[01:09] jcastro: have my test posts to summit been removed? [02:41] popey: yeah you're all reset [02:55] jcastro_: still around? [02:55] yo [02:56] howdy.. my buddy atomicferret has a unity problem... maybe you can assist a little [02:56] heh [02:56] is there a reliable mechanism to get the sidebar to display the option to pin an item? [02:57] I get several things I can't pin in place, as the add option just isn't there [02:57] (tried reboots, etc) [02:57] current netbook version 10.10 [02:57] jcastro_: on 10.10 netbook [02:58] no [02:59] well.. i guess thats an easy answer :-( [02:59] it's kind of not very good [02:59] lol [02:59] I personally would just use unity 2d if you are on 10.10 [02:59] despite the unfinshedness of it [02:59] that just a different package in apt? [02:59] or just log into normal gnome [02:59] or a PPA [02:59] yeah, one sec [03:00] http://askubuntu.com/questions/21686/how-do-i-install-the-unity-2d-desktop [03:00] ah sweet [03:00] thanks [03:00] jcastro_: is my go to uniuty guy... [03:01] unity too [03:01] \o/ [03:01] jcastro_: did you see my scheduled call with mr. metal? [03:01] yes [03:01] I accepted [03:01] * cjohnston is tired of the partial upgrade message on +1 :-( [03:01] cool [03:02] I wonder how the poulsbo driver is coming along in +1 [03:04] jcastro_: would Bug #711033 be bitesize? [03:04] Launchpad bug 711033 in unity "Add the ability to remove mounted drives from the Unity launcher" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/711033 [03:04] heh, don't get your hopes up [03:04] yeah, silly gma bs [03:04] hmm, I can ask cjohnston [03:04] atomicferret: I've been eyeballing the new thinkpad [03:05] http://www.fudzilla.com/home/item/21928-lenovos-fusion-x120e-116-inch-thinkpad-available [03:06] that is cute [03:06] jcastro_: atomicferret works in the cloud world at slicehost [03:07] the only reason I have the poulsbo nightmare is from a fit-pc2i [03:07] where do I know that name from? [03:07] VPS provider [03:07] rackspace [03:07] oh dude, I think I have one of your uds shirts [03:17] g'nite [03:58] jcastro_: ok i have Modern Family on on Hulu [04:02] maco: excellnt [04:02] you'll know as soon as you see yourself [04:02] jcastro_: well you already told me with an arrow! and i dont play cello, i play bass :P [04:02] yeah just pretend it's a bass [04:04] * maco is impatiently waiting to get the bass back from Dad's house [07:29] good morning all [07:32] good morning [08:16] Morning all [08:26] o/ [09:10] Aloha [09:58] :) [09:58] Thanks very much for requesting sponsorship to uds-o. ' [09:58] :D [10:46] Technoviking: why does our loco subdomain of ubuntuforums.org no longer work? [10:46] Technoviking: uk.ubuntuforums.org used to go to http://ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=274 but now it just goes to the forums home page [13:58] *sigh* only 1 woman at this event. Me [13:58] .c [14:01] czajkowski: you? [14:12] yup [14:29] what event is it [14:30] BARK BARK HELLO POPEY BARK BARK [14:30] WOOF WOOF! === daker_ is now known as daker [14:37] popey: ODF plugfest [14:38] lotta UK politicans tomorrow [14:43] where? [14:44] maidenhead? === dholbach_ is now known as dholbach [15:01] * popey tickles dpm [15:02] heya popey :) [15:02] dpm: a friend of mine who has developed something and is using launchpad, is asking me translations questions, I am _clueless_ about this. Would it be possible to point him in your direction? [15:03] popey, sure! [15:03] can i fire an email at you? what email address is best? [15:03] just give him my e-mail or we can catch up on IRC [15:04] sure, on PM [15:04] thank you! [15:04] no worries :) [15:13] popey: make the person ask questions! [15:13] you know where! [15:14] http://askubuntu.com/questions/22587/patches-and-translations/23708#23708 [15:14] look at David's wonderful expertise [15:18] * dpm hugs jcastro [15:49] popey: we have been having dns re-direct issue on the forums since the new hardware went in. I beleive IS know. [15:49] popey: looks like it is working for me now [15:52] indeed, it is for me now too [16:18] jcastro: starting to get the hang of askubuntu [16:19] nice! [16:19] jcastro: do you guys yse any programs to interface with the side (gwibber/rss feeds) or do you just refresh the page and go through questions [16:20] there's a branch/bug for supporting the API [16:22] jcastro: I would say that idea I brought to the table ( https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/alaide ) is really well implemented in the stackexchange model, better than I could have ever imagined. I'm excited to see what apps will take advantage of the upcoming API. [16:23] yeah I remember that [16:23] Any chance of having points ion stackexchange reflect as karma in LP, or is that a big no-no [16:50] popey: http://www.odfplugfest.co.uk/ [16:51] komputes: karam isn't that big a deal [16:51] komputes: people put too much focus at times on it [16:51] czajkowski: I agree, it's the little things like karma and badges and rep that make people feel involved. it's not too important. [16:55] yeah, its what got me first involved [16:55] for a while I had more karma than anyone, just for answering questions on launchpad [16:55] then I stopped being a bum, and got a job ;) [17:00] popey: have you heard if other loco forums are not resolving? [17:00] I have not. [17:00] I only know about ours because we link to it on the podcast site [17:00] and someone complained ;) [17:10] popey: did you get a response from IS about the wiki? [17:10] i forwarded you a mail about i [17:10] *it [17:15] I have the one you sent, but I am failing to find a response [17:16] hmm, did I not? [17:16] alright my friends, I'll go and meet soren (and family) for dinner now [17:16] o/ dholbach [17:16] so have a great evening and see you all tomorrow [17:16] ah, my bad [17:17] AlanBell: yhm [17:20] dholbach: later [17:21] bye Technoviking [17:37] dpm: feel free to miss me out of any replies to neil ;) [17:37] popey, ok, no worries :) [17:57] cjohnston: we're on in 3? [17:57] there's a branch/bug for supporting the AP <- Do you know the URL for this? [17:58] yes [17:58] komputes: in ~gwibber somewhere [17:58] komputes: sorry quite slammed right now [17:58] np will look gwibber lp bugs [17:59] it's a branch from kenvandine [17:59] look in code.lp [17:59] ahhhh [18:00] cjohnston, hey, give me a min [18:00] wrapping something [18:00] yup [18:01] Reference for jono / jcastro bug 672113 bug 709395 [18:01] Launchpad bug 672113 in ubuntu-website "uds.ubuntu.com uses too bright orange" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/672113 [18:01] Launchpad bug 709395 in ubuntu-website "uds.ubuntu.com needs the use the Ubuntu font" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/709395 [18:04] bug 672113 jcastro [18:04] Launchpad bug 672113 in ubuntu-website "uds.ubuntu.com uses too bright orange" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/672113 [18:05] sorry.. bug 716726 [18:05] Launchpad bug 716726 in ubuntu-website "right navigation arrow on uds.ubuntu.com slideshow cut off" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/716726 [18:06] jcastro, jono thanks :-) [18:07] wooo [18:07] nice and quick, just the way I like it! [18:07] I like how you roll [18:09] :-) [18:10] thanks cjohnston [18:10] yup [20:22] jono: I'd call that latest comment to your blog offensive. Have you seen it? [20:24] doctormo, deleted [21:04] it's funny how people will release code under a permissive license, then complain when people use the code accordingly [21:05] mhall119: well, personally, I bitch when stuff I write is jacked verbatim and re-licensed as someone else's work. If you don't maintain copyright, it's illigal [21:05] mhall119: that's the only situation I whine in. What's this jabroni saying? [21:06] paultag: reading some of the comments on jono's blog [21:06] (and I'm talking about plagiarism here, not decent changes) [21:06] mhall119: link? [21:06] the "OMG! You modified GPL software for your own benefit? How dare you!" [21:06] http://www.jonobacon.org/2011/02/24/banshee-in-natty-to-ship-multiple-stores-and-contribute-to-gnome-foundation/ [21:07] no doubt the same people also complained that Ubuntu One's server-side component wasn't released under a license that would allow others to make money off it [21:07] mhall119: I don't see it [21:07] <-- I whined about that [21:07] and Launchpad [21:08] Launchpad sucked ass, and it was nonfree for a while. Now it's free, but still meh [21:08] at least there's progress [21:09] right, but it doesn't make sense to complain about Ubuntu locking in profit for themselves, then complaining when Banshee's profit lock-in is changed [21:09] mhall119: ubuntu is not locking in profit [21:09] mhall119: canonical is [21:09] right [21:09] * mhall119 forgets to make the distinction sometimes [21:10] I don't really care too much about that. I just hate it when it messes with my life as an end user [21:10] such as changing the default search provider *cough* [21:10] the point is, either you support software being open to modification for the benefit of the person doing the modification, or you don't [21:10] mhall119: yeah, but that's not the issue [21:10] with which? [21:10] the Banshee decision? [21:11] mhall119: the issue is saying "Canonical (a corperation, out to make money) is preventing the authors of this software (people on their own) from getting paid" [21:11] mhall119: it's not if they have a right to do that, because they clearly do, it's a moral argument [21:11] "preventing" is a bit of a stretch there [21:11] mhall119: you see that argument, though, right? [21:11] right, I see it [21:11] mhall119: OK, cool. All set. [21:12] I just don't see how it meshes with the criticism over closed-source U1 [21:12] it does not compare -- U1 authors are getting paid by the cash generated from U1 [21:12] or, really, with promoting the virtues of the license Banshee is released under [21:13] right, but the complaints I heard was that Canonical would not open-source it so that people could modify it and run it themselves, thus making money off the original author's code [21:14] mhall119: of ubuntu one? [21:14] or at least "preventing the authors of the software from getting paid" [21:14] paultag: yes [21:14] mhall119: no, canonical for some stupid reason wants to lock people into paying for the sync service [21:15] mhall119: so I can't set up my own cloud and grant myself contact sync rights [21:15] mhall119: banshee is a totally different argument [21:15] and both are morally questionable [21:15] I don't see how [21:15] but I guess corperations don't need to be moral [21:15] other than that banshee is released under a license that makes it legal [21:15] mhall119: it's not about legality [21:16] it's not even a question of morality, it's a question of consistency [21:16] 21:11 < paultag> mhall119: it's not if they have a right to do that, because they clearly do, it's a moral argument [21:16] so, is it "moral" to use someone else's code, which they are getting money from, and changing how it is used so that they no longer recieve money from it? [21:17] mhall119: no, clearly. [21:17] so it would not be moral, even if U1 server was open source, to host it on your own server [21:17] mhall119: I don't care about U1 [21:17] mhall119: that was never what I'm arguing [21:17] but it's what I was arguing [21:17] mhall119: OK, I'll stipulate -- it would be legal [21:17] mhall119: and moral [21:17] if you're not arguing it....then we're not really arguing at all [21:18] mhall119: *but*, you're not paying for the code, you're paying for bandwidth [21:18] mhall119: with banshee, there's no additional cost of the service to canonical, or the authors [21:18] mhall119: as such, it becomes an issue of trying to squeeze money out [21:18] well, there's maintenance [21:18] and distribution [21:18] integration [21:19] clearly it cost Canonical some money to make Banshee the default [21:19] mhall119: yes, but it cost the developers more to create it [21:19] god forbid :) [21:20] mhall119: I really don't care about this argument, I'm actually switching to Debian so I can avoid some of this [21:20] there's way too much drama nowadays [21:20] burning me out like a mo'fo [21:20] o_O [21:20] good luck, but I bet you an iceweasal that you won't escape the drama ;) [21:20] mhall119: nah, I'm using chrome [21:21] * popey wonders what the revenue split is for chrome :) [21:21] the point remains, debian's been burned by these things too [21:21] popey: I'm not ditching Ubuntu as a community, just as my OS :) [21:21] still.. [21:21] mhall119: yes, but cash is never the motive [21:21] true [21:21] mhall119: whereas canonical will ignore me ( as a community hacker ) to get some cash flow [21:22] so yeah [21:22] Debian it is [21:22] okay, so the main problem for you is that the drama involves money? [21:22] mhall119: nope. I don't give two shits about money [21:23] then why specify that Canonical/Ubuntu drama is different because cash is involved? [21:23] mhall119: it's the fact that I (as an ubuntu contributor, and not canonical) am a second-class contributor -- the work that I decide to do is secondary to the folks at Canonical it's self [21:24] and I don't want to work for Canonical, so I'll never be able to have a real, meaningful contirbution to Ubuntu [21:24] Hell, with Debian they give *@debian.org access to servers [21:25] if you want to run a script against all the packages, that's fine. Here we have to email someone at canonical, ask them if they can do it, then get a "no" back in 4 weeks [21:25] * czajkowski hugs jono [21:26] paultag: are people without *@debian.org second-class contributors? [21:26] mhall119: clearly, but then that creates a new class below @ubuntu.com, which is third class [21:26] mhall119: and there's no constraint on how many debian folks are around, there is a constraint on how many canonical folks are around [21:26] so I guess I just don't see where this difference in degrees becomes a difference in kind [21:27] mhall119: then you'll be happy here [21:27] paultag: are you being cranky [21:27] well I certainly hope so [21:27] czajkowski: nah [21:27] or your usual charming self [21:27] he's always charming [21:27] indeed [21:27] * jono hugs czajkowski [21:28] anyway, time for me to run, thanks for the discussion paultag [21:28] jono: there are some amount of toss pots on twitter this evenig [21:28] mhall119: aye, cheers [21:28] * czajkowski tickles paultag [21:28] * paultag hugs czajkowski [21:28] czajkowski, it is what it is :-) [21:29] and I don't want to work for Canonical, so I'll never be able to have a real, meaningful contirbution to Ubuntu [21:29] paultag: that's kind of not true. :( [21:29] jono: indeed. [21:29] still sucky and childish of some folks though [21:30] jcastro: what if I needed to run something on one of the servers with packages extracted on it? I can't ssh into it because I'm not canonical I.S. [21:30] paultag: oi I take offence at that, I don't develop but you can be damn sure I contribute in a meaningful ranting entertaining way mister [21:30] paultag: I don't get your example [21:30] does people.u.c have ssh access? [21:31] jcastro: for example, the reason why we're switching to DEP5 headers is to parse copyrights [21:31] paultag: not even caonical staff can do that unless they are IS. so daft reason. [21:31] jcastro: if I wanted to take a look at which packages have what, and run statistics on it, I'd have to be local and run a python / perl script to parse them [21:31] jcastro: either I can download the whole archive ( which sucks for everyone ), or I run it on the machine it's self [21:31] jcastro: if I was *@debian.org, I could ssh in and run it, I can't do that with ubuntu :( [21:32] so you needed an ssh account on a machine with the ubuntu archive [21:32] we can do that anywhere [21:32] jcastro: well I don't *need* it, it was an example -- just sort of talking about the mentality differences between debian and ubuntu [21:33] well, I don't have any more shell access to archive machines than you do [21:33] jcastro: I know that, and that's part of the bummer [21:34] ok so I just don't get how not being able to ssh into an archive machine = never be able to have a real contribution to ubuntu [21:35] jcastro: it feels like at times that some of the work is stuck in a box [21:35] jcastro: rather then having ubuntu membership mean you are really part of the whole project [21:35] I [21:35] I'm not trying to be an ungrateful toolbag [21:36] so basically you WANT to be a sysadmin [21:36] paultag: bring that up to the CC [21:36] jcastro: hell no [21:36] paultag: see what else could be changed [21:36] man, I'd rather never see a shell again. :p [21:36] I'm really not whining about this and talking about how much Ubuntu sucks, because I clearly care about it, and have cared for years [21:36] PSA, 9 minutes: http://www.ustream.tv/channel/nasa-hd-tv [21:37] I mean, I wear my @ubuntu proudly, it's just something that ticked me off the other day for no real reason [21:38] hell, if I was a DD, I think i'd still use @ubuntu for stuff [22:08] thanks newz2000 jcastro too much cloud cover :-( the wife and kids got to see it where they were [22:08] dang [22:08] uggh... jcastro Thats for you anyway.. we just talked about going to the coast for the last one [22:09] so the kids can see it [22:09] since we have a condo on the beach by daytona [22:10] * popey hugs jono [22:13] * jono hugs popey :-) [22:27] get a room :) [23:07] paultag: do motus have the access you're talking about? [23:07] mhall119: no [23:07] so basically the problem is that Ubuntu's archives are on Canonical's servers, not community-owned servers [23:08] mhall119: it's not that that's a problem [23:08] but that's the barrier [23:08] mhall119: it's just a different vibe then a community run project [23:08] it also means that the Ubuntu community doesn't need to raise funds for maintenance [23:08] mhall119: it's the idea that it's OK to shut out the community from some things [23:09] canonical is a subset of community, not external to it [23:09] in theory [23:09] AlanBell: +1 [23:10] so a bit of "the community" has shell access to the servers [23:10] just happens to be the bit that isn't you [23:10] AlanBell: but in practice, if someone @canonical wants a change, if the whole ubuntu community votes against it, they will still do it [23:10] AlanBell: aye, I see your point [23:10] same for the core Debian team that have shell access [23:11] AlanBell: the whole of debian has access to servers via ldap, I thought [23:11] I have no idea really [23:11] AlanBell: there is a team that is in charge of admin, but I could have sworn @debian auth'd you [23:11] in case you needed something [23:12] I think you can build stuff [23:12] but we have PPA access [23:12] AlanBell: yeah, but then you have to actually upload it, not just ssh into the arm build box to test a quick build before an upload [23:12] I know Debian have arm and mips servers that can do builds for people [23:12] AlanBell: yeah, they have most all arches [23:13] I'm really not that vested in "fighting the man", and I really don't hate Ubuntu or Canonical [23:13] I like them just fine, actually [23:14] just stressed and whining, I think. Not really sure what I'm doing :) [23:25] * AlanBell thinks somebody needs a hug [23:26] yeah, I think so [23:26] I've been unusually crabby lately [23:28] * pleia2 hugs paultag [23:29] * paultag hugs pleia2 [23:51] popey, pleia2: Got rejected by kickstarter. Oh well. [23:51] why? [23:52] try http://www.indiegogo.com/ instead... Linux Outlaws used that to fund Dan to FOSDEM. http://www.indiegogo.com/lo-fosdem2011 [23:54] popey: "It's not right for their platform" [23:57] fair enough [23:57] at least you can see indiegogo have done this before