/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/02/11/#ubuntu-devel.txt

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killownhelp me understand why flash was updated for 10.2 on official ubuntu repositories? it's very very bug, alot annoying bugs00:59
persiakillown, we only ship an installer, not flash directly.  That said, the answer is in the changelog: looks like a security update fixing all sorts of outstanding CVEs.01:03
killownany browser is crashing easily with 10.201:06
micahgkillown: it's been working fine for me01:06
blackmoon-105i've create a new project on launchpad01:34
blackmoon-105the source is already in the universe repo of ubuntu01:34
blackmoon-105i've set the series in my project01:35
blackmoon-105but now i don't know how set it01:35
blackmoon-105no one?01:37
RAOFSet what?01:38
blackmoon-105RAOF: Code for this series01:43
blackmoon-105a message say that i haven't yet told Launchpad where your source code is01:44
RAOFHm.  I'm not sure; I've never tried doing that.01:45
RAOFSo it's not *terribly* important if you don't, either :)01:45
persiaYou might ask in #launchpad: they tend to be a bit better about advice on using LP for projects01:47
blackmoon-105persia: ok, thank you01:47
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broderwhat are the practical implications of the beta 2 vs. rc swap? is it just that we'll be rolling a thing-that-looks-like-a-pre-release a week sooner?02:35
persiabroder, Also, because we'll be in beta2 soft-freeze from probably Tuesday before Final Freeze (hard), it reduces the time available for the last-minute fix that isn't OMG-kittens by a couple days.02:38
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poolieasac, hi?07:15
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didrocksgood morning07:36
dholbachgood morning07:38
=== mthaddon changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Launchpad down/read-only from 09:00-10:30 UTC for a code update | Archive: open | Development of Ubuntu (not support, not app development) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion for dapper -> maverick | #ubuntu-app-devel for application development on Ubuntu | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | Current Friendly
pittiGood morning08:07
pooliehi pitti08:08
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al-maisanHello, upgraded to the 2.6.38-3.30 kernel this morning and laptop (thinkpad t410) froze twice on resume from suspend (nothing in /var/log/syslog) .. is this a known issue?08:46
al-maisanFWIW the 2.6.38-2.29 kernel does not exhibit this problem08:47
brycehal-maisan, probably you should be on #ubuntu-kernel...08:53
al-maisanbryceh: thanks for the pointer08:53
* al-maisan relocates08:53
pittiara: so the plan is to roll the (supposedly) final 10.04.2 CDs today, right?08:55
pitticjwatson: ^08:55
pittiara: dpm and I are currently testing some more langpacks, then I'll move the tested ones to lucid-updates, and we'll do the final rebuild, so that they will be available in ~ 4 hours; does that sound ok?08:56
pitticjwatson: FTR, disabling lucid cron jobs now08:57
dpmpitti, ack. Let me see if I can test the Spanish one as well, as discussed08:59
pittissh: connect to host bazaar.launchpad.net port 22: Connection refused09:02
pittio_O09:02
pittiis that just me?09:02
pittiah, LP maintenance09:03
didrocksyeah, not only you pitti :)09:03
arapitti, we are still testing the latest laptops, but so far it goes well. I guess we will need to respin in case we find anything in the latest laptops, but even the ones that are not 100% done, we have already run some tests on them, so I would be surprise to find anything09:09
pittiara: yeah, I don't expect any breakages either09:10
pittiara: but in last meeting we said that we should have finals on Friday09:10
pittiso I wanted to coordinate with you whether "in ~ 4 hours" is enough09:10
arapitti, sure thing09:11
pooliepitti, didrocks, sorry09:15
pooliethis time for sure09:15
pooliehttp://blog.launchpad.net/general/launchpad-read-only-09-00-utc-11th-february-201109:15
asacpoolie: ?09:20
janimomvo, hi I have a question related to package availability notifications, maybe you know what the best choice is. For arm images we want to notify the user when a new bootloader package is available. Can this be done using currently available components withoiut having that package previously installed?09:23
janimomvo, as we do not currently install the bootloader packages in the image, they are only on a separate boot partition written at image creation09:24
mvojanimo: hello, could you have a meta-package that points to the right package that you then upgrade? like linux-image -> linux-image-$version ?09:27
mvojanimo: or a empty "bootloader" package that you can later (if needed) can fill with life09:28
janimomvo, we have about 8 binary packages, (2 sources * 4 arm falvours)09:28
janimomvo, do we need to have soemthing installed to be able to check ?09:29
janimoI guess that is what we need to do, maybe have all these preinsatlled09:30
janimoand be notified when they are new09:30
mvojanimo: it seems like the best choice to make it a package (even if initially empty) as it will seamlessly integrate with all our tools09:30
janimoI was told jockey could help with this situation but no further details09:30
janimomvo, I'll check how linux image does it if that is a solution09:31
mvojanimo: right, I guess that would work, but I don't really see the benefits09:31
janimomvo,  I cannot judge either way. The use case is, when we have a new bootloader ready, niotify the user so they can install if they want to. So optional09:32
janimoAn otion is have all these packages preinstalle,d and when they update have a dpkg hok notify the user that it can flash it if they want09:32
mvojanimo: what is the benefit for the user (just out of curiosity)09:33
mvojanimo: but yeah, my feeling is it should just be a package09:33
janimomvo, the whole use case you mean? Sometime the bootloader has a bug which prevents some hw feature being enabled09:34
janimoso sometimes they can be instructed to flash a new one if they really want that feature - usually nothing serious but nice to have09:34
janimoI don;t know any examples as I wasn;t around in 10.10 but something like not setting up some voltage, and the kernel not being able to set it by itsel09:35
janimomvo, if it is a package, how does a post-install  hook notify the user (either in the notification area, or especially in headless at the next login)?09:36
mvojanimo: not sure I understand, why would the user need to be notified post-upgrade? is there something he/she needs to do?09:38
janimomvo, yes, these flashings of bootloader would be optional. apt only installs the files on the filesystem, but in order for them to be used at boot they need to be specifically put by another tool into a boot partiotion which is usually not mounted09:39
janimoso the files formthe package are only needed to have the blobs ready for the flashing tool09:39
janimoand being a potentialy risky operation it was decided it should not happen automatically09:39
janimobut the user would use a command line tool to do it09:40
mvojanimo: aha, now I get the full picture09:40
janimoso on login the user would see, new version of U-boot available, you may want to flash it to the boot partition using tool-xxx09:40
janimomvo, sorry for not explkaining it better in the first place09:41
janimomvo https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/other-arm-n-handle-core-boot-files-update09:41
janimohere's a rationale09:41
mvojanimo: check https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Internationalisation/Packaging#Interactive%20upgrade%20hooks09:42
mvojanimo: or https://wiki.ubuntu.com/InteractiveUpgradeHooks09:42
janimomvo, thank you for the links and the advice09:42
mvojanimo: the UI is not that great, the longer term goal is to make this much more plugable and flexible, but that relies on some of the cool new upstart session support09:43
janimomvo, if it notifies and works in console mode it is fine for us too09:43
mvooh, console mode?09:44
janimomvo, we wil have headless images as well09:45
janimoI was told the kernel install hooks at least print out some message on first login if some action is required09:45
janimobut I had not seen that in action yet09:45
mvojanimo: in this case its probably best to hook into update-motd09:47
janimomvo, I am looking at that now, it says it is superceded by pam-motd, I'll ask in the server team maybe they have such scenarios more often09:48
janimothanks for the pointers09:48
mvoyw09:56
gerthI experienced several problems with mawk 1.3.3 in Ubuntu 10.1010:03
gerthI found a site with a new maintained version: http://invisible-island.net/mawk/10:04
gerthThis version solves all problems I had with mawk10:04
gerthgawk and mawk now to the same10:05
hyperairgerth: please report the bugs on bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mawk10:06
gerthOK10:06
hyperairthanks10:08
persiajanimo, Do be careful: changing the bootloader is the easiest way to brick a device: if the old bootloader is configurable, and you can load a new kernel, this is almost certainly safer.  This is all the more true for devices that do not have a separate preboot environment from bootloader.10:13
cjwatsonpitti: right, that's what I was expecting ... do you want me to take care of builds?10:17
pitticjwatson: if you want to, sure; but I need to copy the langpacks to -updates first and get them published10:18
pittiLP is back up now, doing that now10:18
pittioh noes10:21
pitti2011-02-11 10:21:18 ERROR   Unhandled exception10:21
pitti -> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/64023385/3fXOMNPsLdTZdUGxZ1qA5uyCv1P.txt (FATAL:  Ident authentication failed for user "archivepublisher"10:21
pittiFATAL:  Ident authentication failed for user "archivepublisher"10:21
pittilooks like some problem with postgresql?10:22
pittiStevenK, lifeless: ^ do you know who we can ask about this?10:22
pitti(copy-package.py failure)10:22
StevenKAwesome. That's fallout from the rollout.10:23
StevenKlifeless, wgrant: Pls fix, I'm on holidays10:23
lifelesspitti: see internal IRC10:23
lifelessfor less zomg things, contact any dev in #launchpad10:23
lifelesspitti: see francis email about the reorg for full details10:23
=== mthaddon changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Archive: open | Development of Ubuntu (not support, not app development) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion for dapper -> maverick | #ubuntu-app-devel for application development on Ubuntu | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | Current Friendly Patch Pilots:
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gerthbug report mawk: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mawk/+bug/71692010:41
ubottuUbuntu bug 716920 in mawk (Ubuntu) ""mawk -F '\0' '{print $1}'" doesn't give the expected result" [Undecided,New]10:41
persia#ubuntu-bugs is likely a better place to coordinate bug reports10:44
pitticjwatson: cocoplum is happy again, and I copied the tested lucid langpack updates now10:44
cjwatsonRiddell: kubuntu-mobile: you need to propose a Launchpad change to cronscripts/publishing/cron.germinate that adds kubuntu-mobile to the 'for distro in' list10:52
cjwatsonsince the task doesn't exist10:52
cjwatsonpitti: OK, so we should be good to start builds after the next publisher run?10:54
pitticjwatson: yes, from my side10:55
janimopersia, I try to be as careful as I can given that the goal _is_ to change the bootloader :)10:55
pitticjwatson: but let's verify madison after that, just be sure (after the recent db trouble)10:55
persiajanimo, well, depends.  Make sure the user is already running a packaged bootloader beforehand.  If the user is running the vendor bootloader, they may prefer it that way.10:55
janimopersia, the update is not automatic, so the user will run the update if they think it is wise10:56
persiaThat seems safer.  I just worry: it's akin to a BIOS update, which many folk happily never do for the lifetime of their device.10:57
janimopersia, sure, I hope they won't have to do it too often on our images as well.10:57
janimopersia, honestly I think this spec is a bit silly and contrived, but I was not at the UDS so I may misjudge how useful it is overall10:58
persiaWhy would they have to do it ever?  I can imagine wanting to do it, but I don't see when it would be a must, once the kernel is loaded.  It's not like there's data stores used (e.g. dmidecode)10:58
Riddellcjwatson: ok, how do I do that, bug on soyuz?10:58
janimopersia, there were bugs during maverick which only an x-loader update could cure10:58
janimothe kernel not being up to the task10:59
janimolow level twiddling probably10:59
persiaSure, but that was for a pre-retail device.  Anyway, if it's a spec, worth implementing.  Just be careful.10:59
janimopersia, there are going to be other pre retails devices further down I guess, so having the possibility is useful.11:00
persiajanimo, Absolutely.  I just worry about the post-retail case: I don't want you to brick my handheld just because it needs some special tweak in the bootloader :)11:01
janimopersia, I hope we'll be wise enough not to put new updates via SRU unless absolutely useful. And this only targets SD card/OMAP, so it is a very soft kind of bricking11:02
janimonothing that someone who uses this cmdline tool cannot fix with a littel IRC help11:02
persiajanimo, Except if I use a blaze, which uses a hardwired (non-removable) eMMC, rather than SD.11:02
janimonot actual firmware update like x86 BIOSes11:02
cjwatsonRiddell: bug on launchpad, and it's probably quickest if you attach a branch11:03
persiaAnyway -> -arm11:03
cjwatsonRiddell: I'm updating tasksel11:03
janimopersia, right now I put beagle,igep and panda in the handled list. We'll see if others will be added, but it is explicit11:03
persiaAh, that's being careful :)11:04
Riddellcjwatson: a branch of what?  soyuz?11:11
cjwatsonRiddell: launchpad, it's all one piece11:12
cjwatsonRiddell: oh, if you don't already know how, I'll do it11:13
Riddellcjwatson: I'd be interested to learn though11:13
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cjwatsonpitti: so which packages should we verify?  language-pack-de is at 1:10.04+2011020412:18
pitticorrect, and language-pack-fi at 1:10.04+20110204.1 (manual update)12:19
pitticjwatson: so, all green from my side12:19
cjwatsonok, I'll just do a manual sync to check that antimony's mirror will pull the right things12:21
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cjwatsonpitti: building13:03
ScottKbarry: Nice job on the numpy doc fix.13:08
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sorenIs it just me, or does mountall not handle SIGPIPE *at all*?13:23
cjwatsonyow13:24
cjwatsonRiddell: is it known that you can't do a Kubuntu install with 512MB of RAM at the moment13:24
cjwatson?13:25
cjwatsonwell, at least not in debug mode ...13:25
cjwatsonmaybe it'll work better if I use the debug-ubiquity boot parameter rather than starting a desktop first13:25
cjwatsonoh, sod it, I'll just bump the memory for now13:27
Riddellcjwatson: I don't think I've tried13:28
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cjwatsonI switched to -m 768, I just habitually use -m 51213:29
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Riddellcjwatson: does bug 716311 seem like it would be caused by bug 680328 ?  if so should I backport the three patches to packagekit?13:44
ubottuLaunchpad bug 716311 in flashplugin-nonfree (Ubuntu) "flash not installed" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/71631113:44
ubottuLaunchpad bug 680328 in qapt (Ubuntu Natty) "Many postinst scripts fail using either PackageKit, or QApt" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/68032813:44
cjwatsonRiddell: um - the fixes were ported *from* packagekit to qapt13:47
cjwatsonRiddell: oh, do you mean to older releases?13:47
cjwatsonRiddell: yes, I think we probably ought to backport those to packagekit, qapt, and possibly aptdaemon (though I think it's different there)13:48
Riddellcjwatson: ok I'll take a look at that13:50
cjwatsongreat, thanks13:52
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sorencjwatson: You've touched mountall before. I can't seem to find a bzr branch for it? Any hints?14:13
cjwatsonlp:ubuntu/mountall14:14
sorenAh.14:14
sorencjwatson: Ta.14:14
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sorencjwatson: Would you mind reviewing a mountall patch for me? It's not very big.14:55
sorenhttps://code.launchpad.net/~soren/ubuntu/natty/mountall/sigpipe-handler14:56
cjwatsonsoren: a bit deep in yak-shaving at the moment - could you mark me as the reviewer on a MP?15:00
sorencjwatson: Will do. I wasn15:00
sorent sure who would be the reviewer by default.15:00
bdrungtumbleweed: u-d-t build failure: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/64035083/buildlog_ubuntu-natty-i386.ubuntu-dev-tools_0.116~daily%2Bbzr1012~natty1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz15:02
sorencjwatson: MP filed with you as the reviewer. Thanks. If you don't get to it today, I might bug someone else to review it.15:03
tumbleweedbdrung: I can look at fixing that in the morning15:05
kirkland@pilot in15:09
=== udevbot changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Archive: open | Development of Ubuntu (not support, not app development) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion for dapper -> maverick | #ubuntu-app-devel for application development on Ubuntu | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | Current Friendly Patch Pilots: kirkland
kirklandhold on to your butts, ladies and gentlemen...today's patch pilot has arrived  :-)15:09
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* pitti closes his seat belt15:15
pittigo, Dustin, go!15:15
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ogracjwatson, any idea why http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/livefs-build-logs/natty/ubuntu-netbook/ doesnt get updates anymore ? i see current/, latest/ and 20101119/ (?!?) having a fresh timestamp but no logs15:41
cjwatsonogra: isn't that just for the i386 netbook image, which is no longer being built?15:44
ograoh, might be15:44
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GunnarHjcjwatson: Hi Colin, considering your comments at https://launchpad.net/bugs/666565, it would be great if you could spare a minute or two to act on the comment I posted on Feb 3.15:50
ubottuUbuntu bug 666565 in Ubuntu Translations ""utf8" charmap in locale name is wrong" [High,Triaged]15:51
cjwatsonGunnarHj: I've replied briefly15:59
cjwatsonRAOF: did I ask you for some debugging information on the GRUB problem with corrupted video on Thinkpads?  I'm sure I remember doing so, but I can't find the mail16:03
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GunnarHjcjwatson: Thanks! Then, how about just replacing .utf8 with .UTF-8 to start with, and introduce parsing of .../SUPPORTED later on, if the simplistic solution proves to not suffice?16:12
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cjwatsonGunnarHj: it would likely be an improvement, at least16:16
kirklandcjwatson: I'm on patch pilot duty, and I willing to sponsor SpamapS' ssh fix at https://code.launchpad.net/~clint-fewbar/ubuntu/natty/openssh/init.d-chroot-aware/+merge/4807016:18
kirklandcjwatson: unless you'd prefer I left it to you...16:18
cjwatsonoh, actually I'd sort of like to read through that so that I know what's going on later16:18
cjwatsoncan you leave it to me?  I promise to get it done today16:18
kirklandcjwatson: fair enough, i'll bypass16:18
kirklandcjwatson: sure thing, no worries16:18
janimohyperair, hi, is banshee 1.9.3 planned to be updated?16:21
GunnarHjcjwatson: Ok, then I include .utf8 => .UTF-8 in a couple of MPs, so we get it confirmed that it's an improvement, to start with.16:22
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dholbachcan somebody have a look at the u-d-a moderation queue?16:52
hyperairjanimo: yes.16:53
sebnerbryceh: is there currently some b0rken font rendering known bug? Using nvidia but only installed the normal xorg updates (so no dist-upgrade)16:55
cjwatsondholbach: done16:58
dholbachthanks cjwatson16:59
brycehsebner, there's been a few font rendering issues reported on natty.  However they've ended up all being unrelated problems, so you should probably report your issue separately.17:21
sebnerbryceh: well, I'm seeing this issue since yesterday. Have you got some links for me (or can tell me against which packages they were filed) so I can check before filing a new bug17:23
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brycehsebner, just do ubuntu-bug xorg and we'll sort it out.  Include a photo of the corruption17:24
brycehif you can, file the bug after you've reproduced the corruption, and outline the steps you take to reproduce the bug17:25
sebnerbryceh: reproduce = start system ^^, well my backgroundimage looks a little bit broken (the black part) but if I make a screenshot of the b0rken font it looks normal on the screenshot :\17:27
alexblighI'm sure this is really obvious, but is there any way to skip the "make" stage of building a package (I'm typing "debuild -us -uc" and I know all I have changed is the install stuff)17:31
cjwatsonyou can often do  fakeroot debian/rules binary17:31
james_walexbligh, try ./debian/rules binary17:31
james_wah fakeroot, yeah17:31
brycehsebner, yeah you need a photo17:31
alexblighcjwatson, james_w, thanks17:32
sebnerbryceh: will try, why does a screenshot on the broken backgroundimage/game works though?17:32
alexblighOK, one more. If I am overriding dh_auto_configure in debian/rules, do I need to pass ALL the parameters, or just the additional ones I need? Specifically, do I need to pass --prefix and --sysconfdir, and should they be set to /usr and /etc/foo or to `pwd`/debian/tmp/usr (etc.)17:39
cousteauis there any channel about help relating packages on repositories?17:40
pittizul, kirkland: do you now who is working on eucalyptus in the server team these days?17:41
zulthat would be daviey17:42
cousteau(particularly, I'm wondering why Flash was updated to 10.2)17:42
pittiDaviey: we have a question wrt. xulrunner in main; eucalyptus build dep gwt build-dep swt-gtk build-dep xulrunner17:42
pittiDaviey: do you think this chain could be broken anywhere?17:42
chrisccoulsonDaviey, we're trying to drop xulrunner out of main17:43
pitti(if we could drop swt-gtk, so much the better -- it's only in main for this one reason)17:43
cjwatsonalexbligh: just the extra ones you need; and they should be set to the real destination locations, not the temporary ones in the build tree17:44
cjwatson(with reasonably conventional build systems, anyway)17:44
smoseranyone know about peristent net rules ? i'm wanting to add to the 'globally_administered_whitelist' in /lib/udev/rules.d/75-persistent-net-generator.rules17:44
smoseri wanted to do so without editing the file17:44
smoseris that possible in /etc/udev/rules.d ? or is that too late.17:44
pittismoser: locally, or should that go upstream?17:45
smoserwell, locally for now.17:45
smoserits arguable if it should go upstream17:45
smosereucalyptus uses 'd0:0d' as a prefix (ie "dude")17:45
alexblighcjwatson, thanks. I am not using dh_auto_install or whatever anyway (as I am overriding it) so that makes sense. I am trying to make a dhcpd package that is, um, less baroque than the current one...17:46
pittismoser: I'm afraid you can't just specify a single rule in /etc; you'd need to copy the entire file to /etc and edit it17:46
pittismoser: as the checks and actions are all in just one file, there's nothing "in between"17:46
alexblighsmoser, Eucalyptus should have paid their $3000 for a MAC range allocation I think..17:46
pittismoser: if that is an officially registered prefix, I see nothing wrong with committing it upstream17:46
smoseralexbligh, that is not arguable, you are correct.17:46
smoserpitti, they didn't happen to be assigned "dude".17:47
smoser:)17:47
alexblighsmoser, if you are doing what I think you are doing (where all interfaces are virtual), why don't you just disable ALL interface persistence. That's what we do17:47
alexblighwe just remove the file17:47
smoserah.17:47
alexbligh(i.e. the file to build it)17:47
smoserthat makes sense for my local hack17:47
smoseryou'r saying just rm /lib/udev/rules.d/75-persistent-net-generator.rules17:48
pittihttp://www.coffer.com/mac_find/?string=d00d17:48
pittinothing official :/17:48
alexblighsmoser, yes. It causes a huge amount of problems and counterintuitive behaviour. I'd vote for removing it from UEC images17:48
pittismoser: so yeah, local hack for now, I'm afraid17:48
alexbligh(or having some /etc/default type thing to disable it)17:48
pittismoser: or we patch it in the Ubuntu package17:48
smoserpitti, i might open a bug for ubuntu local mod17:49
pittiso, good night everyone, have a nice weekend!17:50
alexblighsmoser, there is also (just so you know) a bug with Xen where the PV driver MAC address and the non-PV driver MAC address are the same (as it's the same interface). One is ignored by udev, one isn't, which causes all sorts of random renaming and failure to reboot.17:50
alexblighwhich is the other reason we remove the file...17:50
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cjwatsonalexbligh: uh, isn't isc-dhcp in natty reasonably current already?17:52
Davieypitti, Hmm...  TBH... i'd need to do a trial build.17:52
alexblighcjwatson, we have local patches (see http://blog.alex.org.uk/2010/12/02/adding-sql-support-to-dhcpd-part-2/)17:52
Davieypitti, But as it stands euca is still FTBFS'ing in Natty.. which is making me cry.17:52
alexblighcjwatson, , and no, it's 4.1 not 4.217:53
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kirklandpitti: yeah, like zul said, it's Daviey18:02
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kirklandslangasek: howdy18:10
kirklandslangasek: we're running into some contention building/uploading qemu-kvm18:11
kirklandslangasek: qemu-linaro and qemu-kvm are producing some of the same binary package names18:11
slangasekkirkland: oh?18:11
kirklandslangasek: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qemu-linaro18:11
slangasekkirkland: qemu-kvm is supposed to drop those packages18:11
slangasekSerge took the action to clean that up on the qemu-kvm side - do you need me to knock them out?18:12
kirklandslangasek: qemu-keymaps?18:12
kirklandslangasek: qemu-system18:12
kirklandslangasek: i can probably handle it;  i just want to make sure i get it right18:12
kirklandhallyn: you around?18:12
slangasekkirkland: hum? those packages were never part of qemu-kvm before18:13
kirklandslangasek: okay, it looks like it's just [qemu-kvm-extras, qemu-kvm-extras-static]18:14
slangasekkirkland: yes18:14
kirklandslangasek: right, sorry about that noise18:14
slangasekn/p :)18:14
kirklandslangasek: okay, so i just need to drop those from our build18:14
kirklandhallyn: do you have a branch with that already?18:14
slangasekkirkland: it also means you should update the build to only build for the targets that get packaged in qemu-kvm itself... that will substantially reduce the build time18:17
slangasekjanimo: did you land the CFLAGS workaround for qemu-kvm on armel?18:18
janimoslacker_nl, no, it was serge hallyn18:18
slangasekjanimo: ok, but it's done now - great :)18:18
janimoyes, I just filed the bug18:18
janimoslangasek, any news on the porting queue project?18:19
slangasekjanimo: I'll be doing some initial population of the queue today, with plans for our first jam session next Wednesday18:19
Keybukslangasek: I saw a video on YouTube yesterday and thought of you ... ;-)18:20
slangasekKeybuk: uhoh? :)18:20
Keybukslangasek: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVmq9dq6Nsg18:20
kirklandslangasek: right, debian/control, and debian/rules18:21
slangasekKeybuk: putabirdonit.com18:21
slangasek:)18:22
slangasekkirkland: yep; the target selection is a bit non-obvious, but I guess you may be familiar with how it goes :)18:22
kirklandslangasek: shall i drop armel from the build entirely?18:22
Keybukslangasek: ;-)18:23
slangasekkirkland: you should only be building those targets that are going to be packaged in the qemu-kvm binary... so x86*/powerpc?18:23
slangasekkirkland: looks like qemu-i386, qemu-x86_64, and qemu-system-"" are the only bits that we build from here, so those are the only targets that should be selected18:24
slangasek(and the 'user' build phase should be dropped entirely)18:24
kirklandslangasek: k;  i'm hacking on it;  will pastebin a diff to settle upon before uploading18:24
=== Seeker is now known as Seeker`
slangasekkirkland: pastebin? pff, push a branch! :)18:25
nigelbheh18:25
kirklandslangasek: i spent my morning working in the customer lounge of the VW service department;  bzr sucks over a slow link;  apt-get source + pastebin was my friend18:25
Keybukslangasek: the discovery of this show is nearly as awesome as when ev introduced me to Canadian Trailer Park Boys (the story of cody-somerville's life)18:26
hallynkirkland: oh, no, i haven't done a branch without qemu-kvm-extras yet18:26
kirklandslangasek: alas, i'm back home now, on a good up/down link; so sure, a branch18:26
hallynis that just a matter of removing that from the control file?18:26
slangasekkirkland: is that because bzr sucks over a slow link, or because you had a local apt source repo?18:26
kirklandhallyn: okay, i'm trying to sort it out now18:26
alexblighcjwatson, hmm "fakeroot debian/rules binary" just produces the output "dh  binary" and does nothign else18:26
slangasekKeybuk: <snort>18:26
hallynkirkland: cool, thanks18:26
kirklandhallyn: it's a bit more of a mess in debian/rules18:26
hallynkirkland: fwiw, natty boots fine with -std vga in qemu :)18:26
kirklandhallyn: the debian/control part is easy18:26
kirklandslangasek: i had no local apt source18:27
slangasekalexbligh: that means it's been run before; dh aggressively caches the results18:27
slangasekkirkland: interesting18:27
slangasekalexbligh: you would need to run 'debian/rules clean' first18:27
alexblighslangasek, I am attempting to avoid recompiling (i.e. doing the make). Won't debian/rules clean clean the make?18:28
hallynkirkland: and simply rm debian/qemu-kvm-extras* ? :)  feels reckless18:28
kirklandhallyn: yeah, that too18:28
slangasekalexbligh: yes, it will.  You could try running 'dh_prep', it's possible that this is smart enough to roll back the debhelper.log files under debian/ also18:29
kirklandhallyn: it's the debian/rules stuff that looks complicated to me18:29
alexblighslangasek, no difference.18:29
slangasekhallyn: my suggestion to kirkland was that if you're no longer shipping any of the dozen or so binaries emulating other architectures, you should also not waste buildd time building them :)18:30
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hallynslangasek: yup18:30
slangasekalexbligh: so, deleting the debian/*debhelper.log files will tell dh to start from the beginning18:31
slangasekalexbligh: no guarantee that this won't also require rebuilding the upstream source - it depends how good the upstream target definitions are18:31
alexblighslangasek, I am using the default dh version 7 rules file. It's (essentially) my package.18:32
alexblighslangasek, so not dh_clean?18:32
slangasekalexbligh: you could try it, I'm not sure what that will give you either18:33
kirklandslangasek: i suppose i should drop sparc from here too18:33
alexblighslangasek, it gave me a huge rebuild :-(18:33
slangasekkirkland: just to make sure there's no understanding - you're going to continue to build the x86 targets *on* all archs, right?18:34
slangasek(this should greatly simplify the rules for all architectures)18:35
slangasekthe only special case will be x86 now, because of the binfmt handling18:35
slangasekalexbligh: sorry to hear it.  If you're lucky, at least some of it is cached18:35
kirklandslangasek: hmm, is that how you'd like to handle this?18:36
slangasekkirkland: that's what was agreed at the rally :)  qemu-linaro is *not* building x86 emulators for any arch, with the reasoning that qemu-kvm is going to have the best x86 emulation generally - so please continue to build those for everyone18:37
kirklandslangasek: okay, sorry;  i think hallyn was a party to that discussion and i was not18:38
slangasekkirkland: I think you begged off :-)18:38
kirklandhallyn: we should probably work together on this ;-)18:38
alexblighslangasek, nope, it essentially did a make clean. I think it removed build.stamp. There must surely be a simple way to rebuild only the package (not the binary) for an autoconf style package.18:38
slangasekalexbligh: removing debian/*.debhelper.log is as close as I know to come, in the dh model18:39
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alexblighslangasek, thanks - I'll test that in a bit. In the mean time, the obvious consequence of playing with dhcpd on a remote machine without kvm access has happened. I should really use a VM for this :-/18:42
hallynkirkland: wouldn't that just be the default?  (to keep building qemu-system-amd64 and qemu-system-i386 on all architectures) ?18:42
kirklandslangasek: lp:~kirkland/ubuntu/natty/qemu-kvm/fix-build18:45
kirklandhallyn: right18:46
kirklandhallyn: lp:~kirkland/ubuntu/natty/qemu-kvm/fix-build18:46
kirklandslangasek: hallyn: that's a first draft18:46
hallyn(fetching)18:48
hallyn(slowly - i'm getting 7mbs down, but something like 7kps from launchpad.net)18:49
hallynactually i guess that's just ppa.l.n - bzr is fetching 10x as fast18:49
slangasekkirkland: FYI, there were un-uploaded changes committed to the UDD branch for qemu-kvm; those should get merged in also18:51
kirklandslangasek: i'm pretty sure i did18:51
kirklandslangasek: i saw your manpage change18:51
kirklandslangasek: i had a cve/security fix18:51
kirklandslangasek: plus an arm build fix from hallyn18:52
hallynkirkland: looks good so far18:52
slangasekkirkland: ah - the changelog entry didn't make it into the upload18:52
kirklandslangasek: ?18:52
kirklandslangasek: see ubuntu13, ubuntu14, ubuntu1518:52
slangasekkirkland: the package that was uploaded (0ubuntu14) doesn't show the manpage change18:53
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slangasekI haven't looked at your branch yet, downloading it now (having just figured out that the UDD branch no longer matches the archive)18:53
kirklandslangasek: right, that one didn't make it into 0ubuntu1418:56
kirklandslangasek: i'll move your changelog entry up to 0ubuntu1518:56
kirklandslangasek: as it will be included in this upload18:56
jamslangasek: there are only 14.5k jobs pending...18:56
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kirklandslangasek: now that I have decent networking and can work from the bzr branch :-)18:56
jamdowntime is shockingly painful18:57
slangasekkirkland: ok; let me know when that's done, I'll need to do some minor surgery on the branch afterwards to make everything match up again18:57
slangasekjam: not that - I mean there's a desync between what was uploaded and what was committed :)18:57
jamplus a wheezy release18:57
jamslangasek: so the foo-x.y.deb doesn't match the tag x.y?18:57
kirklandslangasek: okay, i'm pushing to lp:ubuntu/qemu-kvm;  can you take it from here?18:58
slangasekjam: the 0.13.0+noroms-0ubuntu12 deb matches the tag; then there were further commits to the branch, and further uploads to the archive18:58
slangasekkirkland: i.e., you want me to upload?18:59
kirklandslangasek: sure18:59
slangasekok18:59
kirklandslangasek: pushed to lp:ubuntu/qemu-kvm18:59
slangasekkirkland: NB I'm also in the midst of uploading 5 armel kernel source packages, so it'll be a bit before I can make any headway :)19:00
kirklandslangasek: okay, well, i can upload to;  you just said you wanted to do some surgery19:00
slangasekkirkland: the surgery can happen on the branch once the upload is in the archive19:00
slangasekit's specifically branch surgery not package surgery19:00
kirklandslangasek: i'm building now locally19:01
kirklandslacker_nl: ah19:01
kirklandslangasek: ah19:01
kirklandslangasek: cool, i'll get this built/tested/uploaded then19:01
kirklandslangasek: i have a bunch of other stuff to do, but this has my attention right now ;-)19:01
slangasekk :)19:01
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=== dendro-afk is now known as dendrobates
keesstgraber: will you take care of uploading the natty italc updates? just wanted to make sure that got fully taken care of now that the others are public. thanks again for all the dediffs on that. :)19:15
kirklandhallyn: is there a bug open for all this qemu-kvm build futzing?19:15
ohsixhrm, can timidity be made to play well with pulse, it lords over the hw from a single instance19:25
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ohsixfalse alarm, java6 is ugly19:28
hallynkirkland: with linaro you mean?  no19:29
sbeattiejdstrand: do you have any idea why byacc got demoted to universe?19:40
jdstrandsbeattie: doesn't ring a bell otoh19:40
jdstrandsbeattie: are there any bugs on it?19:41
jdstrandno, doesn't seem so...19:42
sbeattiejdstrand: not that I can see. It's a build dependency of krb5 at least, and I'd suspect of many others in main.19:42
jdstrandsbeattie: the version that came in was an autosync from Debian...19:43
jdstrandsbeattie: I can only say it happened on 2011-01-1419:44
sbeattiejdstrand: right, which came in during maverick, but then (according to https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/byacc) it got republished in natty/universe19:44
=== bcurtiswx_ is now known as bcurtiswx
jdstrandyeah, clearly that was a mistake19:44
jdstrandsbeattie: I'll fix19:45
jdstrandsbeattie: it is only krb5 and gob2 that have a build dep on it btw19:45
kirklandslangasek: i just moved all of the qemu-system-arm* bugs over from qemu-kvm to qemu-linaro19:46
slangasekkirkland: sounds reasonable, thanks19:46
kirklandslangasek: some might need to grow a qemu-kvm task too (if the fix necessitates an SRU against qemu-kvm, in Lucid, say)19:46
kirklandslangasek: i think we'll follow your lead on that19:47
jdstrandsbeattie: actually, krb5 has a byacc | bison in the build depends19:47
jdstrandsbeattie: and bison is in main19:47
jdstrandsbeattie: so I don't think I will make the change19:48
sbeattiejdstrand: hunh. odd. sbuild/maverick is failing to build krb5 because it can't install byacc.19:48
jdstrandsbeattie: that might be a ust thing19:49
sbeattiejdstrand: okay. I'll dig into it.19:49
kirklandslangasek: hmm, i'm looking for a better way to do this ...19:59
hallyncjwatson: i'm chasing down a bug (not yet filed, guess i should) that lucid (and probably maverick) does not boot in qemu with '-vga std', while natty does.  A bleeding edge kernel doesn't help, so at this point I think I have to blame grub.  Was wondering whether you had any ideas.  It bombs just hangs after complaining about 'out of range pointer 0x80220000'19:59
kirklandslangasek: after my test build, i realized that all of those binaries previously moved to qemu-extras just landed in qemu-kvm now20:00
kirklandslangasek: i can:20:00
kirkland        # Remove the binaries provided by qemu-linaro20:00
kirkland        for i in alpha arm armeb cris m68k microblaze mips mipsel sh4 sh4eb sparc sparc32plus sparc64 system-arm system-cris system-m68k system-microblaze system-mips system-mips64 system-mips64el system-mipsel system-sh4 system-sh4eb system-sparc system-sparc64; do \20:00
kirkland                rm -f debian/qemu-kvm/usr/bin/qemu-$$i20:00
kirkland        done20:00
kirklandslangasek: easily enough;  but it's kind of a waste to bother building them20:00
kirklandslangasek: i'm looking for a --configure option to just not build/install them20:00
kirklandslangasek: hmm, maybe --target-list20:01
slangasekkirkland, hallyn: huh, looks like maybe I misunderstood the state of play of the qemu-kvm packages on armel.  I assumed qemu-kvm was being built for all archs and would contain the qemu-*-x86* emulators, but it seems this package doesn't exist at all and we're not providing an x86 emulator for arm *anywhere*?  Should qemu-kvm provide this (as the branch w/ better x86 emulation), or should qemu-linaro provide this?20:01
slangasekkirkland: right, --target-list is the key20:01
slangasekkirkland: the Debian qemu source package makes use of --target-list, if you need an example20:02
slangasekkirkland: no it doesn't, I'm lying20:02
slangasekthe qemu-maemo package had that example, only I've superseded that source and deleted it from the ppa, ho-hum :)20:02
slangasekanyway, yes - use --target-list to only build the objects you care about20:03
kirklandslangasek: okay, thanks20:03
slangasekkirkland: I'm just about done with the branch surgery; I recommend holding off a few minutes before making any further changes to bzr, I'll push my cleanup and you can pull it back with bzr pull --overwrite20:09
hallynpackages for natty are not auto-syncing now right?20:12
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slangasekkirkland: branch pushed; please do a fresh checkout or a bzr pull --overwrite to get back in sync20:12
geserhallyn: no, we are after DIF, if you need something you need to "requestsync" it20:12
stgraberkees: natty has been fixed "cleanly", as in, ubiquity re-generate the keys at install time. I uploaded this one on Monday.20:13
sorenslangasek: Do you think you could review this instead of cjwatson: https://code.launchpad.net/~soren/ubuntu/natty/mountall/sigpipe-handler/+merge/49401 ?20:15
slangaseksoren: sigpipe> far better to have cjwatson review it20:15
slangasekhe has deep understanding of sigpipe; I run screaming20:15
sorenslangasek: Alrighty.20:16
hallyngeser: thx20:22
keesstgraber: ah, okay.20:25
keesstgraber: still might be a good idea to fix it in the natty italc-client, in case someone upgrades from maverick live DVDt to natty without first installing -security updates...20:25
kirklandslangasek: okay, the manifest of qemu-kvm_0.13.0+noroms-0ubuntu15_amd64.deb is at: http://paste.ubuntu.com/566040/20:32
slangasekkirkland: shouldn't the user targets be in here, in addition to the system targets?20:42
slangasekkirkland: i.e., qemu-i386, qemu-x86_6420:42
kirklandslangasek: yeah, i'm just trying to figure out how to state those in             --target-list="x86_64-softmmu i386-softmmu" \20:43
slangasekkirkland: qemu-linaro does separate passes for system vs. user20:44
slangasekone is --disable-system, the other is --disable-linux-user20:44
slangaseknot sure to what extent that's required20:44
hallyn--enable-user?20:45
kirklandhallyn: yeah;  just added that;  what about --enable-linux-user ?20:45
slangasekkirkland: ah, it's i386-linux-user and x86_64-linux-user for the targets20:45
hallynkirkland: actually yes, i think you want20:45
hallyn--enable-linux-user,20:46
slangasekI guess --target-list may override --en/disable-linux-user20:46
hallynand the way i read configure, it seems to say that enable-user == ! enable-linux-user20:46
slangasekor vice-versa20:46
kirklandslangasek: hmm, okay, i'm testing now20:46
hallynweird20:46
kirklandslangasek: it was VERY nice to get our build back down to ~2 minutes (from 45+ minutes before)20:46
slangasek:-)20:46
slangasekkirkland: now, can I switch this package to use dh :)20:47
kirklandslangasek: dh7 you imply?20:47
slangasekyah20:47
slangasekI'm not really going to do it right now though20:47
kirklandslangasek: would you like to?20:47
slangasekeventualy20:48
kirklandslangasek: you're *welcome* to do so20:48
kirklandslangasek: don't do it yet, as I need to merge my changes in on top of yours20:48
kirklandslangasek: ask i'm still tweaking the build correctly20:48
slangasekyep20:48
kirklandslangasek: but yeah, dh7 would be nice here20:48
slangasekqemu-linaro is dh7.  It doesn't look all that much nicer ;)20:49
kirklandslangasek: :-P20:50
killownwhen ubuntu will upgrade to gtk3?20:50
kirklandslangasek: perfect!20:54
kirklandslangasek: i think we have a winner20:54
kirklandhallyn: I have not added ppc64 to the target list yet;  let's do that when we get the patches from our friends20:55
hallynkirkland: i woudln't be surprised if we hear a bug report overnight from one of the two people who quietly are using it20:56
kirklandhallyn: that would be kinda cool, actually :-)20:56
kirklandhallyn: snuff 'em out!20:56
hallynyeah but they're not gonna be nice about it :)20:58
kirklandhallyn: what are the ppc64 targets then?20:58
kirklandppc64-softmmu and ppc64-linux-user ?20:58
hallynlooks like21:01
kirklandhallyn: ack, got it21:06
kirklandhallyn: slangasek: okay, built, tested, committed, uploaded21:10
kirklandhallyn: slangasek: give 'er a test sometime later today or tomorrow21:11
=== dendrobates is now known as dendro-afk
hallyni'll update right now, see if it puts a stop to my current ongoing tests :)21:15
LinuxPhreak1I don't know if this is the correct channel to ask this question in. But I'm working on program to help users transition from Windows to Ubuntu. I wanted to know if it is possible to build deb package inside of Windows21:19
slangasekLinuxPhreak1: inside a VM, maybe; otherwise you need a chroot and I don't recall Windows having that feature21:21
slangasekactually, even in a chroot you'd be tainted by cygwin21:22
LinuxPhreak1what about chroot compiled with cygwin? Has chroot been compiled with cygwin21:22
slangasekit's not about /compiling/ it, it's about having the underlying system facilities that /implement/ chroot21:22
broderLinuxPhreak1: what do you mean by "transition from Windows to Ubuntu"? what's wrong with Wubi or Ubuntu Light?21:22
slangasekso in theory you could have a cygwin environment with a Windows->Linux cross-compiler21:24
slangasekbut I don't see the point21:24
LinuxPhreak1This program is not geared towards installing Ubuntu with Windows. It is simply going to copy users data such as pictures and videos. Place them into a .deb file. Then the user will be able to have the files in locations on Ubuntu such as Pictures directory.21:25
slangaseka .deb is a package format for system software; it's not a reasonable format for transferring data between Windows and Ubuntu21:25
LinuxPhreak1Okay so maybe something like archiving the files and generating a bash script to extract the files into certain locations21:27
broderLinuxPhreak1: i think that ev is already working on that for ubiquity on natty21:27
LinuxPhreak1Cool. I'll fetch the source and check it out. This program is not just geared for ubuntu but for several Linux OSes21:28
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=== drdanz_ is now known as drdanz
brycehrickspencer3, you about?  I sent you an essay on your intel freeze bug21:37
brycehrickspencer3, but basically, I think you might be seeing a freeze we already know about, but there's not enough info to say one way or the other.  if you want to gather the info I sent directions, but if you want to just assume it's covered by one of the other bugs and wait 'til they get resolved, that's cool too.21:38
rickspencer3bryceh, I added a note to the bug21:39
rickspencer3let me know if you need more info, happy to help, but closing it is fine too21:39
brycehah great21:39
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cjwatsonhallyn: I don't have an answer for you off the top of my head, but basically that message is equivalent to malloc arena corruption, or freeing a non-malloced pointer, or similar, and can be similarly hard to debug (no valgrind either).  if you can give me a rough recipe for reproducing it in a bug report, I may be able to work something out; even better if you can produce a cut-down version with grub-mkrescue or something ...21:40
cjwatson... like that21:40
cjwatsonhallyn: I'd probably start by executing menu commands one by one to see where it breaks21:40
hallyncjwatson: i figured i would try compiling natty's grub for lucid, but that failed21:41
cjwatsonno xorriso would be awkward21:41
slangasekkirkland: any further thoughts about where we should be putting i386 emulation for non-kvm-supporting archs?21:42
cjwatsonI don't remember a specific fix that might correspond to that, but it could have been in the course of general code cleanup or anything21:42
kirklandslangasek: on a call, will get back with you after21:43
slangasekkirkland: okie21:43
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hallyncjwatson: replacing grub2 with grub it boots fine.  at least now i know waht to file the bug against :)22:06
sorencjwatson: Do you think there's any chance you'll get to reviewing that patch of mine today? If not, that's perfectly fine, then I just need to flick a switch somewhere.22:11
Laneyoijoijoijoijoijoijoijhhoihoih22:13
kirklandslangasek: back now22:17
kirklandslangasek: okay, i propose this: qemu-kvm builds the binaries for and on those that support KVM acceleration22:18
kirklandslangasek: qemu-linaro builds everything else22:18
kirklandslangasek: ie, qemu-kvm really is for "KVM", and qemu-linaro is more for "QEMU" (non-kvm)22:18
kirklandslangasek: does that sound reasonable?22:18
kirkland@pilot out22:24
=== udevbot changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Archive: open | Development of Ubuntu (not support, not app development) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion for dapper -> maverick | #ubuntu-app-devel for application development on Ubuntu | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | Current Friendly Patch Pilots:
=== Claudinux_ is now known as Claudinux
slangasekkirkland: is that an exclusive or inclusive and?22:42
slangasekkirkland: i.e., does build for those that support KVM mean building qemu-i386 on armel, or not?22:42
kirklandslangasek: i'm ambivalent on that;  though I think it a precious waste of armel cpu time to waste running qemu-i386 emulation :-)22:43
kirklandslangasek: ie, is there sensible reason to do that, that I'm missing?22:44
slangasekkirkland: well, no one seems to have minded that it wasn't building before now <grin>, but I have some evil designs for it that involve multiarch22:45
kirklandslangasek: neat :-)22:45
* kirkland has long awaited this magical multiarch22:46
slangasekand it's at least as useful as, y'know, qemu-sparc on armel22:46
slangasekwhich we /are/ building22:46
slangasekkirkland: so at the root, my question is - will using the kvm branch of qemu give any advantage in terms of x86 system emulation on non-kvm archs?22:47
slangasekif not, I'm happy to build from qemu-linaro (it's already building, we're just throwing it away at the end)22:48
kirklandslangasek: nope, none that i know of22:48
slangasekif so, I'd like us to get those benefits and have it built from qemu-kvm22:48
kirklandhopefully hallyn can keep me honest there ^22:48
kirklandslangasek: currently, qemu-kvm only positively effects i386-on-i386, i386-on-amd64, and amd64-on-amd6422:48
hallynmy understanding is the same22:49
slangasekok, so even amd64-on-i386 isn't helped, the differences are entirely in the code that leverages the proc for native execution?22:50
sorenYeah. amd64-on-i386 could actually work (I've learned this recently), but kvm doesn't do it at the moment.22:54
slangasekso thinking about it, the other issue is that qemu-kvm already has all the x86 bioses sorted already22:55
slangasekif I build qemu-system-i386 from qemu-linaro and it wants a different version of seabios or vgabios, I'm in trouble22:55
alexbligh1What does the file [packagename].templates do in the debian directory? It seems to be translation related. If it's not there, bad things happen. If it's there, I get (on dpkg -i) "Template parse error near `# These templates have been reviewed by the debian-l10n-english', in stanza #1 of /var/lib/dpkg/info/extility-dhcpd.templates"22:57
alexbligh1I have copied the file from the Natty dhcpd package so I don't see why it causes a parse error (particularly on a comment)22:58
slangasekalexbligh1: .templates are the source of the questions asked by a package via the debconf interface at install time22:58
hallynslangasek: yes, tracking the bioses is a bit of extra work...22:58
slangasekhallyn: not just tracking them but making sure we don't have mutually exclusive requirements for bios versions due to upstream version skew22:59
kirklandslangasek: hmm, yeah, the bios problem is a bitch22:59
alexbligh1slangasek, ok, any idea why it chokes on a line begining with a #?22:59
slangasekkirkland: I think the easiest way to avoid the bios problem is to use qemu-kvm to build all x86 emulation, even on non-kvm archs - do you think that's reasonable under the circumstances?23:00
slangasekalexbligh1: I'm guessing there's some difference in the post-processing of the templates when copying into the binary package23:01
slangasekalexbligh1: I'm having a look now at the dhcp3 source package23:01
alexbligh1slangasek, it's actually the templates file from https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/amd64/isc-dhcp-server/4.1.1-P1-15ubuntu2 I used23:03
persiaslangasek, So, some of the cross-arch build stuff we have floating around expects that a single package will handle all cross-arch needs.  Is the expectation that we'd have ${src}-extras-static and ${src}-x86-static and need to generally pull both to ensure full cross-arch support?23:03
slangasekpersia: -static is a special case; qemu-user-static does it all23:03
slangasekalexbligh1: are you using 'dh_installdebconf' to install the templates into the package?  Are you building on natty?23:04
alexbligh1I'm building on Lucid. I'm just using the stnadard dh7 rules file with a couple of overrides.23:05
persiaslangasek, Ah, so your suggestion is only that qemu-system-foo be generated separately.  by qemu-kvm for x86, and by qemu-linaro for ARM+powerpc?23:05
slangasekalexbligh1: it's possible that the behavior of either debconf or dh_installdebconf has changed between lucid and natty.  I haven't run into this before though23:05
alexbligh1slangasek, Does that not do dh_installdebconf?23:05
slangasekpersia: yep - they're already being generated separately, we just have a gap wrt i386-on-other23:06
slangaseker, x86-on-other23:06
kirklandslangasek: yes, that seems fine23:06
slangasekkirkland: ok, I'll wire it up and push to bzr, thanks23:06
persiaAh, OK.  And if it's just qemu-system, and not qemu-user, it won't affect any of the scripts I care about.  Sorry for the noise.23:07
alexbligh1slangasek, the annoying thing is I don't actually need debconf but the .init file does weird things I don't understand that seem to rely on it23:07
slangasekpersia: oh, sorry - it would also affect qemu-user but not qemu-user-static; does that make a difference?  (non-static qemu-user is never used for binfmt-misc...)23:08
=== bjf is now known as bjf[afk]
persiaNot to me.  My uses of qemu are either related to binfmt-misc, or (when I have time) about powerpc-on-powerpc with qemu-system, which I need to rearrange some services locally to test with qemu-linaro (in my queue)23:09
slangasekpersia: ok23:09
kirklandslangasek: ack, thanks23:10
slangasekalexbligh1: unwinding debconf integration from a package is somewhat non-trivial, I'm afraid I don't have time to help you with this at the moment; you could see if anyone around on #ubuntu-motu can lend a hand23:15
persiaThis channel is also fine for such things: there's no difference in the on-topicness of questions in one place or the other.23:16
alexbligh1slangasek, no problem. I will try and learn about debconf.23:16
alexbligh1After all, it would be better if it worked, and dhcp with a DBI back end might just be useful to someone else23:17
slangasekpersia: not meaning to suggest it's off-topic, merely that #ubuntu-motu is usually a good place to find people able to pitch in; is that no longer the case (de jure or de facto)?23:17
persiaslangasek, de jure from about a year back: with the breakdown of developers into lots of different types, we seek to encourage teaching and mentoring in all development channels.23:18
slangasekokie23:18
persiathe MOTU are still happy to help with stuff, as before, but other people are also supposed to be happy to help :)23:18
persiaalexbligh, To be clear: feel free to ask in -motu if you like, but odds are that most folk who understand debconf templates well are also here.23:22
alexbligh1persia, thanks. I am sure I have missed something dumb. I think I shoudl look at it when i am less tired...23:34
alexbligh1well, the issue is db_get extility-dhcpd/interfaces is returning "RET=10 extility-dhcpd/interfaces doesn't exist". Presumably the key should be defaulted somewhere, but I don't know where.23:41
sorenKeybuk: Oh, maybe you could review my mountall patch?23:43
sorenKeybuk: https://code.launchpad.net/~soren/ubuntu/natty/mountall/sigpipe-handler/+merge/4940123:43
slangasekalexbligh1: "doesn't exist" means the question isn't registered with debconf; for that you need a working .templates23:44
Keybuksoren: not without context, no23:45
Keybuksoren: why can't you add MSG_NOSIGNAL to the culprit send/write call?23:46
sorenKeybuk: Because I'm not sure which of the many send/write calls in Plymouth's client code is at fault.23:46
Keybukwell, that's where to start then ;-)23:47
Keybukgiven it's EASY to tell which syscall causes a signal23:47
sorenKeybuk: Well, I can't really.23:47
sorenKeybuk: it could be any one of them.23:47
Keybukand it's pretty easy to add the flag to all of the calls23:47
alexbligh1slangasek, thanks23:47
sorenKeybuk: Plymouth has gone the way of the segfault. The next thing that tries to talk to it blows up.23:47
sorenKeybuk: One time around it could be one write() call, next time around it could be another.23:47
Keybukright, so add the flag to them ;-)23:48
Keybukit's the right fix23:48
sorenKeybuk: I'm not sure which effect that would have, really.23:48
Keybukwe did it to D-Bus for example23:48
Keybukyou get SIGPIPE when you issue a write()/send() etc. on a disconnected socket23:48
sorenRight.23:48
Keybukadding the MSG_NOSIGNAL flag means you get an error back instead via usual errno23:48
waltersi'd be nice if the kernel had a system call to the kernel to opt out of all the broken stuff from unix23:49
walterslike, all signals23:49
Keybukwalters: it'd be *really* nice if that flag opted out of filesystem authors citing broken stuff from posix as justification for their crazy filesystem behaviour <g>23:50
waltersheh23:50
Keybuksoren: also, really close plymouth?!23:50
walterswelcome your new sprinkle-userspace-with-fdatasync() overlords23:50
Keybuksoren: why not just SIG_IGN?23:50
Keybukwalters: oh, it got much worse23:50
Keybukdid you not see the dpkg thread?23:50
sorenKeybuk: Because if I close it, we automatically attempt to reconnect.23:50
macolink plz?23:51
waltersKeybuk: nope23:51
Keybuksoren: won't the -EPIPE from write() cause that anyway23:51
waltersi should really be working but, i'll read the link =)23:51
sorenKeybuk: Good question.23:51
Keybuksoren: if you ignore the signal, it behaves23:51
sorenKeybuk: Would that be an acceptable change to mountall, then?23:52
sorenKeybuk: Or where would you stick it?23:52
Keybuksoren: since I get to play upstream, I think the acceptable change is to fix libplymouth23:53
Keybukso then everyone benefits23:53
Keybukand you don't hit this bug next week somewhere else23:53
Keybukmaco, walters: I can't find the link23:54
Keybukbut it got insane23:54
Keybukoh23:54
slangasekKeybuk: you're proposing to change the caller's signal handling from within libplymouth?23:54
Keybuknow I have23:54
Keybukslangasek: no, I'm proposing that libplymouth guards its write() calls to not result in a signal to the caller23:55
sorenKeybuk: Silly question, but what's the write() equivalent of MSG_NOSIGNAL?23:55
Keybukmaco, walters: http://lists.debian.org/debian-dpkg/2010/11/msg00075.html23:55
slangasekdid it get insane before or after tytso and Olaf van der Spek started emulating one of joeyh's thread batterns?23:55
Keybukthat has a quote of Ted's suggestion23:55
slangasekKeybuk: guards> ok23:56
macooh so i was on the right thread. i found ted's suggestion here https://bugzilla.sourcefire.com/show_bug.cgi?id=8392423:56
macoerm no23:56
macohttp://us.generation-nt.com/answer/bug-605009-serious-performance-regression-ext4-help-201204702.html?page=823:56
macoTHERE23:56
maco(two paste buffers...)23:56
maco:( ted doesnt wrap at 80 char23:58
Keybuknor do I...23:59
waltersKeybuk: the only bug i see here is dpkg isn't threaded; it's like all the unix calls, to make them sane you have to wrap them in a thread worker library23:59

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