=== rtdos is now known as z80 === z80 is now known as retrodos === anna is now known as Anna === shadeslayer_ is now known as shadeslayer === _LibertyZero is now known as LibertyZero === txwikinger2 is now known as txwikinger === Raist is now known as Guest81381 [16:49] http://irc.freenode.net/ === m4n1sh_ is now known as m4n1sh [17:25] * jcastro taps the mic [17:29] 2 minutes until Q+A with Marjo Mercado (Ubuntu QA Manager) [17:30] ok marjo's having xchat problems [17:30] so one minute === ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Current Session: Q and A with Marjo Mercado, Ubuntu QA Team Manager - Instructors: marjo [17:30] Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/03/11/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session. [17:31] (We'll give it another minute for the stragglers to join) [17:31] Ok so welcome everyone [17:31] to Ubuntu Q+A with QA manager Marjo Mercado [17:32] and his team [17:32] marjo_: why don't you guys introduce yourselves [17:32] and then let me know when you can start taking questions! [17:32] jcastro ack [17:33] hi folks [17:33] i'm Marjo Mercado and I'm the ubuntu qa team manager [17:35] marjo_: can you explain it is what your team does? [17:36] the ubuntu qa team is responsible for a couple of major areas [17:36] 1) Bug Management [17:36] 2) Testing [17:37] bug management involves bug triage, reporting for both released and development versions [17:37] testing includes SRU (stable release updates) and development releases, too [17:37] .. [17:40] jcastro:next [17:40] QUESTION: There are people (myself excluded) who would like to see Ubuntu as a rolling distribution. Much like Gentoo. What's the QA's position on this? [17:43] hggdh: obviously this would impact the way we do testing and how to ensure quality [17:43] the beauty of the cadence we currently have is it allows for good planning to ensure quality on a predictable basis [17:43] .. [17:45] ozone702> QUESTION: Will there be support for Gnome in future versions of Ubuntu? [17:46] I can answer that [17:46] GNOME continues to ship GNOME [17:47] currently, for Natty since there is a transition between GNOME2 and GNOME3 if you want the "GNOME3" experience with gnome shell you will need to use a PPA [17:47] but we expect for Oneiric that the transition will be more sorted and we can ship more of a GNOME3 stack [17:48] jcastro: thx; from a qa point of view, we continue to test GNOME, so no change there [17:50] next? [17:50] QUESTION: How is the work on natty going? [17:52] lpox123: quite well as far as QA is concerned; we've been creating lots of automated tests for both desktop and server [17:53] http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/qadashboard/qadashboard.html [17:53] .. [17:53] QUESTION: Is is possible to get a broad idea how you guys plan testing versus community ISO testing. I'd be interested in the relationship of internal versus external. :) [17:54] JFo: broadly speaking, there's really not much difference [17:55] since all of our ISO testing is with the community [17:55] JFo: did i answer your question? [17:56] JFo: where things are different is the community has access to a broader set of HW types and configurations (compared to internal) [17:56] * hggdh goes and add his personal interest: of course, the more community-performed tests, the better: many different hardware, more chances of issues [17:56] hggdh: +1 [17:57] QUESTION: How is with regression testing? You mentioned automated tests, what things do they cover? I assume that it is hard to test everything especially things that were developed by 3rd party developers. [17:57] BigWhale: you're right [17:58] our current automated tests for desktop are trying to ensure that natty works very well and provides an excellent user experience [17:59] and for our automated server tests, we want to ensure high reliability in several server configurations [18:00] both are run on a daily basis, so we're able to detect regressions very quickly [18:00] furthermore we run regression tests for the SRU (stable release updates) for packages and the kernels (2 week cadence) [18:00] .. [18:01] QUESTION: Does the Ubuntu QA Team test upstream package, such as GNOME? And after you find a bug, do you report it to the upstream developers or Ubuntu developers? [18:02] Griever: the ubuntu QA team focuses our testing on ubuntu packages [18:03] after we find a bug, we do the bug triage and assign to ubuntu devs and upstream bugs, as appropriate [18:03] .. [18:04] we do upstream bugs we find [18:04] .. [18:05] as an addendum, we would like more people building pure upstream packages, and testing them *for* upstream. For example I use to build coreutils and weechat [18:05] QUESTION: When newer kernels, packages, etc. are incorporated into 10.10 or newer, such as gcc-4.5, why are such updates to newer repositories not backported to the LTS build(s)? === i is now known as Guest58535 [18:12] EvilPhoenix: can we get back to you on that? (not a straight-forward answer) [18:12] there are some issues here: some packages have heavy interdependencies. For example, GCC: if we update GCC, we will have to rebuild & retest *all* dependend packages [18:12] * hggdh goes to answer [18:13] and this means -- again on this GCC example -- pretty much everything [18:13] so there are limits on what we can upgrade. There is always the SRU (Stable Release Update) for specific issues [18:14] QUESTION: How about writing some a general QA guidelines/manual for developers so that they would help with the testing. Perhaps even with unit testing. In the long term, an application could get 'Ubuntu QA approved seal'. [18:14] BigWhale: great idea; that's been one of the biggest challenges from a testing point-of-view [18:15] some teams have unit testing done but they don't always carry over well into the functional and integration testing areas [18:15] but in general, i like your suggestion; thx [18:17] next? [18:18] marjo_: ooh I have a question! [18:18] marjo_: Can you go into some detail on how your team gets a bug fix from an upstream or a contributor and how that gets shipped to users [18:18] like I see tags like "regression testing" and things like that [18:19] and how your team works with for example a desktop engineer to get that fix out [18:20] jcastro: yes, we use tags to indicate bugs of specific interest so that we can focus the bug triage [18:20] There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session. [18:21] the bug squad team takes care of the initial triage to determine which team and or engineer a bug should be assigned to [18:21] then we make sure to follow up with the team and/or engineer to ensure timely resolution [18:22] we apply this same process whether the bug is for a released version or one in development [18:23] as far as verification of fixes is concerned, it depends on whether the bug is in an SRU or in development [18:23] if it's in an SRU then we use our SRU verification process [18:24] if it's in development, then we make sure to verify the fix as soon as a new package is available and we can also check through the ISO testing at release milestones [18:24] .. [18:24] QUESTION: Would QA benefit from a longer release cycle? :> [18:25] There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session. [18:25] BigWhale: that's a tricky question, but let me try [18:26] BigWhale: a longer release cycle would benefit QA because it would allow more time for more testing [18:26] but as you would probably agree to, a longer release cycle also means more time to put more features and updated packages in [18:26] therefore, the benefit is reduced IMHO [18:26] .. [18:27] that about wraps it up [18:27] marjo_: where can people find out more information about QA? [18:28] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam [18:28] http://qa.ubuntu.com [18:28] and send us email at: ubuntu-qa@lists.ubuntu.com! [18:29] thanks everyone! great questions! i appreciate your time and interest in QA! [18:30] thanks everyone for participating! [18:30] Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/03/11/%23ubuntu-classroom.html [18:30] jcastro: thx for setting this up! === ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || === jporsini is now known as jfi