[00:19] <dajhorn>  How can I get the regular dpkg and apt-get at the rescue prompt of the alternative Natty installer?
[00:21] <kklimonda> dajhorn: what rescue prompt is that?
[00:22] <kklimonda> dajhorn: both apt and dpkg are on your disk, and are available if you get to the point where both / and /usr are mounted.
[00:23] <dajhorn> kklimonda: The shell prompt that you get if the installer is canceled or fails.
[00:24] <dajhorn> kklimonda: Only udpkg and the apt-install / apt-setup helpers are available at this prompt.
[00:27] <kklimonda> dajhorn: if you have ar, gz and tar you can unpack any deb
[00:27] <gordonjcp> right, half an hour in and I've nearly gone blind
[00:27] <gordonjcp> is there a way to disable the drop-shadow on windows in Unity
[00:27] <gordonjcp> ?
[00:27] <kklimonda> gordonjcp: probably in ccsm?
[00:28] <kklimonda> dajhorn: but I'm not sure how far will it get you
[00:28] <gordonjcp> kklimonda: that doesn't appear to be in Natty
[00:28] <dajhorn> kklimonda: Indeed, and I can use udpkg to install from the /pool, but manually walking the dependencies takes a long time.
[00:28] <kklimonda> dajhorn: right, but it's an emergency
[00:29] <gordonjcp> maybe I need to be running an installed version rather than off the live USB disk image
[00:29] <kklimonda> you can try installing ccsm, it's in universe afair
[00:30] <kklimonda> dajhorn: also, apt doesn't have many dependencies
[00:30] <kklimonda> neither do dpkg
[00:32] <dajhorn> kklimonda: It is a bunch.  I got stuck at the libc dependencies and the empty /var/lib/dpkg.
[00:33] <dajhorn> kklimonda: I got a bug report that APT in the alternative environment is resolving package dependencies differently than the regular desktop environment.
[00:57] <storrgie> How do I do multiple firefox instances with unity?
[00:58] <Gulfstream> how do I scale the CPU when using Unity?
[01:00] <ali1234> storrgie: instances or windows?
[01:00] <storrgie> windows/tabs
[01:00] <ali1234> storrgie: you have to do file -> new window in ff
[01:00] <storrgie> then how do i switch between them?
[01:00] <storrgie> how do I use panorama?
[01:01] <ali1234> when you click on the panel it will show all of them, then click the one you want
[01:01] <ali1234> is panorama that new thing if ff4? if so, i have no idea
[01:26] <gordonjcp> kklimonda: I tried installing ccsm but all I managed to do was crash compiz
[01:26] <gordonjcp> kklimonda: is there anything else I can do to get rid of the drop shadows?
[01:46] <coz_> gordonjcp,  I didnt see you post here :)  but pick it up tomorrow... many are generally during the day hours
[01:46] <gordonjcp> yeah
[01:47] <gordonjcp> to be honest I probably won't use unity anyway
[01:47] <gordonjcp> it's too hard to use without some means of seeing which apps have windows open
[01:48] <gordonjcp> there's the launcher but I don't like having to mouse over each square in turn to see what it is
[01:49] <mhall119> gordonjcp: the icon in the laucher gets a small overlay when it has open windows
[01:49] <gordonjcp> mhall119: right
[01:49] <gordonjcp> but you still have to mouse over it to get the text label to pop up
[01:49] <mhall119> oh, text label, yes
[01:50] <gordonjcp> it's a bit of a usability fail
[01:50] <mhall119> such is the way of docks it seems
[01:50] <gordonjcp> I guess I could stick post-its to the side of the screen lined up with each little square
[01:50] <mhall119> heh
[01:51] <grusum> gordonjcp, u get used to it - took me abt day and half - no prob now
[01:51] <mhall119> why do you want to see which apps have open windows?
[01:51] <gordonjcp> mhall119: well, I quite frequently switch between windows
[01:51] <gordonjcp> mhall119: usually I have gedit open and a couple of terminals
[01:51] <mhall119> right, same here
[01:51] <grusum> gordonjcp, alt-tab still works
[01:51] <gordonjcp> so I have to stop and work my way down each square and mouse over it to see what it is
[01:52] <gordonjcp> grusum: true
[01:52] <mhall119> ah
[01:52] <gordonjcp> I can't really "see" icons, it's a dyslexia thing
[01:52] <mhall119> compiz + scale + scale filter for me
[01:52] <gordonjcp> what does that do?
[01:52] <mhall119> scale shows all your open windows, scaled down so you can see them all without overlap
[01:53] <mhall119> scale filter let's you type some text, and any window that doesn't have that text in it's title goes away
[01:53] <gordonjcp> getting back to my original problem, does anyone know how to make the huge drop shadows around the selected window go away?
[01:53] <mhall119> so I press F12 (my scale trigger), type "gedit", and all I see are my gedit windows, side by side, ready for me to pick which one to switch to
[01:54] <mhall119> gordonjcp: get compizconfig-settings-manager and you can change the shadow radius in the window decorators plugin
[01:54] <gordonjcp> mhall119: I tried that, it doesn't seem to have any effect
[01:55] <mhall119> hmmm...
[01:55] <mhall119> maybe they changed it in Unity
[01:55]  * mhall119 is still on Maverick
[02:21] <bpr> Is there a way to display an image in the message area of a libnotify bubble?
[02:26] <trism> bpr: the body of the message has to be a string, so you would need to use markup, but I don't know if any notification daemons support the image tag
[02:28] <robin0800> bpr, most music players display album art in notifications
[02:29] <bpr> i'm seeing in the pynotify module there's a property called attach-widget for the Notification object
[02:29] <bpr> so, i'm thinking that may be the way
[02:30] <bpr> robin0800: don't most music players put the album art in the icon area, rather than the body area?
[02:31] <robin0800> bpr, yes but they are not icons are they?
[02:31] <bpr> I'm actually making a system to enable rating the currently playing song (1-5 stars).  I'd like to display the number of stars that the song chas been changed to
[02:31] <bpr> robin0800: right, they're images, but they're not in the body of the notify bubble
[02:32] <bpr> hrm.. let me see if it does the right thing if I just use the icon area
[02:32] <bpr> s/song chas/song has/
[02:35] <gordonjcp> bpr: unicode stars...
[02:36] <bpr> gordonjcp: interesting
[02:38] <bpr> gordon, i think that's probably gunna be perfect
[02:38] <bpr> thanks!
[02:38] <MaximLevitsky> any ideas:
[02:38] <MaximLevitsky> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/728803
[02:39] <MaximLevitsky> I bet here many users use ubuntu in the vbox
[02:39] <MaximLevitsky> any workarounds?
[04:42] <bpr> is there a way to get the ubuntu1 client to stop spamming libnotify?
[04:47] <robin0800> bpr, you can uncheck notifications in devices in its control panel
[04:50] <bpr> robin0800: ty
[04:51] <bpr> wow, that was clear as day, but somehow i couldn't see that earlier
[04:52] <bpr> btw, is there a config somewhere that allows you to blacklist (or whitelist) apps from using libnotify?
[04:52] <bpr> at the libnotify lvl perhaps?
[05:11] <Mathuin> Is two-factor authentication on the roadmap for Natty or any later version?
[05:43] <whereami> so, how do I go back to the traditional interface? Is there a plan for some sort of introduction? I find discoverability of this interface to be terrible.
[05:44] <duanedesign> whereami: when booting select classic  desktop
[05:44] <whereami> when booting? or in gdm?
[05:45] <duanedesign> yes
[05:45] <duanedesign> when entering your password
[05:46] <whereami> okay, thanks. I haven't quite given up on this yet, but that's good to know. So far I'm not impressed.
[05:46] <whereami> what's this thing called, so I know where to find and file bugs?
[05:46] <duanedesign> if you enter what you are looking for into the dash it should show up
[05:47] <whereami> what is "the dash"?
[05:47] <duanedesign> when you press the 'super' key or click the ubuntu logo
[05:47] <duanedesign> in the top left
[05:48] <whereami> righto
[05:48] <whereami> is there a keyboard shortcut to the workspace switcher?
[05:49] <whereami> also, is there a keyboard shortcut to the menu bar? I can't access menus because I use focus-follows-mouse...
[05:50] <duanedesign> http://www.ubuntugeek.com/list-of-ubuntu-unity-keyboard-shortcuts.html
[05:50] <whereami> "unity"? is that what this thing is called?
[05:51] <whereami> alright.
[05:51] <whereami> thanks for the help, btw.
[05:51] <duanedesign> unity is the shell that runs on Gnome
[05:51] <whereami> sorry if I'm in grumpy mode... :/
[05:51] <duanedesign> no worries
[05:52] <duanedesign> alt + tab  right/left arrow is how i switch workspaces
[05:52] <duanedesign> oops
[05:52] <duanedesign> ctrl + alt
[05:52] <duanedesign> left/right arrow
[05:52] <duanedesign> and up/down
[05:52] <whereami> cool
[05:53] <whereami> I'll find in CCSM how to re-enable edge switching.
[06:02] <whereami> hmm, I guess edge switching just doesn't work... gonna get my bug on... a little later.
[06:03] <bpr> whereami: iirc F10 will get you into the menu
[06:04] <bpr> yup
[06:05] <bpr> for a lot of pretty good info on the new interface check: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity
[06:14] <whereami> bpr, yeah, I found that, thanks. unfortunately, I guess the menus don't work with all apps... eg, xchat only brings up a "File" menu with a single greyed-out "Close" entry.
[08:03] <gordonjcp> any clues as to where the settings are hidden?
[08:11] <whereami> gordonjcp, search for "settings" is how I found them.
[08:12] <whereami> Are there any replacements for panel apps in unity? specifically, I'm missing the system monitoring graphs.
[08:13] <whereami> also, how the heck do you get the menus for xchat? they don't appear in the app menu area.
[09:49] <varun> hi friends,today my system is becoming slow, so i did top in the terminal,i came to know that 99% of memory is earting by indicator applet,why that much of memory is taking,is there any way to stop that process?
[09:53] <varun> http://pastebin.com/rz22Zxd9
[09:57] <mfraz74> Any one else seeing this bug? #744834
[10:56] <xAndromeda> do you guys know wher i could find the settings for unity?
[10:57] <gordonjcp> xAndromeda: I was looking for them too
[10:58] <gordonjcp> xAndromeda: they turned out to be in the menu when you click on the little circle thing in the top right
[10:59] <psypher246> hello all. Could someone please confirm that you have to actually click on the ubuntu logo to get the launcher to come up, mouse over does not work and moving your mouse to the left of the screen does not unhide either. Is this a bug or a feature?
[11:20] <drommy> heys
[11:20] <drommy> anybody here? O.o
[11:21] <gordonjcp> quite a few people, by the looks of it
[11:23] <drommy> *criket* lol
[11:23] <drommy> hey um do you know how i can change unity so that when i launch app finder/launcher etc it dosnt take up the eintire screen?
[11:45] <drommy> *criket*
[11:55] <rocky> so... what would cause /var/lib/dpkg/alternatives to be turned into a file (and thus breaking apt-get install) and how do i fix it? :)
[11:57] <roffe> webgl, does it work for anyone else in natty with an ati card?
[12:21] <psypher246> hello all. Could someone please confirm that you have to actually click on the ubuntu logo to get the launcher to come up, mouse over does not work and moving your mouse to the left of the screen does not unhide either. Is this a bug or a feature?
[12:32] <penguin42> psypher246: In my setup it's very odd, generally if I move over the icon it half appears - literally appears but shaded out, I have to click to get it to appear
[12:33] <psypher246> penguin42: yup exactly what i get
[12:33] <psypher246> very annoying
[12:33] <penguin42> psypher246: Do you have autohide enabled?
[12:33] <psypher246> penguin42: whatever the default is, i just installed and updated, I would say it's more like intellihide
[12:34] <penguin42> interesting, I'd assumed it was because I'd enabled autohide
[12:34] <psypher246> what is also anjnoying is this:
[12:34] <psypher246> open fullscreen ap
[12:35] <psypher246> now click logo
[12:35] <psypher246> now click workspace switcher
[12:35] <psypher246> nothing happen and one sec later the luancher huides again
[12:35] <psypher246> you have to click workspaces twice to get focus on it
[12:36] <psypher246> and not as fast a doubleclick but not too slow or launcher disappears
[12:37] <psypher246> the whole things behavoiur is just wrong and weird and cumbersome, does anyone know if this is feature or bug?
[13:09] <xAndromeda> lol
[13:09] <xAndromeda> i thought that too
[13:09] <xAndromeda> but if you move to top left corner
[13:09] <xAndromeda> the bar becomes solid
[13:09] <xAndromeda> im still trying to figure out how to resize the dammed launcher thingy though
[13:09] <xAndromeda> it looks so ugly full screen
[13:10] <xAndromeda> so big and pixillated
[13:15] <psypher246> xAndromeda: not gonna happen for now i reckon
[13:15] <psypher246> I HOPE canonical relaise that nothing short of a FULYL customizable, themeable and hacable launcher is acceptable
[13:16] <psypher246> xAndromeda: i see what u mean about the launcher now, not easy to spot when u using it in a vbox window
[13:18] <xAndromeda> lol :P
[13:18] <psypher246> NOW thats MUCH better
[13:18] <xAndromeda> hey
[13:18] <xAndromeda> when you click the application drawer
[13:18] <xAndromeda> or the unity menue thing
[13:18] <psypher246> ok that i mist say answer my qorries about muyltiple screens
[13:18] <psypher246> worries*
[13:18] <xAndromeda> does the search ting appear full screen?
[13:19] <psypher246> cos is i have a screen to the left i don't want the launcher popping up each time i move left
[13:19] <psypher246> xAndromeda: oh u mean the search screen not the launcher bar
[13:19] <xAndromeda> yeah that
[13:20] <xAndromeda> from the pics i saw it was supposed to have a resize button
[13:20] <xAndromeda> on the lower right
[13:20] <psypher246> so when u click the ubuntu logo u get search box and shortcuts?
[13:20] <xAndromeda> but i dont see it, its full screen al lthe time
[13:20] <psypher246> pres esc
[13:20] <psypher246> then click it again
[13:20] <psypher246> then it's a smaller window again
[13:21] <psypher246> with the resize button botom right
[13:21] <xAndromeda> nope
[13:21] <xAndromeda> esc just exits the menue
[13:21] <xAndromeda> *menu
[13:21] <psypher246> yes then click again
[13:21] <psypher246> icon
[13:21] <psypher246> log i mean
[13:21] <psypher246> on mine its smaller again
[13:21] <xAndromeda> log?
[13:21] <psypher246> logo*
[13:22] <xAndromeda> :/
[13:22] <xAndromeda> what version do you have
[13:22] <xAndromeda> theres only 1 version right?
[13:22] <psypher246> yeah, fully updated natty
[13:22] <psypher246> u sure it's running 3d and not 2d?
[13:22] <xAndromeda> yep
[13:23] <xAndromeda> its a tiny thing
[13:23] <psypher246> applications and files and folders has the same thing
[13:23] <xAndromeda> but its really starting to piss me off :(
[13:23] <psypher246> click applications on launcher, it's a small window, make it large then press esc and then if i click on it again it's smaller again
[13:24] <xAndromeda> exactly! every time i click it i see massive freaking icons :(
[13:24] <psypher246> oh
[13:24] <psypher246> i thought u meant the window
[13:24] <psypher246> yeah the icons are massive
[13:24] <psypher246> the window has 2 sizes
[13:24] <psypher246> small and fullscreen
[13:24] <xAndromeda> mine only has 1 :(
[13:24] <psypher246> but the icons stay the same
[13:25] <xAndromeda> i wonder if theres i file i can edit somewhere
[13:25] <psypher246> must say the coner thing is a little annoying too
[13:25] <psypher246> corner
[13:25] <psypher246> cos i have screen on the left
[13:25] <psypher246> have to be precise to get that co
[13:26] <xAndromeda> yeah
[13:26] <psypher246> corner or the mouse goes to the left screen
[13:26] <xAndromeda> its also annoying to switch workspaces
[13:26] <xAndromeda> you ahve to go to the corner then the button
[13:26] <xAndromeda> thank god for compiz
[13:27] <psypher246> i must admirt i rarely use the workspaces even on ghnome
[13:27] <psypher246> ctr-alt left right up down is all i use
[13:27] <psypher246> i only use the workspaces whenni wanna move apps around
[13:28] <psypher246> can see that i will be using the windows key a lot in natty
[13:28] <xAndromeda> lol
[13:28] <xAndromeda> i love workspaces
[13:28] <xAndromeda> i went back to windows
[13:28] <xAndromeda> last week
[13:29] <xAndromeda> couldnt stand it
[13:29] <psypher246> Windows as in M$?
[13:29] <xAndromeda> yeah lol
[13:29] <psypher246> blergh
[13:29] <psypher246> @#% THAT
[13:29] <psypher246> NEVAAAA
[13:29] <psypher246> hehe
[13:29] <xAndromeda> i sorta like the aero glass though
[13:30] <psypher246> meh
[13:30] <xAndromeda> it looks pretty cool
[13:30] <psypher246> for all the productivity I get out of ubuntu/linux, I will NEVER go back to windows
[13:30] <xAndromeda> especially with chrome
[13:30] <xAndromeda> which looks like shit on linux :/
[13:30] <psypher246> yeah chrome does look cool
[13:30] <psypher246> yeah
[13:30] <psypher246> still, i can't work in windows anyjmore, retarded IMHO
[13:31] <psypher246> in ubunut, i'm just happy
[13:31] <xAndromeda> same when i stopped playing games the only reason i kept windows was so my friend can borrow it
[13:31] <xAndromeda> and not get completly lost lol
[13:32] <psypher246> only use i have for windows is for it be my gaming console, virus and crapware free, i love it and at work i use a vm for IE and outlook
[13:33] <xAndromeda> lol
[13:33] <xAndromeda> IE @_@
[13:34] <psypher246> what can i do, my work uses a retarded activex CRm app only
[13:34] <xAndromeda> lol
[13:34] <psypher246> and that integrates with outlook
[13:34] <psypher246> else i am always in thunderbird
[13:35] <psypher246> with imap it's the only stable way to talk to exchange
[13:36] <xAndromeda> :P
[13:36] <xAndromeda> ima go to bed, hopefully reinstalling natty will fix things lol
[13:39] <xAndromeda> actually screw it, ill wait untill the beta lol
[14:02] <BluesKaj> Hiyas
[14:57] <admiralf> hey folks, i recently wanted to upgrade my kubuntu 10.10 to 11.04 because the summer term starts next week, but when i fired up the daily build in an VM it killed X.org and/or KDE while initilaising Akonadi
[14:57] <admiralf> i  didnt had a deeper look into that issue, but id like to here if this is known?
[14:57] <admiralf> hear
[15:02] <charlie-tca> Is that https://launchpad.net/bugs/744944
[15:03] <genii-around> charlie-tca: And alternately if you booted to single user and updated, it then tries to start kdm
[15:04] <admiralf> i didnt upgrade, i tried the Daily Build Desktop CD
[15:04] <admiralf> in virtualbox
[15:05] <charlie-tca> There are a couple of other bugs, I don't have the numbers, in work right now. there will be a new daily published in a while for Kubuntu
[15:06] <charlie-tca> The beta comes out thursday, so qa is testing this week, and the images will be rebuilt a few times
[15:08] <admiralf> ok thanks, then i will wait till 1.4.
[15:23] <coz_>   hey guys
[15:29] <Muschel> hi
[15:29] <Muschel> question !!
[15:29] <Gulfstream2> what is the new way to scale the CPU to performance?
[15:30] <Muschel> task manager
[15:30] <Muschel> hehe
[15:30] <Muschel> hehe
[15:30] <patdk-wk> vm's :)
[15:32] <Muschel> question:
[15:32] <Muschel> will the ubuntu 11.04 get a new design ?
[15:32] <popey> o_O
[15:32] <popey> have you been living under a rock!?
[15:33] <popey> yes, it has a new desktop :)
[15:33] <Muschel> i meant the design ;)
[15:33] <Gulfstream2> Unity
[15:33] <Muschel> desktop i saw
[15:33] <Muschel> but ambiance changing
[15:33] <popey> it will be tweaked
[15:34] <popey> but not a brand new one, I wouldnt have thought
[15:34] <Muschel> to the desktop
[15:35] <Muschel> ok
[15:35] <Muschel> but i really would happy
[15:35] <Muschel> then
[15:35] <Muschel> but if no then no
[15:35] <Gulfstream2> how do I scale the CPU to performance in Unity?
[15:35] <Muschel> Gulfstream2: uname -r you can find the kerne
[15:35] <Muschel> kernel
[15:35] <yofel>  he means by GUI
[15:36] <Gulfstream2> yeah by GUI
[15:37] <Gulfstream2> it appears to be already at performance, from what sysinfo says
[15:37] <yofel> shouldn't be, it's set to performance in ther kernel, but the system sets it to ondemand after boot
[15:40] <Gulfstream2> it is running at full 1.6Ghz, and the computer appears to be really slow right now... is there a way to load apps to RAM in 11.04?
[15:53] <irv> has anyone experienced windows 7 suspend features stop working after installing 11.04 alpha along side?
[16:15] <Muschel> question
[16:16] <Gulfstream2> answer
[16:19] <Muschel> please can ubuntu GIVE ALL!
[16:19] <Muschel> EVERYTHIN G!
[16:19] <Muschel> to make ubuntu the best
[16:49] <BUGabundo> meh
[16:49] <BUGabundo> manage to break my PulseAudio a bit more
[16:49] <BUGabundo> fuuuuu
[16:50] <Dr_Willis> Hmm.
[16:50] <shaneo> someone please help http://i51.tinypic.com/2nao4df.png
[16:54] <charlie-tca> Hello, BUGabundo
[16:54] <BUGabundo> hey charlie-tca
[16:55] <charlie-tca> You can't break PA all the way just one time around?
[16:55] <IdleOne> !upgrade
[16:56] <charlie-tca> I must be doing it wrong. Ever since I quit listening to all the ideas to make PA work, I have had no problems with it.
[17:00] <IdleOne> charlie-tca: if it ain't broke don't fix it :)
[17:00] <IdleOne> I let PA do what it does and I have no problems either
[17:01] <BUGabundo> eheh
[17:01] <BUGabundo> mine was boken
[17:01] <BUGabundo> *broken
[17:01] <BUGabundo> now its worse
[17:01] <BUGabundo> need to get crisum
[17:02] <IdleOne> So should I do an upgrade to natty?
[17:02] <yofel> hm, does unity work with nvidia by now?
[17:03] <Pici> IdleOne: you haven't already
[17:03] <charlie-tca> I am testing the upgrades now
[17:03] <charlie-tca> Ubuntu seems to work fine, xubuntu is in process of upgrading good so far
[17:03] <charlie-tca> Of course, that is still 2 hours to go on Xubuntu
[17:03] <IdleOne> Pici: I did a clean install of 10.10 about 2-3 months ago (feels like longer) and since then I haven't felt like dealing with brokenness
[17:03] <BluesKaj> I deleted PA as soon as I upgraded... it leaves out too many options and another distortion layer of digital processing isn't needed
[17:04] <bjsnider> yofel, sure does. quite well
[17:04] <IdleOne> ah, heck with it. I am going to jump in the pool.
[17:04] <yofel> hm, then I'll try it again later, all my attempts this month ended with compiz crashes
[17:04] <yofel> that apport couldn't retrace -.-
[17:05] <BluesKaj> kde4.6 is working quite well so far on natty , I'm kinda pleased :)
[17:05] <IdleOne> Fetching!
[17:06] <yofel> +1 for KDE
[17:06] <yofel> except nepomuk and strigi still don't quite work right, take far too much resources after login :S
[17:07] <BluesKaj> yofel, just disable it in startup services , unless you rely on it.
[17:08] <yofel> I have it disabled but gave it a try again a week ago. No, not something I want to have on all the time...
[17:10] <charlie-tca> PA lets me have sound on both my hardware installation and my VirtualBox installs
[17:10] <gordonjcp> can anyone tell me how to get rid of the drop shadow on windows in Natty?
[17:11] <BluesKaj> I personally don't feel the need for indexing/search services , wish i could just remove it , but it tries to remove the whole desktop. afaik
[17:11] <gordonjcp> basically the drop shadow and pulseaudio are the two main things remaining that stop me being able to use Ubuntu
[17:12] <penguin42> gordonjcp: Use compizconfig settings manager
[17:12] <gordonjcp> the lack of a taskbar is merely annoying
[17:12] <gordonjcp> penguin42: it doesn't work
[17:12] <penguin42> gordonjcp: In the 'window decorations' tab there is a  'shadow radius'
[17:12] <gordonjcp> penguin42: yeah, it has no effect on the shadow
[17:13] <kroson> hi people, do you think that ubuntu 11.04 beta is good for daily usage?
[17:13] <penguin42> gordonjcp: Hmph, how about the 'shadow windows -> any' setting at the bottom?
[17:14] <gordonjcp> penguin42: I can't see that anywhere
[17:14] <penguin42> it's on the window decorations tab for me, at the bottom
[17:15] <gordonjcp> ah, yeah, right there; what should I set it to?
[17:15] <gordonjcp> "none" seems to have no effect
[17:15] <penguin42> gordonjcp: That would have been my guess
[17:15] <gordonjcp> should ccsm changes take effect immediately?
[17:16] <gordonjcp> okay, I've been at this for ten minutes now, I have to give up
[17:16] <kroson> [17:13] <kroson> hi people, do you think that ubuntu 11.04 beta is good for daily usage? -> anyone?
[17:16] <penguin42> gordonjcp: They seem to here; and certainly reducing the shadow radius works
[17:16] <gordonjcp> penguin42: it's having no effect here
[17:16] <gordonjcp> penguin42: sorry, I have to reboot back into normal Linux, this has given me a blinding headache
[17:16] <gordonjcp> brb
[17:17] <gordonjcp> kroson: absolutely not, as far as I'm concerned
[17:17] <kroson> gordonjcp: are there many things to fix until final?
[17:17] <kroson> im thinking about trying linux again, but dont know if unity is a good alternative :S
[17:18] <kroson> never tested it xD
[17:18] <penguin42> kroson: You don't have to use unity in Natty, you can still use the old mode
[17:18] <penguin42> kroson: So give it a go, if you don't like it you can use 'classic' mode
[17:18] <gordonjcp> I really wanted to like Unity, but it's just horrible
[17:18] <kroson> penguin42: is it default?
[17:18] <penguin42> kroson: Yes it is, but on the login box you can just pick classic from a menu at the bottom
[17:18] <kroson> gordonjcp: which one do you think is better? unity or gnome-shell?
[17:19] <kroson> penguin42: will it be gnome 3 or 2.32?
[17:19] <gordonjcp> kroson: neither, they're both unusable
[17:19] <penguin42> gordonjcp: It's a million times better than it was a month or two back, another million would be good
[17:19] <penguin42> kroson: 2.32
[17:19]  * penguin42 would like to give Gnome 3 a go
[17:19] <gordonjcp> penguin42: if I could just get rid of the little squares down the side and get a proper taskbar it would be okay
[17:19] <kroson> penguin42: i like that canonical tries to differentiate its distro from all others
[17:19] <kroson> by creating a new DE
[17:19] <penguin42> gordonjcp: So drop back to classic then
[17:21] <kroson> gordonjcp: i think you maybe have to get used to it
[17:21] <gordonjcp> kroson: I can't
[17:21] <kroson> yes its different, it looks like an App store or something lol
[17:21]  * penguin42 has switched to KDE4 on ----> that machine, it's getting there
[17:21] <gordonjcp> kroson: it's too reliant on hiding text behind little squares
[17:21] <kroson> penguin42: KDE4 seems to be the DE that always has a bug to fix
[17:21] <gordonjcp> so instead of actually seeing what your app is called, you've got to mouse over the row of little squares every time
[17:22] <kroson> i think its slowness may be considered a bug xD
[17:22] <penguin42> kroson: And there is a DE that doesn't have that description?
[17:22] <kroson> penguin42: you know what i mean, gnome tends to be more stable
[17:22] <penguin42> kroson: I think KDE4 might have actually got there
[17:22] <gordonjcp> kroson: also, Natty has FF4 so forget using it for web development
[17:23] <gordonjcp> and get used to seeing adverts again
[17:25] <kroson> penguin42: how is KDE4 on kubuntu 11.04?
[17:26] <penguin42> kroson: It's pretty sweet for me
[17:27] <penguin42> kroson: There are some things I prefer about gnome (in particular it's handling of multiple desktops)
[17:28] <kroson> yea
[17:29] <penguin42> and I can trigger a really nasty Radeon driver screwup; but hey I'm using the open driver and I don't think it's KDEs fault
[17:29] <gordonjcp> well, "Classic" mode gets rid of the drop shadows etc
[17:29] <gordonjcp> I could probably get used to not knowing what apps are called without hovering over the squares
[17:30] <gordonjcp> why on earth is the "taskbar" down the side anyway?
[17:30] <penguin42> you still seeing that in classic?
[17:30] <gordonjcp> and how do you get it back if something has pushed it off to the left?
[17:30] <gordonjcp> no, it's not in classic
[17:30] <gordonjcp> I'm determined to give unity a chance, *if* I can get rid of the drop shadows
[17:31] <penguin42> gordonjcp: You can get the bar back by clicking on the ubuntu icon a t top left
[17:31] <gordonjcp> penguin42: when I tried that it brought up a big black box with squares in it
[17:31] <penguin42> gordonjcp: the squares should be icons for all the available apps
[17:31] <gordonjcp> I don't know
[17:31] <gordonjcp> I can't tell what they are, they're just squares
[17:32] <penguin42> gordonjcp: I think what they're trying to do is to make it work for touchscreens and tablets
[17:32] <gordonjcp> hm, I don't have a touchscreen or a tablet
[17:32] <penguin42> gordonjcp: Hmm shouldn't just be squares; that's a bug
[17:32] <penguin42> gordonjcp: Neither do I
[17:32] <gordonjcp> penguin42: they're probably *not* squares
[17:32] <gordonjcp> but I can't actually see what they are
[17:32] <gordonjcp> it's a kind of visual dyslexia thing
[17:32] <gordonjcp> I have no idea what icons are
[17:33] <charlie-tca> hovering over the squares/icons should give a name
[17:33] <gordonjcp> it does, but that's a pain in the arse
[17:33] <gordonjcp> especially when they take up so much room
[17:33] <penguin42> gordonjcp: Ah right, hmm then this interface really is going to suck for you
[17:33] <charlie-tca> +1 on pain
[17:34] <charlie-tca> pretty much useless for those that can not use the hardware keyboard, too
[17:35] <penguin42> charlie-tca: Why do you say that?
[17:35] <charlie-tca> because to type in the dash search, requires a hardware keyboard. It disappears when trying to use Onboard
[17:36] <charlie-tca> I haven't investigated further to see what else requires hardware keys only
[17:37] <charlie-tca> those who can not use the mouse are in trouble too
[17:37] <e01> hello, can i ask for a help
[17:37] <charlie-tca> Please ask your question all in one line. All of us are volunteers and will attempt to answer if we know.
[17:37] <gordonjcp> !ask | e01
[17:37] <e01> i was installed from repository gnome-shell, after while i was purging the ppa, but i still can`t get back the native gnome from the ubuntu natty
[17:38] <e01> the ppa for the gnome3 i was get from the ppa:gnome3-team/gnome3
[17:38] <e01> any idea how to fix it without preinstall?
[17:38] <penguin42> e01: Have you used ppa-purge?
[17:40] <e01> penguin42, yes, sudo ppa-purge ppa:gnome3-team/gnome3
[17:40] <penguin42> e01: Hmm, then try apt-get install ubuntu-desktop ?
[17:41] <e01> penguin42, i was try it, but it just install libreoffice that i was removed before
[17:41] <penguin42> e01: and what happens if you try and login to a gnome session?
[17:42] <e01> ehm.., i am getting a ugly gtk with many errors with cancel and send report
[17:42] <e01> themes not apply, i think i am with gtk3 for default
[17:43] <penguin42> e01: I think I would try clearing out all my .gtk/.gnome dot files
[17:47] <e01> penguin42, will try
[17:55] <kroson> penguin42: so ubuntu 11.04 won't have gnome 3.0?
[17:56] <penguin42> kroson: That's my understanding
[18:02] <Muschel> ubuntu  11.04 have gnom3
[18:02] <Muschel> not the gnome shell unity
[18:04] <BUGabundo> anyone know off a app or fuse to access amazon cloud drive?
[18:08] <Daekdroom> Muschel, it uses GNOME 2.32
[18:08] <Muschel> yes but
[18:08] <Muschel> i believe it gnome 3 is out
[18:08] <Muschel> it will be there then
[18:09] <Muschel> only with the unity shell
[18:09] <Daekdroom> Nope. 11.04 will use 2.32 regardless.
[18:09] <Daekdroom> A transition to GNOME 3 needs so many changes in too little time they're delaying it to 11.10
[18:28] <Daekdroom> Is anyone else having problems with gcalctool crashing?
[18:30] <yofel> Daekdroom: crashed here when I switched it to advanced view
[18:30] <Daekdroom> Must be why I can't start it
[18:41] <nperry> Hummm I wonder where ubuntu mono font is
[18:41] <nperry> !info ubuntu-font
[18:41] <IdleOne> Reboot!
[18:45] <yofel> Daekdroom: bug 744798 was the crash I got
[18:55] <ChrisBuchholz> Now that we got "love handles" in Natty, will there be a way to set up multitouch gestures on your own? I have Super+W set fire the scale plugin in Compiz, but i would love to have a way to set three-fingers-pull-up to it also. I should be possible, since the multitouch things are already implemented. Is it possible, or will it be in the near future?
[18:58] <IdleOne> How do I add indicator-weather to the panel?
[18:59] <ChrisBuchholz> IdleOne: i believe its bugged
[19:00] <IdleOne> figures
[19:00] <ChrisBuchholz> you can google it, theres ways described to get it working
[19:04] <mobster> ati 11.3 driver released few hours back. will it support natty?
[19:15] <gnomefreak> i am here right?
[19:15] <Pici> gnomefreak: no, you're there.
[19:15]  * yofel looks through gnomefreaks ghost
[19:16] <gnomefreak> thanks. network is extreamly slow, takes >3minutes to open google.com
[19:16] <charlie-tca> gnomefreak: doesn't appear so
[19:16] <gnomefreak> after updates i guess i will work on it again
[19:17] <gnomefreak> if they start
[19:18]  * yofel gives unity another go
[19:19] <gnomefreak> is there a command to find out the speed of the network is at
[19:20] <gnomefreak> it should be at least 200mbps but i can say it is no where in the area of that today
[19:21] <gnomefreak> from what update is giving me its ~600kbps
[19:21] <gnomefreak> 78% [36 Sources 654 kB/865 kB 75%]
[19:22] <gnomefreak> in nm it is telling me its at 100mbps
[19:22] <yofel> and compiz still crashes...
[19:22] <trijntje> maybe the server is busy, cant you run an online speedtest?
[19:22] <gnomefreak> well that is one thing its not doing here
[19:23] <gnomefreak> trijntje: not sure how
[19:23] <yofel> unity-2d is somewhat nice, but I'm not sure if I could get used to it
[19:23] <yofel> gnomefreak: what's the ping time?
[19:24] <gnomefreak> 16 packets transmitted, 14 received, 12% packet loss, time 21116ms
[19:24] <IdleOne> should of just stuck with 10.10 :/
[19:24] <gnomefreak> that is pinging google.com
[19:24] <trijntje> gnomefreak, http://speedtest.net/
[19:25] <yofel> 21seconds o.O? that's ~40ms here
[19:25] <gnomefreak> i guess it would have to open the page to test it
[19:26] <alex_mayorga> can somebody help me with bug 727365?
[19:26] <gnomefreak> ill let you know when it loads. but nothing not even a letter has loaded yet
[19:26] <trijntje> of you wireless it might be that all your neighbours are on the same radio channel, you could check your modem
[19:26] <trijntje> *if
[19:26] <gnomefreak> not wireless
[19:27] <gnomefreak> i have reset everything and still no change
[19:27] <gnomefreak> still not even a letter or nothing
[19:27] <charlie-tca> gnomefreak: my isp uses http://speedtest.net to tell me my connection is "fast"
[19:28] <gnomefreak> i guess if it loads i can test it, but it isnt looking good on loading
[19:28] <gnomefreak> alex_mayorga: my java isnt crashing
[19:28] <charlie-tca> I download consistently at 156KBS, but they say it is 1.2mbps
[19:30] <yofel> alex_mayorga: mine neither (using minefield)
[19:30] <alex_mayorga> yofel: do you use HOB?
[19:30] <yofel> wth's that?
[19:31] <gnomefreak> still nothing loaded. i have to go cook && eat i guess i will save the site and test it tomorrow. alex_mayorga chomium,minefield,firefox4 none of them showing java crashing. icedtea6-plugin: Installed: 6b21.1~20110320-0ubuntu1
[19:31] <gnomefreak> works fine here.
[19:32] <gnomefreak> ok im out. see you tommorow i hope
[19:32] <gnomefreak> but kind of what to know what HOB is
[19:32] <gnomefreak> still nothing on that page
[19:35] <alex_mayorga> yofel: this thing https://www.hobsoft.com/products/secure_remote_access/JWT_Juniper_SA.jsp the firm I consult for uses it for remote desktop and it triggers bug 727365
[19:36] <shaneo> im having trouble updating anyone else ??
[19:38] <yofel> shaneo: define 'trouble' (no, I'm fine here)
[19:38] <shaneo> E:Encountered a section with no Package: header, E:Problem with MergeList /var/lib/apt/lists/archive.ubuntu.com_ubuntu_dists_natty_main_i18n_Translation-en, E:The package lists or status file could not be parsed or opened.'
[19:38] <yofel> alex_mayorga: and how do I start that applet?
[19:38] <yofel> shaneo: try to refresh the package cache again
[19:39] <shaneo> i have been all day
[19:39] <alex_mayorga> yofel: http://www.hob.de/webapps/jwt33/www/jwt.htm
[19:39] <alex_mayorga> yofel: but I believe I need to get out first
[19:40] <yofel> alex_mayorga: runs fine for me
[19:41] <alex_mayorga> looks like at work they have a version that's a bit more dated, might be that
[19:41] <alex_mayorga> yofel: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=642117
[19:43] <yofel> shaneo: what happens if you delete the file?
[19:44] <shaneo> idk where is it ??
[19:44] <yofel> alex_mayorga: no idea, maybe talk to the others in -mozillateam
[19:44] <yofel> shaneo: it says so in the error: /var/lib/apt/lists/archive.ubuntu.com_ubuntu_dists_natty_main_i18n_Translation-en
[19:44] <shaneo> lol sorry
[19:44] <alex_mayorga> yofel: would try
[19:46] <shaneo> what is the command u remove a single file in terminal
[19:47] <shaneo> n/
[19:47] <shaneo> m
[19:47] <yofel> shaneo: sudo rm /var/lib/apt/lists/archive.ubuntu.com_ubuntu_dists_natty_main_i18n_Translation-en
[19:48] <shaneo> everything is running fine now thanks
[19:48] <shaneo> i didnt even think of removing the file
[19:49] <shaneo> wow still a lot of fails but not getting the error i was receiving before
[19:50] <shaneo> E: Encountered a section with no Package: header
[19:50] <shaneo> E: Problem with MergeList /var/lib/apt/lists/archive.ubuntu.com_ubuntu_dists_natty_main_i18n_Translation-en%5fUS
[19:50] <shaneo> E: The package lists or status file could not be parsed or opened.
[19:50] <yofel> ...
[19:50] <yofel> sudo rm /var/lib/apt/lists/*
[19:50] <yofel> that will remove all of the package list files
[19:50] <shaneo> also the partials ??
[19:51] <yofel> hm, no, they're in a subfolder
[19:51] <shaneo> should i remove them though
[19:52] <yofel> if you get errors yes, otherwise I would only delete the others first
[19:52] <shaneo> ok
[19:52] <shaneo> yofel: thank you
[19:59] <shaneo> wow 66 updates yesterday and 111 today gotta love beta's lol
[20:29] <smallfoot-> alpha 1, alpha 2, alpha 3 sucked, but now that im using alpha 3 (almost beta1) then its great
[20:30] <smallfoot-> 10.04 is pretty nice if you use GNOME (unity sucks)
[20:30] <smallfoot-> 11.04 i mean
[20:30] <smallfoot-> things work pretty well
[20:30] <smallfoot-> some small bugs here and there, but seem to works pretty ok
[20:32] <gordonjcp> smallfoot-: it's kind of cool, but I can't seem to turn off the drop-shadows on the active window
[20:32] <Gulfstream> is there a Ubuntu Free Culture Showcase in Natty?
[20:32] <gordonjcp> smallfoot-: which entirely stops me using it
[20:32] <elias> is there a way to get the 10.10 <for purchase> items in the 11.04 software center?
[20:36] <Daekdroom> elias, they'll be available once 11.04 is released
[20:37] <elias> was just wondering if i could change some config setting to try them now
[20:44] <skyjumper> anyone with a thinkpad experiencing touchpad lag / inability to adjust anything in gpointing-device-settings?
[20:46] <penguin42> anyone else having problems running 'perf' - libbfd-2.21.0-system seems to have a naming problem
[20:48] <yofel> penguin42: got the exact command I should test?
[20:49] <penguin42> yofel: Try just perf by itself
[20:49] <yofel> gave me the usage instructions
[20:49] <penguin42> hmm
[20:49] <penguin42> yofel: What kernel version exactly are you running?
[20:50] <yofel> 2.6.38-7-generic
[20:51] <penguin42> yofel: Ah, thanks - I had an old linux-tools package
[20:58] <elias> Daekdroom: managed to install my purchases by manually adding them to the apt sources :)
[21:15]  * BUGabundo is this close on giving up on Ubuntu :(
[21:15] <Gulfstream> BUGabundo: why?
[21:15] <BUGabundo> audio broken .... again
[21:16] <Daekdroom> Don't worry. Pulseaudio went on broken for like 2 whole releases in here. Unfortunately I had no knowledge of Launchpad...
[21:17] <Daekdroom> I mean, it will - eventually - fix itself :P
[21:17] <gordonjcp> pulseaudio is pretty unpleasant
[21:19] <smallfoot-> GNOME 2.32 supports color management and ICC profiles, but ubuntu does not install the packages by default
[21:19] <smallfoot-> yeah, sometimes my Spotify stops playing music
[21:25] <smallfoot-> what happend to xulrunner in natty?
[21:29] <smallfoot-> why isnt openoffice.org-core marked as "supported" ?
[21:30] <smallfoot-> oh its just a transiational package that can be removed
[21:33] <DarthFrog> Hi folks.  I'm trying to install VMWare Workstation on Natty.  But the building of the kernel modules fails and, as I'm not a programmer, I don't know how to get around it.  The output is at http://paste.ubuntu.com/587030/   Is this easy to get around?  Should I file a bug report?
[21:40] <trism> DarthFrog: http://communities.vmware.com/thread/304307 this thread gives the impression that the vmware team has resolved the issue, but have to wait until the next version comes out
[21:40] <DarthFrog> trism: Thank you very much.
[21:41] <gordonjcp> this is a slightly more technical crowd so I'll ask here although it's a more generic Ubuntu question
[21:42] <gordonjcp> Arch Linux has AUR, the Arch User Repository, for user-contributed packages - what's the Ubuntu equivalent, if any?
[21:42] <arand> gordonjcp: PPAs
[21:43] <gordonjcp> arand: ty
[21:43] <gordonjcp> will investigate
[21:44] <arand> gordonjcp: But I'm guessing that more packages make it into universe that into the "core" of AL...
[21:44] <gordonjcp> arand: this is for a fairly "niche" package anyway, I don't expect it to have a lot of users
[21:45] <gordonjcp> are PPAs release-specific?
[21:45] <arand> Yes.
[21:45] <gordonjcp> that is, do I need one for 10.04, 10.10, 11.04 and so on?
[21:46] <arand> many times they can be installed regardless, if there are specific dependencies, not.
[21:46] <gordonjcp> okay
[21:46] <gordonjcp> and what's the best way of testing in all the various releases?
[21:47] <gordonjcp> just install a machine with half a dozen different versions of Ubuntu?
[21:47] <arand> virtual machines, chroot magic, mayhaps.
[21:48] <arand> But, what is the applications and wht is your system and what is your final goal?
[21:49] <BUGabundo> frak
[21:49] <BUGabundo> its flash that is breaking Pulse Audio
[21:49] <BUGabundo> time to upgrade PA to trunk
[21:49] <BUGabundo> and alsa too
[21:52] <kklimonda> BUGabundo: sounds like fun :)
[21:52] <BUGabundo> NO IT DOESN'T
[21:52] <BUGabundo> it doesn't *sound* like anything
[21:52] <BUGabundo> cause its NOT working
[21:53] <kklimonda> :D
[21:53] <mhall119> I hear ya
[21:53] <kklimonda> BUGabundo: I hear ya ;)
[21:53] <kklimonda> damn
[21:53] <mhall119> ;P
[21:53]  * BUGabundo adds extra peeps to /ignore
[21:53] <mhall119> aw
[21:54] <BUGabundo> I have xedgers version
[21:54]  * BUGabundo hides
[21:57] <gordonjcp> I really dislike pulseaudio
[21:58] <penguin42> it's worked for me for the last 3 or 4 releases
[21:58] <gordonjcp> arand: https://github.com/gordonjcp/lysdr/wiki
[21:59] <gordonjcp> arand: system is a P4-3GHz that doesn't really do virtualisation, and the idea is that it should be a simple matter to install lysdr, hook up your SDR board, and expect it to work
[21:59] <BUGabundo> humm no ppa for audio https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-audio-dev/+archive/ppa
[22:02] <genii-around> BUGabundo: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio maybe
[22:02] <arand> gordonjcp: Ah, right, you want your stuff in ubuntu (I though you were looking for an ubuntu version of something). Right, you can simply upload several versions to the PPA which will be built using the avaiable dependencies in the deifferent versions of ubuntu, if you are lucky that will be enough to make it run on all target releases.
[22:02] <BUGabundo> you forget that I try to be an end user
[22:02] <BUGabundo> no compiling from source
[22:03] <genii-around> Hehe
[22:03] <arand> gordonjcp: For long-term though, best way to get something into ubuntu, is getting it into debian.
[22:04] <gordonjcp> arand: yeah
[22:04] <gordonjcp> arand: the deps aren't critical
[22:04] <gordonjcp> arand: Debian doesn't appear to ship with a new enough version of jack though
[22:06] <arand> gordonjcp: Not even sid?
[22:06] <gordonjcp> arand: didn't try sid, I couldn't get it to work
[22:07] <arand> gordonjcp: http://packages.qa.debian.org/j/jack-tools.html
[22:07] <gordonjcp> arand: most of my users are either using Ubuntu or Arch
[22:09] <penguin42> gordonjcp: ppa's are pretty easy, although you woul dhave to keep it updated through releases; what is it that the standard stuff in ubuntu doesn't do?
[22:09] <arand> gordonjcp: Ehm, jack is exactly the same version in ubuntu as in debian stable...
[22:09] <gordonjcp> penguin42: did you look at the link I posted?
[22:10] <gordonjcp> arand: oh, okay, hmm
[22:10] <gordonjcp> penguin42: this simply does not exist in Ubuntu
[22:10] <penguin42> the lysdr wiki?
[22:10] <gordonjcp> yeah
[22:10] <gordonjcp> it's not packaged for Ubuntu
[22:10]  * penguin42 reads
[22:11] <penguin42> gordonjcp: Does it actually need jackd or will pulse's jack compatibility work?
[22:12] <gordonjcp> penguin42: it's also unlikely to have the mass appeal to get into the mainstream package repository
[22:12] <gordonjcp> penguin42: no idea
[22:12] <penguin42> gordonjcp: There is plenty of obscure stuff in 'universe' - lots of ham radio stuff and sdr stuff
[22:12] <gordonjcp> penguin42: if you can use pulse to route audio between applications, and if it serves up a known amount of samples every time, I don't see why not
[22:13] <penguin42> gordonjcp: So I don't know enough about audio routing; I know there is a pulseaudio-module-jack  'jackd modules for PulseAudio sound server'
[22:14] <penguin42> hmm no, that s the other way around
[22:14] <penguin42> that package lets pa connect to jackd
[22:14] <gordonjcp> penguin42: yeah, I'm currently downloading 10.04 because most of my users seem to be on that
[22:14] <gordonjcp> but it's already 22:15 and I've got an early start tomorrow
[22:15] <gordonjcp> and my eyes are still sore from trying Unity earlier
[22:15] <penguin42> gordonjcp: Basing on jack rather than pa is what's making it hard
[22:15] <gordonjcp> penguin42: well, PA doesn't do what I want
[22:15] <DarthFrog> trism:  There was enough info in that URL you gave me that I was able to get VMWare Workstation running.  Thanks again.
[22:15] <trism> DarthFrog: excellent
[22:16] <penguin42> gordonjcp: and you're saying it needs really recent jack as well?
[22:16] <gordonjcp> well, 0.118 ideally
[22:17] <gordonjcp> it can be made to work with 0.116 but that's unbelievably old
[22:19] <penguin42> gordonjcp: You can file a bug asking for it to be updated, but it'll take at least a revision to happen
[22:19] <gordonjcp> penguin42: the jack in Ubuntu is new enough
[22:19] <gordonjcp> apparently the one in Debian stable is now new enough too
[22:20] <arand> gordonjcp: Installing libjack-jackd2-dev solves the dependency on debian stable it seems...
[22:20] <gordonjcp> I just can't stand pulseaudio...
[22:21] <arand> gordonjcp: Like I said, jack in ubuntu and debian stable is the exact same version.
[22:24] <gordonjcp> arand: yup
[22:28] <arand> gordonjcp: Well, it compiles and runs here on debian stable at least, not sure if it is working with all componets though, I need to read what it's actually supposed to do =)
[22:29] <gordonjcp> arand: read through the wiki page
[22:29] <gordonjcp> arand: although that does rather assume you know what a software-defined radio is
[22:29] <gordonjcp> arand: you know shortwave radio, right?  Well, this does it with a very simple bit of hardware, a soundcard, and a fastish PC
[22:30] <penguin42> gordonjcp: does it do a pair of phases, one into each stereo channel?
[22:31] <gordonjcp> penguin42: yes
[22:31] <gordonjcp> penguin42: generate a local oscillator at four times the centre frequency of the bit you want to listen to, divide by four with a Johnson counter, and you've got two clocks 90 degrees apart
[22:31] <gordonjcp> bang that through a mixer with your incoming RF and you've got complex samples
[22:32] <penguin42> don't you need aliasing filters and stuff?
[22:32] <gordonjcp> nope
[22:33] <gordonjcp> you apply a bandpass filter to the aerial to take out seriously out-of-band stuff, and then your captured signal is anti-aliasing filtered by the sound card
[22:33] <gordonjcp> so if you ride a bike
[22:33] <gordonjcp> plot the height of the tyre valve above the wheel spindle against time
[22:34] <arand> gordonjcp: Well, it works fine if I do the mplayer test example, I have no clue about radio stuff...
[22:34] <gordonjcp> or, distance travelled really
[22:34] <gordonjcp> you get a sine wave
[22:34] <gordonjcp> arand: nice
[22:34] <gordonjcp> okay so we have a complex sample, that is where the sample comprises a real and an imaginary value
[22:35] <gordonjcp> the sample is the end of a vector that rotates, so a complex sine wave is like the tyre valve seen from the spindle of your bike wheel
[22:35] <gordonjcp> spin the wheel faster for a higher frequency
[22:35] <genii-around> gordonjcp: If you plot the tire valve , you don't get a sine wave but something that looks more like the top of two sine waves
[22:36] <gordonjcp> genii-around: how do you get that?
[22:37] <gordonjcp> genii-around: for half a revolution of the wheel, the valve is below the centre...
[22:39] <gordonjcp> arand: incidentally if you grabbed sdr1.flac, there's a bonus prize for spotting the Windows error "choonk" sound
[22:40] <arand> gordonjcp: Heh, that's take ages of looking :)
[22:40] <gordonjcp> arand: aha
[22:40] <gordonjcp> does it?
[22:40] <gordonjcp> how else might you do it?
[22:41] <Jaymac> quick question on dash - is it possible to resize the font?
[22:41] <Jaymac> when i click the ubuntu logo and get the main dash window, the font and icons are huge
[22:42] <Jaymac> the Files & Folders and Applications windows are fine
[22:43] <gordonjcp> "system problem detected, do you want to report the problem?"
[22:43] <gordonjcp> no, of course I don't!
[22:43] <Jaymac> and if FF isn't my default browser, can I change the Browse the Web program to something else?
[22:43] <gordonjcp> what the hell *is* the problem?
[22:43] <Jaymac> my default web browser isn't FF
[22:43] <gordonjcp> don't just tell me there's a problem, tell me what it is, what the hell do you think this is?  Mac System 6?
[22:44] <gordonjcp> stupid design decisions ftl
[22:44] <Jaymac> that doesn't sound like a design problem, more a useability problem
[22:44] <Jaymac> usability*
[22:45] <MTeck> I just installed the comand line system of natty with the daily image onto a mac mini using the amd64+mac.iso image. It went through the install just great but then when it's booting up it gets through bios, loads up grub, then shortly after grub is done and it starts loading linux, the screen stops displaying anything and the light on the monitor blinks like there's no signal being sent to it.
[22:45] <gordonjcp> and usablility is a function of design...
[22:45] <MTeck> Any thoughts what might be wrong here?
[22:45] <penguin42> MTeck: What hardware?
[22:46] <MTeck> penguin42: mac mini
[22:46] <MTeck> penguin42: so far, that's all i know about this thing
[22:46] <Jaymac> gordonjcp, i don't know what your issue is but it sounds more like the error message text needs improved rather than anything being redesigned
[22:46] <penguin42> MTeck: Have you tried the rescue mode?
[22:47] <penguin42> MTeck: On the grub menu?
[22:48] <MTeck> penguin42: hmm..... nope
[22:48] <MTeck> penguin42: works perfect there
[22:48] <penguin42> what works perfect there?
[22:48] <coz_> hey all
[22:50] <MTeck> penguin42: must be the vt.handoff=7 in the menu that's breaking it.......
[22:51] <MTeck> thanks :D
[22:52] <MTeck> penguin42: heh... also also seem to have misplaced my password :S
[22:52] <penguin42> nothing that can't easily be fixed
[22:52] <MTeck> I don't wanna reinstall though..... and ecrypt on my home dir
[22:52]  * MTeck (now) lazy.....
[22:53] <gordonjcp> argh, why does Ubuntu come as a .iso?
[22:53] <MTeck> gordonjcp: because iso is de facto; personally I think it should also come as a .dd
[22:53] <gordonjcp> MTeck: yes
[22:54] <penguin42> unetbootin makes nice thumb boots from the isos
[22:54] <gordonjcp> MTeck: what's .iso even for these days?
[22:54] <gordonjcp> penguin42: doesn't work for me at all
[22:54] <MTeck> I have plenty of times where I need an iso
[22:55] <meganerdca> The iso It does not work on my new sandy bridge PC as a burnt disk, seems to work fine after unetbootin makes a USB thumb drive
[22:55] <MTeck> So where is this vt.handoff being tacked on?
[22:55] <meganerdca> most of the time having the ISO kicking around has been a good thing
[22:56] <penguin42> meganerdca: What controller is the DVD drive plugged into?
[22:56]  * MTeck hates new grub
[22:56] <gordonjcp> I've used floppy drives more recently than CDs
[22:56] <meganerdca> penguin42: the normal one, nothing is plugged into the new 6 Gbit sata
[22:57] <meganerdca> I also tried a USB DVD drive and a PATA DVD
[22:57] <meganerdca> Checked the md5s of the iso and probably burned 20 disks.  Its been real fun
[22:58] <meganerdca> Seems to work fine on the machine this will eventually replace (an old AMD 4400+ dual core)
[22:58] <gordonjcp> DVD is obsolete
[22:58] <meganerdca> sure, this system won't have one once installed
[22:58] <gordonjcp> why do we even bother to support this legacy cruft?
[22:58] <meganerdca> My older Core i7 does not have an optical drive either
[22:58] <MTeck> penguin42: looks like at some point I have a bug to report....
[22:58] <meganerdca> gordonjcp: becuase it is still widely used
[22:59] <penguin42> MTeck: Yeh it should boot and display video
[22:59] <meganerdca> gordonjcp: it also seems to be how operating systems are still installed/reinstalled
[23:00] <MTeck> crap... my company has a firewall that is going to prevent me from easily downloading packages...
[23:00] <MTeck> downloading anything....
[23:01] <meganerdca> thats why I have a myfi (well a Wind branded equivalent
[23:01] <MTeck> It needs 1) authentication and 2) for unapproved websites downloads need to be downloaded to a separate server and scanned before clients can grab it (and are provided an internal link for the downloaded file)
[23:02] <JockeTF> Anyone else having problems playing Flac with gstreamer in Natty?
[23:02] <Jaymac> in totem? banshee?
[23:02] <JockeTF> I'm getting a bit of stutter and crackling.
[23:02] <JockeTF> Both.
[23:03] <JockeTF> gst-launch as well.
[23:03] <Jaymac> flac working fine in banshee
[23:04] <gordonjcp> meganerdca: it's not how they're installed, they're installed off USB drives these days
[23:04] <gordonjcp> meganerdca: I don't think I've owned a machine with an optical drive for nearly ten years
[23:05] <meganerdca> My two main desktops do not have optical drives, so you are sort of preaching to the choir
[23:05] <gordonjcp> man, I can't get 10.04 onto anything bootable at all
[23:06] <JockeTF> Hmm, seems to happen only when using PulseAudio for output.
[23:06] <matcouto> Is anybody here testing Ubuntu 11.04!? I'm having some wireless problem, the connection is not stable. Any idea of what could it be?
[23:06] <JockeTF> With ALSA only it doesn't crackle. :S
[23:06] <meganerdca> I am trying to test it, my problem is that it is not installing due to bleeding edge hardware
[23:07] <meganerdca> matcouto: check /var/log/daemon.log
[23:07] <meganerdca> matcouto: that is where network-manager puts it's messages
[23:07] <meganerdca> matcouto: it might also help to know what wireless device and driver you are using
[23:09] <matcouto> meganerdca: there's no daemon.log file
[23:13] <meganerdca> matcouto: /var/log/daemon.log
[23:53] <arand> gordonjcp: I couldn't help but poke, using dh7, this rules file seems to work ok: http://paste.debian.net/112367/ It's likely all kinds of bad practice, but it works...
[23:54] <gordonjcp> arand: cool, thanks for that
[23:54] <gordonjcp> it's a good place to start; I was going to start looking at how packaging works in debianish distros
[23:55]  * gordonjcp -> bed