[00:56] <gnomefreak> any reason on why if i add minefield to unity it will not launch. it will launch if ran from terminal or menu but not from unity panel
[14:24] <m_conley> chrisccoulson: ping
[14:24] <chrisccoulson> hi m_conley
[14:25] <m_conley> chrisccoulson: hey - I was wondering, what is the best way to degrade gracefully if the libindicate service is not found?  Like...my messaging menu extension just assumes that functions like indicate_server_ref_default exists
[14:26] <m_conley> so, how would you suggest I make my extension go inert if these functions aren't available?
[14:26] <chrisccoulson> m_conley, do you mean if the service doesn't exist, or the actual libindicate library doesn't exist?
[14:26] <chrisccoulson> ah
[14:26] <m_conley> well
[14:26] <chrisccoulson> you'll need to do some dlopen/dlsym trickery
[14:26] <m_conley> hm
[14:27] <chrisccoulson> m_conley, have a look at https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/attachment.cgi?id=503226 as an example
[14:27] <m_conley> ok cool, thanks. :)
[14:27] <chrisccoulson> (which will degrade gracefully if glib is too old to have GSettings support)
[15:03] <m_conley> chrisccoulson: hm...testing this isn't very easy.  libindicate seems to be a pretty important part of Ubuntu right now...
[18:11] <m_conley> chrisccoulson: hey - if you get a moment, would you mind poking around with my messaging menu extension?  I'd love any feedback you might have.
[18:11] <chrisccoulson> m_conley, yeah, sure :)
[18:11] <m_conley> chrisccoulson: thanks! :)
[18:20] <chrisccoulson> m_conley, i haven't seen any bug reports since we started shipping the menubar extension for thunderbird btw
[18:20] <chrisccoulson> i assume that's good news ;)
[18:20] <m_conley> chrisccoulson: phew.  :)  Do you have any usage stats?
[18:20] <chrisccoulson> m_conley, i don't think so :(
[18:21] <chrisccoulson> we have popcon, but that is opt-in, and i'm not sure how accurate it is
[18:21] <m_conley> chrisccoulson: well, we had one of our UX guys look at it - besides the menu flicker (which we have a bug for), he seemed pleased with it.
[18:21] <chrisccoulson> yeah, the menu flicker is a bit annoying
[18:21] <chrisccoulson> i need to talk to ted about that
[18:22] <davidascher> chrisccoulson: do you know on what IRC channel i could find barry warsaw?
[18:23] <chrisccoulson> davidascher, i think he'll be in #ubuntu-devel
[18:23] <davidascher> thx!
[18:23] <chrisccoulson> there is someone in there called barry, i just need to make sure it's the right one ;)
[18:24] <chrisccoulson> yeah, barry is barry warsaw
[18:27] <chrisccoulson> fta2 - i might move the thunderbird branches around a bit later (so lp:thunderbird will start pulling from comm-central, so we get 3.3 nightlies)
[18:28] <chrisccoulson> and lp:thunderbird will become lp:thunderbird/3.1 (similar to how we have the firefox branches laid out already)
[18:28] <chrisccoulson> i guess that will affect your bot won't it?
[18:29] <micahg> chrisccoulson: I'm glad someone finally got around to that :)
[18:29] <chrisccoulson> micahg - i haven't got round to it yet. but it's next on my list once i've investigated fta's breakpad issue ;)
[18:29] <gnomefreak> can we get 3.2 also?
[18:29] <chrisccoulson> i really want to get the 3.3 nightlies running
[18:29] <micahg> gnomefreak: there is no 3.2 ATM
[18:30] <micahg> chrisccoulson: I have the beginnings of it if you want me to push it up
[18:30] <gnomefreak> ah ok 3.3 is great for me than :)
[18:30] <chrisccoulson> micahg - yeah, sure
[18:33] <chrisccoulson> m_conley, is the menu flicker considered a big issue btw? i *think* i have a way to partially fix it
[18:33] <chrisccoulson> we can quite easily delay the opening of top-level menus
[18:33] <chrisccoulson> but delaying the opening of the sub-menus is a lot trickier
[18:34] <chrisccoulson> but i think if we can delay opening the top-level menus, that will fix most cases
[18:34] <m_conley> chrisccoulson: hard to say - but I think it might be one of those little papercut things.  The user might not even notice what happened, but still might be a little annoyed.
[18:34] <chrisccoulson> the unity panel is in control of opening the top-level menus, so it should be easy to delay those
[18:35] <gnomefreak> unity panel + minefield == failure to work
[18:35] <chrisccoulson> gnomefreak, do you mean the launcher?
[18:35] <gnomefreak> chrisccoulson: yes
[18:35] <chrisccoulson> bamf ;)
[18:35] <gnomefreak> chrisccoulson: i can add it but it wont work. i can however launch it every other way
[18:36] <chrisccoulson> although, i thought asac fixed those problems
[18:36] <gnomefreak> not as of today
[18:36] <chrisccoulson> oh
[18:36] <gnomefreak> at least not for end user
[18:36] <chrisccoulson> it works here :
[18:36] <chrisccoulson> hmm
[18:36] <johnny77> asac: Hello, I'm working on Ubuntu Community Documentation when I found this page: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Chromium It automatically redirects to a page you last edited. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Chromium/Build I would like to create a documentation page for Chromium, but the name is used. Is that old page needed?
[18:39] <gnomefreak> johnny77: i get an empty page when i go to the Chromium page
[18:40] <gnomefreak> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Chromium/
[18:40] <gnomefreak> afaik help.ubuntu../community is still wiki.ubuntu
[18:42] <johnny77> gnomefreak: I don't think they are the same. If you go to the link I supplied, it shows a different page briefly before redirecting.
[18:43] <gnomefreak> johnny77: take https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Chromium/Build  and remove Build
[18:44] <gnomefreak> you get an empty linl
[18:44] <gnomefreak> link. notice you are using both links wiki and help..
[18:44] <johnny77> I understand that, but that is not the page I'm asking about.
[18:44] <johnny77> The help page redirects to the wiki page.
[18:45] <gnomefreak> my point being is that the first link is redirecting you to the wiki page. not sure if all help... pages do that but with yours it does
[18:46] <gnomefreak> we changed the links for wiki to help..community a while ago so either link should bring you to same page. in theroy
[18:46] <gnomefreak> theory
[18:47] <gnomefreak> chrisccoulson: yeah atm minefield doesnt work (just making sure)
[18:49] <johnny77> Yes. But I want to write a howtouse documentation page and the help page is the name I'd use.
[18:52] <gnomefreak> compare a intel P4 1.7ghz with 256mb ram to a amd 11 X2 with 4gig ram  it is just amazing :)
[18:53] <gnomefreak> johnny77: i understand. IMPO i dont see why not but its safer to be sure
[18:54] <johnny77> gnomefreak: So who can I talk to to "be sure" The help page was last edited almost two years ago.
[18:56] <gnomefreak> micahg: chrisccoulson asac fta2 any thoughts on best course of action. im ok with using wiki....
[18:56] <gnomefreak> thats one way :)
[18:56] <gnomefreak> but ill get yelled at for that im sire
[18:56]  * micahg isn't sure what the question is
[18:59] <johnny77> micahg: I want to write a Community Help Documentation page of Chromium. The link the I would use is already used, redirecting to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Chromium/Build. What I need to know is if the old page https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Chromium can be deleted so that I can write my page.
[19:00] <micahg> johnny77: yeah, the page is out of date anyways
[19:00] <micahg> You might want to include a link to the build page on your help page though
[19:01] <johnny77> micahg: I can certainly do that. Do you think it would be better to delete it and start over or just continue with a new version? I'm just worried about people that are subscribed to it.
[19:02] <micahg> johnny77: which one?
[19:02] <gnomefreak> well if the build page isnt current or at least it doesnt work than replace otherwise if the info there still works than keep it (saves you some work)
[19:03] <johnny77> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Chromium
[19:04] <micahg> johnny77: there's nothing there at the moment
[19:05] <johnny77> micahg: For my it redirects to a new page. Is that what you are getting?
[19:05] <gnomefreak> it redirects to build and kind of sloppy too. i dont ever remember seeing a section of first page before redirect in wiki docs before
[19:05] <micahg> johnny77: yes, so you can get rid of the redirect
[19:05] <johnny77> micahg: Thank you.
[19:06] <micahg> johnny77: thank you for helping with the documentation
[19:06] <johnny77> micahg: no problem.
[19:07]  * gnomefreak cant believe the determination some people have when it comes to trolling/spamming/so on
[19:07] <gnomefreak> ok need a break before i get back to him
[19:37] <fta> johnny77, the build instructions are mostly obsolete, the whole 64bit section should go
[19:37] <fta> chrisccoulson, ACK the tb changes, let me know when you're ready to do it
[19:40]  * gnomefreak finally owns a 64bit system :)
[19:40] <gnomefreak> ive been wanting one since before dapper
[19:55] <gnomefreak> i used to have a few launchpad search engines for firefox. what did i not install or was it taken out of
[20:14] <gnomefreak> ok it seems if i create a launcher on my desktop useing the command firefox-4.0 it launches. i dragged it to unity panel and it launches now. so i have to guess that the launcher command gets changed from menu to panel
[20:25] <gnomefreak> ok maybe not
[20:26] <gnomefreak> from desktop it works but cant drag it to the pael(i guess it was already running) but now it will only launch from desktop launcher and menu items
[22:06] <m_conley> chrisccoulson: ping
[22:09] <chrisccoulson> hi m_conley
[22:10] <m_conley> chrisccoulson: hey - just some clarification for my question from a few hours ago:  so, say we include my messaging menu component binary with the linux version of TB...what would happen on systems where libindicate did not exist?
[22:10] <m_conley> chrisccoulson: or is libindicate ubiquitous enough so that this would not be an issue?
[22:11] <chrisccoulson> m_conley, i think it's only ubuntu using it so far
[22:11] <m_conley> chrisccoulson: alright - and if PR_LoadLibrary("libindicate.so") returns NULL, is this sufficient to determine that libindicate is not available?
[22:13] <chrisccoulson> m_conley, yeah, as long as you're also using PR_FindFunctionSymbol to bind the symbols too
[22:13] <m_conley> chrisccoulson: alright, gotcha - thanks.
[22:14] <chrisccoulson> m_conley, although, you'd need to load libindicate.so.5 as libindicate.so is only shipped in the -dev package
[22:14] <m_conley> right - forgot to add that part, but yeah, I have that.  :)
[22:20] <chrisccoulson> fta, we should be able to publish bug 538796 tomorrow \o/
[22:20] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 538796 in moon "cannot open Firefox/Chromium/Google Chrome when libmoon is installed" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/538796
[22:20] <chrisccoulson> the reports just needed a bit of a push ;)
[22:21] <micahg> chrisccoulson: great job on that one :)
[22:21] <chrisccoulson> well, it wasn't me who figured it out ;)
[22:21] <chrisccoulson> that was evmar and one of the moonlight guys
[22:22] <fta> great
[22:23] <fta> micahg, openarena regressed :(
[22:24] <fta> micahg, i'm now hitting debian 611336
[22:24] <ubot2> Debian bug 611336 in openarena "openarena: The game does not quit when I confirm it." [Important,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/611336
[22:25] <micahg> fta: I'll take a look later this evening
[22:26] <fta> i have so many regressions in natty..
[22:27] <gnomefreak> most of the regresions i am seeing are related to unity/compiz
[22:29] <micahg> fta: sorry, I thought I was pulling in some useful changes
[22:29] <fta> i see tons of glib-dbus regressions
[22:30] <fta> unity is expected, it's miles away from feature parity
[22:30] <micahg> fta: I'd suggest filing them if you have time, we're 2 months out and that won't be good for the platform
[22:31] <fta> micahg, i do, but seb128 told me the team has his hands full on more popular bugs already
[22:31] <chrisccoulson> i feel a bit the same too ;)
[22:31] <micahg> :(
[22:31]  * micahg doesn't know glib yet
[22:32] <gnomefreak> a few weeks ago i heard someone say something was wrong with glib but i dont recall much of that convo
[22:32] <chrisccoulson> this is definitely the most disruptive cycle i remember
[22:32] <fta> same here
[22:32] <micahg> chrisccoulson: imagine if we would've tried to land GNOME3 :)
[22:32] <chrisccoulson> everything still feels pretty broken considering we are only 2 months off the release
[22:32] <chrisccoulson> micahg - heh ;)
[22:33] <gnomefreak> s/feel pretty/is really
[22:33] <chrisccoulson> i'm sure it will all be good eventually :)
[22:33] <fta> well, with gnome3, we'd have the help of other distros working on it, with unity, we're alone
[22:33] <gnomefreak> postpone release if they need to but its only happened once and dapper was no where near this bad
[22:34] <chrisccoulson> i don't think it would be postponed, unless it was another LTS ;)
[22:34] <gnomefreak> dapper was more adding features that fixing bugs
[22:34] <gnomefreak> s/that.than
[22:35] <fta> imho, unity should have been prepared in the background, spanning over 2 or 3 cycles
[22:35] <gnomefreak> if a system is broken being LTS or not shouldnt matter
[22:35] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i think people underestimated the amount of work in porting it to compiz ;)
[22:35] <gnomefreak> classic edition is still around
[22:36] <gnomefreak> it was working with mutter
[22:38] <gnomefreak> compiz has always been a problem IMHO
[22:38] <fta> it is, but because unity is draining all the efforts, classics's regressions remain unaddressed
[22:38] <fta> no, mutter was for UNE only, classic has metacity
[22:38] <fta> or plain compiz
[22:41] <chrisccoulson> i tried installing fedora F15 earlier this evening. their classic fallback session is also pretty dire
[22:42] <chrisccoulson> i guess that their efforts also aren't directed towards that ;)
[22:43] <gnomefreak> something in wrong way too much lag
[22:56] <jcastro> chrisccoulson: what are the chances you have the tbird messaging menu extension installed?
[22:57] <chrisccoulson> jcastro - probably not for this cycle (feature freeze is in 2 days) ;)
[22:57] <chrisccoulson> we could probably get it in the archive though
[22:57] <jcastro> chrisccoulson: no I mean installed on your computer, not in the archive
[22:57] <chrisccoulson> oh, i misread your message there ;)
[22:57] <chrisccoulson> lol
[22:58] <chrisccoulson> i don't have it installed just yet ;)
[22:59] <chrisccoulson> jcastro - i misread your question as "what are the chances of having the tbird messaging menu extension installed?" ;)
[23:02] <jcastro> chrisccoulson: I just need a screenshot of it working but I can't be bothered to build it right now and setup tbird, so I was just taking a stab in the dark
[23:03] <chrisccoulson> jcastro - i will build it soon, but i'm looking at some dbusmenu crashers atm
[23:05] <m_conley> jcastro: hey - I can get you that screenshot
[23:14] <m_conley> jcastro: http://i.imgur.com/IQuVs.png
[23:14] <m_conley> jcastro:  let me know if you'd like something different - though I'll have to send it tomorrow, heading home.
[23:14] <chrisccoulson> nice :)