=== ScottL_ is now known as ScottL
cody-somervilleHey. Are there any fellow DMB members kicking around with a few minutes to spare?00:38
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slangasekpitti: I would be interested in your input on bug #72293303:09
ubottuLaunchpad bug 722933 in cdbs (Ubuntu) "cdbs doc linking behavior is different when building with -b vs. -B" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/72293303:10
Chipzzslangasek: if you want my 2c, the correct solution is to walk the dependency chain when creating those symlinks03:21
slangasekChipzz: what dependency chain?  You mean look at packages outside the current build?03:21
ChipzzI mean03:21
Chipzzlibfoo-dev: depends: libfoo03:22
Chipzzthe symlink should be from libfoo-dev to libfoo03:22
slangasekthat's what it already does03:23
slangasekbut it does so inconsistently where arch: all packages are concerned03:23
Chipzzsorry, rather late here and I didn't think my comment through 100%03:24
Chipzzprobably should have shut up and not wasted your time ;)03:24
slangasekno worries... :)03:24
Chipzztrying to recall the difference between arch: all and arch: any at 4AM tends to not be very productive ;p03:25
ChipzzI always get these 2 mixed up03:25
Chipzzthe similarity between the 2 words is rather unfortunate03:26
ScottKChipzz: All means one package works on all archs (~same as rpm noarch).  Arch any means you can build the package for any arch, but you have to built it for that arch.03:39
ChipzzScottK: yeah, I can recall when I look it up :) the problem is having to look it up03:40
Chipzzwhich I didn't at 4AM ;P03:40
ScottKOnce I started thinking of it like that ^^^ I was finally able to remember it.  YMMV.03:40
ChipzzI just thought of a better way ;)03:41
Chipzz.all.deb is sth that exists, .any.deb doesn't03:42
Chipzzso all refers to the archs it will be able to installed on03:42
pooliescottk, hi04:43
pooliethanks for your feedback04:44
ScottKpoolie: Hello.04:44
pooliei think a debian/control field would work well04:44
pooliei'm just wondering how that would come to be set on a package: who would decide about it?04:44
ScottKI think that can be decided on a team by team basis.04:45
ScottKIn my mind there's a huge difference between "Hey, if you don't use UDD someone will come and hunt you down if you didn't have a really good reason" and the package upload is impossible.04:46
ScottKAs long as it's put in debian/control and not hard coded in launchpad somewhere, we can iterate on how best to manage it.04:46
poolieand, indeed, there's another one to the left of that which is "let's make sure there's a bug explaining why it wasn't or couldn't be used"04:47
pooliewell, it can be on the server and still controllable by teams04:47
ScottKPerhaps, but I think the package is a more natural place to find it.04:48
poolieone draw back is that it would take one update per package to flip it04:48
poolieperhaps that's not a big deal04:48
ScottKIf it's a package someone wants to set this on, I doubt it's a big deal.04:48
ScottKIt'll be getting uploaded anyway.04:49
ScottKI don't know about the need for filing a bug.  Most of the reasons I can think of for not using UDD with such a package are very tactical: trying to get an ISO to build and needed to push a quick fix and didn't want to mess with bzr.04:49
ScottKFor packages where UDD is problematic (e.g. kernels),  the flag won't be set anyway.04:50
pooliecan you tell me more about the "trying to get an iso to build" case?04:50
ScottKJust an example where time is of the essence.04:50
pooliei'll update the lep to suggest that then04:51
poolieshould that warning come from dput, or soyuz, or maybe somewhere else?04:51
broderpoolie: do you think it's reasonable to assume that any package that a team wants built solely from branch will also be carrying ubuntu changes?05:00
broderi guess if you need to build from a branch in the first place you almost certainly have a change of some sort05:00
pooliebroder, it seems likely05:06
pooliethough, i guess, that policy could carry over from one ubuntu cycle to the next even if there are no new changes from debian05:07
broderoh look, someone beat me to the punch on-list05:07
ScottKpoolie: I'd suggest from dput parsing the .changes file.05:11
pooliescottk, that seems reasonable05:20
poolieas i said on the list this is not the first thing we need05:21
pooliei guess it's good to know there's a way to do it eventually05:21
poolieperhaps it should have been removed from the lep05:21
ScottKRight, just recognize that some people are going to go ballistic at anything that smells of making this mandatory.05:21
pooliei know :)05:22
pooliei'd almost rather have it out there and answer it than have them suspect though05:23
pooliesuccess for me here means having people use it and like it, not having them use it at any cost05:23
ScottKI suspect that for people who tend to touch the same package or a few over and over this is a relatively easy sell.  For people who work on different packages all the time, I think it's going to be harder because branching performance is more important.05:28
pooliewe've worked on that and we'll do more05:29
pooliethe idea that came up in January was basically that for people who _can_ use it, we ought to connect the dots all the way through05:29
ScottKWhich makes sense.05:30
pooliethen we can come back and make things smoother or faster05:35
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StevenKUbuntu Distributed Development06:07
pittiGood morning06:55
pittislangasek: as we don't have access to the arch:all binaries on !i386, I don't see another way than the one you proposed06:58
pittislangasek: is there any documentation about this "Multiarch: foreign" field? it seems very weird to me that you have to mark an arch:all package with that (regardless of what it does)07:10
slangasekpitti: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MultiarchSpec07:22
slangasekpitti: specifically, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MultiarchSpec#Dependencies%20involving%20Architecture:%20all%20packages07:22
pittiah, thanks; I wonder why this isn't already the implicit default behaviour for arch:all packages then07:25
slangasekpitti: because of the explanation given there - existing packages can assume that the dependencies of the arch: all package are fulfilled by packages of the same architecture (think python + python extensions)07:27
slangasekso if we suddenly change the behavior and let the dependencies be satisfied by packages from other architectures, things will break07:28
cdbs@pilot in07:32
=== udevbot changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Archive: open | Development of Ubuntu (not support, not app development) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion for dapper -> maverick | #ubuntu-app-devel for application development on Ubuntu | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | Current Friendly Patch Pilots: cdbs
tjaaltonslangasek: you probably want the libx11 multiarch change to ubuntu as well? i've got a merge ready, could pull that in too07:41
tjaaltonit was uploaded already :)07:42
slangasektjaalton: yeah; I didn't want to step on anyone's toes by merging, but as I'm going to be looking at quite a lot of the X library stack in the coming days, if there are other libs you'd like me to merge up I'm happy to do so :)07:50
tjaaltonslangasek: there shouldn't be any left, a bunch of them were synced on friday, and only a couple of them have ubuntu changes08:01
tjaaltonso push the changes to debian and then we can sync again08:01
tjaaltondepending on the package08:01
tjaaltonslangasek: http://www.bryceharrington.org/X/Reports/ubuntu-x-swat/versions-current.html08:01
tjaaltonthat shows which packages have changes08:02
slangasektjaalton: right, I'll be pushing these changes directly to Debian first; there probably aren't too many packages I can actually change for this round, most of my work is still staged in ppa08:02
didrocksgood morning08:03
tjaaltonslangasek: okay08:07
dholbachgood morning08:20
kklimonda05:49           ScottK | It'll be getting uploaded anyway.08:21
kklimonda05:49           ScottK | I don't know about the need for filing a bug.  Most of the reasons I can think of for not using UDD with such a package are very tactical: trying to get08:21
kklimonda                       | an ISO to build and needed to push a quick fix and didn't want to mess with bzr.08:21
=== hunger_ is now known as hunger
cdbs@pilot out08:41
=== udevbot changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Archive: open | Development of Ubuntu (not support, not app development) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion for dapper -> maverick | #ubuntu-app-devel for application development on Ubuntu | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | Current Friendly Patch Pilots:
* dholbach hugs cdbs08:47
dholbachpatch pilots FTW!08:47
cdbsthanks dholbach08:59
cdbsdholbach: probably my last session of patch piloting before my exams :(09:00
dholbachcdbs, all the best with your exams!09:00
cdbsthanks dholbach09:00
debfxRAOF: X doesn't crash anymore with you packages, thanks :)09:13
RAOFdebfx: Awesomeo.09:13
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ricotzbdrung, hi09:35
=== bdrung changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Archive: open | Development of Ubuntu (not support, not app development) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion for dapper -> maverick | #ubuntu-app-devel for application development on Ubuntu | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | Current Friendly Patch Pilots:hi
=== bdrung changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Archive: open | Development of Ubuntu (not support, not app development) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion for dapper -> maverick | #ubuntu-app-devel for application development on Ubuntu | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | Current Friendly Patch Pilots:
ricotzbdrung, you looked at the current debian/changelog, and you are not happy with what is looks like?09:36
bdrung(stupid focus)09:36
ricotzbdrung, using a new "*" doesnt look right to me09:38
bdrungricotz: yes09:38
bdrungricotz: why not?09:39
ricotzhas this something to do with make it work with a script?09:39
bdrungricotz: no, it's just common practice.09:39
ricotzi my opinion it is a change to the debian packaging09:40
ricotzso if there were only one commit you would have been happy with it?09:40
bdrungno, it's not the number of commits.09:41
bdrunglook for example at http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/p/portaudio19/current/changelog09:41
ricotzsince it is going to be merged to the real branch, the commit message can be pretty09:41
ricotzbdrung, ok, this is done with git-dch?09:42
bdrungricotz: it's not about commit messages, it's about what's in debian/changelog09:42
ricotzthere are many styles to list the changes of a package09:42
bdrungone "*" for every distinct change. you did two: keep the remaining changes from last merge and drop the win32 package09:43
bdrungthe drop of the win32 package is not a subitem of "remaining change"09:44
bdrungre the link: that were all remaining changes09:45
ricotzgzip (1.3.12-9) unstable; urgency=high09:46
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tkamppeterpitti, hi09:46
bdrungricotz: there we have one old change "build and install the libx264 plugin" and a new one "v4l is gone from the kernel. Build only v4l2."09:47
ricotzbdrung, have you looked a the gzip one?09:47
ricotzbdrung, ^ this might be the most recent example09:48
ricotzwhich is the same thing09:49
bdrungricotz: look at cpio 2.9-13ubuntu1 -> http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/main/c/cpio/cpio_2.11-6ubuntu1/changelog09:50
bdrungricotz: since that version, it is a "remaining change"09:50
ricotzbdrung,  now i see what you mean09:51
ricotzbdrung, ok :), i will change this, anything besides that?09:52
bdrungricotz: probably not09:52
ricotzbdrung, done09:59
bdrungricotz: uploaded10:08
ricotzricotz, thanks10:10
bdrungsoliloquy :)10:11
ricotzi mean, bdrung, thanks ;)10:14
lifeless2363 robertc   20   0 1182m 694m 1844 S    0  9.1   4:03.13 gnome-power-man10:26
lifeless-not cool-10:26
persiaWhen managing power, the first step is accumulation: only once all power is claimed can it be distributed to others (and even that is risky)10:27
ograaccumulated power can get risky though (see lybia)10:30
ograRiddell, ScottK, so what about QT ? FF is soon and there only seems to be a symbian related bug holding it up, could we get a package before FF ?10:31
persiaogra: Isn't the difference between 4.7.1 and 4.7.2 covered by the "Upstream microreleases" clause from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FeatureFreeze ?10:33
ogramight be, my concern is that we are waiting for a feature we need to test asap10:34
Riddellogra: feel free to package a git snapshot, I'll package 4.7.2 when it's out but I don't have time or need to do anything before10:36
ograRiddell, just be aware that if NEON runtime detection doesnt work and we dont get a fix in by release i will have to turn it off statically again10:37
ograto my knowledge it hasnt been tested upstream and the bugfix is only based on assumptions10:38
mok0I'm looking for a program that will accept input from stdin (from a GTK app) and display it in a window10:44
persiamok0: zenity?10:47
mok0persia: hm, don't know that one... let me check it out10:47
persia(you might have to fiddle a bit with redirects and such, but ...)10:47
mok0persia: the problem is, this graphical app outputs a lot of error info and such via stdout, but you don't see that if the app is started from the menu10:48
persia(unless you look in .xsession-errors)10:48
persiaThat sounds like the application itself needs to be fixed.  It oughtn't do that.10:49
persiaWrapping in a display tool doesn't strike me as ideal.10:49
mok0persia: me neither10:49
mok0persia: I could pipe the output to a file in the users home dir, but that doesn't strike me as ideal either10:50
persiaThat's already implemented: .xsession-errors10:50
mok0persia: heh I completely forgot about that10:50
mok0persia: haven't worried about .xsession-errors for years10:51
persiaThe application is still buggy, but if you're digging for the output for some reason, it is saved locally.10:51
mok0persia: I suppose it is partly to help developers10:51
Riddellogra: yeah, with KDE not compiling on ARM, Qt on ARM isn't much of a priority for me :(10:51
ogratell that to the unity guys10:52
mok0persia: this program embeds Python, and the user is free to create scripts and so on; these output stuff on stdout10:52
Chipzzseems like the output is not properly redirected then10:53
persiaAh, that's a different issue.  That ought be trapped, etc.  File an upstream bug: help them there if you have interest, as this will surely be invasive.10:53
mok0persia: I am working with them already, but I doubt they would give it any priority. It's quite slow to get even small patches accepted10:55
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persiaWell, architecturally, I'd probably approach the solution as follows: 1) trap stdout in the launched python scripts, and redirect to some internal buffer10:56
persia2) Add some window or view that allows users to view the internal buffer (or perhaps just some window into it)10:56
mok0persia: hm, xconsole might do the job10:56
persia3) Add some control to show/hide the window/view10:57
mok0persia: I agree that would be a good solution. But, as I said, I doubt the developer(s) would give it any priority.10:57
persiaxconsole doesn't seem like an ideal solution: you'd still have to trap/redirect stuff to /dev/console rather than inherited STDOUT (.xsession-errors), *AND* you break if someone has an actual device attached to /dev/console10:58
mok0persia: I think you can run xconsole with a different device, using the --file switch10:58
persiaYou're planning to initiate a new pty?11:00
mok0persia: no, just wondering if it might work using a file11:00
persiaIt won't: read the manpage.  "This does not work on regular files ..."11:01
mok0persia: it actually does11:01
mok0persia: if I append to the file (using cat >> ) it appears in xconsole11:02
* persia would be very suspicious and check the code path when the manpage says "this does not work" but it appears to work: there's probably N subtle bugs11:02
mok0but ugghh it's ugly :-)11:02
mok0persia: yes. It's a bad solution anyway11:03
* mok0 ponders if he could use the notification system :-/11:03
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mok0persia: I would also have to deal with shutting down xconsole when the user quits the program. That would be quite hacky11:04
persiaNot if you write a good wrapper.  Parent opens xconsole child, then opens other child, and waits.  When other child exits, send signal to xconsole.11:05
persiaAnnoying in shell, but not hard in other languages.11:06
mok0Could probably be done in Python ...11:07
pittihey tkamppeter11:12
mok0persia: then I might as well write a wrapper program that opens a nicer window11:13
persiaIndeed :)11:14
mok0persia: Hm, I'll give it a thought. Seems like a nicer solution. There are other issues as well. The program is designed for users to navigate to their working directory, and then invoke the program from the CLI11:15
mok0persia: then it tries to read status files in that dir when starting11:16
mok0persia: but perhaps I can deal with that using python magic :-)11:17
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tkamppeterpitti, around?11:32
pittitkamppeter: yes; I was out for some errands and an appointment11:34
tkamppeterpitti, I succeeded that the Debian maintainer accepted all my Ubuntu changes into the Debian package of foo2zjs (except apport hook). Now I want to merge back the Debian package before FF, but it does not appear on https://merges.ubuntu.com/f/. Will there still be a refresh before FF?11:40
tkamppeterpitti, if not, is there a program for merging the debian/changelog? I do not want to do this manually.11:41
pittitkamppeter: it's supposed to run11:41
pittitkamppeter: you could try your luck with the new world's UDD branches11:41
pittitkamppeter: i. e. check out lp:ubuntu/fo2zjs and bzr merge lp:debian/foo2zjs11:41
pitti(if the latter is current)11:41
tkamppeterpitti, what are the "new world's UDD branches"?11:42
Chipzztkamppeter: I don't know how practical this is for merging changelogs, but I have found vimdiff invaluable in the past for merging various other things11:42
pittitkamppeter: using bzr merge on the ubuntu/debian imported branches11:42
Chipzz(if you know how to drive it, which isn't very dificult)11:42
pittitkamppeter: "bzr lp-open lp:debian/foo2zjs" -> hm, this looks out of date11:42
pittitkamppeter: personally, in these cases I just write a detailled summary of "Remainign Ubuntu changes:" into the changelog, and drop the older stuff11:44
tkamppeterpitti, packages.debian.org already shows it and AFAIK the upload was Sunday.11:44
pittitkamppeter: as this is only the apport hook now, that's easy to do11:44
pittitkamppeter: the Debian changelog has the other changes from us already, after all11:44
pittiand the older changelogs remain on Launchpad as well, so they aren't lost11:44
pittitkamppeter: i. e. take the Debian package, add the apport hook, and that's it11:45
pittitkamppeter: btw, if you can commit to the debian repo, you could commit the apport hook there as well, and only install it when building under Ubuntu11:45
tkamppeterpitti, OK, then I will simply do it this way.11:45
pittitkamppeter: http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-utopia/udisks.git;a=blob;f=debian/rules;h=82db4040c633833183d2f42576758ebbdba95152;hb=HEAD11:46
pittitkamppeter: line 27 to 2911:46
pittierm, 25 - 2811:46
tkamppeterpitti, what is planned for the future is that I will make packages for Debian where someone at Debian sponsors the upload and after a certain amount of such uploads they want to make me DM, and then one lets all packages auto-sync in Ubuntu. WDYT?11:47
pittitkamppeter: that sounds great11:48
pittitkamppeter: that's what I do as well with most of my packages11:48
tkamppeterpitti, so if in some time they will avaluate my DM approval, please add a good word for me.11:50
pittimy pleasure!11:50
tkamppeterpitti, thanks for the help.11:50
lamontScottK: postfix_2.8.0-1~build1 uploaded to natty12:30
lamontfreshening things to build for sid now12:31
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cjwatsonslangasek: I multiarch-foreign-ified binfmt-support in unstable - hope I did it right12:32
cjwatsonwill sync into Ubuntu in a bit12:32
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mdzpitti, can you tell me what this retracer error means? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-bluetooth/+bug/72089514:01
ubottuError: Bug 720895 is private14:01
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seb128mdz, it means the retracing didn't give a valid stacktrace14:06
mdzseb128, can we guess why?14:07
mdzit seems to be happening with a number of bluetooth-applet crashes14:07
pittihey mdz14:07
seb128#2  0x00007ffffe672e70 in ?? ()14:07
seb128No symbol table info available.14:07
seb128those symbols are lacking14:07
seb128let me look at the procmaps14:07
pittimdz: that's a bit misleading indeed, as the obsolete package really doesn't contribute to the stack trace being bad14:07
pittimdz: but all in all it's better to err on this side rather than keeping bugs with useless stack traces open14:08
* pitti checks the logs14:08
seb128mdz, the libdbusmenu debug symbols didn't work it seems14:09
pittiwhat the heck, it's missing two metric tons of debug symbols14:09
seb128pitti, the only revelant ones a libdbusmenu-glib3-dbgsym missing14:09
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pittioh, wait, this is misleading14:10
pittithat's noise added by a recent patch, that tries to find both -dbg and -dbgsym14:10
seb128pitti, can you see what libdbusmenu versions were installed?14:12
* pitti fixes that in trunk14:12
seb128pitti, fix what? the -dbg thing?14:13
pittiseb128: the confusing warnings about missing -dbg packages14:13
pittiseb128: I can't see the installed libdbusmenu versions in the log, but it tries to install the one from Dependencies.txt14:14
pittilibdbusmenu-glib3 0.3.97-0ubuntu314:14
seb128pitti, can you see what dbgsym was brough in?14:15
seb128there was no version changes for some days before that crash14:15
seb128the ddeb binaries should have been current and working14:15
seb128or we are back to the gdb failing to load symbols issue we discussed yesterday14:15
pittihttp://ddebs.ubuntu.com/pool/main/libd/libdbusmenu/ even has both still14:16
pittiseb128: if it's too old gdb, then it's a different breakage; https://i64539621.restricted.launchpadlibrarian.net/64539621/Stacktrace.txt doesn't complain anywhere about DWARF opcodes14:16
seb128mdz, can you trigger that crash easily?14:17
mdzseb128, it happens pretty regularly, debugging with cyphermox right now14:17
mdzbut on the phone14:17
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seb128mdz, can you submit the crash and give me the number before it's retraced if you have a chance?14:18
seb128mdz, I want to try to retrace it manually to see what's going on14:18
mdzseb128, it may not be the same one but my most recent crash is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-bluetooth/+bug/72316614:18
ubottuError: Bug 723166 is private14:18
seb128mdz, I was going to suggest opening also a but with a stacktrace, seems a libdbusmenu issue14:18
seb128then we can ping ted about it14:18
seb128but if cyphermox is debugging it that works as well14:19
pittiseb128: just telling him how to get to mdz's unretraced bug and how to use apport-retrace14:21
seb128pitti, I want to figure why the retracing is failing14:21
seb128pitti, debug symbols work locally, I've been doing indicator valgrind and gdb logs recently and didn't get issues14:22
pittithat'd be great; good luck!14:22
pittiseb128: you could locally install gdb 6.8 and see whether that makes it fail?14:22
pittias a first step for bisecting where the problem is14:22
seb128pitti, ok14:22
pittiseb128: if it's 6.8, then I'll move back the gdk-pixbuf and udisks issues that'd be next in my queue, and start debugging that in the fakechroots14:23
seb128why the heck isn't the apport-retrace auth thing working on the retracers14:29
seb128ok, let me downgrading gdb locally first14:30
pittiseb128: apport-chroot login --auth $HOME/.lpcookie chroots/natty.tar.gz14:30
pittiseb128: --auth needs an absolute path, that's a common trap14:30
seb128pitti, I did that14:30
seb128and then apport-retrace --auth /tmp/auth14:30
pitticat /tmp/auth works?14:30
pittiif you use e. g. --auth ../.lpcookie, it'll fail14:30
seb128pitti, ok, that was it, thanks14:31
pittiseb128: fixed apport-chroot in bzr for doing os.path.abspath() now14:32
seb128pitti, thanks14:33
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ricotzpitti, hi, could you look at the libbluray package in upload queue?14:43
pittiricotz: which queue?14:47
ricotzpitti, natty new queue14:48
pittiseb128: hm, gdk-pixbuf builds just fine here locally..14:49
pittiricotz: maybe later today, after meetings14:49
pittinatty queues are usually done by the archive admins14:49
ricotzpitti, alright, thanks14:50
seb128pitti, it might be using system libraries for itself or something?14:50
seb128pitti, it built fine there as well before I uploaded14:50
pittiright, that was my idea; I'll try to remove them first14:50
seb128ricotz, Riddell is archive admin of the day14:50
ricotzseb128, thx14:51
ricotzRiddell, could you take a look at the libbluray package in the natty new queue it will be needed to build a bluray-capable mplayer14:51
Riddellricotz: I'll be doing New queue reviews shortly14:52
ricotzRiddell, thanks14:52
pittiseb128: ah, there; that was it, building against libgdk-pixbuf2.0-dev14:53
seb128pitti, ok, explains why it works locally14:53
doko_mterry: about 555901, I opened it myself, I can't review it14:57
mterrydoko_, oh, must have missed that15:00
Riddellmterry: could bug 718774 get some love?  we have a feature freeze deadline coming15:03
ubottuLaunchpad bug 718774 in pyudev (Ubuntu) "[MIR] pyudev" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/71877415:03
mterryRiddell, sorry, I've been doing feature freeze stuff of my own.  I can look at it today15:07
raphinkhi there :-)15:07
Riddellhi raphink15:08
raphinkwhat's up?15:08
Riddellfeature freeze in two days!15:08
raphinkI know Riddell15:08
raphinktrying to get some people motivated to release augeas 0.8.0 before so I can upload it :-)15:09
Riddellmpoirier: ** linux-n900 could not be accepted due to The source linux-n900 - 2.6.35-1.1 is already accepted in ubuntu/natty and you cannot upload the same version within the same distribution15:29
mpoirierpersia: ^^^^^^^15:30
RiddellI accepted the first upload and rejected the second15:30
vilacjwatson: after banging my head for quite some... time, I finally came across: http://paste.ubuntu.com/570627/15:35
vilacjwatson: I'm more than willing to add my own thanks but I still don't understand what is going on15:36
vilacjwatson: are such handlers inherited ? The case at hand is a python process spawning a shell itself spawning a 'yes' process15:37
vilacjwatson: if I kill the shell, it turns into a zombie but the the parent python process can still read the 'y' sent by the 'yes' process 8-/15:38
siretartwho rejected libbluray in NEW and why?15:38
cjwatsonvila: signal dispositions set to SIG_IGN are preserved across fork and execve15:39
vilacjwatson: if I use the subprocess_setup in the paste above, the 'yes' dies with the shell... I'm probably close to understanding why but... not there yet15:39
Riddellsiretart: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-archive/2011-February/039665.html15:39
cjwatsonvila: meeting, I'll get back to you in a bit15:39
vilacjwatson: ok15:39
siretartRiddell: ah, I see. thanks15:39
siretartricotz: I guess you are already on it?15:40
ricotzsiretart, hi, actually not, should have looked the copyright file :(15:41
siretartricotz: I'm pretty busy today with work stuff. do you have time to have a look?15:42
ricotzsiretart, not sure, was it accepted in debian?15:43
siretartricotz: still in NEW15:43
hyperairDktrKranz: ping. got a moment to look at a NEW banshee-community-extensions? ;-)15:43
siretartricotz: if you can, please fix it in our git and upload from there. or ping me or someone to upload15:44
ricotzsiretart, ok, will see if i have some time15:45
ScottKlamont: Coolness.  Thanks.15:46
mdzis there a bug open about the excessive U1 notifications in natty? I get them constantly15:46
Riddellogra: W: libqtdee2: breaks-without-version libqtdee115:49
hyperairDktrKranz: actually forget it, we have new extensions, so wait til 1.9.415:50
pitti? shouldn't different sonames be coinstallable?15:50
lamontpitti: that is sort of why we have sonames in package names15:50
ograRiddell, thanks15:51
Riddellpitti: the package contains some data files15:52
pittiah, that should be moved to a -common package then15:52
seb128pitti, ok15:52
seb128pitti, http://paste.ubuntu.com/570635/15:52
seb128pitti, on the same return process locally with gdb 6.8 and7.215:52
* ogra is currently busy with libqtbamf, i'll care for qtdee afterwards15:52
pittiseb128: ok, so I'll sit down and have a deep look at this gdb 7.2 breakage after the TB meeting15:54
pittiseb128: which bug # were you using for testing again? (in the fakechroots)15:56
seb128pitti, I didn't find one which fails in today's queue and all the old retracing which failed has their crashdumps cleaned15:57
pittiseb128: which one were you using for above pastebin?15:57
seb128pitti, let's wait a bit i'm sure we will receive another crash to play with15:57
seb128pitti, I just attach gdb to a running indicator and put a breakpoint15:57
pittiseb128: well, at some point we need to update to gdb 7.2 anyway; it alreayd hurt us with x.org15:57
pittiseb128: ah15:58
seb128pitti, I guess you can sig11 an indicator and copy the crashdump to the dc and play with gdb on it15:58
pittiseb128: I'll find one15:58
pittiseb128: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdk-pixbuf/2.23.0-1ubuntu3 \o/15:58
seb128pitti, danke!15:58
pittide rien15:58
seb128wth with the i386 retracer as well15:59
seb128pitti, oh btw I commented the 10.10 amd64 retracer because I screwed the tarball for it16:00
seb128I will fix that later on16:01
pittiseb128: that's ok; it will fail anyway, as maverick's apport is still trying to talk to edge16:01
seb128(I did Ctrl-C the wrong command and stopped it while it was doing the update)16:01
pittiseb128: you can "exit 1" (or anything non-zero) in a --save chroot to abort the saving, btw16:03
pittithat's the "oh sh**" ejection seat16:04
seb128right, I know, but that was a run of the crash-digger16:04
seb128i.e same command as the cron16:04
GunnarHjScottK: Hi, the lists of backports bugs are alarmingly long. Is there any chance to draw your attention to bug 719815, which I have prepared with branches that should be ready to build from?16:05
ubottuLaunchpad bug 719815 in maverick-backports "Please backport gdm and language-selector to Lucid and Maverick" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/71981516:05
ScottKGunnarHj: For something as central to Ubuntu Desktop as gdm, I'd want someone from the Desktop team like seb128 to review it.16:06
ScottKIf you can get seb128 (or whoever he wants to look into it) to concur with the backport, then ping me.16:07
seb128no opinion on that one, pitti has been sponsoring the work in natty and is probably better placed to comment16:08
GunnarHjScottK: I see. I'll ask Martin P. then, since he sponsored me when uploading the things in Natty.16:08
ScottKThat'd be fine too.16:08
=== herton is now known as herton_lunch
=== beuno is now known as beuno-lunch
pittitseliot, bryce: AFAIR nvidia or nvidia-common now have postinst magic to do the necessary xorg.conf additions; do we still need to do any of them in jockey? We currently set DefaultDepth=24 (all versions) and AddARGBGLXVisuals=True (for version 96)16:14
pittiand it also disables the dri2 module16:15
pittiAFAIR the actual driver doesn't need to be set any more, as x.org now autodetects it and prefers nvidia > nv, right?16:15
tseliotpitti: nvidia-common, in addition to the libraries which Jockey uses, has some debconf magic to handle obsolete drivers but I don't think it deals with xorg.conf in any way16:16
tseliotpitti: the code that touches xorg.conf files is all in Jockey's handlers. And we definitely need the NoLogo option even though DefaultDepth is now set by default when no xorg.conf is available16:18
pittitseliot: ah, ok, thanks; seems I misremembered then16:18
pittimight have mixed it up with the blacklisting in wl16:18
tseliotpitti: yes, that's likely (about wl). I keep forgetting about nvidia-common too ;)16:19
slangasekcjwatson: looks good to me :)16:25
* slangasek giggles at the implications of a multi-arch: foreign binfmt-support16:26
cjwatsonthought you might like it16:26
sebnertseliot: is the new linux blob beta driver compatible with new xorg already?16:26
tseliotsebner: nope16:27
sebnertseliot: :(16:27
=== jam3 is now known as jam
sebnertseliot: well, still 2 months time ^^16:31
GunnarHjScottK: Martin added a short comment on bug 719815. His remark about l-s not working was made before he realised that I prepared custom branches. (He is in a meeting now.)16:45
ubottuLaunchpad bug 719815 in maverick-backports "Please backport gdm and language-selector to Lucid and Maverick" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/71981516:45
kirklandseb128: pitti: didrocks: hey guys;  you helped me get alt-tab working in Gnome last week;  i'm *trying* to use unity now, and alt-tab is disabled there16:45
seb128kirkland, try to run unity --reset16:45
ScottKGunnarHj: OK.  I'm just heading out for a $work meeting.  Please ping me again tomorow.16:45
kirklandseb128: pitti: didrocks: I went back to compiz settings in unity and enabled application switch and all hell broke loose16:45
kirklandseb128: okay, i'll do that, but can you tell me what unity --reset does, and why i need to run it daily?16:46
didrockskirkland: enabling disabling plugin make compiz crash16:46
seb128you shouldn't need to run it daily16:46
GunnarHjScottK: Ok, will do.16:46
didrockskirkland: did you change other plugins?16:46
seb128kirkland, it reset your compiz unity profile16:46
kirklandseb128: hmm, well i have to run it every time i ask a question about unity16:46
didrocksnormally, staticswitcher is enabled by default16:46
didrocksI didn't run it for weeks here16:46
seb128kirkland, well seems resetting your normal profile worked last time you might have the same issue in your unity profile16:47
didrocksit's just resetting all your unity and compiz config to default16:47
seb128kirkland, you shouldn't have to run it again if you don't play with ccsm settings16:47
kirklanddidrocks: seb128: okay, i've run unity --reset, still no alt-tab16:47
kirklandseb128: i never play with ccsm settings16:47
seb128ok so you probably have a different issue, I will let didrocks deal with that16:48
kirklandseb128: thanks16:48
kirklanddidrocks: help?  :-)16:48
kirklanddidrocks: i haven't changed any settings;  any settings that might have been changed can be killed16:48
didrocksseb128: only dealing with easy answers?  :p16:49
kirklanddidrocks: all i want is alt-tab to work, and i want super-L to push-to-talk in Mumble16:49
seb128kirkland, what videocard do you have?16:49
didrockskirkland: ok, so now that you resetted16:49
didrockskirkland: can you try two things16:49
seb128didrocks, we all need to recon our competence limits :p16:49
didrocksSuper + W16:49
didrocksseb128: heh :)16:49
didrocksthen, look at ccsm and look if staticswitcher is enabled16:49
kirklandseb128: intel, in an x20116:50
kirklanddirecthex: what is Super + W ?16:50
didrockskirkland: it's supposed to trigger the expo mode16:50
didrocks(same that if you click on the ws switcher button)16:50
didrocksdirecthex: I think the question was for me :)16:51
kirklanddirecthex: sorry16:51
kirklanddidrocks: right, what keys are Super + W ?16:51
didrockswhat keys? Not super to understand the question16:52
kirklandseb128: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/570658/16:52
kirklanddidrocks: what do i press on my keyboard to activate Super + W ?16:53
kirklanddidrocks: ie, I press the Windows key to activate Super + L16:53
kirklanddidrocks: what do i press to do you what you asked me to do, Super + W?16:53
seb128kirkland, super = windows key16:53
seb128so super - W = windows_key - W16:53
=== jj-afk is now known as jjohansen
kirklandseb128: okay, when i press that, all of my windows zoom out to little thumbnails16:54
didrockskirkland: ok, so the expo effect (used by staticswitcher is there)16:54
kirklanddidrocks: ^16:54
pittiseb128: I sent an RT ticket for the dchroot error message cron spam, FYI16:54
didrockskirkland: so, look at ccsm now16:54
didrocksis staticswitcher enabled?16:54
=== herton_lunch is now known as herton
kirklanddidrocks: hmm, i'm kind of afraid of ccsm right now;  when i changed something in there 10 minutes ago, my whole desktop when bonkers....16:55
kirklanddidrocks: okay, application switcher is not enabled16:55
kirklanddidrocks: i don't see anything called "static switcher"16:56
didrockskirkland: right, activating/deactivating plugins make compiz crash16:56
kirklanddidrocks: aint that a shame16:56
didrockskirkland: a bug rather16:56
seb128it will be fixed before natty16:56
didrockskirkland: ok, you don't have compiz-plugins-main installed I bet16:56
didrockslet me look for the exact package name16:57
didrockskirkland: compiz-fusion-plugins-main16:57
=== deryck is now known as deryck[lunch]
kirklanddidrocks: right, that wasn't installed16:58
kirklanddidrocks: installing now16:58
kirklanddidrocks: okay, installed, now what?16:58
* kirkland bets he has to unity --reset again16:58
didrockskirkland: hum, maybe not :)16:58
robertknightThe blueprint page for the 'ThirdPartyApt' spec states that it has been superseded (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ThirdPartyApt) but I couldn't see what it was replaced by.16:58
didrockskirkland: not sure if compiz changes the keys16:59
kirklanddidrocks: okay, now i have the static switch in compiz config thingy16:59
kirklanddidrocks: and it is enabled16:59
didrockskirkland: ok, just restart unity then :)16:59
kirklanddidrocks: how do i do that?16:59
didrockslaunch unity16:59
kirklanddidrocks: logout and log back in?17:00
didrocks$ unity17:00
didrocksor logout and log back17:00
didrocksas you want :)17:00
kirklandcan i launch unity from within unity?17:00
didrocksyeah :)17:00
kirklanddidrocks: okay, thanks, now i can alt-tab, thanks17:00
kirklanddidrocks: indulge me with one more question ...17:01
didrockssure :)17:01
kirklanddidrocks: why do my icons go back and forth, back and forth from colored icons, to the monochrome ones, every day?17:01
kirklanddidrocks: like the ubuntu symbol in the top left?17:01
didrockskirkland: when you hover the ubuntu icon?17:01
didrocksyeah, it's fading17:01
didrocksI can ensure you it's fading, I wrote it :p17:02
didrocksso, basically, the idea is:17:02
kirklanddidrocks: that's not what i mean17:02
kirklanddidrocks: http://people.canonical.com/~kirkland/Screenshot.png17:02
kirklanddidrocks: see how i have the 3-color ubuntu symbol right now?17:02
didrocksgnome-settings-daemon is crashing for you17:02
didrocksI think there is a known crasher right now, seb128 ? ^17:03
kirklanddidrocks: if i reboot or logout/login later, i might have the colored one, or, i might have the black-and-white monochrome theme17:03
seb128kirkland, run gnome-settings-daemon17:03
pittiseb128: purging the launchpadlib cache helped, i386 retracer runs again17:03
kirklanddidrocks: and if i logout/in later, it might be back to the colorful one17:03
seb128pitti, oh, weird but nice as well17:03
didrocksyeah, g-s-d in any case17:03
seb128kirkland, it seems g-s-d is crashing17:03
seb128didrocks, yes, several known crashers17:03
kirklanddidrocks: seb128: i don't care much which it is;  i'm just kinda tired of the back and forth, back and forth :-)17:03
kirklandseb128: okay17:03
kirklandlet me run that17:03
seb128there is a race with the gdm g-s-d which makes the user one try to run before the gdm one exit on modern hardwares17:04
pittiseb128: ~/.launchpadlib/api.launchpad.net/credentials/ had ".lpcookie       apport-collect  debug", that looked confusing asa well17:04
seb128in those case it fails to start17:04
kirklandseb128: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/570665/17:04
pittiseb128: I don't restart them yet, though, while I'm debugging17:04
seb128pitti, that was me trying to figure what ./subscribe... tries to use17:04
seb128pitti, the directory was empty earlier17:04
pittiah, ok; so it was something in the cache then17:05
seb128pitti, I started by copying the debug one api.edge17:05
=== dendrobates is now known as dendro-afk
seb128one from api.edge17:05
ograRiddell, what data files were you referring to above in libqtdee ?17:09
Riddellogra: qml files no?17:10
Riddellogra: my issue is that Breaks should be Conflicts (at least that's what lintian said, I'm not too bothered)17:10
ograRiddell, /usr/lib/qt4/imports/dee/qmldir which contains the plugin name17:11
ograi think its needed by the lib to function properly17:11
ograRiddell, yeah, i see that lintian warning, i wonder why a check of the source doesnt reveal it and i'm a bit confused, i thoght all Confilcts are supposed to be replaced by Breaks nowadays17:12
ograpitti, ^^^ ?17:12
ograwasnt theer a policy change ?17:12
Riddellnot all17:12
pittiogra: it needs to be versioned then, if the breakage is only due to a bug (and getting fixed), and not permanent17:13
ograwell, its mainly just a transition to a new ABI number17:13
pitti"Conflicts should be used ... in other cases where one must prevent simultaneous installation of two packages for reasons that are ongoing (not fixed in a later version of one of the packages)"17:13
=== Quintasan_ is now known as Quintasan
cjwatsonvila: I'm not sure I quite understand the context of your question.  Can you give me some?  An 'strace -f' would help too17:14
pittiogra: as this is clearly a bug in the package which should be fixed (and should have been caugth in MIR review, FWIW), Breaks: is actually correct :)17:14
ograpitti, it was v1 during MIR review17:15
ograABI bump just happened with recent upload17:15
pittiogra: right, but library packages must not ship non-SONAME specific paths17:15
vilacjwatson: hmm, strace would be tricky there as it's in a test and can't reproduced on demand :-/ but,17:15
ograpitti, oh, you mean i need to create a whole package for the one file that tells the lib where to find its plugin ?17:16
ogra(it wont function without that one file)17:16
vilacjwatson: roughly it's subprocess.Popen('yes', shell=True, stdout.PIPE, sterr.PIPE)17:16
ograthat seems a bit overkill17:16
pittiogra: that, or make the one file obsolete, or moving it to a subdir which is named after the soname17:16
pittiogra: why do you need a file which tells you where to find another file?17:16
ograi'm not sure upstream will still work afterwards17:16
cjwatsonvila: ok, and what results are you trying to get?17:17
vilacjwatson: then os.kill(proc.pid)17:17
ograpitti, no idea, i'm just taking upstreams branch and upload it, i have no clue how QML works17:17
vilacjwatson: and I want both '/bin/sh' and 'yes' to die17:17
* ogra will try to find out17:17
vilacjwatson: I got that most of the time, but sometimes, I get '/bin/sh' zombie and 'yes' still alive17:17
vilacjwatson: so the preserved SIG_IGN was at least a valid scenario, but after tens of tests, the zombie is back (not that surprising for a zombie you might say but still)17:19
cjwatsonvila: I would do subp.stdout.close(); subp.wait()17:19
cjwatsonvila: if you've done that subprocess_setup thing to fix python's broken defaults, then that will cause the yes process to get SIGPIPE and die, and then its parent sh will die too17:19
cjwatsonassuming there are no other dups of subp.stdout17:19
vilacjwatson: that will work for 'yes' but I use it only for tests, I want to capture stderr/stdout until the death in the general case17:20
vilacjwatson: that's what I thought too, but evidence disagrees :(17:20
cjwatsonyour current code has nothing to do with that SIG_IGN thing17:20
cjwatsonyou're not sending it SIGPIPE so the disposition of SIGPIPE is at best relevant only by chance17:21
cjwatsonSIGPIPE only happens when a process tries to write to a pipe with no open readeres17:21
vilacjwatson: so even if the ssh is a zombie the pipes are still alive between 'yes' and my python 'process' ?17:21
cjwatsonthe data from yes does not go through the sh process17:22
vilaand but the SIGTERM signal should still be received by 'yes' no ?17:22
cjwatsonno, why would it?17:22
cjwatsonyou're only killing the sh17:22
cjwatsonif you want to kill all the subprocesses, then you need to create a new process group17:23
=== beuno-lunch is now known as beuno
cjwatsonthen you can os.kill(-proc.pid) (note the -) to send a signal to all the processes in the process group17:23
vilacjwatson: the group can start at the subprocess level ? (aka the /bin/sh one)17:23
cjwatsonyes, you can do setpgrp in a preexec_fn17:24
vilathat's it then17:24
cjwatsonyou may still have some other problem; consider races between the kill and your subprocess forking something17:24
=== bjf is now known as bjf[afk]
cjwatsonit's difficult to fix this if you don't want to close subp.stdout17:25
vilacjwatson: not in my case17:25
cjwatsonyou have at least one fork even in your dummy example17:26
vilaat least if the progress group is inherited17:26
vilacjwatson: two forks, one for /bin/sh, one for yes, correct ?17:26
cjwatsonyeah, two, and of course you have no control over whether the kernel pauses for a week between scheduling the two of them17:26
cjwatsonyou should be OK as long as none of the processes have SIGTERM handlers17:27
cjwatsonyou could follow the strategy of SIGTERM, wait a bit, SIGKILL17:27
vilayou mean I can manage to kill /bin/sh while 'yes' is still llimbo ?17:27
vilas/llimbo/in limbo/17:27
cjwatsonno, in your case it will be OK17:28
cjwatsonit would only be for processes that have "clever" SIGTERM handlers so that they might go on to fork something else even after you've sent SIGTERM17:28
vilaright, out of scope for me indeed17:29
cjwatsonI would say, though, that any and all uses of Python's subprocess module to do anything other than forking another Python process should use that SIGPIPE fragment17:29
cjwatsonI have a bug open to make it the default17:29
cjwatsonI should push that further up the hill at some point17:29
vilathe subprocess aren't supposed to play tricks like that17:29
vilacjwatson: but then, if the subprocess is a python one, won't it re-install the handler for its own need ?17:30
cjwatsonthat's why I said "anything other than forking another Python process", because as you say Python will reinstall the handler17:30
vilacjwatson: so your fragment can be safely used in all cases17:30
cjwatsonoh, certainly17:30
cjwatsonit's just not mandatory in that exceptional case :)17:30
vilaok great17:30
cjwatson(and honestly, who does that ...)17:30
vilacjwatson: well, I was about to switch to shell=False and stick to python to be honest ;)17:31
cjwatsonshell=True is usually a bad idea anyway17:31
=== diwic is now known as diwic_afk
cjwatsonthere's no reason for it except in very lazy programs17:31
vilacjwatson: or very simple tests from an unsuspecting dev :-}17:32
=== Claudinu1_ is now known as Claudinux
cjwatsonshell=False saves a process, avoids going through the shell's command parsing, and encourages clearer thinking17:32
cjwatson(and saves kittens)17:32
=== Claudinux is now known as Guest18451
=== dendro-afk is now known as dendrobates
vilahehe, well, 'false', 'yes', 'true' are good and simple commands to think about when concentrating on other stuff ;)17:34
vilacjwatson: thanks a lot anyway (I found this snippet while grepping madly, glad you were the right Colin ;)17:35
=== Claudinu1_ is now known as Claudinux__
cjwatsonheh, yeah, I'm the one obsessed with minutiae of spawning subprocesses17:37
cjwatsonpitti: could you look at utouch-frame in NEW?17:38
cjwatsonneeded to fix d-i17:39
ograpitti, what does the policy gain us here Kaleo and i are discussing the package, the lib wont work without the dir, QML needs the file ... if i package a -common package with the one file included we wont gain anything17:39
vilacjwatson: well, we're two ;)17:39
cjwatsonogra: the purpose of the policy is to simplify future upgrades by ensuring that multiple versions of libraries are coinstallable17:39
=== Claudinux__ is now known as Claudinux
Kaleoogra: one thing though: the lib works without the QML plugin17:39
Kaleoogra: the QML plugin can be made a separate package that depends on the lib17:39
cjwatsonogra: non-coinstallable libraries create complications for apt17:40
vilacjwatson: and I think I found the problem in my test: I was probably killing /bin/sh *before* it could fork 'yes', adding os.setpgrp made it fail at one point highlighting the race17:40
ograKaleo, so should i create a -common package for ./usr/lib/qt4/imports/dee/ then ?17:40
Kaleoogra: not really17:41
cjwatsonvila: if you killed it before it forked yes, it wouldn't have forked it, I'd expect17:41
ograhow else do we solve it ?17:41
Kaleoogra: more of a package named libqtdee-qml or libqtdee-declarative17:41
cjwatsonvila: perhaps sh has a race where if you kill it just after it forks a subprocess it forgets that it needs to clean it up17:41
ograthat needs changes in a lot of additional places then17:42
ograassuming that libqtdee-qml will now be our toplevel17:42
cjwatsonor perhaps killing sh doesn't reliably kill its subprocesses in the first place; I try to avoid relying on that kind of thing17:42
vilacjwatson: could be, and tests may not be the best place to ... right17:42
Kaleoogra: libqtdee-qml would depend on the libqtdee and unity-2d would depend on libqtdee-qml17:42
ograKaleo, thats what i mean, yeah17:43
bcurtiswxis there an apt command to view the changelog from a package?17:43
Kaleoogra: actually I don't think we use libqtdee-qml in Unity 2D anymore, let me check17:43
vilacjwatson: sounds like the best option anyway, too many obscure edge cases there that I can safely avoid by sticking to python17:43
* Kaleo has the feeling he is talking shit17:43
ograKaleo, you mean it could go completely ?17:43
* ogra is confused17:43
Kaleoogra: well, it *could* go because nobody is using it today; it does not mean it should go: it is a very useful QML plugin on its own17:44
* ogra tries to find an ARM employee to get him access to the coffee bar ... one sec brb17:45
Kaleoogra: but in terms of dependency for Unity 2D we don't need it; we can depend as we do today on libqtdee17:45
Kaleoogra: and just split out in a separate binary package the qml plugin17:45
Kaleoogra: would that be ok?17:45
cjwatsonbcurtiswx: apt-get changelog, as of natty.  not in earlier releases.17:46
Kaleoogra: but I am not sure it helps the purpose of the policy17:46
Kaleoogra: essentially the QML plugin is a library17:47
bcurtiswxcjwatson, OK so if I'm on a maverick machine looking for a natty changelog, i should just use packages.ubuntu.com ?17:47
Kaleoogra: and right now multiple versions of libraries are not coinstallable17:47
Kaleoogra: and it won't help to create another package I am afraid17:47
cjwatsonbcurtiswx: yes, or launchpad17:48
ograKaleo, well, if pitti hadnt complained i wouldnt have been inclined to even think about changing it17:54
ogra(sorry for the interruption)17:54
Kaleoogra: don't worry :)17:54
Kaleopitti: what's your take on it? (I was not on the chan before, sorry)17:55
=== sforshee is now known as sforshee-lunch
jonois anyone having playback issues with Banshee in Natty?18:22
=== deryck[lunch] is now known as deryck
jonoI am getting this when running it in the terminal:18:22
jono[Warn  10:21:46.152] Service `Banshee.MediaEngine.PlayerEngineService' not initialized: Broken pipe [EPIPE].18:22
davidascherbarry: ping18:23
* ogra wonders if jono secretly switched to arm hardware ... we are used to such errors in banshee :)18:25
=== bjf[afk] is now known as bjf
jonoogra, strange18:28
jonoI assume my alsasink is not working in gstreamer18:28
ograyeah, something like that18:28
ograthere is a debug flag you can run mono apps with18:28
ograsee --help of banshee18:29
slangasekpitti: so do you think we need to worry about package size increases on i386 if I make this cdbs change?18:29
pittiogra: we will gain upgradeability18:30
pittiogra, Kaleo: as I said, you could store the qml file in a per-SONAME path18:31
pittii. e. not /usr/share/myproject/foo.qml, but /usr/share/myproject/0/foo.qml18:31
ograpitti, then QML wont work anymore18:31
ograit looks in that specific path18:31
pittithe hackish alternative would be to have all libfooN Replaces: libfoo(N-1), libfoo(N-2), etc.18:32
pittibut that piles up over time18:32
pittiogra: the cleanest solution really is to move the QML file away from the library18:32
ograand have a -common package ?18:32
pittiogra: why does it need to be in the lib? it could be in unity-2d itself?18:32
pittior another one which is suitable18:32
ograi think a -common package or a -qml package would be cleaner18:33
pittislangasek: alternates will certainly go up a bit, but as the difference to amd64 hasn't gone up significantly, I'm not too worried about this18:33
ograinstead of tainting unity-2d sources18:33
slangasekpitti: ok18:33
pittislangasek: and anyway, we don't have much choice here, do we?18:33
slangasekpitti: well, we could defer this change until the beginning of natty+1 and I could use $CDBS_NO_DOC_SYMLINKING for anything I need to touch right now18:35
slangasekpitti: but I prefer to fix cdbs if that's ok with you :)18:35
tkamppetermterry, I have uploaded the ghostscript version which needs gs-cjk-resource now. Can you please move gs-cjk-resource into main before FF? Thanks. Bug 718692.18:43
ubottuLaunchpad bug 718692 in gs-cjk-resource (Ubuntu) "[MIR] gs-cjk-resource" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/71869218:43
tkamppeterpitti, or can you move an approved MIR, too?18:44
mterrytkamppeter, I'm not an archive admin, so I can't do it18:44
tkamppeterpitti, I have uploaded ghostscript 9.01~dfsg-1ubuntu1 which depends on gs-cjk-resource at run time, but not during build. Does this cause any problem with gs-cjk-resource being moved to main?18:48
pittitkamppeter: it will cause CDs to become uninstallable18:48
pitti(main dependency to universe)18:48
pittidoes it have an approved MIR?18:49
tkamppeterpitti, the MIR is filed as bug 718692 and already set to "Fix committed" by the MIR approval team.18:50
ubottuLaunchpad bug 718692 in gs-cjk-resource (Ubuntu) "[MIR] gs-cjk-resource" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/71869218:50
pittitkamppeter: ah, sweet; let me promote it then, to avoid uninstallability18:50
cody-somervilleCan anyone confirm that marking a bug as incomplete after a bug has been verified and triaged and we're just waiting to confirm a patch fixes the issue is *not* standard process?18:50
tkamppeterpitti, thanks.18:50
pitticody-somerville: I have used "incomplete" in that way -- for me it generally means "the assignee cannot continue working on this bug wwithout further data from the reporter"18:51
pittinot sure whether that's being frowned upon, though18:51
tkamppeterpitti, thanks.18:51
cody-somervillepitti, It seems wrong to me that a bug would get expired because the reporter decided not to build their own kernel to test a patch when clearly the bug had enough information for a developer to come up with a tentative patch.18:53
pitticody-somerville: that seems extreme, yes; I usually build a package with a patch in a PPA if I can't reproduce the problem and am unsure whether my patch fixes it18:54
pittiI think it should be acceptable to ask a bug reporter to try a PPA18:54
pitti(if you ensure that it has nothing else/crackful in it)18:54
pittibuilding kernels with a patch, not so much18:54
* cody-somerville happens to be the reporter who has a kernel bug marked incomplete waiting for him to test a kernel patch <g>.18:56
cody-somervillepitti, what would you recommend as a status instead? maybe in progress?18:57
pittisounds ok, but it would interfere with my bug list18:57
pittiI'd actually recommend "needs info", but ask for a test kernel in a PPA or some people.c.c. URL :)18:58
* cody-somerville nods.18:59
cody-somervillepitti, Are you on Maverick?18:59
pittino, natty COTD18:59
cody-somervillepitti, Do you have a usb headset by any chance?19:00
pitticody-somerville: I had until a few months ago, then the cable broke, and I threw it away19:00
pittiI have an USB sound card, though19:00
pittii. e. USB to standard mike/headphone jack19:00
pittiI found that more flexible, as usually I want to use my laptop's normal jacks19:01
cody-somervillepitti, not sure if that would trigger it but if I unplug my usb headset while audio is playing my kernel panics - a number of other folks have reported the same issue. Seems like a nasty little regression in maverick. :(19:02
\shanyone has a clue how to determine reliable a chroot environment (without tweaking the shell prompt, pls ;))19:02
\shcody-somerville: should I unplug my usb headset now to test?19:03
\sheventually switching before that to tty0?19:04
=== sforshee-lunch is now known as sforshee
=== dendrobates is now known as dendro-afk
cody-somerville\sh, after saving your work, be my guest. I've gotten a kernel traceback and vmdump but if you do see anything interesting not already in the bug report (LP #715318) feel free to add.19:05
ubottuLaunchpad bug 715318 in linux (Ubuntu) "Disconnecting USB headset while audio playing results in kernel panic" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/71531819:05
=== dendro-afk is now known as dendrobates
cody-somerville\sh, If you can reproduce and also happen to enjoy compiling your own kernel, I'd be most grateful if you tested the proposed patch as well :)19:05
pitticody-somerville: just tried that here in current natty, works fine19:06
\shcody-somerville: the stacktrace is written somewhere while it crashes or should I enable crashdump writing support somehow?19:07
slangasekpitti: do you want to review my cdbs patch before I upload, or are you happy as long as it passes my shallow testing?19:08
=== shadeslayer is now known as shadeslayer_
pittislangasek: I trust the test suite enough to prevent major damage, but I'm happy to peer review; is it in bzr?19:09
cody-somerville\sh, I installed 'crash', ran sudo mkdir -p /var/crash/, and tweaked a few files in /etc/defaults/ for good measure turning all the crash related stuff I could find on, lol19:09
pittislangasek: hm, nothing new in the branch right now19:09
slangasekpitti: not yet, let me push it there (gimme 10 minutes, I don't have the branch downloaded yet)19:10
\shcody-somerville: ok..will do the same :) just to be sure...but give me a couple of minutes I need to tweak our firewalls first19:10
slangasekI only looked at the UDD branch, which is out of date ;)19:10
pitti"Vcs-Bzr:" is the right onw19:11
pitti(dinner ready, back in a bit)19:11
pittislangasek: anyway, feel free to upload; there are enough version numbers :)19:12
pittibut please commit it to bzr as well19:12
cody-somerville\sh, Note that if you have apport enabled it'll churn over the dump for awhile generating a crash report after crashdump reboots the system for you.19:12
slangasekpitti: yes, will do19:12
barrydavidascher: hiya!19:14
davidascherbarry: question for you about smtpd.py...19:14
davidascheralthough i think i figured out most of what i wanted.19:14
cody-somerville\sh, I also found apport complained (sadly) about 'TypeError: Incorrect padding' but I just ignored that, downloaded the debug kernel, and used crash to extract the log data myself. A second go at it seemed to work alright but then Launchpad gave apport a server error at the very end of the very long upload :(19:15
barrydavidascher: goforit19:15
davidascheris there something better?  I don't actually need TLS right now, but it seems that some parts of ESMTP are worth doing.19:15
davidascheri think i figured out the other q's i was going to ask.19:16
barrydavidascher: there's nothing better in the stdlib.  it's possible twisted has something more feature full.  i do remember a patch to smtpd.py that added a bunch of useful esmtp commands.  i need to dig up where i saw that thow19:16
barryer, though19:16
slangasekpitti: my UDD wish of the day: documentation for how to merge a pre-existing bzr packaging branch into a UDD branch without losing any history from either :-)19:19
\shcody-somerville: looks like I need to postpone the testing towards tomorrow morning ... real life work haunts me ...19:28
cody-somerville\sh, no problem :) ty anyways19:28
=== ogra is now known as Guest4712
=== Guest4712 is now known as ogra_
highvoltagehey, on the edubuntu daily builds, the packages shipped on the live disk aren't added through apt-cdrom when booting from a live USB disk19:35
ricotzRiddell, i have fixed the copyright file of libbluray you can take a second look if you dont mind19:35
highvoltagethis used to work on maverick, I'll file a bug on it, but is there anyone I should poke about it?19:36
highvoltageit seems like the usb disk used to be mounted as /media/cdrom before, but that doesn't seem to be happening anymore for some reason19:36
pittislangasek: seconded19:39
slangasekhuh; how do we get a branch format update for a vcs-import branch?19:48
sorenslangasek: There used to be a button on the launchpad web ui.19:48
slangaseksoren: only for branches you have write access to :-)19:48
slangasekwhich I don't, for ~vcs-import19:48
=== Quintasan_ is now known as Quintasan
=== dendrobates is now known as dendro-afk
siretartRiddell: ricotz: libbluray reuploaded20:36
RoAkSoAxvish: ping20:41
psusipitti: I threw in a UDF DVD+RW the other day and it was not being mounted with uid=,gid= options.  Does udisks only add those for fat/ntfs or something?20:58
pittipsusi: no, they are in udf_defaults[]21:00
pittipsusi: perhaps you had the drive in /etc/fstab?21:00
psusipitti: I'm pretty sure I don't have it in fstab... it's auto mounted when inserted...21:01
psusiI'll check though21:01
psusiso it should be adding the options for udf as well then?21:02
pittipsusi: fstab doesn't preclude automounting, it just overrides udisks' default options21:02
pittipsusi: yes21:02
psusiahh, cool... probably that then.. I'll check and get rid of it.21:03
psusiI wonder if I should add those options for ext4 too?21:04
pittiext4 doesn't have uid/gid21:04
psusiwould be kind of nice to be able to use that for removable media21:04
pittiit's a real file system21:04
psusiright... I have been thinking I shuold add it21:04
psusibe nice to be able to disable permissions for removable media21:04
=== dendro-afk is now known as dendrobates
psusiudf can store proper ownership, but lets you disable it21:05
psusibe nice if ext4 did the same21:05
=== m4n1sh_ is now known as m4n1sh
=== sconklin-lunch is now known as sconklin
=== dendrobates is now known as dendro-afk
zulskaet_: is there a way to nominate a bug for a later release?21:37
ogra_zul, ubuntu-later as milestone ?21:37
ogra_iirc we had that once21:37
zulnm i think i figured it out21:38
slangasekzul: there are pre-populated release series for O, P in launchpad21:38
pittiev: got bug 723223 working in trunk now; I have some other refinements to make; do you want me to upload this now, and do the refinements later, or can it still wait a bit?22:02
ubottuLaunchpad bug 723223 in jockey (Ubuntu Natty) "Jockey should provide a way to run noninteractively without dbus" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/72322322:03
=== Nafallo_ is now known as Nafallo
seb128pitti, speaking of jockey, bug #712685 seems to have some recent duplicates22:06
ubottuLaunchpad bug 712685 in jockey (Ubuntu) "jockey-gtk crashed with UnboundLocalError in install_package(): local variable 'repository_added' referenced before assignment" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/71268522:06
seb128pitti, bug #719523 as well but that might be due to the svg breakage22:07
ubottuLaunchpad bug 719523 in jockey (Ubuntu) "jockey-gtk crashed with GError in function(): Icon 'jockey-disabled' not present in theme" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/71952322:07
pittiseb128: the latter should be fixed now22:07
pittishould be a dupe of bug 715753)22:08
ubottuLaunchpad bug 715753 in jockey (Ubuntu Natty) "jockey-gtk crashed with GError in function(): Icon 'jockey-disabled' not present in theme" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/71575322:08
seb128pitti, ok, I'm just doing some cleanup of apport-crash bugs22:08
* pitti dupes22:08
seb128pitti, thanks22:08
pittiseb128: thanks for pointing out the first one, this looks easy to fix22:08
cndRiddell, I've been working on the multitouch stuff, and I've got a patch to enable multitouch in qt22:11
cndI'm cleaning it up and testing it right now22:11
cndI'd like to get it in before feature freeze22:11
cndwhat are your thoughts?22:11
pittiseb128: fixed :)22:11
seb128pitti, ;-)22:12
seb128pitti, bug #717776 could be an easy one as well22:12
ubottuLaunchpad bug 717776 in jockey (Ubuntu) "jockey-gtk crashed with ValueError in install_package(): Package nvidia-glx-195 does not exist" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/71777622:12
seb128not sure if that's a list of nvidia drivers to update?22:13
pittithat's a bit more tricky, I'm afraid; I'll keep it on the radar, thoug22:14
* pitti waves good nigth22:15
seb128pitti, ok, there is also bug #710194 and some similars22:15
ubottuLaunchpad bug 710194 in jockey (Ubuntu) "jockey-gtk crashed with UnicodeEncodeError in update_tree_model(): 'ascii' codec can't encode characters in position 0-12: ordinal not in range(128)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/71019422:15
seb128but enough for today indeed22:15
seb128pitti, 'night!22:15
Riddellcnd: hi22:20
Riddellcnd: that's interesting22:20
Riddellcnd: the first question from Kubuntu with regards to patches is always is there a path to getting it upstream22:21
cndRiddell, the patch came from a qt developer22:21
cndhe had to step away from the project22:21
cndbut it will get into upstream one way or another22:21
cndthough it may not be in exactly this form22:21
cndthe patch adds about 600 lines of code22:21
Riddellcnd: then does it add unstable interfaces?22:22
cndRiddell, nope22:22
cndapi is the same as always22:22
cndjust that touch events now are possible on linux22:22
cndthe touch api has been available since qt 4.6, and it works for win and mac22:23
Riddellah, I didn't know that22:23
cndthis patch just hooks up the plumbing from the new xi 2.1 that I've been working on22:23
Riddellcnd: sounds good then, we should get some packages made22:23
Riddellcnd: are you into packaging or are you looking for me or something to do it?22:23
cndRiddell, in fact, I've already got a package in ppa:utouch-team/xorg-unstable22:23
cndI can package it up (just throwing the patch in)22:24
cndhow do you normally take things?22:24
cndbzr merges?22:24
cndcopy the new source package somewhere?22:24
Riddellcnd: we use ~kubuntu-members/qt/ubuntu for the packaging22:28
Riddellso a merge into that would be lovely22:28
cndRiddell, ok, I'll work on that22:28
cndRiddell, when do you need it by to review and upload for feature freeze?22:28
Riddellcnd: not sure when feature freeze is going to be declaired but within 24 hours would be sensible22:29
cndRiddell, ok, I think I can make that22:29
valavanisalexHi All... Packaging query: does the X-Ubuntu-Gettext-Domain key need to go under the [Desktop Entry] group in a .desktop file, or can it just go anywhere?22:33
=== sconklin is now known as sconklin-gone
Riddellricotz: ping22:41
Riddellricotz: http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.comp.audio.libcanberra.general/19922:43
JontheEchidnavalavanisalex: it's automatically added to .desktop files that need it22:46
JontheEchidnaby the ubuntu build daemons22:46
JontheEchidnayou don't have to worry about that unless it needs to be customized for some reason22:47
ricotzRiddell, huh? you mean robert_ancell ;)22:49
valavanisalexJontheEchidna: ah OK.  The Inkscape package currently contains a manual patch to add the line.  However, it appears at the end of the .desktop file inside a different group22:49
valavanisalexJontheEchidna: Is it best to remove the manual patch then, and allow automatic configuration?22:50
robert_ancellRiddell, thanks.  That's a very indirect way of contacting the Ubuntu developers :)22:50
JontheEchidnavalavanisalex: if there's a patch manually setting it, there is probably a reason22:50
Riddellricotz: I don't think so, your name is down as adding the patch which makes that change22:51
ricotzrobert_ancell, i have upload the g-s package22:51
ricotzRiddell, where?22:52
Riddellricotz: libcanberra debian/changelog says [ Rico Tzschichholz ] - add 90-patch-theme-for-ubuntu.patch22:53
valavanisalexJontheEchidna: The trouble is that a new dpatch patch has been added recently, which creates a new group in the .desktop file.  The X-Ubuntu-Gettext-Domain key is appended afterwards by debian/rules, so the key ends up being added to the new group rather than [Desktop Entry].  Is this a problem?22:54
ricotzRiddell, mhh, i see, i think it was an inline patch which i extracted22:54
JontheEchidnavalavanisalex: I don't know, it depends on how gnome's menu implements .desktop file translations from external .po's22:56
JontheEchidnaIt shouldn't be a problem for KDE's setup, iirc22:56
Riddellricotz, robert_ancell: ok well if one of you could fix that libcanberra issue and e-mail the mailing list he posted to saying it's fixed that would be great22:57
JontheEchidnavalavanisalex: oh, actually that would cause problems22:57
JontheEchidnapkgbinarymangler should probably be made more smart, and put X-Ubuntu-Gettext-Domain in the right group22:58
ricotzrobert_ancell, could you look into this? perhaps it could be updated to libcanberra 0.27 too23:00
robert_ancellricotz, ok23:00
valavanisalexOK, thanks.  So I guess I could remove the manual patching from debian/rules, and add the key to the dpatch instead?23:01
ricotzRiddell, did you have time to look at libbluray again? siretart also accidently uploaded again23:01
ricotzrobert_ancell, thanks23:01
Riddellricotz: hah I tried looking for that earlier and it wasn't there, turns out blueray isn't spelt proper23:03
ricotzRiddell, right ;)23:03
Riddellricotz: is there anything in here equivalent to libdvdcss?23:06
ricotzRiddell, yes, but not appropriate for the repo23:06
Riddellricotz: so there's a separate bit for the DRM that isn't included in this upload?23:07
ricotzRiddell, yes, this package makes it possible to read not encrypted blurays23:07
ricotzRiddell, libaacs would be the drm workaround which also exists23:08
Riddellricotz: groovy accepted23:09
Riddellricotz: I find "Most commercial Blu-Ray are protected by AACS or BD+ technologies" very biased language though, I'd strongly think that should be changed to "restricted"23:10
ricotzi see23:12
ricotzRiddell, thanks for your time23:14
broderkees: ooc, is patching mountall actually easier than generating a patch to debugfs to take -o mode=?23:20
keesbroder: based on the reception of my upstream patches; yes.23:21
broderugh, ok23:22
keesthe other problems is that debugfs is a singleton like /sys so "mode=" would actually take global affect.23:22
keesso I'm just going with a chmod, and we'll see what shakes out. it's been a frustrating path. :P23:23
=== panda is now known as Guest34992
keesbryceh: what triggers the GPU lockup apport hook thing? I want to make sure I'm not smoking crack and breaking that hook23:49
brycehkees, it's triggered by code in the kernel intel drm driver23:50
keeswhoa, in the kernel driver?23:50
keesbryceh: do you have a string I can search for? call_usermodehelper_fns() doesn't show up in the drivers/gpu/drm tree23:53
brycehspecifically, there is code in there that will reset the gpu when it locks up23:53
bryceh(unfortunately, it seems to rarely work, but...)23:53
brycehso there is code in there which also fires off some sort of event.  we register the apport hook to be triggered off that (via an upstart rule)23:54
keesoh, interesting23:54
keesupstart, not udev?23:55
brycehudev, sorry23:55
brycehSUBSYSTEM=="drm", ACTION=="change", ENV{ERROR}=="1", RUN+="/usr/share/apport/apport-gpu-error-intel.py"23:55
bryceh# Jesse Barnes on ubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com:23:55
bryceh#   You'll get three events, one when the error is detected, one before the23:55
bryceh#   reset and one after.  Each has a different environment variable set; the23:55
bryceh#   initial error has ERROR=1, the pre-reset event has RESET=1 and the23:55
bryceh#   post-reset event has ERROR=0.23:55
keesnice, okay, yeah, that totally runs as root.23:56
Keybuk(you could also do that with:23:57
Keybuk start on drm-device-changed ERROR=123:57
Keybuk exec /usr/share/apport/apport-gpu-error-intel.py23:57
keesKeybuk: don't hurt me too hard for my mountall upload! ;)23:59

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