halfway16:10
superflymarcog: we're deploying python apps... if the svn up falls over, the deployment won't continue16:11
marcogah ok16:12
tumbleweedit doesn't sound like this is incredibly critical if the devs can currently write directly to the webroot16:12
tumbleweedso you also don't want to suddendly jump into an overly-bureaucratic system16:13
tumbleweedsuperfly: is bzr ok on windows? (are there decent gui bits). svn has the advantage of being built into many IDEs, which windows people seem to like16:14
superflytumbleweed: Bzr Explorer works on Windows, and there's also TortoiseBzr (which I prefer if I'm on Windows)16:14
tumbleweedmarcog: non-SVN/CVS VCSs probably wont have the problem of updates failing half-way16:15
tumbleweedi.e. update local repo first then update the checkout from that16:15
marcogtumbleweed: wasn't aware of that16:17
marcogalthough superfly mentioned they use svn16:17
tumbleweedwell if you have disk failure / permissions issues / local modifications, you could still get a partial update failure, I guess16:18
Kiloscorrie206, ping18:11
inetprosuperfly: Marble 1.0.0 now available in Maemo extras http://nienhueser.de/blog/?p=29520:44
* superfly looks to see if he can install it20:46
inetprosuperfly: you still happy with your N900?20:47
superflyinetpro: I'm LOVING it20:47
superflyit's the BEST phone I've ever had20:47
* superfly installs Marble20:50
inetprosuperfly: Thanks to some clever detective work by the guys at NokiaPort, who unearthed the specs from a MeeGo bug report, it looks possible that the N9 will have a dual-core 1.6 GHz Intel Moorestown processor, a 200 MHz graphics unit that drives a 480×854 pixel display, 1 GB RAM and an Infineon 3G modem that supports HSPA+ speeds (21 Mbps downlink). 20:52
* inetpro can't wait to see that20:54
superflyinetpro: the N900 is Nokia's iPhone killer :-P just that they don't regard it as such20:55
inetprosuperfly: maybe next month I will decide what to get20:56
superflynight folks21:01
inetprogood night superfly21:04
deegee_superfly: g'dnight21:06

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