[15:57] <marjo> hi ara!
[15:57] <ara> hello marjo
[15:59] <skaet_> hi ara, marjo, pitti :)
[16:00] <skaet_> heh, gangs all arriving.
[16:00] <skaet_> looks like we can get an on time start as the first few are here.  :)
[16:00] <skaet_> #startmeeting
[16:00] <MootBot> Meeting started at 10:00. The chair is skaet_.
[16:00] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[16:00] <skaet_> Thank you to everyone who helped get 10.04.2 out the door!
[16:01] <skaet_> This meeting will focus on the SRU interlocks and hand offs, and looking at where we are, and what's needed to get back in the cadence groove again.
[16:01] <skaet_> [TOPIC] Kernel SRU status - sconklin
[16:01] <MootBot> New Topic:  Kernel SRU status - sconklin
[16:01] <sconklin> Current status:
[16:01] <sconklin> Testing for ec2 kernels has not been completed, so
[16:01] <sconklin> we held off uploading new kernels to build on
[16:01] <sconklin> Friday. I am waiting for more information about
[16:01] <sconklin> the ec2 failures but the last status I know is:
[16:01] <sconklin> Lucid ec2 was thought to have a problem, but I have
[16:01] <sconklin> been told on irc that it's OK. However, the tracking
[16:01] <sconklin> bugs have not been updated, and until we get a definite
[16:01] <sconklin> resolution, we'll hold off preparing th enext Lucid
[16:01] <sconklin> kernels.
[16:02] <sconklin> Maverick apparently does have a problem, but it turns
[16:02] <sconklin> out that it may be a regression that appeared several
[16:02] <sconklin> releases ago. I'm also waiting for more information
[16:02] <sconklin> about testing results for this. If it turns out that
[16:02] <sconklin> this is the case, we will have to decide whether to
[16:02] <sconklin> go ahead and ship this kernel with the known bug
[16:02] <sconklin> which is already in the field, or to hold Maverick
[16:02] <sconklin> updates until the root cause is found. Since
[16:02] <sconklin> Maverick ec2 kernels are a flavour built from the
[16:02] <sconklin> master branch for Maverick (i.e. there is not a
[16:02] <sconklin> separate ec2 source base), any hold to Maverick
[16:02] <sconklin> must apply to all Maverick kernels other than
[16:02] <sconklin> ARM.
[16:02] <sconklin> I expect further updates on the ec2 kernels today.
[16:02] <sconklin> Source packages have been prepared for upload for
[16:02] <sconklin> Dapper, Hardy, and most of Karmic, and are ready
[16:02] <sconklin> for building on the kernel PPA. We will wrap up
[16:02] <sconklin> the rest of the Karmic packages today, and wait
[16:02] <sconklin> to proceed until we know about Lucid and Maverick
[16:02] <sconklin> ec2.
[16:02] <sconklin> ..
[16:02] <ara> o/
[16:03] <skaet_> go ara
[16:03] <ara> when are you taking the go-no go decision? who is doing the further testing on those?
[16:04] <sconklin> I'm awaiting a status report from Stefan Bader about the ec2 kernels, should have it very soon and then will circulate that by email. He's testing right now
[16:04] <skaet_> o/
[16:05] <vanhoof> sconklin: please let me know once the decision has been made
[16:05] <vanhoof> ..
[16:05] <sconklin> vanhoof: Will do.
[16:05] <ara> sconklin, OK, thanks. Please update the tracking bugs as well, there are people subscribed that will be interested
[16:05] <skaet_> sconklin: can you list the explicit tracking bugs that we should all be following?
[16:05] <skaet_> ..
[16:05] <ara> ..
[16:06] <sconklin> I'm not sure of the bugs releted to the specific failures in ec2.
[16:06] <sconklin> The master tracking bugs are all listed here: http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/reports/sru-report.html
[16:06] <marjo> skaet: QA team is tracking this one for Maverick:
[16:06] <pedro_> bug 725089 might be one, that's the bug we found during our testing:
[16:06] <pedro_> ..
[16:07] <marjo> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/725089
[16:07] <ara> o/
[16:08] <marjo> sconklin: that bug is assigned to jjohansen, is he the correct assignee?
[16:08] <sconklin> marjo: Yes
[16:08] <skaet_> sconklin:  the wiki pages has a lot of bugs listed, and it isn't clear to me on it which ones the status tracking are going on in.
[16:08] <marjo> sconklin: ack
[16:09] <skaet_> which specific one for maverick and lucid should I be looking at for this cycle?
[16:09] <sconklin> skaet_: you can tell from the bug title:
[16:09] <sconklin> linux: 2.6.32-29.58 -proposed tracker
[16:09] <sconklin> for example. That's the master tracker for the -proposed kernel
[16:09] <bjf> skaet_, if you look at the Maverick section, the one with the big red X icon next to it is the tracking bug which has a failure on it
[16:10] <skaet_> 723335 	linux: 2.6.35-27.48 -proposed tracker
[16:10] <skaet_> 		716532 	linux: 2.6.35-27.47 -proposed tracker
[16:10] <sconklin> I think that th etracking bugs for ec2 should have been set to verification-failed, but they weren't
[16:10] <skaet_> 		709352 	linux: 2.6.35-26.45 -proposed tracker
[16:11] <skaet_> there are mulitple proposed trackers, which should be used, and when?
[16:12] <bjf> skaet, you match the version in the title with the version in proposed
[16:12] <sconklin> which is just above the bugs for that kernel on the same page
[16:14] <skaet_> sconklin, bjf - will work with you offline then on the subject.   I do see now, but think if I'm confused, others probably are as well.
[16:14] <skaet_> any other questions?
[16:15] <skaet_> [TOPIC] HW certification - ara
[16:15] <MootBot> New Topic:  HW certification - ara
[16:15] <ara> hello again :)
[16:15] <skaet_> :)
[16:15] <ara> Our testing results for both Maverick and Lucid are going very well. As usual the reports can be found at
[16:15] <ara> [LINK] http://people.canonical.com/~hwcert/sru-testing/current/
[16:15] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://people.canonical.com/~hwcert/sru-testing/current/
[16:15] <ara> There are some desktops that are misbehaving, and we are troubleshooting them now, but nothing indicates so far that those could be kernel regressions.
[16:15] <brendand> o/
[16:15] <ara> Anyway, we will be updating the tracking bugs today, with all this information. But so far, thumbs up from us.
[16:16] <ara> Also, tomorrow I won't be able to attend the Kernel meeting, sconklin, but the tracking bugs will be updated from us by then.
[16:16] <ara> ..
[16:16] <marjo> ara: thx, looking forward to it
[16:16] <sconklin> ara: ack
[16:16] <skaet_> brendand: go
[16:16] <brendand> re: misbehaving desktops, they are behaving better now :)
[16:17] <skaet_> ara and brendand,  thanks!
[16:17] <skaet_> [TOPIC] QA status - marjo
[16:17] <MootBot> New Topic:  QA status - marjo
[16:17] <marjo> hi folks
[16:18] <marjo> * Hardy testing done
[16:18] <marjo> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/KernelSRU-hardy-2.6.24-28.84
[16:18] <marjo> * Lucid and Maverick testing
[16:18] <marjo> - Lucid completed. lucid https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/KernelSRU-lucid-2.6.32-29.58
[16:18] <marjo> - Maverick – regression found  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/KernelSRU-maverick-2.6.35-27.48
[16:18] <marjo> - Bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/725089 assigned to jjohansen
[16:18] <marjo> ..
[16:19] <skaet_> Thanks marjo
[16:19] <skaet_> o/
[16:19] <marjo> skaet_ go ahead?!
[16:19] <skaet_> how is this week going to work with alpha3 coming out for your team in terms of the new maverick kernel showing up?
[16:20] <marjo> skaet_ will be challenging :)
[16:20] <skaet_> marjo: ack
[16:20] <skaet_> any other questions?
[16:20] <marjo> skaet_ hggdh will be most affected, i.e. server ISO testing
[16:21] <bjf> marjo, you are doing iso testing this week ?
[16:21] <skaet_> bjf, yes, alpha 3 comes out on March 3rd.
[16:21] <marjo> bjf: yes, natty alpha 3 is due this thursday
[16:22] <bjf> marjo, next week will be the week for qa regression on a new maverick
[16:22] <marjo> bjf: you seem surprised?
[16:22] <bjf> marjo, not at all surprised
[16:22] <marjo> bjf: yes, we will be available again for SRU kernel testing next week (after alpha3 is out)
[16:23] <bjf> marjo, then i don't see where the conflict is between iso testing and maverick -proposed testing
[16:23] <skaet_> [TOPIC] general SRU status - pitti
[16:23] <MootBot> New Topic:  general SRU status - pitti
[16:23] <pitti> nothign really noteworthy here, as we don't have a coming deadline for a point release
[16:23] <skaet_> :)
[16:24] <skaet_> how are the SRU validation backlogs doing?
[16:24] <pitti> lucid still looks okay, as we flushed it for .2
[16:25] <pitti> we have some 3 or 4 proposed packages which are very old
[16:25]  * skaet_ nods
[16:25] <pitti> (but that isn't unusual either)
[16:25] <pitti> I usually give a warning for them in the bugs after half a year, and kill them from -proposed after another month
[16:26] <skaet_> ok, wasn't sure of the pattern, and some did look a bit old.
[16:26] <pitti> but that affects stuff like eclipse in lucid, not core things like eglibc
[16:26] <skaet_> thanks pitti.
[16:26] <skaet_> ..?
[16:27] <pitti> ..
[16:27] <skaet_> thanks,   sorry was commenting in the flow.
[16:27] <skaet_> any other questions?
[16:27] <skaet_> [TOPIC] OEM priorities - vanhoof
[16:27] <MootBot> New Topic:  OEM priorities - vanhoof
[16:28] <vanhoof> heh
[16:28] <skaet_> :)
[16:28] <vanhoof> news to me
[16:28] <vanhoof> current -proposed, or next cycle?
[16:28] <skaet_> next cycle
[16:28] <skaet_> was the though,  but if you've got concerns right now, feel free to raise.
[16:29] <vanhoof> we may have an interesting i915 patch, which needs a bit more testing, and then proper review ... that is the most pressing thing on my plate at the moment
[16:29] <vanhoof> I'll know more once we get a bit more testing done
[16:29] <vanhoof> as for the current -proposed, we're in good shape, just monitoring the release as it holds a few key bug fixes within it
[16:29] <vanhoof> ..
[16:30] <skaet_> thanks vanhoof!   questions?
[16:30] <skaet_> [TOPIC] Support priorities - martins
[16:30] <MootBot> New Topic:  Support priorities - martins
[16:30] <Guest78155> just sent you a long list
[16:30] <Guest78155> but for now, the status of the likewise open
[16:31] <Guest78155> need to fix my id, this is martins
[16:31] <zul> likewise open?
[16:31] <Guest78155> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/likewise-open/+bug/534629
[16:32] <Guest78155> yes, looks like it is commited
[16:33] <Guest78155> I just need to understand if it will go into the next point release
[16:33] <Guest78155> make sense?
[16:33] <skaet_> Guest78155, can we get its priorities set  so it gets into the right focus queues?
[16:34] <Guest78155> skaet_:  sure I will have it adjusted
[16:34] <skaet_> thanks!  in addition to importance, please make sure its targetted to milestone 10.04.3.
[16:35] <Guest78155> skaet_: I have a few others that I will want to cover with you off line, that is the one that I am tracking now
[16:35] <Guest78155> skaet_: sure will do
[16:35] <skaet_> Guest78155, sounds good.   Will work with you on it off line.
[16:35] <skaet_> thanks for letting us know which is on your hot list.
[16:36] <skaet_> any other questions?
[16:36] <skaet_> [TOPIC] New business, last chance for general questions? - all
[16:36] <Guest78155> skaet_: not now, I am good
[16:36] <MootBot> New Topic:  New business, last chance for general questions? - all
[16:36] <ara> o/
[16:36] <skaet_> ara: go
[16:37] <ara> in the StableReleaseCadence documentation the tag documented for tracking bugs is kernel-tracking-bug, but lately they have been tagged as kernel-release-tracking-bug
[16:37] <ara> which one is the correct one?
[16:37] <skaet_> sconklin, bjf ^^ ?
[16:37] <bjf> ara, kernel-release-tracking-bug, i'll update the doc
[16:37] <ara> bjf, thanks :)
[16:38]  * skaet_ looks around for any other questions?
[16:38] <skaet_> Thanks sconklin, bjf, marjo, ara, pitti, vanhoof, martins.
[16:38] <skaet_> #endmeeting
[16:38] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 10:38.
[16:39] <vanhoof> see ya skaet_
[16:39] <ara> thanks skaet_!
[16:39] <marjo> skaet: thx
[16:40] <skaet_> thanks again,  will put out minutes for this meeting, and get an agenda present out for the next one.
[16:40] <skaet_> minutes will be tomorrow though.
[18:11] <jdstrand> o/
[18:11] <micahg> o/
[18:11]  * sbeattie waves
[18:12] <mdeslaur> hello
[18:12] <jjohansen> \o
[18:12] <kees> \o
[18:13] <jdstrand> alrighty, let's get started
[18:13] <jdstrand> #startmeeting
[18:13] <MootBot> Meeting started at 12:13. The chair is jdstrand.
[18:13] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[18:13] <jdstrand> The meeting agenda can be found at:
[18:13] <jdstrand> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/Meeting
[18:13] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/Meeting
[18:13] <jdstrand> [TOPIC] Review of any previous action items
[18:13] <MootBot> New Topic:  Review of any previous action items
[18:13] <jdstrand> there aren't any ACTION items from last week, but I did want to follow up with sbeattie regarding openjdk
[18:14] <jdstrand> sbeattie: are you getting the help needed from doko for the update?
[18:15] <sbeattie> jdstrand: we're poking at it, yes; though as I mentioned elsewhere, I'm somewhat inclined to release the openjdk-6 packages I have, that built everywhere except ppc/karmic, and work with doko to resolve the build failure there and the 6b18 arm build failures.
[18:16] <jdstrand> sbeattie: that sounds reasonable
[18:16] <sbeattie> but I can poke a little harder at doko's hack first.
[18:17] <jdstrand> sbeattie: how severe are the vulns? specifically, is it worth haing the supported arch' users wait on ppc?
[18:17] <jdstrand> s/haing/having/
[18:18] <sbeattie> jdstrand: one of the vulns is the magic large number DoS (similar issue that php5 experienced), there's at least one security manager bypass issue.
[18:18]  * jdstrand nods
[18:19] <kees> fyi, chromium wants to put a floor on the minimum version of openjdk of 1.9.7, and expects to do that with the chromium 10 release.
[18:19] <jdstrand> I'm inclined to skip ppc this time
[18:19] <sbeattie> I'd really like to get fixes out to the supported arch users.
[18:19] <jdstrand> eek
[18:19] <jdstrand> micahg: ^
[18:19] <micahg> :(
[18:19] <sbeattie> kees: that... will be a problem on arm.
[18:19] <micahg> jdstrand: actually, not an issue, lucid+ will have that with sbeattie's updates
[18:19] <kees> sbeattie: I suspect arm will have lots of problems beyond just that :)
[18:19] <jdstrand> sbeattie: ack
[18:20] <sbeattie> (assuming I ever release something :-( )
[18:20] <jdstrand> micahg: ah, good
[18:20] <micahg> sbeattie: I think we've got at least one more release before chromium 10
[18:20] <jdstrand> sbeattie: I appreciate all the time and effort you've put into this
[18:20]  * jdstrand hugs sbeattie 
[18:21] <kees> anyway, it came up with a conversation I was having with chris evans
[18:21] <jdstrand> sbeattie: is there anything that can be added to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/UpdateProcedures so that it would be easier next time? eg, so that we don't lose knowledge, etc
[18:21] <jdstrand> kees: is chris evans the google chromium security guy?
[18:21]  * jdstrand can't remember off-hand
[18:22] <sbeattie> jdstrand: yes, I can document how to put together the orig tarball, though that's not been the source of the issue with this update.
[18:22] <jdstrand> sbeattie: perhaps added to QRT/notest_testing if that makes more sense
[18:23] <jdstrand> sbeattie: ok. I think that would be a good idea
[18:23] <jdstrand> sbeattie: whenever you get a chance
[18:23] <kees> jdstrand: no, that's... someone else. who's name I'm blanking on. this is http://scarybeastsecurity.blogspot.com/
[18:23] <sbeattie> jdstrand: will do. (feel free to add it as an action item)
[18:23] <jdstrand> kees: ah right. duh
[18:24] <jdstrand> [ACTION] sbeattie to update https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/UpdateProcedures and/or QRT for openjdk tarball generation, build instructions, etc
[18:24] <MootBot> ACTION received:  sbeattie to update https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/UpdateProcedures and/or QRT for openjdk tarball generation, build instructions, etc
[18:24] <jdstrand> sbeattie: thanks
[18:24] <jdstrand> [TOPIC] Weekly stand-up report
[18:24] <MootBot> New Topic:  Weekly stand-up report
[18:24] <jdstrand> I'll go first
[18:24] <jdstrand> I'm in the happy place this week
[18:25] <jdstrand> I've got archive-admin work for alpha3
[18:25] <jdstrand> some more libvirt sponsoring
[18:25] <jdstrand> tbird and chromium testing on amd64
[18:25] <jdstrand> QRT updates for apparmor and libvirt
[18:25] <jdstrand> more investigation of changes auditing
[18:25] <jdstrand> and investigate a reported ufw logging issue
[18:25] <jdstrand> basically a bunch of random stuff :)
[18:26] <jdstrand> I'll pick up an update if I've got time, but I am not optimistic this week
[18:26] <jdstrand> that's it from me
[18:26] <jdstrand> kees: you're up
[18:26] <kees> okay, spent a while working on upstreaming lkml things, adding more qrt tests for them, docs, etc.
[18:26] <kees> this week I'm on triage.
[18:27] <kees> that's really about it from me.
[18:28] <jdstrand> kees: is that s/spent/spend/?
[18:28] <kees> jdstrand: I was reporting last week, yes. spent
[18:28] <jdstrand> ah
[18:29] <jdstrand> k
[18:29] <kees> jdstrand: this week I'd like to work on gcc testsuite updates but I always say that.
[18:29] <jdstrand> ok
[18:29] <jdstrand> mdeslaur: you're next
[18:30] <mdeslaur> I'm currently publishing samba, clamav and fuse
[18:30] <mdeslaur> and then will work on ffmpeg, and some more from the list
[18:31] <mdeslaur> I have an embargoed issue or two to look at
[18:31] <mdeslaur> and will do some iso testing this week
[18:31] <mdeslaur> that's about it!
[18:31] <mdeslaur> sbeattie: tag, you're it
[18:33] <sbeattie> I'm on community this week; I was on triage last week; I fell a bit behind on bug triage (sorry kees!) so will try to help catch up on that this week.
[18:33] <kees> jdstrand: evan martin is the guy from UDS.
[18:33] <jdstrand> ah yes
[18:33] <jdstrand> micahg: you might try to get in contact with him ^
[18:33] <kees> sbeattie: no worries :)
[18:33] <jdstrand> micahg: I was unsuccessful
[18:34] <micahg> jdstrand: ACK
[18:34] <jdstrand> micahg: well, I may have contacted him, I don't know. He never contacted me back :)
[18:34] <sbeattie> I have the whole openjdk issue (already discussed) and a logwatch update underway
[18:35]  * jdstrand notes that sbeattie got apparmor 2.6 released and uploaded to natty last week
[18:35] <sbeattie> I also released the upstream apparmor 2.6.0 tarball, merged that into natty (with jdstrand's review and sponsorship), but I need to formally announce it.
[18:35] <jdstrand> hehe
[18:35] <sbeattie> jdstrand: heh
[18:36] <jdstrand> sbeattie: I didn't think you were going to mention it!
[18:36] <jdstrand> :)
[18:36] <sbeattie> I also need to do a similar release for 2.5.2.
[18:36] <sbeattie> I think that's it for me.
[18:37] <jdstrand> sbeattie: fyi, the binaries haven't hit the archive cause an archive admin other than me needs to deNEW it (hung on the new python-libapparmor)
[18:37]  * sbeattie should probably schedule an upstream apparmor meeting.
[18:37] <sbeattie> jdstrand: oh, okay. do we think they'll get approved by alpha 3?
[18:37] <jdstrand> sbeattie: would you mind poking an AA today so it can get deNEWed in time for alpha3?
[18:38] <sbeattie> jdstrand: sure, can do.
[18:38] <jdstrand> sbeattie: well, the should be, but I want to make sure they are
[18:38] <jdstrand> sbeattie: thanks!
[18:38] <jdstrand> I'm pretty excited about the python bindings
[18:38] <micahg> alpha3 freeze is in 4.5 hours, so I would suggest that happen sooner rather than later if you want it in
[18:38] <jdstrand> micahg: well, it is already uploaded from 4 days ago, so the aa *should* do it
[18:39] <jdstrand> but yeah
[18:39] <jdstrand> sooner than lator
[18:39] <sbeattie> jdstrand: me too! Especially given the last minute tweaking I had to do to get them to work at all.
[18:39] <jdstrand> heh
[18:41] <jdstrand> if sbeattie doesn't have any more, micahg, you're up
[18:41] <sbeattie> yep, all done.
[18:41] <micahg> Chromium/Firefox/Thunderbird updates
[18:41] <micahg> upgrading to natty
[18:42] <micahg> still have a few setup items to do
[18:43] <micahg> I think that's it
[18:43] <jdstrand> cool
[18:43]  * micahg also needs to get up to speed on webkit
[18:45] <jdstrand> great, mdeslaur can brain-dump on you
[18:45] <jdstrand> that sounded kinda wrong
[18:45] <jdstrand> anyhoo
[18:45] <jdstrand> [TOPIC] Miscellaneous and Questions
[18:45] <MootBot> New Topic:  Miscellaneous and Questions
[18:45] <jdstrand> does anyone have any other questions or items to discuss?
[18:46] <mdeslaur> nope!
[18:46]  * sbeattie eyes jjohansen nervously.
[18:47] <jjohansen> hehe, problem solved boring technical paper to follow
[18:47] <jjohansen> :)
[18:47] <sbeattie> jjohansen: heh, cool. Technical papers are good.
[18:47] <jdstrand> jjohansen: mentioned ealier. do you think we should have an apparmor upstream meeting this week?
[18:47] <jjohansen> yeah, it might be a good idea
[18:48] <jjohansen> start planning for 2.7/3.0
[18:48] <jdstrand> cool, we can do that in #apparmor
[18:48] <jdstrand> (schedule it that is)
[18:48] <jjohansen> yep
[18:49] <jdstrand> ok
[18:49] <jdstrand> thanks kees, mdeslaur, sbeattie, micahg and jjohansen!
[18:49] <jdstrand> #endmeeting
[18:49] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 12:49.
[18:49] <mdeslaur> thanks jdstrand!
[18:50] <sbeattie> jdstrand: thank you!
[18:50] <jdstrand> sure thing :)
[18:50] <micahg> thanks jdstrand
[18:50] <kees> thanks!
[18:50] <jdstrand> :)
[19:04] <kklimonda> geser: is the dmb meeting tonight, as mentioned on te agenda?
[19:05] <geser> kklimonda: yes (if we get quorum)
[19:05] <hallyn> \o
[19:05]  * stgraber waves
[19:05] <Daviey> o/
[19:06] <Quintasan> kklimonda: sup
[19:07] <geser> bdrung_, cody-somerville, persia, maco: DMB meeting
[19:08]  * cody-somerville is here.
[19:08] <maco> hi
[19:09] <SpamapS> o/
[19:11] <geser> if I didn't miscount, then we are quorate
[19:11] <maco> Laney: around?
[19:11] <SpamapS> i can only stay for a little whil... at what point is the meeting postponed?
[19:12] <geser> any volunteers for chair?
[19:12] <geser> maco: Iain mailed the DMB list that he can't today
[19:12] <cnd> o/
[19:12] <maco> oh ok
[19:12] <maco> im still not on that list
[19:12] <bdrung_> o/ i couldn't make it earlier
[19:14] <geser> #startmeeting
[19:14] <MootBot> Meeting started at 13:14. The chair is geser.
[19:14] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[19:14]  * cody-somerville has a nose bleed, afk.
[19:14] <geser> [TOPIC] Review of previous action items
[19:14] <MootBot> New Topic:  Review of previous action items
[19:14] <geser> * Emmet Hikory to organise the selection process for DMB renewal
[19:15] <geser> the voting is done
[19:15] <geser> but I don't know how far Emmet is with organizing the take-over of the DMB mailing list (will try asking him)
[19:16] <geser> and I don't remember seeing an official announcement of the new DMB (will ask him about it too or do it myself)
[19:16] <geser> anything else regarding the new DMB?
[19:17] <geser> [TOPIC] Administrative Matters
[19:17] <MootBot> New Topic:  Administrative Matters
[19:17] <geser> * Review progress of probationary period of Marco Rodrigues
[19:18] <geser> as cody-somerville went afk we have to defer it for later
[19:18] <geser> [TOPIC] MOTU Application: Sylvestre Ledru
[19:18] <MootBot> New Topic:  MOTU Application: Sylvestre Ledru
[19:19] <geser> is Sylvestre Ledru here?
[19:21] <geser> ok, looks like we have to defer it to e-mail
[19:22] <geser> [TOPIC] core-dev application: Dave Walker
[19:22] <MootBot> New Topic:  core-dev application: Dave Walker
[19:22] <geser> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DaveWalker/DeveloperApplication
[19:22] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DaveWalker/DeveloperApplication
[19:22] <Daviey> o/
[19:23] <geser> a first question was already done during the last meeting
[19:23] <Daviey> Yes
[19:23] <Daviey> I was interviewed in the last meeting
[19:24] <geser> [LINK] http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/02/14/%23ubuntu-meeting.html#t12:28
[19:24] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/02/14/%23ubuntu-meeting.html#t12:28
[19:24] <bdrung_> i have no questions
[19:25] <geser> someone have any questions? or are all still reading?
[19:25]  * cody-somerville is reading.
[19:26]  * stgraber is reading the log
[19:26] <cody-somerville> Daviey, What upload permissions do you already have?
[19:27] <Daviey> cody-somerville, mythbuntu-dev
[19:27] <cody-somerville> ah, right.
[19:27] <Daviey> last timei polled
[19:27] <Daviey> http://erk.daviey.com/ubuntu-archive-access.txt
[19:27] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://erk.daviey.com/ubuntu-archive-access.txt
[19:29] <maco> need to keep the cadbury eggs away?
[19:29] <Daviey> eek.
[19:29] <stgraber> ok, done reading the log
[19:31] <maco> done reading
[19:31] <geser> any questions or are we ready for voting?
[19:32] <cody-somerville> Daviey, Becoming a Ubuntu Core Developer is more than just about upload rights - Its a leadership position. What are the most important values and ethics you demonstrate as a leader? Give me an example of these in practice.
[19:32] <Daviey> cody-somerville, Good question.
[19:32] <Daviey> It's about taking responsibility for your actions... thinking of other teams
[19:33] <Daviey> That is, don't upload something before speaking with others it might cause woe to.
[19:33] <Daviey> If you break something, ,make sure you notify people if needed... fix it
[19:33] <geser> does this also apply to MOTU?
[19:33] <Daviey> or give someone else enough information to fix it themselves
[19:34] <Daviey> geser, yes.. because Universe isn't just MOTU :)
[19:34] <Daviey> but equally, some packages have people who are essentially maintainers.. it would be rude and potentially damaging to not at least speak to them first
[19:34] <Daviey> I appreciate they aren't /really/ maintainers... but some people tend to look after some
[19:35] <Daviey> Equally, whilst it isn't in main... it still has rdepends, maybe
[19:35] <geser> where do you see differences (in leadership position) between MOTU and core-dev?
[19:35] <Daviey> so ABI bumping, or version increasing could be bad cookies
[19:35] <Daviey> geser, not a great deal TBH.
[19:36] <Daviey> core-dev clearly had more responsibilty
[19:36] <Daviey> If i broke a package in main, it would, for example, it could hurt others developement that is shipped
[19:36] <Daviey> Damaging a daily for example
[19:36] <Daviey> Universe doesn't have that same harm.
[19:36] <Daviey> (for the main flavours anyway)
[19:37] <Laney> Do you monitor bugs for packages which you upload to watch out for such breakage?
[19:37] <micahg> that's not true
[19:37] <Laney> (/me appears for 2 minutes)
[19:37] <Daviey> Laney, yes
[19:37] <micahg> a bad upload in universe could break the xubuntu dailies
[19:37] <maco> or edubuntu
[19:38] <Daviey> micahg, <Daviey> (for the main flavours anyway)
[19:38] <Daviey> maco, ^^
[19:38] <maco> i assumed edubuntu was being intentionally not counted as "main flavours" but i do tend to think of xubuntu as being one of them
[19:38] <cody-somerville> Daviey, Do you consider yourself a generalist?
[19:39] <Laney> Daviey: Being a core developer is more than just raw packaging, it includes feature work too. Have you done much of that? (answer Cody's question first)
[19:39] <Daviey> cody-somerville, My heart is looking out for the whole distro... but i tend to find there are areas where i /need/ to work on.
[19:39] <Daviey> Laney, yes :)
[19:40] <Laney> Can you briefly outline your experience and plans for when/if you get access? :-)
[19:40] <Daviey> Laney, My daily work is mostly around blueprints work.
[19:40] <Daviey> I've been heavily tracking features of -server for the last year.
[19:41] <Daviey> As in monitoring progress and such... been the server representive for some  of the weekly release meetings.
[19:41] <Daviey> Laney, I have a good understanding of the release cycle stages.
[19:42] <Laney> Good, that's important to have a firm grasp of.
[19:42]  * Laney has no more questions
[19:42] <Daviey> Laney, did that suitably answer your question?
[19:43] <cody-somerville> Daviey, What motivates you to apply for core developer instead of just upload rights to the ubuntu-server package set?
[19:43] <Daviey> cody-somerville, I don't want to purely work on the -server.. I want to be more of a general player.
[19:44] <Daviey> As i mentioned in the previous meeting, i feel i'm using up my sponsorship time on stuff i HAVE to work on
[19:44] <Daviey> not /want/ to work on
[19:44] <cody-somerville> Daviey, Whats stopping you from using the standard sponsorship process to work on things you want to work on?
[19:44] <Daviey> Equally, there is quite an overlap between what is not in the server seed and core.
[19:45] <Laney> OK I do have to leave now, will vote by email if needed.
[19:45] <Daviey> cody-somerville, Nothing especially.
[19:45] <Laney> /away
[19:45] <cody-somerville> Daviey, Are you familiar with the community processes around sponsorship?
[19:45] <Daviey> cody-somerville, yes..
[19:45] <Daviey> cody-somerville, Both UDD and tradional debdiff attached to LP bug
[19:46] <maco> I'm getting the impression Daviey is starting to feel like nixternal did when his sponsors all turned on him and said "JUST APPLY ALREADY"
[19:46] <cody-somerville> maco, for server stuff, definitely seems like it.
[19:47] <Daviey> There has been some of that...  When i do get stuff sponsored i don't tend to hear on quibbles with it
[19:47] <Daviey> The last one was a superfluous white space at an end of a patch
[19:48] <Daviey> cody-somerville, Well this is true.. but equally for the stuff not in server seed.
[19:49] <cody-somerville> Daviey, So you think that if you were to be granted core-dev you'd be more inclined to work on packages you have a personal interest in but for whatever reason you've never touched before via a sponsor? Why is that? Is the normal sponsorship process (where you don't have a dedicated set of sponsors like you seem to have with server stuff) do heavy? Any feedback on how we might improve it so that folks like yourself will use
[19:49] <cody-somerville> it instead of waiting for upload permissions?
[19:50] <Daviey> I would like to do more sponsorship for others, than i've currently been able to do.
[19:50] <cody-somerville> s/do/too/
[19:50] <Daviey> cody-somerville, The process has been improved massively in the last couple of years.
[19:51] <Daviey> Particularly with UDD and patch pilot, has helped improve that
[19:51] <Daviey> There was a time when some of my work would bake in places like revu or debdiffs for months
[19:51] <Daviey> cody-somerville, It's not totally about personal interest TBH.
[19:52] <Daviey> personal interest in specific packages that is
[19:52] <Daviey> I have had frustrating times when i've pushed a bzr branch, done the sponsorship process, waited...
[19:52]  * cody-somerville is ready to vote.
[19:52] <Daviey> only to find someone else uploaded it independently
[19:53] <Daviey> which really makes you want to scream.
[19:53] <ari-tczew> Daviey: sorry for interrupt, are you going to spend some time on sponsorship for community in your free time? (non-Canonical hours)
[19:53] <Daviey> ari-tczew, Canonical is largely irrelevant in this :)
[19:53] <geser> [VOTE] Should Dave Walker become core-dev?
[19:53] <MootBot> Please vote on:  Should Dave Walker become core-dev?.
[19:53] <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0  to MootBot
[19:53] <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting
[19:53] <bdrung> +1
[19:53] <MootBot> +1 received from bdrung. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1
[19:53] <geser> +1
[19:53] <maco> +1
[19:53] <MootBot> +1 received from geser. 2 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2
[19:53] <MootBot> +1 received from maco. 3 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 3
[19:53] <stgraber> +1
[19:53] <MootBot> +1 received from stgraber. 4 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 4
[19:53] <Daviey> ari-tczew, I was doing packaging work yesterday
[19:53] <cody-somerville> +0
[19:53] <MootBot> Abstention received from cody-somerville. 4 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 4
[19:53] <Daviey> handling bugs
[19:54] <geser> [ENDVOTE]
[19:54] <MootBot> Final result is 4 for, 0 against. 1 abstained. Total: 4
[19:54] <geser> Daviey: congrats
[19:54] <Quintasan> Daviey: \o/
[19:54] <Daviey> \o/
[19:55]  * Quintasan hands Daviey cookies
[19:55]  * Daviey just shouted an obscenity, and apologies
[19:55] <geser> you even didn't need the two +1 from the previous DMB members
[19:55]  * Daviey is really happy chappy.
[19:55]  * bdrung is getting hungy and want's cookies too.
[19:55] <bdrung> Daviey: congrats
[19:55] <Daviey> bdrung, grab me at UDS for a cookie.
[19:55] <Daviey> Thanks all o/
[19:55]  * cody-somerville has to go to another meeting in 5.
[19:55] <SpamapS> i can only stay for a little whil... at what point is the meeting postponed?eetg my met connection went out...i
[19:56] <geser> [TOPIC] PPU application: Serge Hallyn
[19:56] <MootBot> New Topic:  PPU application: Serge Hallyn
[19:56] <hallyn> o/
[19:56] <geser> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SergeHallyn/PerPackageDeveloperApplication
[19:56] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SergeHallyn/PerPackageDeveloperApplication
[19:56] <SpamapS> ooops pls disregard
[20:00] <SpamapS> sorry if my nar was called... connectivity has been spotty
[20:00] <SpamapS> s/nar/name/
[20:01] <geser> SpamapS: you'll be next one
[20:02] <geser> any questions for hallyn?
[20:02] <maco> hi hallyn
[20:03] <hallyn> maco: hey
[20:03] <maco> some of the endorsements on your wiki page include folks saying you should start working on more packages so you can have wider contributions aside from the ones you're currently asking for PPU on. any plans in that direction?
[20:04] <hallyn> yup.  I've been pretty swamped with bugs in older releases in qemu, etc - but I do like to look at bugs in new packages
[20:05] <bdrung> hallyn: you dislike having ubuntu-specific patches and don't caring in forwarding them. have you done some work to reduce the delta to debian? looking for example at libvirt 0.8.8-1ubuntu1 shows a huge delta
[20:06] <hallyn> bdrung: what do you mean, don't care to forward them?  I definately do want to fwd them to debian/upstream
[20:06] <Daviey> (/me throws in that i suggested hallyn do a rather complex merge of libvirt and multipath-tools, and he did a really good job... listened to comments, and acted on them)
[20:07] <hallyn> bdrung: until this latest merge, libvirt had diverged from the debian package, but now that we've resynced (as of last week) I intend to push as much as possible back up
[20:07] <maco> hallyn: he meant carrying them forward to th enext ubuntu version of the package
[20:07] <bdrung> hallyn: i just rephrased "without the requisite followup"
[20:07] <maco> (or at leas,t i think so)
[20:08] <hallyn> bdrung: ah.  so yes.  we still haven't been able to resync with deiban for qemu, but for libvirt that's the plan
[20:09] <bdrung> hallyn: is resyncing qemu-kvm on the todo list?
[20:10] <hallyn> it's on the...  someday? list.   it would at this point involve qemu-linaro as well
[20:10] <hallyn> bdrung: the package splitup is very different between the two
[20:10] <hallyn> but, I absolutely do not like having a completely different base from debian.
[20:11] <hallyn> I'm hoping in next cycle to have a discusison with lool and slangasek about it, fwiw
[20:11] <bdrung> looking at the qemu-kvm changelog, there seems to be no common anchor
[20:12] <slangasek> syncing qemu with Debian requires solving the "arch: all packages from !i386" issue, fwiw
[20:12] <bdrung> hallyn: do you have any idea how to avoid such huge deltas?
[20:13] <hallyn> bdrung: sync with debian and forward patches back to them?  :)  other than that, no.
[20:14] <bdrung> hallyn: there's a way that goes beyond that: joining the debian team for the package and apply the changes there
[20:15] <hallyn> I wouldn't want to look like I'm shoving patches down their throats, but joining the team is appealing
[20:15] <SpamapS> hey guys sorry to interrupt your questioning of sergr... i hqve mjor jet lag and avery bursty connection....
[20:16] <geser> anymore questions?
[20:16] <stgraber> not from me
[20:16] <maco> nope
[20:16] <SpamapS> so i will have to reschedule for next meeting
[20:16] <bdrung> we can vote
[20:16] <Daviey> (hallyn has previously expressed interest in getting more involved with Debian)
[20:16] <maco> SpamapS: ok
[20:17] <geser> [VOTE] Grant Serge Hallyn PPU rights for vmbuilder, multipath-tools, qemu-kvm, qemu-linary, seabios, vgabios, kvm-pxe, libvirt-bin, lxc and libcap2?
[20:17] <MootBot> Please vote on:  Grant Serge Hallyn PPU rights for vmbuilder, multipath-tools, qemu-kvm, qemu-linary, seabios, vgabios, kvm-pxe, libvirt-bin, lxc and libcap2?.
[20:17] <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0  to MootBot
[20:17] <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting
[20:17] <geser> +1
[20:17] <MootBot> +1 received from geser. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1
[20:17] <stgraber> +1
[20:17] <bdrung> +1
[20:17] <MootBot> +1 received from stgraber. 2 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2
[20:17] <MootBot> +1 received from bdrung. 3 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 3
[20:17] <maco> +1
[20:17] <MootBot> +1 received from maco. 4 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 4
[20:18] <hallyn> yay :)  thanks
[20:18] <geser> cody-somerville?
[20:18] <cody-somerville> +0
[20:18] <MootBot> Abstention received from cody-somerville. 4 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 4
[20:18]  * cody-somerville is in another meeting.
[20:18] <geser> [ENDVOTE]
[20:18] <MootBot> Final result is 4 for, 0 against. 1 abstained. Total: 4
[20:18] <geser> hallyn: congrats
[20:19] <geser> SpamapS: you would be next right now, you want to reschedule?
[20:19] <hallyn> geser: thanks :)
[20:21] <geser> ok, we will reschedule SpamapS for the next meeting and move on
[20:21] <geser> [TOPIC] MOTU application: Krzysztof Klimonda
[20:21] <MootBot> New Topic:  MOTU application: Krzysztof Klimonda
[20:21] <geser> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KrzysztofKlimonda/MOTUApplication
[20:21] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KrzysztofKlimonda/MOTUApplication
[20:22] <kklimonda> hey
[20:28] <bdrung> kklimonda: do you want to join the sponsor team?
[20:29] <bdrung> making it more "humane"?
[20:30] <kklimonda> bdrung: yes, although I prefer not to get involved with packages I'm unable to test myself. Still, if there are some sponsorships for packages I know of (or are simple enough) I see no problem helping with working on them.
[20:31] <bdrung> kklimonda: so sponsoring only in your comfort zone?
[20:32] <geser> kklimonda: +1 for packaging pyramid, I'm currently moving from turbogears to pyramid so would like to see pyramid in Debian and Ubuntu
[20:33] <geser> bdrung: don't do all sponsors it? sponsor only fixes you are comfortable with?
[20:33] <bdrung> geser: python-pyramid is in NEW
[20:33] <kklimonda> bdrung: I believe that working on packages you use yourself (or packages that are dependencies of those packages) gives better result.
[20:33] <kklimonda> bdrung: I have no problem sponsoring anything - it's not a technical problem on my part, I just don't believe it works well
[20:34] <maco> geser: i hope so!
[20:34] <bdrung> geser: probably, but looking at packages outside your comfort zone can give you a broader knowledge
[20:34] <kklimonda> bdrung: I'd actually prefer unseeded packages to be split among teams, and packages that are not in any packageset to be synced with debian.
[20:34] <geser> kklimonda: re gtkmm lp group: who are "we"?
[20:35] <kklimonda> (minus some edge cases like FTBFSs)
[20:35] <kklimonda> geser: it's actually an entire ubuntu-desktop team, me, asomething and the Gtkmm upstream author who we can talk with in case of problems.
[20:36] <kklimonda> geser: I really don't have a head to write better description :)
[20:37] <geser> was creating the gtkmm group the right step to ease maintainance?
[20:39] <kklimonda> geser: I believe so - it's safer to give commit rights to few packages from the gtkmm "packageset" without adding people to the ubuntu-desktop team - that would give them access to GNOME 3 PPA and all their branches.
[20:40] <geser> makes sense
[20:40] <geser> any other questions or can we vote?
[20:42] <geser> [VOTE] Should Krzysztof Klimonda become a MOTU?
[20:42] <MootBot> Please vote on:  Should Krzysztof Klimonda become a MOTU?.
[20:42] <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0  to MootBot
[20:42] <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting
[20:42] <geser> +1
[20:42] <MootBot> +1 received from geser. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1
[20:42] <bdrung> +1
[20:42] <MootBot> +1 received from bdrung. 2 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2
[20:43] <stgraber> +1
[20:43] <MootBot> +1 received from stgraber. 3 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 3
[20:44] <maco> +1
[20:44] <MootBot> +1 received from maco. 4 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 4
[20:44] <geser> cody-somerville: still in another meeting?
[20:45] <cody-somerville> +0 - yup.
[20:45] <MootBot> Abstention received from cody-somerville. 4 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 4
[20:45] <geser> [ENDVOTE]
[20:45] <MootBot> Final result is 4 for, 0 against. 1 abstained. Total: 4
[20:45] <Quintasan> kklimonda: highfive
[20:45] <geser> kklimonda: congrats
[20:45] <bdrung> congrats kklimonda
[20:45] <kklimonda> thanks all :)
[20:46] <geser> the next two topics are connected
[20:46] <geser> [TOPIC] Create uTouch package set and grant Chase Douglas upload rights to it
[20:46] <MootBot> New Topic:  Create uTouch package set and grant Chase Douglas upload rights to it
[20:46] <geser> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Multitouch/uTouchPackageSetApplication
[20:46] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Multitouch/uTouchPackageSetApplication
[20:47] <geser> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ChaseDouglas/DeveloperApplication-uTouch
[20:47] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ChaseDouglas/DeveloperApplication-uTouch
[20:47] <ScottK> kklimonda: Congratulations.
[20:47] <kklimonda> ScottK: thank you :)
[20:47] <maco> kklimonda: now we can all stop going "wait youre not a motu yet?!"
[20:47] <geser> cnd: here?
[20:47] <cnd> geser, yep
[20:47] <ari-tczew> Polish developer grow up :D
[20:47] <cnd> hi!
[20:47] <ari-tczew> s*
[20:48] <cnd> I have two agenda items
[20:48] <cnd> this first is to allow some members of our utouch team to upload more efficiently to our packages
[20:48] <geser> cnd: how many new developers are expected for the uTouch package set in near future?
[20:48] <cnd> I would guess two or three
[20:49] <cnd> including myself
[20:49] <oubiwann> geser, cnd: yup
[20:49] <oubiwann> (I manage that team)
[20:50] <cnd> If approved, I'll be asking Stephen Webb, another member of our team, to apply for sure
[20:51] <cnd> there are a few others who I could see going for approval if they were interested
[20:54] <bdrung> cnd: are there plan for getting the utouch packages into debian?
[20:54] <cnd> bdrung, they are currently dependent on the X stack that we have in ubuntu
[20:54] <cnd> I'm leading development on XInput 2.1 upstream in X.org
[20:54] <cnd> and once that is in X.org and trickles down to debian
[20:55] <cnd> then we can look into going through debian first
[20:55] <cnd> however, we do extremely rapid development as well
[20:55] <cnd> right now, for example, I don't believe we could go to debian even if there weren't dependency issues
[20:56] <cnd> because of the deadlines upon our team :)
[20:56] <cnd> hopefully in the future these will lessen
[20:58] <geser> any questions?
[21:00] <geser> [VOTE] Create the uTouch package set as described at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Multitouch/uTouchPackageSetApplication?
[21:00] <MootBot> Please vote on:  Create the uTouch package set as described at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Multitouch/uTouchPackageSetApplication?.
[21:00] <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0  to MootBot
[21:00] <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting
[21:00] <bdrung> cnd: you plan to work more on package uploads for universe packages. do you already have some packages you want to work on?
[21:00] <maco> geser: too fast :P
[21:00] <cnd> bdrung, there are some community multitouch games
[21:01] <cnd> I hope to help shepherd them in
[21:01] <cnd> but otherwise, I haven't had a chance to even take a look at universe sponsorship
[21:01] <cnd> this kind of gets into the second item on the agenda though, which is my own personal application
[21:01] <cnd> I'd be happy to talk about it here too, just wanted to make that note
[21:04] <bdrung> +1
[21:04] <MootBot> +1 received from bdrung. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1
[21:04] <stgraber> +1 [Create a package set for utouch packages]
[21:04] <MootBot> +1 received from stgraber. 2 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2
[21:05] <geser> +1
[21:06] <MootBot> +1 received from geser. 3 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 3
[21:06] <maco> +1
[21:06] <MootBot> +1 received from maco. 4 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 4
[21:07] <geser> [ENDVOTE]
[21:07] <MootBot> Final result is 4 for, 0 against. 0 abstained. Total: 4
[21:08] <geser> any questions for cnd's application?
[21:08] <cnd> I want to make a note
[21:08] <cnd> I'm trying to work towards being a core dev
[21:08] <cnd> I've been pushed by others to do so :)
[21:08] <cnd> so my application technically is just for the utouch stack
[21:08] <cnd> but after I filed it, I figured it wouldn't hurt to ask for motu on top too
[21:09] <cnd> if you'd prefer, I can prepare a separate applciation for that though
[21:09] <cnd> but some of the endorsements on the utouch application, such as bryce's, show that I am ready for at least motu
[21:09] <bdrung> for motu/core-dev you may need to broaden your work
[21:10] <cnd> bdrung, yeah, I understand
[21:10] <cnd> which is why I didn't think I'd apply directly for them at this time
[21:10] <cnd> but I'd been urged by others to do so
[21:10] <cnd> I have prepared multiple uploads to ubuntu main
[21:11] <cnd> many more than universe, unfortunately
[21:11] <cnd> and technically, I've touched quite a bit up and down the ubuntu stack :)
[21:11] <bdrung> outside the utouch and related packages?
[21:11] <cnd> yes
[21:12] <cnd> I've prepared an upload for qt for multitouch, I've done linux kernel packaging as a previous job at canonical
[21:12] <cnd> I've prepared gnome-settings-daemon, pkg-create-dbgsym
[21:12] <cnd> the x server, input proto, x input modules
[21:13] <cnd> I'm the maintainer of my own package in debian
[21:13] <cnd> and I sync that if there are bug fixes
[21:13] <cnd> (that's my only real universe work :)
[21:13] <cnd> the only thing keeping me from doing more is my day job on utouch :)
[21:14] <bdrung> :)
[21:14] <cnd> it's been quite more than a normal full time job lately :)
[21:14] <cnd> which is also a problem for getting this packaging experience :)
[21:14] <cnd> I have quite a bit, but it's rather vertical
[21:15] <cnd> I only get a chance to branch out when there are bugs elsewhere that I fix, usually
[21:15] <geser> do you have much time to branch out?
[21:15] <cnd> no, tbh
[21:15] <cnd> but if it's required
[21:15] <cnd> then I'll make the time necessary
[21:17] <geser> "required" as in we would like to see you have a broad expierence with different packages
[21:17] <cnd> I'm hoping that some of these new multitouch games will be able to give me some more experience
[21:17] <cnd> yeah, it's hard to tell what that quantifies to :)
[21:18] <geser> stacks have often the tendency to use a similar packaging
[21:18] <cnd> I currently have no idea
[21:18] <cnd> does that mean 10 packages spread out?
[21:18] <cnd> there's a lot of this that's subjective, and I'd be happy with any guidance you can give
[21:20] <cnd> I believe I have the competency level that is required
[21:21] <cnd> I've been taught proper procedures by Didier Roche, who helped me understand the full ubuntu developer mechanisms
[21:21] <cnd> integrating with bzr and such
[21:21] <cnd> and I've worked in some of the most complex packaging, such as the ubuntu kernel and xorg-server
[21:22] <cnd> so I'm really just missing the experience, and that's a big question mark for me because I'm not sure what types and how much experience I need
[21:22] <geser> any more questions for cnd or can we vote on his uTouch package set upload rights?
[21:23] <stgraber> geser: I'm fine to vote on his package set application
[21:23] <bdrung> me too
[21:24] <geser> [VOTE] Grant Chase Douglas upload rights to the uTouch package set?
[21:24] <MootBot> Please vote on:  Grant Chase Douglas upload rights to the uTouch package set?.
[21:24] <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0  to MootBot
[21:24] <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting
[21:24] <geser> +1
[21:24] <MootBot> +1 received from geser. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1
[21:24] <bdrung> +1
[21:24] <MootBot> +1 received from bdrung. 2 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2
[21:24] <stgraber> +1
[21:24] <MootBot> +1 received from stgraber. 3 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 3
[21:25] <maco> +1
[21:25] <MootBot> +1 received from maco. 4 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 4
[21:25] <geser> [ENDVOTE]
[21:25] <MootBot> Final result is 4 for, 0 against. 0 abstained. Total: 4
[21:25] <geser> cnd: congrats
[21:25] <stgraber> cnd: the packages you've touched so far seem to mostly be well maintained packages with proper procedures and using modern packaging tools. It's sadly not the case for all packages.
[21:25] <cnd> geser, thansk!
[21:25] <cnd> stgraber, yeah, I understand that
[21:26] <geser> any other business?
[21:26] <stgraber> cnd: merging from Debian / fixing bugs / ... is probably a good way to gain more experience with what's in universe
[21:26] <geser> any volunteers as chair for next meeting?
[21:26] <cnd> stgraber, is there any way to quantify how much more I need?
[21:26] <cnd> any guidance at all
[21:26] <bdrung> cnd: we have no numbers for that.
[21:27] <cnd> bdrung, yeah, I don't need explicit numbers
[21:27] <cnd> but when will I know whether to come back to ask for perms?
[21:27] <bdrung> cnd: you may look at what the other who became MOTU did
[21:28] <stgraber> cnd: I think working on some merges (early 11.10 cycle) and getting some testimonials from other MOTUs would help a MOTU application a lot
[21:28] <cnd> ok
[21:28] <cnd> thanks everyone!
[21:28] <stgraber> thanks and enjoy your PPU upload rights !
[21:28] <kklimonda> geser: btw, pyramid is already in Debian - it's just waiting to get accepted by ftp-masters
[21:28] <bdrung> cnd: you could ask your sponsors if you are ready.
[21:29] <bdrung> kklimonda: i said that a while ago
[21:29] <cnd> bdrung, heh. most of them say I'm ready
[21:29] <cnd> that's the challenging part
[21:29] <kklimonda> bdrung: ah, sorry - I haven't noticed your response, just remembered that geser was talking about it.
[21:30] <geser> [ENDMEETING]
[21:30] <geser> #endmeeting
[21:30] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 15:30.
[21:31] <bdrung> ^ 15:30?
[21:31] <bdrung> that's not UTC
[21:32] <bdrung> cnd: when you do some universe work (e.g. merge), you could ask these sponsors.
[21:32] <cnd> bdrung, hmm?
[21:33] <cnd> I can get more sponsors, but the sponsors I have feel I'm ready
[21:33] <stgraber> bdrung: that's CST