/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/02/09/#ubuntu-x.txt

RAOFSeems about right.00:07
RAOFHah, yes.  There it is.02:26
brycehgood bye McCreary desktop.  hello sandybridge desktop02:38
RAOFOoooh funky.02:40
LLStarksyup, that graphical corruption from bug 710961 can be reliably replicated while scrolling sites in firefox.03:01
ubot4Launchpad bug 710961 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu) "[i945gm] Screen Corruption with new Xorg stack (affects: 4) (heat: 22)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/71096103:01
LLStarksshut up ubot03:01
LLStarksj/k love ya03:02
RAOFOk, that's useful to know.03:30
tjaaltonmvo: looks like bug 614993 has some people complaining about the same upgrade issue I had yesterday, removing nouveau was the cure10:28
ubot4Launchpad bug 614993 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) (and 2 other projects) "10.04 -> 10.10 upgrade fails: pkgProblemResolver::Resolve generated breaks: xserver-xorg-video-v4l demoted to universe (affects: 46) (dups: 11) (heat: 250)" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/61499310:28
tjaaltonwith logs, even10:28
mvotjaalton: hm, fix released, is the fix incomplete?10:29
tjaaltonmvo: they hijacked the bug.. :/10:31
mvobää10:31
tjaalton:)10:32
tjaaltonI could open a new one and ask them to join10:34
=== evilvish is now known as vish
mdeslaurA small Haiku to sum up my feelings this morning:13:44
mdeslaurNouveau drives my card,13:44
mdeslaurMakes my graphics open-source.13:44
mdeslaurPlease stop freezing though!13:44
tjaaltonyes, likely a kernel bug13:46
tjaaltonyou can try vanilla 2.6.36 and see if that helps :)13:46
tjaaltonapparently the changes in .37 broke it13:47
tjaaltonwell, causes a hang that I'm seeing13:47
mdeslaurtjaalton: and it's still not fixed in .38?13:48
tjaaltonno13:48
tjaaltonsee fdo bug 3399913:48
ubot4Launchpad bug 33999 in kubuntu-meta (Baltix) (and 1 other project) "/dev/ram Alert! does not exist (DVD install) (dup-of: 27539)" [Medium,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/3399913:48
ubot4Launchpad bug 27539 in ubuntu "issue in booting live dvd (dups: 1) (heat: 1)" [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2753913:48
tjaaltonbah13:48
tjaaltonfreedesktop bug 3399913:48
* mdeslaur kicks ubot413:48
ubot4Freedesktop bug 33999 in Driver/nouveau "2.6.37 - NV11 crashes X if glxgears started" [Normal,New] http://bugzilla.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3399913:49
tjaaltonthe same trace with my nv5013:49
mdeslaurtjaalton: ah, yes, I get that with libgl1-mesa-dri-experimental installed. But, I don't have it installed right now, and am getting freezes 3-4 times a day.13:50
tjaaltonmdeslaur: hmm yes, could be related or not13:51
tjaaltonseen it too13:51
=== yofel_ is now known as yofel
tseliottjaalton: is the kernel in xorg-edgers Natty's kernel?14:35
Sarvatttseliot: yep it is14:35
tseliotSarvatt: ok, thanks14:35
pwnguinhad a random question from a frustrated user. they want to remove -nouveau but leave other x drivers intact22:05
pwnguinwhy does xserver-xorg-video-all use depends vs recommends?22:05
RAOFBecause it's not essential itself.22:10
dandelI don't know about removing the driver, however, it's easy enough to disable (Blacklist the nouveu module), or boot with the xforcevesa boot option added.22:10
RAOFie: there's no penalty to not having xserver-xorg-video-all installed.22:10
pwnguinthe complaint is that debian dependencies are too complicated, unlike arch22:11
pwnguinso when you go to remove nouveau, it asks to remove -all, and then autoremove everything else22:11
dandelhmm... sounds like your request is to lighten the cd load a bit by using vesa or vga driver by default, and then do like what is done with the closed source drivers, and ask if you want the other drivers installed ?22:12
pwnguinwell, i donno about that. mainly just trying to figure out why this is different than ubuntu-desktop22:13
RAOFAt least in part because Ubuntu-desktop's Recommends: are user-visible.22:13
dandelpersonally, i think that would be a better option to begin with, actually.22:13
RAOFWheras the user-visible difference between having -nouveau installed or not is ~400KiB of disc space.22:14
dandelI have had issues with Ubuntu 10.04 boot because of my video card (not supported by radeon driver) in that release... so it's harder.22:14
dandelmost end users who are new will grab the lts version, and if it auto-sets things which are not properly supported it can be troublesome... 10.04 kernel does not support rhd5000 or newer cards, but forces radeon driver by default on them anyways.22:16
RAOFWell, that's a bug.  The drivers *should* fall back cleanly to vesa when encountering unsupported hardware.22:17
RAOFBut using vesa on the livecd isn't a good option.22:17
LLStarkshttps://lists.launchpad.net/hybrid-graphics-linux/msg00450.html22:17
dandelwell, the livecd in 10.04 is useless with rhd5000 (or newer) cards unless you force vesa.22:17
pwnguinim just looking at the policy and it's not quite an absolute dependency. i think recommends would be sufficient, and traditional for metapackages, so i was thinking there might have been a reason for it22:18
LLStarksif we can turn optimus cards off, i hope we can turn them on.22:18
dandelRAOF, the problem with that is the xorg driver does not always know that the device is unsupported, and is blanket enabled on all cards which have the rhd 2000 or higher id set.22:19
RAOFpwnguin: It's probably a holdover from when Debian didn't install recommends by default.22:19
RAOFdandel: Actually, it's got a list of supported PCIIDs and checks aganist that.  The X server will always try to load radeon on all ati hardware, but the radeon driver will check against its list.22:24
dandelRAOF, True, however, what happens when the kernel module does not support the card... which is the case with 10.04 and the rhd5000 series.22:26
LLStarksdoes radeonhd support it?22:26
dandelNot in 10.04.22:26
RAOFLLStarks: radeonhd doesn't usefully support anything anymore :)22:26
dandeli get garbage and system freezes with the open source driver on 10.04.22:27
RAOFdandel: In that case, the radeon driver should fall back to its UMS support; if that doesn't work, it's a bug in the driver.  But it's not because it doesn't (in theory) support the card :)22:27
dandelYea, and i can reproduce this bug every time... on livecd and usb (although usb creation for 10.04.1 amd64 is also broken, no boot menu)22:28

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