=== jtv is now known as jtv-eat
=== jtv-eat is now known as jtv
[07:41] <dpm> good morning all
[08:04] <TLE> good morgning
[08:04] <TLE> og my, monday! __morning__
[08:10] <TLE> dpm: Just a reminder, we have a lang pack update starting this thursday, will you keep on top of the build and announce if succesful ?
[08:10] <dpm> hey TLE, yes, I mentioned it on the translators list last week
[08:10] <dpm> (and good morning :)
[08:10] <TLE> dpm: D'oh!
[08:11]  * TLE returns to caching up on old email
[08:11] <dpm> TLE, but nevermind, thanks for the heads up, though :-)
[08:11] <TLE> np
[08:12] <andrejz> hello dpm! i have a question/problem for you
[08:12] <dpm> hey andrejz :)
[08:12] <TLE> oh meant caTching up, though caching would be very handy too, suppose one could mentally cache the emails before going to boring meetings
[08:12] <dpm> :)
[08:13] <TLE> on the other hand, that is what internetphones are for
[08:14]  * TLE hugs his HTC Desire
[08:16] <andrejz> sorry for the delay , running 11.04 alpha (sometimes things become slightly ackward when doing upgrades) ;)
[08:17] <andrejz> the problem is once again with apt related programs
[08:17] <andrejz> encoding is incorrect for some strings.
[08:17] <andrejz> i went to check it out and launchpad suggests i translated them "In upstream" on 2011-02-23 although i haven't touched apt since december
[08:18] <dpm> andrejz, could you point me to the particular strings?
[08:19] <andrejz> sure - https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/apt/+pots/apt-all/sl/+translate
[08:21] <andrejz> You can see all these versions In upstream suggested by me on 2011-02-23
[08:21] <andrejz> i have no idea where they come from
[08:21] <andrejz> i have manually owerwritten them
[08:21] <andrejz> but the same thing has happened in the beginning of december in maverick
[08:22] <andrejz> (just before the proposed language pack update
[08:22] <andrejz> i am wondering if something can be done to prevent that in the future
[08:24] <dpm> ok, let me have a look in a few mins, brb
[10:18] <dpm> hi andrejz, the "In upstream" translation in https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/apt/+pots/apt-all/sl/+translate marks when an upstream translation was imported. So that means that there was a package upload around that date that contained upstream translations with the wrong encoding. I believe this is not a bug in LP, but rather that the package (be it through a translation mistake, be it to a packaging bug) contains these tr
[10:18] <dpm> anslations with the wrong encoding. The thing to do would be to find out the package which contains the wrong translations and take it from there. I'd recommend doing 'apt-get source apt' for the Lucid, Maverick and Natty packages, look at the translations there and find out which package contains the wrong ones
[10:22] <andrejz> dpm do you know in which folder does the source package get extracted
[10:24] <dpm> andrejz, if you do 'apt-get source <package>' the package is extracted in a subfolder generally named 'package-version' (i.e. a subfolder of the one you invoked 'apt-get source' from)
[10:27] <andrejz> found it thanks.. looking at the po file it seems it's exported from launchapd, all encodings are utf-8, but some strings are not encoded properly
[10:27] <andrejz> i found this interesting :
[10:27] <andrejz> "POT-Creation-Date: 2011-03-03 17:39+0100\n"
[10:28] <andrejz> "PO-Revision-Date: 2010-09-05 20:35+0100\n"
[10:28] <dpm> let me ask mvo how apt translations are handled
[10:28] <andrejz> does this mean trnaslations as were on 2010-09-05 are used ?
[10:32] <dpm> andrejz, it depends on how the file was translated. What I mean is, whether the PO-Revision-Date was updated or not. Launchpad updates it and some PO file editors do it as well. But if you edit a PO file with e.g. gedit, it will not update it for you, and you'll have to update it manually
[10:32] <andrejz> i translated the files on 2010-09-30 with poedit and uploaded it to launchpad and since then only done modifications in launchpad
[10:36] <andrejz> i have also done some modifications (in launchpad) on 2010-12-03, 2010-12-04 and 2010-12-05
[10:41] <dpm> then it seems that the upstream translations coming from the package are overriding the LP translations
[10:43] <dpm> andrejz, I've just asked mvo (the apt maintainer) about it on #ubuntu-devel: http://paste.ubuntu.com/576915/
[10:44] <andrejz> ok thanks
[10:44] <andrejz> so if i undestand correctly all packages come exclusively from upstream and tehrefore launchpad translations have no effect on the translations that will appear in 11.04 ?
[10:45] <andrejz> the thing is i talked with debian translator and he has commited translated packages (if you remember the problems originally came from debian) in december or so, so they should be ok
[10:48] <andrejz> is it possible i can export all translations from laucnhpad and send it to mvo and he commits it ? that should solve these problems once and for all
[10:48] <dpm> andrejz, you should still be able to override upstream translations through Launchpad, which comes handy for these kind of fixes, so I'm not sure why the upstream ones overwrote them. It might well have been because of the bug I mentioned a few weeks back on the translators list, which is fixed by now, but it might not have been when the translations were imported. In any case, I'd recommend re-checking that the translation fixes were a) indeed co
[10:48] <dpm> mmitted upstream and b) those translations included in the package
[10:50] <dpm> andrejz, yeah, that might be an option, I'd recommend talking to mvo directly on #ubuntu-devel. He's a nice guy, and I'm sure he'll help you if he can. Mention to him that you are in touch with the upstream translators as well
[10:54] <andrejz> ok i will ask
[10:54] <andrejz> thanks for all the help
[10:55] <gtriderxc> can it be my turn now to ask a question/:)
[10:56] <gtriderxc> the problme is:
[10:56] <gtriderxc> # Template “indicator-datetime”
[10:56] <gtriderxc> %l:%M %p
[10:56] <gtriderxc> http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/natty/man3/strftime.3.html
[10:57] <gtriderxc> I already got from U the link above
[10:57] <gtriderxc> but now the question is
[10:58] <gtriderxc> whether I should translate the single letters or will it brake down all the time script?
[10:58] <gtriderxc> should I translate engligh HH:MM into Polish GG:MM??
[10:58] <gtriderxc> or just leave it as is?
[10:59] <dpm> gtriderxc, you should only use the appropriate letters from  http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/natty/man3/strftime.3.html according to your language. For example:
[11:00] <dpm> if the original is %l:%M %p and in Polish you don't use the am/pm specifier (the %p part), you should transltate the string to:
[11:00] <dpm> %l:%M
[11:00] <dpm> (Leaving out %p)
[11:00] <andrejz> or maybe %H:%M
[11:01] <dpm> exactly
[11:01] <andrejz> that's what is usually use
[11:01] <dpm> so you shouldn't "translate" the single letters, just adapt them to your format, if you see what I mean
[11:01] <andrejz> since %H means 24 hour clock
[11:01] <dpm> you can test the translations with the 'date' command on the command line
[11:01] <andrejz> here you can read what they mean  -http://php.net/manual/en/function.strftime.php
[11:02] <dpm> for example, try running 'date +"%H:M%"' on a terminal (without the ' quotes)
[11:02] <andrejz> in the example returned values you can see what certain letter gets you
[11:02] <dpm> sorry, I meant
[11:02] <dpm> date +"%H:%M"
[12:50] <dpm> andrejz, mvo will upload the latest translations from Natty now, which contain the coding fix:
[12:50] <dpm> apt (0.8.10.1) unstable; urgency=low
[12:50] <dpm>    [ Christian Perrier ]
[12:50] <dpm>    * Fix encoding for Slovenian translation. PO file switched
[12:50] <dpm>      to UTF-8. Closes: #609957
[12:50] <andrejz> yes, just talking to him now
[12:51] <dpm> Just in case, could you export the translations from LP, to make sure no work is lost? (it shouldn't, but just in case)
[12:56] <andrejz> yes i will, because he will also commit it upstream
[12:59] <dpm> cool, thanks
[12:59] <andrejz> thanks to you