[00:38] <rick_h_> hmmm, my checked back for pycon is exactly 50# according to my scale
[00:39] <rick_h_> and that's the limit
[01:10] <snap-l> fun fun. :)
[01:11] <snap-l> Full house. We've got 8 folks here
[01:11] <greg-g> rick_h_: holy cow, you packed a lot :)
[01:11] <Blazeix> wooo chc
[01:11] <greg-g> snap-l: nice!
[01:11] <rick_h_droid> sweet
[01:11] <rick_h_droid> greg-g yea, mics, stands, second laptop
[01:12] <Blazeix> wow, it took me about 10 seconds to write 'wooo chc'. The wireless is somewhat lacking.
[01:12] <rick_h_droid> moved 4 # of power adapters to backpack
[01:15] <snap-l> rick_h_: Sheesh, it's like backpacking. :P
[01:16] <rick_h_droid> i'm the over prepared type
[01:16] <greg-g> that ain't my style of backpacking :)
[01:16] <rick_h_droid> two laptop power adapters, spare batteries, etc
[01:17] <rick_h_droid> could get awsy with less , but what if xxx happens
[01:18] <Blazeix> gah, rick_h_droid's profile picture just showed up in my google results.
[01:19] <Blazeix> he apparently shared jquery mobile on twitter, so his picture shows up next to the results now.
[01:19] <rick_h_droid> lol, i'm everywhere! !!
[01:22] <snap-l> mic delivered
[01:26] <rick_h_> snap-l: woot, thank you sir
[01:28] <snap-l> np
[01:57] <rick_h_> greg-g: bookie work, party part
[02:11] <snap-l> party party
[02:13] <greg-g> rick_h_: w00t! :)
[02:13] <rick_h_> yea, some virtual CHC
[02:13] <rick_h_> greg-g: crap, had wanted to chat before I left oh well
[02:13] <rick_h_> looks like sprints might die off after a day/two
[02:14] <rick_h_> so bookie si going to be getting a lot of love after the weekend
[02:14] <greg-g> awesome!
[02:18] <greg-g> rick_h_: oh, people you shold talk to: Asheesh Laroia (paulproteus) of Creative Commons (past) and OpenHatch. Also, Will Kahn-Greene (willkg) of Participatory Culture Foundation (Miro), and Chris Webber (cwebber) of Creative Commons
[02:19] <greg-g> they will all be at PyCon and they're good people
[02:19] <rick_h_> oh, awesome
[02:21] <greg-g> tell them I sent you and they'll buy you a drink for having to deal with me
[02:21] <rick_h_> hah
[02:29] <greg-g> rick_h_ / snap-l wow, thanks guys for the kind words about my blog post in the lococast
[02:37] <rick_h_> greg-g: :) thanks for the material to chat about
[02:37] <greg-g> and dang, nice words about me in general
[02:37]  * greg-g blushes
[02:38] <rick_h_> just remember that when we kill you interview style :P
[02:44] <snap-l> ;)
[02:50] <greg-g> haha, jerks, softening me up so you can eviscerate me
[03:31] <snap-l> I prever the term vivisection.
[04:03] <greg-g> alright, UGJ announcement sent and blogged. That's good for the evening.
[12:16] <wolfger> greg-g: "spectacular upgrade"? Are you drinking the Canonical brand kool-aid?
[12:38]  * wolfger pokes the channel with a stick
[12:43]  * rick_h_ stabs pack with a giant ray gun
[12:43] <wolfger> Hey, isn't somebody here from Milan? jrwren?
[12:43] <wolfger> ...
[12:43]  * wolfger tries to picture rick_h_ wielding a giant ray gun... and *poking* with it instead of shooting it....
[12:44] <wolfger> That's just a bizzarre mental image
[12:50] <brousch> no, giant ray gun is his pet name for his … bah, nevermind
[12:52] <brousch> hah, anyone read shuttleworth's blog post today?
[12:52] <brousch> "We handle that very well, I think, though occasionally some muppet calls Kubuntu the blue-headed-stepchild etc etc"
[12:52] <brousch> nixternal the muppet!
[12:54] <rick_h_> ok, time to shut down and pack up
[12:54] <rick_h_> see you all on the mobile side
[12:56] <brousch> break a leg!
[13:09] <wolfger> have fun, rick_h_
[13:09] <wolfger> If nixternal's a muppet, he must be Animal
[13:10]  * wolfger goes off in search of Shuttleworth's blog post
[13:13] <snap-l> Happy Birthday, jcastro!
[13:13] <snap-l> Have fun, rick_h_ !
[13:18] <greg-g> wolfger: hey man, its the official announcement, I'm trying to get attendees :)
[13:22] <brousch> i was surprised to see a thanks from wolfger :P
[13:22] <wolfger> :-p
[13:22] <brousch> who, i just realized there's a business card on my desk, and the guy's last name is "Woltjer"
[13:24] <wolfger> I love the way I try to file a bug on Launchpad that xxx doesn't work, and it helpfully suggests that my bug might be a duplicate of yyy doesn't work and zzz doesn't work
[13:28] <wolfger> Woltjer? How odd.
[13:28] <wolfger> Another bug filed
[13:28]  * wolfger slowly rebuilds Launchpad karma
[13:30] <wolfger> of course, it just makes me sad
[13:30] <wolfger> to see how many bugs I'm subscribed to are *STILL* sitting there in an open state
[14:02] <jcastro> thanks snap-l!
[14:05] <wolfger> @shuttleworth: just drop Gnome and give more love to your blue-headed step-child. :-p
[14:05] <wolfger> happy bday, jcastro
[14:10] <greg-g> jcastro: what are you doing for your birthday? (and Happy Birthday!)
[14:11] <jcastro> thanks guys!
[14:11] <jcastro> greg-g: coming to U-M!
[14:11] <jcastro> my wife sponsored a rib of a basilisaurus for the U-M Whale exhibit
[14:11] <snap-l> ruh roh... better watch out U-M
[14:11] <snap-l> jcastro: Oh that's awesome!
[14:11] <jcastro> so we get to go see it at a party before the exhibit opens
[14:11] <jcastro> and meet real paleontologists, etc.
[14:12] <snap-l> Your buddy, Paleo Joe?
[14:12] <snap-l> ;)
[14:13] <greg-g> jcastro: rock!
[14:16] <wolfger> Ugh. DST starts this weekend.
[14:16] <snap-l> wolfger: And nobody has come out to abolish it
[14:16] <wolfger> I really !@#$%^&* hate DST
[14:16] <snap-l> I'm very disappointed that I don't have the change that I can believe in
[14:16] <snap-l> I believe it's time to abolish DST.
[14:17] <wolfger> snap-l for president!
[14:17] <wolfger> Russia recently decided to move to DST permanently. Which is just as good
[14:17] <wolfger> I don't care what time it is, I just want to keep flip-flopping twice a year.
[14:18] <wolfger> s/keep/quit/
[14:21] <snap-l> amen
[14:35] <wolfger> holycrap, PainBank is in the house.
[15:14] <wolfger> CHC road trip? http://drupal.txwikinger.me.uk/content/inaugural-open-data-waterloo-region-codefest-saturday-march-12-2011
[15:21] <jrwren> if ya'll had to guess when FF4 would come out, when would you guess?
[15:21] <jrwren> will IE9 be out before FF4 ?
[15:21] <jrwren> jcastro: thanks for htat techcrunch interview
[15:21] <jcastro> heh
[15:22] <jrwren> rick_h_: if you meet Chris Webber, get his autograph and ask him to introduce you to some women. ;)
[15:23] <wolfger> jrwren: FF4 is shipping with Natty... ;-)
[15:23] <jrwren> wolfger: great info.
[15:23] <jrwren> wolfger: default in natty?
[15:23] <wolfger> Yes
[15:23] <jrwren> excellent.
[15:24] <wolfger> I don't know if that qulifies as "coming out", though... It seems to still be a beta version.
[15:24] <jrwren> RC
[15:24] <wolfger> but it's deemed stable enough for Canonical
[15:24] <jrwren> its RC2 even.
[15:25] <wolfger> ah, ok
[15:25] <jrwren> but IE9 comes out in a week, so I guess IE9 will ship first.  if you would have asked me a year or two ago if FF4 would be out before IE9 I would have said "6mo before"
[15:25] <jrwren> is it me or has FF4 taken forever?
[15:25] <jrwren> Chrome has shipped like 5 versions in the time it has taken to go from 3.5 to 4 for FF
[15:26] <wolfger> Sure
[15:26] <wolfger> Young products do tend to ship lots of versions in shorter time than older products do
[15:27] <wolfger> I think the time between FF4 and FF5 will be longer yet.
[15:28] <wolfger> and it's also worth noting that there's no real metric there
[15:29] <wolfger> One browser might go from  v1 to v2 while another goes from 3.5.11 to 3.5.12 with the same number of improvements
[15:53] <jrwren> wolfger: yes, that is very noteworthy
[15:53] <jrwren> wolfger: plus, chrome, while young, has the age of webkit with it. They get to stand on some mighty shoulders. Yet google is given lots of credit.
[15:53] <greg-g> jrwren: I'm confused about the chris webber comment :)
[15:53] <jrwren> maybe not too much credit. V8 is damned cool.
[15:54] <jrwren> greg-g: Chris Webber was a NBA player. One of hte Umich Fab5 IIRC
[15:54] <jrwren> pop culture talked about him dating Tyra Banks years ago when Tyra was hot and awesome and not dumb and annoying like she is now.
[15:54] <greg-g> jrwren: ahhhhhhhhhhhh
[15:55] <greg-g> sports references usually go right over me
[16:01] <brousch> jcastro: awesome present from your wife. i was a docent a lab assistant at UMMA all through college
[16:01] <snap-l> I would have never thought of that at all
[16:02] <jcastro> brousch: I seriously mulled docenting at the detroit zoo
[16:02] <jcastro> but didn't want to tie into a multi year commitment
[16:02] <brousch> ah, i got to do it as work-study
[16:02] <brousch> got paid ;)
[16:02] <jcastro> jrwren: google's also committing more code to webkit than anyone else right now
[16:17] <wolfger> Google ftw
[16:17] <wolfger> does Chrome/Chromium have NoScript yet?
[16:17] <wolfger> Or any other means of preventing clickjacking or other hostile scripts?
[16:19] <jrwren> jcastro: I didn't know google was committing much to webkit. TY for htat info.
[16:19] <jrwren> i imagine its all html5 support?
[16:20] <jrwren> pretty cool that apple and the rest of us all get to benefit from all that.
[16:21] <jcastro> jrwren: old but http://techcrunch.com/2010/02/06/google-apple-webkit/
[16:25] <jrwren> anyone know where to see a more recent webkit-who output graph?
[16:45] <wolfger> Why is PETA against pigeon racing? I just don't get it.
[16:46] <wolfger> Oh, nevermind. Better question is: why do I care what PETA thinks? :-p
[16:48] <snap-l> And there's your answer.
[16:57] <snap-l> ugh, seems that Wordpress 3.1 grabs sidebar RSS feeds and doesn't cache the results like it used to
[16:57] <snap-l> so the identi.ca group feed that I had on the side of openmetalcast is slowing things down
[16:58] <snap-l> strange that it isn't doing the same for decafbad.net, though
[17:13] <snap-l> http://www.meijer.com/s/big-steals/_/N-5io?CAWELAID=677385714&cmpid=dsthu
[17:13] <snap-l> Any opinions on this?
[17:13] <snap-l> Bah, n/m, it's the X100e.
[17:15] <jcastro> greg-g: any luck on the firefox accell stuff?
[17:15] <greg-g> jcastro: none
[17:15] <jcastro> snap-l: yeah that's the crap version before the one I got
[17:15] <greg-g> I even tried install mesa and forcing it to use that, nothing
[17:15] <greg-g> oh, good, then he leaves
[17:16] <jjesse> just catching up on feeds after traveling, does Mark write posts to get flamed?
[17:17] <greg-g> haha
[17:18] <snap-l> jjesse: I think he's damned if he does, damned if he doesn't
[17:18] <snap-l> I would not want to be mark for a day
[17:18] <jjesse> me either
[17:18] <snap-l> unless I got to decide the Unity direction
[17:18] <jjesse> Mark could say 1+1 = 2 and people would be pissed at him for it
[17:18] <snap-l> in which case, sign me up
[17:21] <jjesse> wow 52 comments so far and no reference to hitler yet, i'm disapointed :)
[17:24] <snap-l> heh
[17:36] <wolfger> I still say Canonical should stop supporting Gnome and go another direction. Since Gnome clearly doesn't want their help (and *cough* sucks).
[17:39] <wolfger> man... tough to stir this crowd up today.
[17:39] <wolfger> I'm losing my touch?
[17:42] <Blazeix> the problem is Mark wouldn't say "1+1=2". He'd say "It's time to rethink math. We're getting rid of addition. Who needs it?" :D
[17:43] <Blazeix> wolfger: now _that_ is a proper troll.
[17:44] <wolfger> LOL
[17:49] <jjesse> as a kde guy i've enjoyed all the fedora posts about how gnome3 sucks and you should use kde or lxde instead
[17:54] <wolfger> I'm trying to use xmonad, but it doesn't work at all on Naughty :-(
[18:26] <wolfger> Ha! Just read a quick tutorial on xmonad, and it might not be broken after all... :-p (was planning to read tutorial from within xmonad so that I could follow along, but apparently if you don't know how to use it, you'll never figure it out on your own)
[18:27] <_stink_> xmonad... i think that was one i didn't try.
[18:28] <wolfger> I'm used to minialist wm's not having a start button of any sort, but usually you can bring up a menu with a right click or middle click, or even a left click on the background
[18:28] <wolfger> xmonad says "throw your mouse away"
[18:29] <wolfger> mod-p to launch dmenu
[18:29] <wolfger> not intuitive in the least
[18:29] <_stink_> oh yes.  i use stumpwm, ratpoison's better cousin.
[18:29] <_stink_> the mouse must die.
[18:30] <wolfger> _stink_: what did the poor little mouse ever do to you?
[18:31] <_stink_> make me realize that i need 3 hands to use it and the keyboard at the same time
[18:35]  * wolfger tries to remember a time (outside of MMORPGs) when he wanted to move the mouse around while simultaneously typing....
[18:35] <_stink_> your solid logic will not sway me!
[18:41] <wolfger> I'm looking for a window manager that simultaneous doesn't require and doesn't hate the mouse
[18:42] <wolfger> The mouse is nice for getting things done single-handedly.
[18:42] <Blazeix> I think resizing windows often requires you to press keys while mousing
[18:42] <Blazeix> if you're using the alt+click method
[18:42] <wolfger> I don't want to have to set my beverage down to open a term window (alt-shift-enter on xmonad)
[18:43] <_stink_> i just hate moving my hand to and from the mouse.
[18:43] <_stink_> whether or not the use is simultaneous
[18:43] <wolfger> ok, I *could* hit those three keys with one hand, but it might give me muscle cramps
[18:44] <wolfger> I can see hating the mouse when it comes to productive use of the computer, but for leisure use, the mouse rules
[18:44] <Blazeix> Wise of you to bring this point up when rick_h_ isn't paying attention :)
[18:45] <wolfger> mouse in one hand, drink/keyboard/phone/whatever in the other
[18:45] <_stink_> yeah, i think rick_h_ would hate on me for not being rabid enough in my mouse hatred
[18:45] <wolfger> I'm sure rick_h_ will read his log when he arrives at pycon
[18:45] <wolfger> and craft a new Rick's Rants around me
[18:45] <wolfger> :-p
[18:47] <Milyardo> I find that mouse shortcuts are helpful when reading documents, instead of writing them
[18:47] <Milyardo> mostly because I tend to read with my cursor
[18:47] <snap-l> I'm hoping rick_h_ is actually on a plane
[18:47] <snap-l> HIs tweet at 11:05am seems to state otherwise.
[18:48] <wolfger> Anybody got physical access to rick_h_'s computer? Let's install a wm based entirely upon mouse gestures. :-D
[18:48] <wolfger> Does anybody actually like/use mouse gestures? I've always thought that was the dumbest thing in the world
[18:49] <snap-l> I personally getest mouse gestures
[18:49] <wolfger> Although....
[18:49] <snap-l> that's one level more than detest
[18:49] <Milyardo> We can replace his keyboard with a left handed mouse for mutli-cursor gestures!
[18:49] <wolfger> Using a mouse with a virtual keyboard and swype could be awesome
[18:49] <_stink_> ColonelPanic001 is a mouse gesture lover.
[18:54]  * wolfger waits for ColonelPanic001 to confirm or deny.
[18:54] <Blazeix> the only place I like gestures is on my android phone.
[18:54] <Blazeix> and those gestures are simple, like 'swipe up to open menu' and 'swipe down to open notification are'
[18:54] <Blazeix> *area
[18:55] <snap-l> http://blog.pythonisito.com/2011/03/allura-open-source-forge.html <- SF has open-sourced their beta platform
[18:56] <snap-l> http://developers.slashdot.org/story/11/03/10/1846215/SourceForge-Open-Sources-Their-Platform-Software?from=twitter
[18:56] <wolfger_> Gah. Stupid webchat...
[19:11] <wolfger_> interesting. Did a search for perl-based wm's and got nothing... searched for python-based wm's and saw that Circus WM was started in 2002, and apparently was instantly forgotten about.
[19:13] <Blazeix> qtile is a pretty popular python wm. I think it's still pretty young, though.
[19:14] <jjesse> yay for time change on sunday
[19:22]  * wolfger_ shoots jjesse
[19:22] <wolfger_> anybody else in favor of time change?
[19:33] <Scott_firebeta> why can't they set clocks forward 1 hour permanently?
[19:33] <brousch> politics
[19:34] <brousch> that would be useful change, which all politicians are against
[19:41] <jcastro> nixternal: what's up muppet?
[19:43] <nixternal> according to hunch.com/muppet I am most like Animal & Cookie Monster, who just happen to be 2 of my favorites
[19:45] <jjesse> i'm cookie monster
[19:45] <nixternal> yeah, i would love to find out how they figured that. one test i took said i was beeker. no fuckin' way i am beeker
[19:50] <brousch> http://www.nerdist.com/2011/03/muppet-alignment-chart/
[19:52] <wolfger_> Scott_firebeta++
[19:52] <wolfger_> LOL @ jcastro
[19:58] <snap-l> Royal Oak Review has a story about a guy that accidentally discharged his shotgun while cleaning it
[19:59] <snap-l> managed to shoot his TV
[19:59] <snap-l> which leads me to believe that the military should use televisions as shielding in armed conflict
[19:59] <snap-l> apparently all guns want to do is shoot your television.
[20:00] <nixternal> was bristol palin on it by chance?
[20:00] <snap-l> didn't say
[20:04] <greg-g> wow, a zing from Ryan Paul: A platform bogged down by infighting has no future. The Linux desktop has marginalized itself. Too much ego and not enough actual progress.
[20:05] <greg-g> oh, and to be followed up by: Future of Linux in consumer space is commercial mixed-source forks like webOS/Android. GNOME is going nowhere. I switched to a Mac this week
[20:05] <greg-g> say hello to the author of "Open Ended" on Ars
[20:07] <brousch> mmmmm, mac
[20:07] <_stink_> how has the Linux desktop not made enough progress?
[20:08] <snap-l> Apparently he's tired of waiting.
[20:08] <brousch> waiting for what?
[20:08] <greg-g> he doesn't say, other than "progress"
[20:08] <snap-l> For whatever it was that he thought he was getting from OSS.
[20:09] <_stink_> yeah.  i'm not a zealot but that is garbage.  like OS X is the bastion of progress?
[20:09] <brousch> the biggest problem i have with linux is stuff (drivers) breaking on new releases. the thing i like most about osx is that the os and hardware are made for each other, and stuff doesn't break every 6 months
[20:10] <snap-l> Well, to be fair, Mac is a very nice platform if what you're looking for is consistency.
[20:10] <snap-l> All of the applications fundamentally work the same way
[20:10] <snap-l> those that do not do not last very long.
[20:11] <snap-l> I think the pendulum of OSS taking over the world is moving back
[20:12] <nixternal> i wouldn't say it is moving back, but it isn't moving forward either. the same stuff going on now has gone on numerous times over the years
[20:12] <snap-l> And I think it's because GNOME and Ubuntu are trying radical changes while leaving the desktop space in flux.
[20:12] <nixternal> when suse sold out, it happened
[20:12] <snap-l> nixternal: Suse, Nokia
[20:12] <snap-l> there's a rumor that Red Hat may be up for sale
[20:13] <nixternal> what i find funny, is all of the panic from those events, and all of the 'this or that is going to happen', never happened
[20:13] <snap-l> I mean, it's getting a little bleak out there because companies are not able to make a lot of money.
[20:13] <snap-l> nixternal: Most of the people who prognosticate this shit have very limited world-views
[20:13] <nixternal> so true
[20:14] <snap-l> there's only a handful of folks that I trust to make that kind of statement
[20:14] <snap-l> because they've been in the trenches for so long
[20:14] <brousch> linux is dead! long live android!
[20:14] <snap-l> jzb is one of them
[20:14] <nixternal> i kind of see why jcastro snapped about 5 years ago with his 'fuck it, i am going back to windows' rant. step back away from the community for a while and watch it, it looks far worse than it really is
[20:14] <jcastro> right
[20:15] <jcastro> except now if you say "fuck it I'm going mac" everyone thinks that's awesome
[20:15] <nixternal> hahaha
[20:15] <snap-l> It's true, though
[20:15] <jcastro> "I'll show you, I'm leaving this single digit marketshare crap for ... oh wait, another single digit marketshare crap..."
[20:15] <jjesse> lol
[20:15] <snap-l> It's like saying you're ceoming a buddhist
[20:15] <brousch> they don't think it's awesome, but i think they understand why
[20:15] <nixternal> still i think mac is freakin' horrible. i hate everything about it usability wise, but i guess that is linux' fault since that is what i have been pretty much raised on
[20:15] <jcastro> "I'm sick of the drama, I'm going to move to a platform ... oh wait, they invented platform drama..."
[20:15] <jcastro> "oh wait, I'm just an asshole"
[20:15] <jcastro> those are the three steps
[20:16] <nixternal> jcastro: according to the latest mac is almost double digit now. i think either a high 8 or 9% :D
[20:16] <Scott_firebeta> why is apple stock over $400 while Microsoft is sitting around $25?
[20:16] <nixternal> Scott_firebeta: microsoft has split a million times, apple refuses to do so
[20:16] <snap-l> Scott_firebeta: because Apple has a more developed mobile platform than Microsoft.
[20:17] <snap-l> and that's where the money is
[20:17] <nixternal> they think that if their stock is at $400, they will only get serious investors, whereas every mom and pop in the world owns microsoft stock
[20:17] <snap-l> and the myriad of stock splits.
[20:17] <nixternal> it used to be about volume, but it seems apple & microsoft trade at about the same volume these days
[20:17] <nixternal> berksher hathway is a perfect example of this
[20:18] <snap-l> That and you get a Microsoft stock certificate with every new PC purchase. ;)
[20:18] <nixternal> berksher is currently trading at about $13,000 a share
[20:18] <nixternal> snap-l: really? i never paid attention to the paperwork, it is always the first thing that gets thrown out :)
[20:19] <snap-l> nixternal: Should read the license more carefully.
[20:22] <jrwren> $400/share v. $25/share is meaningless.
[20:22] <jrwren> learn about market valuations
[20:22] <jrwren> its not evan a valid question.
[20:22] <jrwren> and its definitely NOT about volume.
[20:22] <Scott_firebeta> so there are less total shares of Apple?
[20:23] <jrwren> look it up
[20:23] <jrwren> but their marketcap is similar IIRC
[20:23] <snap-l> It's because jrwren can't even use his shares as expensive tissue paper to wipe away the tears of sadness over Windows Phone 7
[20:23] <jrwren> oh no.
[20:23] <jrwren> 319 v. 213 marketcap for AAPL v. MSFT
[20:24] <jrwren> what shares?
[20:24] <jrwren> what sadness?
[20:24] <snap-l> http://www.google.com/finance?q=msft+aapl
[20:25] <snap-l> jrwren: There there... the pain must be excruciating for you
[20:25] <jrwren> don't even know what you are talking about :)
[20:25] <jrwren> troll harder.
[20:26] <nixternal> jrwren: marketcap is all about volume, if it weren't, then wallstreet would be far more mad than it already is
[20:26] <brousch> troll smarter, not harder
[20:26] <snap-l> well, because Apple has provided their investors over 300% of a reason to invest with thim since 2007, while Microsoft is slowly costing folks money.
[20:26] <nixternal> marketcap is the only regulation that has worked thus far for wallstreet
[20:27] <snap-l> ie: Apple makes people money. Microsoft makes people use Visual Studio
[20:27] <jrwren> " marketcap is all about volume"  <-- i don't even know what this means.
[20:28] <jrwren> marketcap isn't a regulation, so that is a nonsensical statement
[20:28] <snap-l> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Market_capitalization
[20:29] <nixternal> marketcap, aka market capitlization is where they take the size of a company, shares outstanding, and share price, put it all together to create a necessary measurement, which just happens to be in volume (which i think they picked because they had no idea wtf volume meant in the old days)
[20:30] <rick_h_> [6~[6~[6~[6~[6~[6~[6~woo! made it to the hotel
[20:30] <rick_h_> oops
[20:30] <rick_h_> man, now they want $12 a day for internet
[20:30] <nixternal> snap-l: how does apple make people money and microsoft doesn't? if that were true, then microsoft wouldn't be damn near 90% of the market
[20:30] <jcastro> http://techcrunch.com/2010/06/26/microsoft-numbers/
[20:30] <snap-l> nixternal: I can't answer everything, man
[20:30] <jcastro> almost a year old
[20:30] <jcastro> but worth a read
[20:31] <nixternal> hahaha
[20:31] <rick_h_> ruh roh, what are we chatting about?
[20:31] <nixternal> rick_h_: Microsoft Michigan LoCo Team
[20:31] <rick_h_> really?
[20:31] <jcastro> rick_h_: nothing, just snap-l's typical apple fanboism. :p
[20:31] <nixternal> yeah, I am moving there just to be a part of it <3
[20:31] <rick_h_> awesome
[20:31] <snap-l> rick_h_: Segphault made a post that he's no longer using Linux as a desktop
[20:31] <rick_h_> snap-l: yea, saw that one
[20:31] <nixternal> i am not using linux as a desktop either
[20:32] <nixternal> i am using linux as an os and tool :p
[20:32] <snap-l> and that turned into a Microsoft stock vs. Apple stock argument
[20:32] <jrwren> i didn't say I didn't know what marketcap was. I said I don't understand your statements :p
[20:32] <nixternal> jrwren: don't feel bad, either do i ;p
[20:32] <nixternal> 4 years of fighting to finish an mba will do that to you
[20:32] <jrwren> i can tell, since you did follow up and define marketcap incorreclty :)
[20:32] <snap-l> rick_h_: And of course I tied it in to the developments with GNOME and UNity.
[20:33] <jrwren> oh shit, you are an MBA and can't define marketcap?
[20:33] <nixternal> well i didn't give it a true definition
[20:33] <rick_h_> yea, well that seems to be part of his issue
[20:33] <nixternal> i wasn't going to read from wikipedia and make it sound like it was my definition
[20:33] <jrwren> maybe we are using different definitions of volume?
[20:33] <nixternal> i just gave a quick mumbo-jumbo on it, i could always elaborate and go way in depth, but that is more for a face-to-face chat with a cognac and stogey
[20:34] <jrwren> i hear volume and think an hours, days or weeks volume, as in the number of shares traded in that time period.
[20:34] <nixternal> jrwren: exactly, our definitions of volume, what we were taught in school, doesn't necessarily make sense in regards to wall street. that is the confusing crap that i failed to come to grips with for the first 2 years of business schooling. made me realize i picked the wrong damn degree too :)
[20:34] <nixternal> that and if you didn't cheat you weren't going to be an mba grad
[20:35] <jrwren> how is that not a valid definition of volume?
[20:37] <nixternal> oh, i didn't see your comment before my last. volume in the trading world is all about how much is in the till and how much is leaving the till (ie. how full is the till), which is controlled/regulated/looking for the right word, in regards to market capitalization
[20:37] <nixternal> think i should have proofed that last line before hitting enter, as i got lost using the word till so many times
[20:38] <jrwren> i think i see what you mean.
[20:38] <nixternal> reuters has good information on this stuff, and so does bloomberg. so if there is a day you feel like blowing your head off, don't. read those first, then blow your head off :)
[20:39] <nixternal> it is the most boring shit in the world, and i can't believe i shelled out so much money in an attempt to learn that crap, when i should have been doing computer science instead. thankfully market shit was only a semester and a half
[20:39] <rick_h_> snap-l: I think segfault has been kidnapped
[20:39] <rick_h_> finished identica and now linux
[20:40] <jrwren> nixternal: i understand the relation now.
[20:40] <jrwren> I'd never considered it.
[20:41] <jrwren> its not boring at all, its how our world works.
[20:41] <jrwren> but why shell out money for anything. you could just use your library card ;)
[20:42] <nixternal> hahaha
[20:42] <nixternal> it was all about that paper, the mba moniker...or really, all about the money
[20:45] <jrwren> since the numbers I deal with are never large enough for volume's relation to marketcap to matter, I'd never considered it.
[20:46] <jrwren> although I do own some low volume trusts that can effect liquidity. I should pay more attn to that
[20:47] <nixternal> probably more important if you are day trading. if you learn how it all moves then you can tell yourself when a market is becoming bullish or bearish and not wait for that guy on cnbc to tell you after the stock market closes for the day
[20:55] <snap-l> rick_h_: Same here
[20:55] <snap-l> I think we need an intervention
[20:55] <rick_h_> heh, I don't blame him. He's becoming a fan of the closed software
[20:55] <rick_h_> http://twitter.com/#!/segphault/status/45948224002985984
[20:56] <snap-l> I think we've all been there
[20:56] <rick_h_> yea
[20:57] <rick_h_> and for what he does, it's not like he does a lot of stuff where you want that server as much like the desktop/dev environment stuff
[20:57] <rick_h_> most of his articles come out of VMs anyway
[20:58] <brousch> i love having all 3 OSes available on the same machine in VMs
[20:58] <rick_h_> man, thi shotel sucks
[20:59] <brousch> rick_h_: shouldn't you be out mingling by now?
[20:59] <rick_h_> waiting for my roomy to arrive so I can give him a key
[20:59] <rick_h_> and catching up on tons of work email
[21:00] <rick_h_> man, you leave and suddenly emails go nuts
[21:00] <rick_h_> http://twitter.com/#!/markramm/status/45907183665291264 awesome
[21:01] <snap-l> rick_h_: Yeah, I saw that. :)
[21:01] <snap-l> Welcome to the big leagues. :)
[21:05] <brousch> awwwwwwww, how sweet
[21:05] <brousch> all it needs a picture of you and mark ramm hugging
[21:05] <snap-l> brousch: be areful what you wish for
[21:07] <brousch> a christian side hug of course, so your pythons don't touch :P
[21:07] <snap-l> I totally could have left that image alone
[21:08] <brousch> you're welcome
[21:16] <_stink_> is 'areful' a typo for 'careful' or 'arseful'?
[21:17] <snap-l> careful
[21:18] <_stink_> darn
[21:19] <snap-l> Whatever you were planning to do with arseful, knock yourself out, and leave me clean out of it.
[21:23] <_stink_> i was trying to set up brousch.
[21:25] <brousch> i went over the line with pythons. i don't need to leap into arseful
[21:33] <brousch> snap-l: did i send this to you yet? http://portal.friendika.com/
[21:33] <snap-l> You might have
[22:22] <Milyardo> ls
[22:24] <snap-l> Bad command or filename
[22:24] <Milyardo> :(