[00:17] <czajkowski> :)
[00:17] <duvelhedz> gord: The answer to windows 98 is to up your ram to 256 and install lubuntu
[00:18] <duvelhedz> czajkowski: I'm on the way home now
[05:49] <knightwise> MOrning
[06:53] <HazRPG> hmm, I can't get calibre to convert a cbr (essentially a rar/zip file of images) into a pdf or any other eReader format
[06:53] <HazRPG> anyone know anything
[06:55] <knightwise> hey HazRPG
[06:55] <knightwise> try calibre
[06:55] <HazRPG> knightwise: hey dude :)
[06:55] <knightwise> it might work
[06:55] <HazRPG> knightwise: I'm using calibre ;)
[06:55] <knightwise> frack
[06:55] <knightwise> so much for my good advice
[06:55] <HazRPG> I know!
[06:55] <HazRPG> heh
[06:55] <HazRPG> nah, see I'm using calibre and its added it to the library and I can open it in calibre
[06:56] <knightwise> http://www.freewaregenius.com/2006/11/16/how-to-convert-cbz-cbr-files-to-pdf/
[06:56] <HazRPG> but I just can't see to get it to convert to any other file format :/
[06:56] <knightwise> but its a win app
[06:56] <HazRPG> I was about to say :P
[06:56] <HazRPG> don't fancy booting into windows
[06:57] <knightwise> ill give it a google when i have the time , have you tried the twitterverse ?
[06:58] <HazRPG> is that the terminal twitter?
[06:58] <HazRPG> *shrug*
[06:58] <HazRPG> don't know what twitterverse is... so I'm going to assume no lol
[07:01] <HazRPG> ah wait
[07:01] <HazRPG> would help if I read the full details of the error
[07:01] <HazRPG> seems I'm missing a .so file
[07:01] <HazRPG> OSError: libunrar.so: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
[07:02] <HazRPG> hmm, apparently I already have unrar :/
[07:04] <knightwise> ah yeah i got that error once too
[07:04] <knightwise> now i remember , but i didnt get it to work cause i could not find the so file on the web
[07:23] <HazRPG> ah, think I've found it
[07:23] <HazRPG> apparently the tarball for calibre has the .so file inside it
[07:23] <HazRPG> and all I need to do is copy it to /usr/lib :)
[07:24]  * HazRPG sets off download
[07:27] <HazRPG> yes!
[07:27] <HazRPG> \o/
[07:33] <MartijnVdS> \o
[07:48] <HazRPG> MartijnVdS: o/
[07:56] <MartijnVdS> Time for some serious houswork L|
[07:56] <MartijnVdS> :|
[07:57] <HazRPG> :P
[08:36] <czajkowski> Aloha
[08:36] <MartijnVdS> hi czajkowski
[08:43] <czajkowski>  /c
[08:45] <alexcockell> MOrning..
[08:45] <alexcockell> Housework?  What's that?  ;)
[09:08] <popey> morning
[09:08] <czajkowski> popey: how do
[09:13]  * popey remembers eating a kebab on the way home with alexcockell 
[09:13] <popey> er AlanBell
[09:13] <MartijnVdS> You can't even remember which one? :)
[09:13] <MartijnVdS> (or was that just lazy tabbing :))
[09:14] <popey> yes
[09:14] <czajkowski> very late when I got back
[09:15] <popey> :)
[09:16] <alexcockell> Popey - when was that?
[09:17] <popey> nvm
[09:18] <alexcockell> Ahh... typing while still waking up?
[09:18] <AlanBell> morning
[09:18] <AlanBell> heh
[09:18] <czajkowski> AlanBell: howdy
[09:22] <AlanBell> had a conversation with Aine ealier: "did you eat anything when you were out" "no" "you must be starving" "not really . . .  . . . ohh, there may have been a kebab involved at some point"
[09:26] <alexcockell> Sky currently geeking about Storm Shadow...
[09:26] <alexcockell> Sorry - wrong channel
[09:27] <czajkowski> *yawns* no sign of keith being alive down stairs
[09:28] <popey> i bought him a pint that he refused to drink because "it smells and tastes of farts"
[09:28] <popey> :)
[09:28] <alexcockell> Oh - of course - was a big rugby thing, wasn't it..
[09:28] <czajkowski> popey: oh dear
[09:29] <alexcockell> Pints of coffee being prepped for house occupants?
[09:30] <czajkowski> I left sorcha in the pub with the other guy whos name I dont remember and we got the 23:00 train home
[09:32] <AlanBell> I really think at these events we need name badges for people who are not called Alan
[09:33] <czajkowski> lol
[09:34] <AlanBell> was it duvelhedz
[09:34] <AlanBell> or was that Keith?
[09:34] <czajkowski> duvel is alan
[09:34] <czajkowski> keith is talideon on irc
[09:53] <popey> czajkowski: graham?
[09:56] <czajkowski> ahh yes
[10:09] <popey> czajkowski: he's lovely, I've known him for a few years now
[10:09] <Myrtti> boo
[10:09] <Myrtti> I can't remember D's tesco password, I can't order him a birthday cake delivery for tomorrow on his expense
[10:09] <Myrtti> :-/
[10:10] <Myrtti> not that it matters, I don't know at what time he'd be home to receive it
[10:11] <AlanBell> its the thought that counts Myrtti
[10:12] <AlanBell> well actually when the thought is about cake, it might actually be the cake that counts
[10:12] <Myrtti> indeed :-(
[10:13]  * AlanBell has cake
[10:14]  * BigRedS will have cake shortly
[10:15] <BigRedS> I'm being made to leave the house for it, though, which I think is most unfair
[10:17] <Myrtti> I've got vanilla bagels and cream cheese
[10:17] <Myrtti> I guess that makes up for the cake, he did have some yesterday
[10:18] <czajkowski> going to head to London
[10:18] <czajkowski> any suggestions for things to do today
[10:18] <ging> the ubuntu network manager is infact magical
[10:18] <ging> czajkowski: do you like dinosaurs?
[10:18] <popey> thanks for organising last night czajkowski  / danfish
[10:19] <popey> we should do that again
[10:19] <czajkowski> aye
[10:19] <czajkowski> bit of a laugh alright
[10:19] <czajkowski> :D
[10:19] <czajkowski> knew it would be a good match :D
[10:19] <ging> popey: did czajkowski get drunk and do anything her co-works shouldnt know about?
[10:20] <czajkowski> ging: start that lark buddy trolling me here and you and I will have some issues :)
[10:20] <czajkowski> am I being clear enough :)
[10:20] <ging> i was only joking
[10:21] <czajkowski> just to be clear :)
[10:21] <czajkowski> plus I helped get you the job so you've to be nice
[10:21] <Myrtti> I suppose every nation needs their silly sports
[10:22] <Myrtti> I don't try to understand cricket or rugby, and I don't expect anyone to understand pesäpallo or kyykkä
[10:27] <popey> i was there for the beer and friends, not the sport :)
[10:28] <czajkowski> have to say watching that kinda game in an english bar, was defiantely interesting
[10:28] <ging> were you the only irish fan there?
[10:28] <czajkowski> nope
[10:29] <czajkowski> there were a few...
[10:29] <czajkowski> but definately out numbered
[10:32] <AlanBell> ging: czajkowski had rounded up some reinforcements
[10:36] <AlanBell> looks like we may need to push back the train to later in the year http://www.watercressonline.co.uk/section.php?xSec=191
[10:40]  * AlanBell adds note, Myrtti to organise kyykkä event http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finnish_skittles
[10:41] <ging> you could organise a kurling event then UK can win it
[10:42] <ging> oh it's spelt curling
[10:42] <AlanBell> no, you were right http://www.kurling.com/
[10:42] <AlanBell> kurling is curling but not neccessarily on ice
[10:43] <AlanBell> just needs a room with a flat floor that might hold say 400 people for example
[10:51] <caulkz> morning guys/gals
[10:51] <jacobw> quick question about screen, why is the parameter to change the control character to X '-e^Xx' rather than '-e x' ?
[10:51] <jacobw> good morning caulkz :)
[10:52] <caulkz> im taking my trust Nikon d300 out of hibernation, any useful utils that compliment it nicely?
[10:54] <caulkz> and, my webcam dont work on some website (no image), using firefox with logitech pro 9000?
[10:54] <caulkz> works with cheese straight out of box!
[10:55] <caulkz> anyone?
[10:55] <caulkz> please with cherries lol
[10:56] <caulkz> any1 awake?? lol :)
[10:57] <jacobw> if it works with cheese, it'll probably work with other programs when the other programs are configured correctly
[10:57] <caulkz> no feed from some websites
[10:57] <caulkz> issues with flash?
[10:59] <popey> i guess this is a v4l vs v4l2 issue
[10:59] <jacobw> probably, flash is a massive source of issues which can't fixed by any one in the community
[11:01] <caulkz> ok
[11:01] <caulkz> flash is closed source and only adobe can fix?
[11:01] <alexcockell> Pretty much..
[11:02] <jacobw> yes, that is it exactly
[11:02] <caulkz> is there a OSS alternative to flash?
[11:02] <alexcockell> not one that you can use against iPlayer...
[11:02] <jacobw> there's many, but they're all far behind Adobe's implementation of Flash
[11:03] <caulkz> ok
[11:03] <alexcockell> .. due to the Beeb locking it all down with Adobe's "check it's really Adobe Flash you're running" code.
[11:03] <caulkz> damn
[11:04] <caulkz> at least adobe supports linux..
[11:07] <jacobw> caulkz: try starting firefox with this command and see if it works, `
[11:07] <jacobw> ..
[11:07] <caulkz> ?
[11:07] <jacobw> LD_PRELOAD=/usr/lib/libv4l/v4l2convert.so firefox &
[11:09] <jacobw> i read about that command at http://lab.marand.com/2010/04/making-webcam-work-in-flash-on-ubuntu/
[11:10] <alexcockell> And nice that they've got experimental ION support now..
[11:10] <alexcockell> Adobe-flashplugin, libvdpau1, textfile change...
[11:11] <caulkz> bookmarked the url, cheers alex
[11:11] <ubuntuuk-planet> [Andy Loughran] FPTP versus AV - http://zrmt.com/2011/03/19/fptp-versus-av/
[12:18] <daubers> Morning
[12:18] <MartijnVdS> howdy
[12:18]  * daubers tries to hack together a linked list in C++
[12:32] <Seeker`> daubers: "hack together"?
[12:34] <daubers> Seeker`: Never done it before :)
[12:34] <MartijnVdS> it's not that hard :)
[12:34] <daubers> No, but just takes a little reading to understand
[12:37]  * directhex downloads palm sdk
[12:37] <brobostigon> goodafternoon everyone.
[12:38] <MartijnVdS> brobostigon: afternoonings :P
[12:38] <Seeker`> daubers: understand what?
[12:38] <MartijnVdS> Seeker`: linked lists
[12:38] <Seeker`> linked list = data + pointer
[12:38] <brobostigon> MartijnVdS: good afternoon. :)
[12:38] <Seeker`> simples
[12:39] <MartijnVdS> Seeker`: maybe two pointers, if you want double links
[12:40] <daubers> Seeker`: Just moving around in them really. Just want to make sure I have it right before I make a mess of it :)
[12:40] <Seeker`> MartijnVdS: well, yes, but thats more "advanced" :P
[12:41] <MartijnVdS> daubers: list<your_type> L;
[12:41] <MartijnVdS> \o/ STL
[12:42] <directhex> i am gonna start writing a mobile app!
[12:42] <brobostigon> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel/+bug/720468
[12:43] <daubers> directhex: Anything exciting and will it work on my Pre Plus?
[12:43] <MartijnVdS> directhex: for the platform that's even less used than Symbian ;)
[12:43] <brobostigon> hopefully i will get no more gpulockup. :)
[12:43] <MartijnVdS> brobostigon: cool
[12:44] <brobostigon> MartijnVdS: it was releated to libdrm,
[12:44] <Seeker`> MartijnVdS: daubers: a puzzle for you; how can you tell if your list has a loop in it?
[12:44] <MartijnVdS> Seeker`: Walk it. If you see yourself, it has a loop.
[12:45] <MartijnVdS> Seeker`: or do you mean any kind of loop?
[12:45] <brobostigon> is*
[12:45] <Seeker`> "if you see yourself"?
[12:45] <MartijnVdS> Seeker`: yes.. your starting point
[12:45] <Seeker`> what about if you have a->b->c->d->b->c->d->b->c->d->b->c...
[12:46] <MartijnVdS> Seeker`: store the "next" pointers somewhere, bail out if you've already seen it
[12:46] <MartijnVdS> Seeker`: hash table-ish
[12:46] <directhex> daubers, 2.1 firmware?
[12:46] <daubers> directhex: Don't think so.... thats only for the Pre 2 onwards isn't it?
[12:47] <directhex> daubers, nein, 2.1 update available for pre plus and higher on o2
[12:47] <daubers> directhex: It is???
[12:47] <Seeker`> what about if you have 1->2->3->...->5,000,000,000->5,000,000,001->5,000,000,002->5,000,000,000
[12:48] <daubers> Seeker`: Store the 'id' of the list item?
[12:48] <Seeker`> daubers: the "id"?
[12:48] <MartijnVdS> pointer
[12:48] <Seeker`> thats still 4 bytes
[12:48] <directhex> you're writing your own linked list?
[12:48] <daubers> Seeker`: e.g. item number
[12:49] <Seeker`> so if you have a large data strugcture you are still storing 4*number of items bytes
[12:49] <Seeker`> which for long lists is a large amount of memory
[12:50] <MartijnVdS> Seeker`: You could store one/a few pointer at a time and walk the list several times, I guess
[12:50] <MartijnVdS> +s
[12:51] <directhex> daubers, http://ws.palm.com/WebOsChecker/serialnumberinitial.htm
[12:51] <Seeker`> how do you know when to stop walking the list if it has a loop in it? :P
[12:51] <MartijnVdS> Seeker`: Walk it twice _at the same time_, at different speeds
[12:51] <MartijnVdS> Seeker`: if you pass yourself, you have a loop :)
[12:51] <Seeker`> MartijnVdS: correct :)
[12:52] <daubers> directhex: When I put my serial in it offers webOS® Doctor™ for Palm® Pre™ Plus for O2. Build O2.236.222, webOS 1.4.5
[12:52] <MartijnVdS> that might even be relatively fast
[12:52] <directhex> hmph
[12:52] <Seeker`> MartijnVdS: depends on the size of the loop
[12:52] <MartijnVdS> Seeker`: sure but it won't be O(n²) or something evil
[12:53] <directhex> daubers, oh, you'll love this. o2 germany have it for the pre plus.
[12:53] <daubers> Bah, blasted o2
[12:53] <MartijnVdS> It won't be O(2) :P
[12:54] <daubers> So I can get it, bit only in German?
[12:54] <directhex> daubers, nothing in software update on the phone?
[12:54] <Seeker`> MartijnVdS: Might be O(n) actually.
[12:55] <daubers> directhex: only application updates
[12:55] <directhex> daubers, how vexing. really just seems to be o2 germany
[12:56] <directhex> daubers, if the pre3 is an o2 exclusive, i'm skipping it
[12:56] <directhex> o2 are the worst network ever that isn't vodafone
[12:57] <daubers> directhex: Yeah :(
[12:57] <daubers> stuck till November anyway
[12:57] <MartijnVdS> directhex: Hm, Vodafone-NL have the best network.. KPN-NL is good as well, but T-Mobile = NOOOOOOOoooooo....
[12:58] <directhex> daubers, wife is on o2 until around then. i'm on orange until july
[12:59] <daubers> directhex: I may actually just buy a phone instead of get one on contract at that poin
[13:00] <directhex> daubers, yes, i'm considering the same... see also what i said about o2 exclusives
[13:00] <directhex> daubers, right now, 3 have the best sim-only contract sim. giffgaff are better, if you trust them long-term (not sure i do)
[13:00] <daubers> directhex: The only thing that would swing me is if they gave a free pr3 with a discounted tablet
[13:00] <directhex> pre³
[13:00] <popey> giffgaff is o2 though
[13:00] <popey> so you're using their coverage
[13:01] <directhex> popey, yeah, but coverage isn't the issue
[13:01] <popey> ah
[13:01] <directhex> i really don't care much about coverage maps, they're much of a muchness. i care about data rates and i care about lockdown
[13:01] <directhex> three have the best data rates for a mainstream company (unlimited data sim), giffgaff have some kind of weirdo attitude to things
[13:02] <directhex> lockdown... i'll only accept with a good contract. e.g. if three had the pre³
[13:02]  * brobostigon shakes fist @ sky box, for resetting itself, while brobostigon is trying to watch the simpsons.
[13:03] <directhex> brobostigon, what do you expect for an amstrad?
[13:03] <brobostigon> directhex: this is a grundig.
[13:05] <directhex> brb, restarting x
[13:08] <directhex> ...
[13:09] <directhex> daubers, developer device program.
[13:09] <directhex> daubers, the pre³ will  be available at a discount for devs. and i'm writing an app
[13:09] <directhex> wait, that's US only -_-
[13:09] <daubers> directhex: bah
[13:09] <daubers> got me partially excited briefly
[13:10] <AlanBell> hi all
[13:10] <brobostigon> afternoonings AlanBell
[13:10] <AlanBell> I was thinking about putting dual boot Ubuntu on my brothers new laptop
[13:10] <AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/Screenshot.png
[13:10] <AlanBell> however HP have been evil with the partition table
[13:10] <AlanBell> 4 primary partitions all used
[13:10] <AlanBell> now what?
[13:10] <AlanBell> can't create extended partitions without a primary to put them in
[13:11] <MartijnVdS> GPT :)
[13:12] <AlanBell> the windows setup routine is *horrible*
[13:12] <directhex> AlanBell, not a lot you can do
[13:12] <AlanBell> I went through it, but it was so evil I used the recovery thing to set it all back again so he can experience it too
[13:13] <AlanBell> is Wubi a good way forward in this instance?
[13:15] <TheOpenSourcerer> AlanBell: Backup sda3 somewhere else then move the partitions around?
[13:16] <directhex> AlanBell, oh, that's a good idea
[13:19] <AlanBell> sda2 seems to be the one to nuke and rejiggle
[13:19] <TheOpenSourcerer> what is is sda1?
[13:19] <TheOpenSourcerer> s/is/in
[13:19] <AlanBell> not too sure
[13:20] <directhex> many vendors have weirdo partitions, sadly
[13:20] <directhex> another point for dell: they ship real windows media, on real discs, with latitude laptops. can just reinstall a pristine windows, for dual-booting
[13:21] <directhex> lenovo have a crazy purposefully bad partiiton table (e.g. overlapping partitions) which only their tools can fix
[13:21] <AlanBell> wow
[13:22] <AlanBell> trouble is if I nuke stuff I am going to end up breaking windows beyond my ability to fix it
[13:22] <AlanBell> and my brother isn't going to like that
[13:22] <AlanBell> I think I will explore wubi a bit
[13:22] <TheOpenSourcerer> Yes, but at least he will have Ubuntu :-)
[13:24] <AlanBell> true :)
[13:24] <alexcockell> Lenovo kit supplied by Linux Emporium is pretty hot though - THEY are taking the step of blowing away Windows... then again, I am a bit more of a user than you lot.
[13:25] <directhex> if you burn backup media, the lenovo tools permit you to blat the recovery partition, then you can repartition fine
[13:25] <directhex> although our contracts with lenovo the os doesn't matter
[13:25] <directhex> since we don't send them the hard disks when stuff needs repairing
[13:29] <AlanBell> problem solved, he has brought his old laptop to be forensically wiped
[13:29] <AlanBell> so going to nuke it hard with dd then put Ubuntu on it
[13:30] <MartijnVdS> Doesn't want his "photo collection" to fall into the wrong hands, eh?
[13:31] <AlanBell> ;) funny, but he is actually a forensic accountant and wants it clean of customer stuff
[13:48] <popey> AlanBell: what does the window recovery thing do if partitions already exist?
[13:48] <popey> does it just blat the disk?
[13:49] <penguin42> AlanBell: Not going to use dban or scrub?
[13:49] <popey> I'd be inclined to dump /dev/sda3 and /dev/sda4
[13:49] <popey> 16GB is enough for you to install ubuntu in for him to play
[13:50] <popey> and can later resize sda2 down
[13:56] <domjohnson> Anyone here take DiDA?
[13:56] <domjohnson> (that is, the subject...)
[13:57] <Seeker`> anyone have a xmltv config for freeview?
[14:03] <kvarley> domjohnson: I did it last year
[14:05] <domjohnson> God I hate it.
[14:05] <domjohnson> lol
[15:11] <ubuntuuk-planet> [Matthew Garrett] Archos tablets - http://mjg59.livejournal.com/134903.html
[15:42] <brobostigon> no gpu lockup yet, :)
[15:47] <AlanBell> popey: I am not sure what the windows recovery tool does or how upset it would be with a different partition table
[15:48] <AlanBell> and I don't really want to nuke the recovery partitions, it doesn't come with any other installation media
[15:50] <mgdm> AlanBell: in my experience as long as it stays in the same place and with the same partition number, it's fine
[16:27] <brobostigon> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel/+bug/720468/comments/10
[16:27] <brobostigon> :(
[16:36] <brobostigon> any clever graphics people around?
[16:50] <popey> AlanBell: doesnt it let you make recovery DVDs?
[17:00] <AlanBell> I didn't see that option, and I don't have any blank DVDs here
[17:17] <Azelphur> Anyone amazing at SQL feel like trying to reverse engineer this horrible query I'm trying to understand? XD
[17:17] <Azelphur> It's evil...pure evil
[17:19] <Azelphur> I also realized it's entirely pointless too, so never mind xD
[17:28] <popey> heh
[17:31] <alexcockell> Azelphur - would you reckon that query belongs on DailyWTF?
[17:34] <Azelphur> alexcockell: no idea
[17:40] <shauno> I don't get this at all.  some days MC will run for hours on end, others I'm lucky to get 90 seconds before it crashes.  and I'm finding absolutely no rhythm nor reason behind it :(
[17:45] <directhex> which java are you using?
[17:46] <shauno> the one apple push, appears to be no alternatives  (yes, it's completely offtopic.  I'm just frustrated because I'm literally getting 90 seconds at a time)
[18:08] <jacobw> MC?
[18:09] <shauno> oh .. minecraft
[18:09] <jacobw> I see :)
[18:16] <shauno> just figured there's enough addicts in here than someone may have some pointers :)
[18:16] <shauno> experimenting with 32bit vs 64bit atm.  tried not using 3 mice, but seemed to make zero difference
[18:19] <brobostigon> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yzIeiyzRLCw&feature=player_embedded  interesting.
[18:20] <MartijnVdS> brobostigon: "Help me Obi-Wan Kenobi, you're our only hope"
[18:21] <brobostigon> MartijnVdS: :)
[18:26] <phonex01> hello gys
[18:26] <phonex01> today i gave presentation about aircrack-ng it was really amazing
[18:27] <popey> is it online?
[18:27] <phonex01> no man
[18:27] <phonex01> it is not allowed to recored !
[18:27] <popey> :(
[18:27] <popey> why?
[18:27] <phonex01> university policy !
[18:27] <MartijnVdS> popey: you know security people, very insecure about their security policies
[18:27] <MartijnVdS> popey: also.. very insecure in general :)
[18:27] <phonex01> hahahah
[18:28] <MartijnVdS> (or should I say paranoid)
[18:28] <jpds> MartijnVdS: Nothing's secure anyway at the end of the day.
[18:28] <phonex01> next week we will be about " Software Reverse Engineering "
[18:28]  * popey hacks the gibson
[18:28] <popey> shame, i would like to have seen that
[18:28] <MartijnVdS> jpds: Not having data = perfect security :)
[18:28] <brobostigon> phonex01: can i suggest starting with wine, :)
[18:29] <phonex01> oh nice
[18:29] <phonex01> but i will start with them by the basics
[18:29] <phonex01> they are not that Experience !
[18:29] <phonex01> they dont even use linux !
[18:29] <brobostigon> phonex01: reverse engineering the windows api, in order to emulate the windowsapi.
[18:29] <phonex01> yes you are right
[18:29] <brobostigon> phonex01: oh i see,ok.
[18:30] <phonex01> normally everything done with the ollydebug tool
[18:30] <brobostigon> phonex01: but i would suggest, staying within legal limits, like wine.
[18:30] <phonex01> ya it is a good idea
[18:31] <phonex01> by the way is there any software like File recovery pro for ubuntu  ?
[18:31] <jpds> phonex01: photorec?
[18:31] <brobostigon> phonex01: you dont need to be called on for teching people to break the law.
[18:31] <phonex01> photorec ?
[18:32] <MartijnVdS> photorec :)
[18:32] <MartijnVdS> phonex01: it recovers deleted files from disks
[18:32] <phonex01> im installing it right now
[18:32] <MartijnVdS> phonex01: useful if you accidentally format your camera memory card, for example
[18:32] <MartijnVdS> phonex01: or some other disk with pictures 8-)
[18:32] <jpds> files out of dead disks too.
[18:32] <phonex01> no i want to make some simple research about low-level file processing
[18:33] <phonex01> which mean deals with data without there file system
[18:33] <phonex01> the same as recovery tools do
[18:33] <phonex01> actually when you delete a file you just delete the pointer or address of that file but physicly the file still there !
[18:33] <jpds> phonex01: http://www.cgsecurity.org/wiki/PhotoRec_Data_Carving
[18:34] <phonex01> thank you jpds
[18:34] <brobostigon> !info photorec
[18:34] <brobostigon> !info photorec natty
[18:34] <mgdm> brobostigon: it's in the testdisk package
[18:34] <mgdm> !info testdisk
[18:34] <brobostigon> mgdm: ah, thank you,
[18:35]  * mgdm has used that to get people out of some sticky situations :)
[18:37] <Myrtti> I wish the local lemsip would have decongestant in it :-( aspirin, vitamin c and caffeine is a rather useless mix
[18:39] <brobostigon> :(
[18:39] <Myrtti> especially useless when I want to sleep anyway and have even medication to help me with it
[18:40] <phonex01> ok im using photorec right now it seems good
[18:40] <Myrtti> Oh well. blackcurrant juice and aspirin it is then
[18:40] <phonex01> oh yah guys i have strange problem about backtrack 4
[18:40] <popey> there is a backtrack support channel
[18:40] <phonex01> when i use back track 4 from live CD or flash everything is ok
[18:40] <popey> ##backtrack-linux i think
[18:41] <phonex01> but when i install it the mouse stop working after loading the dekstop
[18:41] <Myrtti> "try ubuntu instead"
[18:41] <phonex01> ok no problem with ubuntu
[18:42] <phonex01> but im asking about the problem !
[18:42] <phonex01> i need to know why ?
[18:42] <phonex01> ubuntu is ok
[18:42] <Myrtti> strangely enough, this is ubuntu channel
[18:42] <phonex01> ok im not allowed to ask such question here
[18:42] <phonex01> ok no problem im sorry any wya
[18:42] <Myrtti> sure you are
[18:43] <Myrtti> probably you're just not getting answers ;-)
[18:43] <brobostigon> phonex01: but they in the backtrack channel will be specilist, :)
[18:43] <phonex01> im in backtrack channel no one is responding !
[18:43] <phonex01> they maybe sleeping !
[18:44] <brobostigon> phonex01: i have had a gpu lockup problem. so have been sitting in #ubuntu-x all afternoon, i am being patient, because i know i will get an answer.
[18:45] <popey> phonex01: the official #ubuntu support channel does indeed ban the asking of backtrack questions, and mint too i think
[18:45] <Myrtti> mmmm cough medicine
[18:45] <phonex01> ok i got the msg !
[18:45] <popey> but here we are more relaxed, I just wondered if you knew about the other channel, that's all.
[18:45] <phonex01> hi popey ok i said im sorry !
[18:46] <popey> I am not having a go at you
[18:46] <phonex01> oh photorec is really good
[18:46] <popey> I am explaining the situation
[18:46] <popey> no need to get ratty with me
[18:46] <phonex01> no problem !
[18:46] <phonex01> take it easy
[18:46] <popey> *sigh*
[18:46]  * popey wanders off
[18:48] <jpds> I say !
[18:54] <Azelphur> running a dynmap fullrender on my minecraft server, according to top java is using 115% CPU flat out
[18:55] <Azelphur> defying the laws of physics \o/
[18:56] <mgdm> That means it's using more than one CPU
[18:56] <Azelphur> but minecraft is single threaded?
[18:56] <mgdm> I suspect that the app itself is but that bits of the JVM might handle different things on different threads
[18:56] <Azelphur> ah
[18:57] <mgdm> or part of the GUI. or something. I don't know, I have no interest in Minecraft
[18:57] <Azelphur> tis the server, so no gui
[18:57]  * mgdm shrugs
[18:58] <phonex01> guys i need a good learning easy way to write shells for ubuntu ?
[18:59] <phonex01> any link ?
[18:59] <dutchie> "shell" can mean a lot of things, what exactly do you mean?
[19:00] <phonex01> i mean writing shells
[19:00] <jpds> phonex01: http://tldp.org/LDP/Bash-Beginners-Guide/html/index.html
[19:00] <phonex01> thnak you
[19:26] <Myrtti> shell scripts probably...
[19:32] <gord> we have a tend to call anything that contains anything else in software a shell, this is starting to backfire ;)
[19:32] <gord> i suggest we now start calling everything a bucket
[19:34] <ali1234> "we"?
[19:35] <AlanBell> unity is a bucket for gnome, but not gnome-bucket
[19:35] <AlanBell> works for me :)
[19:36] <ali1234> if you put just a little bit more thought into it you can probably convince some people that it is a whole new UI paradigm and get a book deal out of it
[19:37] <daubers> Once you've filled the gnome-bucket with widgets, it works more like bucketless gnome?
[19:37] <ali1234> no, not widgets... you need to com eup with a new name for them
[19:37] <daubers> spades?
[19:37] <ali1234> like plasmoids
[19:37] <AlanBell> pebbles
[19:37] <Myrtti> warts
[19:37] <daubers> crabs!
[19:37] <ali1234> except plasmoids is already taken
[19:38] <Myrtti> nailpolish
[19:38] <daubers> lava-oids
[19:38]  * AlanBell wonders what is going on in the minds of Myrtti and daubers 
[19:38] <Myrtti> AlanBell: feet
[19:38] <Myrtti> a la Gnome logo
[19:38] <daubers> footprints?
[19:39] <ali1234> that one is actually good
[19:39] <ali1234> footprint would be a better name for "the desktop" (what kde calls an activity)
[19:41] <ali1234> i believe os x calls it the dashboard?
[19:41] <ali1234> and on windows it's just called "active desktop"
[19:42] <daubers> so the bucket handles the footprint, which contains the assorted feet?
[19:42] <ali1234> sure
[19:42] <daubers> Anyone else confused yet, or just me?
[19:42] <ali1234> it doesn't even matter if it makes sense
[19:43] <ali1234> the more confusing it is, the more innovative it appears to be
[19:44] <mgdm> Hence, Google Wave
[19:44] <mgdm> and we saw how well that did
[19:44] <ali1234> mgdm: the problem with googlewave is they actually innovated
[19:45] <ali1234> the path to success is copy something that everyone is familiar with and then rename all the parts so people think it is something new
[19:45] <shauno> wave was fascinating, but the client they put on the frontend wasn't :(
[19:46] <mgdm> the tech seemed to be rather cool, but yeah, the UI was less-than-obvious
[19:46] <mgdm> though I did do some useful things in it
[19:46] <Myrtti> AWWWWW GOATS http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQ6xGMSOu1E
[20:11] <daubers> C++ question.... if I have a pointer set up that is being reassigned now and again, how can I assign a new object to that point with the correct arguments to initialise that object?
[20:12] <phonex01> guys need help
[20:12] <daubers> I'm trying to do foo->bar = new FooBar(x,y,z);
[20:12] <phonex01> how can i change color on IRC ?
[20:12] <daubers> phonex01: Depends on your client
[20:12] <phonex01> i mean i saw some people on some rooms change the bg color and such things
[20:13] <phonex01> ok im using XCHAT
[20:19] <jacobw> :s
[20:25] <ali1234> so my youtube video has been flagged: Entity: Music Publishing Rights Collecting Society Content Type: Musical Composition
[20:25] <ali1234> even though the music is out of copyright
[20:26] <ali1234> that is, the composition was done in the 1900s and it is an original recording
[20:26] <shauno> heh, I like the name tho.  atleast they're not pretending to be artists
[20:27] <ali1234> that's just a generic name for whatever local organization collects royalties on behalf of compaosers
[20:27] <Azelphur> is there any free alternative to spotify that runs on Ubuntu?
[20:28] <popey> Azelphur: bittorrent
[20:28] <popey> lastfm?
[20:28] <popey> grooveshark?
[20:29] <Azelphur> well yea I use that but was after something more spotify-ish for a friend :p
[20:29] <Azelphur> they said they don't like last.fm because you can't choose specific songs
[20:29] <popey> why not spotify?
[20:29] <Azelphur> grooveshark I'll take a look at
[20:29] <Azelphur> popey: because it's not free for Linux, which is extremely lame and makes me want to slap them? :D
[20:29] <popey> it works in wine
[20:29] <popey> apparently
[20:29] <popey> actually I have tried it in wine
[20:29] <popey> on my joggler
[20:30] <Azelphur> I see
[20:30] <Azelphur> suppose I'll just wine spotify, irritating when there's a native client right there
[20:30] <Azelphur> makes me want to send them an email.
[20:30] <popey> they know
[20:30] <popey> spoke to them about it ages ago
[20:31] <shauno> ali1234: bummer.  for a moment I thought someone actually had the gall to name their company "copyright trolls"
[20:31] <Azelphur> fun
[20:31] <Azelphur> popey: what did they say?
[20:34] <popey> i think they said it was something to do with not being able to guarantee the delivery of the adverts on the client
[20:34] <popey> but that sounds more like what you'd say if you were implementing an open source client
[20:34] <popey> mark (on the podcast) spoke to them about it
[20:34] <popey> more recently than I
[20:37] <popey> ask them in #spotify
[20:42] <Azelphur> fun \o/
[20:46] <ali1234> hmm
[20:48] <jacobw> !info vim
[21:00]  * brobostigon puts bbc2 on, for wonders.
[21:01] <HazRPG> hi
[21:01] <HazRPG> :)
[21:01] <HazRPG> how's everyone doing?
[21:01] <brobostigon> evening HazRPG :)
[21:01] <MartijnVdS> sleepy :)
[21:02] <AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/beard.jpg should I keep it or not?
[21:02] <brobostigon> HazRPG: quiteill, headache, throat ache, back pain. how about you?
[21:02] <brobostigon> HazRPG: also i added you to me new project on launchpad.
[21:02] <HazRPG> brobostigon: evening :)
[21:03] <brobostigon> HazRPG: :)
[21:03] <HazRPG> brobostigon: :( hope ya feel better soon squire
[21:04] <HazRPG> brobostigon: I know the feeling though, woke up 3 times in front of the computer since last night... so I have a sore back and neck now
[21:04] <HazRPG> brobostigon: ooo, new project?
[21:04] <brobostigon> HazRPG: thank, me too.
[21:04] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: and a keyboard full of drool? :P
[21:04] <HazRPG> AlanBell: yes!
[21:04] <brobostigon> HazRPG: https://launchpad.net/~hazrpg is that you?
[21:05] <HazRPG> AlanBell: Personally I find it easier to keep trimming a beard, than it is to keep shaving every couple of days
[21:05] <HazRPG> brobostigon: That would be correct :)
[21:06] <HazRPG> MartijnVdS: heh, no... thankfully :P
[21:06] <brobostigon> HazRPG: i have added you to the new group then, https://launchpad.net/~hydraulic-hybrid , it is the old project, but gives me version control, which i needed.
[21:07] <HazRPG> brobostigon: ah yeah, I recall you looking up various version control stuff and people recommending bzr to you :)
[21:08] <brobostigon> HazRPG: is also makes it much easier on me, to allow people to see the code.
[21:08] <brobostigon> :)
[21:08] <MartijnVdS> but.. that's scary
[21:08] <MartijnVdS> having other people look at your code ;)
[21:08] <brobostigon> MartijnVdS: very much, so, yes.
[21:09] <MartijnVdS> you'll get used to it
[21:09] <brobostigon> MartijnVdS: at the moment it is a  total mess.
[21:09] <MartijnVdS> we do code reviews at work.. at first everyone is scared :)
[21:09] <brobostigon> :(
[21:09] <HazRPG> heh yeah, sharing code around for the first time is always scary
[21:10] <HazRPG> I remember setting up my SVN and sharing my code off to close friends by giving them access to it...
[21:10] <MartijnVdS> hah, I used 3.5" disks for that :)

[21:10] <brobostigon> HazRPG: thats why i am keeping it a relativlyclosedgroup. so i dont get silly stupid people, wrecking it.
[21:11] <HazRPG> when you think your coding is pretty decent, and others go off and say there's a few issues with it... always makes you feel inadequate lol
[21:11] <Myrtti> pwaah.
[21:11] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: at some point they'll start saying it's good though
[21:11] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: and you learn to anticipate their criticism (as well as your own -- reviewing goes both ways :))
[21:11] <brobostigon> so any ideas, are welcome, :)
[21:12] <MartijnVdS> which means overall code quality increases
[21:12] <HazRPG> MartijnVdS: Yeah, but they were expecting it to be fully working when I'd only been spending like a few weeks on it lol
[21:12] <HazRPG> MartijnVdS: Indeed :)
[21:12] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: you can't fix unrealistic expectations (well, maybe by showing it earlier. Agile-ish approaches etc.)
[21:13] <HazRPG> exactly
[21:13] <brobostigon> HazRPG: so if you have any ideas, you can, s you are now a group member, i am keeping it this way, so i dont get arses messing with it, and or vandalising it.
[21:13] <HazRPG> brobostigon: good stuff :)
[21:14]  * MartijnVdS decides it's time for sleep
[21:14] <HazRPG> brobostigon: is this pretty much the project I was helping you review a few years back?
[21:14] <brobostigon> nos da MartijnVdS
[21:14] <MartijnVdS> good luck with your project, brobostigon & HazRPG
[21:14] <HazRPG> MartijnVdS: aww you off :(?
[21:14] <HazRPG> MartijnVdS: Night, sleep well.
[21:14] <brobostigon> HazRPG: what i have there now, is the lastfew months, i havent put any of thatoldstuff up yet.
[21:14] <brobostigon> MartijnVdS: thank you, :)
[21:15] <HazRPG> MartijnVdS: Indeed, thanks :)
[21:16] <brobostigon> HazRPG: also i need to put up the C modules i am using, aswell.
[21:17] <brobostigon> HazRPG: that means atthe moment, you need to get the modules manually.
[21:17] <HazRPG> brobostigon: ah ok
[21:18] <brobostigon> HazRPG: the modules are in an entirly different folder, to where the source is held, and i need to find a way, of doing that properly.
[21:18] <Myrtti> damned cough
[21:19] <HazRPG> Myrtti: got a cold?
[21:19] <brobostigon> HazRPG: so you just bzr one lot, and have everything, rather than having to bzr seperate folders, and combine them.
[21:20] <popey> brobostigon: tip: commit messages should have useful text in them :)
[21:20] <HazRPG> brobostigon: yeah, that does sound better - because then people don't have to worry about the dependencies, plus everyone will be working with the same code-set
[21:20] <brobostigon> popey: yes, sorry, :)
[21:20] <HazRPG> popey: heh, I was just about to bring him up on that :P
[21:20] <brobostigon> HazRPG: yes, that is a thought,
[21:21] <brobostigon> should compile* is maybe alittle weak.
[21:21] <popey> it was all the ones before that actually :)
[21:21] <brobostigon> thats also, yes, :)
[21:21] <HazRPG> brobostigon: that one's fine, because that at least tells people it should compile - problem is with the others
[21:21] <popey> nvm
[21:21] <popey> :)
[21:22] <brobostigon> HazRPG: they are content light, very true, i need tobe more discriptive.
[21:22] <HazRPG> looks like you beat me to it :P
[21:23] <HazRPG> brobostigon: trust me, its not just useful for others to understand what's going on - it'll help you too so you can see the way things have been going :)
[21:23] <brobostigon> HazRPG: i agree, i will add some of the stuff in my paper notes, in the future,
[21:24] <HazRPG> brobostigon: coolies :)
[21:26] <HazRPG> brobostigon: just out of interesting, what's the graphie stuff for?
[21:26] <brobostigon> HazRPG: :), if you see any mistakes or improvements, pleaseadd them,  :)
[21:26] <HazRPG> brobostigon: will do :)
[21:26] <brobostigon> HazRPG: thats to repreent the output data, from the arduino over the usb.
[21:26] <brobostigon> represent*
[21:26] <brobostigon> is a nice graph.
[21:26] <HazRPG> ah cool :)
[21:26] <brobostigon> in a*
[21:27] <brobostigon> :)
[21:27] <popey> exobuzz: hey!
[21:27] <HazRPG> I am tempted to get an arduino myself tbh, so I might be more useful over time :)
[21:27] <exobuzz> popey, hi
[21:28] <exobuzz> excellent podcast (as usual) :
[21:28] <exobuzz> :) even
[21:28] <popey> yay, thanks
[21:28] <brobostigon> HazRPG: that would be interesting yes, you can do alot, and interesting things, as i am trying, and all it is, is simple C, so easy to program, atleastshould be, anyways, :)
[21:29] <HazRPG> brobostigon: I'm not sure if it'll fit my needs, but it will definitely help get me back into the swing of electronics though :)
[21:30] <brobostigon> HazRPG: ah, i see. yes it will definatly  do that, :)
[21:32] <HazRPG> popey: I must say, I do love the way Calibre grabs news sites! I was reading away through some articles before I went to bed
[21:33] <popey> its rather cool isnt it
[21:33] <popey> reminds me
[21:33]  * popey updates his calibre
[21:33] <mgdm> popey: what reader do you use?
[21:34] <ali1234> every commit should compile
[21:34] <ali1234> just saying
[21:34] <HazRPG> popey: Hmm, do you grab Calibre straight from the site? Because I've noticed the repo only has up to 0.7.18
[21:35] <HazRPG> ali1234: you mean without errors?
[21:35] <popey> HazRPG: on osx i do
[21:35] <mgdm> HazRPG: that's the generally accepted definition of "compile", yes
[21:35] <mgdm> :)
[21:36] <czajkowski> danfish: you missed an epic day!
[21:36] <HazRPG> mgdm: heh
[21:37]  * HazRPG pokes brobostigon to see ali's comment
[21:37] <ali1234> yes without errors
[21:37] <brobostigon> HazRPG: where?
[21:38] <HazRPG> brobostigon: (2011-03-20 9:34:42 PM) ali1234: every commit should compile
[21:38] <ali1234> a commit is a snapshot in history
[21:38] <ali1234> ask yourself why would you ever want to go back to a snapshot that doesn't compile?
[21:39] <HazRPG> ali1234: heh, when you put it like that makes me think "why would you ever take a photo, without the people in it yet"
[21:39] <popey> a bad analogy is like a leaky screwdriver
[21:39] <popey> you would never roll back to a photo
[21:40] <popey> unless you were in a film like Back to the future
[21:41]  * mgdm takes lots of photos and very few of them ever have people in
[21:41] <brobostigon> ali1234: maybe, yes, but sometimes even i am not perfect.
[21:42]  * brobostigon making croaking noises,
[21:44] <HazRPG> heh, I've only *just* seen the WikiReader
[21:44] <popey> i do like that device, if only you could use a kindle sized device offline for that
[21:45] <HazRPG> popey: I'm sure if you grabbed a dump of wiki you could
[21:47] <HazRPG> is it just me, but having a dump of the full wiki for offline use, is like having a hitchikers guide to the galaxy (minus the fact that its not the whole galaxy)
[21:47] <ging> popey: you know about the free internet on the 3g kindle right?
[21:47] <popey> i do
[21:47] <HazRPG> ging: only if you dished out extra for that version :P
[21:48] <popey> he said "3g kindle"
[21:48] <ging> HazRPG: I did
[21:48] <ali1234> HazRPG: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Database_download
[21:48] <ali1234> 27GB uncompressed just for the newest revisions
[21:48] <ging> just seems wrong to download wikipedia
[21:48] <popey> hmm, that would fit on my ipad :)
[21:48] <popey> the wikireader is a cut-down version, no images
[21:48] <ging> it's like keeping a monkey in a tiny cage
[21:49] <ali1234> popey: 27GB does not include images
[21:50] <popey> thats fine
[21:50] <popey> its the text i'd mostly want
[21:50] <popey> the wikireader is 4GB iirc?
[21:50] <popey> micro sdhc
[21:51] <HazRPG> popey: 8GB according to this source
[21:51] <ali1234> sure, if you compress it and remove all the buffy the vampire slayer articles it would be much smaller
[21:51] <HazRPG> popey: the download they provide is 4GB
[21:52] <ali1234> "all revisions, all pages" uncompresses to 5 terabytes
[21:52] <ging> i dont see how it is in anyway better than using a kindle in a country where you get free internet on it
[21:53] <ali1234> it isn't
[21:53] <Seeker`> ging: just because you can?
[21:53] <popey> i was thinking more for the kids
[21:54] <ali1234> wikireader is for people who are worried about looking up the major characters of buffy in the event of a large scale disaster taking out the 3G network
[21:54] <popey> heh
[21:54] <AlanBell> ging: in preparation for when society breaks down and anarchy rules, the internet is gone, and you want to look up the article for rubbing sticks together to make fire
[21:54] <ging> ali1234: i never thought about that
[21:54] <Seeker`> ali1234: you seem to be obsessed with buffy
[21:54] <ali1234> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Making_fire
[21:54] <AlanBell> and then the article for making a steam powered kindle charger
[21:54] <ali1234> better print that just in case
[21:55] <Azelphur> is there any place to look at the major/blocker bugs for 11.04?
[21:58] <mgdm> To be fair it's not just Buffy. There's a fair amount of Pokemon in there too
[21:58] <popey> and doctor who
[21:58] <mgdm> Ah, but that's worthwhile!
[21:58] <mgdm> ;)
[21:59] <popey> wikireader is only 60 quid
[21:59] <popey> blimey
[21:59] <ging> they sell them in UK?
[21:59] <popey> no
[21:59] <mgdm> is it hackable in any way?
[21:59] <czajkowski> boo no moodoo :(
[22:00] <popey> https://github.com/wikireader
[22:00] <HazRPG> WikiReader is open source as far as I'm aware
[22:00] <mgdm> cool
[22:01] <HazRPG> and popey just confirmed that :P
[22:01] <ging> what happened to openmoko?
[22:01] <popey> they made a sucky phone
[22:01] <ali1234> Azelphur: try this: http://bit.ly/hyoVYE
[22:02] <Azelphur> ali1234: ty :D
[22:02] <popey> haha, is the nintendo 3ds and the ipad 2 releasing on the same day!?
[22:02] <ging> i remember wanting 1 when they came out because everyone said they were awsome
[22:02] <popey> http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/gamesblog/2011/jan/19/nintendo-3ds-uk-launch-details
[22:03] <popey> they were never awesome ging
[22:03] <ging> doesnt mean people didnt say they were
[22:03] <ali1234> i don't see a problem, i mean it's not like there's any overlap... i mean one is a kids toy and the other is a handheld gaming device...
[22:03] <popey> :)
[22:06] <HazRPG> true... plus its not like the queues are going to be for the same stores, I doubt GAME or GameStation will be selling iPad 2
[22:07] <popey> uhm
[22:10] <HazRPG> although would be interesting to see stores like Tesco releasing them both :P
[22:10]  * brobostigon makes a pot of coffee for the communal table.
[22:10] <HazRPG> brobostigon: \o/
[22:10]  * daubers still wants a kindle :(
[22:10] <ali1234> you're not going to see huge queues for ipad 2 and nds anyway
[22:10] <ali1234> not harry potter type queues
[22:11] <popey> yeah, not in the UK
[22:11]  * brobostigon kinda wants a n900 with android, however,
[22:12] <ali1234> i'm sure the media will manage to drum up a "huge queue" somewhere
[22:12] <daubers> or apple will pay for one
[22:12] <HazRPG> ali1234: I would like to say your right, but I use to work at GAME during the time the PS3 Slim/DSi/etc
[22:12] <ali1234> probably by advertising in advance that the bbc will be coming down to report on the "huge queue" so if you want to get your face on tv, be sure to turn up!
[22:13] <HazRPG> it took 3-4 hours to get rid of the queue that had parked themselves
[22:14] <HazRPG> daubers: I must say, I just got a kindle the other day... and I'm enjoying it, so highly recommended :)
[22:14] <popey> surely the ps3 market is much larger than the ipad one?
[22:14] <ali1234> i would expect so
[22:14] <ali1234> and the 3ds market too
[22:14] <HazRPG> daubers: I got mine in tesco's, so you don't have to link it up with amazon
[22:15] <HazRPG> popey: ah I thought ali was referring to the 3DS
[22:15] <ali1234> i don't expect huge queues for the 3ds
[22:15] <daubers> HazRPG: I know :( But moneys a bit of an issue at the moment... silly house buying messyness
[22:15] <ali1234> but they'll be bigger than ipad queues
[22:16] <mgdm> There was a guy buying a Kindle at LHR T5 the other week when Iw as there
[22:16] <mgdm> they were trying to sell him a massively overpriced cover for it
[22:17] <mgdm> I held up the jiffy bag mine's in, pulled the Kindle out a little bit, winked and wandered off
[22:17] <mgdm> They didn't sell him one ;)
[22:17] <daubers> Might see if my boss can get one for me from 'merkia when he goes over there. Play the exchange rate a little
[22:17] <HazRPG> mgdm: heh yeah I noticed on amazon, they have a case that costs £50 just because its leather and has an LED light :/
[22:18] <brobostigon> HazRPG: thats half the cost, amazing.
[22:18] <popey> haha, just realised my kindle fits in this here jiffy bag!
[22:18] <HazRPG> mgdm: haha winner :P
[22:18] <mgdm> HazRPG: aye - boggling
[22:18] <mgdm> popey: yay! I have about 3 that are exactly the correct size
[22:18] <popey> the best part is that these jiffy bags were "free2
[22:18] <popey> "free"
[22:19] <HazRPG> brobostigon: it is!
[22:20] <brobostigon> HazRPG: isnt the kindle justover £100 ?
[22:20] <HazRPG> brobostigon: £110 for wifi edition, £152 for wifi+3g
[22:20] <HazRPG> brobostigon: I bought a case for £3 off ebay :P
[22:21] <Daviey> popey, There is no such thing as a free lun^D jiffy bag!
[22:21] <popey> well, no
[22:21] <popey> these came in a box, and contained 2TB hard disks :)
[22:21] <brobostigon> HazRPG: £50 for that cover is roughly half, that cost. £3yes, i made a cover for mmy n800, our of somespare felt, cost, nothing.
[22:21] <Daviey> popey, heh, 2TB.. that is just greedy.
[22:21] <popey> thats backups for you :)
[22:22] <zleap> hi Daviey i have added  a link to the podcast on my website
[22:22] <zleap> i mean there is a link to the ubuntu podcast on my website
[22:23] <HazRPG> brobostigon: I would make one, if I had something to make one with :P
[22:23] <Daviey> zleap, Oooo.. that is good.  Sadly, i'm no longer a regular presenter. :(
[22:23] <zleap> ok
[22:24] <brobostigon> HazRPG: however it shows, how muchpeople get ripped off, as you said.
[22:24] <zleap> well thats ok, its on there, so hopefully anyone going on my site to download a club newsletter (rugby club) will see the banner
[22:24] <HazRPG> brobostigon: in egypt, they have problems with sand and dust getting everywhere in the house... plus people eat with their hands usually, communally as a family... so what my family does is cover remotes for TV's etc in cling foil to stop them getting ruined :P
[22:25] <brobostigon> HazRPG: ah, i see, interesting idea.
[22:26] <HazRPG> brobostigon: I always thought that was normal! Until I moved back to the UK for college/uni
[22:26] <brobostigon> HazRPG: ah, ys, you will notice clearly.
[22:27]  * AlanBell struggles with Launchpad and GPG
[22:27] <HazRPG> AlanBell: what's up?
[22:28] <AlanBell> Launchpad could not import your OpenPGP key
[22:28] <AlanBell> http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x4D8800C856EBDC35 there it is
[22:28] <AlanBell> http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=vindex&search=0x4D8800C856EBDC35
[22:28] <brobostigon> HazRPG: my htc dream would make things difficult, to protect, with the fold out keyboard.
[22:29]  * hamitron pokes Azelphur
[22:29]  * popey pokes hamitron 
[22:29]  * Azelphur pokes hamitron and popey
[22:29] <hamitron> you find a price for the psu?
[22:29] <HazRPG> AlanBell: I'm confused... that looks like its there :S
[22:29] <Azelphur> hamitron: the one you wanna buy off me?
[22:29] <hamitron> yeh
[22:30] <Azelphur> my friend just posted me a PSU for £11 if that's what you mean
[22:30] <hamitron> £11 delivery?
[22:30] <AlanBell> HazRPG: it is there in the keyserver, but launchpad won't let me import it to my account so I can do "quickly share"
[22:30] <Azelphur> yea
[22:30] <hamitron> :-o
[22:30] <hamitron> not worth the hassle is it :/
[22:30] <Azelphur> *shrug* still cheaper
[22:30] <HazRPG> AlanBell: ...oh
[22:30] <hamitron> £10 + 11 > £20
[22:31] <Azelphur> so I'll sell you it for £5 tada :P
[22:31] <Azelphur> lol
[22:31] <hamitron> imo, you should just keep it as a spare
[22:31] <hamitron> or some arduino project
[22:32] <hamitron> ;)
[22:32] <hamitron> my 250W psu seems to be holding up atm
[22:33] <Azelphur> hamitron: I don't have any machines that'd take it haha
[22:33] <hamitron> no, but use it for general psu for arduino
[22:33] <hamitron> :)
[22:33] <Azelphur> xD
[22:34] <hamitron> is £11 royal mail?
[22:34] <Azelphur> I think so yea
[22:34] <Azelphur> first class too
[22:34] <ali1234> you shouldn't use PC powersupply as a bench PSU
[22:34] <ali1234> they are rather unstable when not laoded correctly
[22:34] <popey> when i worked at a college, the students would play tricks on us using the bench PSUs
[22:35] <popey> they'd put an electrolytic cap between two contacts, hit the stop button on the room then turn the psu on
[22:35] <popey> we'd walk in. look around, unlock the stop button and BOOOM! paper everywhere
[22:35] <popey> fun
[22:35] <hamitron> :)
[22:35] <ali1234> yeah the kids in my school used to do stuff like that
[22:35] <ali1234> except they would also turn on all the gas taps
[22:36] <hamitron> ali1234: I use mine with old motherboards
[22:36] <Laney> Glibc and others may be using the kernel headers that can be generated from a kernel source tree by doing a "make headers_install". That Makefile target was added to help library developers and distributions create the header files that are required to use the kernel ABI. It is not a requirement, as there are other ways to generate (or create) the required headers, and various libraries have done it differently along the way. The ...
[22:36] <Laney> ... Android developers intend to eventually use the headers that can be created from the kernel tree, but there are currently some technical barriers to doing so. The key piece to understand is that the information required to use the kernel ABI are contained in one and only one place: the kernel header files.
[22:36] <Laney> NO
[22:36] <popey> No?
[22:36] <Laney> I /really/ wish I could turn off triple click paste
[22:36] <HazRPG> AlanBell: are you trying to import it using the https://launchpad.net/~AlanBell/+editpgpkeys ?
[22:37] <daubers> Minecraft won't let me login :(
[22:37] <Laney> one of these days I am going to accidently paste something terrible
[22:37] <HazRPG> or is there another way that I haven't heard of before?
[22:37]  * webpigeon just read <hamitron> £10 + 11 > £20 and thought type error, I need more sleep or less code x.x
[22:37] <ali1234> i heard about that android stuff
[22:37] <ali1234> apparently if you #include a kernel header in your code, your code has to be GPL
[22:37] <AlanBell> HazRPG: yes, that is what I am trying to do
[22:37] <Laney> according to some nutters, but not Linus or the license of the kernel
[22:38] <hamitron> who is webpigeon
[22:38] <hamitron> :)
[22:38] <ali1234> well funny you should say that because linus himself is the source of that one
[22:38] <webpigeon> hamitron: I ask myself that a lot :P
[22:38] <Laney> you should read the LWN article
[22:38] <brobostigon> hamitron: webpigeon ia friend of mine.
[22:38] <ali1234> i did, in the comments it links to a mailing list post by linus where he says exactly this. in capital letters no less
[22:38] <popey> http://lwn.net/Articles/434318/ that one Laney ?
[22:39] <brobostigon> hamitron: he also manages unity-coders,
[22:39] <hamitron> brobostigon: just wondered if he was an alt name for someone :)
[22:39] <HazRPG> AlanBell: still no joy? I'll make a new key and see if I can give it a go
[22:39] <Laney> popey: yeah
[22:39] <webpigeon> hamitron: na, I just haven't been arround in here much for the last while :P
[22:39] <hamitron> k :)
[22:39] <ali1234> http://lkml.org/lkml/2003/12/5/13
[22:40] <AlanBell> HazRPG: still nothing
[22:40] <ali1234> here is the quote: "BUT YOU CAN NOT USE THE KERNEL HEADER FILES TO CREATE NON-GPL'D BINARIES. "
[22:40] <AlanBell> I will ask in #launchpad tomorrow if it still doesn't work
[22:40]  * Laney sighs
[22:40] <Laney> please read the article, it addresses exactly that
[22:40] <ali1234> oh it does does it? was it written by linus?
[22:40] <Laney> not going to be trolled
[22:40] <Laney> EOD
[22:40] <hamitron> one "problem" with the GPL I suppose
[22:40] <hamitron> :/
[22:40] <webpigeon> ali1234: caps much :P
[22:40] <ali1234> webpigeon: linus caps, not mine
[22:41] <webpigeon> I know
[22:41] <ali1234> interesting to see how someone manages to make that quote mean the opposite of what it says, but will have to wait until 31st of march to find out
[22:42] <webpigeon> "You can use it to control a nuclear submarine, and that's totally outside the scope of the license" ^.^
[22:42] <brobostigon> lol
[22:43] <ali1234> i don't agree that linus is correct btw
[22:43] <ali1234> but it's pretty clear what he is saying
[22:44] <webpigeon> You can't distribute GPL'd code (or use gpl'd code in your projects) if you distrubute the binaries and not the source.
[22:44] <ali1234> and of course what i meant to say was "your code has to be GPL if you want to distribute the binary"
[22:45] <webpigeon> but that's a whole heated flamey topic
[22:45] <hamitron> gets ya thinking though ;)
[22:46] <shauno> not entirely sure what's being discussed myself.  all I've got so far is "please read the article" -> paywall
[22:47] <ali1234> in a nutshell: "can you #include a linux kernel header file in a program which you then later distribute without source?"
[22:47] <ali1234> linus says you can't. in all caps, and at great length.
[22:47] <shauno> right.  but the odd thing is it doesn't actually matter what linus says
[22:47] <brobostigon> nos da everyone, sleep well.
[22:47] <webpigeon> night brobostigon o
[22:47] <ali1234> yeah i know :)
[22:48] <webpigeon> ignore the o
[22:48] <ali1234> and it was 8 years ago too
[22:48] <brobostigon> night webpigeon :)
[22:48] <hamitron> I'd guess Linus is right tbh
[22:48] <ali1234> but if he ever came out and said "actually guys i was wrong" i'm sure someone would have found it by now
[22:48] <Laney> the thread is about kernel modules and not user-space
[22:48] <hamitron> else there wouldn't be a need for the LGPL?
[22:49] <Laney> that is what 'binaries' refers to
[22:49] <ali1234> Laney: why does it matter?
[22:49] <webpigeon> way the libraries are linked?
[22:49] <ali1234> kernel modules might be forced to be GPL for some other reason
[22:51] <Laney> it matters because that is what the exemption in the license says
[22:51] <Laney> see this post too http://lkml.org/lkml/2003/12/5/162
[22:51] <Laney> really EOD now: watching ER
[22:57] <HazRPG> AlanBell: Hmm, I've managed to take mine off and put it back up again... wonder why its not working on your end
[23:05]  * popey wonders if anyone can replicate bug 739024
[23:06] <HazRPG> hmm, apparently I'm doing karaoke tonight...
[23:07] <HazRPG> to the pub!
[23:07] <ali1234> popey: screenshot?
[23:07] <popey> on the bug
[23:07] <ali1234> oh there is one never mind
[23:07] <popey> :)
[23:08] <ali1234> nope, doesn't happen here
[23:08] <popey> happens on two machines here
[23:08] <popey> classic, non-unity
[23:08] <ali1234> oh, i'm on maverick
[23:09] <HazRPG> popey: hmm, that's an interesting one
[23:09] <HazRPG> does do that here, I'm on maverick too
[23:09] <HazRPG> doens't*
[23:10] <ali1234> hmm 'sudo update-manager -d' isn't offering me natty?
[23:10] <dutchie> try with -c too?
[23:10] <dutchie> for check
[23:10] <popey> i doubt it would do it on maverick
[23:11] <ali1234> er... why?
[23:11] <popey> because natty introduces lots of new compiz oddness
[23:11] <ali1234> oh, i thought you meant -d
[23:11] <popey> oh, sorry
[23:11] <popey> two convos
[23:14] <ali1234> oh, i think it was because no wireless connection...
[23:14] <ali1234> yup
[23:58] <RedHillian> t