[11:46] <scott-work> i'm baaaaaaack :)
[11:46] <falktx> hey
[11:46] <scott-work> abogani: either this afternoon or tomorrow's i will begin again with the -lowlatency kernel
[11:47] <scott-work> abogani: i believe i have to correct the version number and use the tilde "~" in lieu of the dash or minus sign to correct what i had done
[11:47] <scott-work> hi falktx, how are you?
[11:47] <scott-work> ailo, paultag:  i'm guessing that the -controls update isn't going to happen for natty
[11:48] <scott-work> i'll talk to luke about getting it out of natty unless someone has a very strong objection
[11:48] <falktx> scott-work: good, I'm working on rt-kernel drivers again (nvidia should be working by now)
[11:48] <falktx> scott-work: what about cadence?
[11:48] <scott-work> ailo, paultag: the good news is that we have _plenty_ of time to get the -lowlatency kernel in the repository now for natty+1 (ocelette ?) for the -controls update
[11:48] <falktx> scott-work: I can work really hard on it, if you promise me it will be included in US
[11:49] <scott-work> falktx: i don't know at this point, i'll need to refresh my knowledge of cadence lately
[11:50] <falktx> scott-work: http://repo.or.cz/w/cadence.git
[11:50] <scott-work> falktx: i have seen screenshots from before, but that was probably three months ago and i think you've been working on it pretty heavy during that time
[11:50] <scott-work> heh, you, ailo, and abogani are going to drag me kicking and screaming into the 21 century with 'git'
[11:51] <falktx> hehe
[11:51] <falktx> scott-work: the GUIs itself don't change much, but there was a lot of bug-fixing
[11:52] <scott-work> i got pretty comfortable with bzr and so i didn't really worry about learning more about git, but apparently the rest of the world doesn't revolve around ubuntu :P
[11:52] <scott-work> falktx: cool
[11:52] <falktx> scott-work: you should just try them
[11:52] <falktx> git clone git://repo.or.cz/cadence.git
[11:52] <falktx> make
[11:52] <scott-work> falktx: probably next week i'll look at it, but we need to also see how this contrasts with what ailo and paul have been doing
[11:53] <falktx> scott-work: yep, I'll be here waiting
[11:53] <scott-work> okay, thanks falktx for the instructions :)  you've just increase the chances i'll succeed dramatically
[11:53] <falktx> lol
[11:53] <scott-work> actually i'm starting to get git
[11:53] <scott-work> heh, i made a funny
[11:54] <scott-work> hi holstein :)
[11:54] <falktx> scott-work: build depends: python-qt4-devel pyqt4-dev-tools ladspa-sdk dssi-dev libasound2-dev
[11:54] <falktx> scott-work: runtime depends: libjack0 python-rdflib python-qt4-dbus python-qt4-gl jack-capture
[11:55] <falktx> scott-work: my patchbay can now use GL for rendering
[12:10] <ailo> falktx, I think paultags idea was to make a controls application that was pluginable
[12:10] <falktx> ailo: extensions to the control app?
[12:10] <falktx> hm...
[12:10] <ailo> falktx, My app so far was just a hack that was intended for Natty only
[12:12] <ailo> falktx, So, my idea was to make something like an indicator app called ubuntustudio-controls, and then let any app that wants to act as a plugin be called utc--<name>. That could be anything, like qjackctl.
[12:12] <ailo> falktx, Main part of it would be a system preferences plugin
[12:13] <ailo> falktx, But, I haven't really started coding anything yet.
[12:13] <falktx> ailo: that gives me some ideas...
[12:14] <ailo> falktx, I was going to use GTK, but I don't have any problems with QT, though I don't see why the two couldn't be mixed, even.
[12:14] <falktx> i would prefer qt
[12:14] <falktx> qt plays nice with gtk, but gtk does not play nice with qt/kde
[12:15] <scott-work> the new kernel patch that improves performance in the stock kernel is apparently in Ubuntu and Fedora :  http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/222185/speedy_wonder_patch_debuts_in_new_linux_kernel.html
[12:16] <scott-work> this might seem ignorant or niave but i wonder if which kernel version it will be in and if we will see any performance boosts for latencies
[12:16] <ailo> falktx, I really have too little experience with QT and KDE to know the difference. I guess there could be two versions of a main app, if done the way I propose
[12:16] <scott-work> i realize it's in 2.6.38 mind you, just not what dot verison
[12:17] <ailo> falktx, One nice thing would be that the indicator icon could be activated by any plugin, like go red for xruns, or go yellow for system warnings and so on.
[12:17] <ailo> scott-work, It should be in all of them, though it might not be activated
[12:18] <falktx> ailo: that could be a specific app
[12:18] <ailo> scott-work, As far as I have been able to tell, it makes it easier to watch Youtube while compiling from source.
[12:18] <falktx> ailo: I already have some tools, your idea is good for a new one
[12:18] <falktx> ailo: lol, compiling and watching videos
[12:19] <scott-work> ailo: well then, that's a success!  we should make a advert for ubuntu studio and tell everyone how good this kernel is
[12:19] <scott-work> just kidding :P
[12:20] <ailo> scott-work, I'm sure I'm missing something. The link you posted seems to adress other enhancements too.
[12:33] <ailo> Ah, he quit. I was just trying out Cadence
[12:37] <ailo> falktx, Was just trying Cadence
[12:38] <ailo> falktx, On Natty. Perhaps easier on another system?
[12:38] <ailo> falktx, dbus.exceptions.DBusException: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name org.jackaudio.service was not provided by any .service files
[12:39] <falktx> ailo: you need to use jackdbus, not jackd
[12:39] <ailo> falktx, Ok.
[12:39] <falktx> ailo: please stop jackd and restart the app
[12:39]  * falktx will soon remove jackd support from his jack2 PPA package
[12:42] <ailo> falktx, Why jackdbus only? I must be missing some packages. I was able to start cadence, and start jack, but not configure. All other options were grayed out
[12:43] <falktx> ailo: cadence itself is the most poor app
[12:43] <falktx> ailo: try other tools like catia, claudia, carla, xycontroller
[12:43] <falktx> still no readme in there though
[12:43] <falktx> for 'carla' (the plugin host), run 'make carla' first
[12:43] <falktx> ^ not build by default, still very unstable
[12:44] <ailo> falktx, Ok. About Cadence, I find the window is too large for my little screen. I would hide some options in an advanced tab, while keeping only the essential stuff on the main page.
[12:45] <falktx> yep, todo soon
[13:00] <scott-work> ailo: do you still advocate removing -controls from natty?
[13:01] <ailo> scott-work, Yes. How about earlier releases? I think on Lucid, only firewire settings are right.
[13:02] <ailo> scott-work, While 10.10 should be all wrong, just like 11.04.
[13:02] <scott-work> i'm not sure at this point, i'll need to talk to someone about what/how to do things
[13:02] <scott-work> obviously i would like to make sure natty is correct first since it's not released yet
[13:03] <scott-work> secondly, i think we should evaluate for the last LTS verison (lucid)
[13:03] <ailo> scott-work, It would have nice to update those. At least make sure on Lucid that app edits the right file. That should be easy enought to do
[13:03] <scott-work> right
[13:03] <ailo> scott-work, It would just mean editing one line or so in the source code
[13:04] <scott-work> and i'm least worried about 10.10 - if we ignored it or sent an email to the mailing list then i wouldn't loose sleep
[13:04] <scott-work> i'll start talking to luke later today about going forward then for information and see if he would be agreeable to remove -controls for natty then
[13:05] <ailo> scott-work, There are at least two other apps that are not needed. Both PA related
[13:05] <ailo> scott-work, I have to double check, though
[13:05] <ailo> scott-work, Since I use Ubuntu mainly, I seem to forge Ubuntustudio Desktop functions differently
[13:05] <scott-work> ailo: okay
[13:07] <ailo> scott-work, What's the deal with wireless? Would network-manager still add any problems to Ubuntustudio? I hear it is less then before. Don't know about firewire
[13:07] <scott-work> ailo: are you experiencing problems with wireless?
[13:08] <scott-work> ailo: i expected less problems with network-manager than the previous gnome-network-admin
[13:08] <scott-work> to clarify:  i expect less complaints about getting wireless working with network-manager
[13:09] <ailo> scott-work, Not really. My wireless driver may be bad, but I don't think network-manager is causing whatever problems I have.
[13:09] <scott-work> however, i also wouldn't be surprised if someone complained that using network-manager increased intermittent xruns
[13:13] <ailo> scott-work, I haven't had any problems with network-manager. Doesn't many audio distros include that? If we investigate that, perhaps we could consider adding it to the mix?
[13:14] <scott-work> ailo: we already include network-manager as a replacement for gnome-network-admin
[13:15] <scott-work> many, many users complained about gnome-network-admin being difficult to set up wireless during installation (and post-installation for that matter)
[13:15] <scott-work> effectively, many users simply couldn't use wireless directly after installation
[13:16] <scott-work> they would have to use the DVD as a repository and install network-manager which had been included on disc but not installed
[13:16] <ailo> scott-work,  I was just trying Lucid. You mean since then, it is much easier?
[13:16] <scott-work> or download network-manager or one of the other managers and put it onto their machine
[13:16] <scott-work> ailo: natty is the first one to include network manager
[13:16] <ailo> scott-work, Ok. Good. Then that is already decided.
[13:32] <ailo> Or, perhaps an app could be created on which ubuntustudio-controls could be a plugin.
[13:33] <scott-work> ailo: i'm not sure i understand your defintion of 'plugin' in this instance
[13:33] <scott-work> do you mean for previous version of ubuntustudio or for going forward
[13:33] <scott-work> and what use case would you need this
[13:35] <ailo> scott-work, Some of the many ideas that have been for ubuntustudio-controls could perhaps be divided into different applications. It would make it easy for users to find all of that from an indicator menu. 
[13:35] <ailo> scott-work, The main use for ubuntustudio-controls is to help users adjust their system
[13:36] <holstein> o/ 
[13:36] <ailo> Whatever is done on top of that, could be made into "plugin" that you can install, and add to that menu, if you want
[13:40] <ailo> I'm not of the opinion that we should add session management, and PA jack bridge as default components of ubuntustudio-controls. I am not against including those as options. Exactly how that should be categorized, divided into apps or menus and tabs, I don't know. 
[13:44] <ailo> scott-work, A plugin could be as simple as just including an application starter in a menu. At least, I think it would be nice for some apps, like a jack control app, to change the icon color for xruns and so on.
[13:46] <ailo> I'm just throwing ideas around at this point, and I was meaning to start working on a new ubuntustudio-controls, based on the work I did so far, but turning it into an indicator app. Also, I would want to include options for checking the system at startup, as my script did.
[13:46] <scott-work> ailo:  okay, i think i start to understand
[13:46] <scott-work> -controls would provide the framework and the indicator menu in the panel
[13:47] <scott-work> and as the plugins are installed they are available in the indicator menu
[13:47] <scott-work> i like the concept :)
[14:24] <falktx> back
[19:18] <holstein> scott-work: boing
[19:18] <holstein> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntustudio/+bug/739628?comments=all
[19:18] <holstein> could you or someone look at that
[19:18] <scott-work> looking
[19:18] <holstein> and mark it 'wishlist' if you agree
[19:20] <scott-work> we are including network-manager with natty now, which is what ubuntu desktop uses
[19:20] <holstein> scott-work: COOL
[19:20] <scott-work> and i think it has a pretty good network icon already
[19:20] <holstein> i'll re-comment there on the bug
[19:20] <scott-work> so this may not be an issue then
[19:21] <holstein> nah, that'll totally do it
[19:21] <scott-work> you might wait to comment until we verify it in natty
[19:21] <holstein> scott-work: maybe mark it fixed
[19:21] <holstein> scott-work: OK
[19:21] <scott-work> i say that because we do funny things with the panel with the icon set, etc
[19:21] <scott-work> well not "funny" but idfferent
[19:21] <scott-work> different
[19:21] <holstein> not funny = haha
[19:22] <scott-work> so i would like to make sure it beheaves like expected, i'll do that tonight while i'm working on the -lowlatency kernel