[00:00] <judgen> yofel: FFE
[00:00] <gordonjcp> judgen: bit of a beast
[00:00] <yofel> !ffe | judgen
[00:00] <gordonjcp> judgen: I must go and pick up my old Mega STE from my mate's studio
[00:00] <judgen> yofel: Could it possible to add it to the update list for ocelot then?
[00:01] <judgen> amiwm is tiny. Making the binary only takes a few seconds on a 2ghz machine.
[00:01] <yofel> judgen: we only sync amiwn from debian currently, so it should preferebly be updated there, it will be auto-synced for O then
[00:02] <judgen> yofel: aah so "when he gets time for it" is the way it is.
[00:03] <gordonjcp> right, thanks for all the help
[00:03] <gordonjcp> the grub thing is a bit of a nasty gotcha
[00:03] <judgen> the debian people probably have more important things to do than cater to a few amiga expatriates.
[00:04] <gordonjcp> I haven't got FreeBSD and Haiku working again yet, but at least I've got Arch back
[00:04] <judgen> gordonjcp: How can haiku not work? what did you do?!
[00:04] <judgen> =D
[00:04] <gordonjcp> judgen: I just haven't put the entries back into grub yet
[00:04] <judgen> gordonjcp: aaah...
[00:05] <judgen> gordonjcp: coded anything with BeIDE(or equivalent) in beos or haiku?
[00:05] <coz_> ooo I havent worked with BeOs for some time
[00:06] <judgen> coz_: BeOS in it self is dead but the legacy lives on in Haiku
[00:06] <gordonjcp> judgen: not yet, I plan on porting my SDR app across
[00:06] <judgen> gordonjcp: what kind of app?
[00:06] <coz_> judgen,  I know I have had it installed but I still have BeOs 5.1 here in its orginal box :)
[00:07] <gordonjcp> judgen: software-defined radio
[00:07] <judgen> coz_: no you do not. 5.1 was never released except as on a single CD to beta testers.
[00:07] <gordonjcp> judgen: it actually does work in Ubuntu, but because it requires jack it does Bad Things to the Ubuntu sound system
[00:07] <coz_> judgen,  it comes with the update
[00:07] <judgen> coz_: 5.01 sounds probable
[00:07] <coz_> judgen,  rather  yes sorry  5.01
[00:08] <coz_> well actuall y let me op0en the box
[00:08] <coz_> judgen,  it is 5.0.3
[00:08] <gordonjcp> judgen: https://github.com/gordonjcp/lysdr
[00:08] <judgen> coz_: Gobe CD?
[00:09] <coz_> judgen,  yes
[00:09] <judgen> coz_:  =D
[00:09] <coz_> :)
[00:09] <judgen> coz_: then you got CL-Amp for free
[00:09] <judgen> awsome app
[00:09] <coz_> judgen,  also bought all of the books  including BeOS bible lol
[00:10] <judgen> coz_: Scot Hacker is a good writer.
[00:10] <judgen> too bad that he mostly does macos X books now
[00:10] <coz_> :(
[00:11] <coz_> ah BeOs memories :)
[00:11] <judgen> He is a aquaintance of mine, i will ask him if he could not do a Haiku bible once it is R1 released.
[00:11] <judgen> i think he will.. that BeOS bible sold more than a million copies.
[00:11] <coz_> judgen,  ooo cool
[00:11] <gordonjcp> judgen: heh
[00:12] <coz_> judgen,  I have said this many times... I am only on ubuntu because of sun java :)  and my nephew who worked with alleheny ludlum steel who ran BeOs with a minimal java installation woujld not give me the cd :)
[00:12] <judgen> Anyone that has not had the priviligie of reading thtat book. IT IS HUGE! and it is also awsome.
[00:13]  * gordonjcp turns to look at the bookshelf - ah, there it is beside the Citroën CX workshop manual and some Python books, The BeOS Bible
[00:13] <coz_> :)
[00:13] <judgen> coz_: Bryan Varner has a total working java+swing working on BeOS.
[00:13] <judgen> but he can not release it
[00:13] <coz_> judgen,  damn him lol
[00:13] <gordonjcp> licensing issues?
[00:14] <judgen> yes
[00:14] <gordonjcp> ugh
[00:15] <judgen> if everyone could settle on the basics. 1 MIT/BSD/LTH license, 2.GPL and others like them and finally NOTHING!
[00:16] <judgen> I mean i can just keep my code, but it should be illegal to sell people food without an declaration of content.
[00:16] <gordonjcp> judgen: maybe he can port Dalvik instead
[00:16] <judgen> same with code
[00:16] <judgen> gordonjcp: I think java will die for certain now that oracle owns it.
[00:17] <gordonjcp> judgen: I only have a P4 3GHz, so it's not like I'll miss it much
[00:17] <judgen> it will be not for "c.o.r.e" but create once run on oracle producs.
[00:17] <gordonjcp> create once, run like a two-legged dog on anything less than an eight-core nuclear-powered ubermachine
[00:18] <judgen> java has a few strengths that is har too look by, but the flaws is surely insurmountable when looking at modular and portable c code.
[00:18] <gordonjcp> judgen: I seriously wonder what will happen if Oracle get nasty over Android's java-like Dalvik
[00:19] <judgen> gordonjcp: They will kill java for googles own language
[00:19] <gordonjcp> it's supposed to be a clean-room implementation of JVM opcodes in a not-very-Java-like framework
[00:19] <judgen> and thus not be the bad guy
[00:19] <judgen> and all will conform
[00:19] <gordonjcp> I can easily see how Google will then go "O RLY?" and bring out a drop-in replacement that looks like Python
[00:20] <judgen> oracle had the possibility to rule the office world with openoffice but went "nah i do not care" and now libreoffice is the highest downloaded product on cnet even for windows.
[00:21] <judgen> the linguistics of the libreoffice supporters helped alot though... even lied and said that the ooo.o would not be updated as much
[00:21] <coz_> what is ibm's office suite named ... sorry for temporary change of topic
[00:21] <judgen> coz_: Lotus
[00:21] <judgen> coz_: they bought the company at max value and ruined it.
[00:21] <judgen> IBM is good at that.
[00:22] <coz_> judgen,  oh?  darn I was hoping to try it out
[00:22] <Patrickdk> ya, ms is totally pushing against openoffice with the whole, 30day trial pre-installed on all win7 systems
[00:22] <Patrickdk> most all my coworkers are confused and think the system comes with office
[00:22] <judgen> coz_: it is still available, but i would say it is just as outdated as os/2
[00:22] <coz_> judgen,  ah ok  , darn
[00:23] <judgen> Patrickdk: they are in for a treat when they have used it for 30 days and can not open their files.
[00:23] <Patrickdk> yep
[00:23] <coz_> blackmail of sorts
[00:23] <Patrickdk> they don't believe me till I pop the about screen up
[00:24] <judgen> and no other office suite supports the lousy crap xml format that microsoft tried to make the standard
[00:24] <judgen> ODF for the win there.
[00:24] <coz_> judgen,  mm  I though abiword did  ,,, I am probably wrong
[00:24] <coz_> thought
[00:24] <itaylor57> came in late what is the topic?
[00:24] <judgen> coz_: it supports office 2007 WORD documents.
[00:24] <judgen> nothing more
[00:25] <coz_> judgen,   ah ok  I havent used that in a while either
[00:25] <Random832> how broken is +1 today?
[00:25] <judgen> the only suite i use nowdays is koffice. I know it is not as sophisticated as many other apps,, but until now i did fine with just sc and nano
[00:26] <judgen> Random832: Not at all at the time of my install.
[00:26] <judgen> i still hate the indicator crap though..
[00:26] <Random832> indicator crap?
[00:26] <itaylor57> how is libre?
[00:27] <judgen> Random832: indicator service... horrible idea. Also i dislike pulseaudio, but for purely different reasons.
[00:27] <coz_> itaylor57,  in all honesty ,, since I never really used openoffice much  they look the same and function the same as far as I can tell
[00:27] <Daekdroom> Currently, I'm hating appmenu the most.
[00:27]  * Random832 has no idea anything about the New Ubuntu UI
[00:27] <judgen> itaylor57: atm, it is pretty much a close fork to ooo.o but with a few changes.
[00:27] <Daekdroom> Because it's losing the application's menu when I minimize the app =/
[00:28] <Daekdroom> judgen, well, it has more than a few changes
[00:28] <Daekdroom> Ubuntu never shipped the original OpenOffice.
[00:28] <itaylor57> judgen: will I have installed it, but haven't used it much yet
[00:28] <coz_> Daekdroom,  you mean the global menu hicky?
[00:28] <Daekdroom> coz_, yeah
[00:28] <charlie-tca> Random832: it is only a little bit broken today
[00:28] <judgen> Daekdroom: The problem with gnome apps will be solved.. no more minimize button =D
[00:28] <Random832> hey, should i install 32 bit or 64?
[00:28] <coz_> Daekdroom,  yeah I understand the frustration with it
[00:28] <judgen> Random832: how much memory do you have?
[00:28] <charlie-tca> small things like the desktop not coming up when you login, etc
[00:29] <Daekdroom> judgen, lack of minimize button is not planed for unity. Only Gnome Shell. >.>
[00:29] <Random832> 2GB
[00:29] <psusi> Random832, if you have a 64bit processor, then you should install 64bit
[00:29] <Random832> is there any benefit to _not_ installing 64-bit?
[00:29] <judgen> Random832: then go with 32 bit as you will have better speeds an less overhead.
[00:29] <Daekdroom> Random832, less RAM usage, Wine doesn't give you headaches?
[00:29] <Random832> if i want to run windows apps i'll run in virtualbox
[00:29] <psusi> Random832, mostly if you want to install third party proprietary software that only comes as 32bit
[00:30] <Random832> psusi: can't you get 32-bit libraries?
[00:30] <psusi> judgen, 64bit is generally faster
[00:30] <charlie-tca> Random832: with 4 gb or less ram, there is little gain installing 64bit
[00:30] <judgen> psusi: no because you have memory access blocks that are bigger. so you are wrong.
[00:30] <psusi> Random832, you CAN, but it's a royal pain in the arse
[00:30] <Random832> is it possible to upgrade from 32-bit to 64-bit?
[00:30] <Random832> or, from 64-bit to 32-bit?
[00:30] <judgen> psusi: on large memory systems 4+gb you are very correct
[00:30] <Daekdroom> No.
[00:31] <coz_> Random832, that sounds like a reinstallation thingy there :)
[00:31] <psusi> judgen, not really, no, you don't... and it is faster because it has a heck of a lot more general purpose registers and thus, has to rely IO to the stack less
[00:31] <charlie-tca> actually, it is not much faster, since it still uses so many 32bit libraries
[00:31] <Daekdroom> psusi, that makes a difference in, let me see, video decoding, (de)compressing files and such?
[00:31] <judgen> charlie-tca: gp
[00:31] <psusi> charlie-tca, what does?
[00:31] <Daekdroom> if you don't want any of those..
[00:32] <charlie-tca> 64bit linux
[00:32] <psusi> Daekdroom, yea, those are generally the areas where you will notice it the most
[00:32] <Daekdroom> I don't think it pays off, honestly.
[00:32] <charlie-tca> There still are not a ton of 64bit libraries to support it, thus the performance gains are not there without big ram
[00:32] <Daekdroom> I have 4G and I'm using x86.
[00:32] <psusi> charlie-tca, no... only 32 bit apps use 32 bit libs and those generally only are seen for the aforementioned 32 bit only proprietary third party software
[00:32] <charlie-tca> no
[00:33] <coz_> example?
[00:33] <Daekdroom> and it takes so much RAM.
[00:33] <charlie-tca> that is not true, since the libraries are copied from 32bit directory to the 64bit directory
[00:33] <psusi> charlie-tca, every single library on a default 64 bit Ubuntu install is 64 bit
[00:33] <Daekdroom> If he's talking about 2G running VirtualBox VMs? Forget about 64bits.
[00:33] <itaylor57> will I am a programmer so I like being able to create 32/64 bit code
[00:33] <gordonjcp> meh
[00:33] <gordonjcp> you kids with your 32-bit processors
[00:33] <judgen> psusi: The problem with 64bit adressing unless it is done correctly (all amd, and intel core2 or later) does not have this problem but all that is still using core1 and older systems will actually bebefit from both binary size (thus reducin cache activity) and much more.
[00:33] <gordonjcp> 22-bit ftw
[00:34] <Random832> ok
[00:34] <judgen> gordonjcp: Extended windows 3.11?
[00:34] <gordonjcp> PDP11/73
[00:34] <Random832> can i share a firefox profile between linux and windows if i symlink it
[00:34] <coz_> a milkshake with 32 straws or a milshake with 64 straws
[00:34] <psusi> judgen, the more ample register supply tends to more than make up for the slightly larger code size
[00:35] <judgen> Random832: no, but depends on who symlinks it anf if it is a folder, yes.
[00:35] <Random832> wait, huh?
[00:35] <judgen> Random832: It this on an an ntfsvolume?
[00:35] <gordonjcp> x86 is bloat
[00:36] <gordonjcp> want a prediction for the second decade of the 21st century?
[00:36] <gordonjcp> we're going to see transputers coming back
[00:36] <Daekdroom> transputers?
[00:36] <Daekdroom> That sounds obscene.
[00:36] <judgen> gordonjcp: Return of atari? =D
[00:36] <gordonjcp> yup, transputers
[00:36] <gordonjcp> judgen: maiko \o/
[00:36] <Daekdroom> I have no idea of what a transputer is, tho
[00:36] <gordonjcp> meiko, even
[00:37] <gordonjcp> Daekdroom: lots and lots of small, simple CPUs with very fast networking between them
[00:37] <Random832> judgen: i would be symlinking _from_ my linux homedir _to_ the existing firefox profile on windows
[00:37] <judgen> gordonjcp: i would liken it more to small clusters of computers
[00:37] <judgen> but that would be incorrect
[00:37] <gordonjcp> judgen: kind of, kind of not
[00:38] <judgen> Random832: windows can not read yourfiles from an ext4 partition... you have to do it the other way around
[00:38] <Random832> if i wanted to symlink from windows i would make the symlink in windows, since windows symlinks carry an attribute over whether they link to a file or a directory
[00:38] <Random832> and it'd need to live on an ntfs or fat32 volume
[00:38] <gordonjcp> they were like microcontrollers, in that they typically had a small amount of RAM, a small amount of code storage either RAM or ROM, a certain amount of GPIO and some on-chip networking
[00:38] <gordonjcp> each transputer needed basically a clock source to run, and that's it
[00:39] <judgen> Random832: why
[00:39] <cg2916> hey, i need help with a wubi installation error
[00:40] <judgen> Random832: just make your profile writable and symlink let say your firefox settings folder to the windows partition...
[00:40] <gordonjcp> Daekdroom: have you seen the simple little ARM microcontrollers that you get really cheaply these days?
[00:40] <judgen> it is even possible to do it by copying the windows ff folder staright  over into .mozilla
[00:40] <Random832> well if i copied it then i couldn't use it from windows anymore
[00:40] <Random832> or it'd get out of sync
[00:41] <cg2916> I have a 03-08 19:24 ERROR  root: [Errno 13] Permission denied Traceback error
[00:41] <judgen> Random832: simple then. make sure your ntfs partition is r+w then symlink the entire settings dir of firefox to that dir that includes the settings for windwos. simple as that.
[00:42] <judgen> you can just as well have been using the same browser all the time
[00:42] <Random832> ok i guess then i don't get why you said "no"
[00:42] <Random832> 19:32 <judgen> Random832: no, but depends on who symlinks it anf if it is a folder, yes.
[00:42] <judgen> if it is a folder it works mostly
[00:43] <Random832> so does +1 support proper permissions and owners on ntfs yet?
[00:43] <judgen> files as symlinks might be difficult in windows 7 as they contain FS-metadata.
[00:43] <Random832> i _know_ ntfs-3g _has_ support for it in latest versions
[00:47] <judgen> i am sorry if i have misled you
[00:48] <judgen> I did not mean to
[00:52] <cg2916> I have a 03-08 19:24 ERROR  root: [Errno 13] Permission denied error in WUBI
[00:58] <h00k> boo, nautilus is failing for me.
[00:58] <h00k> and by failing, I mean it won't open;) Attempting to jump start it opening with terminal....oh...a dbus issue
[00:59] <h00k> http://pastie.org/1649607 Is this...anyone come across this yet?
[01:00] <h00k> dbus is apparently running
[01:01] <coz_> h00k,  does  gksudo nautilus work?
[01:02] <h00k> I never remember if I should gksudo or gksu
[01:02] <coz_> gksudo
[01:02] <h00k> coz_: yes, it does launch now
[01:03] <coz_> h00k,  ok that was expected ,, and in terminal      nautilus     does it spit anything out?
[01:03] <h00k> coz_: see the pastie above ^
[01:04] <h00k> coz_: http://pastie.org/1649607
[01:04] <cozziemoto> h00k,  yeah  mm  not sure then
[01:05] <cozziemoto> sorry my other machine is giving me issues in xchat :( have to log  off
[01:05] <coz_> what  dummy,, my one key was stuck,,, time to clean the keyboard
[01:06] <coz_> h00k,  I am not sure ,,, I am sure one of the guys here could handle that one
[01:06] <coz_> I have to break here as coz_    be back a bit later
[01:08] <h00k> ubottu: bug 731708
[02:09] <aroman> hello, is anyone here using compiz 0.9 with the desktop switcher plugin, and noticing that the dock/panels aren't being excluded?
[02:11] <Daekdroom> aroman, desktop switcher? Is that the default?
[02:12] <aroman> Daekdroom: don't think so
[02:12] <aroman> not actually using Unity, but Natty used compiz 0.9, so I figured i'd ask
[02:41] <shaneo> hey ubuntu one is killing my speed how can i get it to stop constantly syncing i cant even open a folder it takes like 5 min
[02:42] <robin0800> shaneo, killall ubuntuone-syncdaemon
[02:43] <shaneo> still there and running the crap out of my processors
[02:44] <shaneo> omg it wont stop
[02:44] <shaneo> pc is getting so hot
[02:44] <robin0800> shaneo, I had to uninstall all of it
[02:45] <shaneo> damn
[02:45] <shaneo> did u reinstall ??
[02:45] <robin0800> shaneo, no
[02:46] <shaneo> darn too bad its a speed killer for me i find it very useful guess ill have to do it manually on the site
[02:47] <IdleOne> shaneo: try removing it from the startup apps
[02:47] <robin0800> shaneo, I think what happens is that if its syncing and you log off or shutdown it corrupts something so even reinstalling does not work
[02:52] <shaneo> yeah thats what happened before this battery died and had a hella time booting up and then bam pc killagr
[02:52] <shaneo> *killage
[02:55] <shaneo> im getting this annoying samba 4 message too can anyone help me with that
[04:12] <Random832> alps touchpad no work
[04:12] <Random832> is this a known issue? is it +1-specific?
[04:45] <MasterU> Hi all
[04:46] <MasterU> Can anyone tell me how to reorder icons in unity?
[04:56] <DanaG> sAY, is the current nm-applet known to be totally broken?
[04:59] <DanaG> Or rather, it sometimes seems broken.
[05:00] <DanaG> Long: http://pastebin.com/f8YxzNG6
[05:05] <edgy> Hi, I install falshplugin-installer but still no flash, tested firefox and chromium in youtube, any hint?
[05:08] <MasterU> Hi all
[05:09] <MasterU> Has anyone been able to reorder there icons in unity?
[05:09] <MasterU> all the blogs say you can do it by drag and drop
[05:10] <MasterU> but it oly slides the whole list up and down
[05:10] <MasterU> Has anyone been able to reorder there icons in unity?
[05:45] <victory747> Hi, I'm having troubles with unity-2d, especially as there is no shutdown button and other notifiers on the top bar. Should I be running this out of the repos, or out of the ppa?
[05:56] <mrdebuntu> is nn ready to install?
[06:14] <judgen> aaah this theme restored singleclik in konqueror
[06:14] <judgen> pain!
[06:56] <judgen> how do i get vitualbox tp recognize a folger=
[06:56] <judgen> the man page is not good in this coneritn
[06:57] <judgen> "windows shares" or cif.
[07:46] <mrsun> ough updating to latest was the stupidest thing i could do i think :P
[07:49] <coz_> good day all
[08:09] <twager> !nvidia
[09:21] <Severian> judgen, I may not quite get your questions.  The first one is something about VirtualBox toliet paper and coffee.  The second question is about cifs shares and I use those all the time in VirtualBox VMs.  What is your problem there?
[09:22] <Severian> toliet -> toilet
[09:38] <JohnFlux> Hey all
[09:38] <JohnFlux> shouldn't this be ubuntu +0.5   since version numbers go up by 0.5 each time
[09:38] <JohnFlux> anyway, is Narwhal safe-ish to upgrade to right now?
[09:39] <Severian> no and no
[09:40] <Severian> Narwhal is for testing and experimentation.  If you use it on an important computer, you are asking for trouble.
[09:41] <Severian> And, the version actually goes up by 6 each release.  6 months, that is.  If you want to call it +.5, that is your business.
[10:27] <will_> hey guys. i was using natty fine with my newish evergreen card and the radeon drivers. compiz, unity, the works. now i've reinstalled natty alpha 3 again (and updated everything) onto a new harddrive and i simply can't get anything other than software rendering. running compiz --replace from the command line tells me "Fatal: GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap is missing. Fatal: software rendering detected. then it dumps me back into 
[10:27] <will_> any ideas? why wouldn't it work now?
[10:28] <coz_> will_,  the video drivers may be broken
[10:28] <coz_> will_,  not absolutely sure about that though
[10:28] <will_> coz_: it would've have to have happened in the last few days. shame! maybe if i install the xorg-edgers and update'll be available
[10:28] <will_> *an
[10:29] <coz_> will_,   well I would stick around here and ask one of the regular guys here about that
[10:30] <will_> coz_: cool, i'll do that. thanks :)
[10:30] <coz_> will_,  no problem... you already know that in this state,, the prerelease is most likely going to have issues especially video driver issues
[10:30] <will_> here we go: latest news from the radeon drivers
[10:30] <will_> evergreen accel disabled explicitly,
[10:30] <coz_> ah
[10:31] <will_> I wonder why? it was working pretty well
[10:31] <coz_> will_,  not sure ,, did you check in #radeon  channel?
[10:31] <will_> no, i'll do that
[10:31] <coz_> cool
[10:33] <will_> oh whoops, i was looking at the news from 2010 :P
[10:38] <veloc1ty> will_, i think your problem is related to this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fglrx-installer/+bug/709505
[10:38] <veloc1ty> the fglrx (ati radeon driver) doesn't work at all at the moment
[10:42] <will_> veloc1ty: i'm using the radeon open source drivers :) got my ATI cards specifically for it (that and the fact that they're passive!)
[10:46] <veloc1ty> ah okay ;)
[10:46] <will_> veloc1ty: thanks for the link though, i'm scouring the bug lists now
[12:29] <gaelfx> I can't install nvidia drivers on a liveusb, is that by design or what?
[12:30] <Ian_Corne> is this related with ubuntu 11.04?
[12:30] <gaelfx> yes indeedy
[12:31] <Ian_Corne> well I don't know any design choices for that
[12:31] <gaelfx> and it is a persistent usb, btw
[12:31] <Ian_Corne> but you should give more information about the error you're getting
[12:37] <gaelfx> well, when I tried to install via Synaptic, it tried, but gave an exit status: 1, but now I can't boot the liveusb again, so I can't get more information than that
[12:37] <gaelfx> I guess it's just something I'll have to forget about until later
[12:50] <jml> if the unity WM crashes (no more window borders etc), what's the quickest way to recover?
[12:52] <htorque> jml: alt+f1, log in, run: (unity --replace &)
[12:52] <jml> htorque: thanks.
[13:02] <BluesKaj> Hiyas
[14:32] <coz_> hey all
[15:11] <h00k> SO, I'm not terribly familiar with indicators and how they're supposed to work with Unity's panel
[15:12] <h00k> for instance, I just installed indicator-weather, and found it in the unity menu (ubuntu logo -> search -> click)
[15:12] <h00k> I'm not sure if it crashed, or indicators aren't working right now
[15:12] <h00k> but I don't see it :)
[15:34] <royale1223__> hi
[15:34] <royale1223__> is unity as good as gnome?
[15:36] <danyR> royale1223__: unity is gnome :) think of it as an addition to the standard GNOME environment
[15:37] <royale1223__> danyR, thanks
[15:37] <royale1223__> danyR, so you think its better right?
[15:39] <danyR> royale1223__: you can use standard gnome. you can use gnome + the unity experience. i can't say which one is better, because they aren't comparable. GNOME is a full-fledged desktop environment, Unity is a shell, an overlay on top of GNOME
[15:39] <Daekdroom> royale1223__, it's a matter of taste
[15:40] <royale1223__> danyR, how come natty is not using gnome 3?
[15:40] <Daekdroom> The transition to GNOME 3 should be carefully done
[15:40] <Daekdroom> Too much to do in too little time.
[15:41] <danyR> royale1223__: natty is using gnome 2.32. you'll be able to install gnome 3 through a PPA, though. which will guaranteee a nice experience gnome3 experience on natty +1
[15:42] <royale1223__> danyR, so will future releases use gnome 3?
[15:42] <royale1223__> Daekdroom, thaks
[15:42] <royale1223__> Daekdroom, thanks
[15:43] <Daekdroom> royale1223__, yes, they will use GNOME 3
[15:43] <danyR> royale1223__: 11.10 will use GNOME 3 (3.2, I believe). it won't using GNOME-Shell, but it'll use all other components: Gnome-control-center, gtk3, etc...
[15:44] <royale1223__> thanks Daekdroom, danyR.
[15:44] <danyR> royale1223__: you welcome :)
[15:44] <royale1223__> is there any distro that ships with gnome 3?
[15:45] <danyR> royale1223__: fedora 15 will ship with vanilla gnome3: gnome-shell included.
[15:45] <danyR> and there are already some gnome3 live images for testing.
[15:46] <danyR> over at gnome3.org
[15:47] <royale1223__> when will fedora 15 be released?
[15:47] <Daekdroom> I believe April
[15:47] <danyR> royale1223__: 17 may, according to http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/15
[15:51] <royale1223__> danyR, thanks
[15:52] <royale1223__> that will be before 11.10 right?
[15:52] <royale1223__> i'm thinking of switching to fedora. what do you think?
[15:54] <Daekdroom> 11.10 is due October.
[15:54] <danyR> royale1223__: yes, 11.10 is scheduled for October. Fedora is nice, but it hasn't such a large, popular community as Ubuntu and sometimes can be trouble for new users.
[15:54] <danyR> troubly*
[15:55] <danyR> if you already have some linux knowledge, then I would recommend :)
[15:56] <royale1223__> danyR, i'm quite new. Been using ubuntu for only 6 months tops.
[15:56] <royale1223__> what do you think?
[15:57] <danyR> royale1223__: it all comes down to personal choice. my advice is for you to get a live cd, try it, maybe install it on a spare partition, and then make your decision. I've never used fedora for more than a few hours too, so maybe I'm not the one you should be asking :)
[15:57] <royale1223__> is getting softwares easy in fedora as in ubuntu?
[15:58] <royale1223__> danyR, thanks for your help mate
[16:17]  * nanomad is upgrading to 11.04 for 10.10. Let's see how bad it gets
[17:25] <dogukan> hi
[17:25] <dogukan> i can't see system tray icons on 11.04 unity
[17:26] <dogukan> is there a way to see them?
[17:28] <Daekdroom> dogukan, Unity?
[17:28] <dogukan> yep
[17:28] <Daekdroom> In unity, the only systray icons that you're going to be able to see are Skype's, Wine apps and Java apps.
[17:29] <Daekdroom> Everything else is blacklisted
[17:29] <dogukan> how can i see all of them?
[17:29] <Daekdroom> Use Classic Gnome instead.
[17:31] <dogukan> hmm, i think i can't see them for now on unity
[17:31] <Daekdroom> I don't think you'll ever be able to see them in unity.
[17:31] <Daekdroom> Unless they change their minds
[17:40] <robin0800> Daekdroom, its funny but with unity 2d update today I can see them now
[17:41] <Daekdroom> robin0800, odd. I recall it was readded to Unity a few days ago (for wine, java and skype only)
[17:42] <robin0800> Daekdroom, Ive got cortina and Xchat up
[17:42] <Daekdroom> but unity-2d and unity have a lot of individual code.
[17:43] <robin0800> Daekdroom, well I was surprised but this is very good at the moment
[18:10] <coz_> hey all
[18:11] <eBittin> hi
[18:11] <eBittin> somone near Stockholm wants a powermac 4400/200?
[18:36] <coz_> eBittin,   I have a couple of old power macs and an SE/30 :)
[18:38] <evilvish> eBittin: thats not really a topic for this channel.. ;)
[19:23] <marlow59> What is this channel exactly for?
[19:23] <Daekdroom> Technicall support and discussion regarding Ubuntu Natty?
[19:23] <robin0800> marlow59, ubuntu 11.04
[19:24] <marlow59> Natty? name of 11.04 like Lucid Lynx or Hardy ?
[19:24] <Daekdroom> Yeah
[19:24] <marlow59> ah thanks
[19:25] <robin0800> marlow59, but only open until release
[19:25] <marlow59> I just was wondering, why GNOME 3 was abandoned? If someone could give me a briefing... ;)
[19:27] <marlow59>  I just was wondering, why GNOME 3 was abandoned? If someone could give me a briefing... ;)
[19:29] <marlow59> Any Answers ?
[19:29] <robin0800> marlow59, abandoned by whom?
[19:31] <marlow59> Ubuntu
[19:35] <genii-around> !info gnome3-session
[19:35] <genii-around> Hm
[19:36] <robin0800> marlow59, wont be ready in time will be in 11.10 gnome shell wont be
[19:54] <aLeSD> hi all
[19:55] <aLeSD> maybe this is not the right place .. but why are u not using AWN instead of Gnome-panel etc etc ...
[19:55] <aLeSD> ?
[19:56] <Amaranth> aLeSD: You mean as default?
[19:56] <aLeSD> I have been using it for 1 year and I really enjoy my screen totally empty of panels and stuffs
[19:56] <Amaranth> natty uses unity
[19:56] <aLeSD> Amaranth: yes by default ?
[19:57] <Amaranth> aLeSD: Yes, natty has unity by default
[19:57] <aLeSD> why unity ?
[19:57] <Amaranth> Why awn?
[19:57] <aLeSD> with AWN I havo nothing on the screen
[19:58] <aLeSD> it take me back to the fluxbox ages
[19:58] <Amaranth> unity has a bar at the top that merges with your titlebar
[20:01] <aLeSD> Amaranth: http://imagebin.org/142025
[20:03] <Amaranth> aLeSD: If you have a window maximized unity uses zero screen real estate (except for a part that isn't used anyway)
[20:03] <aLeSD> and this when I go down
[20:03] <aLeSD> http://imagebin.org/142026
[20:03] <Amaranth> aLeSD: So if that is your requirement it's sorted
[20:03] <aLeSD> lol
[20:03] <aLeSD> ok
[20:03] <Amaranth> imagebin is horrible, it loads half the image then goes to a broken image icon
[20:04] <Amaranth> aLeSD: Otherwise use what you want but AWN will never be the default
[20:04] <aLeSD> oh yes .. Iu have to refresha couple of times
[20:04] <aLeSD> it was the first entry googling
[20:05] <aLeSD> Amaranth, I am not telling about AWN .. the concept is to have an empty screen
[20:06] <Amaranth> If you are the kind of user that maximizes windows (everyone I know except me who isn't a programmer) unity doesn't use any space
[20:06] <Amaranth> It has a dock on the left that autohides and the titlebar and top panel merge together on maximized windows
[20:06] <aLeSD> :)
[20:06] <aLeSD> ok
[20:07] <Amaranth> The idea is useful minimalism, not just removing all UI :P
[20:07] <aLeSD> I will try it in the next version
[20:07] <Amaranth> With your setup you can't see the time, network status, etc
[20:07] <aLeSD> well I need UI only when I want to do something
[20:08] <aLeSD> or some notification arrives
[20:08] <aLeSD> so .. no reason to stay there if I am not searching for it
[20:08] <Amaranth> It's nice to see it at a glance
[20:08] <Amaranth> And know where it is without randomly searching
[20:09] <aLeSD> ok
[20:09] <aLeSD> I have to go
[20:09] <levu> Hi, notify-osd doesn't show any bubble, how can i enable it?
[20:10] <aLeSD> bye
[20:10] <levu> well, i saw that volume change bubbles are shown but no other bubble, neither from pidgin nor bubbles i send with notify-send
[20:17] <mrsun> gah can  downgrade ubuntu again ?: P
[20:25] <DJHuraken> hi everybody, i have a question, the ati drivers works in Natty ?
[20:30] <marnux> for me the open source drivers work => hd 4870
[20:31] <marnux> dual screen
[20:31] <marnux> no experience with proprietary
[20:38] <DJHuraken> marnux: ok ok i going to try the proprietary driver and i see what happend xD
[20:41] <marnux> good luck
[21:06] <zacwhite15> hey guys need some advice :)
[21:06] <zacwhite15> i am trying to find a way to customize the top bar in unity
[21:06] <zacwhite15> got any suggestions?
[21:08] <levu> zacwhite15: it's not made for customizing
[21:09] <zacwhite15> i know... but it doesn't hurt too try :P
[21:10] <levu> zacwhite15: there's some gconf key, try googling for that :)
[21:10] <zacwhite15> kk :)
[21:27] <zacwhite15> hey anyone know whats going to be in the next round of updates for natty
[22:33] <Ian_Corne> hmm I've installed bootchart but it doesn't actually do anything..
[22:35] <Ian_Corne> could that be because I have /var/log/ on a tmpfs?
[22:40] <Patrickdk> yep :)
[22:41] <Ian_Corne> ok
[22:43] <genii-around> Bah. After last round of updates today X isn't playing nice with nvidia again.
[23:26] <KenBW2> I'm struggling to install Natty using a memory stick. I've tried Maverick's default USB creator, as well as Unetbootin (including latest from PPA). I always get "No init found" while booting from the memory stick. Any ideas?