[00:50] <coz_> doctormo,  sorry guy did you ask me to revive that desktop background?
[00:51] <coz_> I know i just realized you had asked that and my attention was taken away from irc with family stuff
[00:51] <coz_> oh review that background
[00:51] <coz_> mmm
[07:49] <coz_> good day all
[09:02] <coz_> doctormo,  are you available?
[14:32] <coz_> hey all
[18:10] <coz_> hey all
[18:10] <coz_> doctormo, `  did you want me to see something?
[18:10] <doctormo> coz_: yes I did
[18:10] <doctormo> http://divajutta.com/doctormo/art/edu/perspective.png
[18:11] <coz_> doctormo,  oh! you added a lady bug :)
[18:11] <doctormo> ladybird, lady-bird! ;-)
[18:12] <coz_> doctormo,  one problem I see,,, to the right of the tree,, even though I know its meant to be a snow capped peak...it appears at first glance to be a piece of paper  to the right of the tree
[18:12] <coz_> doctormo, is th is an svg image originally?
[18:12] <doctormo> coz_: It is
[18:12] <coz_> doctormo,  a peice of paper?
[18:13] <doctormo> no, it is an svg
[18:13] <coz_> oh :)
[18:13] <coz_> doctormo,  my opinion is to fill that w hie area to the right of the tree with the lightest or darkest green of the hills
[18:13] <coz_> white area rather
[18:14] <coz_> doctormo,  other than that the composition is pretty solid..
[18:16] <coz_> doctormo,  are you doing this in inkscape?
[18:16] <doctormo> yes
[18:17] <coz_> doctormo,  that must be painful to save ... it is slow in rendering with all of the gradients?
[18:17] <doctormo> not that many gradients, but blue in the back is a killer
[18:17] <coz_> :)
[18:18] <doctormo> Put each part in a layer and switch off while I work on it
[18:18] <doctormo> total is only 100KB svg so far
[18:18] <vish> doctormo: (since opinions are free ;p ).. you might wanna also add a hint of shadow for the tentacles..
[18:18] <doctormo> no wait 1.2MB
[18:18] <vish> doctormo: also, technically the moon cannot be visible when the sun in right next to it, its not a light source it reflects light, and the sickle-shape moon is not possible at the angle the shadow is what forms the sickle.. :)
[18:18] <coz_> doctormo,  wow  yeah dont for get to vacuum defs
[18:19] <doctormo> vish: I know it's not physically possible.
[18:19] <vish> doctormo: if you want to show the moon, you could consider the shape as not a sickle, to the other half..
[18:19] <coz_> well the composition  is pretty solid regardless of its non -naturalistic look
[18:19] <vish> yup..
[18:19] <doctormo> vish: Can you provide an example shape?
[18:19]  * vish looks..
[18:21] <coz_> well the sun is shining on the correct side of the moon
[18:21] <coz_> I dont see much of a visual discrepancy here
[18:22] <vish> doctormo: http://visual.merriam-webster.com/images/astronomy/celestial-bodies/moon/phases-moon.jpg something like the second and fourth in the bottom row..
[18:22] <darkmatter> doctormo: interesting composition, but it's lacking a powerpuff girl ;D *ducks*
[18:22] <coz_> :)
[18:22] <coz_> naked bodies
[18:22] <darkmatter> nekkid
[18:22] <coz_> swing
[18:22] <coz_> shwing
[18:23] <coz_> doctormo,  do you have something in mind for this image   Edubuntu maybe?
[18:24] <coz_> oh I see ... vish wants more realizm in an otherwise unrealistic piece :)
[18:24] <coz_> vish,  you are definitly evil dude :)
[18:25] <vish> coz_: nah, just an opinion, i dont expect doctormo to listen to me :)
[18:25] <coz_> :)
[18:25] <vish> lets just leave it as an observation, rather than a critique.. ;)
[18:26] <coz_> vish,  ok but that doesnt sound as evil :)
[18:26] <vish> damn!
[18:26] <coz_> vish,  I think you will not lose that  adjective
[18:26] <coz_> :)
[18:26] <darkmatter> coz_: realism in the unrealistic is awesome. I do it daily ;)
[18:26] <vish> where are my evil pills!
[18:26] <coz_> :)
[18:27] <evilvish> muuhhhaaaa! :D
[18:27] <coz_> doctormo,  one thing you could "trY'  if you decide on the whole moon or not..is to set it behind the tree
[18:27] <coz_> evilvish,  lol
[18:27] <coz_> evilvish,  now I feel at home :)
[18:28] <coz_> but the main thing I see as a problem is that white portion bottom right poking out from the tree
[18:29] <darkmatter> evilvish: welcome back, I missed you! let's go barbecue some kittens and catch up :D
[18:29] <evilvish> yumm
[18:31] <evilvish> huh, "dark"matter , "evil"vish … maybe we are clones ;p
[18:31] <darkmatter> hehe
[18:35] <coz_> evilvish,   ah doctormo  must be editing the image as to our specifications...things are going as planned   :)
[18:35] <evilvish> oh no! people should really not be listening to me :D
[18:35] <coz_> :)
[18:48] <evilvish> coz_: do you know how to change the timing for the trailfocus compiz plugin?
[18:48] <coz_> evilvish,   ah let me check hold on
[18:48] <evilvish>  it takes a couple of seconds to adjust when we bring the unfocussed window to focus.. i'm trying to see if i can have the change quicker
[18:49] <coz_> evilvish,  mm no settings in the plugin ..
[18:49] <evilvish> bah!..
[18:49] <coz_> evilvish,   of course you could go the hard way and edit the xml for that plugin
[18:49] <coz_> evilvish,  you want this slowed down ,,, more speedy??
[18:50] <evilvish> coz_: faster.. would i have to rebuild something?
[18:50] <coz_> evilvish,  I trhink if you edit the xml and just restart compiz it should work
[18:50]  * evilvish goes looking for the xml files..
[18:50] <coz_> evilvish,  check for the conf file also ...looking here myself
[18:51] <coz_> evilvish,  the xml should be under /usr/share/compiz
[18:52] <coz_> oo maybe the .so file as well let me open that to check
[18:52] <evilvish> coz_: and the conf file?
[18:53] <coz_> evilvish,  well I did find the libtrailfocus.so   under /usr/lib/compiz  let me check that first
[18:55] <doctormo> Yes the target is the Edubuntu wallpaper
[18:55] <doctormo> I've updated it with your suggestions
[18:55] <coz_> doctormo,  I suspected that :)
[18:55] <doctormo> And some of my own wrangling
[18:55] <coz_> cool
[18:55] <doctormo> coz_: This was the concept they choose out of the 5 I presented to them
[18:55] <coz_> doctormo,  the biggest issue was that white area bottom right,,
[18:55] <coz_> doctormo,  ah ok  that's cool
[18:55] <coz_> doctormo,  it will work for younger kids :)
[18:56] <coz_> evilvish,  in the xml file I beieve line 185    <max>150</max>  would change the duration
[18:57] <coz_> let me make sure
[18:58] <evilvish> i think thats the number of windows to track..
[18:58] <coz_> yeah sorry
[18:58] <evilvish> looks like the .so needs to be edited :(
[18:58] <coz_> I would think duration is in there somewhere
[18:58] <coz_> probably along with the xml
[18:59] <coz_> evilvish,  sam is probably asleep right now
[18:59] <evilvish> aww..
[18:59] <coz_> evilvish,  well he is in austrailia and believe,, at least from this time zone it is 13 hours ahead of me
[19:00] <coz_> fo rnow 2 pm so sam is 3 am
[19:00] <coz_> evilvish,  i have not had to play with t his particular plugins xml or .so before
[19:01] <coz_> evilvish,  generally it was animations  before 0.9.x came out
[19:01] <evilvish> coz_: ok, no worries ;)
[19:01] <coz_> evilvish,   is this 0.8 or 0.9 ?
[19:01] <evilvish> 0.8
[19:01] <coz_> ah
[19:01] <evilvish> i'm still in maverick
[19:01] <evilvish> only using VM for natty
[19:02] <coz_> evilvish,  you can install 0.9.x there with a script
[19:02] <coz_> oh
[19:02] <coz_> evilvish,    git clone git://anongit.compiz.org/users/soreau/scripts
[19:03] <evilvish> yea, i did think of getting compiz to 0.9 but then i just got lazy and was wondering if it might cause other problems..
[19:03] <coz_> evilvish,  just run  the ./build_compiz++  , it will then generate several more scripts in that folder ,, one for the compiz_addons++  for experimental ones
[19:03] <evilvish> coz_: how has it been for you?
[19:03] <coz_> evilvish,  its fine  and that script will install it into /opt  so it doesnt interfere with the 0.8  installation
[19:03] <coz_> evilvish,  to start it would be  /opt/compiz++/bin/compiz++
[19:04] <coz_> evilvish,  you may find it much snappier and les resource intensive than 0.8.x
[19:04] <coz_> less
[19:04] <evilvish> coz_: ok, so i'd need to start compiz .9 every time i boot?
[19:04] <coz_> evilvish,  one warning... it takes a fairly long time to compile
[19:04] <coz_> evilvish,  no
[19:04] <evilvish> cool!
[19:04] <coz_> evilvish,  unless you wanted it to start up automatically
[19:05] <coz_> evilvish,  that soreau's script is about the only script I truly trust
[19:05] <evilvish> ok.. :)
[19:06] <coz_> evilvish,  he is pretty diligent at keeping up with it
[19:07] <coz_> rather keeping it current
[19:08] <evilvish> hmm, deps fail :s
[19:08] <coz_> evilvish,  o0
[19:08] <darkmatter> coz_: I used to use his script all the time :)
[19:08] <coz_> darkmatter,  very reliable
[19:08] <evilvish> oh wait, i had my own gtk
[19:08] <coz_> evilvish,   this is ubuntu ...yes?
[19:08] <evilvish> hehe! i had patch a gtk and the ~ppa is breaking it
[19:08] <darkmatter> yesh
[19:08] <evilvish> patched*
[19:09] <coz_> oh!!!
[19:09] <coz_> ppapurge :)
[19:10] <evilvish> hmm, not a bad idea.. i can downgrade to stock and then again install my deb
[19:11] <coz_> evilvish,  the script should automatically detect which dependencies and install them
[19:11] <evilvish> yea it did.. but my gtk ppa was the prob :)
[19:11] <coz_> yuk    understood
[19:11] <doctormo> evilvish: At least you didn't have to build a dkms package today out of a fresh wacom kernel module :-(
[19:11] <coz_> I hate errors :)
[19:12] <evilvish> doctormo: you still having problems with the wacom? is it fully supported yet?
[19:12] <coz_> it better be
[19:13] <doctormo> evilvish: These weren't for my problems, these were updated for other people. Lucid and Maverick kernel module upgrades
[19:13] <evilvish> ah!
[19:13] <doctormo> I creamed a few people's wacom support by including my Makefile.
[19:13] <coz_> I would be very very angry with that :)
[19:13] <doctormo> and so I had to post a new version with that fixes and hopefully everyone will get the updated dkms today.
[19:13] <coz_> doctormo,   11.04 ?
[19:14] <doctormo> Well you can't be too angry, I'm looking after wacom-plus support for older ubuntu's. Much more than Ubuntu mainline is doing.
[19:14] <doctormo> In my spare time, for an issue that doesn't actually effect me ;-)
[19:14] <coz_> doctormo,  oh  very nice of you
[19:14] <doctormo> 10.04 and 10.10, 11.04 has the new kernel driver anyway.
[19:15] <doctormo> Basically it's to support all these newer bamboo devices that came out since 2.6.30 released.
[19:16] <coz_> doctormo,  ok yeah that I understand... I have intuos
[19:16] <coz_> so probably not effected
[19:16] <doctormo> prob not, if you find your keys cause the mouse to jump to 0,0 then you're suffering from the xorg driver bug.
[19:16] <doctormo> Which I also fix in my ppa wacom-plus
[19:17] <coz_> doctormo,  oh I have seen on both lucid and maverick as well as natty a cursor jump like that  random it appears
[19:17] <coz_> doctormo,  then I will try your ppa
[19:17] <doctormo> What version of xserver-xorg-input-wacom are they shipping in natty?
[19:18] <coz_> ah  not sure let me try to check on that system
[19:19] <coz_> doctormo,  xorg-server 1.9.99.902
[19:20] <doctormo> coz_: that's the version of xorg, what's the driver version?
[19:20] <coz_> oh wait wrong thing
[19:21] <coz_> doctormo,  1:0.10.11-ubuntu3
[19:22] <doctormo> Looks like the same version as my ppa, perhaps I have a patch... although I don't think so.
[19:22] <coz_> ok
[19:23] <doctormo> coz_: try it and let me know, it'll be fun to see if it fixes issues in natty. Although you should certainly report them too as a bug report.
[19:23] <coz_> doctormo,  sure no  problem... do you have ppa link?
[19:24] <doctormo> https://launchpad.net/~doctormo/+archive/wacom-plus/+packages
[19:24] <doctormo> I published a natty version too, just in case
[19:24] <coz_> doctormo,  ok bookmarked,,, will try to get to it  t his evening
[19:29] <darkmatter> damn. gotta think of a name for my wm/environment (technically a windowmanager based environment as opposed to a "omg! it's a desktop!" thingy :P)
[19:30] <coz_> :)
[19:30] <coz_> darkmatter,  how about  "Darkmatter"
[19:32] <evilvish> coz_: found the desktop team's ppa for 0.9, but does 0.9 have the show desktop plugin?  i cant see any -extra's package
[19:33] <coz_> evilvish,  well it should be in there... or the compiz ++ addons   are you not going to use the script?
[19:33] <evilvish> hehe! i'm lazy :D
[19:33] <coz_> evilvish,  the compi_addons++  script will install all of the extras and experimentals
[19:33] <coz_> evilvish,  there is quite a number of them
[19:33] <evilvish> coz_: i tried to downgrade, but that broke the packages.. and ppa seemed easier than
[19:33] <coz_> oooo
[19:33] <evilvish> downgrade the gtk
[19:34] <coz_> damn
[19:34] <coz_> evilvish,  I believe there are tarballs  let me check
[19:34]  * evilvish also looks in debian
[19:34] <darkmatter> coz_: lol. I was thinking something more "freedom inducing" n "open". since there is no "desktop" in the traditional sense (well there's the display area, which can host/embed a ton of junk, but it's decidedly not traditional), and since it's more of a "going places/doing things" mentality as opposed to "running apps" (you already know my "emotive metaphor" direction) I want something that damn near screams "I'M FREE AT LAST!"
[19:34] <darkmatter> and*
[19:35] <coz_> evilvish,    http://lists.compiz.org/pipermail/community/2010-October/000253.html
[19:36] <coz_> wow he pushed in my icons..cool
[19:37] <evilvish> wheeee! lets see how this goes.. :D
[19:37] <coz_> :)
[19:37] <coz_> evilvish,  make sure you dont install to the same directory as the 0.8.x
[19:38] <coz_> you dont want complications
[19:38] <evilvish> coz_: i think if i do it with the ppa it will do that..
[19:38] <coz_> evilvish,  ppa for compiz 0.9?
[19:38] <evilvish> but i'm not able to build either :(
[19:38] <coz_> evilvish,  oh no
[19:38] <evilvish> coz_: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ppa
[19:38] <coz_> evilvish,  time for reinstallation
[19:39] <evilvish> coz_: whaaaa?
[19:39]  * evilvish stopped update ;)
[19:39] <coz_> evilvish,  doesnt look like a compiz ppa
[19:39] <evilvish> coz_: thats from didrocks
[19:39] <coz_> evilvish,   last ppa was from sam and even he didnt suggest using it
[19:39] <evilvish> desktop team
[19:39] <coz_> ah ok
[19:40] <evilvish>  <coz_> evilvish,  time for reinstallation « this would be only for reinstallation of compiz right?
[19:40] <coz_> ah that ppa is naming the compiz-fusion-plugins-main incorrectly
[19:40] <coz_> evilvish,  no  silly,,, the entire system
[19:40] <coz_> :)
[19:41] <evilvish> ok.. not playing with compiz …
[19:41] <coz_> the plugins should now just be  compiz-plugins-main   compiz-plugins-extra   etc
[19:41] <evilvish> coz_: thats how the plugins are in ubuntu
[19:41] <coz_> evilvish,    ah ok
[19:41] <evilvish> coz_: http://releases.compiz.org/components/plugins-extra/
[19:41] <coz_> the project dropped  the "fusion" part quite a while ago
[19:42] <coz_> good
[19:42] <evilvish> well, atleast the 0.8 ones.. so maybe he just made sure it re-wrote tbe old ones..
[19:42] <evilvish> s/tbe/the
[19:43] <coz_> when I think back a few years about the headaches we had with the naming of the project and the in house arguing  ,, and now we are back to "compiz"
[19:43] <evilvish> heh, planet fedora is on fire! ;)
[19:44] <coz_> oh!
[19:45] <coz_> ok I have to break here ,, be back in about an hour hopefully less
[19:46] <thorwil> bitching about a so called "we know what's best for you" attitude is a common problem
[19:47] <thorwil> it's as if people don't get that designers *must* decide for others. there simply is no way around that
[19:49] <evilvish> actually shell has some interesting ideas, it is a start but not yet a complete concept..
[19:50] <evilvish> if people just want everything the same way, then what is gonna be changed?  we'd just have people going OOOHH ahhh over wallpapers ;p
[19:50]  * evilvish goes back to readin thorwil's post..
[19:52] <thorwil> i have no problem with people complaining about gnome shell. i might join, even. but that the criticism is presented so poorly, mixed with very dumb slogans is saddening
[19:53] <evilvish> yup.. i'm not saying shell is perfect.. :)  but yea criticism is horrid
[19:53] <evilvish> we could just call it name calling ;p
[19:54] <evilvish> the funny thing was someone commented on an Ubuntu bug today about Unity
[19:54]  * evilvish finds the bugs..
[19:54] <thorwil> name calling is better, because there's no pretense of having an actual argument in it
[19:56] <evilvish> https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/715001/comments/6  one hr later he was filing another Unity bug!!!
[19:56] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 715001 in unity "DesktopMenu should have a title" [Medium,Opinion]
[19:56] <evilvish> as if Mark is going to get scared since he wants to switch to Win7 hehe!
[19:58] <thorwil> if mark can't collect enough souls, he can't transform into a super gagajin and steve ballmer might succeed instead!!!
[20:19] <doctormo> thorwil: You mean Mark won't be able to go Malphas?
[20:21] <thorwil> doctormo: isn't the usual path in that direction via becoming a lawyer?
[20:22] <doctormo> thorwil: No, collect 20 souls http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sk-S_6qt44c
[20:23] <doctormo> I enjoyed the time I went malphas and killed about 60 people, oh fun fun.
[20:23] <doctormo> Lots of lovely souls, nom, nom.
[20:23] <thorwil> lol
[20:23] <doctormo> By the way, have you seen this thorwil? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tD5P7RsC9TI
[20:24] <thorwil> rofl
[20:25] <thorwil> doctormo: i have, but it has been a while
[20:26] <doctormo> Bill Baily is A+ in my book, his black books is great too.