hamitronI am just hoping nothing has happened to other comps on this network00:00
hamitronnot in the mood for major hassle00:01
dwatkinshamitron: does it have malware bytes, threatfire and avg?00:01
hamitronit has AVG and something else00:01
hamitroncame with the packard bell software00:02
hamitrontempted to slam MS Security Essentials on next time00:03
popeythats what I run on my XP VM00:03
hamitronI've read it is good00:03
hamitronand it seems reasonably light00:03
directhexhamitron, i have a simple rule: i'll support windows if the software stack i install post-format isn't adjusted00:05
shaunoout of the blue; I think it'd be better not to have "that tick-box" at all.  it should offer to install if/when it's required  (and so should the samba preference thingie)00:06
directhexand no support for dumb idiots00:06
hamitrondirecthex: hhaha00:06
hamitronit is hard with family :/00:06
directhexany email or IM infection is unsupported00:06
popeyshauno: i tend to agree00:06
directhexto regain support, it's format time00:06
directhexhamitron, they'll never learn if you keep wiping their bums00:07
shaunoI find family easier, because I can be just as demanding as they can :)00:07
hamitrondirecthex: best bit is, she is not sure she kept the recovery media I burnt for her when she got the thing00:07
directhexhamitron, then wipe the disk, and give her a link to the microsoft store00:07
directhexit's only £150 for windows!00:08
hamitroncan i use windows 7 retail dvd for oem install?00:08
hamitronfs :/00:08
directhexwell... perhaps00:09
directhextechnically i think you can, but not for OEM licenses from major manufacturers00:09
directhexonly OEM licenses you buy yourself from places like scan00:09
hamitronI don't mind having to buy something, but the worry of what hoops I must jump through annoys me00:09
directhexbuy online, burn iso!00:09
HazRPGNew rack00:12
HazRPGalso, hi all :)00:12
HazRPGshauno: https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/Ogr7XDAuntqcOkEtcg5WYQ?feat=directlink00:12
shaunothat's not a rack!00:13
HazRPGshauno: its not the type of rack you were expecting... no lol00:13
HazRPGhmm, I should really figure out how to change that avatar on that...00:14
HazRPGthat's my ex-missus00:14
HazRPGthat's on that00:14
* shauno goes back00:14
shaunoI'm such a crap stalker.  didn't even notice that was there00:15
directhexi should take some photos with my amazing new futuristic camera of the future!00:16
HazRPGdirecthex: you should!00:17
HazRPGshauno: heh, wouldn't bother me normally - but it's a picture of both me and her, and since me and her don't exist anymore... sort of inappropriate00:17
HazRPGesp. since she dumped me in 2009 lol00:17
hamitrontoo much ubuntu and irc?.... ;)00:18
HazRPGbarely use my web picasa :P00:19
HazRPGfind it odd how my google avatar, isn't the same as my picasa avatar - I always assumed it was00:20
hamitronanyone here use a 20 pin PSU with 24 pin motherboards?00:20
HazRPGconsidering they're both google...00:20
HazRPGhamitron: I have, didn't work lol00:20
HazRPGpretty much00:20
hamitronk, my motherboard manuals say I can00:21
HazRPGwith the system bare... it sort of worked, but after it passes POST it just sort of doesn't know what to do - guessing from the lack of power00:21
hamitronbut it is either that, or faulty00:21
HazRPGheh, mine said it had to be 24 pin...00:21
hamitrontime for a bodge job then00:21
HazRPGso if yours says it can work with 20 instead of 24... it might be ok :)00:22
hamitronthey boot00:22
hamitronand work ok00:22
hamitronbut then freeze00:22
dwatkinssounds like the psu isn't delivering enough power00:22
dwatkinsor that there are extra volt lines in the additional 4 pins which aren't suplied00:22
HazRPGyeah, that's what mine did when I was using just 20 instead of 2400:23
dwatkinsI've had PSUs with a detachable extra 4-pin section on the motherboard connector00:23
hamitronI have a blown up PSU with a 24 pin connector....00:23
shaunoa bit slow because it needed a little trimming, but http://dl.dropbox.com/u/23042/arack.jpg  is the rack they dumped on my desk at work :(00:23
hamitronmay have to use that on this psu00:23
hamitronadapter on ebay is only few quid00:24
shaunonot in a closet.  right close enough to keep me toes toasty00:24
hamitronbut I'd have to wait for it to arrive00:24
HazRPGshauno: heh, pretty big considering it was just dump there...00:24
HazRPGeven plugged it in and everything!00:24
shaunoI've tried to move it .. I'm too little00:25
dwatkinsI'd like a mini rack to put on my desk.00:25
HazRPGshauno: is that your desk that's next to it?00:25
HazRPGalso... little?00:25
shaunolittle .. it's got a 20k ups in it.  it's not light00:26
HazRPGmy odds of guess work says that things about 2 to 2.5 metres00:26
HazRPGshauno: ah, so when you say little you mean your not Arnold when it comes to muscles00:27
HazRPGyou like using that word don't you :P00:27
shaunoI'm not a midget, but I am a very stereotypical scrawny, pasty-faced nerd00:27
HazRPG*raises drink to that*00:28
shaunoanother out of the blue; yes, the release names are getting daft.  I had to resort to the oed app on my phone to learn how to pronounce eric thingie00:28
hamitronwhat is the 6 pin connector on the psu?00:29
HazRPGGPU usually00:30
directhex6-pin is for low-end GPUs00:30
HazRPGmainly for power-hungry graphics cards00:30
hamitron1x6 pins00:30
directhexit's a 75W power connector00:30
HazRPGdirecthex: low-end?00:30
hamitronisn't gpu 2x3?00:30
directhexHazRPG, well, there's the 6+2 pin version for hungrier cards00:30
directhexhamitron, wait, you have a 1x6 connector? white plug?00:31
HazRPGdirecthex: ah, that's probably the one I'm thinking of00:31
directhexsounds like a P6. that's OLD.00:31
HazRPGhamitron: must be for floppies00:31
shaunofloppy is 4 pin00:31
directhexHazRPG, and meaty cards use 2 of them, either a 6+2 and a 6, or two 6+200:31
shauno2x3 is the pci-e "moar juice plz"00:32
hamitronfor old P4 motherboard00:32
hamitron"6-pin AUX connector"00:32
HazRPGheh, haven't seen any that really needed more than 6+2's00:32
directhexhamitron, two orange wires in it?00:32
directhexyeah, sounds like AUX... but i've never seen it used00:32
hamitronif I cut that off, just need a source a 12V00:32
directhexperhaps for the old socket 423 p4's?00:33
hamitronfor the 20 to 24 pin conversion00:33
HazRPGcorrect me if I'm wrong, but I think some 5" card reader bays use those 6 pins too00:33
hamitronI'll cut it off, can't always put it back on later00:33
shaunoty google overlords; http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/cputopiaonline/mp3atx40.jpg00:33
directhexHazRPG, never seen that. card readers usually use floppy connector00:34
shaunoI've never had a card reader that needed anything more than fw & usb headers00:34
directhexor that, sure. i hate it when they use up a usb header on the mobo through, i end up with some dead usb ports on the case00:35
HazRPGshauno, directhex: that's why these are useful: http://amigakit.leamancomputing.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=33800:36
shaunonah.  you just buy mobo with a stupid amount of headers00:37
shaunohaving a cable coming out of an internal bay and into an external plug is just messy00:37
HazRPGheh, my sister had a case that had 3.5mm jacks for audio that you had to loop round to the back from the inside00:38
directhexi saw that on some school pcs in the 90s00:38
HazRPGeven came with a metal strip for feeding the wire through00:38
shaunoI'm just gonna drop an a-bomb and say I'm glad apple think about that before they build the machine :p00:39
HazRPGshauno: heh, it's the reason I always build my machines with expansion in mind00:39
hamitronapple bomb? :(00:39
shauno(yes, I'm aware that just ends up meaning you have 2 usb plugs and you like it.)00:40
shaunoHazRPG: I don't.  I buy machines with resale in mind00:40
shaunoI don't plan a purchase around something I'd want to use in 3 years time.  I plan a purchase around something I'll be able to get rid of in 3 years time00:41
hamitronI buy mine with the price in mind....00:41
hamitronand hoard them all for many years00:41
shaunoI think it's still keeping price in mind, it's just the new car vs old car thing00:41
hamitronnew car all the way!00:41
hamitronunless you go classic ofc00:42
HazRPGshauno: ah, see I was talking about the case :P00:42
shaunoapple laptops do resell well.  stupidly well.  I've seen mbp sell for more in "spares and repairs" condition than a working laptop should be worth00:42
HazRPGmy case can hold up to 5 CD/DVD/etc drives, and 2 floppy drives00:42
HazRPGit can also hold up to 6 hard drives00:43
shaunoso it means half - 2/3 of my next laptop is paid for00:43
hamitronI was too tight to get a dvd drive for my last build :/00:43
hamitrongot a 2nd hand case with not enough blanking plates, so they don't all line up00:44
HazRPGhas two huge fans, plus space for another 1 (or 2 small ones)00:44
hamitronfans? ;)00:44
hamitronis it right my i3 idles at 9 C?00:44
HazRPGhmm, should be more like 20'C00:45
HazRPGbut I could be wrong00:45
hamitroncooler than my c2d00:45
hamitronit idles around 1400:46
directhexit's not at 9C00:46
directhexit's not possible for it to be lower than room temperature00:46
shaunoI never did figure out what to put in my dvd bay, after someone's darling fork() discovered the slot-loader would still spin a disk up with a surprising amount of coinage in there00:46
hamitronit is prob about room temp at a guess00:46
directhexyour room isn't at 9°C00:46
hamitron1 sec00:47
hamitronaround 10C00:47
hamitrongive or take a few C00:47
shaunobut you got a stellar deal on the heating?00:48
hamitronno heating00:48
HazRPG. . . . . .00:48
HazRPGI think this is where years of living in a desert has killed me00:48
shaunoam I wrong in thinking you're up north with the scary hairy people?00:48
HazRPGI find it cold when it gets less than 20'c00:48
hamitronscarey hairy? :|00:49
directhex16°C is the legal minimum for a work room under health & safety laws00:49
hamitronwhat has law got to do with it?00:49
directhexa cold machine room is around the 17°C mark00:49
shaunowhat's law but a second-hand emotion ...00:50
ali1234there is no legal requirement for minimum temperature00:50
* screen-x cools machine room to 20 degrees, which feels arctic in the summer00:50
HazRPGI was use to room temp of about 40-50'c at one point :P00:51
* hamitron just has it how it is, cold in winter and warmer in summer00:51
hamitronworks for me00:51
directhexyou're putting your health at serious risk if you sit in a room which is too cold00:51
HazRPGhamitron: body temp is 37'c dude... just saying00:51
hamitrondirecthex: in what way?00:52
Azelphur37c for a room is way too hot :o00:52
ali123410 degrees isn't particularly hazardous as long as you are not also starving or 80 or something00:52
AzelphurI'd suffer at 37c lol00:52
HazRPGsince I think 36-38 is normal (could be wrong)00:52
AzelphurI'm comfortable at 20ish00:52
hamitronI ahve cake to keep me warm ;)00:52
directhexnormal for a room is ~21°C00:52
shaunoI was always told 36, but that's irrelevant to room temp.  we're warm-blooded for a reason00:52
Pendulumwin 4100:52
Pendulumfail :(00:52
hamitronI tend to get headache when temp is upto mid 20s00:53
hamitrongimme lower temps any day00:53
HazRPGhamitron: you'd probably suffer in saudi then :P00:53
hamitronI suffer in England ;/00:53
HazRPGroom temp was 40-50'c if no A/C was on.00:53
hamitronI'd be useless00:54
ali1234i lived in a house with no heating or hot water for 3 months in winter in manchester00:54
hamitroneven more so than now....00:54
HazRPGA/C's would normally only cool down to about 26'c... but that would feel artic almost!00:54
ali1234at the same time i worked in an office which also had no heating or hot water00:54
HazRPGI use to set mine to around 28-3000:54
hamitronali1234: you are still alive?00:54
shaunoditto.  40+ is nuts.  I was pretty much useless when outside temps hit 3000:54
* screen-x should be in bed00:54
ali1234i just drank lots of tea00:55
HazRPGshauno: you slowly get use to it funnily :P00:55
hamitronI ahve 4 wool jumpers on I suppose00:55
hamitronthat helps keep warm00:55
shaunoover 5 years, summer in the states knocked me out every year00:55
HazRPGbeen back in the UK for around 8 years now... and I still haven't adjusted to the cold properly yet :/00:56
shaunowinter's easy.  you can wear more, you can move more.  80-90F is inhumane00:56
hamitronexactly shauno :)00:56
shaunoI wouldn't keep home at 10º tho00:56
hamitronparts of the house are warmer00:56
* HazRPG googles to find out what 80-90'F is...00:56
shauno80's about 2500:57
hamitroncan't heat all rooms00:57
shauno90's not going to be far off00:57
shauno10º would stall my yeasties00:57
HazRPGthat sounds wrong ...00:57
shaunoit's very wrong.  stalled yeasties make no alcohol!00:57
HazRPGthat kind of yeasties ;)00:58
hamitronmy wine is in the kitchen00:58
hamitrongot an aga there to keep it warm00:58
HazRPG... isn't it illegal to make your own here??00:58
shaunoit's bad enough that I have to give them a little immersion widget when we get snaps.  I don't want to know what'd cost to do that all winter00:58
directhexmore than 24°C is uncomfortable for most people00:58
ali1234HazRPG: only distilling00:59
shaunono.  illegal to sell your own.  there's probably a volume limit too00:59
hamitronvolume limit? :(00:59
shauno(eg, I believe the US is 200 gals per adult per year.  I completely expect the UK to have something similar)00:59
hamitronso 54 demi-johns is maybe bad?01:00
hamitronah, be ok then01:00
shaunoit may not do, as the US can be a bit funky about alcohol.  but as a rule of thumb their law tends to be rooted in ours01:00
shauno(oddly less versed in UK law because I never lived there as an adult :)01:01
shaunothey used to sell beer kits in boots tho, so I know it's not illegal :)01:02
hamitronunlimited in the UK according to wikipedia01:03
hamitronfor personal use01:03
HazRPGI knew I was right when me and my friend were arguing it the other night... made me believe it was illegal :/01:03
shaunoah, germany does the 200L thing too.  funky.01:04
shaunothem of all people  </stereotype>01:04
hamitronthey prob have a fancy long form to fill in too01:05
shaunobut yeah.  my office stays 18-20º so they don't crash01:06
hamitroncrash? :/01:06
HazRPGcomputers play funny at too low and too high a temperature... if I recall01:07
HazRPGor any electronics for that matter01:07
HazRPGbut unsure of the numbers01:07
shaunohigh temps sure.  cold temps is pretty harmless01:07
hamitronI had a comp that was a little unstable this winter01:07
hamitronit has frost on the case01:07
shaunothey should be above the dew point so you don't get a condensate risk01:07
shaunopast that, they'll keep themselves warm01:08
HazRPGcold temps make it harder for electricity to flow through01:08
hamitronbest solution is never turn them off01:08
hamitronmy comps are my heating01:08
ali1234in germany even caffeinated soft drinks are controlled01:08
hamitronhow much coffee you allowed?01:08
ali1234i dunno01:09
shaunoI had a friend who described that as 'dark' sodas.  made it a bit confusing01:09
ali1234it only applies to kids afaik01:09
ali1234kids don't generally drink coffee01:09
hamitronnow I am even more glad we won the war01:09
hamitronI'd be totally different01:09
shaunoja, wurden sie01:10
hamitronI'd know what that means also no doubt01:10
hamitroninstead I am inferier and don't01:10
shauno:)  "yes, you would"  (someone had to )01:10
shaunoone day they'll figure out how to drop google translate into our ear01:11
screen-xshauno: babelfish01:11
shaunoI know, but AV died01:12
screen-xnooo, a real google powered in ear babelfish :)01:12
shaunoyeah, I know01:12
shaunopreferred it with google because it's a little less obvious that way :)01:13
shaunoeven if altavista did snag the primo name first01:13
screen-xplus google translate works rather well01:13
hamitronI just don't read anything in anything other than English01:14
ali1234real time translation is impossible01:14
ali1234unless, like the babel fish, it can actually read the mind of the speaker01:14
shaunoyou can get pretty damned close tho01:14
ali1234otherwise it will always have to wait until they finish speaking to get the necessary context01:14
shaunolike the translators you see babbling away at the UN01:15
shaunoI'd rather a sentence or two of lag, than be the stereotypical englishman stood there going "sorry?"01:15
shaunosay it again, a bit slower, and a bit more .. english?01:16
HazRPGany translation, is better than no translation...01:16
shaunoor excitedly yelling out 'si' at the end of a sentence because you remember that one :)01:16
hamitroneasier if everyone just spoke English01:16
hamitronI never leave England anyway01:17
shaunoI had fantastic fun trying to buy train tickets in spain, with a total vocabulary of four words.  the name of the city I was trying to get to, 'yes', 'monkey' and 'big chicken'01:17
shaunoa translation via a 3yo with an etchasketch would have done better than I did01:18
hamitronlesson to be learnt... learn the language of where you go01:18
shauno(on the upside, I apparently bought first-class tickets)01:19
hamitronnice :D01:19
shaunodidn't want first class tickets, but we got there01:19
hamitronin style too ;)01:19
shaunostrange country tho.  I thought the highspeed trains were rather snazzy.  and proceeded to receive a telling-off for trying to take a picture of one01:20
shaunotourist, but I can see how easily it's lost in translation :(01:20
screen-xshauno: mono madrid pollo sí grandes, I'm not sure why they didnt understand you.01:21
directhexel pollo diablo!01:21
shaunosee, that reads like something my brother would come up with.01:21
shauno"oi, monkey!"01:21
shaunoan evil chicken?01:21
shaunopolo grande is from a warlock quest in WoW :/01:22
shaunosi you learnt from manuel01:22
shaunoand monkey is obviously the first non-curse word you want to learn in any language01:22
shaunothing is, I'd love to learn a useful language.  but we don't go to the same country repeatedly.01:24
shaunoeurope has so damned many of them, and they're all much of muchness as far as value goes01:24
hamitronI wouldn't mind learning German01:25
shaunodutch drives me nuts because if you can get them to talk slow enough, it almost sounds like old-school english01:25
shaunoand then they transcribe this to paper in a manner which completely hides this01:25
hamitroncome across a few engineering reports in German I wanted to read01:25
hamitronI need sleep01:26
shaunoicelandic is the same.  it sounds like english, the same way rural geordie sounds like english.  and then loses it when they write it down01:26
hamitronlaters o/01:27
HazRPGshauno: haha, love the 4 words you knew in spanish01:28
shaunodutch is proper nuts tho.  like the word 'free', as in 'smoke-free'.  is pronounced, as near as makes no difference, as 'free'.  and then written as something like vrij, just to confuse me01:29
dutchiethat makes sense to me01:29
dutchienot being even slightly dutch :)01:30
HazRPGI can just imagine you saying "mono, mono, train to <place>... pollo grande!"01:30
shaunohaz, much less amusing than that01:30
shaunoI just kept repeating zaragoza, si? and adding more money until he shut up and gave me tickets01:30
screen-xshauno: good tactic :)01:31
HazRPGnice one01:31
shaunoit was hugely embarassing to be reduced to a drooling idiot01:31
HazRPGI always make it habit to translate some phrases into my drafts on my phone (or a notepad)... and just say them out as best as I can :)01:31
shaunoamsterdam to paris was fantastic.  the lady at centraal spoke english better than most english I know :)01:31
HazRPGsee this is why I always feel bad for people who try to speak english but can't get their message across and sounding stupid at the same time... because I know what its like to be on the other end of it01:33
shaunothat was the first time I ever took a train across a border  (discounting scotland).  I was expecting major hassle.01:33
shaunowhen she answered "what time?" I coulda hugged her01:33
HazRPGI can speak arabic pretty well, but when trying to have a normal grown-up conversation - I must sound like a 6 year old01:33
HazRPGshauno: :P01:34
HazRPGI swear my family in egypt must think I'm thick as pig shit lol01:34
shaunonah, "the slow one" is just a pet name01:35
shaunoI think what changed my mind on languages was seeing the italians01:36
shaunomost italians over 35-40 I came across, treat italian the same we do english.  "no, I'll speak my language and you'll learn it"01:36
HazRPGthey'll say something like "I just saw something on the news, it was great..." and continue to quote from the news... and all I understood from it were "government ... price ... people ... angry ... street ... money ..."01:36
shaunowhich I found incredibly obnoxious, until I realised they were doing exactly the same to me, as we stereotypically do to foreigners01:37
HazRPGto which I always say "oh that sounds interesting", and then they shout at me for agreeing with it >_<01:37
HazRPGheh, yeah I know what you mean01:37
HazRPGalthough the first thing I always do before/while there is buy a language book to at least sound like I know what they're talking about01:38
shaunoI don't :/01:38
HazRPGbest one was the tagalog book I bought01:39
shaunoI try to pull the language apart and figure out how it devolves back into PIE01:39
shaunoit keeps my brain wonderfully entertained, but makes me completely useless01:39
HazRPGbecause it had phrases you should say, phrases they'll probably respond with, and the best way to answer those ... fantastic book!01:39
HazRPGhehe :p01:40
shauno(it's also the best evidence I have that finns are aliens)01:40
HazRPGhaha do too01:40
HazRPGdon't know where I got too from tell >_<01:40
shaunotheir language is just insane01:40
HazRPGdoesn't devolve back to PIE?01:41
shaunoit doesn't seem to compare to anything, at all01:41
shaunomost closely hungarian, but that's because they went 'n beat them around the head a few times.01:41
shaunobut after that .. it's a black sheep01:41
HazRPGhmm, I always found some african languages amuse me... with the clicks they have01:42
shaunoyou can atleast see that they've taken a completely different path tho01:42
shaunolike most the asian languages sound somewhat similar.  european divvies up into germanic/romantic/slavic/nordic, but they all share common roots01:43
HazRPGI would love to meet the first person who decided to talk words... would amuse me no ends01:43
shaunoafrican languages don't sound anymore european than asian ones.  which makes total sense01:43
HazRPGI guess01:44
shaunobut having finnish stuck up there sounding like no other european root is insane01:44
shaunoif someone came up with a plausible theory that aliens put them there to keep russia out, I'd probably believe it.01:45
shaunonot saying it's a bad thing, just fascinating01:46
shaunothe same way finding huge rocks in the middle of nowhere must have been before they had any theory behind glaciers at all01:46
HazRPGtagalog: oo (pronounced oh-oh), means yes01:47
HazRPGthat confused me01:47
HazRPGand hindi means no01:47
shaunoinfact, that's a very good way to describe it.  their language feels like a boulder that's been dropped hundreds of miles from home.  but I have no idea what the glacier is analogous to01:48
HazRPGand mabuti (ma-boot-tay) is: fine01:48
shaunoeasy there tiger01:48
HazRPGjust some odd words I remember from my trip to the philippines01:48
HazRPGevery time I heard "mabuti" from lasses... I kept thinking they were saying "does my ass look big in this?"01:49
shaunoI'm meant to be spending 6-8 weeks in thailand at some stage in the next year or two.  dreading that from a language point of view01:49
shauno(nowhere near a city either, so it's tough to make assumptions)01:50
shaunomy mandarin is pretty much limited to "excuse me, do you speak english"01:51
shaunoand that's the closest to any asian language I've touched at all01:51
HazRPGhehe, thai sounds awesome though01:52
HazRPGhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WotlKEogxm4 <== this might come in handy for you01:52
shaunoand that's only because we've got a customer in wuhan, who tends to answer the phone with a torrent of noise01:53
HazRPGapparently no, if you're a man... is "mai krab" and sounds like your saying "mine craft"01:53
HazRPGso you now know how to say no ;)01:54
shaunothat was a fun one.  china doesn't directly have a 'yes' and 'no'01:54
HazRPGcos I'm sure that'll stick easily in your mind :P01:54
HazRPGyeah I know, its random01:54
shaunodo you ... received I do, or I do not01:54
HazRPGthere's an african language, can't remember which, that doesn't have a translation for the word "depression" because they don't understand the concept of it ... which makes you really think01:55
shaunovery rarely a straight shi / bu shi  (yes or  not yes)01:55
shaunothere is no no.  there's a negative yes   lol01:56
HazRPGheh, its not shocking though, in egypt and in saudi - most will respond "inshallah" which basically means "god willing" but translates more like "maybe..." in its usage01:56
shaunothe irish do that, sorta01:57
shaunobut then the english do, it's just devolved01:57
HazRPGyeah I've noticed :p01:57
HazRPGwhat the use of the word "god willing"01:57
shaunonot that one, but I'm pretty sure that's where goodbye comes from01:57
ali1234"all being well"01:58
shauno1590s, from godbwye (1570s), itself a contraction of God be with ye (late 14c.),01:58
ali1234as in "i'll see you next week, all being well"01:58
shaunoI was thinking more directly pious01:59
HazRPGlanguage is a funny thing ain't it01:59
shaunoas the irish have a 'dia duit' is a format greeting, and I don't know of a non-religious equivalent02:00
ali1234americans use "god willing" in exactly that way too02:00
ali1234maybe not quite the same02:00
shaunogoodbye being 'god be with ye' immediately sounds like something that'd translate into arabic very easily02:01
HazRPGwe have "masalama" in egypt, which just means bye02:02
HazRPGwell more goodbye I guess02:03
HazRPGhowever if you know they're muslim, then either masalama or "selam wa lakum" is used02:04
HazRPGthe last one means "May god grant you peace"02:04
HazRPGI think...02:04
HazRPGah wait, my mistake its "Peace be upon you"02:05
shaunolanguage is funny.  and I maintain english is the funniest :)02:07
shaunowhat's the difference between a ship and a boat?02:11
HazRPGand the reply is basically "may Allah's blessings be upon you" which is "wa alaykumu s-salamu wa rahmatu l-lah wa barakatuh" or shorted as "wa alaykum wa s-salam"02:11
HazRPGI find arabic is the funniest (p.s. the size?)02:11
shaunoor dirt and soil02:11
shaunodirt's germanic and soil latin/old french, but .. why we use them both ?02:11
HazRPGin arabic, "el noor atah" means that the power got cut (blackout, etc)... proper translation is "the lights been cut"02:11
HazRPGdirt is generic isn't it?02:11
HazRPGsoil is specific02:11
shaunoI'd say lights cut is pretty direct from black out02:11
HazRPGsoil is a type of dirt, however dirt can be anything02:11
shaunoso ship and boat?02:11
HazRPGboat is small, and ship is usually big02:11
shaunothey're just skip and bateau02:11
HazRPGyeah but even using blackout sounds funny02:11
HazRPGthere isn't a proper way to say power cut or power surge in arabic I don't think02:11
ali1234yacht, skiff, coracle, barge...02:12
shaunobarge is via greek02:12
HazRPGhowever boat can use used as generic too, and ship is also specific now that you say those02:13
HazRPGyacht, barge are types of boats...02:13
shaunoyacht has to be germanic, skiff I'd guess norse again02:13
HazRPGnot sure what the other two are  but I'd say they were boats too :P02:13
ali1234skiff is germanic same as ship02:13
shaunoreally?  most places we get a the sk- were norse02:14
HazRPGeasiest way to amuse an egyptian... pull them about the "el noor atah", I managed to get them laughing for hours over it02:14
shaunoOE ship was norse skip, so we ended up with skipper02:14
shaunoand kept skip for something that's still vaguely boat shaped.  but don't have a shipper in charge of a ship.  or a skipper in a skip, for that matter02:15
HazRPGI thought a skip was for putting trash in :/02:15
shaunobelieve that was also the skirt/shirt deviation when it would have originally been a gown-length tunic type deal02:16
shaunoshall have to figure out how exactly I'd phrase this to google to try prove I'm not nuts :)02:17
shaunothat second link has Old English scip (“small craft, boat”)02:21
shaunoI swear it's in one of grimm's consonant shifts, but I get completely thrown off by the characters they use02:22
HazRPGthis is the best I could find for clothing over the years: http://blog.teacollection.com/images/history-of-childrens-clothing.jpg02:22
shaunohttp://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/skipper   has From Middle Dutch scipper, from scip. Compare German Schiff, Schipp, Old Norse skip; confer ship, skiff.02:22
shaunoso a skep may have been a basket, but a skip was a ship02:23
shaunoaye, http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/skirt#English is a parallel formation from Old Norse02:23
ali1234same thing02:23
shaunoI don't follow02:24
ali1234ship and shirt are germanic, skip and skirt are from norse02:24
shaunoand that's not what I said 10 minutes ago ?02:25
shaunothe fun being that english just adopts every word it runs into too often, and finds an excuse to keep it02:26
ali1234best way to do it02:26
ali1234it beats inventing a new word just so you can keep the "purity" of your language or something02:27
shaunoso where the germans, if they need a more precise term, just start sticking more words together until they've got one02:27
shaunowe find one that's close enough, in whatever countries we're in contact with at the time, and borrow theirs02:27
shauno(I do believe loanword is a loanword, which is why it's contraction is german "bolt them all together" style rather than hyphenated)02:28
HazRPGshauno: oh, just remember a Thai word one of my friends taught me years ago! "Cop Coon Cup" means thank you02:28
ali1234i thought it *was* hyphenated02:28
shaunoit's not :)02:29
ali1234i think "alot" will become a word soon :)02:29
shaunohttp://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/loanword   it's lehnwort02:30
shaunothey put a space in it as an alternate, I don't come across it used like that.  and never loan-word02:31
shaunoeven tho osx's spellchecker is fine with loan-word, apparently :/02:31
HazRPGshauno: Arabians don't even bother trying to make it sound more arabic, they're just content with keeping the word as-is as long as the letters are available in their language02:32
shaunothat always bothers me to listen to02:33
shaunowhen you hear the welsh throw words like 'radio' into a sentence02:33
shaunoit's like they spit the marbles out for half a breath, and just throw that one intelligible chunk at you02:34
shaunothe irony of course being that I believe welsh is the remains of what the britons spoke before the romans, yet it's one of the least intelligible languages to me02:35
HazRPGe.g. english->arabic (also french); gear -> vitesse, clutch -> debrayage,02:35
shaunois that not directly from colonial periods?02:36
HazRPGyeah, but there wasn't a car in Egypt before that02:36
HazRPG(I don't think)02:36
shaunoyou can have gears without cars :)02:37
shaunobut I'd expect that's the period version of computer terms going largely untranslated02:37
HazRPGah sorry I mean gearbox02:37
shaunoa friend at work was helping me buy amiga parts from a polish website02:38
shaunomost the terms look just like english, but for the few words that pre-existed computers02:38
HazRPG"harda" means hard drive02:38
HazRPG"cee-dee room" -> CD-Rom02:39
shaunoI think memory and keyboard were the two that stood out  (they used typewriter, or a variation of, for their translation of keyboard)02:39
shaunobut other words looked like they just tacked a -y on the end to fit their grammar02:39
HazRPGI bet ya, I could say arabic words, and you'd know what they were02:39
ali1234russian does that too (tack on an ending i mean)02:40
HazRPGsometimes a starting letter02:40
shaunoyeah.  he tried to explain how their sentence structure works.  I couldn't get my head around it02:40
ali1234like discotech -> diskoteka02:40
HazRPGlike debrayage02:40
shaunolike we mutate a verb to fit it's tense.  they do it to almost everything, and for more reasons, as far as I can tell02:41
HazRPGgoogle translate tells me the french version is "embrayage"02:41
ali1234english does all that stuff too, it's just that the rules are completely random in english so nobody actually learns about it02:41
HazRPGI know in arabic, they've also created 2 new letters over recent years, to account for the english letters "p" and "v"02:42
shaunowe don't tend to mutate nouns so much02:42
HazRPGsince the closest they had was "b" and "f" respectively02:42
HazRPGthe arabic p and v amuse me, because the letters basically just add another two dots to the original letter02:44
shaunothere we go.  komputery.  laptopy.  monitory.  technical terms seem to survive the language they were taught in02:44
shauno(except in the norman case, where I believe it was intentionally forced)02:45
HazRPGhazard a guess what "benzene" is in english ;)02:45
HazRPGgasoline or petrol usually :p02:46
shaunomost our words for law, governance, etc are from the normans.  that wasn't an accident tho02:46
shaunothat said, I'm not sure what the equivalents would be pre-norman02:48
HazRPGwhat word for example?02:48
shaunowell, government, parliament, etc02:48
shaunojustice doesn't sound very germanic02:49
shaunoI think 'law' itself is pre-roman, but I can't think of many words deeper into the process that are02:50
HazRPGarabic for government is "hakuma" or "al-kakuma"02:51
HazRPGthey like to use "al" in everything that's said by itself02:51
HazRPGal = the02:51
HazRPGmainly for things that don't have a male or female way of saying it02:51
HazRPGsince they don't have a "it" in arabic02:51
HazRPGyou can't say "it is a dog"02:52
shaunothat's an entire concept I've never got my head around02:52
HazRPGusually its "he is a dog"02:52
shaunoI can understand in the case of a dog; it's still useful to have an 'indeterminate', but gender makes sense02:53
HazRPGtrust me, I've been living with arabic in my head for years... and I still don't get it02:53
ali1234what if you want to say "this is a dog"02:53
HazRPGI get funny looks when I say things wrong...02:53
shaunobut when you find languages (and you don't have to look far) that have a gender for things that ... have no gender02:53
ali1234or like "this one"02:53
ali1234this vs that02:54
shaunoI should be asleep :/02:54
HazRPGali1234: "da kalb" (egyptian arabic) or more traditionally "hatha kalb" (used in all arab countries)02:54
HazRPGbut kalb is male02:54
HazRPGkalba is female02:54
HazRPGusually if it has no gender (objects) its male02:55
shaunoI imagine when we get gender wrong, we sound as silly as they do when they say 'runned'.  and we can't quite explain to them why some verbs are strong either02:55
shaunodoesn't mean it's something my head's gonna grok at 3am02:55
HazRPGhowever... in arabic is more depends on who's saying it - not the actual thing your talking about02:55
shaunonow that I think about it, I think bed is a sensible option.  I only got up because I got a low disk sms from my vps02:57
HazRPGe.g. "howa da" is for a guy saying "this one" but for a lass it would be "heya da"02:57
shaunoand that was nearly 4 hours ago now :(02:57
HazRPG"da" would be "this"02:57
HazRPGI guess...02:57
shaunomakes sense.  it's the same in orcish :p02:57
shaunocome on squishy, I know you played dat game too02:58
HazRPGcalling me squishy now?? lol02:58
shaunowell if you didn't get orcish immediately, I peg you for alliance, so yes :)02:59
HazRPGyeah I've played it, but never really paid much attention to the languages02:59
HazRPGalways mage... so squishy makes sense in that sense... but what alliance!? No... for the horde!03:00
HazRPGalliance was always filled with kids when I first started - plus the horde always looked better03:00
* HazRPG was undead on release date03:00
HazRPGI've only just played that link for treasure island from earlier T_T03:02
HazRPGel pollo diablo03:03
HazRPGhmm, disturbing!03:04
HazRPGoh, that last comment was unrelated03:04
HazRPGapparently sony just won a subpoena for GeoHotz's paypal records03:04
HazRPGnews from about 3hrs ago03:04
HazRPGapparently they're allowed to view his history to see if he has enough ties to northern california... that way they can pick where he gets sued - apparently...03:06
shaunofun stuff03:06
HazRPGI'm sure it was a few months back when sony got rights to check his site's IP log for similar - why do they need his PayPal records too :/03:06
shaunoso they can paper-trail more victims03:07
shaunovisiting his website is a lot more denyable03:07
shaunoit could have been anyone.  you didn't have a password on your wifi, right?03:07
shaunobut if they can follow the money, you're screwed03:08
HazRPGah but the money was only recently opened up for him to get more attorneys03:08
ali1234it's not about finding more people to sue (which is trivial anyway)03:08
HazRPGdo go on03:08
ali1234it's about establishing that he made his work available in CA03:09
HazRPGdon't see how that is relevant though :S03:09
HazRPGit was on the internet... anyone could (would) have seen it03:10
ali1234well duh03:10
shaunounless there's a law in california which works more to their favor than local03:10
shaunoatleast in the US, internet purchases take place in the buyer's state.  I know that from taxes03:11
HazRPGI wish cases like this would go through under European courts...03:11
HazRPGunder European law03:11
HazRPGwould be more interesting to see the outcome03:11
shaunoif you buy from someone out of state, you don't pay sales tax at the point of purchase; you owe it on your state taxes when you file03:12
shaunoso the actual purchase occured where the buyer is; so that's the state the taxes are paid to.  and in this case, the state the law was (allegedly) broken in03:13
ali1234groklaw is actually covering this stuff now that sco is mostly over03:13
HazRPGwhat's SCO?03:14
shaunoit keeps consumer complaints as a matter for local authorities that way too; otherwise they'd be intra-state, so federal wire fraud03:14
ali1234HazRPG: a company that tried to sue everyone who used linux for 1 MILLION DOLLARS03:15
shaunothat was kinda funny :)03:16
HazRPGwoah, have I missed out on some interesting news here recently?!03:16
shaunothat wasn't recent03:16
ali1234it was like 10 years ago03:16
HazRPGoh wait03:16
HazRPGI think I heard something about that, now that you mention it03:17
ali1234because it was rich people vs rich people it took an extremely long time for the case to get anywhere03:17
shaunothe short version, is that someone who thought they owned some rights to unix, tried to push their own linux.  realised they weren't making any money off it.03:17
shaunoso they went back to trying to push their own unix, realised they weren't making any money off that either, and went nuts03:17
HazRPG*rolls eyes*03:18
shaunoand spent the better part of a decade dying slowly on various courtroom floors03:18
=== Craig_Dem_ is now known as Craig_Dem
shaunoon the other hand, they did license 'ancient unix' sources under an 'enthusiast' license somewhere down the line, so it wasn't all bad03:19
HazRPGah see this is why they're doing it :/03:20
shaunonah, they just crapped themselves when they realised that linux was beating traditional unix in just about every area you could think of03:20
HazRPGthey're trying to see if geohotz is getting a lot of backing from people in California, so that he can be trialled in San Francisco's court room03:20
HazRPGwhich is apparently half-hr drive away from Sony HQ03:21
shaunoseriously, travel expenses are the least of their legal bill03:21
shaunogoogle california trade secrets, there has to be something there that's worth more than his home state03:21
shaunough, trade secrets03:21
shaunoyou look at the legal costs in any of these things, and tell me a couple of flights and a hotel room or three would make a noticeable difference to the bill03:23
HazRPGI guess03:23
HazRPGcould be that San Francisco has better rules in sony's favour though03:24
shaunoyou should read into the sco thing some time tho.  it's pretty damned funny03:25
shaunoif you had to set the whole thing in a bar; pasty-faced nerd, linux wanders into a bar one day, and drink's SCO's pint.03:25
shaunoSCO jumps up in a fit of rage, finds the biggest guy in the bar (ibm), and takes a swing03:26
shaunowhen he stood up and announced he was going to sue ibm, the board should have shot him in the face.  the company would be in better shape today.03:28
shaunoor in irc terms03:29
shauno<sco>  you stole my unix!03:29
shauno<ibm> it's not your unix.  it's novells.03:29
shauno<sco> novell: wtf? you sold me unix!03:30
shauno<novell>  TROLOLOLOLO03:30
shaunoanyhow.  'night03:30
HazRPGI'm reading this: http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20110311112544990 seems interesting03:32
HazRPGshauno: and I shall bid you a dew03:32
HazRPGgoodnight and all that stuff :)03:32
shauno*adieu.  and yes that's deus again03:38
HazRPGI couldn't remember the spelling, so went with what I wrote instead03:42
HazRPGyou know... I'm shocked that no one has mentioned that new games force you to update or not be able to play the game...03:54
=== artv61_ is now known as artv61
ali1234new games?03:58
ali1234i only play old games03:58
ali1234and minecraft03:58
HazRPGon the playstation 3 and also on the PSP, when you buy a new game... the latest firmware (as of pressing, or as of what the game was coded to run off, or whatever sony said must be used - whichever comes first) has to be installed before you can play04:00
ali1234i would never buy a new console04:00
ali1234i only buy old gen04:00
HazRPGsaying that the x360 is the same04:00
ali1234and the wii04:00
HazRPGI can understand that04:01
HazRPGbut my point is, why haven't they used this against sony?04:01
ali1234they have04:01
ali1234there is a class action against them04:01
ali1234see groklaw04:01
HazRPGI am :P04:01
HazRPGas linked above (what I'm reading now)04:01
ali1234that's basically the the whole argument against them04:02
HazRPGso far, no mention of firmware being forced from new games, only mentions of updates that have been downloaded04:02
HazRPGwhich you need, if you want to use PSN04:02
ali1234"Users who downloaded Update 3.21 had a core advertised feature removed from       their system. Users who did not download Update 3.21 lost other core advertised features. "04:02
ali1234you are not forced to download the update04:03
ali1234but you lose functionality whether you do or do not04:03
ali1234that's the argument04:03
HazRPGtrue... but if they used the new games thing too in their argument, it would give them a stronger backing04:03
HazRPGsince if one was to pick not using PSN, and keep OtherOS04:03
HazRPGand was happy or fine with that... what if they wanted a new game, they couldn't04:04
ali1234yes, people in the class action have done that04:04
HazRPGI suppose I should keep reading then :P04:04
ali1234inability to play new games is the feature you lose if you choose not to update04:04
HazRPGwhen you word it like that...04:05
HazRPGunrelated... I'm hungry again :/04:05
ballI think I need a UPS or two.04:13
ball...and a pie.04:14
knightwisemorning everyone07:06
knightwisehope all of you are doing ok ?07:06
HazRPGmorning squire, how's it going?07:21
knightwisehey HazRPG07:36
knightwisedoing fine07:36
HazRPGgdgd :)07:36
screen-xmorning :)07:37
* screen-x wonders if HazRPG sleeps at all07:38
HazRPGfrom time to time :P07:38
knightwisehey screen-x07:39
knightwiseaha :) I mananged to get TWIDGE working again :)07:39
screen-xmorning knightwise :)07:40
knightwiseAll i need to find out now is how to script it so i can post some podcast related tweets every x hours07:41
knightwiseyep ,07:41
knightwisecli twitter client07:41
knightwiseinteresting little program , so its always nice to use that :)07:41
hoovergood mornin07:42
knightwisehello hoover07:43
knightwisehow are you today07:43
knightwisei have a small question07:48
knightwisethe updates by twidge are done with the "twidge update" command07:48
knightwiseyou type twidge update07:48
knightwisehit enter07:48
knightwiseenter your text07:48
knightwiseand hit enter again07:49
knightwisebut how do i script that ? i can script the command twidge update07:49
knightwisebut how to i script the "hard returns ?"07:49
screen-xknightwise: can twidge take the update text as an argument or on stdin?07:58
knightwisenot as an argument i guess08:01
knightwiseyou need to type , twidge update08:01
knightwisethen hit enter08:01
knightwiseen then you get a blank line to enter text08:01
knightwisehit enter again and it gets updated08:01
screen-xknightwise: try giving it the text on stdin, eg echo "foo" |twidge update08:03
screen-xif it doesn't like that, you can either hack it so that it does ;-) or use expect08:04
knightwisechecking my twitterfeed now ,08:05
knightwisei think that worked08:05
knightwiseYES !08:05
knightwiseAaawesome :)08:05
* knightwise can now script some podcast promo tweets to run while he is sleeping08:06
knightwisehey czajkowski good to see you again08:14
knightwisehey DJones08:17
DJonesHi knightwise czajkowski screen-x08:17
AlanBelltop o' the morning to ya czajkowski08:26
AlanBelltoday being "talk like a leprechaun day"08:26
knightwiseHey AlanBell08:27
knightwisehow do leprechauns talk ?08:27
knightwiseTopadamorninntoya ?08:27
knightwiseall they yap about all day are pots of gold anyway08:33
* screen-x has lost his wallet :(08:35
screen-xbring on NFC payments08:35
MartijnVdSscreen-x: with a chip implanted in your finger?08:36
screen-xMartijnVdS: or phone, either would work :p08:36
MartijnVdSuntil you lost your phone08:36
MartijnVdSit'd have to be a bad day to lose your finger08:36
screen-xMartijnVdS: yah, but my phone tells me where it is..08:36
czajkowskioh dear08:37
MooDoowell thanks to the podcast i now know how to say czajkowski :)08:38
screen-xMooDoo: seezedtab?08:39
MooDooscreen-x: yay!08:39
knightwisemorning MooDoo08:43
nigelbAlanBell: poke?08:52
MooDooknightwise: morning08:52
knightwisehey MooDoo how are you doing today08:55
AlanBello/ nigelb08:56
nigelbAlanBell: PM? :)08:56
AlanBellany time08:56
MooDooknightwise: i'm not bad thank, i'm on bacon coffee and head ache tabs :)08:57
knightwiseooh , thats a killer combo,08:59
MooDooknightwise: might keep me awake this morning :)08:59
knightwisei'm on donuts , mint tea and a citrix session to my workplace08:59
MartijnVdSknightwise: awww08:59
knightwisehey MartijnVdS08:59
knightwiseThank god for irssi, centerim, twidge and alpine in a command line windows09:00
* knightwise wished byobu also split the windows vertically instead of only horizontally09:02
knightwisehey diplo09:02
MartijnVdSknightwise: Ctrl+A |09:03
screen-xknightwise: it does :)09:03
screen-xscreen has had vsplits for a while now09:03
knightwisehuzza !09:03
knightwisethanx ! :) hadn't googled it properly either09:05
kazadepodcast! \o/09:07
knightwiseHuzza (again)09:08
knightwisePs : I featured a little review of the podcast in my latest article09:08
* bigcalm raises the white flag. Is it the weekend yet?09:08
knightwiseI did a review of my opml file09:08
knightwisebigcalm: probably need to sync to a different timeserver09:08
bigcalmJust put the podcast on. Did popey say it was 2010?09:12
knightwisehahaah no way !09:12
* bigcalm chuckles09:12
* MooDoo goes and listens to the podcast to check09:14
knightwiseI just ordered Gpodder to download it09:14
MooDooyes he did, he says 2010 :) lol09:14
bigcalmOh good :)09:15
MooDoopopey: it's 2011 :p09:15
* DJones checks his phone & notes that Listen has automatically downloaded it overnight09:15
knightwiseDJones: i never managed to "understand" google listen09:15
knightwiseI never know if it has downloaded the episode or is streaming it09:15
DJonesknightwise: I just added it as a subscription via the web interface09:16
* knightwise uses gpodder.org or just gpo subscribe <RSSfeedofthepodcast>09:16
DJonesknightwise: On mine, if its downloaded, it just plays when requested, otherwise it gave me a warning about whether I wanted to play the streamed version09:18
MooDoobigcalm: no do i comment about it on the podcast.ubuntu-uk.org page ;)09:18
knightwiseDJones: good idea , might look into that for my wifes Android phone. She likes trancy tune podcasts09:19
knightwiseso that way she"'ll have a self charging mp3player09:19
DJonesknightwise: The only other thing I set was so that it only downloaded over wifi when available09:20
knightwiseah , that thus prevents it from streaming ver gprs too ?09:21
DJonesno, I think if you choose to listen to a stream, thats fine, but rather than downloading a 60Mb podcast & using a big chunk of the bandwidth, it just does the download to teh device via wifi09:23
knightwiseok , i'll take a look at it09:24
knightwisedid a review on the way i podcatch right now in the last episode of the podcast (made a pdf howto)09:24
knightwisethe entire script that i made with the help of you guyz is also in there09:25
selinuxiumMonring all   o/09:32
knightwisehahaha :) Watch + twidge lsrecent = command line twitter client !09:36
knightwisewatch -b -n 60 twidge lsrecent09:37
shaunodidn't realise screen did vertical splits.  irssi & mutt sit next to each other so much nicer that way09:38
knightwisewe learn something new every day :)09:42
AlanBelltwidge seems broken09:53
MooDoomorning czajkowski great podcast :)09:54
czajkowskiheh cheers.09:54
knightwiseczajkowski: you're ON the podcast ?09:54
knightwiseNice !09:54
czajkowskijust on the latest one. they were stuck on missing a laura09:55
AlanBellknightwise: they had to bring out the emergency replacement Laura09:55
MooDooczajkowski: only one thing, it's 2011 not 2010 :p09:55
DJonesI saw a tweet from laura saying she was at Bank Quay Station in Warrington yesterday afternoon, living about 20 minutes away from there, I can say that people have gone there and never been seen or heard of again09:57
knightwiseAlanBell: :) Lol ERL ! thats a nice title10:03
* AlanBell fixors twidge10:04
knightwiseAlanBell: its a cool program :) some combinations with echo and watch commands and you can build a complete automatic twitter client10:05
mungojerryknightwise: or put tweets into conky output?10:05
directhexblarg :(10:06
knightwisewould be a great idea10:06
mungojerrynow i need to find out how to send nagios alerts as tweets10:07
knightwiseecho "(nagios output)" | twidge update10:08
mungojerryoh really?10:08
mungojerrysounds a bit too eay10:08
knightwisewell, how about making the nagios output a variable and using backticks ?10:09
* knightwise must dash to work10:09
bigcalmIn WordPress, how do you make a page the homepage rather than the blog?10:16
JamesTaitHappy St Patrick's Day, everyone! :D10:18
bigcalmNever mind, found it10:19
* TheOpenSourcerer prepares to go to London for a very traditional St. Paddy's Day curry with some old mates. One is in fact Irish.10:24
TheOpenSourcererselinuxium: I'll piing you mid-late afternoon. If I forget, don't be shy and give me bell.10:25
bigcalmpopey: all of the images in the twitter feed are broken on the ubuntu-uk.co.uk site10:32
directhexamazon storage is broken, if that's relevant10:35
=== madlabuk is now known as Tallscreen
bigcalmAnd there are stlying issues on the podcast site :)10:37
=== madlabuk is now known as Tallscreen
* BigRedS wishes FTP would just go away10:42
bigcalmDon't rub eyes while eating wasbi peas :(10:43
directhexdon't rub wasabi peas when eating eyes10:43
directhexBigRedS,  http://mywiki.wooledge.org/FtpMustDie ?10:44
shaunoI thought it pretty much had.  only ever see it used for uploading fw to embedded devices10:46
BigRedSdirecthex: pretty much :)10:48
BigRedSshauno: lots of website-making-people seem to demand it10:48
BigRedSThey dislike scp, but don't mind so much if you call it sftp10:48
selinuxiumHi BigRedS10:51
BigRedSg'morning selinuxium!10:53
mungojerrydirecthex: were you taling about redmine yesterday or was it someone else10:54
directhexi was10:54
mungojerryi been using it for 3-4 years10:54
mungojerryi actually use it as a helpdesk system10:55
mungojerrythe UI is lovely10:55
directhexi am prepared to look past the Ruby on Rails evilness, to the fact that it's freaking awesome compared to trac10:55
directhexthe privilege separation appears to work perfectly, so we can have a "base" project, with "client1" and "client2" subprojects - and members of client1 will never see any leakage10:55
directhexe.g. they can put a blocker on bugs in base, but client2 members will never see that10:56
directhexabsolutely perfect for us10:56
mungojerryi have a few issues outstanding with it, but it's almost perfect for me10:56
mungojerryi'd like to change the author of a ticket etc.10:57
directhexalso, the project manglement parts appear like extra delicious candy for us10:57
mungojerryi also wrote some extra stuff to draw pretty graphs based on mysql queries10:57
dogmatic69ive been trying to follow this tutorial on aws stuff http://tinyurl.com/yct4oua but having a prob with this command, it does not seem to work "nohup dd if=/dev/sda1 of=/dev/sdh &" ... output http://bin.cakephp.org/view/148665090310:57
BigRedSdogmatic69: what's in nohup.out?10:58
dogmatic69i cant find that10:58
directhexmungojerry, we're just testing with sqlite for now. can always move to postgres later10:59
dogmatic69BigRedS: found it :) looks like it did work at some point.10:59
BigRedSdogmatic69: aha! so no problems then?11:01
nacolI am having problem downloading backtrack11:01
selinuxiumBigRedS, How's things?11:01
nacoli was told file was not found on server after downloading 1514MB11:02
nacolPLEASE HELP11:02
Myrttitry ubuntu instead?11:02
nacoli am using ubuntu now but i want backtrack too11:03
BigRedSselinuxium: pretty good! Still pretty pleased with the whole using-debian-all-day thing going on here :)11:03
BigRedShow're you?11:03
nacolMyrtti, i want backtrack too11:03
DJonesnacol: There is a #backtrack-linux they may be able to help you, that seems like the main support channel for backtrack11:03
nacoli dont understand am a newbie11:04
DJonesnacol: It sounds like there's been a problem with the Backtrack server though & the file you were downloading is no longer available11:04
nacolDjones, what do i do11:04
nacolplease help11:05
DJonesnacol: If you join the #backtrack-linux channel (type /join #backtrack-linux in your irc client) they may have come across the problem and have a solution, or just try downloading the file again11:06
mungojerrynacol: maybe there's also a mirror site that might not have the problem you are experiencing?11:07
mungojerrynacol: for example, http://backtrack.linuxfreedom.com/download.html11:08
nacolthanks, i will try the mirror11:09
mungojerrynacol:  on second thought, that doesn't look like the latest version11:09
mungojerrybut there should be other mirrors , or bittorrents?11:10
nacolwhich one is the latest version11:10
mungojerryhttp://www.backtrack-linux.org/downloads/ says backtrack 4 r211:11
mungojerrythere is also a link to the torrent too11:11
nacolthat was the site I used and had that problem11:12
nacolmungojerry, are you using backtrack?11:12
mungojerrynacol: no, but i've used it before for forensics. the torrent file  is downloaded from seeders, not from the site11:15
mungojerryknoppix and backtrack are useful to have nearby on a live cd11:15
dogmatic69BigRedS: it said permission denied and then also (from another attempt looked like it worked) but /dev/sdh is empty11:16
mungojerryanaconda now needs > 512mb in SL6 :(11:20
nacolam still having problem downloading backtrack11:22
nacolplease help11:23
BigRedSnacol: what are the problems?11:23
DJonesnacol: You'll get better help if you ask #backtrack-linux that is the support channel for backtrack11:23
BigRedSand, without meaning to sound rude, what is the connection to ubuntu?11:24
nacoli download 1714 MB and there was error11:24
BigRedSIt's not that this is ubuntu-only, but here's not necessarily a place I'd expect to find a bunch of people with backtrack expertise11:24
BigRedSdogmatic69: what made the otehr attempt look like it worked?11:25
BigRedSnacol: it does sound like just a fairly common download error. Something, somewhere along your connection, failed. Most probably at backtrack's server11:26
BigRedShave you tried downloading again?11:26
mungojerrybittorrent is a better way to retrieve the file11:26
mungojerrysince you can resume the download11:27
nacolhow do i do this11:27
mungojerrydownload the small torrent file on the page11:27
AlanBellfind a .torrent file and click it, it should open in transmission11:27
nacolok thanks11:28
gordi'v somehow managed to get firefox to resume a download before, but its like a random dice roll on weather it decides to do it11:29
AlanBellprobably depends whether the server does byte range serving11:36
dogmatic69BigRedS: http://bin.cakephp.org/view/180957328511:36
dogmatic69df -h == /dev/sdh              9.9G  151M  9.2G   2% /mnt/ebsimage11:37
dogmatic69i think it is too small...11:37
brobostigonmorning everyone.11:43
DavieyI'm not convinced it's that simple.... i think often firefox gives up too easily... i mean, i use wget -c http://some-url-file all the time to continue downloads11:46
DavieyI suspect firefox would just laugh at me most of the time11:46
BigRedSdogmatic69: that would do it11:48
BigRedSI don't know dd that well, but I think if you don't specify anything else (via count=) it just stops when it runs out of either if or of11:49
dogmatic69cant eject that mount now11:49
BigRedSah yeah11:49
BigRedSthings get annoyed when you do stuff like that. partprobe *may* help11:50
dogmatic69if i just yank the drive out on aws will the main data be ok?11:50
dogmatic69just gonna bin that ebs that is mounted11:51
* brobostigon shakes fist at java for sucking ram.11:51
BigRedSdogmatic69: I've no idea with aws. Generally, though, if you're pulling the drive you were copying *to* there's no reason for breakage on teh source drive11:52
BigRedSbut the OS might complain horribly11:53
dogmatic69this is all that could be stoping the eject, i think http://bin.cakephp.org/view/113879002611:57
brobostigonanyone know how i change the way fonts are rendered in natty, ?11:58
dogmatic69BigRedS: *facepalm* i was in /mnt/ebsthingy doing the eject :D12:00
dogmatic69cd / and then it worked12:00
BigRedSdogmatic69: haha! I do that far too often12:06
ubuntuuk-planet[Chris Rowson] How to read data from a remote Windows registry using Python - http://www.justuber.com/blog/2011/03/17/how-to-read-data-from-a-remote-windows-registry-using-python/12:09
DavieySoooo... Anyone tried the Magic Mouse?12:23
bigcalmThat the one with the nipple?12:23
selinuxiumAnyone up for coming to see me gig with my Metal band 2nd April at the Camden Barfly?12:23
selinuxiumBigRedS, Ok this end.. been very stressful recently, but getting through.. :)12:25
Davieybigcalm, yes!  single nipple12:28
Davieyi think12:29
popeythe magic mouse has no nipple12:29
popeydo you mean the mighty mouse? http://store.apple.com/uk/product/MB112ZM/B12:30
gordnever quite understood why apple go for that style mouse, as opposed to one that fits the contours of your hand - i'm sure they have a reason, they aren't stupid12:31
bigcalmStyle over comfort?12:31
BigRedSI think few people genuinely think about ergonomics when they pick computery things12:32
BigRedSthey want something that looks pretty and forget there's that whole comfort thing going on12:32
BigRedSselinuxium: Ah, are you still surrounded by umoving cobol guys?12:33
selinuxiumBigRedS, indeed..12:37
mungojerryany clever yum dudes in here?12:38
mungojerryi want to list the packages of a yum group12:39
mungojerryah, yum groupinfo <group>12:40
Davieypopey, ah yes!  I did mean the magic mouse, but was looking at mighty mouse...doh12:41
* Daviey wants a mouse, a bluetooth mouse12:41
popeyi would personally not get one, I'd get the tablet thing12:44
popeyalthough i have just bought two normal mice12:44
popeyone is pink, logitech, and has a tux logo on the box :)12:44
popeythe other is black, microsoft, and does not12:45
mungojerryat least it won't get stolen if it's pink12:45
popeyit might do12:45
gordthere is only one way to decide the winner?12:45
popeyi dont care though12:45
gordman i haven't seen harry hill in years, is that still going?12:45
popeyi do like microsoft mice though12:46
gordif there is one thing that microsoft know (and arguably, there is) - its mice12:46
gordi use some random "gamer" mouse, just because it has a high DPI12:47
popeyi am going to sound stupid now.12:49
popeywhat is the 'dash' in ubuntu 11.04?12:49
mungojerryisn't that when you click the ubuntu icon?12:50
AlanBellis that the term for the thing when you click the circle of friends top left?12:50
AlanBelland get a page of useless stuff to click on12:50
mungojerrybtw try dragging one of those things somwhere like the desktop12:51
popeyi have literally no idea12:51
gordpopey, places12:53
gord... which are actually lens's now12:53
popeyhow do i get to places?12:54
gordsuper key, or click the bfb or press one of the places icons at the bottom of your launcher12:55
gordalso, alt+f2 (which is awesome if you haven't tried that yet)12:55
popeyrecordmydesktop seems broken in natty12:57
gordit was for a while for me, just hung eating up all my cpu but i used it successfully a week or so ago12:57
mungojerrywhy, when unity feels like a more tablet oriented DE, does it require MORE keyboard input than any other DE i've used12:57
popeyit doesnt seem to copy with alt-tabbing and leaves artifacts on the screen12:58
mungojerrydoes recordmydesktop use a systray icon12:58
gordpopey, oh, i'v seen that stuff when using  compiz. using force full frames?12:58
gordno idea then12:58
popeyis places configurable?12:59
popeye.g. it says 'check email' and I'd like that to go to gmail, not evolution12:59
mungojerrypopey: as an alternative, i saw someone using byzanz-record to record their desktop on natty13:00
popeyno audio too13:00
popeyi hate screencasts with no audio13:00
mungojerryok :P13:00
mungojerryhmm seem to have 2 network indicators in natty atm13:01
mungojerrypopey:  Allow recording audio with Theora video.13:02
brobostigonmungojerry: ihad that yesterday, in unity-2d. seems to have gone now in normal unity.13:02
mungojerrybrobostigon: yay :)13:02
gordpopey, if you set the preferred mail application to gmail somehow, maybe13:03
brobostigonmungojerry: mind you, i have had alot of nm-applet problems recently.13:03
mungojerryjust rebooting after a olt of updates in last 24 hrs13:04
* brobostigon goes to make a hot-toddy, he isnt feeling well.13:04
mungojerryhot toddies and chicken soup fix most known ailments13:04
brobostigonno whisky,i will have to use brandy insted.13:05
mungojerrydoes anyone find the concertina effect doesn't work?13:05
mungojerrywhen you try to expand the lower items, they disappear off screen13:05
popeyi have made my thing 32px wide13:07
popeyso i dont see the concertina effect13:07
mungojerry36px for me13:07
mungojerrypopey: try long click on an icon..what happens?13:07
popeysame as right click13:07
popeywhich says to me 'built for touch devices'13:08
mungojerrytry very long click on an icon lower in your launcher13:08
popeywhat am i supposed to be seeing?13:09
popeyyes, i get that13:09
mungojerryis that a bug or feature?13:10
popeyno idea13:10
mungojerryhard to search for in launchpad too13:10
mungojerryi think it's a bug since a long click on applications shoudl present a list of app types , but then the launcher jreks down like that13:10
mungojerrycool, there's progress on bug 717114 :)13:12
lubotu3Launchpad bug 717114 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu Natty) "[i945gm] Screen Corruption with new Xorg stack with terminal programs" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/71711413:12
popeyhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bCuSeziHHw is now my phone ringtone13:14
bigcalmI wonder if you can develop a nut allergy later in life13:16
* popey steals bigcalm's graze box13:16
bigcalmpopey: ancient forest nuts13:16
popeysame to you!13:16
bigcalmThe walnuts and almonds are fine13:16
popeywifey is allergic to almonds13:17
bigcalmThe hazels are having an adverse effect :(13:17
popeyare you asthmatic?13:17
popeyyeah, makes sense13:17
bigcalmMy lips are swelling up, fun times13:18
bigcalmI'll leave the hazels for Hayley ;)13:18
bigcalmI like the track, puts me in mind of mr ben13:18
popeyit was used on Charlie Brooker's thing13:19
bigcalmThose crazy late 70s early 80s13:19
popeyand I coudln't recognise it13:19
popeyso posted to one of those 'whats that tune' sites13:19
bigcalmI wonder if programme credits should list indcidental music used13:20
popeyhe apparently has a spotify list13:21
popeybut the link from browser to spotify is broken on linux13:21
popeyworks on osx13:22
bigcalmPut that into the spotify search bar13:23
popeyooo yay13:24
popeyunfortunately the song i wanted isnt available on spotify :)13:25
popeyloads of Syd Dale stuff is13:25
popeyi didnt realise he made "Full Flight" and "Man Friday"13:26
MezSeriously, what's the point of the sandwhich van turning up at our work with literally 1 sandwhich on it?13:27
bigcalmSomebody will buy it13:29
bigcalmLunch time I think13:29
MezNo - I mean - he knows theres at least 5 of us who buy our food from him.13:29
MezNow I've gotta go hunting for a sandwhich shop that's still open.13:30
screen-xMez: maybe the company before you on the rota where hungry today13:30
Mezscreen-x: now I'm hungry. yay.13:40
MezAnd, all the damned sandwhich shops around here shut at 1 or half 113:40
Mezand I really don't feel like going to subway or something like that.13:40
screen-xmez buy a spud and microwave it :)13:42
shaunoI have ramen for lunch :/13:44
Myrttimmmm subway13:45
mungojerrynothing gives post-food regret quite like subway13:47
mungojerryrepeats on me for 8 hrs after13:47
Myrttisubway? in comparison to pizza or hot wings...13:47
Myrttisubway is the regret free option13:48
mungojerryeven after i eat a full evening meal , i still get subway burps from lunchtime13:48
MartijnVdShmm running :)13:48
MartijnVdSMakes all options regret-free ;)13:48
* mungojerry is underweight, never regrets eating calories, but sometimes regrets for other reasons13:49
shaunoI swear I have an indestructable stomach.  there's very, very little I'll regret eating13:49
Mezshauno: me too...13:49
mungojerryit's quite annoying always  having to choose the higher calorie option , even when i don't feel like it13:49
mungojerryshauno: every irish person i've met is similar, and have a MASSIVE appetite13:50
shaunomy lunch options are mostly limited by how far I can be bothered walking.  especially on holidays13:50
BigRedSWhy can't I find the view-all-my-mail-in-plain-text option in Thunderbird?13:53
mungojerryi take probiotics to keep the stomach elfs happy, not sure if they work..feel the same about homeopathic stuff too13:53
BigRedSI suspect probiotics are better grounded in science13:53
BigRedSbut do seem to have a fair whack of exageration, too13:54
popeyI saw a doctor once who said don't even touch them, because you'd need to drink gallons of the stuff to get any useful amount of the probiotics to stay in your tummy13:55
mungojerryi have freeze dried ones...they're probably all dead already13:55
popeyhowever, conversely we always give our kids those yog thinks like actimel if they're on antibiotics, it helps a lot13:56
mungojerryantiobiotics mess me up badly13:56
* MartijnVdS hasn't been on antibiotics for ages13:56
mungojerrycouldn't leave the house the last time13:56
popeySophie gets infections, hole in her eardrum13:56
MartijnVdSpopey: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hole_(band)13:57
mungojerryMartijnVdS: every the sensitive type!13:57
popeyher ears are big, not that big13:57
brobostigonis this the same for everyone, in unity, with apps  on different workspaces, alt-tab doesnt show apps  fromother workspaces,only th same workspace?13:58
mungojerrybrobostigon: yes, i guess that's the desired functionality13:59
brobostigonmungojerry: i amused to alt-tab showing everything, from any workspace, its alittle weird, iforget some apps are there.14:00
mungojerryjust tried to zoom out to wirkspace switcher with super-e  - realised that the unity launcher now destroys any super-key shortcuts :(14:00
mungojerrythought that super-tab might do the all-workspaces but unity broke that too14:00
MartijnVdS\o/ unity14:01
DJonesHeh http://www.27bslash6.com/blockbuster.html (It is safee for work)14:02
dwatkinsDJones: nice :)14:09
DJonesdwatkins: Been looking at some of the others on the site, but some of them are a bit NSFW14:09
mungojerrydoes anyone remembre a website that showed pieces of paper that had randomly been found14:11
mungojerrysometimes they were weird shopping lists and other times surreal statements14:12
mungojerryfound it, www.foundmagazine.com probably NSFW14:22
MartijnVdSgood thing my W isn't too concerned about things being S :)14:25
popey14:00:14 < mungojerry> just tried to zoom out to wirkspace switcher with super-e  - realised that the unity launcher now destroys any super-key shortcuts :(14:30
* mungojerry tries again14:31
popeyalso super+w14:31
gordyeah its just compiz keybindings14:31
popeywhich is listed in the launcher14:31
mungojerrysorry, didn't notice there were 3 shortcuts on the lower icons14:32
mungojerrythought it was just 1-1014:32
* screen-x just had a trainwreck of a phone interview :(14:32
mungojerryscreen-x: :(14:32
mungojerryhard qu's?14:32
dutchiei should probably do something about some sort of job14:33
screen-xI had answers, I just dont think I gave them the most relevant ones..14:33
screen-xI had made loads of notes in prepartion, but nervousness does strange things..14:34
mungojerryafter a couple more interviews your recall will prob improve14:34
screen-xmungojerry: thanks..14:34
mungojerryyou never know how others fared14:35
screen-xI had prepared for them to ask how my experience/skills match each of the requirements, but I was just asked to talk about my current role while they took notes.14:38
screen-xNext time will prepare some prose!14:38
selinuxiumArrghhh!!! Seriously dumb question right now, but just realised I have never configured upstart. trying to get /etc/init.d/vmware-tools to start on reboot.. #14:38
selinuxiumsudo update-rc.d vmware-tools defaults 8014:39
selinuxiumthrows errors...14:39
mungojerryjust noticed that /var/log/messages doesn't exist on natty14:39
MartijnVdSit doesn't?!14:39
selinuxiumAny ideas?14:40
gordpopey, i just had what you seemed to experience with recordmydesktop with the gnome screenshot tool, i'd expect its a weird compiz thing14:41
selinuxiumThe Upstart page isn't very helpful... Or I am stupid... Or both..14:41
=== WillyWonka is now known as Kirrus
=== Kirrus is now known as kirrus
bicyclerepairmaney up. I graphics card and monitor are both capable of resolutions up to 1280x1024, but in the Monitors dialogue, 1024x768 is the highest one available. How can I find out what's going on?15:00
screen-xbicyclerepairman: read xorg.0.log and see why it rejected the other modes.15:01
bigcalmCheck that /etc/X11/xorg.conf isn't limiting your mode choices15:01
bicyclerepairman"Not using default mode "1280x1024" (exceeds panel dimensions)"15:03
bicyclerepairmanI *know* my panel does higher resolutions, I've seen it with my own eyes15:04
MartijnVdSyour screen is telling your graphics card it only supports up to 1024x76815:04
bicyclerepairmaneven in ubuntu, earlier in boot sequence :-)15:04
bicyclerepairmanah so then I suppose I need to delve in and do some hacking?15:04
screen-xbicyclerepairman: you could try creating an xorg.conf and only giving it one mode to choose from.15:05
MartijnVdSor removing it completely15:06
* MartijnVdS hasn't had a xorg.conf for 3 releases now15:06
screen-xMartijnVdS: I use it for twinview15:06
MartijnVdSscreen-x: ah.. I don't buy nvidia :)15:08
shaunoI used to only buy nvidia because of the predictability of their drivers.  sad to see so many troubles now :/15:09
MartijnVdSI don't buy it because of the predictible breakage of their drivers ;)15:10
mungojerryi buy intel so that i'm not tempted to play games ;)15:12
MartijnVdSmungojerry: it's getting better15:12
* bigcalm chuckles15:12
gordi use linux so that i'm not tempted to play games ;)15:12
mungojerryhttps://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-qa/2011-March/001484.html << for nvidia users15:13
mungojerrygord: also true15:22
mungojerryi tend to prefer indie games anyway..more old school the better15:22
mungojerrythats probably old age creeping in15:23
directhexi dual-boot windows because i love games15:24
mungojerrydirecthex: how old r u15:24
mungojerryif u don't mind me asking..15:24
bigcalmI have a Wii console because I hate games15:25
* mungojerry used to love games in his 20s15:25
mungojerrynow i don't have the time :(15:25
directhexmungojerry, um... 26 or 27. something like that15:25
mungojerrymy flatmate used to come home and snipe-shoot people from the multistorey car park in GTA3 to unwind15:26
mungojerrydirecthex: enjoy it while you can :)15:26
directhex27 in a couple of weeks, that's the badger15:26
mungojerrywhen i was 27 i bought the game black and white15:31
mungojerryto run on my windows machine15:31
mungojerryturned out that it would regularly cause windows to crash upon saving your game15:31
mungojerryi blame 98/ME though..win xp was not out at the time15:32
mungojerryGoogle have fixed the flash vulnerability in chrome faster than adobe15:34
directhexblack & white was fairly buggy15:37
DJonesI don't even want to think what games would have been out when I was 2715:38
=== tim_ is now known as mistertim
mungojerrydirecthex: yeah, after all the hype, i never got past level5 or so due to the insance amount of micromanagement required, and the inevitable BSOD15:40
directhexthere were only 5 levels, so you got pretty far15:40
DJonesAh, Doom was created when I was 27 :)15:40
BigRedSHah. I think I was about 915:41
mungojerrydirecthex: really? i only got to the level where my monster got tied up15:41
* mungojerry remembers to sync his mp3 player for the uupc podcast on the commute home16:30
* DJones needs a stiff drink, England won a game in the world cup after they looked to be getting battered16:36
* screen-x needs a sleep16:41
* BigRedS has a coffee16:50
MartijnVdS\o/ new Extra Credits17:02
shaunough.  'Based on your corporate access policies' blah blah blah17:04
MartijnVdSshauno: try again at home :)17:04
shaunoit's no wonder I took a nap this morning.  they've managed to make the internets pretty boring17:04
* screen-x goes home17:13
Myrttimy IRC is broken again17:50
jpdsMyrtti: Clearly not.17:51
Myrttijpds: I see you fixed it17:52
MartijnVdSpurple? not green today? :)18:16
bigcalmI use a yellow highlighter, wouldn't work too well18:16
popeybug 66408818:23
lubotu3Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: 664088 (https://launchpad.net/bugs/664088)18:23
popeycan anyone see that?18:23
MartijnVdS"Page not found"18:23
bigcalmIs it the weekend yet?!18:24
popeyTomorrow I will likely be booking the OggCamp venue.18:30
BigRedSooh! Does that mean there's a decided-upon date for it?18:30
popeythere is18:31
screen-xoooh oogcamp date :D18:36
* screen-x shakes popey till it falls out18:36
* popey drops a 318:36
* screen-x theorises18:36
MartijnVdS2038 :)18:50
MartijnVdS\o issyl019:00
issyl0MartijnVdS: :-)19:00
MartijnVdShow are things?19:00
issyl0Good thanks - and with you?19:00
* issyl0 tired and in the middle of a French essay (one of three - the other two I don't *have* to do though.)19:01
* MartijnVdS is watching Youtube videos19:01
MartijnVdSwork is exhausting :)19:01
issyl0Ah, *was*.  :-(19:03
MartijnVdSwell it's 20:00 -- not a time to be at work for me ;)19:04
issyl0MartijnVdS: Very true.19:04
* issyl0 doesn't pay attention to the time much in the evenings.19:05
DJonesissyl0: That sounds likeypical student attitude :)19:06
DJoness/likeypical/like a typical19:06
issyl0DJones: Hehe.19:06
* issyl0 isn't one for going to bed at 3 in the morning and getting up at midday.19:07
MartijnVdSDJones: hm.. that would explain HazRPG's schedule as well :)19:07
* issyl0 can't handle lie-ins.19:07
screen-xDJones: I didn't even see the error on first reading19:07
MartijnVdSissyl0: I wake up at 6 -- whether I want to or not :)19:08
* issyl0 has been waking up at half past six of her own accord for the past few days.19:08
MartijnVdSissyl0: alarmless?19:08
issyl0Madness, but I enjoy getting up that early.19:09
MartijnVdSI've been living alarmless for years now.. I only set one for special occasions (so I don't miss a flight, for example :)19:09
issyl0Ah, right.19:09
issyl0Any particular reason why you wake up so early?19:09
MartijnVdSI think it's because it's 7 hours after I tend to go to sleep :)19:10
issyl0Ah - probably!19:10
DJonesMartijnVdS: I'm about the same, I always wake between 5:30 & 6am19:11
dutchiei have been waking up at 11:30 ish all this week19:11
dutchieit is lovely19:11
dutchie(going to bed around midnight)19:12
* DJones kicks dutchie 19:12
MartijnVdSI stopped using my alarm clock when I noticed I always woke up 5-10 minutes before it was supposed to go off19:12
MartijnVdSand it stuck :)19:12
MartijnVdSdutchie: last time I slept longer than 7 hours was a 19:00-7:00 sleep after a 20km run :)19:12
DJonesHeh, I still put my alarm on, to wake my wife up so she's not late :)19:13
MartijnVdSDJones: there must be more gentle ways to wake her up than a beeping alarm clock19:13
DJonesMartijnVdS: Not that doesn't involve me getting a punch19:13
issyl0DJones: Hah!19:19
MartijnVdSsounds like a happy marriage ;)19:19
* MartijnVdS wonders when natty will become less broken19:30
* dwatkins gets an e-mail from BT who appear to have decided that the ADSL line is ok, which we already knew, but the router is still resetting each day19:31
MartijnVdStime to buy a new router ;)19:31
ali1234how do you know it is resetting?19:31
ali1234and not just disconnecting and reconnecting19:32
dwatkinsthe bt home hub was provided by BT, so I'm loathe to just replace it out of my own money, every couple days it fails such that all wifi devices can no longer see it until it's reset although cabled devices continue to be connected.19:36
MartijnVdStweet angrily about it -- lots of companies monitor twitter now19:37
dwatkinsMartijnVdS: I'm in touch with them because I complained on twitter ;)19:37
=== richard is now known as Guest63999
freeloredwatkins, i had a homehub that was exactly the same19:39
dwatkinsaha freelore - did you replace it with a proper router?19:39
freeloredwatkins, it was the only way. the bt people just denied everything. infact, they insisted it was one of the best routers in the world. no joke.19:40
dwatkinsfreelore: I'm not surprised, I've dealt with at least three separate people so far (including the time I was threatening to cancel because they charged me 150 quid because the system decided I'd cancelled inside my 18 months), I'm thining my only recourse is to threaten to cancel at renewal time because they have supplied what appears to be defective equipment.19:41
freeloredwatkins, they kept telling me it was a minor problem with static electricity and the a software update would be forthcoming.19:41
dwatkinsI'd be amazed if static electricity were to blame here, the router never gets touched except to reset it every 2 or 3 days (sometimes several times per day, however)19:42
dwatkinsI think I'd rather just get a WRT54G and install the Tomato firmware for fun :D19:42
freeloredwatkins, i would never deal with bt again. never. the *worst* customer experience of my life.19:42
dwatkinsI've not had too many issues with them from a customer service perspective, they just fail to understand and appreciate my problem.19:43
dwatkinsmind you, that is the definition of a customer service failure...19:43
dwatkins...they're just fairly polite and responsive about it :)19:43
dwatkinsI have a Buffalo one somehere, perhaps I'll cable it in instead and see how well it performs19:44
ali1234it would be easier to just list the companies that have good customer service19:45
ali1234i can't think of any at the moment19:45
freeloredwatkins, they know how to talk the talk, but it all falls of deaf ears. i'd tell you mroe about it but, "oh, that's not my department -- i'll have to put you though. will you hold the line for a moment?"19:46
ali1234this pretty much sums up how customer service works: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYTR280ji4g19:47
freeloredwatkins, too big, too many departments, all supervisors hide behind an excuse that they only make outbound calls so leave you waiting for a callback between 8am and 5pm -- you are not busy that day are you?19:49
freeloreseriously, im not really one for irrational judgement but avoid BT at all costs.19:50
freelorei guess that touched a nerve for me. ;)19:51
freeloredwatkins, have you tried getting to the internet using just an ip of the website you are connecting to? that used to work for me.19:52
=== Jerkman2 is now known as TakingADump
freelorei did ask them why it was that i could get out to the net using by typing an ip directly, yet dns queries were not able to resolve. they said it was static electricity again.19:54
freelorei guessed that maybe it was something to do with some kind of caching19:54
ali1234yeah routers these days like to run a dns cache19:54
ali1234you can hop straight over it19:55
freeloredwatkins, do you use bittorrent on your homehub?19:55
ali1234just tell your PC to ignore the DNS servers provided on DHCP19:55
ali1234bittorrent is a good way to kill any router that doesn't have custom firmware19:55
MartijnVdSbufferbloat.net :)19:55
ali1234for some reason router manufacturers are incapable of configuring linux kernel nat parameters in a way that actually works19:55
ali1234making this not happen is literally just a matter of tweaking some settings in proc19:56
dwatkinsfreelore: ironically, the connection dropped just as I was about to reply to you again19:57
freeloredwatkins, lol19:58
dwatkinsfreelore: when the problem occurrs, all wifi devices are unable to connect to wifi until the home hub gets reset19:58
dwatkinsI think I have Google's DNS server set on my laptop, also.19:59
directhexyou're putting me off Infinity here19:59
freeloredwatkins, i switched to virgin media -- though i use talktalk nowadays19:59
dwatkinsdirecthex: I have BT's unlimited broadband tarif which cots me 23 pounds per month plus line rental19:59
dwatkinsfreelore: yeah, I would have used VM if I could have.19:59
ali1234you think BT customer service is worse than talktalk?20:00
directhexdwatkins, yeah, but they use a homehub for Infinity too20:00
HazRPGMartijnVdS: heh, no my schedule is because I make my own schedule20:00
directhexalthough any PPPoE router should work20:00
MartijnVdSHazRPG: not because you're a student? :)20:00
freeloreali1234, i've never needed to call talktalk ;)20:00
dwatkinsI work in customer services myself, so I know how they tend to work. The trick is to get through to someone in the UK who you can explain the problem to in full and they won't just respond with a link to a knowledgebase article and close your case.20:00
ali1234freelore: you're in for some fun if you ever do20:00
HazRPGMartijnVdS: Got a HND...20:01
MartijnVdSHazRPG: yes, like I said.. student ;)20:01
freeloreali1234, don't depress me :D20:02
HazRPGMartijnVdS: heh... well I was doing a degree top-up as they call it (which is a year), but student financing has recently screwed that up for me because the uni has stupid rules :/. So they've essentially (paraphrasing) kicked me off because they weren't getting their money. Which resulted in me being unable to log in to anything at the uni (even the digital register to prove that I was there)... and bleh. Complicated. I'm getting work, currently hav20:07
MartijnVdScurrently hav[cut off here]20:07
HazRPGI have experience in the field already anyways 1 year when I was doing the HND, and one year before doing that too (which I got just by chance)20:07
HazRPGIf I can get there's site punched out quick enough, looks like I'll be having a good partnership with these 2 fellows (one does DB work, the other design)... and another guy I've done work with in the past, which was my reference point for the year experience that I got before doing my HND20:09
HazRPGI just need to get my self-employment sorted out (which I'm still doing research for) so that everything is sweet20:10
MartijnVdSself-employment is a lot of work imho :)20:10
HazRPGall else fails, my dad's been offering me a job in Saudi for years since he knows I'm more than capable for the job (he's seen me do it many times, and has even asked for advice to pass on to some of the nit-wits he has working for them)20:11
MartijnVdSalways nice to have a backup plan20:11
HazRPGI'd rather just find work myself first and see how that works out... because I think I could do well for myself, but at least I know I have backup if all goes badly20:13
HazRPGMartijnVdS: indeed :)20:13
Martiinihow do I search specific repository ?? does this look right -  aptitude search '~S ~i (!~Alaunchpad  ~O"kernel")'20:13
HazRPGI won't know what self-employment is like, till I've tried it... and since my name seems to be passed around because of friends my dad knows around this area, so far I haven't had trouble20:14
MartijnVdSit's easier to start off self-employed than to go self-employed when you already have a "normal" job20:16
freeloreanyone know how to add the volume applet back to the menubar? (ubuntu 10.10 desktop)20:17
MartijnVdSsound volume?20:17
MartijnVdSjust add the indicator applet, it should be in there20:18
freeloreMartijnVdS, yes. i removed it mistakenly.20:18
HazRPGMartijnVdS: heh, I did start off self-employed first, which landed me a year contract with a company... but they knew I was going to do my HND after that year, so they didn't renew on that basis - since they didn't want me to screw up my education20:19
HazRPGhowever self-employed in the sense that I did one job (cash in hand) type style20:19
freelorei can't seem to find it in the add to panel dialogue20:19
MartijnVdSfreelore: the indicator applet?20:20
freeloreMartijnVdS, yes the indicator applet. i didn't know it was both volume and also tied into the setup mail, broadcast, chat, etc.. stuff.20:21
freeloreanyway to just have a volume control without that other main/broadcast/chat part?20:22
HazRPGanyways got my HND now... and another year experience (for unpaid work, because that's how HND courses go)... my name was passed from my tutor who started doing freelance stuff again after I finished my HND (long story), and so I've been in contact with those two - which is where the work I'm doing now is for... and they want more work, and also the guy I did work for the very first time has asked for more work now (almost 2-3 years later), which is 20:22
HazRPGI'll shush now lol20:22
* HazRPG /endrant20:22
MartijnVdSfreelore: no, I don't think so20:23
freeloreMartijnVdS, a pity. do you know the reason why they are combined?20:23
MartijnVdSfreelore: that's a LONG story, read up on the Ubuntu/Canonical design team + their work for that20:24
freeloreMartijnVdS, care to try giving me a brief synopsis?20:24
ali1234you can have "just" a volume control20:25
MartijnVdSfreelore: The old "system tray" was overused/misused, and the new indicator API/applet replaces it. It's more menu-like.20:25
ali1234all you have to do is remove the indicator tray thing and go back to using the old one20:26
freeloreMartijnVdS, thanks ;)20:26
freeloreali1234, thanks. its ok though, it doesn't sound like it's worth the hassle.20:27
ali1234it isn't20:27
ali1234i could actually remove the whole thing since none of it works anyway20:27
freelorei do like the way rhythmbox appears there compared to the old volume slider20:28
ZoeRWas it something I said?20:29
ali1234i don't use rhythmbox, empathy, evolution, gnome-bluetooth, or pulseaudio, so none of the indicator applet stuff works for me20:29
MartijnVdSluddite ;)20:29
ali1234it just sits on the screen taking up space20:29
ali1234i use spotify, pidgin, gmail, blueman, and alsa instead20:30
ali1234some are older, some are newer20:30
ali1234all are better20:30
MartijnVdSI disagree :)20:31
MartijnVdSexcept on the gmail bit20:31
ZoeRgmail is indeed lovely20:32
freelorehere's one: if i swapped my motherboard, and boot from the same hdd, would all the hardware changed be detected? with new stuff added, old stuff removed and such? or would it be best to perform a clean install?20:34
ali1234you have all the drivers installed by default20:35
ali1234the only thing that will break is your network config if you have customized it20:35
freeloreali1234, no, just network manager. so their are no permanent configurations that are setup during install which would need to be changed?20:36
freeloreby permanent i suppose i mean 'hard coded' in the config20:36
ali1234well, video card settings maybe20:36
freelorei use a discrete ati card20:37
DJonesI was just going to say if its built in video with different drivers could cause problems20:37
ali1234the installer itself does not make any hardware specific customizations20:37
freeloreali1234, useful to know.20:37
ali1234the restricted driver manager does, and network manager does, but only if you tell it20:37
DJonesI've taken a drive from one machine and put it in a different one, it took a couple of reboots, but everything worked with no problems20:38
ali1234i do it regularly20:38
ali1234never had any problems20:38
ali1234the worst thing that can happen is xorg doesn't start20:38
ali1234then you just wipe the xorg.conf and try again20:39
freelorexorg config is dynamically generated when it isn't present isn't it?20:39
freelorei'll try that route then. with a sensible data backup plan before the upgrade -- whats the worst that can happen? :D the full reinstall i was planning on doing in the first place.20:41
freeloreby the way, you folks are much better than google at these ubuntu questions :D thanks for all the help.20:43
ZoeRAn ubuntu chatroom being better than google at ubuntu? Who would have guessed? :20:44
DJonesfreelore: Do you have /home on seperate partition? If it is, that would reduce any problems on reinstall anyway20:45
HazRPGZoeR: \o :)20:45
HazRPGDJones: I do :), I always setup my home on a separate partition as standard :)20:46
* ZoeR should really do that some time20:46
freeloreDJones, no i just went with the defaults at install and have a single large partition with everything in it20:46
AlanBellevening all20:47
freelorei was considering getting a second (much larger) hard drive and putting /home on there20:47
=== JethroTroll is now known as Stalin_Cat
DJonesfreelore: ok, you can reinstall specifying but telling the partition manager not to format which should save any data as well,although thats something I've never tried20:48
DJonesspecifying the original partition20:48
=== Stalin_Cat is now known as Bolshy_Cat
freeloreDJones, so it would install *over* the files that already there?20:50
* ZoeR has been looking at KolibriOS lately. Anyone ever tried it?20:50
=== Bolshy_Cat is now known as KimJong-Il_Racoo
DJonesfreelore: Yes, thats the idea behind it20:50
HazRPGAlanBell: meeting on soon right?20:54
* HazRPG wondering why else my phone would be ringing away at this time if it wasn't20:54
HazRPGalso, good evening AlanBell :)20:55
DJonesThats better20:56
ZoeRThat's a lot of bans. Did I miss a trollfest or something?20:57
DJonesZoeR: No, just 3 from the same date a while back, I'd forgotten to remove them & when I did, it didn't quite work correctly20:58
DJonesHazRPG: I get the feeling the meeting may have been forgotten about20:58
popeymeeting in -uk-meeting btw :)21:00
* HazRPG pokes people to join the meeting21:00
ZoeRwhat meeting?21:01
ZoeRIs this the super secret meeting of the new old new world order?21:01
BigRedSOooh. That sounds more fun than the debugging of dovecot I came here for :)21:01
ZoeRMy brain hurts21:01
DJonesZoeR: Its the ubuntu-uk regular meeting, join #ubuntu-uk-meeting if you want to take part21:01
* ZoeR rubs her boozed-up head21:02
* ZoeR really should avoid St Patrick's day21:03
freeloreZoeR, how much did you drink?21:04
ZoeR2 cans21:04
ZoeRand yes that makes me sound like a lightweight21:05
ZoeRbut i should point out that i'm not supposed to drink, so i think it's excusable21:05
ZoeRi have a note from my mum21:05
ZoeRit's not in my handwriting. honest.21:05
freelore2 cans of what?21:06
ZoeRI would have preferred guiness but the shop had run out21:07
freelorei use to quite like guiness myself21:08
ZoeRit makes me sneeze but at least it doesn't give me headaches, like this muck did21:08
freelorei gave up drinking a few months ago21:09
ZoeRDo you feel healthier for it?21:10
freelorei didnt have a problem or anything -- just prefer to be keep a clear head these days and thought; why not draw a line?21:10
* ZoeR nods21:10
freeloreyeah, much better21:11
ZoeRI usually don't drink but every now and then I'll have the odd one with friends21:11
ZoeRThen regret it for days after21:11
freeloreyeah, i dont miss that at all21:11
freelorei wasnt even a heavy drinker21:12
ZoeRI can't understand the people who go out and get bladdered every weekend.21:12
freelorenor me -- what is wrong with breaking / fixing linux installs? much more satisfying. if you do it too much you still get a headache, too. quite similar i'd say.21:14
ZoeRYes but Linux is cheeper21:14
freelore'free as in beer' as they say21:14
freelorenot sure if the person who coined that phrase lived in the uk21:15
ZoeRI was thinking the same thing21:15
=== psutton is now known as zleap
freeloredwatkins, homehub again?21:17
ZoeRwelcome back21:17
* bigcalm welcomes his new Alan overlords21:20
AlanBellbigcalm: resistance is futile21:22
=== ZoeR is now known as Picard
freeloreresistance will be embraced and extended21:23
PicardResistance is not futile21:23
* Picard goes a bit crazy and smashes up the ready room21:23
freelorePicard, Jean-Luc! I've got a good question for you.21:24
PicardLet's blow up the ship!21:24
freeloreSeriously, I've been wanting to ask you for ages.21:24
PicardYes, freelore?21:24
freelorePicard, really -- if I ever bumped into you -- I was going to ask.21:24
AlanBellcapacitance has potential21:25
freelorePicard, the question is... the one I've been wanting to ask for, like, ever... is...21:25
freelorePicard, how many lights do you see?21:25
PicardThere... are... four... lights!21:25
freelorelol :D21:25
=== Picard is now known as ZoeR
ZoeRSorry about that. Don't know what came over me.21:26
freeloreI wish TNG never ended. But then again, All good things...21:27
freelorestill, the new movie was pretty good. and a sequel is in production.21:30
ZoeRYes, the 2009 film was great. :)21:30
ZoeRHowever, I'm not sure I will ever be able to look at McCoy without thinking "Eomer, what have you done to your hair?"21:31
ZoeRAnd now McCoy is going to be Judge Dredd. What is the world coming to?21:31
ZoeRIt's like one guy has suddenly become the nexus of my entire childhood.21:31
freelorei thought it was very, very, very well done. lots of stuff that would go over a non-fans head but without it being in the way.21:32
ZoeRMy only problem with the new trek was vulcan. I still think that was unnecessary.21:32
mgdmKarl Urban was ace as McCoy, IMO21:33
freeloreZoeR, i thought it was very bold and brilliant21:34
freeloreno one-on-one duels to the death under the vulcan sky though21:34
ZoeROh I'll grant you it was bold but, if I'm honest, it's not right up there with stuff I've seen so many times in comics over the years. We need something original, not something that is just there to initiate angst21:35
freeloreangst? i was overjoyed! i can't stand the pointy-eared, green-blooded, inhuman...21:36
ZoeRangst for spork, not for you21:37
ZoeRspock, even21:37
freeloreyeah i know what you're saying there21:38
freeloreof all the things that i loved, the one thing that got to me was the motorola product placement21:38
freelorecheapened things a bit for me21:39
freelorei also loved that it was a prequel, sequel and reboot all in one21:40
ZoeRyes, that was a nice touch21:43
ZoeRwell I'd better be going. House is on in 15 minutes and I have to record it or my wife will kick my arse21:43
ZoeRcya later, everyone21:43
daubersUuuhhhh... someone said I had an action??21:51
* daubers is very confused21:51
HazRPGhmm... apparently I'll be controlling Mootbot-UK next week !21:52
HazRPGdaubers: action?21:53
daubersI was hilighted in -meeting, something about being actioned for something21:53
alexcockellBBC just reported - UN are now voting..22:02
alexcockellHopefully NATO will bonb the fuck out fo Gadaffi22:03
lubotu3Please watch your language and topic to help keep this channel family-friendly, polite, and professional.22:03
alexcockellJust been a tad angry... fromt he humanitatian aspect22:03
jacobwI think it was justified to be fair ;)22:03
alexcockellSorry about the typos - just a tad hacked off at the delay - but we need the whupping to be legal..22:04
alexcockellBut I hope he'll be waking up to lots of cratered runways... and BLU-755s ruining his day...22:05
alexcockellSorry - was also connected to Telecomix's server - and hadn't toniced where the focus was..22:09
BigRedSbah. Gnome's save dialog doesn't do command substitution22:12
freelorebest way of getting an ipod nano to work with ubuntu?22:16
ali1234install rockbox on it22:16
AlanJenkinsgtkpod or what ali1234 said if there is support =)22:17
freeloreali1234, tried. i can't with this model.22:17
AlanJenkinsnot tried with a recent nano but i have had luck with my iphone with gtkpod so am guessing it should work for a nano22:18
freeloreis virtualbox + windows + itunes just daft?22:18
AlanJenkinsnope that works but its a faff22:18
dwatkinshackintosh dual boot? ;)22:18
AlanJenkinsdwatkins: that sounds like more fun if your computer is hackintosh compatible22:19
AlanJenkinsnever had any luck myself though22:19
dwatkinsAlanJenkins: if you're prepared to replace the wifi adapter, the Eee 1005HA is very hackintoshable.22:19
freeloreprob inappropriate but where can i find a hackintosh iso?22:19
ali1234"the usual place"22:20
dwatkinsfreelore: an Apple store ;)22:20
* dwatkins is using a Macbook Pro right now to talk to you lot, so is understandably a little pro Apple22:20
AlanJenkinscool, I have a macbook pro that I bought last week now though =) (what i am talking on)22:20
freelorei like apple, but they are too expensive for me22:20
AlanJenkinslol snap dwatkins =)22:21
dwatkinsI considered triple-booting this MBP like my other half did, but it seems like a lot of hassle when I'll probably not use 2/3rds of the OSs much, I prefer having a virtual machine available22:21
AlanJenkinsnot dual booted this yet though, you got yours in ubuntu?22:21
dwatkinsAlso, sound doesn't work on this model under Ubuntu yet22:22
dwatkinsif you go for triple boot, backup everything first22:22
freeloreand get a bigger disk22:22
AlanJenkins750gb in this one should  be fine =), not checked on hardware support yet though, dwatkins was the sound not supported in the latest mbp? or are you talking about the gen before?22:24
AlanJenkinspossibly same chip though =/22:24
dwatkinsAlanJenkins: i have a core2duo, also she got a 750 gb disk too22:24
freelore750 in a mdp?22:25
AlanJenkinsyep freelore its one of the new i7 17inch ones22:25
freelorethats a lot of data to leave on the train22:25
freelorewb ZoeR22:26
AlanJenkinswb ZoeR22:26
ZoeRThanks :)22:26
dwatkinsfreelore: she also has a 1.5 TB external backup disk22:26
ZoeRErk! It's hard to type on this phone app. :(22:26
freelorei hope the MoD don't start using them22:26
freelorenot the way they lose laptops22:27
ZoeRDid I miss much?22:27
AlanJenkinson the subject of macbook pros now ZoeR22:28
AlanJenkinsotherwise no not really22:28
ZoeRAh right.22:28
freelorei was just talking about the new mbp with the 750gb hard drive. thats a lot of data to leave on a train.22:29
dwatkinsfreelore: this is what we got her, it seems to work fine in her 15" MBP which is now triple booted (yes, including Ubuntu): http://www.dabs.com/products/seagate-750gb-momentus-7200rpm-sata-300-16mb-2-5--78YB.html22:29
AlanJenkinsgood cache size on that disk =)22:30
dwatkinsit was the only 750 GB disk I could find which was supported22:30
AlanJenkinsbest thing about this thing though for me is the battery life, longest i have ever had in a laptop =)22:32
dwatkinsthe difficult part was triple-booting, as windows stomps all over the master boot loader and you have to be very careful of the partition order22:33
dwatkinsAlanJenkins: try a 1005HA Eee ;)22:33
AlanJenkinswhats the life on that one dwatkins ?22:33
dwatkinsin practical terms about 8 hours, although the blurb says 10.522:34
AlanJenkinsyikes thats nice22:34
AlanJenkinsthis ones blurb says 7 but i get 5ish22:34
dwatkinsI have a 901 Eee and it's great but a bit slow now, and I had to get a huge battery for it to make it useable22:35
ZoeRBah. Got to go.22:35
AlanJenkinskk catch you later ZoeR22:36
duvelhedzHappy st Paddys day everyone!22:38
ali1234is there a library for language detection in the repos?22:40
duvelhedz_Who is coming to the rugby meet up on Sat?22:41
=== AlanBell changed the topic of #ubuntu-uk to: Welcome to #ubuntu-uk! http://ubuntu-uk.org | This channel is publicly archived: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com | Mailing List: http://tinyurl.com/uukml | Support Guidelines - http://tinyurl.com/uuksupport | Meeting Thursday March 31st 21:00 GMT in #ubuntu-uk-meeting http://tinyurl.com/uukmeet | Quiz Night: 16th April 21:00 | Odd Shaped Balls \o/ http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/team/615/deta
AlanBellduvelhedz_: list is here http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/team/615/detail/22:44
=== duvelhedz_ is now known as duvelhedz
=== AlanBell changed the topic of #ubuntu-uk to: Welcome to #ubuntu-uk! http://ubuntu-uk.org | This channel is publicly archived: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com | Mailing List: http://tinyurl.com/uukml | Support Guidelines - http://tinyurl.com/uuksupport | Meeting Thursday March 31st 21:00 GMT in #ubuntu-uk-meeting http://tinyurl.com/uukmeet | Quiz Night: 16th April 21:00 | Odd Shaped Balls http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/team/615/detail/
AlanJenkinsright guys i have to run22:47
AlanJenkinscatch you again soon22:47
* daubers dislikes politics22:48
dwatkinsthere was politics?22:50
dwatkinsI must have been busy doing the washing-up.22:50
daubersIf anyone is any semblance of awake, can I have soe eyeballs on this please? It appears I was actioned to write this lot down :) http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/UUKElectionProcess22:50
shaunosucker :p22:53
daubersshauno: I seemed to have been volunteered22:53
daubersI'll throw that etherpad out to the mailing list so it can have more eyeballs, then I can go to bed having done the first part of that action22:58
shaunoI'd try to nitpick, as it seems to be all I'm good for.  but I couldn't possibly claim to be awake atm22:58
daubersheh, that's why I'll send it to the list and let people nitpick over the next few days22:59
shaunolesson learnt; don't volunteer to be oncall between 12hr shifts.  it's just stupid.22:59
daubersEmail away!23:05
freeloreanyone know about rhythmbox settings?23:11
freeloreit seems mine is unable to transfer songs to my ipod if they are in m4a format23:12
freeloreit claims the ipod can't play them23:12
freeloreand that it can't transcode them23:12
* daubers heads to bed23:12
freelorebut ipods can play that format ;)23:12
freeloreis there something i'm missing?23:13
freeloreall im really finding on google is a load of howtos written for people who *want* to convert m4a to mp323:18
freeloreim inches away from getting off windows + itunes :S23:19
* dutchie pokes daubers with excess apostrophes in ML post23:22
bigcalmIs REGEX a MySQL only function?23:24
* dutchie pokes daubers with lots of spelling typos in the etherpad (and fixes)23:27
freeloreanyone have any idea where i might find an answer?23:28
freeloregoogle is just throwing up forum posts from 2007 / 0823:28
freelorei guess this issue has been solved?23:28
dutchiefreelore: the first step i'd take is checking to see how many gstreamer-plugins-<something> packages i had installed23:29
freeloredutchie, which would you advise?23:30
dutchieas many as possible :)23:31
freeloreswitch to the multiverse variants?23:32
dutchiethough someone with more knowledge would be able to give a better, more specific answer23:32
dutchieyou may well need to23:32
freelorei see23:32
freelorei really don't know but it seems to me to be more a case of rhythmbox just not being aware of the formats the ipod can play (assuming it can only play mp3, thus needing to convert songs on-the-fly)23:33
freeloreas though all it would take is a setting somewhere, that i would be able to change ".mp3" to ".mp3;.m4a"23:34
freeloreknow what i mean?23:34
dutchieyeah, ipods are a pain on linux23:34
=== kirrus is now known as WillyWonka
freeloreit updates the database fine23:36
freelorejust seems to think it can't play m4a23:36
shaunoI believe faad is in the gstreamer 'bad plugins' package23:37
shauno(faad takes care of aac/m4a & I believe apple-lossless too)23:38
freelorebut would that be required for rhythmbox to transfer the files to the ipod?23:39
freelorerhythmbox can 'see' the files just fine23:39
freeloreplays them, etc.23:39
shaunonot sure in that case :)23:39
freeloreyeah, strange isn't it?23:40
jacobwis evolution going to be the default mail client in natty?23:40
shauno(it would need to be able to play them, or atleast parse their metadata to write the ipod's db, but you've already got that far)23:40
freeloreshauno, exactly23:40
freelorei'll have to live with transcoding them to mp3 each time i sync23:41
freelorewhich seems wrong23:41
freelorehopefully the next version of ubuntu will have this problem fixed23:42
shaunoare the tracks purchased from the itunes store by any chance?23:42
freeloreunless its not a problem and i just don't know how to reconfigure it :D23:42
freelorebut people seem to be complaining about this behaviour since 200723:42
freeloreshauno, no. they drm free.23:43
jacobwis it excessive to keep 8000 emails?23:44
freelorejacobw, are they all for those blue pills?23:44
freeloreif so, yes23:44
shaunoI used to have about 12 years' worth, but lost them in a silly accident :)23:45
jacobwi will read them one day..23:45
jacobwhigh volume mailing lists, i assume someone must use evolution to handle this volume of email23:46
jacobw*someone else23:46
ali1234i get about that many emails per week from mailing lists, evolution cannot cope at all23:48
ali1234nor can any email client i ever tried for that matter23:49
freelorethis transcoding thing is really bugging me  -- anywhere else i could look for an answer?23:49
dutchiefreelore: banshee :)23:49
dutchieor some other client23:49
freeloreali1234, syncing my ipod with rhythmbox, rhythmbox tells me that the ipod doesn't support m4a and wont transfer the tracks -- but it will dynamically transcode them to mp323:51
ali1234dunno about that23:51
freeloreipods popularised the m4a format, didn't they?23:51
freelorei mean, huh??23:52
ali1234can't say i have ever heard of it, so yeah23:52
ali1234i use ffmpeg to transcode things manually23:52
freelorem4a, aac+mp4 container renamed to m4a23:52
freelorething is, i don't need to transcode23:53
freelorethe ipod supports the format23:53
freelorewhat! i just spent 20 minutes transcoding my library and now there is nothing on the pod?! i give up.23:55
ali1234tried gtkpod?23:55
slackthumbzyou could get a media player that doesn't suck...23:55
freeloreyeah but it is a bit awkward23:56
freeloreslackthumbz, yeah there is that. i had hoped to liberate it with rockbox. no such luck. apple encrypt the bootloader on these later models to prevent just that.23:57
slackthumbztypical apple :(23:57
slackthumbzI just use my phone,it's an n900 and has 32gb of storage built in + supports ajust about every media format I've ever heard of23:57
ali1234hmm encrypted bootloader is really the only roadblock to rockbox?23:58
ali1234sounds like a challenge23:58
freeloreplus reverse engineering23:58
shaunoit's really not worth the fight.  rockbox is aweful.23:58
freeloreand apple lawyers, i believe23:58
HazRPGI keep reading that, what is rockbox?23:59
ali1234custom firmware for mp3 players23:59
freeloreits a firmware replacement for media players23:59
ali1234no proprietary file transfer nonsense23:59
freelorepretty crude but quite capable23:59
ali1234just drag and drop the files to the flash drive23:59

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