shaunofacebook has the ultimate defence00:00
shaunoif you manage to log in, they show you pictures of you drunk, that some "friend" helpfully uploaded00:00
HazRPGshauno: xD00:02
dogmatic69_tx for the advice all, much appreciated00:04
dogmatic69_will figure out the bash version soon :D00:04
HazRPGF... (almost swore then) YEAH! Managed to get calibre to do pdf conversion :D00:04
* HazRPG does happy dance00:05
HazRPGshauno: ubuntu uses an old script to do pdf export for other apps00:05
HazRPGmanaged to force calibre to use a different one :)00:06
shaunogood stuff00:06
HazRPGnow if only I can force the recipe to download as a pdf...00:07
HazRPGand hopefully get it to be right-to-left and not left-to-right, because this looks too confusing :S00:08
HazRPGooo, I should get some Terry Pratchett!00:15
shaunoin arabic?00:15
HazRPGshauno: that would be sacrilege!00:16
HazRPGI'm only trying to download arabic news sites... so the next time I go to visit my mum I can go "hey look, aren't I a clever lad"00:17
HazRPGthat, and I'm too scared to put "arabic kids books" into google...00:18
shaunowell bleep.  pay just arrived, and it looks like the taxman did worse than I thought possible00:23
shaunoby my math, they're taken about 45%.00:24
HazRPGdid he take you round the back, wine, dine and dress you?00:24
shaunoit looks like that's the only thing he didn't take :p00:25
HazRPGouch, man 45%!00:25
HazRPGcan they do that??00:26
HazRPGconsidering its only 25% here00:26
X3Nexplaining revenue generation of oprnspurce at a dinner *raally* hard00:26
HazRPGhamitron: UK?00:27
HazRPG25% is emergency tax, which I always seem to get roped into :/00:28
X3Nespecially after a few drinks00:28
hamitronworks out higher than 25% with NI :/00:28
HazRPGX3N: I've tried explaining it to many people before and they go "but how!? Your not selling a product!?"00:28
HazRPGhamitron: I doubt its 45% though00:29
hamitronmaybe it is a rich guy complaining ;)00:29
HazRPGX3N: its shocking how people seem to forget that a service can still be charged for - despite it being a non-physical object00:30
HazRPGhamitron: I wish I was rich...00:30
HazRPGI'm the sort that says if ever I was rolling in it... I'd actually go out and try and extract it from the bank and try to roll in it...00:31
hamitroncan never have too much money00:31
hamitrongotta re-invest00:31
HazRPGI've seen so many use the phrase... yet, when they do come into a nice sum, they don't actually roll in it as they said they would - but maybe I take the phrase a little too literally :P00:32
hamitronthey maybe mean dog poo?00:33
HazRPG. . . . . . .00:33
* hamitron shrugs00:33
hamitronnever tried it00:33
hamitron"don't knock it till you've tried it"00:33
shaunowell, there goes the new laptop :(00:34
dutchieand probably :(00:34
HazRPGhamitron: guessing you've never had to unblock a toilet with your bare hands before then...00:34
hamitroni've used gloves00:35
HazRPGnot that I'm saying I have...00:35
HazRPGhamitron: not quite bare though is it ;)00:35
HazRPGand on that note... I think its time for a topic change :P00:35
HazRPGshauno: so, what is the tax rate over there exactly?00:36
hamitronbut if someone wants to.... so long as they are out of smell range, let them00:36
shaunousually just over 20.  plus whatever charges they keep inventing00:36
HazRPGshauno: so how's it 45%?00:37
HazRPGshauno: life insurance, etc?00:37
shaunobecause my bonus took me way out of my bracket00:37
shaunoand it appears the taxman responded by pocketing pretty much the whole thing00:38
hamitronwhat rate is the higher bracket?00:38
shauno40, plus charges00:38
shaunotheir latest thing has been to call new taxes 'charges', because they exist outside of tax brackets00:38
dogmatic69_HazRPG: 25% :O00:38
HazRPGdogmatic69_: yeah...00:38
hamitronsounds familiar00:38
HazRPGdogmatic69_: that a wrong value?00:39
dogmatic69_the site i was looking at said im on about 20%00:39
HazRPGdogmatic69_: look up BR00:39
HazRPGI think its BR00:39
hamitronbasic rate?00:40
dogmatic69_wait, i guess its above 20%... a portion is being taxed at 40%00:40
shaunomy best guess is that their plan to solve unemployment, is to screw anyone who does work, so hard that they'd rather leave the country00:40
HazRPGhamitron: yeah, that's what I always get placed on with every job00:40
HazRPGworks out worse then bing on an L code00:41
dogmatic69_HazRPG: http://listentotaxman.com/index.php00:41
HazRPGdogmatic69_: yeah I use that site a bit00:41
shaunothink I'm gonna take a walk into work tomorrow to pick up my chit 'n see what the numbers actually look like00:42
dogmatic69_should just get the work to pay directly to HMRC and then let them send you any change00:42
HazRPGshauno: heh, you know the first time I'd ever heard the word "chit" was when I was in the Philippines, and they tried to rip us off00:42
HazRPGthey tried to charge us twice00:42
shaunoseems to happen most places :/00:43
HazRPGironic thing is, we were told the story about watching out for them bring the chit back once you'd paid earlier that afternoon00:44
HazRPGI worded that poorly00:44
HazRPGhmm... we were told earlier that day about a story of a guy who got ripped off by bring the chits back after he'd already paid... apparently they'd printed two prices one on either side00:45
HazRPGone was higher then the other side00:45
HazRPGI've made it my soul will to take photos of the chit & cash and then again when they take it away with the cash...00:46
HazRPGcan't say we're lying then :P00:46
HazRPGalmost got ripped off a second time later that evening, but I'd done the above and threatened to call the police on them00:47
HazRPGsoon went quite after that :)00:47
hamitronvolume to headphones never goes high enough from comps00:49
HazRPGfirst time, they tried to make out that me and my dad were pissed and that we didn't know what we were saying... just because apparently they can do the math and work out how pissed we are on how many we had per hour... clearly they've not met the Mike & Haz drinking duo ;p00:49
HazRPGhamitron: windows?00:50
HazRPGhamitron: its due to european sound volume laws00:50
hamitronfk europe00:50
hamitronerm, ignore them I mean00:50
hamitronI want power00:50
HazRPGthere's a way to get around it...00:50
shaunoI just can't do it cap'n00:50
hamitronI use an external amp00:51
HazRPGI know on my MP3 player (creative zen) for it to be hearable I had to set it to 25 (max vol) to hear it... I went and downloaded the US firmware... setting the volume to 25 would blow my ear off00:51
shaunoI'm so annoyed at this, that I'm really tempted to buy the laptop anyway & just enjoy being broke as dirt this month00:51
hamitronshauno: if you wait, prices may fall00:52
shaunonah, it's a mac.  they don't get cheaper :p00:52
hamitronthey get more powerful then00:52
hamitronor you could get a cheaper proper machine that is built more carefully00:53
HazRPGhamitron: my trick... build the machine yourself00:53
dutchieHazRPG: i find that headphones in my laptop are painflu at more than ~60%00:53
shaunoI'm not into homemade laptops :)00:53
dutchiepainful even00:53
hamitronHazRPG: a laptop?00:53
HazRPGhamitron: not only do you get a longer warrenty on your gear... you also get to build it the way you want :D00:53
HazRPGso win-win \o/00:54
dutchiehamitron: yes00:54
hamitronwhat is there to put together on a laptop? :|00:54
HazRPGdutchie: also depends where your headphones were bought/manufactured, and what voltage they're optimized to00:54
HazRPGhamitron: http://goo.gl/5SlX900:56
HazRPGhamitron: its do-able, you just have to be prepared to spend a bit of time measuring what you've got to work with00:56
shaunoyou're not going to end up with anything near sensible doing that00:56
hamitronI personally buy them ready made00:57
shaunolaptop motherboards don't come in standard shapes & sizes00:57
HazRPGhttp://goo.gl/rLJtG <==00:57
hamitronwhy not solder all the parts onto a circuit board?00:58
HazRPGhamitron: I've always argued that RAM, CPU, GPU should all just be tracked up properly on a single board to get rid of lag/latency/bottle-necks00:58
shaunothat article points out that you don't really get a choice of motherboard00:59
HazRPGbut until intel/amd/nvidia/ati/etc can all play nicely... its unlikely to ever happen00:59
hamitronAMD owns ATI...01:00
shaunoso you get to pick your own cpu & harddrive, just so you can put together a laptop that's twice the size of something you'd otherwise buy01:00
hamitronI like to read plenty of reviews of off-the-shelf models, and pick the best for me01:00
hamitronheck, not even worth building a desktop pc these days for average joe01:01
hamitronI like to get a laptop with less memory though, saves a lot of money, cheap to upgrade yourself01:02
shaunoyeah, I never mess with build-to-order options.  they never work out well01:03
hamitronshauno: btw, I am a bit of a mac fan too, just always been too tight to invest :/01:03
hamitronmacbook pro look nice :)01:04
shaunoeg, ram in apple laptops. buying it BTO you pay twice as much for the ram, and make it more difficult to return it if anything goes wrong01:04
shaunoif you buy a 'stock' model it's easy to get them to take it back at the first sign of trouble.  BTO, they'll avoid it unless they really have to01:04
shaunoso you buy it stock, and just put the old ram back in if it needs to be returned01:04
shaunocheaper & you get better service.  no-brainer :/01:05
hamitronsilly really :/01:05
shaunoand that's one of the less silly examples :(01:05
hamitronI am still considering doing something really silly... building a comp with a fpga01:05
hamitronnot helping me resist doing so, when I am shown building laptops01:06
shaunoI really fancy playing with that, to toy around with some odd cores01:06
shaunobut I'm waiting for someone else to take care of the hardware first :)01:06
hamitronthere are verilog and vhdl samples of code under the GPL01:07
shaunothere's a whole bunch on opencores01:07
hamitronmain hurdle is getting everything available working together01:07
hamitronI'm also not sure what architecture I'd want01:08
hamitronmaybe a 286 with minix as the OS01:08
hamitronthen have a GSM module and stuff to make phone calls01:09
shaunowell that's boring.  they already exist :p01:09
hamitrona 286 phone....01:09
hamitronif you wait for someone else to make something for you to build.... they will already exist then ;p01:10
hamitronI'm not looking at designing my own cpu core, OS and everything01:10
shaunosee, that's the bit I want to play with01:11
hamitronI want to....01:11
hamitronjust not yet01:11
hamitronbuilding a comp from scratch with parts already available is a start01:12
shaunoI'm really curious what it'd actually take to take an old cpu design, move it to 64bit, and move the OS with01:12
hamitronwhy you need 64 bit?01:12
shaunobecause 2038 is coming :)01:12
hamitronfor a really rubbish phone, cost me £350 just to start I worked out01:13
hamitronand that is worse than everything else on the market.... apart from it would be all mine ;)01:14
shaunookay, I've done the math, I'm still getting my mbp, and Herself is going to hang me.  sorted.01:15
hamitronsomeone did point out to me I'd be better getting a N90001:16
hamitronin fact, a few have told me01:17
shaunothe real problem here of course, is that I insist on spending 2 grand on a nice laptop.  but I'm not gonna let the frikken tax man stop me01:17
hamitronhaha, yhe01:17
hamitronI think my plan in the near future is to sort my mass of crap01:21
hamitrondon't need all the machines I have setup01:22
shaunowire it all together and see if it attains sentience ?01:22
hamitronand the ones I keep really need to have similar setups01:22
shaunowhy? if they're similar you don't need them all :)01:22
hamitronubuntu 10.04 with a apt-cache01:22
hamitronthey do different tasks01:22
hamitronand in different rooms01:23
hamitrononly got 5 in this room01:23
hamitronalso, different tasks on different machines, means the systems you have don't struggle as much01:25
shaunoI still want to figure out what on earth they did with the numbers tho, because this can't be right01:25
hamitronI was considering having vmware to have less machines, but it really doesn't work as well01:25
hamitronshauno: if it is wrong you get a refund at the end of the year?01:26
hamitrontax year I mean01:26
shaunoI've no idea how that works here, because I've never got anything back from them01:26
hamitronI actually have a seperate bank account labeled "tax savings"01:27
hamitronand 50% of all my profit goes into it01:27
shaunothese numbers just can't be realistic.  my bonus is 12% of my annual.  what I actually received was 0.02% of my annual.01:28
hamitronbut you are an employee :/01:28
hamitronsounds messed up01:31
hamitron0.02% is enough for a laptop? :-o01:32
HazRPG...thats odd01:32
shaunoheh, no, 0.02% isn't enough for a laptop.  it's enough to make me cry :p01:33
hamitronif it was enough, I was gonna cry ;)01:33
shaunoit means instead of spending my bonus on the laptop, I'm spending a large chunk of my regular pay instead01:34
shaunobut I think my choices are either make it work, or go visit the revenue office & get arrested :)01:40
HazRPGyou know what, I never did hear from that guy about my extension again...01:59
HazRPGI wonder if he just gave up out of noobrage02:00
shaunothe local apple shrine doesn't open 24hrs.  do I drum my fingers on the desk for 7 hours, or take a nap02:12
HazRPGdrum fingers on desk :D02:13
hamitrondrum for 1 hour, then nap ;)02:13
HazRPGwe are here to assist your boredom :)02:13
shaunoooh, I have credits on audible .. that might burn a few minutes02:13
HazRPGyou buy audio books often?02:13
shaunoI subscribe to their 'audiblelistner' thingie, where you pay a flat rate and receive a couple of credits a month02:14
shaunothen whenever I remember, go along and turn them into books :)02:14
HazRPGI've always been told that audio books are useful if you want to do other things while listening to a book... but well I find I end up being sad at the edge of the seat as I listen... so I might as well have just read it lol02:15
shaunoI keep meaning to cancel it, but whenever I remember it's still there, it's racked up enough credits that I get excited about getting new books instead :)02:15
hamitronwhat do the server iso have on?02:17
hamitrondifferent kernel?02:17
shaunoit is a different kernel for 64bit, for 32bit it's just -generic02:18
HazRPGit just has less gui-related tools and apps02:18
hamitronmaybe not worth me downloading02:18
hamitroncan just install cli from the 32 bit cd02:19
HazRPGhamitron: don't you mean remove the desktop environment?02:19
hamitronthere is a stripped version option on the alt cd02:20
shaunothat'll give you an idea of what it does differently02:20
shaunothere has to be a prettier version somewhere, but the seeds are handy for getting straight answers02:22
HazRPGhamitron: if you want I could just burn off a 32-bit and 64-bit version of ubuntu-server and ship them to you02:22
HazRPGif it's the download time that your worried about02:22
hamitronI've got better internet now ty02:22
HazRPGI'll even ship another disc with the .iso on it :)02:22
hamitrongetting 1.4mbit stable02:23
HazRPGthat not torture?02:23
HazRPGI have trouble with 8Mbps02:23
hamitronbetter than the 0.2mbit I was getting02:23
shaunoif you've already got a mini iso, I'd just go with that and build up as required02:23
hamitronmy plan is to use mini.iso02:24
HazRPGthere is a mini.iso?02:24
shaunogetting the -server kernel by default isn't worth wasting a whole cdr on02:24
hamitronbut grab the .deb's off the alt cd, so i don't have to download it all02:24
HazRPGhamitron: that was the main reason I said I'd ship it to ya if ya wanted :)02:25
HazRPGpostie should be around in about 3hrs or so :P02:25
hamitronI love these mini.iso02:26
hamitronthey should be advertised more02:26
hamitronI couldn't actually find them through the ubuntu website02:27
hamitronhad to use google02:27
shaunothat's probably pretty intentional02:27
hamitronit is? ;/02:28
HazRPGnew users would have a hard time with them if they found them by mistake and tried to use them02:28
shaunogiven the users ubuntu's aiming for, a few obvious choices is better than long list of decisions02:29
HazRPG"I'll download that one cos its smaller"02:29
hamitronwhen i started with ubuntu, I actually went to debian because I didn't know about them for a while02:29
shaunoif you compare http://www.ubuntu.com/desktop/get-ubuntu/download   to http://www.debian.org/CD/02:30
HazRPGhamitron: you mean you didn't initially trust ubuntu over debian?02:30
shaunoubuntu defaults to 'the latest 32bit desktop', with an easy option to switch to 64bit if you're sure02:30
hamitronand defaults to the livecd hassle02:31
shaunodebian gives you a list of http/ftp/torrent/jigdo, and then gives you a list of 10 arches without any clues02:31
shaunoeven then, the netinst images are less than obvious02:32
hamitronI don't mind the page as it is, just give more options under "alternative downloads"02:32
shaunoif you want choices, you use http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/  :)02:32
hamitronwhere is that advertised?02:33
HazRPGyou know, I just thought... windows has made it easier for people to download and burn iso files... isn't that almost like a step in the right direction to making it easier to people to download linux and install it?02:33
shaunoright here baby :D02:33
shaunoit's not advertised.  because it's confusing to users, and skips mirrors completely.02:33
hamitronoh, and it put me on a slow ass mirror earlier02:33
* Azelphur built this today, http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/Photos/March%202011/IMG_20110324_225040.jpg02:34
Azelphurmy second PC build :)02:34
shaunothey keep doing that to me.  geoip keeps giving me heanet in dublin02:34
shaunowhich is lovely, geographically.  but it's slow as pants02:34
hamitronAzelphur: more like a monster, with that dongle out of the front02:34
Azelphurhamitron: don't hate my Ubuntu stick :O02:34
hamitronwhat is glowing on the mobo?02:35
shaunowhy does everyone make PC cases look like bad props from scifi movies :(02:35
Azelphurhamitron: Republic of gamers logo :P02:36
hamitronbright white02:36
hamitronerm, ok ;/02:36
Azelphurpretty leds :302:36
hamitronI like a boring case02:36
directhexshauno: a combination of reasons02:36
HazRPGshauno: hmm, it always seems to point me to heanet too :/02:36
directhexhamitron: i like understated.02:36
shaunoHazRPG: geograpically, it's probably right.  but it's wrong.02:37
directhexa case should look like a bentley, not an old type-r with custom decals02:37
hamitronblack with some sort of trim is nice02:37
hamitronbentley ;/02:37
Azelphurhamitron: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/Photos/March%202011/IMG_20110325_023445.jpg02:37
shaunothis is a pretty obvious reply from me, but I really wish it was straight forward to put a normal motherboard/psu in a mac pro case :)02:37
Azelphurubuntu stick :D02:37
directhexhamitron: mine's http://www.hardwarezone.com.ph/img/data/articles/2007/2280/Lianli_Casing2.jpg02:37
shaunothat tells me I've come to an invalid page?02:38
hamitronmine did first time02:39
HazRPGdirecthex: that's pretty cool02:39
shaunobut lianli are pretty hot in general.  until they try to give you more 5" bays than anyone will never need, and completely ruin the lines02:39
hamitronre-pasted and worked02:39
hamitronlianli do a DTX case I fancy02:39
hamitrononly trouble, psu is on the side :/02:40
Azelphurhttp://www.maximumpc.com/files/u7/antec_case-thickbox.jpg my case :D02:40
shaunoI kept looking for htpc cases that were pretty.   they seem to be rarer than hen's teeth too02:40
HazRPGmy case: http://www.bjorn3d.com/read.php?cID=73102:40
HazRPGAzelphur: hmm, that seems to be a rather popular case02:41
shaunoif you ever get to play with a mac pro, take the side panel off and marvel at what a good case looks like :)02:41
HazRPGshauno: nah, what ya want is a dell server case!02:42
AzelphurHazRPG: indeed :)02:42
HazRPGman oh man... those cases are tidy in there!02:42
shaunoHazRPG: http://www.architosh.com/features/2006/reviews/macpro/images/macpro_inside-lg.jpg   that tidy?02:42
HazRPG(tidy as in everything nicely has a place and no wires trailing everywhere...02:42
HazRPGshauno: ... that looks rather scary actually lol02:43
HazRPGnot cos it's an apple or anything02:43
HazRPGjust... well.... how are you meant to access anything??02:44
HazRPGlooks like a mecano set02:44
shaunoyou pull it out02:44
shaunoit's all just modules.  they're just fitted together perfectly to make 3 or 4 air channels02:44
HazRPGwell as long as you can access stuff... then that's pretty cool02:45
shaunoI really wish I could do that with a bog-standard intel workstation mobo02:45
directhexhamitron: old case was http://www.casedesigns.net/wp-content/lian-li-pc-v1100-1.jpg02:45
HazRPGI was half expecting it to be like a laptop, where one panel just reveals another layer of panels that you need to unscrew02:45
shaunomost of it's completely obvious once you start yanking things.  except the cpu coolers, which are a complete *cough*02:46
HazRPGshauno: well, I'd say you could... http://www.bjorn3d.com/Material/ReviewImages/TtShark/ttsinsideimage.jpg02:47
HazRPGshauno: that's the inside of mine02:47
shaunothey use a gel/liquid paste between the die and the cooler, so once you break the seal to remove the heatsink, you need a new one02:47
HazRPGshauno: I must say, nasty cough you've been having today ;)02:48
shaunoI really do try not to swear in here :)02:48
shaunois there a shelf in that one? or is that just a strut/bar02:48
hamitronmy case http://www.ebuyer.com/product/11958902:48
HazRPGnot quite a shelf...02:48
HazRPGbut its not exactly going to fall off02:49
shaunoI meant more, is it compartmented02:49
HazRPGits got like 1.5 inches on flat metal on either side where the PSU goes02:49
HazRPGwhich bits?02:49
HazRPGwhat you see is what you get :P02:50
shaunoat the top where the psu goes, I can't tell if that's compartmented so that it's a separate airflow, or if that's just a well-placed strut02:50
HazRPGI can take some close ups for ya if you like02:50
shaunojust a slight angle would help :)02:51
shaunoperfectly side-on makes it difficult to see what that horizontal bar actually is02:51
HazRPGI'll apologise for lighting before I take it... won't be that great because i don't intend on turning it off lol02:52
shaunoit's just one thing people don't seem to think out when they homebuild cases.  most seem happy enough to be "a box with everything in it"02:54
shaunoand don't particularly care that their super-duper video card(s) are heating the entire case02:54
hamitronstill there? ;)02:55
shaunoI mean, I'm just as bad.  my PC has hairties holding back some cables that seem insistent on repositioning themselves inside the cpu cooler02:56
HazRPGshauno: https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/5m49vq5G7lMNkt5dM8qTeg?feat=directlink02:57
shaunocool, that does look like the top section is mostly blocked off02:58
shaunoand I like that people have started sticking harddrives sideways.  that makes so much sense it's silly02:58
HazRPGshauno: yeah, the top is mainly blocked off02:59
shaunoused to have a machine where I had to unplug almost everything from the board, because the drives were so close to the mobo, that the path to pull them was obstructed02:59
shaunosideways, the cables don't interfere with airflow, and I can pull the disk without disturbing the rest of the machine :)02:59
HazRPGthere's another two fans you can't see in that photo (or any most photos)03:00
HazRPGits between the front door and where the hard drives go03:00
HazRPGactually I think its just a huge big fan...03:00
shaunothat said, the best case I've ever had was http://www.aqua-computer.de/images/products/systeme/chieftec_1_500.jpg03:01
HazRPGiirc, it blows air in from the front, and blows it out to the outer fan and up through the psu03:01
HazRPGso two exists, one entry03:02
shaunochieftec makes some pretty monstrous cases, but doesn't go overboard on making them look like scifi props03:02
HazRPGand the lid that goes in the open space is just essentially a grill... so the air from the CPU just blows straight out03:02
HazRPGprobably the worst way of testing, I did the fag test on it...03:03
HazRPGlit up a fag... and watched how the air goes through03:03
HazRPGalways paranoid about airflow03:04
shaunoI just get irked by things that seem like really bad choices03:04
shaunolike a psu that vents air in thru the bottom and out thru the back03:04
HazRPGlike having a PSU at the bottom of a case >_<03:04
shaunoso if it's mounted in the top of the case, the feed is hot air from the cpu03:05
shaunoif it's mounted in the bottom, the feed is choked03:05
HazRPGshauno: nah, when its mounted at the bottom, people tend to have the fan pointed up03:05
HazRPGso... its technically draws the heat from the GPU03:05
shaunoI don't mind having the psu in the bottom.  bottom-heavy is useful :)03:05
HazRPGeither way you can't win03:06
HazRPGshauno: guessing you haven't noticed the feet in my image then03:06
shaunoI don't like that they seem determined to line the front wall with hdd bays03:06
shaunomy old one had feet.  hate 'em :/03:07
HazRPGshauno: where would you have them?03:08
shaunoanywhere they're not obstructing :)03:08
shaunothe drive cage in yours03:09
HazRPGoh... see if I designed a case... I'd ideally have them slot from the top03:09
hamitroneither of you know a good ITX case?03:09
hamitronfor an i3 system03:09
shaunopicture that turned 90º, then stuffed in the space infront of the psu03:09
HazRPGhamitron: I've had this case for 4-5 years or more dude, so not really :P03:09
shaunoso they're slotted | | | | with something to pull air out the top of the cage03:10
HazRPGshauno: ah, see that's where I was going with the HDD's :P03:10
shaunothen you can actually pull air from the front of the case out the back03:11
shaunoif you picture yours without the drive cave in the front, you'd be able to put two front-fed ducts in it03:12
shaunoone feeding the gpu, one feeding the cpu03:12
shaunoand just venting straight out the back03:12
shaunoso neither of the hottest components in the case are being fed air that's been pre-heated03:13
shaunothe gpu there, looks like if there's a cooler on it.  it's feeding and venting into the same well of air between the card and the base of the case03:14
shaunoI realise these things don't actually turn out to be problems in the real world, but I like it if it makes sense in my head :)03:15
* shauno wonders how long it's kosher to rant to himself before it needs to be cut shot03:18
hamitronjust looking at cases03:23
hamitronas my ITX is in a full ATX case atm03:23
shaunoif you come across one that looks like a nice, clean dvd player, let me know :)03:23
HazRPGshauno: https://dl.dropbox.com/s/lpcogv6tvve7frd/Case%20Design.png03:24
shaunoHazRPG: what I'd love to do, is build it in two layers03:24
shaunoso looking from the front you've got -|-03:25
shaunothe motherboard is | in the center.  one side has cpu & gpu, ducted so they're individual airflows03:25
shaunothen the other side of the mobo, you've got psu & cd/dvd in one channel, and harddrives in the other03:25
shauno(because dvd aren't a significant source of heat, they're just annoyingly big boxes you've got to stuff somewhere)03:26
hamitronI like the look of this: http://techreport.com/articles.x/19641/103:26
hamitronshame about the slim dvd drive03:26
HazRPGwell in that picture I made, the top is its own compartment03:27
shaunoI don't mind slim; I'd love a slotloader03:27
HazRPGalthough, I guess what would be better... would be to have a spacer between the PSU and HDDs03:27
HazRPGand have a fan in the front blowing out so the HDDs are on their own airflow to the PSU03:28
shaunohttp://www.origenae.co.kr/images/products/h5/htpc_shot5.jpg    something like that, but with a slot-loading dvd, and no display, just a little trapdoor exposing some usb ports on the front03:28
shaunoI don't need a display & ir receiver, we've two phones & an ipod that are all quite capable of being boxee / xmbc remotes over wifi03:29
shaunobut I do want front-facing usb ports, because if I can't hook up controllers for mame & emulators, it may as well just be a $20 dvd player03:30
HazRPGalso means you can't have mates come over with a USB and a film attached ;P03:31
shaunoreminds me03:32
HazRPGand if you say that doesn't happen often... does here :P03:32
HazRPGI like my new cast that arrived today03:32
HazRPGfar better than the ones amazon were planning on selling me03:32
shaunodoesn't here, none of my friends live in the same country as me :p03:32
HazRPGsurely you have friends there though :P03:33
shaunosome day, I really should get off my rear and do something with this junk; http://dl.dropbox.com/u/23042/4.jpg03:36
HazRPGand actually make a mame machine?03:37
Azelphurgah, Natty installer is annoying me03:37
HazRPGI must say I've been tempted myself :P03:37
Azelphurfirst time around it crashed, second time around it presented me with an option to replace Natty (no mention of my windows install) and wiped the entire HDD \o/03:38
Azelphurso now I need to reinstall windows again :P03:38
HazRPGnote: never install alpha/beta builds on production/development systems :)03:41
AzelphurHazRPG: yea, I didn't loose any data it's a fresh install :)03:42
Azelphurjust irritating that I have to go back again :p03:42
shaunonote to self; wow/mage ebooks shouldn't be advertised in public :p03:42
Azelphuralso I run natty as my main OS :D03:42
HazRPGAzelphur: indeed :P03:42
HazRPGbare soul03:42
Azelphurhave been for like a month now03:42
AzelphurHazRPG: it's even more brave when you realize how off the wall my system is03:43
HazRPGI did that during Jaunty, Koala, and prob a few others... never again >_<03:43
AzelphurI doubt anyone on the testing team has a GTX 570 with an x58 mobo, twin graphics cards and quad display03:43
shaunoI've never done that.  half the point of moving off debian was to get onto a sensible release cycle & not have to track unstable03:44
HazRPGI booted up one day (I always have install security updates by default)... and poof everything was gone03:44
AzelphurI'd actually like to move to a rolling release distro/fork one day03:44
AzelphurI hate having to manually install everything to keep it up to date03:44
hamitronoff to bed03:44
Azelphurhaha I doubt it'd delete my data, if the OS goes wonky I'll just reload03:45
hamitronno decent cases out03:45
AzelphurI have separate /home03:45
shaunonight hamitron03:45
HazRPGAzelphur: I did >_<03:45
Azelphurand it just wiped your data? wow :o03:45
shaunoI had sid show up unbootable a good few times, but never any data loss03:46
HazRPGAzelphur: short answer - it fudged the grubnuts03:46
shaunothe only one I actually remember was a bad glibc update03:47
HazRPGproper answer: if corrupted the filesystem when they were playing around with extx (x being the number I can't remember they were playing with)03:47
shaunowhich was entertaining, because it meant that any process that ended, couldn't be relaunched03:47
shaunoit was a good lesson in not resorting to reboots to fix things tho :)03:49
AzelphurAnyone know what on earth these are btw? http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/Photos/March%202011/IMG_20110325_034541.jpg03:49
Azelphura bunch of them came with a case I bought, I've assembled the entire machine without using them03:49
HazRPGhard drive locks03:49
HazRPGinstead of using screws03:49
HazRPGmine has them03:49
AzelphurI see o.O03:49
AzelphurI wonder how they fit on xD03:50
shaunoduct tape!03:50
HazRPGits **** awesome!03:50
HazRPGspecially if your like me and constantly getting bigger hard drives to store more stuff03:50
HazRPGsome will be for the CD/DVD bays too03:51
Azelphuryou havn't seen my case clearly :p03:51
HazRPGI have... I helped a friend build a machine with your case :P03:51
HazRPGnot *your* actual case fyi :P03:51
Azelphureasy to replace parts are easy to replace03:51
HazRPGthose are easy to attach btw :)03:52
HazRPGthe two plastic pins go where the screws normally would03:52
HazRPGthen twist to lock in place :)03:52
HazRPGmost of the cases that have those aren't necessary to screw both sides of the devices03:53
AzelphurI see03:53
HazRPGmine, is almost near impossible to get to the other side even if you *did* want to screw them from both sides03:54
Azelphurin other news, I made a minecraft skin...be afraid http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/screenshots/March%202010/2011-03-25_03.53.05.png03:54
shaunomine's a pirate :)03:54
Azelphurhaha :)03:54
Azelphurthe eyes...they are looking at you xD03:54
HazRPGmines a smiley dude in a suit03:54
AzelphurI keep seeing people with creeper skins, so annoying03:54
shaunoit'd go well with my "thing" for building ships, but you can't rotate view to screenie yourself03:54
HazRPGshauno: can if you have someone else do the screen ;)03:55
HazRPGor get dual accounts...03:55
shaunothis is my latest project.  baconomatic :D03:55
HazRPGwait... how!03:56
shaunopigs & lava03:56
HazRPGjust traps unsuspecting p...03:56
shaunoand ladders03:56
Azelphurshauno: mines better :p03:56
shaunodun care :)  mine's single-player, so doesn't need silly amounts of bacon :)03:57
Azelphurshauno: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/screenshots/March%202010/2011-03-20_22.56.23.png03:57
Azelphurhehe :P03:57
shaunoalso, http://dl.dropbox.com/u/23042/2011-03-14_03.32.32.png   makes me happy03:58
shaunomorning kaushal03:58
kaushalAzelphur: hi03:58
kaushalshauno: hi03:58
Azelphurshauno: haha03:58
HazRPGAzelphur: where'd you get the 'buntu stickers from for your flash drive?03:58
HazRPGmornin kaushal03:58
AzelphurHazRPG: ubuntu shop03:58
kaushalplease help me understand about the issue http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/585182/03:58
kaushalHazRPG: Hi03:58
kaushalHow do i resolve it03:59
HazRPGkaushal: try visiting - http://archive.ubuntu.com/04:00
HazRPGdoes that even load up?04:00
Azelphurkaushal: it looks like a connection issue, your trying to download from archive.ubuntu.com but getting local IP addresses04:00
Azelphuryea, try that04:00
HazRPGlooks like its timing out04:00
shaunoI think that's intentional, popey was helping him setup a caching apt proxy the other morning04:01
kaushalshauno: that fixed it04:01
kaushalso when i remove the local lan address from sources.list04:02
kaushali still get the error04:02
kaushalLet me pastebin the error04:02
shaunoHazRPG: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/23042/2011-03-25_04.08.51.png    my current project, and why my toon needs a pirate skin :)04:10
Azelphurshauno: nice :D04:11
Azelphurshauno: I have a base under an ocean miles away from everyone else :D04:11
Azelphurit's funny people keep asking me why I'm in the ocean when looking at the map :)04:11
shaunoit was walled on 3 sides, until I needed to expand the rail into two tracks.  much tnt later ..04:11
shaunoso now the left-hand side looks a bit .. gimpish04:12
Azelphurshauno: http://game.azelphur.com:8123/ pull the side bar out and click Azelphur :P04:12
Azelphuralso blimey I'm the only person on, that doesn't usually happen :p04:13
shaunohah, nice04:13
shaunowhat are you using for that map ?04:13
Azelphurhehe, I literally swam out there, dove into the ocean and chugged food while drowning to start digging XD04:13
Azelphurit's live, if I run around you'll see, watch :P04:14
shaunohah, that is snazzy04:14
shaunoand the textinput lower left?04:14
Azelphurthat's for chat04:14
HazRPGshauno: wicked :D04:14
shaunothat really is quite nifty04:15
Azelphurindeed :(04:15
AzelphurAlso Windows 7 is stupid, Password: (Recommended), Password Hint: (Required)04:16
AzelphurIt's ok if you don't have a password, just as long as you have a hint to the password you may or may not have, it's all good.04:16
shaunoI was trying one called pigmap, but it completely outweighed the available ram on my vps04:16
Azelphurhehe, this basically generates chunks as changes happen04:16
Azelphurso it's low resource04:16
shaunooverviewer is going nuts now that my map is about 35Mb04:17
Azelphurmy map is 150MBish xD04:17
shaunoI set overview going doing day & night views of my map, and woke up to sms yelling at me about disk quotas :(04:17
Azelphurquotas, I don't have to worry about them04:18
shaunowhich is a poopy way to wake up, because that host does my email, so no disk = no mail04:18
AzelphurI don't even particularly worry when I get DoS'd, I've got so much bandwith I just iptables and absorb04:19
AzelphurIt's nice :)04:19
shaunoheh, well I'm not paying $150/mo :)04:20
shaunoneither do I need that kinda beefery for a mailserver04:20
shaunostuck a failover mx on one of buyvm's $15/year plans, other than that I'm happy on £10/mo04:21
Azelphuryea, I need a lot of server for multiple gameservers :)04:21
Azelphurgot plenty of room for minecraft though :)04:22
shaunohttp://paste.ubuntu.com/585188/   :D04:22
Azelphurshauno: http://pastebin.com/yXPBQuWy :D04:23
shauno(0 cached because failover mx does diddlysquat until I break the primary)04:23
shaunoew, you're swapping04:23
Azelphurlol 1.8GB for MC server atm :D04:23
Azelphurall 16MB XD04:24
Azelphurand that's because of kernel swappiness04:24
Azelphurit's a performance thing, it's fine and actually faster than not swapping04:24
Azelphur(you don't want to swap on a VPS, but on a dedi it's faster/fine)04:24
shaunoI tend to take anything that spends too long in swap, as a sign that it probably shouldn't be there04:25
HazRPGI'm guessing Rhythmbox doesn't actually store the library anywhere... it just scans the folders each time...04:25
HazRPGor am I wrong with that assumption ?04:25
shaunoHazRPG: I hope you're wrong :)04:25
HazRPGshauno: can't find a folder where it'd store its data other than gconf04:25
Azelphurshauno: the notice how I have 3.7GB in buffers/cache? :P04:26
shaunothis is where I <3 apple for fseventer.  but .. hmm .. strace?04:26
shaunoyou should be able to watch exactly what files it's hitting04:27
Azelphurshauno: the kernel is prioritizing keeping files cached in memory which are constantly being written to, rather than some idle application that's doing nothing04:27
Azelphurso on a dedi this is faster, it keeps the files it's constantly messing with in memory and slams some totally idle process into swap04:27
shaunoAzelphur: ofc.  I just avoid having idle apps doing nothing :)04:27
Azelphuron a VPS it's bad because disk I/O is at a premium :P04:27
HazRPGI'm lost now lol04:27
shaunobut when I'm that narrow for ram (that claims I have 256, but I've 128+burst), I have to04:27
Azelphurshauno: pfft, guess where I started my empire?04:28
shaunomongolian steppes?04:28
Azelphurshauno: 32MB VPS running debian :)04:28
shaunoHazRPG: try ~/.local/share/rhythmbox04:29
shaunothat's dot-local04:29
AzelphurI had that from vpslink.com, they totally messed me about I had like 90% packet loss to the server and they made up some crap about how I was out of RAM when I very clearly wasn't :p04:29
AzelphurI ranted about it here, and Daviey hooked me up with a VPS for the same price that didn't suck, then later I upgraded to 64MB, 256MB, then I went and got the dedi :)04:30
Azelphurhttp://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/screenshots/February%202011/2011-02-19-005746_1633x777_scrot.png internet empires :P04:30
HazRPGwow firefox 4 loads pretty darn fast!04:30
HazRPGshauno: cheers :)04:31
shauno4.30am .. half way there04:33
HazRPGshauno: ah, again cheers... managed to fix my db for it :)04:34
HazRPGkept saying I didn't have songs that I knew I actually did in said music folder :/04:35
shaunoI think 'NODATA' is the imperative word in that paste.  I don't think your cache is actually returning anything04:37
shaunoif you can find any logs for service that's providing the apt cache/proxy, I think they'd lead you to the problem04:38
shauno(or if you can wait until the sensible people start waking up, you may find someone who uses the same apt-cache service)04:39
Azelphur:( natty installer crashes every time for me04:45
* Azelphur tries a 10.04 CD04:47
shaunohttp://www.flickr.com/photos/usnavy/5553425877/   do want.04:50
shaunoI keep putting the kettle on & forgetting to make coffee.  how am I ever going to survive 5am like that04:57
AzelphurMy mob spawner machine randomly started producing eggs, upon further review, http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/screenshots/March%202010/2011-03-25_04.53.19.png04:59
AzelphurI wonder how he survived the lava and made it down there, very enterprising o.O04:59
Azelphurcan't complain, free eggs are free :D04:59
shaunough.  now I want to play, but I can't be bothered rebooting for it05:16
HazRPGaww man, apparently ubuntu wasn't selected for the google summer of code05:20
HazRPGshauno: reboot?05:26
shaunominecraft keeps crashing with GL errors, but seems to work fine on 10.705:27
shauno10.7 being a developer preview, I don't tend to use it any more than I have to05:28
HazRPGhmm, how come books aren't subject to VAT?05:28
HazRPGshauno: ah, that makes sense05:29
HazRPGspeaking of coffee...05:29
* HazRPG goes to make a brew05:29
shaunoI think I'm getting old.  I've discovered that the bbc world service is actually interesting05:31
HazRPGhmm, I started reading the news about 2 years ago :/05:37
HazRPGI get called old just for that alone05:37
shaunoalso feels a bit daft that my preferred way to do so now is streaming on my phone :/05:57
shaunoseems incredibly wasteful after years of building radios, but it's so damned handy05:58
HazRPGwait, I'm lost... you mean the bbc world service?06:03
HazRPGI don't know if its real leather... but this kindle cover smells like it is :)06:06
HazRPGdon't know why, but the smell of fresh(ish) leather is just awesome06:06
shaunoused to live next door to a guy that'd tan hides on a wooden post at the bottom of the garden.  less than awesome :p06:07
HazRPG... don't know what that would smell like06:08
shaunomostly just strange chemicals06:09
HazRPG... ... ... ... why did I expect the "text-to-speech" on this would actually speak in Stephen Fry's voice (other than the fact that he's the author of this sample ebook)06:09
shaunoso the kindle's new then ?06:10
HazRPGoh, heh yeah only just got it this week :P06:10
HazRPGwhy do ya think I'm currently obsessed with it at the moment - new toy to play with :)06:10
HazRPGwas an impulse-buy when I saw it in tescos @ 4am in the morning06:11
shaunoI do want to pick up something to read pdfs a bit more comfortably, but not yet06:12
HazRPGif even I'm rolling it... I'll get you one ^^06:13
shaunowell the plan was to pick up a new ipad this month, until I discovered I had a bonus coming06:13
HazRPGI'll even let you pick what model/make :P06:13
shaunojust holding off because this laptop's degraded to the stage where replacing it comes first06:14
HazRPGhmm, guessing text-to-speech is never going to sound properly /real/ is it06:15
shaunoit's getting better, but: no06:15
shaunomy a500 did text to speech.  my mac does too, and it's really not that significantly better06:16
HazRPGI'm  going to find this archived log in 10 years time and probably eat my own hat for saying /never/ lol06:16
shaunoI mean, it's noticeably better, but doesn't feel like 20 years worth of improvement06:16
shaunohm, that's a new one from firefox06:17
HazRPGI don't know... the kindle does sound better than most though... but well I'll let you be the judge06:17
* HazRPG scurries off to record06:17
HazRPGshauno: ?06:17
HazRPGogg okay with you?06:18
HazRPGhmm, how odd (you link)06:19
shaunohah, that's awesome06:20
shaunoI can't figure out what plugin it thinks it needs06:22
HazRPGwait, you have a SID plugin for firefox?06:22
shaunoI do06:23
HazRPGis that the plugin your having trouble with?06:24
shaunohm, would I be able to find the text of that anywhere?06:24
HazRPGthe book?06:25
shaunoI don't think so, just noticed it in the plugin list06:25
shaunoyeah.  or atleast just the passage they're reading out06:25
HazRPGhard to follow?06:25
shaunowas curious to compare with what the OS has built-in06:25
HazRPGah :P06:25
HazRPGMoab Is My Washpot, by Stephen Fry06:26
shauno$ find /Library/ -name SIDPlug.plugin06:26
HazRPGit showed up as "recommended" for me apparently06:26
shauno/Library//Internet Plug-Ins/SIDPlug.plugin06:26
shaunoapparently it is a browser plugin, it's not just being lifted from somewhere else.  <3 sidplug06:26
HazRPGyou know, I keep forgetting the MacOS has a unix base lol06:26
shaunotechnically, MacOS doesn't, and Mac OSX does :p06:27
HazRPGpedantic much :P06:27
shaunosorta :)  but as MacOS is an OS, and isn't remotely unix-based at all, it makes a difference :)06:28
HazRPGhang on, if you want I'll see if I can cut the DRM out of the sample06:28
shaunono worries, taking a peek to see if I can find it on mine06:28
HazRPGooo, see now that's much better... (speed of calibre v.0.7.50, as opposed to the v.0.7.18 in the repo which I was using a few nights ago)06:29
HazRPGif you've got an android, or Kindle for Mac (PC/etc) software, you can grab the book that way06:30
HazRPGnot sure if you can grab it without a "kindle" based piece of kit06:30
shaunohah, $6 what?06:30
shaunoI got kindle.app :)06:30
HazRPGah phone :P06:30
shaunonaw, http://www.amazon.com/gp/feature.html/?docId=100046493106:31
HazRPGiPhone more precisely06:31
HazRPGah, so Kindle for Mac... like I said :)06:31
shaunoI use stanza on my phone.  it's fantastic :)06:32
HazRPGI've heard about that, any good?06:32
shaunoI like it06:33
HazRPGwhat format do you want the book in?06:33
shaunomostly because it doesn't try to tie itself to any store  (well, multiple stores)06:33
shaunoepub would be easiest, otherwise I think I have calibre around here somewhere06:33
HazRPGwow... that... actually... worked!06:34
HazRPGclearly the samples aren't DRMed06:34
shaunoheh, I just found the sample :)06:34
HazRPGwas going to say take your pick, its in azw and epub06:35
shaunotrying to figure out why kindle.app hasn't noticed yet :/06:36
shaunoah, there we go.  just have to restart it, because it's braindead06:37
HazRPGso the "give it a knock on the head" tricked made it work then06:38
HazRPGspeaking of "why didn't it work", I'm pretty such I said "buy" to two books @ £0.91p ... and they still haven't come through yet (even when hitting sync)06:39
HazRPGwait, what was the $6 for?06:39
HazRPGthis book is £2.65 apparently06:39
HazRPGso that would be ... $4 at most?06:40
shaunothat's the price .com was giving me06:40
shaunopft, can't copy & paste.  ty amazon06:40
HazRPGstop people stealing books I guess06:42
shaunoI'm just trying to get text-to-speech to play the same section you did06:42
shaunothey've disabled Services, so I can't do it from within the app itself06:42
HazRPG(but I'm pretty sure there's a py script that opens Kindle for PC/Mac select book, close, and it asks you where to save the DRMless book...06:42
HazRPGI linked to epub above :)06:43
HazRPGI'll redo from page 1 if you want?06:44
HazRPGbecause that's from 31% (whatever that means) of the book06:45
shaunono worries, I'm getting there :)06:45
HazRPGdo you want man or woman version? :P06:46
shaunoI'm just playing with this now.  it'll sing it if I ask it to :/06:47
HazRPGif you've still got my tmp folder open, refresh and you'll see sample-female.ogg06:49
HazRPGits playing page 1 (or well start of chapter 1) and a bit of the 2nd page too06:49
shaunosee if you can play http://dl.dropbox.com/u/23042/sing.aiff06:49
shauno(no idea what aiff is, but it's apparently the default output for the voice engine :(06:50
shaunoit's less fair comparison, and more 7am ADD :)06:51
HazRPGaiff is an old sound format iirc06:51
HazRPGI remember that format from when I was 1406:51
HazRPGcouldn't play that in totem06:51
HazRPGopening up in audacity06:51
shaunospeaking of 7am, I'm surprised no-one's awake yet.  MartijnVdS hiding?06:51
HazRPGoh yeah... random06:52
shaunotell me that's not just a little bit strange :)06:52
shaunoI'd love to leave it on that setting, but I actually use the speech engine :/06:52
HazRPG...strange, all I understood from most of that was "bacon slicer"06:53
HazRPGand the start06:53
HazRPG"you should watch out for... he is Chinese... dead legs... bacon slicer"06:53
HazRPGwas all I could make out :P06:53
shaunosounds like a fun night out06:53
shauno(not the default voice either, but the one I tend to have it on)06:54
HazRPGhmm, apparently audacity is still open06:55
* HazRPG tries vlc for now06:55
HazRPGapparently not06:55
shaunothe firewall app I use, uses voiceover if it needs to prompt, but it can't come to front06:55
HazRPGright... where do I kill it06:55
HazRPGoh right06:56
shaunowhich would be an odd detail, until it needs to ask for an outbound exception while I have a game running06:56
HazRPGerm... that's... I don't know which one I don't understand more :S06:57
shaunoeg, if I open minecraft, hit fullscreen, and then try to connect to a server I haven't used before, I get big boomy voice of god telling me the connection's been filtered06:57
HazRPGsounds like stephen hawking06:57
shaunoyeah, they all kinda do.  except the silly ones, which sound worse :)06:58
HazRPGhmm, see at least the kindle one is understandable I guess :)06:58
HazRPGshe's even more audible when set to the slow option, however does sound a bit more mechanical07:00
HazRPG(if that's even possible)07:00
HazRPGthere's a point, does ubuntu have one?07:00
HazRPGapparently there's "Festival" that does it in ubuntu... but not provided ootb07:04
HazRPGisn't that technically discrimination against people who can't see :S07:05
AlanBellHazRPG: I have about 90 irssi windows at the moment07:05
HazRPGAlanBell: woah, no way!07:06
AlanBellspeech in Ubuntu is provided ootb07:07
kaushal_is there a way to know the hard disk rpm ?07:07
AlanBellHazRPG: at a terminal prompt try: spd-say "Ubuntu like totally rocks dude"07:08
kaushali checked sudo lshw -C disk and hdparam and cat /proc/scsi/scsi07:08
HazRPGAlanBell: also, good morning :)07:08
kaushalno info there07:08
kaushalAlanBell: hi07:08
AlanBelland yeah morning all07:08
AlanBellkaushal: normally printed on the disk, just pop it out and have a look07:09
HazRPGAlanBell: oh wait, yeah I've heard that voice before in mumble... heh, I thought it was built into mumble since it does the same in windows07:09
HazRPGfestival sounds nicer though :)07:09
HazRPGI'll see if I can get a recording of it :P07:10
AlanBellspd-say uses speech dispatcher07:10
AlanBellwhich is a common interface to many speech to text back ends07:10
AlanBellso it could use a nicer synthesis if you plugged one in, then applications like orca would just use it too07:10
AlanBellone thing you can do with the mechanical voices is speed them up, some blind people listen at *huge* speeds07:11
shaunothey'd love ireland then07:12
HazRPGsorry the volumes a bit low... i didn't check it before saving07:13
HazRPGactually that's really poor... I'll try that again07:13
shaunocheck to see if it'll spit it straight to a file?07:13
shaunoeg, on mine I just did say --voice ralph --out ralph.aiff <file07:14
HazRPGits like python, when you type in festival, it takes you to a "festival> " prompt07:14
shaunosure.  and like python I bet it can be run non-interactively too :)07:14
HazRPG--pipe sound about right?07:15
* HazRPG looks in man07:15
shauno--tts filename seems to read from a file, but it's still asking for /dev/dsp :(07:17
shaunoRun in named language, default is english, spanish, russian and welsh are available07:19
shaunooverachiever :/07:19
HazRPGwell "festival --pipe > file.ogg" then giving it something to say after the prompt, then closing didn't do anything07:20
HazRPGits just a blank file :(07:20
kaushalAlanBell: sorry was away07:20
kaushalits a remote server07:20
kaushalrunning ubuntu 10.0407:20
shaunobonus points for BUGS: More than you can imagine.07:21
HazRPGapparently you can pipe it through using echo "text you want to say" | festival --tts07:23
shaunothe manpage :)07:23
HazRPGbut to save to file, you can't for some reason07:23
HazRPGthere's a program called text2wave though07:24
HazRPG(apparently not)07:24
shauno$ dpkg -S `which text2wave`07:24
shaunofestival: /usr/bin/text2wave07:24
HazRPGoh heh, yeah just realised (doh!)07:24
HazRPGwait... so its part of festival :S07:25
shaunoexactly :)07:25
HazRPGto the BATCAVE!07:25
AlanBellkaushal: with hdparm -t you can test the performance of it, but I don't think that gives RPM directly07:25
HazRPGshauno: >_< >_< >_<!!!! OWWW!07:26
HazRPGTOO LOUD! (thinks he's gone def now)07:26
HazRPGthat output was really really bad!07:27
shaunobad? or do you just have your volume all the way up because your last one was so quiet to listen to07:27
HazRPGI'm at 15% (and now have sore ears)07:27
HazRPGI'll see if I can clean it up in audacity07:28
shaunoI'm sure I had a way to query for a harddrive's model number, but every VM I try it on laughs at me for not having a harddrive07:32
HazRPGnope... that's just unfixable for some reason...07:33
shaunoI think I'd just resort to dmesg | grep -E 'ATA|IDE' as they're printed during boot, then google the model number.  the actual rpm isn't really communicated to the OS because it simply doesn't need to know07:35
HazRPGshauno: http://www.hazrpg.co.uk/tmp/ubuntu-festival-is-talking2.ogg07:40
shaunoI don't know what worries me more about google.  that they'll one day end up implanted in my skull.  or that I one day won't have access to google07:40
shaunoHazRPG: four-oh-four!07:41
HazRPGhttp://www.hazrpg.co.uk/tmp/ its in there!07:41
shaunoaye, but you spelt it wrong :p  copy 'n paste man07:41
shaunoI'm bored.  I think I'll update my natty VM.  :D07:42
HazRPGbleh, I typed it out because I'm just c&p-ing the file from one directory over to the server lol07:42
shaunoI name the directory each vhost lives in, by it's canonical name.  so I can copy 'n paste from there :)07:43
HazRPGwhat was the thing you needed to do in 7hrs (remembers you said something about staying up or napping because of a thing)07:43
shaunoeg, /srv/www/example.com/tmp/07:43
shauno:(  upgrade wants to remove gnome-user-guide07:44
HazRPGah see I have my setup differently07:44
HazRPGits a windies server ya see07:45
HazRPGbefore /htdocs/ I have these folders: cgi-bin, logs, (and a few backup ones)07:46
HazRPG(and a few protected pages I think go inside there too)07:47
HazRPGhmm, should this worry me? (error.log) :: 2011] [error] [client] client sent HTTP/1.1 request without hostname (see RFC2616 section 14.23): /w00tw00t.at.ISC.SANS.test0:)07:52
HazRPGwow, apparently I've been getting a few attacks over the last few nights#07:59
HazRPGall checks for usual folders (does not exist because of my folder scheme)08:00
DJonesMorning all08:20
MartijnVdSHazRPG: HTTP server?08:22
MartijnVdSHazRPG: Welcome to the world of constant attacks.. same wit hssh08:22
MartijnVdSthey won't hurt as long as you keep up to date (and maybe install something like fail2ban and configure it to ban IPs that make an "evil request" too often)08:23
TheOpenSourcererI run denyhosts on all our servers and public facing devices.08:24
MartijnVdSTheOpenSourcerer: does that work for non-ssh things as well?08:24
TheOpenSourcererDunno. That's the one I'm really bothered about.08:24
MartijnVdSyeah, that's also fail2ban's default08:25
TheOpenSourcererSeems like it's just ssh/08:25
MartijnVdSbut it can read any log file you ask it to (as long as you supply a regex that matches "this is evil" lines )08:25
* MartijnVdS nattyfies08:25
TheOpenSourcererInteresting - I might take a look at fail2ban.08:27
DJonesI'm in the market for a new laptop, priced below £500, lower if possible, are there any specific machines people would recommend that work OTB and are minecraft capeable :)08:32
MartijnVdSIntel graphics are dirt cheap08:33
MartijnVdSand have proper GL support, so I imagine MC works08:33
DJonesminecraft, sorry08:33
ali1234eg http://www.laptopmag.com/review/laptops/dell-inspiron-mini-10.aspx08:34
AlanBellthere are loads around £350-400 with 1366x768 screens and intel graphics that will work fine08:35
DJonesali1234: I'm probably looking more for a desktop replacement rather than netbook08:35
AlanBellAMD or core i3 processors08:35
MartijnVdSi3 ♥08:35
TheOpenSourcereri3 is nice, shame the VGA port scanning issue is *still* there though.08:36
DJonesAlanBell: Thats about the sort of thing I'm looking for, although preferably a 1600*900 screen08:36
MartijnVdSTheOpenSourcerer: port scanning issue?08:36
MartijnVdSTheOpenSourcerer: explain :)08:36
AlanBellyeah that issue is dragging on08:36
TheOpenSourcererHang on.08:36
AlanBellvga port output is wobbly08:36
DJonesAlthough that does seem to bump the price up quite a bit08:36
MartijnVdSAlanBell: ah.. so DVI is fine?08:36
TheOpenSourcererBug 61423808:37
ali12341600x900 is a weird resolution08:37
lubotu3Launchpad bug 614238 in Linux "Intel Core i3 External Monitor Wavy Output" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/61423808:37
MartijnVdSAlanBell: I have no problems using DVI/HDMI on my i308:37
AlanBelland you can get hdmi-DVI adapters quite easily08:37
DJonesIdeally, 1600*900, 4Gb memory, dvd rewriter, maybe hdmi output08:37
gordah must be spring, giant bumble bee's have started invading my house, causing me to run in fear like a child08:39
DJonesIs there much performance difference between an i3/i5 & Athlon II X2 dual core08:39
DJonesIts that long since I bought a computer, I'm not up to date on processor performance08:39
gordi would expect so i<thing>'s are crazy fast08:39
AlanBellunless you are doing something specific then don't worry about the CPU08:39
gordlooking up a quick benchmark - i5's are about 2-3 times faster than the fastest X208:40
MartijnVdSI bought to soon.. Sandy Bridge has i7s with built-in graphics08:41
* MartijnVdS wants08:41
AlanBellI would pick an i3 with more ram over an i5 with less08:42
MartijnVdSI hit the peak of my i3 sometimes now08:43
MartijnVdSit's really frustrating08:43
MartijnVdSbut if/when I upgrade I'm also buying a bit more RAM :)08:43
BigRedSI've generally heard that i3s aren't worth bothering with08:43
BigRedSthat is from hardware snobs, though08:44
gordif i have 2gb of ram then i'm not interested in more, i would pick an i5. ram is easy to upgrade, cpus aren't so much08:44
gordi3's are budget cpu's, you get what you pay for08:44
* BigRedS tries to only get what other people pay for08:44
ali1234lol 2gb08:45
gordi'v get to be in a situation where i require more than 2gb of ram08:45
DJonesali1234: 2gb would be a 4 fold increase in what I'm using :)08:45
BigRedSyeah, I don't imagine I'd have issues with 2gb08:45
BigRedSI've no idea what I have now08:45
ali1234my current memory usage is 2.4gb08:45
BigRedSheh. 2GB08:45
ali1234i'm not even running anything special08:45
gordali1234, real memory or cache08:46
BigRedSI run firefox, claws & terminator basically08:46
AlanBellI have several virtualbox instances running08:46
screen-xI have 384MB free out of 8GB on a normal desktop.08:46
ali1234if i started up a virtualbox i would be swapping because i only have 4gb08:46
gordthere are instances where you would require > 2gb memory, but most people don't need that08:46
MartijnVdSi3s are the Celerons of this age :)08:46
ali1234yeah, instances like "opening more than one firefox window"08:47
gordali1234, no - firefox will make *use* of more ram, but it doesn't require it08:47
MartijnVdSali1234: or just the one with a Flash page08:47
BigRedSyeah, i can get loads of firefox on this08:47
BigRedSit needs restarting every few weeks, but it is a web browser, not some HA server08:48
ali1234flash is using only 38mb08:48
ali1234firefox is using 500mb08:48
MartijnVdSali1234: Flash uses 100% CPU though08:48
MartijnVdSit does for me, all the time08:48
ali1234currently the highest cu user is gnome-system-monitor at 32%08:48
ali1234that's the only thing using more than 1%08:49
screen-xHeh, my highest residential memory user is shutter, an annoying perl screenshot tool that I keep meaning to remove08:49
BigRedSit's a daemon?08:50
screen-xBigRedS: not really, but I forget to kill it as it starts whenever you press prtscrn08:51
gordcpu is something you want on demand, it might not be used 100% of the time like ram is, but when it is used you want it to finish its operation as quickly as possible. its "time sensitive" - you want "enough" ram, but generally you always want a faster cpu08:52
gordgood morning cztab!08:52
* czajkowski peers at gord oi cheeky no cake for you08:52
czajkowskifar too early to be tabbing me08:52
screen-xczajkowski: I'm not sure I've ever typed czajkowski08:53
ali1234there's simply no point having a fast CPU if every operation causes a page fault which take 1.3 seconds to service08:53
ali1234which is my current situation08:54
gordali1234, you'll note the word "enough". if you had less ram firefox would simply not cache as much stuff08:54
gordthe idea that it would eat in to swap is just plain false. else using firefox on my netbook would plain not work08:55
ali1234it's funny, because firefox on my netbook *does* plain not work08:56
gordmaybe you need a faster cpu ;)08:56
ali1234or more memory08:56
gord1gb memory on my netbook, works great08:56
gorddual core 1ghz cpu08:56
=== tim_ is now known as mistertim
mistertimjoin #liftweb08:57
mistertimsorry all08:58
mistertimmissed a /08:58
ali1234highest memory user on my netbook is actually empathy08:58
ali1234at 127mb08:59
ali1234does zeitgeist serve any purpose if i don't use unity?09:00
gordbunch of programs use it09:00
gordlook at your deps09:01
ali1234i removed it, only thing that got removed with it was unity09:01
ali1234and a bunch of libraries like libzeitgeist09:01
shaunodropbox tends to be my biggest memoryfiend :(09:05
bigcalmMorning peeps :)09:09
kazademorning bigcalm09:09
HazRPGshauno: same :(09:13
HazRPGdoes natty actually play nice in vbox yet?09:14
shaunohow'd you mean?09:15
HazRPGor rather does vbox play nice with natty09:15
HazRPGshauno: well, it was having render issues...09:15
shaunoit works for me, it just doesn't exhibit anything that people are complaining about, because there's zero 3d support09:15
HazRPGhmm, might have to give it a shot09:16
ali1234hmm... well firefox maximum memory cache is 29mb... that blows away the "it's caching" theory09:20
HazRPGali1234: ?09:20
shaunofirefox has always given me the impression that it likes to pig out on about 80% of whatever's available09:21
HazRPGshauno: same, I've downloaded ff4 and it seems to at least run the minute you clicked the shortcut/executable09:22
HazRPGso at least it's a fast hog now :P09:22
shaunoI've not used 4 much, as I can't seem to track down why it always resets geometry back to a screen I'd rather it wasn't on09:23
gordfirefox only using 12% mem here09:23
HazRPGI don't know where to ask this, but here's as good a place as any I guess... but well, why is it that ubuntu applications don't update as fast as the developers who made said apps push it out09:24
shaunothey're not meant to09:24
HazRPGI mean I understand ppa's are available to fix that... but well... is there not a way to do it without that?09:24
ali1234yeah, install gentoo09:24
gordHazRPG, we build a stable release, just taking developers latest crack leads to an unstable release09:24
shaunoif you google rolling release, you'll find plenty of distros that do track upstream as best they can09:24
gordthats why there is a 6 month release cycle, so we can build stable releases and you still have pretty new software09:25
ali1234"stable" doesn't mean "it doesn't crash" like most people mean09:25
oimonHazRPG: in the olden days we didn't even have PPAs09:25
shaunoI still don't have ppa's.  I came for the predictable release cycle :)09:25
oimonali1234: too right. RHEL6 only contains KDE4.3, which is far more buggy than 4.609:25
ali1234it means any security fixes will be backported to the current version but not new features09:25
HazRPGoimon: you make it sound like I'm knew to ubuntu :P09:25
shaunoHazRPG: the basic theory is you grab whatever's new and shiny, but within the realms of supportable.  and then spend most the release cycle polishing it up until it's ready for release day09:26
shaunoinstead of grabbing whatever's newest a week before release, and hoping you don't get fired for it09:26
ali1234the result of this is that the packages are about 6 months to 1 year behind in terms of features09:27
oimonand there used to be a hideous app called automatix that everyone used to "do an ubuntu mint" after install. however it was discovered that when you upgrade to the next release it completely screws up your system. we've come a long way since then09:27
* gord shudders at the name09:27
oimonnow it's called ubuntu tweak :P09:27
HazRPGoimon: heh I remember those days, I hated that application >_<09:27
gordalso you may have set off many peoples old notifys ;)09:27
shaunoyeah.  6-12 months old, but in a state where the platform guys believe they can support it going forward09:28
ali1234if you want to break your system with bleeding edge packages might as well just install gentoo09:28
oimoni need to keep a tomboy note of all the gconftool tweak i need instead of installing ubuntu tweak09:28
ali1234or maybe arch is more popular now, i dunno09:28
shaunogentoo's too crazy.  debian sid can be fun tho :)09:28
HazRPGali1234: never been a fan of gentoo... mainly because I found it too cumbersome, and a pain to install09:29
gordi live on the the latest ubuntu's - sometimes its almost like a rolling release :( not fun09:29
ali1234the big problem with gentoo is... they never fix bugs in anything, they just upgrade to the new version with new bugs09:29
ali1234at leas that was the problem when i stopped using it09:30
MartijnVdSnot that Debian is much better, after release09:30
MartijnVdSor Ubuntu for that matter09:30
HazRPGwell, I guess all these points make sense... and well I did have my suspicions to similar as to why it was done on a ~6 month release cycle, just nice to actually have it confirmed :)09:30
BigRedSI've had a mostly bug-free Debian existance, really09:30
shaunoI've always felt the two should meet in the middle09:31
shaunohave a core platform released on a sensible schedule, then desktop craziness rolling along on top09:32
HazRPGshauno: it technically does with LTS09:32
BigRedSshauno: so Debian Stable & Debian Testing?09:32
ali1234well you could always install portage on top of lts server09:32
oimoni have discovered a bug in rh6 that i suspect will continue for the whole 6.x release cycle. similar problems with rh5.x and an intel driver09:33
oimon3 yrs with the same killer bug09:33
shaunooimon: I wish you'd call it rhel, because I remember 5.x from the 90s :)09:33
oimonme too :P first one i used :)09:33
AlanBellI was just thinking I have a rather dusty old rh6 book on my bookshelf09:33
HazRPGshauno: why the el?09:33
oimonbug in fedora13 = bug for whole rhel6.x series09:34
shaunoHazRPG: that's what it's called now09:34
HazRPGred hat el?09:34
shaunoredhat is the company, redhat enterprise linux is the product09:34
AlanBellso they reset the numbering system then?09:34
oimonAlanBell: i went to the #redhat room on your advice the other day, you should take a look :) it's for the old school rh and still has 30 people in it09:34
shaunoI believe it got to redhat 9 and then split into fedora, rhel, and what not09:35
oimon#rhel is where they hang out now. but i was more concerned about the 30 still in #redhat09:35
AlanBellheh, didn't know that09:35
HazRPGI thought it was just changed to 2 forks, red hat - paid, for businesses (and people who can afford it, etc), and fedora09:35
AlanBellI only guessed at the channel name09:35
gordso i just found out we are entering Blue in our eurovision entry this year, apprently its 199809:35
oimoncalled fedora "core" for a while09:35
shaunoHazRPG: kinda09:36
oimongord: blue, theb boy band, now man band?09:36
shaunoHazRPG: I believe the "plan" is that fedora's a playground where they get to beat up new toys, and rhel is the stable product they give to customers that want stability09:36
shaunofrom our point of view, the fact that fedora is free turns out to be a bigger point09:37
HazRPGshauno: I thought fedora was a community effort... a fork of red hat before they went corporate09:37
HazRPGmuch like SuSE and openSuSE09:37
BigRedSalso, the idea is that Fedora feels more like a community project, RHEL like a polished 'enterprise' product09:38
BigRedSand it's supposed to feel that way - Fedora's not trying to be a Centos09:38
shaunofedora's still largely redhat's thing.  it's not meant to be a "shed The Man" fork09:38
HazRPGshauno: see that's what I thought it was when I first heard about it about to split off09:39
HazRPGreviews  back then just made it sound like the community wanted to keep it free and open (in the true sense of the word)09:39
oimonthe problem is that RHEL is often a fedora freeze - so the bugs get frozen too09:39
HazRPGwas about the same time I stopped using red hat... and looked elsewhere09:39
oimonredhat bugzilla is where bugs never die09:39
HazRPGfor a while didn't have anything linux-based as my main machine because I was testing out the various different waters09:40
HazRPGI did have DSL on a laptop at one point, just because it was a really really old laptop09:40
oimoni still use RHEL/Centos a huge amount. it's a good server distro. although i have it on ~150-200 desktops too09:40
HazRPGoimon: hmm... what is it you do exactly?09:41
shaunoHazRPG: I had bbc-lnx for my main distro for a while.  never again :)09:41
oimonHazRPG: work in a university09:41
BigRedSshauno: that sounds... interensting09:41
oimonHazRPG: fortunately with users who like linux09:41
HazRPGshauno: surely you mean lnx-bbc?09:41
HazRPGoimon: nice09:42
BigRedSoh. I was expecting a micro clone09:42
shaunoI swear it was the other way around.  'business card linux'09:42
HazRPGoimon: the uni I was at seemed keep to spread the news about linux too... always good to see really :)09:42
HazRPGkeen* (not keep)09:42
oimonHazRPG: it's amazing how fun computer can be when you don't have to deal with windows problems09:42
shaunowe passed over linux almost entirely at college.  installed rh5 on a desktop, got it on the network, called the job done and never touched it again09:43
oimonHazRPG: however there are changes afoot...big bosses are calling for "Enterprise Solutions" - which means they want to pay someone loads of money for an oracle system that does half the things a php/mysql system does well09:43
HazRPGshauno: hmm, I remembered it as lnx-bbc... but then maybe I saw it after a possible name change :S09:43
oimonshauno: what a missed opportunity :(09:43
shaunoHazRPG: their website seems to agree with you.  I just don't recall ever calling it that09:43
HazRPGoimon: typical :/09:43
shaunoI used it for a while when I was using garnome as my main desktop.  building the rest of the OS with gar seemed like a good idea at the time :)09:44
HazRPGshauno: heh, yeah we did that at college too - weirdly09:44
shaunoHazRPG: it was bizarre.  it came and went so fast that nothing really stuck with anyone09:45
shauno"this is linux.  it can ping the network, see!  next week, moar turbopascal!"09:45
shaunoI don't recall it coming up in exams either.  I think someone was just trying to confuse us09:46
* oimon used solaris exclusively during his degree09:46
HazRPGwell when we were doing it I think we used RH5 or RH6... not sure which, but it was basically "and this is linux, everyone build a machine with these old parts (it was a hardware class just to point out)... and then we'll  be installing red hat onto them..."09:46
shaunoheh.  you didn't go to college in barrow did you?09:47
HazRPGI asked him about it (the tutor), and he said the main reason was because the techies wouldn't let us use the college windows keys...09:47
HazRPGshauno: nope, carlisle "tech" college09:47
shaunothat makes a worrying amount of sense :(09:47
HazRPGcumbria folk ay!09:48
shaunoI ain't cumbria folk :)  I just spent 10 years passing thru09:49
HazRPG... you confuse! I wasn't saying you were cumbrian lol09:50
shaunoI ain't no farmer :p09:50
oimongoing to work in a wheelbarrow might beat the congestion charge though09:51
JamesTaitOh, hi everyone! :D09:51
HazRPGshauno: tell ya what, I'll give ya the keys to the combine, and we'll see ya drive it - THEN we shall see ;)09:51
HazRPGJamesTait: hey dude :)09:51
shaunoI've never tried a combine.  I've crashed more than my fair share of jcb's tho09:51
HazRPGthat's a little worrying..09:52
shauno(and terrified the life out of some poor yank by driving one on the "correct" side of the road)09:52
HazRPGalso, I've drove a tractor as a laugh before... because one of my mates from college lived on a farm (at the time)09:52
* oimon is going on holiday near "diggerland" http://www.diggerland.com/devon/09:53
shaunoI worked on a farm for a summer :)09:53
HazRPGshauno: xD09:53
shaunosmiley face purely in past tense.  it was hell.09:53
HazRPGah that makes sense09:53
HazRPGooo arrr ooo arrr09:53
screen-xshauno: very hard work?09:53
shaunoa very strange farm.  the whole thing was set up as a tax write-off for a retired millionaire09:53
HazRPGscreen-x: didn't involve a computer was the problem ;)09:53
shaunoscreen-x: I planted an orchard.  by hand.  they thought it was funny.09:53
screen-xshauno: you planted an orchard for the lolz?09:54
shaunofor someone else's lolz09:54
HazRPGscreen-x: does sound like that doesn't it :P09:54
HazRPGshauno: aren't all lolz for someone else's benefit?09:54
screen-xshauno: seems like a strange reason to pay someone to plan an orchard09:54
shaunoI also crashed a ford f350, two horse trailers (empty), two jcb back-hoes, one "little kabota", and one golf cart09:55
screen-xshauno: are you sure you weren't filming for topgear?09:55
shaunowhich taught me a lot about mending split-post fences :(09:55
* HazRPG has a vision of shauno in dungeries trying to fix a fence backwards09:56
oimonjust learned that facebook is only for over 13 year olds09:56
screen-xoimon: oh, I thought it was 1609:56
shaunoscreen-x: we ran into a small issue where they simply didn't believe that I couldn't drive.  they all learn at school.09:56
HazRPGoimon: \o/ free gold star09:56
oimoni know a lot of under 10s that use it09:56
Hornettbh it should be taught at school imo09:56
Hornetessential skill09:56
shauno13 is the cutoff for the Children's Online Privacy Protection Act09:57
HazRPGoimon: pretty much, I only have it to keep in contact with idiots who are either a) hooked, b) old friends and family09:57
shaunodon't ask me how I know that :)09:57
* oimon has a big family09:57
oimontbh its nice to keep in touch with nephews etc, so long as perants police their use of it09:57
shaunobut googling COPPA will render plenty of info on why 13.09:57
diploI was an agricultural engineer for 5 years, spent beginning of my career on farms fixing equipment09:57
diploPity it payed so badly otherwise I'd guess I'd still be doin git.09:58
HazRPGshauno: oh was this in the states? (drivers ed.?)09:58
shaunoHazRPG: yeah  (hence terrifying people by driving on the correct side of the road)09:58
shaunojust driving out and about, switching sides is a no-brainer, you automatically try to go with the flow.  when you're out in the middle of nowhere, it's up to muscle memory09:59
screen-xdiplo: what did they use distributed version control for on the farm?09:59
HazRPGscreen-x: I'm scared to click that link..09:59
HazRPGshauno: well yeah09:59
screen-xHazRPG: hmm, its just a form reporting profiles of people who are under 1310:00
directhexi drove in france about a year after passing my test. was fine10:00
HazRPGscreen-x: I almost pulled him about that (ba-dum-tish)10:00
shaunodirecthex: I found it fine when there's traffic.  when there's no traffic at all, I couldn't always promise I'd pull out of a T junction into the right lane10:01
HazRPGdirecthex: as shauno said, easy to observe and go with the flow... harder when there's nothing about10:01
directhexstick to the motorway :p10:02
shaunogets a tad more funky when you're driving symmetrical vehicles too10:02
oimonthe software may be free but the mugs are pricey http://shop.canonical.com/product_info.php?products_id=82810:02
HazRPGshauno: you know a vehicle that isn't symmetrical?10:02
shaunoHazRPG: sure.  most passenger vehicles put the driver on one side10:02
MartijnVdSHazRPG: left/right or top/bottom or front/back symmetrical? :)10:03
HazRPGMartijnVdS: I thought he was referring to the overall shape10:03
HazRPGoimon: gotta make their cash somehow right?10:04
HazRPGoimon: pens are a bargain though :)10:04
oimonyeah :)10:04
HazRPGoimon: I remember getting a stack of those for the office at one point :)10:05
screen-xeverytime someone talks about the canonical shop, it is essential that this is linked to http://shop.canonical.com/product_info.php?products_id=77610:05
HazRPGscreen-x: xD10:05
oimonno way !10:05
oimonnever noticed that before10:06
HazRPGscreen-x: that product still... to this date... makes no sense to me10:06
screen-xcomedy ubuntu gear10:06
oimonthe meerkat tee is nice10:06
screen-xsomeone should wear one to oggcamp (figure permitting)10:06
oimoni got a kubuntu tshirt previously, because the ubuntu ones were lame at the time10:06
HazRPGah crud10:06
HazRPGtotally forgot to buy the meerkat tee10:06
HazRPGnow its out of stock (in medium)10:07
shaunoif I had to, I'd assume they made those for something in particular, and had to satisfy a minimum order.  otherwise.  wtf.10:07
MartijnVdSHazRPG: buy the XXL, wear it as a dress10:07
HazRPGMartijnVdS: ... cos that's not disturbing at all!10:07
shauno(that said, google's store also sell cycling gear. there may be some nerdocrati joke that I'm simply not privvy to)10:07
oimonfind it a bit odd that there's a womens' tee with launchpad written across the breast10:08
HazRPGshauno: man-kini? Quite a common joke since borat for some obscure reason :/10:08
MartijnVdSHazRPG: OK, buy the XXL longsleeve hoodie and wear it as a djellaba then10:08
bigcalmI keep forgetting how to do this in MySQL: I have a few joins going on, but I need records from the 1st table returned even if there are no corrolating records in the joined tables10:08
HazRPGseems the last 2 festivals I was at (last year and year  before) people were wearing borat man-kini's :/10:08
MartijnVdSHazRPG: you go to the wrong festivals (or the right ones, depending on your preference)10:09
oimonthe regular polo shirt is nice too http://shop.canonical.com/product_info.php?products_id=64810:09
MartijnVdSoimon: I'd only wear that if I worked for canonical and went to their office10:09
oimoni have a redhat one like it10:09
HazRPGMartijnVdS: if I think your talking about what I think you are... in egypt (and obviously the dialect to which I'm use to) its called a galabaya :)10:09
HazRPGMartijnVdS: Mainly rock festivals...10:10
oimonMartijnVdS: you're right though - if you wanted to get past security, it would be a good uniform10:10
MartijnVdSHazRPG: (also djellabah, galabiya, jellāb(a))10:10
HazRPGMartijnVdS: my friend got a face full of Amy Wh**ehouse >_<10:10
MartijnVdSHazRPG: eww!10:11
HazRPGnote, censored on purpose because its note whitehouse10:11
MartijnVdSHazRPG: wine isn't family-unfriendly 8-)10:12
HazRPGit is when the ** is "or"10:13
MartijnVdSHazRPG: it would be, yes10:13
HazRPGMartijnVdS: ...also, that's a double-negative >_<10:13
bigcalmLEFT OUTER JOIN!10:13
HazRPGbigcalm: heh... was about to say10:14
shaunoI swear I can never find a working pen when I need one.  silly outdated tech :(10:14
MartijnVdSshauno: Pen? Why would you need a pen if you have fingers & blood of your enemies?10:15
HazRPGshauno: also the reason I bought a pack of ubuntu pens...10:15
shaunoI can't use ubuntu pens.  no 3d accell :p10:15
* MartijnVdS accelerates a pen in shauno's direction (through 3D space)10:16
HazRPGMartijnVdS: ... how do you know so much about muslim attire and speech?10:16
bigcalmHazRPG: but you didn't say quick enough :P10:17
shaunorandom man strikes again!10:17
HazRPGbigcalm: I was trying to keep up with all the conversations lol10:17
* HazRPG looks behind him10:17
bigcalmLooks too busy for that this morning10:17
shaunoman I hate phone menus :(10:17
HazRPGshauno: where!?10:17
shaunoin phones!10:17
MartijnVdSHazRPG: People are paranoid... "men in djellaba talking on the phone on a train" have been the source of several bomb scares :(10:18
MartijnVdSHazRPG: so I remembered from the news10:18
bigcalmshauno: you want one button for each task, so no menu?10:18
shaunonot pressing anything no longer means "I don't have a dtmf phone, help!".  it means I wasn't paying attention and need to hear the options again.10:18
HazRPGshauno: still confused...10:18
bigcalmOh, those menus10:18
shaunoinstead, I call them over and over again, writing down a breadcrumb trail of the numbers as I go10:18
screen-xbigcalm: something like left outer join10:19
bigcalmscreen-x: cheers, fixed :)10:19
screen-xoops, I was scrolled up10:19
bigcalm~Living on the ceiling~10:19
bigcalmI think that it's an Absolute 80s dot com kind of day!10:20
HazRPGshauno: ... your special :) ...10:20
shaunoapparently I'm not, because I just found my way back to the start of the menu :(10:20
* shauno scratches out the last 3 numbers10:21
HazRPGshauno: what are you attempting to do?10:21
shaunotalk to my bank10:21
HazRPGuse a local number?10:21
HazRPGgoogle is my friend for things like that :)10:21
shaunonah, the locals aren't very useful10:22
HazRPGI hate 0800 numbers :/ or even 0845 numbers :/10:22
HazRPGwait, your bank makes you press millions of buttons?10:22
HazRPGI always feel like I'm on a gameshow whenever I get put onto a "phone menu" system10:23
gingshauno: can't you find something online to generate the tones you need?10:23
HazRPGging: modem love :)10:23
HazRPGI use to use my modem to prank call people when I was younger10:24
gingsays did you mean modern love ?10:24
HazRPG(refers to previous comment)10:24
HazRPGyou know, I've been tempted to get this so many times: http://shop.canonical.com/product_info.php?products_id=76710:25
shaunoging: the tones are no problem.  following the depths of phone menus to try to get exactly the right person is a royal pain in the expletive tho10:25
HazRPGshauno: mash 0 :)10:26
shaunothing is, I'm at the other end of one of those at work.  I know how annoying it is to get someone who just mashed buttons and ended up with completely the wrong team10:26
gingoh i thought you were strugling to get the tones10:26
popeyX3N: ubuntu-uk still OOMing10:26
shaunono, their menu is just fail.  I ended up 19 options deep10:26
popeymorning all10:26
HazRPGshauno: always works for me, along with say "stupid menu system!" repeatedly... eventually you'll get transferred to a person that'll transfer you to the right place :)10:26
shaunoHazRPG: that's why I don't do that.  most the time I can't transfer people to the right place.  half the time I have no idea what country / company the right place is in10:27
HazRPGpopey: Out Of Mana?10:27
shaunosilly mage.10:27
HazRPGpopey: morning :)10:27
HazRPGshauno: what, I like fire...10:27
HazRPGshauno: and magic...10:27
shaunoget a warlock then. mages are frost or go home now10:28
HazRPGshauno: ah, but there will be an option at the start that says "or to be transferred to someone who can help..."10:28
HazRPGshauno: I would if I still played?10:29
shaunoyeah, that's broken too :)10:29
HazRPGshauno: what bank? And with which number are you calling? And what are you wanting to achieve?10:29
HazRPGMy google foo might help get you the combinations :)10:29
shaunohere's my number one pet hate with phone menus.  on the weekends, support calls for big customers get routed thru to us (if they're from anywhere within emea / anz / nam / asean).10:30
shaunoif people phone the public number instead of the corporate number, and key in the extension number for MIS, they actually key in the menu sequence to get to us10:30
HazRPGheh seriously?10:30
shaunoso almost every weekend we get calls from dubai looking for blackberry support. this confuses them more than us.10:31
HazRPGshauno: ah, that's a cultural thing though... they're telephone systems all use extensions instead of phone menu's10:32
shaunoand they show up for work on weekends.10:32
HazRPGthe only thing (as far as I know) that has a phone menu is mobile phone pay-as-you-go networks10:32
HazRPGshauno: weekends is Thurs, Fri ;)10:33
HazRPGSat is the start of the week10:33
shaunoI know their menus are odd, because if I need to transfer anything to dubai, we have to pick a different phone number for english or arabic10:33
shaunoin theUS, it's just a different menu option for english/spanish10:33
shauno(and for asean, it doesn't matter because you can guarantee the person you get thru to won't speak english anyway)10:34
shaunothis is why I hate phone menus.  I bear the scars of nortel.10:34
HazRPGmost companies in saudi and the U.A.E. tend to either be, a) One number for both, with a number combination for either (then usually asks for an extension number or 0 for operator), or b) different numbers as you said10:34
shaunoon the other hand, I adore australians10:35
HazRPGbut yeah, weekends vary between arabian countries10:35
shaunothey give us a list of cellphone numbers and tell us to call thru them all in order until we find someone sober enough to take it :)10:36
HazRPGin Saudi its Thurs & Friday (Friday is the holy day, much like our Sunday)... in Egypt I think its Friday & Saturday... and U.A.E. is the same as saudi I think - but depends on the companies background10:36
shaunoI've a feeling israel is friday & saturday too10:37
HazRPGusually centred around the Friday, being the day of rest n all10:37
shauno(in other news, iraq doesn't have weekends)10:38
directhexit's friday, friday, the day after thursday?10:38
shaunoanyway, I'm glad I wrote down my breadcrumbs, because I've got to call back.   buahaha.  I won.10:39
HazRPGshauno: my dad only gets Friday off in Saudi... and a half-day on Thurs (but it's a longer shift, it's a 8am-6pm... as opposed to his normal 9am-2pm, then 5pm-9pm)10:40
* oimon might have to find another job :(10:40
HazRPGoimon: why?10:41
oimonjust received news of the impending IT strategy handing down by our fascist dictators10:41
screen-xshauno: the americans seem to think that iraq have friday-saturday as the weekend http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1144.html10:41
screen-xoimon: all opensource from now on?10:41
oimonthey are going to completely destroy the excellent open source infrastructure to replace with micrsoft and oracle products10:41
shaunoscreen-x: I've never had a call from iraq that was from an iraqi.  seems most the "visitors" work to a different timescale10:41
screen-xoimon: very expensive comfortable chairs for all?10:42
popeyoimon: you work at a uni?10:42
screen-xoimon: thats not sounds so good :(10:42
oimondecisions have been made without consideration for the facts10:43
screen-xoimon: are they building an extension to house all the extra windows servers you will need?10:43
oimonand some numpty has looked at a list of top sellng apps and decided thats what we need10:43
oimonscreen-x: yes, although it will get very hot as they will be blade servers10:43
screen-xsounds like an expensive project10:44
oimonall to reduce what we have now to dust10:44
screen-xAren't universities supposed to be strapped for cash these days?10:44
HazRPGoimon: ouch...10:44
* oimon is sad10:44
seekerLinux is great, but when it takes2 hours to change a graphics card I wonder why I bother10:44
jpdsseeker: Try opening your box faster.10:45
seekerjpds: :P physical swap took 30 seconds10:45
popeyi wonder why seeker bothers too10:45
seekerMainly because I can't find anything to replace mythtv with10:46
oimonapparently iptables offers better features than other firewalls but should not be used because it is difficult to support. we are surrounded by bearded linux gurus!10:46
jpdsoimon: Don't you have some formal compliant channel you can bounce this too?10:48
* screen-x wonders if seeker and cking have a common mission10:49
screen-xcking: I read your nick as "seeking",  so I wondered if you were looking for the same thing as seeker..10:51
oimonjpds: it's all coming right from the top.10:51
DJonesscreen-x: I always think helicopter when is see cking's nick10:52
ckingah, cking is just short for colin king ;-)10:52
ckingbut I am always seeking ways to fix things10:53
daubersHmmm.... I have what could be a long meeting on the 31st now. Might need someone to raise some meeting points for me10:54
oimonwhere's a good place to buy solid state drives?10:56
directhexi just use scan.co.uk for things10:57
directhexalthough i have an SSD in my amazon wishlist, for kind passers-by10:57
oimondirecthex: i was just looking on scan and insight10:57
oimondirecthex: which one's on your list?11:00
directhexan ocz vertex11:01
directhexfor price reasons. intel drives are best, but cost more11:01
screen-xstupid flash question, why doesn't performance scale linearly with capacity? Is this because of the controllers limitations?11:02
directhexscreen-x, depends on the type of flash used11:03
directhexscreen-x, thers's MLC and SLC11:03
directhexSLC would scale with capacity, controller allowing11:04
screen-xI was looking at the ocz vertex 90gb and 120gb have the same IOPS and read/write speeds. But they are MLC.11:05
* oimon notices that capacities of SSD are weirdly numbered11:06
screen-xhowso oimon?11:07
directhexscreen-x, you can't afford SLC.11:09
screen-xheh intel's 510 series SSDs have an MTBF of ~130 years, that should be enough to pursuade coporations to buy them.11:09
popeyNg: pls to be looking at bug 74238011:12
lubotu3Launchpad bug 742380 in x11-xkb-utils (Ubuntu) "Error activating xkb configuration" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/74238011:12
popeyalso Daviey11:12
popeyand maybe Laney too :)11:12
* Daviey opens11:12
Davieypopey, logon -> then change keyboard prefs?  or change login prefs and re-login?11:13
popeythe thing I am trying to get fixed is the ~` key on my keyboard does <>11:13
* daubers wonders where his eval SSDs have got to11:13
daubersStill not turned up :(11:13
Davieypopey, i have a hack for that :)11:13
popeyi get it when i login11:13
popeyi dont want a hack :)11:13
Davieypopey, xmodmap11:13
popeyI want it fixed11:13
popeythere is a macbook pro keyboard layout in the keyboard preferences, it should work damnit11:14
Davieyaye... my main reasons for having the hack is because i want a slightly different layout to what is printed on the keyboard11:14
Davieybut yes, it should work11:14
shaunopopey: does it specify it's an en_GB mbp layout?11:15
shauno(just curious.  while the mac layout is more USian than the pc-gb layout, it's not the same as the US mac layout)11:16
popeythere are two options11:16
popeymacbook pro and macbook pro intl11:17
shaunoah, ok.  we should be intl11:17
Davieypopey, gonna restart X to see.11:17
popeyshauno: same issue occurs11:17
shaunopopey: file a bug :p11:17
shaunoI might actually have a play with that one.  new laptop coming, so I'll have a chance to be silly with this one11:18
* popey points shauno to the last 5 minutes11:18
shaunoaw, there goes my shot at being funny :(11:19
shauno7,1 is the same layout as mine tho, that's one I could bash out11:20
Davieypopey, yup.. same issue11:20
ubuntuuk-planet[James Tait] Hacking on txamqp for fun and profit - http://voices.canonical.com/james.tait/2011/03/25/hacking-on-txamqp-for-fun-and-profit/11:21
shaunoor rather, it's the same layout mine should be :/11:22
shaunohttp://dl.dropbox.com/u/23042/layout.jpg   ;)11:24
screen-xmorning shauno11:25
Davieypopey, I didn't see the error activating the mac layout... but i already had it as an option11:25
Davieyi think i'd need to delete it and re-add it11:25
Davieypopey, so we have the international layout?11:26
shaunoI believe so.  macbook US has no key between Lshift and Z11:27
shaunoif the key left of 1 is backtick, you've got the US variant.  otherwise is international11:28
popeyDaviey: i have literally no idea :)11:29
popeywe have the super useful key next to 111:29
shaunoI wondered what that symbol was.11:29
popeyi have never used either of them11:29
davmor2morning all11:30
oimon¬ << what is this symbol?11:30
* popey tickles davmor2 11:30
screen-xoimon: not?11:30
shaunooimon: I've only ever used that as a line continuation11:30
jpdsoimon: sudo apt-get install unicode; unicode ¬11:30
* davmor2 not being ticklish just stares at popey11:30
screen-xoimon: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_logic_symbols11:31
* oimon has a maths degree :P11:31
screen-xoimon: apologies11:31
oimonshould have remembered that.11:31
Davieypopey, I tried to guess looking at the keyboard map... and both seem inaccurate :)11:31
davmor2popey: you got uplink and darwinia installed on your ubuntu box yet?11:31
oimonscreen-x: it's been a while since i though of NOT being anything other than !=11:32
Davieypopey, i made the super useful key map to  #.. as i actually use it :)11:32
popeydavmor2: i have had them for years11:32
oimonwe create really evil pwgen passwords for people.11:32
davmor2popey: :P You would :)#11:33
oimonhowever i realsed that backtick ` doesn't exist on some keyboards11:33
popeyi paid for it a while ago11:33
screen-xoimon: is that to ensure that post-it notes are used?11:33
brobostigongood morning everyone.11:33
oimonthey are temporary wifi passwords for visitors11:34
davmor2popey: I know,  but really real games in USC games that real people might of heard of :)11:34
HazRPGbrobostigon: morning :)11:35
oimonthat game subversion (by the darwinia people) is still being written :S11:35
popeyoh, they're in the store davmor2 ?11:35
davmor2popey: Oh yes, along with crossover office demo11:35
directhexoimon, they take their time11:35
brobostigonHazRPG: good morning :)11:35
gordi'v never seen anything in the ubuntu for purchase thing =\ stupid non released versions11:36
popeyi cant actually see how to get to USC in unity11:36
popeyalso "Find ...rnet Apps" looks rubbish11:36
popeywhere is USC?11:36
oimonone for popey http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQMBGLMtdFE&feature=player_embedded11:37
gordjust type software centre?11:37
popeyi want an icon11:37
gordits in your launcher by default iirc11:37
popeyi dont want to have to type everything11:37
popeynot in my launcher11:37
gordpopey, i used the combo box to change to system, its right there in the system applications11:38
gordor you can just click the system indicator thingy to go to the control centre11:38
popeyoh, i thought you meant in my launcher in the left11:38
popeysystem indicator!?11:38
gordwell on new installs i think its in the left launcher (springboard?) by default11:38
gordpopey, what you click to turn off the computer11:39
popeycan you seriously stop changing the name of stuff!11:39
gorddon't blame me :(11:39
popeythe shutdown thing has no store link11:39
davmor2popey: not for natty yet only maverick11:39
gordpopey, system settings11:39
popeyok, in that11:39
popeythank you11:39
popeyseems like a duff place to put it11:40
popeyooooo i have 6 new recommendations11:40
gordwell you can just use the places (lenses now!) to get to basically the same thing11:40
gordjust open the applications place (lens) and use the drop down box to select system11:41
=== anoon is now known as anoon1
popeydoesnt show up in system11:41
popeyoh, "11 more results"11:41
popeythats 5 clicks to get to USC11:41
gordwell like i said, its in the launcher by default on install11:42
popeyinteresting, wonder why it isnt for me11:42
popeybecause I upgraded?11:42
gordmaybe - i think it ports old favourites from unity 10.10 so if you had a few of those laying about11:42
* popey adds it to comply with THEY WHO MUST BE OBEYED11:42
popeyok, so onto the fun that is "6 new recommendations"11:43
popeyDolphin - kde file manager - no thank you, i have a file manager11:43
gordmy recommendations are just things i had installed once...11:43
popeyFile Manager - uh, I have one11:43
popeyAmarok and Amarok11:43
Davieygord, Stop wasting time on this... and get 2d unity working kkthnxbye.11:44
gordDaviey, i don't work on 2d unity kkthnxbye :P11:44
* popey cuddles gord 11:44
Davieygord, rethink your life, and priorities.11:45
DavieyRecently, at an airport.. after a really tiring week... A Debian Developer walked up to me, and asked me "Why do you exist?"11:46
DavieyWhat sort of answer can you possibly give to that?11:46
popey"to make your stuff work"11:47
gordthe featured apps in usc is pretty good, wish it was more like the android market visually though, but the selection is good11:47
Davieypopey, I wasn't quite sure if he was talking about me personally, or Ubuntu :)11:47
X3Ndoes osc start up in a timely fashion yet?11:47
gordfast enough for me, but my machine isn't a good testbed11:48
X3Ntakes 9 seconds on my i511:48
popeyby way of comparison the app store on ipad takes ~10 seconds11:49
popeyand the app store on my osx takes about 811:50
screen-xsoftware centre takes less then a second to open here :D (10.04)11:50
oimonhow can you choose unity 2d/3d/classic if you have no login password enabled?11:50
DavieyX3N, I just tried it - and exited out as soon as the window opened... took real0m12.335s11:50
popeyoimon: logout11:50
gordpopey, really? wow - oh wait it takes forever on android too :D11:50
popeyactually it went directly to an app i bought11:51
popeylemme kill it and start again11:51
X3Ntakes 7 seconds on my android11:51
oimonpopey: logout?11:51
gordmy phone is getting kinda old and underpowered for android - i keep seeing these fancy "threee deee" games11:51
ali1234osc? the obs client?11:51
X3Nbut it was probably pull data over 4g11:51
gordnever gonna get those to run11:51
popeyyeah, 9-10 seconds11:51
oimonthe session chooser only appears when u ask for password11:51
popeyover wifi11:51
* screen-x installs a stopwatch from software centre to time ios appstore launch11:52
X3Nali1234: i meant usc11:52
DavieyX3N, wow, took over 15 Mississippi's on my android.11:52
X3Nosc on the mind :|11:52
Davieyi'm sure it's not normally that slow.11:52
hooverhi folks11:52
ali1234well it could be worse, it could be hildon-application-manager11:52
gordhonestly... i don't use the android market anymore. just go to http://market.android.com - its nicer11:52
screen-x26 seconds to load app store app (ios4, iphone 3g)11:53
popeywheee, I'm on a roll today11:53
* popey files another bug11:53
Davieygord, wow, i did not know you could install from the webui11:53
popeybug 74239811:53
lubotu3Launchpad bug 742398 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "Missing icon for bluetooth applet" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/74239811:53
ali1234ham takes literally 10 minutes to load up11:54
gordDaviey, yeah its really nice :)11:54
ali1234on n90011:54
ali1234and it gets slower as the maemo repos get bigger11:54
gordhttp://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-03-25-amazon-accused-of-3ds-delivery-failure :(11:54
Davieygord, i am massively impressed.11:56
oimonUSC, and ubuntuone control centre are some of the nicest looking apps around11:56
gordDaviey, people already taking advantage of it, you can install an app on your phone when you lose it, then that app will make a noise :)11:56
Davieyhah!  That is neat..11:57
screen-xgord: you can get the app to start once it's been installed?11:57
MartijnVdSgord: nice thing about Android: you can remote-install apps through market.android.com :)11:58
MartijnVdSscreen-x: autostarting services on cloud-to-device message, easy11:58
gordscreen-x, seems so, applications that are like services11:58
gordits all jabber based so you can do stuff remotely11:58
Garyhey everyone, whatyadoin'11:59
DJoneswelcome back Gary You seem you have been missing for ages12:00
Garyyeah, RL gets int he way eh12:00
* popey tickles Gary till he pukes12:02
gordanyone want two months of love film for free? http://lovefilm.com/share T8N4FM9HB12:02
NafalloI dont believe in free things12:05
hooverbest things in life are free, anyway ;-)12:05
shaunoI don't believe in free things that don't deliver to RoI ;)12:05
gordlovefilm is pretty good, i use it all the time to stream movies12:06
* Gary licks popey 12:08
oimonget a room!12:09
Nafallothis is a room :-)12:10
directhexit's a channel12:12
directhexalso, it's Nafallo!12:12
Nafallohi directhex12:12
Garyoimon: it was only a lick, I'm sure I could do worse12:13
oimonthe other week we had 170 people in here...what happened12:15
DJonesoimon: Clones :)12:16
DJonesHows things Gary, I guess you've been busy12:18
GaryDJones: yes, been very busy, we've moved a server room and refurbished the building12:19
brobostigonand i am really sorry about lastnight, i was reallt aggitated. my apologies.12:23
DJonesGary: Ouch, must have quite time consuming & a lot of questions, where does this cable go?12:24
GaryDJones: yeah, esp as the network had grown organically (read "mess") for the last fifteen odd years, there was still coax networking cable sitting about, along with the worst structured cabling ever12:28
Garywe found a few servers under the caling spaggetti12:28
DJonesHeh, servers you didn't know about?12:29
BigRedSheh. we had to do that once when we ran another 20 cat5 lines and the ceiling collapsed :)12:29
DJonesOr just servers you could ping & knew existed but didn't know the location12:30
GaryBigRedS: we pulled out a full sized skip full of compressed cabling12:30
Gary(ie we compressed it/bundled it up neatly before putting it in the skip, it still filled it)12:31
oimonGary: where do u work?12:31
Garyoimon: a small marketing company in essex12:31
DavieyGary looks after the IT equipment for hell..  He reports directly to the devil. ;)12:31
oimoni still come across weird coax cabling that uses vampire connectors12:33
GaryDaviey: no no, I left hell in Nottingham, I'm just in hells backyard now12:33
oimonthe yellow cable still exists in some offices and i tell staff never to touch them or they might lose their net connection ;)12:34
GaryOMG, woman just walked past with the brightest red dyed hair ever!12:34
oimonwell you are in essex Gary12:34
* Gary tickles Davieywavey12:35
DJonesGary: She must have long leg, she stands outside my office in poynton having a smoke a few times a day12:35
Garywe have windows now!  (IT used to be hidden in the dark, next to a badly accousticly insulated server room12:36
DavieyGary, heh12:36
DavieyGary, Do you still have your red hot poker?12:36
Garyonly for you Daviey12:36
Daviey!ohmy > Gary12:36
Garywhen are you going to leave your (lovely) missus and be mine?12:37
* Gary hides12:37
* oimon notes the tone of the room has dropped somewhat12:38
Garyyeah, sorry, I'll get back to work :'(12:40
DavieyGary, I'll ask her for a good time!12:41
* czajkowski hugs Gary and goes back to hiding 12:55
oimonhmm "Users of the ad-supported version of Spotify were hit by a malware-based attack on Thursday"12:56
popeyJabber \o/12:57
MattJJabber \o/12:57
ali1234oimon: link pls12:57
oimonit's friday lunchtime, so it must be el reg12:57
oimon5 mins into lunch and i've already reported a fresh natty bug12:58
popeyoimon: bug no?13:00
oimonwell it's a crash actually :P13:01
popeybug 74242713:02
lubotu3Error: Launchpad bug 742427 could not be found13:02
popeyprivate bug?13:02
* popey larts launchpad devs13:02
oimonfor the mo i assume until apport retracing has done it's dirty work13:02
oimonprobably 100 other dupes that are private too ;)13:03
hooverhave a nice weekend all13:14
oimoni told tmobile they provide a poor data & voice signal for the entirety of my train journey. thought they might like to know.  it turns out they weren't interested13:42
Ngpopey: hrm (re that bug), I haven't natty'd yet13:44
oimoni thought tube line/national rail interchanges might be a good place to provide a phone signal13:45
czajkowskipopey: did you want something in natty verified ?13:47
HazRPGoimon: mobile phone companies never seem to like it when I say they have a black spot for signal :/13:47
davmor2popey: it's technically an issue with the way that apport reports it,  Apport by default assumes you were doing something private and until the retrace is done leaves the bug in private mode, making it public once it knows there is no highly secure data on it iirc13:47
popeyno davmor2 its a launchpad issue13:48
HazRPGnormally I wouldn't bother, but that black spot just so happens to be my house, and it worked fine when I first went with them :/13:48
popeyi have discussed this at length with Robert Collins13:48
oimonHazRPG: it's strange, because as a service provider, i'd like to know  - it potentially affects revenue generation.13:48
davmor2popey: interesting :)13:48
popeythe "issue" being that the bot can't tell that it's a private bug or a non-existent bug13:48
popeybecause launchpad reports back that private bugs do not exist13:48
popeyso that lp doesn't reveal details that should be secure13:49
popeythe bots _used_ to report "Private bug" which is fine13:49
davmor2popey: I see13:49
oimonHazRPG: the blackspot i am thinking of caters for many hundreds of people waiting around for 30 mins at any point in the day from 7am-12pm13:49
popeyI am unhappy that private bugs are reported as "non existent"13:49
davmor2talking at cross purposes13:49
czajkowskihmm waht ever way things are behaving I cant open another terminal as when I click on terminal I get close terminal, but no way to open more or even a tab13:50
popeyyes :)13:50
gordczajkowski, unity?13:50
popeyczajkowski: middle click13:50
oimonmiddle click13:50
czajkowskigord: yes13:50
czajkowskipopey: touch pad on the laptop no mouse13:50
HazRPGoimon: heh, typical :P13:50
popey3 fingers?13:51
popeyor is it a rubbish laptop?13:51
czajkowskioh you rock13:51
* czajkowski hugs popey 13:51
* czajkowski kicks unity 13:51
gordalso ctrl+shift+n in gnome terminal i think13:51
* czajkowski removes all cake from gord as he's the closest one around me 13:51
HazRPGoimon: still haven't managed to get anywhere with 3 for mine though... I'm wanting my PAC (MAC?) code so that I can move it, apparently I have to wait for it :/13:51
Myrttinew trousers AND jeans ♥ H&M mail order, I love you13:51
popey\o/ H&M13:51
gordor just alt+f2 and type "terminal"13:51
davmor2czajkowski: or you could go file new window on global menu :P13:51
czajkowskidavmor2: it wont let me13:51
popeygord: that fails13:51
gordpopey, let it load13:52
popeyi have13:52
popeyit has returned one result13:52
oimonHazRPG: i'm supposed to have network sharing with orange enabled. it's strange that there's never any coverage where t-mob don't cover - unless they all slap their antennas on the same building?13:52
gordeh i'm being think, alt+f2 is the run dialog so yeah gnome-terminal13:52
gordlemmealone :(13:52
* popey tickles gord 13:52
popeyALT+F2, gnome-terminal13:53
popeyclick it13:53
popeywhere do you get dumped?13:53
* popey gets put in /13:53
popeythis seems sub-optimal to me13:53
davmor2czajkowski: why could you do Ctrl+shift+t  for a new tab or did it need to be a completely fresh terminal?13:53
HazRPGMyrtti: \o/13:53
popeyew tabs in terminal windows should die in a fire13:53
oimonctrl-shift-n for new terminal too13:53
czajkowskiI dont like tabs in terminals13:53
gordpopey, known bug13:53
czajkowskiI admin I am slightly odd ok. it';s just me13:53
popeyta gord13:53
gordwhoever asked for tabbed terminals should of been shot long ago13:54
HazRPGoimon: wouldn't shock me13:54
davmor2czajkowski: it would of solved you're temporary issue though :P13:54
shaunoI don't mind tabs, I just don't want to see them.  I like my terminal chromeless.13:54
* oimon used to use tabs in konsole, but never gnome-terminal13:55
* oimon also remembers he used to use yakauake a lot13:55
BigRedSI don't think I've ever wanted a tabbed terminal13:55
gordi tend to end up just using my second monitor for a wall of terminator terminals, works nicely13:55
shaunoif I need to do something local, I find it easier to pop open a tab, instead of having a remote screen nested in a local screen13:56
shaunoI just don't like the tab bar to be visible13:56
shauno(or the scrollbar, or the menubar .. but gnome-terminal lets you turn those off :)13:57
HazRPGI don't mind the tabbed terminals so much, its nice to have it there if you ever need them13:57
HazRPGhaving two screens though, I tend to just cake them with terminals though13:57
BigRedSI generally have terminator, and then some large number of xterms that I've run 'host' or somethign in and then alt-tabbed away from13:57
HazRPGplus mod4+T ftw!13:57
popeyDominos Pizza now accepts paypal!13:59
* screen-x freezes popey's paypal assets14:00
oimonpopey: from the command line?14:00
gordfor the good of the nation, pizza places should not do online ordering. i don't even like pizza hut but i sometimes get it if i'm working late :(14:00
popeyoimon: hmm?14:01
shaunoyou've not seen that?14:01
gordiirc you could order pizza from world of warcraft. maybe ubuntu should come with something like that by default14:01
gordcould even make the ubuntu logo out of pizza14:02
oimonsorry for multiple reg links in one day, but all the good articles get saved till friday14:04
czajkowskiaye which have been on twitter a lot of the day :)14:05
oimonme needs to widen his twitter usage14:07
oimondidn't realise there was useful stuff on it :P14:08
AlanBellgord: I have thought about making such a pizza14:14
gordwould prefer a cake if people are making ubuntu based confectionaries14:15
shaunoI believe pizza to be the sensible option.  covers more food groups :)14:15
* brobostigon has ginger beer, :)14:15
brobostigoninteresting idea.14:16
oimondoesn't look too appetizing http://technology.desktopnexus.com/get/34966014:16
shauno:(  someone didn't enable Universe14:16
DJonesbrobostigon: I've started getting a taste for Crabbies alcoholic ginger ale/beer14:17
brobostigonDJones: i like aswell, it nice isnt it.14:17
DJonesbrobostigon: Yes, leaves a slight bruning feeling in your mouth14:18
brobostigonDJones: bruning?14:18
brobostigonoh, alittle,14:19
oimoni have a dandelion and burdock waiting for me in the fridge14:20
Myrttiaw damnit14:21
MyrttiI forgot my d&b sodastreamer concentrate at home :-(14:21
screen-xsodastream, oldschool :)14:21
oimonwonder if wifey fancies making me another tux cake again14:22
oimonbest cake ever14:22
AlanBello/ issyl014:24
* daubers beats pyinotify with a stick14:27
brobostigongot gpu lockup again, so gone back to vesa. :(14:36
bigcalmDrum & Bass Sodastream? ;)14:43
moreatipopey: http://hackaday.com/2011/03/25/kinect-minecraft-trifecta/14:43
popeymoreati: wow14:52
davmor2moreati: nice,  you post mincraft here and unity insults on #wolveslug :P14:57
* czajkowski prods davmor2 14:58
moreatidavmor2: i play to the crowd14:58
davmor2czajkowski: thanks love you too :P15:00
czajkowskiI'd not poke you in a long time, I felt it was over due15:02
* davmor2 whacks czajkowski with a rubber baseball bat15:03
czajkowskiI poke you and whack, hardly seems very fair!15:04
davmor2czajkowski: it was a toy rubber baseball bat it's not like it hurt15:05
hamitronczajkowski: you play any comp games?15:05
hamitronspecifically, rugby ones15:06
hamitronor anyone else for that matter15:06
* AlanBell sends davmor2 to therapy to deal with his issues of violence15:06
* AlanBell arranges consecutive appointment for czajkowski 15:07
czajkowskihamitron: nope I follow/adore rugby though15:07
shaunoI've not seen any rugby games.  I thought it wasn't "the done thing" to trivialize such a topic15:07
czajkowskiAlanBell: careful we;d meet and kill one another15:07
hamitronczajkowski: that is why I thought you may have tried the games, if you were a gamer :)15:07
* davmor2 sends AlanBell to Wolverhampton then you'll understand the violence :D15:07
hamitronshauno: there are a few, just not sure which to try15:08
hamitronmanager stuff and the other kind where you "control" the players15:09
AlanBelldavmor2: been there already, no plans to go again15:09
AlanBellI am off to Milton Keynes area on Monday though15:09
AlanBellonly two hours until some people buy some consumer electronics gadget15:10
hamitronwhat gadget?15:10
czajkowskiis that why popey is quiet, is he queuing :)15:10
davmor2AlanBell: That's my point,  rubber baseball bat attacks aren't violent,  Machine pistols, shotgun and machete attacks they are violent :D15:10
shaunoI tried to get a new ipad.  3-4 weeks to ship online.  bugger that for a game of daisies15:10
TommehWeird. Playing music gives a bit of crackling in the background - be it Flash, spotify (linux) or Rythmbox... To stop it, all I have to do is close the app, or open and close the sound preferences dialogue 0_o15:11
gordi forget what it was that was much different in the ipad 2. did it have a bigger resolution or something?15:11
shaunomostly just the camera.  I swore off the first one until I could skype on it15:11
hamitronthe version number is twice as big15:11
hamitrontherefore better15:11
AlanBelldavmor2: I just decided not to say what I was going to say about a rubber baseball bat15:12
davmor2AlanBell: I didn't want to hurt czajkowski  the aim is too annoy :)15:12
czajkowskiwe love one another really15:13
AlanBella worthy aim indeed15:13
czajkowskijust for folks who dont know us ;)15:13
AlanBellon the subject of violence, here is some proprietary software vendors showing us how to behave professionally http://bcgurus.com/_webapp_1414611/Business_Catalyst_Partners_Take_Aim_at_Joomla_Drupal_and_WordPress15:14
AlanBelland a fitting response http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljNZM5Yx0GM15:15
screen-xAlanBell: video has been taken down :(15:16
AlanBellmost of it is in the response anyway15:16
hamitronis 68MB/s good for a flash drive?15:17
screen-xah yes, just watching15:17
hamitronI get mixed up with bits and bytes15:17
AlanBellgord: I believe the device itself is thinner and lighter and has slightly better graphics chip or something15:18
AlanBellgord: fundamentally the big feature is that at 6PM if you still have the old one then everyone will know that you are the type of person that still has the old one15:19
BigRedSAlso, AlanBell that first video is down, but does look interesting15:20
popeyAlso, people using iPads are getting on with using iPads and not asking "What's the best Android tablet to buy"15:21
Myrttimmmm cough medicine15:21
hamitronthat is the best thing about apple imo15:21
hamitronno hassle, you just get THE product15:21
popeyyeah, but it's evil closed source15:22
popeyoh, hang on15:22
BigRedSyeah, the hoops I was jumpingh through last night to unbreak my android phone have put me off getting another15:23
BigRedSbut there's nothing else, really to go for15:23
hamitrontbh, all this complication and lock down is just causing me to lose interest in technology as a whole15:23
popeylots of options15:23
hamitronthey will end up killing it15:23
popeyand "they" :)15:24
shaunoopen source on mobile platforms strikes me as mostly moot point, until they stop leaving the carrier with the last word15:24
hamitronthe makers will kill the interest of enthusiasts15:24
BigRedSthat's the thing. The hoops I was jumping through were on the way to as close to stock android as I could get15:24
gordAlanBell, ah right the graphics chip and thinner, i remember now - interesting that they didn't go for more though15:25
hamitronwhat we need is some open hardware15:25
popeyyeah, that went well for openmoko15:25
BigRedSheh. that's been tried15:25
BigRedShardware is so much more expensive than software15:26
AlanBellhow is pandora going?15:26
shaunothe hardware's really not the problem so much atm.  you still have the carrier telling you what you're allowed to do with it15:26
oimonBigRedS: which phone do u have15:27
screen-xshauno: I get the impression HTC wouldn't sign the firmware unless pressured.15:27
hamitronsuppose the carriers need to make sure it isn't used too much15:27
shaunoI still haven't figured out how O2 manage to bill me separately for tethered data :/15:27
BigRedSoimon: Galaxy S15:28
screen-xshauno: they do?15:28
shaunothey do here  (o2.ie and o2 are different companies, so I've no idea how well it translates)15:28
screen-xshauno: do they tell you how many MB of each you've used per month?15:29
shaunooh, O2 uk is telefonica too .. I thought it was BT  (kinda outta date :)15:29
popeyAlanBell: dunno how many they have sold, but I'd guess in the high hundreds or low thousands15:29
shaunoscreen-x: yes15:29
popeyaim is 3300 by april15:30
screen-xshauno: presumably you've tried ssh dynamic proxy and vpn?15:30
hamitronsurely if the software and hardware did what was wanted, they couldn't tell?15:30
shaunoscreen-x: just vpn15:30
AlanBellpopey: looking at the pandora, I think I would take the iPad :)15:31
shaunothat the openpandora one?  the little folding game thingie that managed to stuff a whole keypad in there?15:31
AlanBellshauno: thats the one15:32
diploWe we're talking about this at work the other day, we we're wondering if they were analysing headers etc15:32
diploto work out what was using the traffic15:32
fvahidhi evryone15:32
AlanBellhi fvahid15:32
shaunoI couldn't figure out what pandora did that my gp2x doesn't, so didn't look too much further at it15:32
hamitronis the gp2x good?15:33
hamitronI was always tempted15:33
MyrttiI still think MeeGo might end up being kick-ass awesome15:33
Myrttifor phones15:33
shaunoit's not that bad, but the amiga emulator pushes it a bit15:33
fvahidI was one question15:33
shaunomine's out of commission atm because they decided to use some strange usb cable that I'm having difficulty locating15:34
fvahidI was one question about squid please help me firends15:34
oimonmotorola could always buy meego :P15:34
screen-xfvahid: hi, ask your question, someone will answer if they can help15:35
Myrttifvahid: "either flash fry it or cook it for a very long time so that the proteins don't go all rubbery"15:35
hamitronisn't meego open source?15:36
screen-xMyrtti: I was considering that pun, but didn't know enough about cooking it ;-)15:36
shaunohamitron: the d-pad is a bit flaky.  I think they put it just too close to the edge of the device.  it's physically sound, but that one edge key just doesn't feel right.  all in all, I'm not sure I'd buy it again, but I'd be game for something very similar15:36
oimonhamitron: i mean , buy all the devs etc15:36
Myrttihamitron: yup15:36
Myrttiscreen-x: I just read about proteins and how to cook squid yesterday from my lovely "Cooking for Geeks"- book :-P15:36
hamitronif these devices acted as a phone, I'd be bought15:37
Myrttioimon: buy all the devs... er. from whom...? it's a Linux Foundation project, majorly backed by Intel and formerly Nokia, and other companies that still are working on it15:37
AlanBellfvahid: just ask in the channel, don't worry about interrupting any other rambling going on15:38
hamitronare there still going to be many meego devices since microsoft pulled nokia?15:38
AlanBellfvahid: in the channel15:39
hamitronthat could be a hurdle15:39
Myrttihamitron: depends on the platform, not sure about how many there's going to be as phones15:39
popeyAlanBell: one apparently15:40
popeyanyone know of any apps in the USC that have reviews?15:40
hamitronI love toys, but don't like having to carry too many with so few pockets15:40
popeyhamitron: you need a barbour jacket15:40
* popey points to AlanBell who carries an OLPC in his pocket15:41
Myrttipopey: I just saw one the other day...15:41
Myrttimight have been docky15:41
hamitronman if that pandora took a sim, and let me use it as a phone with a headset.....15:42
popeyMyrtti: any chance you can confirm that?15:42
MyrttiI just realised I've got vnc to the computer15:43
Myrttiso checking15:43
popeyI have USC open and looking at Docky15:44
popeybut it says "Checking for reviews..."15:44
oimonpopey - tombot15:44
popeyi suspect I know what this is15:45
s-foxGood afternoon.15:45
popeyI am behind a proxy server15:45
oimonMyrtti: yep, docky has 2 reviews15:45
popeyright, thanks15:45
fvahidexec lsb_release -a15:45
* popey files a bug15:45
Myrttipopey: 7zip, ArchiveManager...15:46
popeythank you15:47
Myrttieven calculator :-/15:47
MyrttiI always end up installing qalculate because gnome one is borderlining useless in my use15:47
* brobostigon returns 15:50
* popey files bug 74256415:51
lubotu3Launchpad bug 742564 in software-center (Ubuntu) "reviews not visible behind a proxy" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/74256415:51
gordpopey, did you just thank the bot?15:54
popeyno, Myrtti and oimon15:54
screen-xAm I supposed to be able to see/contribute reviews in 10.04?15:54
gordoh okay then ;)15:55
moreatiscreen-x: I don't think so, it's an 11.04 thing15:55
oimonpopey: that's weird - why would the proxy block it? is it making a request on port 80?15:58
diplooimon, Our proxy ran on port 312816:00
diploSo if USC doesn't pick up the proxy details it wouldn't go through16:00
oimondiplo: i mean, does USC make a regular web request on port 8016:00
diploAll depends whether it uses the proxy details already setup which I suppose is what the bug request is for16:01
oimontransparent proxy is much nicer :)16:01
diployeah, I always wanted to implement at my last job, but 2 others we're against it for no good reason16:05
diploDon't have one at new job, not enough staff I suppose and more trust16:05
diploNot that I ran through the proxy myself at the last job :P16:05
screen-xdiplo: http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc3143.txt16:06
diploBookmarked, too big to read late friday afternoon16:12
screen-xdiplo: they aren't amazing points, but slightly better than "no good reason"16:13
screen-xbut yeah, definitely tl;dr16:14
nigelbAlanBell: ping16:16
diploBy no good reason I meant that it was more of cba attitude, nothing to do with security etc16:18
diploIt was the setup we had had for 10 years and they just decided they didn't want to change16:18
diploWhen we moved to terminal services I just made some changes so we could log windows user names etc instead of doing via hostnames16:19
diploBut I reckon that was the only change we really made in 10 years16:19
screen-xdiplo: well, I guess that counts as stable..16:19
diploheh yeah16:24
MichealHPiTiVi Is not starting up...16:30
bigcalmThat's a PiTi16:31
bigcalmSorry, I couldn't hold it back16:31
bigcalmMichealH: try starting it from the CLI16:32
MichealHbigcalm, Is it just piti or?16:33
Garywoo, pub for lunch on a friday rocks16:33
MichealHmichealh@michealh-desktop:~$ pitivi16:34
MichealHCan't find glade module16:34
MichealHa default app in ubuntu 10.10.... and it does not have the things needed16:34
popeyworks here16:35
oimonMichealH: have you just installed it?16:42
NafalloGary: well... pub for lunch rocks would be more correct, no? ;-)16:42
oimonor long time ago?16:42
MichealHoimon, It came default in ubuntu 10.1016:43
Seeker`weekend \o/16:43
oimonhmm. could always try remove and reinstall pitivi - i didn't realise it was default 10.1016:43
MichealHoimon, And I guess 10.04, as my laptop has it and I do nto remember installing it16:46
oimonMichealH: oh yeah..i am running 10.04 and i have it16:47
oimonnever use it tbh16:47
oimonthe only video editing i requre is of .3gp files, and 10.04 doesn't handle it well16:47
* screen-x waits for a phone to ring16:47
Seeker`ring ring16:47
oimonscreen-x: would it be wrong to type hard questions into irc to get the answer:P16:48
oimonwonder if google or #ubuntu-uk would be quicker16:48
screen-xoimon: :)16:48
screen-xoimon: much as you guys are great, you are unlikely to be able to answer questions about my skills/experience and suitability for a position16:49
oimonthere doesn't seem to be a whole lot of linuxy jobs out there atm16:49
screen-xlinuxjobs has had quite  a steady flow of them.16:49
oimonscreen-x: which site?16:49
screen-xand a few Unis (well, one less now!)16:49
screen-xoimon: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/linuxjobs16:50
oimonah yeah, looked there earlier today16:50
oimoni had hoped to have this job for a long time, but hey ho16:51
screen-xoimon: you'll be an MS MVP in no time ;-)16:51
oimoni'd rather be UB4016:51
exobuzzgrumble launchpad fail.16:52
exobuzzSorry, something just went wrong in Launchpad.16:52
oimoni could always try to change the system from within i guess16:54
moreatioimon: if you have PHP fu, there's a lot of jobs on the PHPWM list the last couple of weeks16:55
oimonmoreati: thanks. guess i should just be patient and see if i get properly stitched up in the new world order at my employer16:56
screen-x*ring* *ring*16:57
diploGood night all, have a good weekend16:57
oimonscreen-x: hope it goes well.16:59
oimoni'm off to play donkey kong and cheer myelf up17:00
hamitron15% off at a model shop17:00
Azelphurhow long does it usually take for a smart check to complete? :P17:01
moreatihamitron: at 1:24 scale that's only 0.625% off, doesn't seem that good17:01
hamitronhaha ;p17:02
hamitron1:32 scalextric ftw ;)17:02
gordgeez. 5pm on release day and my 3ds still hasn't been shipped. amazon are useless17:11
Azelphurkeep hitting refresh it'll make them ship it faster :D17:12
* mgdm orders gord a new F5 key17:14
gordturns out that they shipped everyone who used regular delivery days ago and were waiting for another shipment to ship expedited delivery (ie: people that actually wanted it on day one) - so everyone who did expedited is just left with no information and a "dispatching soon" screen that never updates. i did however get an email saying i won't get it today, at 5pm, so thats.. useful?17:15
hamitrongord: I never got my last pre-order from amazon17:17
gordinteresting, now my order has magically vanished17:17
hamitronended up cancelling and ordering elsewhere17:17
davmor2hamitron: did you report it,  I found amazon to be pretty on the ball with issues17:18
hamitronthey had no stock17:18
hamitrona guy I know who ordered the day after me got his fine, but I ordered for a lower price....17:18
shaunoI've never had a problem with amazon re-sending shipments17:18
shaunothe closest I ever had to an issue, was when the missing shipment showed up a month later, and I couldn't figure out how to return it without cancelling the order17:19
hamitronand what I pre-ordered was only available on DVD for pre-orders, steam download was only option after17:19
shaunoeventually decided two copies for the price of one, was more honest than 1 copy for the price of none.17:20
ubuntuuk-planet[Andy Price] Twyt Discontinued - http://andrewprice.me.uk/weblog/entry/twyt-discontinued17:21
hamitronamazon I've found good generally tbh, had a phone missing in an order, and they just sent another17:21
gordshauno, in those situations - unless it was an expensive thing they will generally just tell you to keep it anyway17:21
gordamazon are pretty good, but when they screw something up they are big enough that it really hurts. getting a hold of someone who can actually make any difference is almost impossible17:22
shaunoit wasn't, a $20 game.  I was just paranoid that if it went awry, I'd have no more amazon  (which is pretty terrifying when you're int he sticks)17:22
hamitronI dunno where I'd get my IT books from, without amazon :/17:23
hamitronprobably have to just use google17:24
hamitronto learn from17:24
hamitrontbh, I think my hassle with amazon was down to codemasters17:25
* AlanBell is off to Battle:Los Angeles this evening17:25
hamitronAlanBell: ?17:26
hamitronnever heard of it I don't think17:26
AlanBella film of some description17:27
HazRPGoh rly?17:39
HazRPGAlanBell: I thought you were talking about Rage Against the Machines for a second...17:40
HazRPGhmm, why is it the kindle screensaver doesn't show pictures of books that's actually on it (or at least related to your interests)?17:44
HazRPGseems odd to see some of the book covers it decides to show :/17:44
HazRPGpopey: cheers17:49
HazRPGalthough seems to easy consider I saw hacks that changed the screensaver - this just seems too easy...17:49
Azelphurhow long do the longer smart tests take?17:58
Azelphurbeen waiting like 1 hour 30 for it now :P17:59
davmor2Azelphur: till they've finished :P17:59
Azelphurthe disk utility gui should just update when it's finished right? no need to restart the disk utility to check18:00
Seeker`oooh, my dentist had some leaflets about OSS in his waiting room18:18
=== james is now known as Guest20905
=== Guest20905 is now known as JamesMcM
phonex01hi HazRPG you there ?20:26
phonex01im hit with  stone on my head !!!20:26
phonex01this is really bad feeling !20:26
phonex01yes we was protesting !20:29
phonex01we were protesting and police used stone to hit us !20:29
phonex01can you imagine that !20:29
hamitronbbl, phone20:30
phonex01if feel storm in my head hahahah20:30
phonex01guys im using backtrack 4 but i have strange thing here20:31
phonex01when i use it as live CD using flash stick everything work fine20:31
phonex01but when i install it mouse stop working >20:32
phonex01why is that  ?20:32
=== cbx333 is now known as cbx33
cbx33boo ya everyone20:32
phonex01hi cbx3320:33
phonex01strange name !20:33
cbx33phonex01, hey - has a history to it :)20:33
cbx33short for cutterbombx3320:33
phonex01oh thats good20:33
phonex01listen you used backtrack4 before ?20:34
cbx33indeed I have20:34
cbx33many times20:34
phonex01when i use it as live CD using flash stick everything work fine20:34
phonex01but when i install it mouse stop working >20:34
phonex01why ?20:34
MartijnVdSphonex01: have you checked the logs?20:34
phonex01what logs ?20:35
MartijnVdScould be a lot of reasons.. but it sounds strange20:35
cbx33hmmm - not sure - i only have it on usb :), booting a live and persistent :)20:35
MartijnVdSphonex01: those in /var/log/ :)20:35
phonex01then ?20:35
cbx33did you try plugging and unplugging a mouse20:35
cbx33does keybaord still work?20:35
phonex01yes i did20:35
phonex01but i think problem with xserver ?20:35
cbx33does kbd still work?20:36
phonex01keyboard is working fine20:36
MartijnVdSphonex01: check the kernel log (kern.lorg)20:36
phonex01wait im installing it again on my flash i will boot using other computer20:36
phonex01give me a min20:36
phonex01i need a good tool for encyrption and de-encyrption ?21:01
phonex01for some common ecnryptions ?21:01
alexcockellHi all..21:10
Azelphuromg Self-tests still in progress :(21:13
Azelphurbeen nearly 5 hours now21:13
MartijnVdSAzelphur: self-tests?21:13
AzelphurMartijnVdS: smart tests for this drive21:13
MartijnVdSyeah those can take a while21:13
Azelphurhmm, is lubotu working?21:59
Azelphurhe's not talking to me :(21:59
directhexhe hates you22:01
directhexbug 122:01
directhexalso hates me22:01
lubotu3Launchpad bug 1 in Ubuntu "Microsoft has a majority market share" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/122:01
directhexloves me22:01
directhexsexy lubotu322:01
AzelphurI think factoids are down22:01
DJonesAzelphur: You could try the web interface22:03
davmor2czajkowski: prod22:18
* willy_1977 is installing eclipse22:23
MartijnVdSso that's why it's gone dark outside22:30
willy_1977who said that...22:34
Azelphurstill waiting for that smart test to finish lol22:40
Azelphurmight just give up and swap the drive out :p22:40
willy_1977smart test?22:43
Azelphurwilly_1977: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S.M.A.R.T.22:44
willy_1977still have loads to learn in terminology SMART ~ chkdsk :)22:45
directhexpoor willy_1977 :(22:47
=== james is now known as Guest78863
willy_1977directhex, how did you know that? have you been speaking to my mrs?22:48
directhex* willy_1977 is installing eclipse22:48
daubersonce you get used to it's weirdness, I actually like eclipse22:48
willy_1977gotta start somewhere right...22:48
willy_1977but I'm after an ide that will support java and python22:49
willy_1977time for bed, nn23:05
* hamitron yawns23:27
brobostigongood night everyone, sleep well.23:58

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