[07:30] <ricotz> robert_ancell, hi
[07:30] <robert_ancell> ricotz, hey
[07:30] <robert_ancell> ricotz, nice work on the GNOME3 PPA btw!
[07:30] <ricotz> robert_ancell, do you have an idea what is causing totem to fail?
[07:30] <ricotz> thanks
[07:31] <robert_ancell> ricotz, no, I had a quick look but I couldn't work it out either
[07:31] <ricotz> it seems to be relate to the totem-pl-parser update, it looks like the includes coming from there are empty but the pkg-config file looks good
[07:31] <ricotz> locally it builds fine though
[07:32] <robert_ancell> ricotz, btw, I made a vinagre branch, but it needs more dependencies until it can be finished
[07:33] <ricotz> i see
[07:33] <ricotz> what do you think about gnome-session and gdm?
[07:35] <robert_ancell> ricotz, I don't know what the side-effects will be, but I figure the PPA should run all of GNOME3
[07:37] <ricotz> robert_ancell, exactly, but these are heavily patched :/
[07:38] <robert_ancell> so, if you think you can make it work, go for it!
[07:39] <ricotz> perhaps ;)
[07:40] <ricotz> robert_ancell, there are some packages which should go into natty like mutter, clutter-1.0, totem-pl-parser, accountsservice, perhaps you have time for them
[07:41] <robert_ancell> ricotz, I just updated clutter-1.0, sure, I'll try and look at the others
[07:41] <ricotz> thanks
[07:56] <pitti> Good mornin
[07:57] <pitti> fta: ah, you didn't use -u? sorry about that
[07:58] <pitti> ugh, starting the desktop session in the morning is *hard work* these days :(
[08:18] <didrocks> good morning
[08:18] <mvo> hey didrocks
[08:19] <pitti> bonjour didrocks
[08:20] <didrocks> hey mvo. Guten Morgen pitti
[08:26] <mvo> pitti: about the openoffice.org-dev package in the archive. it seems likes its in NBS and causes a upgrade issue too, anything I can do to help to get rid of it (causes the main-all upgrade test profile to fail)
[08:27] <mvo> the auto-upgrade-tester looks remarkable less bad than it used to be, server, ubuntu,kubuntu,mythubuntu all green (well, white :)
[08:30] <pitti> mvo: I think we can just kill it; there are just three reverse build deps in universe, i. e. removal won't break installability
[08:30] <pitti> and the next upload of these can just switch to libo-dev
[08:31] <mvo> great
[08:33] <mvo> I can do the transition for the three deps now if that helps
[08:33] <pitti> mvo: removed
[08:37] <Sweetshark> .
[08:38] <mvo> thanks pitti, I look at ooo-build-extensions and the others now
[08:38] <pitti> mvo: don't worry too much about it, though
[08:38] <pitti> hey Sweetshark
[08:38] <mvo> good morning Sweetshark
[08:39] <mvo> at the next uds you have to tell us the story behind your nick
[08:39] <ricotz> Sweetshark, hi :), i hope you will upload the new libreoffice to the ppa for lucid as well
[08:41] <pitti> mvo: yeah, I already pinned him down for telling in exchange for buying him a beer!
[08:44] <seb128> hello desktopers
[08:44] <pitti> bonjour Monsieur Bacher!
[08:45] <seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
[08:45] <cdbs> Bonjour Monsieur `list-all-nicks`
[08:45] <mvo> hy seb128!
[08:45] <seb128> pitti, let me remind you about the meeting reminder!
[08:45] <pitti> hey cdbs
[08:45] <seb128> hey cdbs
[08:45] <pitti> seb128: oh, today I genuinely forgot (so far), merci!
[08:45] <seb128> hey mvo
[08:45] <seb128> pitti, ;-)
[08:45] <cdbs> hello there pitti and seb128 :)
[08:46] <Sweetshark> ricotz: yes, I will. But there are still some deps I must figure out for the backports ...
[08:46] <pitti> seb128: look at the top at http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches.txt
[08:46]  * pitti sheds a tear *sob*
[08:46] <pitti> seb128: do you think we should keep RB in main until next LTS at least?
[08:46] <seb128> pitti, that seems wrong
[08:46] <desrt> are there plans to have networkmanager 0.9?
[08:46] <seb128> pitti, ogra said they wanted to keep it for armel iirc since mono and armel are not best buddies
[08:46] <ricotz> Sweetshark, ok, thanks
[08:46] <seb128> pitti, or I got that wrong?
[08:47] <pitti> seb128: why? the evil fairy stomped it to death
[08:47] <pitti> seb128: ah, then I guess they should seed it on armel then
[08:47] <seb128> pitti, check with ogra
[08:47] <pitti> seb128: I was pondering to add it to supported, but ubuntu-netbook [armel] is better
[08:47] <pitti> seb128: yup, thanks
[08:47] <seb128> but yeah I would keep it in main anyway until lts
[08:47] <seb128> it's not like it was costing a lot to maintain
[08:48] <pitti> seb128: right
[08:52] <rodrigo_> morning
[08:59] <desrt> rodrigo_: good morning
[08:59] <seb128> hey rodrigo_
[08:59] <seb128> hey desrt
[08:59] <desrt> hi seb
[08:59] <pitti> hey rodrigo_
[08:59] <pitti> bonjour desrt, how are you?
[08:59] <desrt> and pitti :)
[08:59] <desrt> tired
[08:59]  * desrt is in india and still not completely cured of jetlag
[09:00] <rodrigo_> hi desrt, seb128, pitti
[09:00] <desrt> rodrigo_: i was wondering if you plan to package networkmanager 0.9 in the gnome3 ppa....
[09:00] <chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
[09:00] <rodrigo_> desrt, yes, needed for g-c-c
[09:00] <desrt> rodrigo_: that makes me happy :)
[09:01] <rodrigo_> desrt, cool :)
[09:01] <pitti> hey chrisccoulson, back to normal hours? :-)
[09:01] <desrt> rodrigo_: looking forward to the awesome new applet
[09:01] <chrisccoulson> hi pitti :)
[09:01] <chrisccoulson> just for today ;)
[09:03] <rodrigo_> desrt, btw, I came up with this patch: http://pastebin.com/HEtQD1iJ
[09:04] <rodrigo_> desrt, I'm going to make a package so that people can test it before I push to master
[09:05] <desrt> rodrigo_: looks quite good
[09:05] <ricotz> rodrigo_, hi
[09:06] <desrt> wait...
[09:06] <desrt> quite bad, actually
[09:06] <rodrigo_> hi ricotz
[09:06] <desrt> g_usleep is for micros
[09:06] <ricotz> rodrigo_, will you have time for the ppa today?
[09:06] <rodrigo_> ricotz, I hope so, why?
[09:06] <desrt> so you only sleep for 1millisecond total
[09:06] <desrt> 2, sorry
[09:06] <rodrigo_> desrt, oh, right
[09:07] <ricotz> rodrigo_, the eog is missing the introspection build, perhaps it could be internally shipped like gedit does
[09:07] <desrt> also: it's very silly but you only try 19 times :)
[09:07] <rodrigo_> ricotz, yes
[09:08] <ricotz> rodrigo_, alright, i hope you could make that
[09:09] <ricotz> desrt, i have a nm09 package
[09:09] <desrt> ricotz: fascinating.  ppa?
[09:10] <ricotz> desrt, but it failed for i386, but seems to work here with amd64
[09:10] <desrt> that seems odd
[09:10] <desrt> what happened on i386?
[09:10] <ricotz> https://edge.launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/staging
[09:10] <rodrigo_> ricotz, oh, cool!
[09:12] <desrt> rodrigo_: i don't suppose natty will go with 0.9
[09:12] <desrt> seems a bit late for that...
[09:13] <rodrigo_> desrt, yes
[09:13] <ricotz> desrt, it would break a lot, but perhaps the current nm packaging of 0.8.4 could be changed
[09:13] <rodrigo_> the ppa for now
[09:13] <desrt> rodrigo_: fine by me
[09:13] <desrt> all the cool kids run with the PPA anyway :)
[09:14] <rodrigo_> :D
[09:14] <ricotz> the natty package should have a separate package for the vpn lib
[09:17] <ricotz> robert_ancell, have you seen the new ibus package, i think it might be better if the gtk3 module is put into an extra package like libcanberra
[09:18] <robert_ancell> ricotz, not sure what you mean, but I don't know anything about ibus anyway :)
[09:19] <ricotz> robert_ancell, there was an ibus package uploaded to the gnome3 ppa which enables the gtk3 support
[09:19] <ricotz> uploaded by wzssyqa
[09:20] <seb128> the ppa seems to start being a bit hackish it seems
[09:20] <seb128> we will need to get quite some cleaning before uploading next cycle
[09:21] <chrisccoulson> hi seb128!
[09:21] <chrisccoulson> how are you?
[09:21] <seb128> we should also recommend users to not run it if they want something that doesn't break their system or the upgrade to next ubuntu version
[09:21] <seb128> hey chrisccoulson, I'm fine thanks, how are you?
[09:21] <chrisccoulson> yeah, good thanks
[09:22] <robert_ancell> ricotz, oh, right, now I see what you mean
[09:22] <ricotz> seb128, i have done some direct copying from debian, so nothing to worry ;)
[09:23] <ricotz> robert_ancell, btw who is wzssyqa
[09:23] <seb128> ricotz, it's rather than the binary are not always distributed as they should
[09:24] <seb128> or that some component should be better let out of ppa builds, ppa are fine for applications, what is in this ppa is becoming border line
[09:24] <robert_ancell> ricotz, ok, delete it from the PPA if it's going to cause problems (as it now _only_ works with GTK3 right?)
[09:24] <seb128> like it's likely it will break other desktops
[09:24] <seb128> or patches got dropped because people didn't want to port them to the new version
[09:24] <ricotz> seb128, yeah, right
[09:25] <robert_ancell> ricotz, he asked to join, he maintains some debian packages.
[09:25] <ricotz> seb128, mostly the lpi patches are applied
[09:25] <seb128> we should communicate clearly that this ppa doesn't give any garanty that it will not screw your distro and that you can't complain if it does
[09:25] <ricotz> seb128, but the control-center-patches were too heavy
[09:26] <robert_ancell> We really need to work out who can be in the team, there are people applying all the time and I have no idea who most of them are
[09:26] <RAOF> #include <xorg-edgers.h> :)
[09:26] <ricotz> robert_ancell, i see
[09:26] <seb128> we should only accept people who contributed to something in Ubuntu before
[09:26] <seb128> if they didn't ask them to do merge requests for a bit and get those reviewed
[09:27] <seb128> to see what work they are doing
[09:27] <huats> morning
[09:29] <ricotz> seb128, ok, besides the ibus package there is nothing hackish in there yet
[09:31] <pitti> didrocks: so!
[09:32]  * didrocks things he should run away now :)
[09:32] <didrocks> thinks*
[09:32] <pitti> didrocks: do you remember the unity startup failures I (and other folks) had with the live CD?
[09:32]  * pitti just can't resist scaring didrocks in the morning two days before b1
[09:32] <seb128> pitti, you mean the if user == pitti; then exit 0
[09:32] <didrocks> pitti: yeah, I remember about it, unfortunately
[09:33] <pitti> seb128: exactly! but I found a clever workaround
[09:33] <pitti> I now call myself p1tti
[09:33] <seb128> you changed your name? ;-)
[09:33] <seb128> lol
[09:33] <pitti> didrocks: anyway, I just tested the current builds on my wife's PC (ati) and my dell mini 10, and it's all working now \o/
[09:34] <pitti> didrocks: I assume what happened was that there was an unity crash earlier, and since it didn't autospawn either, you got stuck
[09:34] <didrocks> pitti: excellent  \o/ I tried last week on the dell mini 10 (intel) as well and try a lot of reboot without getting it
[09:34] <pitti> now I didn't see it crashing, but even if it does, it would respawn
[09:34] <rodrigo_> seb128, hmm, afaik no patches have been dropped, except for the obsolete ones. It's true we have several disabled patches, but nothing dropped for no reason
[09:34] <didrocks> pitti: yeah, that's possible
[09:34] <didrocks> pitti: anyway, the test tool will change just after beta 1
[09:34] <pitti> didrocks: so I think it's all good now, or at least good enough for b1
[09:34] <didrocks> pitti: new, small, and shiny new little piece of software :)
[09:34] <pitti> didrocks: it's just a lot of hard work on my workstation now (i. e. the docked x201), as it still keeps crashing like mad at start
[09:35] <pitti> didrocks: oh, like a script to exercise it?
[09:35] <didrocks> pitti: always the same crashes? (thoses you reported)
[09:35] <pitti> didrocks: yes, the closure thihngy
[09:35] <didrocks> pitti: it's just independant of Nux now
[09:35] <seb128> rodrigo_, well, I've seen quite some indicator patches being not applied because they need to be updated
[09:35] <pitti> about 5 times in a row, whenever you so much as look at it, and then it suddenly settles down
[09:35] <seb128> rodrigo_, or things like applying default keyboard layout for the system in g-c-c
[09:35] <didrocks> pitti: yeah, it's targeted and should be fixed with the next release (it's on the 10 bugs priority list)
[09:35] <seb128> rodrigo_, those will need to be figured before those packages land in Ubuntu
[09:36] <pitti> didrocks: but I'm happy that it doesn't affect more people
[09:36] <didrocks> pitti: mainly, we have a lot of signals not disconnected when objects are still alive
[09:36] <rodrigo_> seb128, yes, of course, that's why they are just disabled, not dropped
[09:36] <pitti> didrocks: perhaps this is specific to multiple monitors?
[09:36] <seb128> rodrigo_, well, when I say "dropped" is "not applied to the current build"
[09:36] <didrocks> pitti: not really, I have multiple monitors and it doesn't happen here
[09:37] <pitti> didrocks: then it's strcmp(user, "martin") ..
[09:37] <didrocks> pitti: but you have scripts at startup, isn't it?
[09:37] <didrocks> pitti: of course! :-)
[09:37] <pitti> didrocks: I do, but doesn't matter -- it crashes before already
[09:37] <didrocks> reminds me to add p1tti now as well
[09:37] <didrocks> pitti: well, anyway, all crashes we have is basically the same symptoms: undisconnected signals, we will get through them
[09:38] <seb128> didrocks, you can't say all the crashes, the most frequent ones rather
[09:38] <seb128> didrocks, there is still quite some crashes which are non frequent ones but not due to signals ;-)
[09:39] <didrocks> seb128: don't be picky on "all" and "most of" :-)
[09:39] <didrocks> right
[09:39] <seb128> ;-)
[09:39] <seb128> didrocks, "don't be picky", you don't know me or what? ;-)
[09:39] <pitti> kwality!
[09:40] <seb128> pitti, gwality you mean? ;-)
[09:40] <didrocks> seb128: heh! it was some kind of *jedi wave*
[09:41] <rodrigo_> seb128, right, but it's just because code was changing too fast to be keeping up the patches, now I guess it's a good time for re-enabling the patches
[09:42] <rodrigo_> ricotz, ^^
[09:42] <seb128> rodrigo_, right
[09:42] <desrt> ricotz: so i had to do a dpkg diversion in order to install your packages without uninstalling empathy :)
[09:42] <rodrigo_> ricotz, if you update a package and have time, please look at re-enabling the disabled patches
[09:42] <seb128> rodrigo_, one other concern is also that some bits landing in the ppa are cross desktop things that might break kde or xubuntu
[09:43] <desrt> ricotz: but i notice something fairly substantial: the new panel applet doesn't appear to be working properly
[09:43] <seb128> rodrigo_, or that the new binaries might not be clearly reviewed and might be different from what will land in debian or Ubuntu proper and break upgrades
[09:43] <rodrigo_> seb128, yes, I guess that's true
[09:43] <chrisccoulson> pitti - whats the plan for gluezilla after beta 1? are we stuck with it?
[09:43] <chrisccoulson> (i'm not sure if there was any more discussion)
[09:45] <pitti> chrisccoulson: there's currently some effort with using webkit in mono, but I wouldn't bet on it getting ready in time
[09:45] <ricotz> rodrigo_, alright, i will try to do so
[09:45] <pitti> chrisccoulson: frankly, I'd be fine with just dropping the webbrowser widget from mono for now
[09:46] <chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, that makes sense
[09:46] <ricotz> desrt, yes, that is caused by the packaging changes and the vpn lib
[09:46] <desrt> ricotz: i guess the old library should be uninstaled anyway
[09:47] <desrt> since the dbus API is different now
[09:47] <desrt> (although i don't know how substantial the changes are)
[09:47] <ricotz> seb128, i see you concerns, but if these build-deps are needed for updating the gnome3 packages, in my opinion it is ok to add them
[09:47] <chrisccoulson> pitti - i guess that things like gluezilla are going to be even more difficult to support in the future based on this announcement: http://groups.google.com/group/mozilla.dev.embedding/browse_thread/thread/73f34c70ef8df30a#
[09:47] <seb128> ricotz, some of those are optional
[09:47] <seb128> we should maybe have 2 ppas
[09:48] <seb128> one with only safe changes and one with extra components for those who want to break their install
[09:49] <ricotz> seb128, actually updating g-s-d is needed and this one makes the most trouble, i think
[09:50] <ricotz> seb128, updating things like clutter is needed for bugfixes
[09:50] <ricotz> seb128, you might speaking of accountsservice which wasnt really needed
[09:51] <ricotz> seb128, i think making two ppas isnt a good idea
[09:51] <seb128> new depends are fine, I will have a review of what is the ppa, but desrt speaking about installing thing that lead to have other things uninstalled or use dpkg-divert seems wrong
[09:51] <rodrigo_> ricotz, thanks
[09:52] <seb128> ricotz, rodrigo_: let's talk about it later, I need to review the ppa before doing extra comments
[09:52] <rodrigo_> seb128, ok
[09:52] <ricotz> seb128, ok
[09:53] <kamstrup> dpm: Saw ou ping yesterday. Awesome! :-D
[09:54] <kamstrup> dpm: I just pushed a fix to the GIR-error handling that makes Unity-3.0.gir work again (even though it contains errors). Also pushed a fix for return in C for methods that return an array of something
[09:57] <pitti> ah, that's better: http://people.canonical.com/~platform/workitems/natty/canonical-desktop-team-ubuntu-11.04-beta-1.html
[09:57] <desrt> ricotz: so there is the .typelib missing
[09:58] <ricotz> desrt, the nm libs might be compatible to some point if there werent abi bumps
[09:58] <desrt> ricotz: it's the dbus API that changed...
[09:58] <ricotz> desrt, i havent checked if it is running on gnome2
[09:59]  * rodrigo_ needs to run some errands, bbiab
[09:59] <desrt> ricotz: oops.  my fault for not installing the package containing the typelib =)
[10:00] <ricotz> desrt, exactly ;)
[10:00] <ricotz> g-s cant depend on it yet :P
[10:02] <desrt> so this is nice
[10:02] <desrt> missing quite some functionality at the moment, but very pretty
[10:02] <ricotz> desrt, do you have an idea why the i386 build fails? http://launchpadlibrarian.net/67321184/buildlog_ubuntu-natty-i386.network-manager_0.8.997-1~ricotz1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[10:02] <desrt> cc1: error: unrecognized command line option "-Wno-unused-but-set-variable"
[10:02] <desrt> looks pretty simple
[10:02] <desrt> i guess the i386 builders have an older gcc?
[10:03] <ricotz> desrt, hmm, the gcc versions should be the same
[10:04] <ricotz> the packaging was made by mbiebl and it seems to work in debian experimental
[10:07] <chrisccoulson> -Wno-unused-but-set-variable needs gcc 4.6 doesn't it?
[10:08] <chrisccoulson> it only exists in documentation for 4.6 anyway ;)
[10:10] <ricotz> chrisccoulson, shouldnt it fail on amd64 too then?
[10:10] <pitti> mvo: hm, apparently apt or python-apt recently changed wrt. the "architecture" field?
[10:10] <chrisccoulson> where is the build log for amd64?
[10:11] <pitti> mvo: apt.Cache()['language-pack-de'].candidate.architecture
[10:11] <pitti> mvo: until recently this used to say "all", now it says "amd64"
[10:11] <ricotz> chrisccoulson, http://launchpadlibrarian.net/67268650/buildlog_ubuntu-natty-amd64.network-manager_0.8.997-1~ricotz1_BUILDING.txt.gz
[10:11] <pitti> mvo: is that expected/intended? if so, what is the correct way to check if a package is arch:all?
[10:11] <pitti> mvo: (this breaks jockey ATM)
[10:12] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, weird - checking whether gcc understands -Wno-unused-but-set-variable... yes
[10:12] <chrisccoulson> in both ;)
[10:13] <pitti> mvo: I could check candidate.filename.endswith('_all.deb'), but this sounds a bit hackish?
[10:13] <pitti> mvo: or would candidate.record['Architecture'] be better?
[10:16] <pitti> mvo: (might be fallout from multiarch?)
[10:17] <chrisccoulson> ricotz, i would try and fix these errors first: "nm-dhcp-manager.c:250:3: error: format '%zd' expects type 'signed size_t', but argument 6 has type 'long unsigned int'"
[10:17] <chrisccoulson> perhaps the last error is just totally bogus ;)
[10:19] <pitti> mvo: using record['Architecture'] for now, this makes the tests happy again
[10:21] <ricotz> chrisccoulson, ah, something like this http://osdir.com/ml/attachments/txt4F3qluZZlN.txt
[10:31] <mvo> pitti: its actually libapt that changed, but it should not have leaked for the non-multiarch case
[10:31] <pitti> jasoncwarner: heh, added you to https://launchpad.net/~canonical-desktop-team after so many months :)
[10:33] <mvo> pitti: I check with donkult, this should only be like this if multiarch is enabled (and even then its wrong to expose it like this)
[10:35] <pitti> mvo: ok, thanks; I'll use this as a workaround in the meantime
[10:36] <mvo> thanks
[10:37] <ogra_> seb128, pitti, mono has a workaround now, so we can switch armel to banshee (which i did), put RB to supported if you still want to keep it
[10:38] <ogra_> i didnt know that was wanted, else i had added it when seeding banshee
[10:39] <pitti> ogra_: ah, splendid; will do, thanks!
[10:39] <ogra_> the fix wasnt tested with an in-archive built mono yet, if everything goes wrong we have to revert (but i dont think so)
[10:44] <dpm> cool, thanks kamstrup, I'll pull the latest version to generate the next updated docs
[10:46] <kamstrup> dpm: sweet!
[11:02]  * didrocks out for 2 hours, bbl
[11:11] <pitti> seb128: we still have an explicit "supported" seeding of pidgin; as we have had empathy in lucid, I think it might be time to remove that?
[11:13] <seb128> pitti, works for me
[11:39] <ricotz> chrisccoulson, the nm0.9 error message was bogus ;)
[12:36] <cyphermox> howdy
[12:37] <pitti> hey cyphermox, good morning
[12:41] <rodrigo_> ricotz, I see you are merging from debian some of the stuff in the PPA, but wouldn't it be better to keep the changelog history?
[12:45] <ricotz> rodrigo_, in most case there wasnt an ubuntu history, because they where already syncs, or there werent differences
[12:46] <ricotz> rodrigo_, in case of g-c-c, yeah it has a huge cluttered changelog which should be collected in one merge-changelog-entry
[12:48] <rodrigo_> ricotz, ok
[13:05] <alex3f> mvo: are you around?
[13:07] <alex3f> hi, is there somebody who can help me, by reviewing a patch sent to software-center? http://pad.lv/704719
[13:11] <mvo> alex3f: thanks a lot for the patch, in order to apply I need a copy of the contributors agreement. could you please check http://www.canonical.com/contributors ?
[13:11] <alex3f> mvo: ok, will do it
[13:12] <mvo> thanks a lot!
[13:13] <kiwinote> (that particular patch would cause the file menu and various other things to no longer work)
[13:14] <alex3f> kiwinote: I'm gonna investigate on a solution
[13:15] <alex3f> my bad.
[13:16] <kiwinote> alex3f: np - thanks a lot for the various patches/comments I've seen coming through this morning!
[13:16] <alex3f> I'm preparing my GSoC application for software-center packagekit backend
[13:16] <alex3f> (as an escuse :-) )
[13:17] <kiwinote> hm, was planning to do the same myself ;)
[13:17] <kiwinote> we can sort something out though
[13:17] <alex3f> competition!
[13:18] <alex3f> the appstream requirements are split in two projects
[13:18] <alex3f> installer backend and OSC integration
[13:19] <alex3f> maybe we can work together, but on different parts
[13:46] <kenvandine> good morning everyone
[13:46] <seb128> hey kenvandine
[13:46] <seb128> how are you?
[13:46] <kenvandine> good
[13:46] <kenvandine> and you?
[13:49] <seb128> I'm fine thanks
[13:57] <bcurtiswx> Good morning kenvandine
[14:01] <kenvandine> hey bcurtiswx
[14:23] <mvo> alex3f: thanks a bunch for the mail, I look at your patches now, was on the phone and everything
[14:36] <pitti> hey kenvandine, good morning
[14:36] <kenvandine> good morning pitti
[15:07] <Q-FUNK> tkamppeter: would you have time to help me with a cups-pdf postrm issue?
[15:13] <rodrigo_> seb128, gdm/gsd race confirmed fixed with my patch, so feel free to review/merge/upload this: https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/gnome-settings-daemon/fix-649809/+merge/55346
[15:14] <seb128> rodrigo_, thanks, I will merge but not upload since we are frozen for beta still
[15:14] <rodrigo_> seb128, ah, ok
[15:21] <pitti> (note that you can upload, but unless you fix an RC bug we won't accept it and respin the images for it)
[15:30] <seb128> pitti, right, but we can as well queue in the vcs and do one upload after the freeze if something else comes in between
[15:30] <pitti> seb128: right, I agree; just saying for cases where a followup upload is unlikely
[15:30] <pitti> "fire and forget" mode
[15:30] <seb128> right
[15:31] <seb128> pitti, did we get new isos since lunch?
[15:31] <pitti> in the pipeline
[15:31] <seb128> ok, let me try the one rsycned during lunch then
[16:09] <pitti> seb128, all: new desktops 20110329.1 for testing
[16:09] <rodrigo_> didrocks, please milestone this bug for me: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/740360
[16:09] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 740360 in unity "[a11y] panel service crashes with a11y enabled while navigating" [Undecided,In progress]
[16:09] <rodrigo_> didrocks, fix is coming
[16:10] <seb128> pitti, thanks, will rsync that while doing a first install with the previous iso ;-)
[16:10] <didrocks> rodrigo_: done! :)
[16:10] <rodrigo_> didrocks, merci beaucoup mon ami :)
[16:11] <rodrigo_> didrocks, hmm, the (ubuntu) bug doesn't need to be milestoned?
[16:12] <didrocks> rodrigo_: no, it's only the upstream one which is taking into account by my script
[16:12] <rodrigo_> didrocks, ok
[16:14] <mterry> mpt, heyo.  More indicator-datetime questions.  Would you like the error-icon-upon-focus-out behavior for the main timezone selection entry too?
[16:19]  * mterry pokes tedg to review indicator-datetime branches
[16:19] <tedg> mterry, I literally setting up my environment for that right now :-)
[16:19] <tedg> mterry, To be fair, I was doing it last night but my computer crashed so I gave up.
[16:20]  * tedg is not having stable love from Ubuntu right now
[16:20] <mterry> :-/
[16:20] <pitti> tedg: unity crashes, or something else, too?
[16:21] <tedg> pitti, Kernel, hard lock.
[16:21] <pitti> :(
[16:21] <tedg> pitti, It seems to be in a busy loop as when I restart my fans go on crazy :-)
[16:22] <tedg> Though, I think it may be network traffic based.  Please don't ping me on IRC ;-)
[16:22] <pitti> tedg: *splatter*
[16:26] <mpt> mterry, I guess so, that makes sense
[16:27] <didrocks> rodrigo_: ping me when you release the meeting lock
[16:28] <rodrigo_> didrocks, meeting lock?
[16:28] <didrocks> rodrigo_: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-03-29
[16:28] <rodrigo_> didrocks, hmm, I edited it 30 mins ago, I guess it failed to unlock it
[16:28]  * rodrigo_ tries to edit again
[16:29] <rodrigo_> didrocks, try now
[16:30] <didrocks> rodrigo_: works, thanks!
[16:30] <rodrigo_> ok
[16:32] <mpt> mterry, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TimeAndDate?action=diff&rev2=31&rev1=30
[16:33] <mterry> mpt, seems fine, thanks
[16:39] <rodrigo_> hmm, no meeting?
[16:41] <seb128> rodrigo_, in one hour
[16:41] <seb128> gcalendar is wrong again though
[16:41] <seb128> rodrigo_, dst was this w.e and the time is fixed on utc
[16:42] <seb128> see pitti's email about shifting from one hour
[16:42] <seb128> he mentioned it in the reminder
[16:42] <rodrigo_> ok
[16:43] <rodrigo_> I might have to miss it today then, let's see if I can postpone my other stuff
[16:45] <seb128> rodrigo_, I'm sure it's ok if you have something else to do
[16:45] <seb128> rodrigo_, we can catch up with you later if needed
[16:45] <rodrigo_> ok
[17:02] <seb128> mterry, bug #742153
[17:02] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 742153 in indicator-datetime "indicator-applet-complete crashed with SIGABRT in g_object_newv()" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/742153
[17:02] <mterry> seb128, yeah, I commented in it
[17:02] <mterry> doesn't make sense...
[17:02] <seb128> mterry, one issue that could lead to that is that an install broke before the trigger updating the schemas mmap ran
[17:02] <mterry> seb128, ah, hm
[17:03] <mterry> seb128, in which case, probably not an indicator-datetime bug
[17:03] <seb128> no it's not, we got similar issue on other components
[17:03] <seb128> it's a local issue
[17:03] <seb128> then you can thanks desrt for making code abort on missing schemas
[17:04] <rodrigo_> mterry, are you looking at indicator bugs, right?
[17:04] <seb128> rodrigo_, several people do ;-)
[17:04] <mterry> seb128, :) gsettings aborts on everything
[17:05] <mterry> rodrigo_, but yeah, especially indicator-datetime and appmenu
[17:05] <didrocks> everyone likes desrt on that one :)
[17:05] <rodrigo_> yeah, I just wanted to ping someone about https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/745057 and https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/745061 which were found during a11y testing, in case they needed some help
[17:05] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 745057 in unity "[a11y] Panel volume window has some entries not accessible" [Undecided,New]
[17:06] <rodrigo_> API is moving those 2 bugs to indicator-*
[17:07] <seb128> they will be noticed and assigned if they are on the right source
[17:07] <rodrigo_> seb128, yeah, my point is that we moved them to indicator-*^but they are a11y-related, so if they need help with that, to let me know :)
[17:08] <seb128> rodrigo_, oh, ok, thanks!
[17:08] <mvo> jcastro: hi, what do you think about generating  new "featured" items for natty?
[17:08] <mvo> jcastro: for softtware-center
[17:08] <jcastro> I thought they were going to be automatic or something?
[17:14] <mvo> alex3f: thanks for your fixes, looks fine, I like whitespace one especily, nice and ellegant
[17:14] <mvo> jcastro: not yet :/
[17:14] <mvo> jcastro: needs server side support
[17:14] <jcastro> I vote for just leaving them as it is, it's a good set of apps
[17:16] <mvo> jcastro: fair enough, I agree. maybe worth looking at the reviews and see what other stuff is popular, I can do that tomrrow
[17:16] <jcastro> mvo: yeah sorry, I am completely off guard, I thought this was going to be fixed
[17:16] <mvo> jcastro: no problem, thanks
[17:17]  * mvo is off to get some dinner
[17:17] <jcastro> mvo: what I did last time is just post on -desktop, but I think just measuring the stars with a good eye and picking a few would work
[17:17] <ricotz> rodrigo_, did you copied the binaries of gtk3-engines to the ppa?
[17:17] <mvo> jcastro: looks like pingus is not that popular (or we have a bug that does not permit reviews for it ;)
[17:18] <rodrigo_> ricotz, no
[17:19] <jcastro> mvo: I wonder what kind of reviews pornview will get, heh
[17:19] <ricotz> rodrigo_, hmm, who did, this packages wouldnt even build since it depends on the old gtk3 packages
[17:19] <ricotz> this/these
[17:19] <mvo> jcastro: one-handed ones
[17:20]  * mvo is really off for dinner now
[17:20] <ricotz> cdbs, hi, did you copied gtk3-engines?
[17:20] <rodrigo_> ricotz, afaik, it was a long time ago, probably robert_ancell
[17:21] <ricotz> rodrigo_, it was copied from the old ppa, but with its binaries
[17:21] <ricotz> so this didnt fail
[17:21] <rodrigo_> ah
[17:22] <rodrigo_> right, we don't seem to even have a branch under ~gnome3-team
[17:23] <mterry> jcastro, it's a good set of apps, but already, some of them are only rated 3 stars.  Obviously we need larger sample sizes though.
[17:23] <rodrigo_> ricotz, ask robert_ancell, afaik it was him whon worked on the early versions of the theme/engines
[17:23]  * rodrigo_ has to go, will read meeting's backlog later
[17:23] <ricotz> rodrigo_, i dont think he would missed that ;)
[17:23] <mterry> mpt, oh also, I allow the user to set UTC in the main timezone dialog.  Is that verboten?
[17:24] <didrocks> jcastro: "not work as advertized" :-)
[17:24] <mpt> mterry, does that work reliably?
[17:24] <rodrigo_> ricotz, no, it wasn't him who missed, it was all of use when there was the gtk3 packages renaming, I guess
[17:24] <rodrigo_> all of us
[17:24] <mterry> mpt, I believe so.  What do you mean by reliably?
[17:25] <mpt> mterry, as in, it's a time zone that people have used on Ubuntu before, it doesn't have any daylight saving or anything
[17:25] <ricotz> rodrigo_, yes, i know, i am just curious who copied it, to blame someone :P while it seems i am getting the emails reporting this problem
[17:26] <pitti> jasoncwarner, Sweetshark, bryceh, chrisccoulson, didrocks, tremolux, Riddell, kenvandine, cyphermox, mterry, rodrigo_, seb128, tkamppeter: meeting in 5 minutes
[17:26] <seb128> pitti, ;-)
[17:26] <mterry> mpt, it has a zoneinfo entry, so it will work as well as any other timezone I believe
[17:27] <mpt> mterry, ok
[17:27] <mpt> New features for free, woo
[17:27] <mterry> mpt, though technically no one lives in UTC, but if you were a truly global traveler, maybe you'd prefer it
[17:27] <cyphermox> o/
[17:28] <mterry> cyphermox, you use UTC time all the time?
[17:28] <mpt> mterry, does that mean you're changing it in a place that will automatically make it available in the installer too?
[17:28] <Sweetshark> mvo: sorry, saw your question too late yesterday. yes, I think we dont need to give out any special warnings like "you want libreoffice-dev".
[17:28] <cyphermox> mterry, I always make sure it's visible...
[17:28] <mterry> mpt, no, the installer does not yet benefit from any of the indicator-datetime work
[17:28] <cyphermox> mterry, although that was for the meeting ;)
[17:28] <mterry> cyphermox, ah
[17:28] <mterry> :)
[17:29] <Sweetshark> mvo: at least thats what I am thinking now. lots of mail in my inbox might change that of course ...
[17:29] <pitti> seb128: it might be that my door bell rings during the meeting; could you take over if that happens?
[17:29] <seb128> pitti, can do!
[17:29] <pitti> seb128: (I'll have some folks visiting my flat in the next days, as we're moving out)
[17:29] <pitti> cool
[17:29] <seb128> ok, just let me know and I can pick over
[17:30] <seb128> pitti, but maybe start with your bits?
[17:30] <seb128> like workitems, bugs
[17:30] <pitti> sure
[17:30] <seb128> so if you have to run that's done
[17:30] <seb128> we can do status update easily without you
[17:30] <pitti> DING DING DING MEETING
[17:30] <pitti> jasoncwarner, Sweetshark, bryceh, chrisccoulson, didrocks, tremolux, Riddell, kenvandine, cyphermox, mterry, rodrigo_, seb128, tkamppeter: meeting starting
[17:30] <didrocks> hey
[17:31] <mterry> yay!
[17:31] <seb128> hey
[17:31] <tremolux> hallo
[17:31] <tkamppeter> hi
[17:31]  * kenvandine waves
[17:31]  * Sweetshark falls into a conference chair.
[17:31]  * pitti hands out the coffee and the snacks
[17:31] <cyphermox> mm... food.
[17:31] <pitti> first, a FYI
[17:31] <pitti> http://people.canonical.com/~platform/workitems/natty/canonical-desktop-team-ubuntu-11.04-beta-1.html
[17:32] <mterry> hah!
[17:32] <pitti> I cleaned up a bit yesterday, and postponed some unimportant/blocked stuff, and moved important ones to b2
[17:32] <mterry> looks like some aggressive cleanup  :)
[17:32] <pitti> so we are down to 1 WI for dpm to talk about mozilla upstream translations which isn't bound by the freeze
[17:32] <pitti> mterry: well, half of the cleanup was actually a bug
[17:32] <mpt> mterry, ok, eventually this should be split out into a spec for the location field in general, but for now: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TimeAndDate?action=diff&rev2=32&rev1=31
[17:32] <pitti> we have moved a lot of stuff to beta-2 before, but the milestone didn't exist in Launchpad until yesterday
[17:32] <pitti> so you can now actually target stuff to beta-2
[17:33] <chrisccoulson> hi!
[17:33] <pitti> as for release critical bugs, these are on the "worrying" radar right now:
[17:34] <pitti> bug 727372  -- chrisccoulson, it's getting a little late for more intrusive changes; do you think we can go ahead with our patch?
[17:34] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 727372 in firefox "FF 4 requires both .desktop and gconf entries for url handlers" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/727372
[17:34] <pitti> bug 663294 - chrisccoulson, micahg: is it good enough to build with gcc-4.4 on i386? (as we did in maverick)
[17:34] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 663294 in gcc-4.5 "Firefox built with gcc-4.5 is a non-starter on i386 with -pie" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/663294
[17:35] <chrisccoulson> pitti - bug 727372 - i'm just waiting for a nod from mozilla to take that patch (i'm reluctant to take it without review)
[17:35] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 727372 in firefox "FF 4 requires both .desktop and gconf entries for url handlers" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/727372
[17:35] <pitti> bug 725434 - bryceh, seb128 -- seb did a summary why a package split is inordinarily hackish and complicated -- should we go with the PPA approach for natty after all?
[17:35] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 725434 in cairo "Nvidia drivers lead to extra memory usage for each process using libGL" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/725434
[17:35] <pitti> chrisccoulson: ok, so by and large "blocked"?
[17:36] <chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah. i've already taken quite a few patches i worked on, but all the ones i've taken have already had some sort of review
[17:36] <pitti> chrisccoulson: ok, good to know; thanks
[17:37] <chrisccoulson> pitti - i don't see it being a problem. the change is pretty small tbh, and i don't think there's much risk of not being able to ship it
[17:37] <pitti> chrisccoulson: would another ping to mozilla speed it up or annoy them?
[17:38] <chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, probably ;)
[17:38] <pitti> anyway, I guess we should discuss libcairo after the meeting, not that interesting for everyone
[17:38] <chrisccoulson> i'll talk to my contact when he's online later
[17:38] <seb128> wrong reply to a "or" question ;-)
[17:38] <seb128> you need to pick a choice
[17:38] <seb128> ;-)
[17:38] <chrisccoulson> oops
[17:38] <chrisccoulson> annoy ;)
[17:38] <chrisccoulson> lol
[17:38] <pitti> otherwise we're doing ok RC bug wise
[17:38] <chrisccoulson> there we go :)
[17:38] <pitti> :)
[17:38] <chrisccoulson> i only saw 1 option ;)
[17:38] <pitti> yeah, just my annoying blabla
[17:39] <pitti> which I'll now stop by handing the mic to kenvandine :)
[17:39] <pitti> partner update?
[17:39] <kenvandine> sure
[17:39] <seb128> "oh, pitti writing again, just tell him 'yes' so he's happy :p" ;-)
[17:39] <kenvandine> UbuntuOne has nothing really to report, they are cleaning up their work items
[17:40] <kenvandine> DX
[17:40] <kenvandine> i assume all the desktopers already know we will drop to classic gnome for a11y this cycle
[17:40] <pitti> for some profiles, anyway?
[17:40] <kenvandine> with hopes that people will test unity more with a11y before Oneiric
[17:40] <pitti> (the ones which need speech, I guess)
[17:40] <kenvandine> yeah
[17:41] <kenvandine> TheMuso is handling that
[17:41] <pitti> I'd be interested in how well it holds up in "mouse deficiency" profiles, though
[17:41] <pitti> from my POV unity works with a keyboard a lot easier than GNOME
[17:41] <pitti> (in fact it rocks!)
[17:41] <kenvandine> overlay scrollbars, the release team rejected the FFE
[17:41] <didrocks> pitti: unity is fully keynav nagivable from the latest tests we made
[17:41] <kenvandine> pitti, indeed
[17:41] <kenvandine> didrocks, yes, it rocks from the keyboard
[17:42] <cyphermox> pitti, I already can tell you keyboard navigation breaks in indicator-datetime because the calendar widget catches focus and doesn't let go
[17:42] <kenvandine> that is all i have
[17:42] <kenvandine> cyphermox, i hadn't noticed, is there a bug for that?
[17:42] <pitti> cyphermox: that sounds smamll enough to be fixable, though; mind to report it?
[17:43] <pitti> cyphermox: (and good catch!)
[17:43] <cyphermox> kenvandine, I don't know, I found that out this morning :)
[17:43] <didrocks> (just confirmed)
[17:43] <mterry> Bug 676222 I think
[17:43] <pitti> heh indeed, confirmed
[17:43] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 676222 in indicator-datetime "Broken/confusing keyboard navigation" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/676222
[17:43]  * kenvandine confirmed too
[17:43] <cyphermox> seems to fit that yes
[17:43] <pitti> not that I could even get to this with the keyboard in the pre-indicator time :)
[17:44] <pitti> kenvandine: thank you
[17:44] <pitti> didrocks already posted a detailled and great report to the wiki
[17:44]  * pitti gives everyone some time to read it
[17:44] <pitti> didrocks: anything you want/need to discuss?
[17:44] <didrocks> just hilighting some points
[17:45] <Riddell> pitti: which wiki page?
[17:45] <pitti> where do you currently see the biggest problems?
[17:45] <pitti> Riddell: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-03-29
[17:45] <didrocks> first, we get a crazy number of bug fixes this week
[17:45] <didrocks> https://launchpad.net/unity/3.0/3.6.8
[17:45] <pitti> didrocks: (isn't that "last week"? we already have 3.6.8)
[17:45] <didrocks> however, we have some crashes still for beta1, mostly on signals not beeing disconnected
[17:45] <didrocks> we fixed most of them today
[17:45] <pitti> \o/
[17:46] <didrocks> pitti: well, "this week" being "last release available" yeah ;)
[17:46] <pitti> this is driving me mad, I'll happily test anything if needed
[17:46] <Riddell> when I ran the Ubuntu Desktop live CD yesterday Unity didn't show up
[17:46] <didrocks> Riddell: did you get anything? was compiz running?
[17:46] <pitti> Riddell: oh, interesting; I tried on three machines today, and I couldn't replicate that any more (I still could with alpha-3)
[17:46] <Riddell> didrocks: it was a virtual machine, I don't think compiz was running, I did get files on the desktop but no panels
[17:46] <pitti> of course I booted it with the intent to debug it, so it's pretty clear why it worked
[17:47] <didrocks> also, just hilighting as well some UI changes comng: (https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/744973, https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/741926, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ayatana-design/+bug/727901)
[17:47] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 744973 in unity "Make the BFB icon turn blue when an application goes urgent" [High,Fix committed]
[17:47] <seb128> Riddell, it's a known issue
[17:47] <pitti> Riddell: ah, so 2D fallback broken?
[17:47] <Riddell> pitti: could be
[17:47] <seb128> well rendering issue
[17:47] <pitti> seb128: is it?
[17:47] <seb128> gnome-panel is running
[17:47] <didrocks> yeah, gnome-panel running, not showing
[17:47] <seb128> i.e alt-f2 opens the run a command dialog
[17:47] <didrocks> there is a bug I reported for alpha3 about it
[17:47] <pitti> I haven't tried beta-1 candidates in kvm, but it has worked fine until a3
[17:47] <seb128> it does the same there in kvm
[17:47] <didrocks> I reopened it as it was wrongly close
[17:48] <didrocks> bug #711378
[17:48] <pitti> didrocks: ok, so apart from the closure crashes, anything else which we need to track, or should help with?
[17:48] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 711378 in compiz "after compiz crashed, gnome-panel isn't mapped again" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/711378
[17:48] <seb128> well it did when I tried thursday daily, I need to try again with today's iso, I've been testing on real hardware today
[17:48] <didrocks> pitti: just testing testing… ;) next week, a new "unity and compiz detection tool" will be available
[17:48] <pitti> odd, a3 worked perfectly in VMs and poorly on real iron; now it's the other way round?
[17:49] <didrocks> way faster than the older one
[17:49] <pitti> didrocks: ok, that sounds relieving!
[17:49] <pitti> thanks
[17:49] <didrocks> so, if you can ensure that the right session is still launched on your hw, that would be great :)
[17:49] <pitti> Software-Center -- tremolux also already posted to the wiki, anything to discuss there?
[17:50] <pitti> seb128, didrocks: ah, confirming the kvm bug
[17:50] <tremolux> hey, not much to say really, just all bugfixing all the time now
[17:51] <pitti> tremolux: ok, great; #507836, #739908, and #723911 are still on the radar?
[17:52] <pitti> == Kubuntu status -- Riddell ?
[17:52] <Riddell> hi
[17:52] <Riddell>  * CDs in decent shape for beta
[17:52] <Riddell>  * arm builds mostly complete from opengles failures, waiting on linero team to report back on avogadro
[17:52] <Riddell>  * Qt security fix for Comodo fake SSL certificates in natty and backports sent to security team
[17:52] <Riddell>  * KDE SC 4.6.2 due out the Tuesday after Beta 1
[17:52] <Riddell>  * probable FFe coming for new Phonon version after beta, we won't include the zeitgeist integration
[17:52] <Riddell>  * http://goo.gl/23eui 7 milestoned bugs for beta
[17:52] <Riddell>  * bug 744944 broken upgrade is worrying
[17:52] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 744944 in kdebase-workspace "kdm is restarted during the upgrade to Natty . The user is disconnected from the session" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/744944
[17:52] <Riddell>  * bug 712061 kubuntu mobile should be fixed shortly
[17:52] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 712061 in kubuntu-mobile-default-settings "kubuntu mobile images fail to load" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/712061
[17:53] <Riddell> when I say shortly, I mean after a 14 hour ARM compile
[17:53] <seiflotfy> Riddell, why not
[17:53] <pitti> Riddell: 744944 -> is that a bug in the upstart script?
[17:53] <seiflotfy> ?
[17:53] <pitti> Riddell: erm, in postinst I mean
[17:53] <Riddell> seiflotfy: I think it's a feature too far for post-beta, but we will include qzeitgeist in the archive and have phonon+zeitgeist in a PPA
[17:54] <Riddell> pitti: I don't know yet
[17:54] <seiflotfy> ah nice
[17:54] <seiflotfy> Riddell, that is nice
[17:54] <pitti> Riddell: it might get an automatic "restart" thing from dh_installinit perhaps?
[17:54] <seiflotfy> we are looking into a KDE GSoC for Zeitgeist
[17:54] <seiflotfy> a nice plasma widget
[17:54] <pitti> or perhaps it crashes and tries to respawn
[17:55] <Riddell> pitti: things to investigate for sure
[17:55] <pitti> ok, thanks
[17:55] <pitti> X.org -> eastern edition
[17:56] <pitti> another general reminder, peer reviews for your colleagues are due this week
[17:56] <pitti> (self/manager review was due last Fri)
[17:56] <pitti> otherwise, nothing else from me
[17:56] <pitti> any other business?
[17:57] <Sweetshark> pitti: my plans for this week: minor fixes for the 3.3.2 release, integrating dbusmenu upstream for 3.4, some cleanup of the LO debian/rules file (debian upstream, not use in doing that alone -- ill just propose some patches to _rene_ and will see what he will accept. if he does not accept, I will scrap that. doing for us only are causing more trouble on the merge that we might win)
[17:58] <pitti> Sweetshark: "dbusmenu" -> is that lo-menubar?
[17:58] <Sweetshark> pitti: yes
[17:58] <pitti> Sweetshark: agreed, less delta > less noise
[17:58] <pitti> cool
[17:59] <pitti> hyphenation, dicts, etc. should all be sorted out now, AFAICS
[17:59] <seb128> speaking about libdbusmenu, firefox display warnings when starting now
[17:59] <pitti> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches.txt looks exemplary for this time of the release :)
[17:59] <seb128> chrisccoulson, ^
[17:59] <seb128> pitti, great ;-)
[17:59] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - it's just 1 warning isn't it?
[17:59] <seb128> chrisccoulson, right
[18:00] <pitti> it also seems that KDE is much happier on armel these days: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/testing/natty_probs.html
[18:00] <pitti> nvidia/fglrx uninstallability is intended (wrong ABI), aside from that i386/amd64 is perfect
[18:00] <pitti> let's keep it that way!
[18:00] <chrisccoulson> seb128:
[18:00] <chrisccoulson> (firefox-bin:6565): LIBDBUSMENU-GTK-CRITICAL **: dbusmenu_menuitem_property_set_shortcut: assertion `gtk_accelerator_valid(key, modifier)' failed
[18:00] <chrisccoulson> just that one?
[18:00] <seb128> right
[18:00] <pitti> so, thanks everyone, let's adjourn the meeting
[18:00] <seb128> thanks pitti
[18:01] <tremolux> thanks!
[18:01] <chrisccoulson> i fixed a whole load of those messages a few weeks back. i'll have to try and figure out which menu item is still broken ;)
[18:01] <Sweetshark> pitti: should I investigate that uninstallable openoffice.org-base transitional btw?
[18:01] <seb128> kenvandine, btw do you know if there is a u1 bug about the indicator entry not being "configuring u1..." by default?
[18:01] <seb128> kenvandine, like the other entries do
[18:01] <kenvandine> seb128, humm
[18:01] <seb128> nessita, ^
[18:01] <seb128> nessita, hey ;-)
[18:01] <kenvandine> not that i heard of
[18:01] <nessita> hello all!
[18:01]  * nessita reads backlog
[18:02] <kenvandine> seb128, good catch though...
[18:02] <tremolux> pitti: p.s. those s-c bugs you mentioned are definitely on the radar  :)
[18:02] <seb128> kenvandine, I'm testing beta1 isos and it's noticable when you open the indicator
[18:02] <nessita> seb128: I'm not sure what you're asking, could you please re-ask? :-)
[18:02] <seb128> it's like
[18:02] <pitti> tremolux: thanks
[18:02] <seb128> configuring ...
[18:02] <seb128> configuring ...
[18:02] <seb128> configuring ...
[18:02] <seb128> u1
[18:03] <kenvandine> nessita, on a fresh install
[18:03]  * cyphermox -> lunch
[18:03] <seb128> pitti, \o/ jockey-gtk starts on the updated iso
[18:03] <pitti> seb128: yeah, the python-apt bug was fixed, barry rocks
[18:03] <kenvandine> each entry in the messaging indicator says "Configure Instant messenger accounts"
[18:03] <kenvandine> stuff like that
[18:04] <kenvandine> until you have ran empathy-accounts and added an account
[18:04] <nessita> kenvandine: ah, I see. Is there an api to do that?
[18:04] <seb128> nessita, what kenvandine says, other entries are "Configuring ..." until used for the first time
[18:04] <nessita> seb128: shot answer, no, there is not bug and we were not aware that that was needed
[18:04] <seb128> well not "needed", just "would be nice"
[18:04] <seb128> what component should I open a bug on?
[18:05] <seb128> nessita, ^
[18:05] <nessita> seb128: it depends on what's needed, may be the control panel or u1client. Do we have to use an API for this?
[18:05] <seb128> not sure what the "api" for that is
[18:05] <seb128> kenvandine, ^ do you know?
[18:05] <seb128> you probably did it for gwibber ;-)
[18:05] <kenvandine> yeah... i can't recall
[18:05] <kenvandine> actually
[18:05] <kenvandine> i think it happens automatically
[18:06] <kenvandine> the registry
[18:06] <kenvandine> so there must be a mismatch somewhere
[18:07] <nessita> kenvandine: maybe we need to setup... something, somewhere to indicate when the U1 account is setup?
[18:07] <kenvandine> nessita, i know why
[18:07] <kenvandine> /usr/share/indicators/messages/applications/ubuntuone-control-panel
[18:07] <kenvandine> should be /usr/share/indicators/messages/applications/ubuntuone-control-panel-gtk
[18:07] <kenvandine> at least i think
[18:07] <kenvandine> tedg, can you confirm?
[18:07] <seb128> kenvandine, let me try that
[18:07] <kenvandine> seb128, thx
[18:08] <nessita> kenvandine: but... I was trying to remain generic since we're pushing to have the -kde client
[18:08] <nessita> but if it needs change, we chage it
[18:08] <nessita> change*
[18:08] <tedg> kenvandine, Honestly, that's a distro issue :-)  They should just be unique as far as I'm concerned.
[18:08] <kenvandine> nessita, yeah... but it will need to change anyway
[18:08] <kenvandine> to point to the non-gtk desktop
[18:08] <kenvandine> tedg, does it match based on the indicator filename and the name of the desktop file?
[18:09] <seb128> kenvandine, renaming doesn't work
[18:09] <tedg> kenvandine, No, it just reads the files.  It doesn't care what they're called.
[18:09]  * kenvandine was wrong then
[18:09] <kenvandine> :)
[18:09] <kenvandine> tedg, so why would it not display the "Configure Ubuntu One" entry then?
[18:09] <tedg> kenvandine, let me look.
[18:10] <pitti> bbl, CD testing/dinner
[18:11] <micahg> pitti: when you get back, are you suggesting building only i386 with gcc-4.4?  I think armel has the same issues.  Is there a reason not to use the same compiler for all archs?
[18:13] <tedg> kenvandine, Because it's running.  And when it's running it gets the menus from the running process not the desktop file.
[18:13] <kenvandine> tedg, oh...
[18:14] <kenvandine> nessita, does syncdaemon autostart no matter what?
[18:14] <kenvandine> i thought that was only if it is configured
[18:14] <kenvandine> Exec=/bin/sh -c '[ -d "$HOME/Ubuntu One" ] && ubuntuone-launch'
[18:14] <nessita> kenvandine: no, there is an script ubuntuone-launch that will start syncdaemon if the user has u1 credentials or there is an Ubuntu One folder
[18:15] <nessita> kenvandine: exactly
[18:16] <kenvandine> maybe ubuntuone-launch should not start syncdaemon if there aren't credentials
[18:16] <nessita> kenvandine: that is indeed checked in ubuntuone-launch
[18:16] <seb128> kenvandine, it doesn't
[18:16] <nessita> or at least should be the case
[18:16] <seb128> I've no process running matching ubuntuone or sync
[18:16] <kenvandine> so that blows tedg's theory out :)
[18:17] <kenvandine> seb128, and you don't have the triangle next to UbuntuOne right?
[18:17] <seb128> no
[18:17] <kenvandine> nessita, any chance it connects to the messaging menu before it checks for the credientials?
[18:17] <tedg> kenvandine, If it drops off, we should catch that.
[18:18] <kenvandine> maybe it connects then exits
[18:18] <tedg> seb128, Try changing "OnlyShowIn" to "TargetEnvironment"
[18:18] <nessita> kenvandine: what do you mean by "connects the messaging menu"?
[18:18] <kenvandine> creates and indicator
[18:18] <kenvandine> tedg, you think you introduced a bug?
[18:18] <kenvandine> :-D
[18:18] <nessita> kenvandine: we should confirm with thisfred, but as far as I know, no indicator code will be exceuted until syncdaemon is running
[18:19] <nessita> thisfred: ping
[18:19] <thisfred> reading backlog
[18:19] <nessita> thisfred: I want to be sure about the following: all the messaging code is not executed at all if syncdaemon is not started, right?
[18:19] <thisfred> nessita: correct
[18:19] <nessita> great
[18:19] <kenvandine> thisfred, for example when ubuntuone-launch runs
[18:20] <kenvandine> and detects there is no credientials
[18:20] <kenvandine> it exits
[18:20] <thisfred> let me triple check
[18:20] <kenvandine> without creating the indicator
[18:20] <kenvandine> that shouldn't be a problem either
[18:20] <kenvandine> just trying to rule out stuff
[18:20] <seb128> tedg, no difference with "TargetEnvironment"
[18:20] <seb128> I don't think we ported the other ones anyway
[18:21] <tedg> seb128, Yeah, I was just making sure.
[18:21] <kenvandine> seb128, cat ~/.cache/indicators/messages/seen-db.keyfile
[18:21] <kenvandine> is ubuntuone-control-panel in there?
[18:21] <seb128> kenvandine, no indicators dir yet
[18:21] <kenvandine> good
[18:21] <seb128> it's a fresh install, nothing created it
[18:22] <seb128> find . -name *indicator* -> empty
[18:22] <seb128> in the user dir
[18:23] <tedg> seb128, killall indicator-messages-service ; /usr/lib/indicator-messages/indicator-messages-service | tee bunch-o-text
[18:23] <dobey> are you guys talking about the double entries in the messaging menu?
[18:24] <kenvandine> dobey, no
[18:24] <nessita> dobey: nopes
[18:24] <kenvandine> i think thisfred fixed that in trunk
[18:24] <thisfred> yep
[18:24] <kenvandine> :)
[18:24] <dobey> sort of
[18:24] <kenvandine> dobey, oh?
[18:24] <thisfred> sort of?
[18:25] <dobey> well, there is a brief period immediately after i log in on my new laptop where i've been seeing 2 menu entries; but then they collapse into one. i presume it is while syncdaemon is doing local rescan or something
[18:25] <thisfred> dobey: with current trunk still?
[18:25] <thisfred> I landed a fix this morning
[18:25] <dobey> oh
[18:26] <nessita> dobey: right, is fixed all the way with trunk
[18:26] <dobey> well i haven't booted my laptop in a couple days. didn't know another fix landed this morning
[18:26] <thisfred> the problem still existed while sd wasn't running'
[18:26] <dobey> so i will see
[18:26] <dobey> upgrading now
[18:28] <seb128> kenvandine, tedg: http://paste.ubuntu.com/586960/
[18:28] <thisfred> nessita: the status listener (and hence the indicator) gets started in main.py L134. I can't immediately tell if that's before the credentials are checked
[18:29] <kenvandine> (process:4374): Indicator-Messages-DEBUG: Looking at blacklist: /home/natty/.config/indicators/messages/applications-blacklist
[18:29] <kenvandine> oh... your user name is natty :)
[18:29] <seb128> kenvandine, it's a beta1 test install ;)
[18:29] <nessita> thisfred: no problem, main is not executed if ubunutone-launch did not find credentials
[18:30]  * kenvandine read that as nessita's name... :)
[18:30] <tedg> seb128, It seems you don't have any Evolution quicklist items either, no?
[18:30] <nessita> kenvandine: I'm Naty :-) (but close!)
[18:30] <seb128> tedg, no, it's a fresh beta install
[18:30] <chrisccoulson> the "add to launcher" option in software-centre is pretty nice!
[18:30] <seb128> tedg, those are just added when you run it
[18:30] <kenvandine> nessita, right.. i didn't catch the two t's
[18:30] <seb128> tedg, I've not run any of those yet
[18:31] <seb128> kenvandine, I will name the next user naty so I can use it to report those u1 bugs ;)
[18:31] <kenvandine> hehe
[18:31] <tedg> seb128, Hmm, sounds like that could be the bug... try putting ubuntuone into your seen-db and restarting.
[18:31] <seb128> tedg, I've no seen-db
[18:31] <seb128> tedg, should I create one?
[18:31] <tedg> seb128, Use VI ;-)
[18:31] <tedg> seb128, Yes
[18:32] <kenvandine> tedg, huh?  why would adding a seen-db help?
[18:32] <kenvandine> shouldn't that do the opposite?
[18:32] <kenvandine> and it is getting it right for all the others
[18:32] <kenvandine> just not u1
[18:32] <tedg> kenvandine, I'm guessing the bug is that all shortcut items are hidden unless the app is seen.
[18:32] <seb128> tedg, you should test yourself, just echo /usr/share/applications/gedit.desktop > gedit
[18:33] <tedg> kenvandine, Which is correct for Evo but not U1
[18:33] <seb128> in /usr/share/indicators/messages/applications
[18:33] <seb128> or whatever
[18:33] <tedg> seb128, Does GEdit have shortcut items?
[18:33] <kenvandine> tedg, oh you think it is because it has shortcut items?
[18:34] <seb128> tedg, no, does it need those to be listed correctly?
[18:34] <kenvandine> gwibber doesn't
[18:34] <kenvandine> empathy doesn't
[18:34] <tedg> Wait.  So what is the bug?
[18:34] <tedg> I thought the bug was that the shortcut items aren't being shown, no?
[18:34] <seb128> tedg, the entry says "UbuntuOne"
[18:34] <kenvandine> it isn't showing "Configure UbuntuOne"
[18:34] <kenvandine> when it has never been run before
[18:34]  * nessita is lost but she keeps reading
[18:34] <seb128> tedg, not "Configure UbuntuOne..."
[18:34] <seb128> or "Set Up UbuntuOne..."
[18:34] <tedg> And "Configure UbuntuOne..." is a shortcut item, no?
[18:34] <kenvandine> no
[18:35] <dobey> oh sigh
[18:35] <kenvandine> right, it should be Setup UbuntOne
[18:35] <kenvandine> tedg, in a first run case
[18:35] <seb128> tedg, no, it's the label that should be displayed until the software is first started
[18:35] <kenvandine> fresh install
[18:35] <kenvandine> empathy has never been run, it doesn't say "Chat" it says "Setup blah... "
[18:35] <kenvandine> for example
[18:35] <tedg> Why would Ubuntu One do that?
[18:35] <tedg> Yes, that's only for those three applications.
[18:35] <nessita> kenvandine, seb128, tedg: please replace all "UbuntuOne" by "Ubuntu One"
[18:35] <seb128> tedg, like "Gwibber" is "Set Up Gwibber..." and turn to "Gwibber once seen"
[18:35] <dobey> kenvandine: but that's hardcoded right?
[18:35] <kenvandine> oh... that is hard coded somewhere?
[18:36] <tedg> Yes
[18:36] <kenvandine> i that is what the seen-db was for!
[18:36] <seb128> tedg, that was the' question we started with, why u1 doesn't behave like the others
[18:36] <kenvandine> s/i that/i thought/
[18:36] <seb128> tedg, seems the reply is "because the other are special cased"
[18:36] <tedg> Oh, it does behave like the others.  Just Gwibber, Evolution and Empathy are special ;-)
[18:36] <kenvandine> so what is seen-db?
[18:36] <seb128> tedg, why should u1 be "Set Up u1"?
[18:36] <tedg> kenvandine, Mostly for managing that special case, but I put the other stuff in there for debugging :-)
[18:37] <seb128> shouldn't
[18:37] <tedg> seb128, Because no one has asked for that :-)
[18:37] <seb128> tedg, since it's not configured
[18:37] <kenvandine> tedg, so maybe U1 needs to be hard coded too :)
[18:37] <seb128> tedg, why isn't the default to be "Set Up ..." until seen?
[18:37] <seb128> why do we special case some?
[18:37] <seb128> is there any case where we don't want to behave this way?
[18:37] <kenvandine> tedg loves maintaining one-off hardcoded things
[18:37]  * kenvandine ducks
[18:37] <seb128> lol
[18:37] <dobey> what's annoying is that i can't immediately log in to IM, until empathy is started by some means other than changing the status in the me menu
[18:38]  * kenvandine has heard him gripe about that many times
[18:38] <tedg> seb128, All applications don't require setup.  For something like a LP viewer or Ask Ubuntu we don't know what it really wants.  It seems like the Set Up is unique in that reqard.
[18:38] <kenvandine> dobey, indeed... that is harder than it should be to handle properly
[18:38] <seb128> tedg, ok, so I should open a bug to add u1 to this list? does it make sense to you?
[18:38] <tedg> dobey, That's basically because we've been maintaining Pidgin compatibility -- we'll ditch that in O :-)
[18:38] <kenvandine> tedg, so maybe that should be handled with a shortcut group
[18:38] <tedg> seb128, kenvandine, Sure, either way.
[18:38] <kenvandine> which only gets displayed if it isn't in the seen-db
[18:39] <seb128> tedg, thanks
[18:39] <seb128> let's add it to the list for natty
[18:39] <seb128> we can figure a better way to flag that next cycle
[18:39] <dobey> tedg: well there's a lot of stuff in empathy that makes me want to not use it, for other reasons. but eh :)
[18:39] <seb128> nessita, unping, it's not an issue on your side ;)
[18:39] <seb128> nessita, sorry for the noise, thanks for reading us ;)
[18:39] <kenvandine> :)
[18:40] <dobey> seb128: it's all dx's fault with their hardcoded things :)
[18:40] <seb128> dobey, you should do a rotation to dx next cycle ;)
[18:40] <kenvandine> now that we figured that out... /me grabs some lunch
[18:40] <kenvandine> bbiab
[18:41] <alex3f> kiwinote: still around?
[18:41] <dobey> seb128: no way :)
[18:41] <seb128> kenvandine, enjoy
[18:42] <mterry> tremolux, got a software-center crash when clicking on "more info" for some apps but all the console says is "software-center: Fatal IO error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
[18:42] <mterry> software-center: Fatal IO error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0."
[18:43] <nessita> seb128: you're welcome! you know I'm at your service :-)
[18:43] <kiwinote> alex3f: yep
[18:44] <kiwinote> mterry: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-center/+bug/743020 , but have no idea what's causing it
[18:44] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 743020 in software-center "software-center: Fatal IO error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0." [High,Incomplete]
[18:44] <mterry> kiwinote, yeah, that's what I see
[18:51] <tremolux> mterry, kiwinote: yeah, we were discussing that one yesterday; I saw this happen occasionally a few weeks ago, but then it went away..seems to have returned tho  :-/
[18:51] <tremolux> stinkish, as my kids would say
[18:53] <tremolux> mterry, kiwinote: I have not seen it again myself however, since those weeks ago
[18:54] <seb128> kenvandine, ted, nessita: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-messages/+bug/745140
[18:54] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 745140 in indicator-messages "should list ubuntuone in default_db" [Undecided,New]
[18:56] <kiwinote> tremolux: the basic trigger for this seems to be list > details, then back to list, then a different details
[18:57] <kiwinote> tremolux: it *seems* to have something to do with either the animation of the pathbar/screenshot, or the loading of the reviews
[18:59] <tremolux> kiwinote: def sounds reasonable
[18:59] <chrisccoulson> oh, bug 729187 is a nice and easy fix :)
[18:59] <kiwinote> tremolux: presumably unrelated, have you noticed all the output in the terminal recently?
[18:59] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 729187 in libdbusmenu "xchat - separators are shown as 'Label Empty'" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/729187
[19:03] <tremolux> kiwinote: do you mean the couple of "G_IS_OBJECT (object)" warnings?  there are a couple of new Zeitgeist ones I notice
[19:03] <kiwinote> tremolux: yeah, those object warnings
[19:05] <tremolux> kiwinote: yep, haven't dug into them at all..I suppose they may not be innocuous
[19:06] <tremolux> kiwinote: trying to think of about when they started appearing..
[19:06] <tremolux> kiwinote: was it the lobby redesign?
[19:06] <kiwinote> tremolux: I tried branching some really old commits and they all got those warnings
[19:07] <kiwinote> tremolux: so presumably something external has changed
[19:07] <tremolux> kiwinote: ah, cool, that's interesting
[19:07] <tremolux> kiwinote: yeah
[19:07] <kiwinote> tremolux: but tbh I've got no idea whether it's something we should be worrying about or not ;)
[19:08] <tremolux> kiwinote: heh, feel the same way  :)
[19:11] <pitti> hmm, seems I missed micahg by some minutes
[19:11] <chrisccoulson> pitti - you wanted to talk about firefox and gcc-4.4?
[19:12] <pitti> 20:05:55micahg[19:11:34] pitti: when you get back, are you suggesting building only i386 with gcc-4.4?  I think armel has the same issues.  Is there a reason not to use the same compiler for all archs?
[19:12] <chrisccoulson> i'd rather fix the problem tbh ;)
[19:12] <pitti> chrisccoulson: I just thought it'd be less intrusive, but I don't midn much building with 4.4 everywhere
[19:13] <chrisccoulson> well, the issue is we haven't ever built 4.0 on gcc-4.4
[19:13] <pitti> chrisccoulson: well, yes, but that might be harder, unless you are a gcc guru? :-)
[19:13] <chrisccoulson> it's a bit risky to switch compilers now isn't it?
[19:14] <chrisccoulson> pitti - also, i386 is the only arch with this issue
[19:14] <chrisccoulson> (the issue looked like it was specific to the way that i386 handles TLS)
[19:14] <pitti> chrisccoulson: well, amd64 has a much better memory protection by design :)
[19:15] <chrisccoulson> i'll take another look at this tomorrow, and maybe try it with an even newer gcc, just to make sure it's not already fixed ;)
[19:16] <pitti> chrisccoulson: with gcc-snapshot?
[19:16] <chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i can try with that
[19:16] <chrisccoulson> i could do that after dinner
[19:17] <pitti> chrisccoulson: do you have reason to believe that gcc 4.4 won't work with ffox 4.0?
[19:17] <chrisccoulson> not really, but we never tested it before
[19:21] <Q-FUNK> micahg is back
[19:26] <micahg> pitti: I have packages in my PPA for firefox 4 with gcc-4.4
[19:27] <pitti> micahg: wb
[19:27] <pitti> micahg: just discussed that quickly with chrisccoulson
[19:27] <pitti> micahg: I mainly suggested "on i386 only" because it seems less intrusive, but I dno't mind much building it with 4.4 everywhere
[19:28] <micahg> pitti: well, it's at least half (i386/armel), so I figure to insure identical experiences we should stick with one compiler
[19:47] <pitti> Riddell: ah, kdm restart is pam
[19:47] <pitti> Restarting services possibly affected by the upgrade:
[19:47] <pitti>   kdm: stopping...starting...done.
[19:49] <tremolux>  alex3f: hello!  are you the Alex that has made some software-center fixes?
[19:49] <alex3f> tremolux: yes, give me 15 minutes please
[19:50] <tremolux> alex3f: sure  :)
[19:52] <chrisccoulson> popey, i think i have a fix for bug 744580 \o/
[19:52] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 744580 in firefox "Firefox doesn't auto scroll when selecting content downwards" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/744580
[19:52] <chrisccoulson> that one is seriously annoying
[20:08] <alex3f> tremolux: I'm back
[20:08] <alex3f> sorry for letting you wait, long phone conf
[20:08] <tremolux> alex3f: hey!  thanks for your patches  :)
[20:08] <tremolux> alex3f: oh, np at all
[20:08] <alex3f> you're welcome
[20:09] <alex3f> I needed an impulse
[20:09] <tremolux> alex3f: so I am looking at your viewswitcher fix, I like it, it's a cool approach
[20:09] <alex3f> yes, but as noted... doesn't show up nice
[20:10] <tremolux> alex3f: what was your impulse?
[20:10] <alex3f> a horizontal rule
[20:10] <alex3f> gsoc
[20:10] <tremolux> alex3f: ah
[20:10] <tremolux> alex3f: right, it's the line that's going to be the stickler  :(
[20:11] <alex3f> in recent gtk fix
[20:11] <alex3f> the line can be themed
[20:11] <alex3f> but that's gtk3
[20:11] <alex3f> maybe natty+1
[20:11] <alex3f> http://osdir.com/ml/commits.gnome/2011-03/msg07535.html
[20:12] <tremolux> alex3f: ah ok cool, I wanted to ask what you meant about theming
[20:13] <duanedesign> kklimonda: hello
[20:13] <alex3f> tremolux: do you have another proposal for the white space problem?
[20:13] <alex3f> I tried disabling the separator row (not marking it as a space)
[20:13] <tremolux> alex3f: I don't, nope
[20:13] <alex3f> but it doesn't work
[20:13] <alex3f> another fix
[20:13] <alex3f> will be to put the viewswitcher in a vbox
[20:13] <alex3f> north side - current
[20:14] <alex3f> south side - progress indicator
[20:14] <tremolux> alex3f: yeah yeah, nice
[20:14] <alex3f> but that means two treeviews...
[20:14] <alex3f> needs investigation, I can do that
[20:14] <tremolux> alex3f: yep
[20:14] <tremolux> alex3f: I fear that would be too big a change at this point in the cycle
[20:15] <alex3f> ah
[20:15] <alex3f> if we can accept the horiz rule
[20:15] <alex3f> one problem is
[20:15] <alex3f> that it doesn't cover all the whitespace
[20:15] <alex3f> (in the left, expanders space is not covered by the rule)
[20:17] <tremolux> alex3f: yeah, two things with the visible line .. 1. I expect that the line would not be considered acceptable by mpt (the designer)
[20:17] <tremolux> alex3f: and 2. we'd need a UI freeze exception at this point
[20:17] <alex3f> I see...
[20:18] <kklimonda> duanedesign: hey, what's up? :)
[20:18] <tremolux> alex3f: do you have a feel for how much of an impact this bug has on folks who use the a11y features?
[20:18] <duanedesign> kklimonda: can i PM you?
[20:18] <kklimonda> duanedesign: sure
[20:18] <alex3f> tremolux: I don't know... for me is just a visual glitch
[20:20] <tremolux> alex3f: it's only really noticeable when navigating the view with the keyboard, right?  or do you mean you don't like the blank space separator?
[20:20] <alex3f> keyboard navigation
[20:20] <alex3f> the space is cool, I also like the line
[20:20] <mterry> tedg, ooh, one more: https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/indicator-datetime/727089/+merge/55409
[20:21] <tedg> NNNNOOOOOO!!!!!
[20:21] <tedg> I'm going to let LP catch up for a moment.
[20:22] <tremolux> alex3f: hmm, maybe the thing to do would be to add the separator only when we are showing the In Progress node
[20:22] <alex3f> thought about that
[20:22] <alex3f> can be easily done
[20:22] <alex3f> but i don't know how consistent that will look to the user
[20:22] <tremolux> alex3f: I'm thinking that might be more acceptable for mpt too
[20:23] <alex3f> :D
[20:23] <tremolux> alex3f: yeah, might be a little strange also
[20:23] <tremolux> heh, yeah, sorry about that autocomplete nonsense!!
[20:25] <alex3f> tremolux: so we wait for mpt input?
[20:25] <tremolux> alex3f: ok, I'll check with mpt about this one tomorrow when he's on to see what he says, howzat?
[20:26] <alex3f> awesome
[20:26] <alex3f> thank you for giving me feedback
[20:26] <tremolux> alex3f: your welcome, thanks a lot for your work!
[20:26] <tremolux> (you're)
[20:27] <alex3f> ah, and forget about the impulse thing. I'm not gonna disappear :)
[20:27] <alex3f> I want to right that reaches people
[20:27] <tremolux> alex3f: great to hear!  welcome then  :D  great to have you
[20:27] <alex3f> have a script-kiddie reputation on omgubuntu
[20:28] <alex3f> but want more...
[20:28] <alex3f> conquer the world!
[20:28] <alex3f> :)
[20:28] <alex3f> s/right/write code/
[20:29] <tremolux> alex3f: alright!  sounds good to me  :)
[20:29] <tremolux> alex3f: it's a fun project to work on, really great people
[20:29] <alex3f> yes, kiwinote told me
[20:30] <tremolux> yeah, kiwinote rocks  :)
[20:30]  * kiwinote hugs tremolux
[20:30]  * tremolux hugs kiwinote
[20:30] <alex3f> :D
[20:32] <mterry> tedg, hah!  I think you cleared the merge queue!
[20:32]  * mterry hands tedg a beer
[20:33] <tedg> mterry, Heh, yeah.  Letting LP update to ensure it's true, think I'm still in a state of disbelief :-)
[20:33] <tedg> mterry, Thanks for all the patches!
[20:33] <mterry> tedg, np, mostly my code anyway  :)
[20:34]  * mterry is working on another patch as we speak, so enjoy it while it lasts
[20:43] <fta> are those errors really harmless? (liferea:20958): GLib-GIO-CRITICAL **: g_dbus_method_invocation_return_dbus_error: assertion `error_name != NULL && g_dbus_is_name (error_name)' failed
[20:44] <fta> kind of flooding my xsession logs
[20:45] <fta> same for (indicator-weather:24083): LIBDBUSMENU-GLIB-CRITICAL **: dbusmenu_menuitem_build_variant: assertion `DBUSMENU_IS_MENUITEM(mi)' failed
[20:45] <fta> 2GB of logs in a few minutes
[20:46] <dobey> fta: -CRITICAL doesn't sound harmless to me :)
[20:46] <alex3f> unrelated indicator question: how is the guide text supposed to work for the label, using python bindings?
[20:47] <fta> dobey, that's why i'm asking, because liferea seems ok
[20:47] <alex3f> my problem is: whatever I set the guide text, the size of the label displayed in the topbar does not change
[20:48] <fta> oh, i see someone already filed a bug about this: bug 736240
[20:48] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 736240 in libindicate "GLib-GIO-CRITICAL **: g_dbus_method_invocation_return_dbus_error: assertion `error_name != NULL && g_dbus_is_name (error_name)' failed " [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/736240
[20:48] <fta> not moving though :(
[20:55] <chrisccoulson> fta - i can take a look at that
[20:56] <fta> chrisccoulson, \o/
[21:02] <pitti> erm
[21:03] <pitti> so I enable "usb tethering" on my android phone, and 2 seconds later nm is connected !?
[21:03] <pitti> man, this is way too easy
[21:03] <pitti> "usb0" interface, how nice
[21:05] <broder> pitti: yeah, i was super impressed with that. neither mac nor windows are as good as nm at handling it
[21:05] <pitti> cyphermox: ^ 'ts magic!
[21:06] <cyphermox> pitti, yes, it's awesome :)
[21:06]  * cyphermox now contemplates dropping 3g modem support, usb-modeswitch et al. altogether ;)
[21:06] <pitti> naah, I still need that for my Huawei stick :)
[21:07] <pitti> but this is still pretty brittle :/
[21:07] <cyphermox> yeah
[21:07] <pitti> my wife uses the usb 3g stick this week, and she often has to boot two times before it works
[21:07] <cyphermox> which huawei model, just curious?
[21:07] <pitti> cyphermox: hmmmmm
[21:07] <pitti> cyphermox: can't say really; Vodafone WebSessions stick, I never really cared much about the model
[21:08] <pitti> cyphermox: when it asks for the pin, it gives you about 15 "y"s with two dots on top of it :)
[21:08] <cyphermox> ugh
[21:08] <cyphermox> I don't like the PIN stuff at all, it's broken in so many ways
[21:09] <pitti> yeah, I can't seem to teach it to just remember the damn thing
[21:09] <pitti> I tried, and added the pin to the connectino profile
[21:09] <pitti> but that still asked me for the pin and instead broke the 3G provider password
[21:09] <pitti> it seems to mix up the provider and sim card pins/passwords
[21:09] <cyphermox> pitti, well, there are some (like me) who think you shouldn't be able to... just like you can't remember the pin on your phone... you just disable it -- otherwise it beats the purpose of having a PIN, but I understand the idea
[21:10] <cyphermox> I think that part should be fairly fixed
[21:10] <pitti> cyphermox: on this card there is no purpose of having a pin
[21:10] <pitti> cyphermox: it's an anonymous card, and you pay a chunk of time
[21:10] <pitti> i. e. 1 h up to 7 days
[21:10] <cyphermox> pitti, like the GoSim?
[21:11] <pitti> cyphermox: I don't know gosim, but I guess the model exists in other countries
[21:11] <cyphermox> right
[21:11] <pitti> cyphermox: it's pretty neat, I mostly have it to bridge internet outages
[21:11] <cyphermox> gosim is a "woldwide" one
[21:11] <pitti> so paying by the hour/day/week is exactly what I need
[21:11] <pitti> (as I need it perhaps twice a year)
[21:11] <cyphermox> yep
[21:12] <pitti> cyphermox: I guess there's no linuxy way to edit/disable the pin?
[21:12] <pitti> cyphermox: I think in karmic or so I tried to put it into my phone, disabled the pin there, and put it back into the usb stick, but NM didn't quite like that back then
[21:13] <pitti> so I reverted that
[21:13] <cyphermox> disabling on the card, yes there is a hack you can do -- some AT commands to disable the pin
[21:13] <pitti> ah, right, terminal FTW
[21:13] <pitti> migth be worth another try in natty
[21:13] <pitti> but it's no big deal really
[21:13] <cyphermox> screen is awesome for speaking to ttys like that
[21:13] <pitti> oh, I never tried that with ttySes
[21:13]  * pitti always uses minicom for these
[21:14] <cyphermox> I used to as well, but screen correctly line wraps, which is good for speaking with cisco boxes
[21:15] <pitti> cyphermox: I'm currently looking at bug 94130
[21:15] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 94130 in apport "HTTPS over proxy fails" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/94130
[21:15] <pitti> cyphermox: do you know how to test this easily? i. e. setting up squid on a box and somehow disallow programs to talk to IPs (except the proxy), but do allow squid to talk to the outside world?
[21:16] <pitti> cyphermox: if I iptable-disable anything but my local IP, squid won't be able to get out either
[21:16] <pitti> although, hmm
[21:16] <cyphermox> pitti, guess so... if you just used SSH it would be a socks proxy instead
[21:17] <pitti> I could install squid locally, and then start a VM and tell that with iptables to only connect to my host
[21:17] <cyphermox> pitti, I can help you testing this, we have this kind of setup here
[21:17] <pitti> cyphermox: socks proxy?
[21:17]  * pitti RTFM
[21:17] <cyphermox> no, https proxy
[21:18] <cyphermox> pitti, socks proxy is the nifty ssh -D9999 ... trick
[21:19] <pitti> cyphermox: wow, that sounds handy; never played with socks proxies before
[21:20] <cyphermox> i don't think it's any help for apport, but it's useful for firefox and graphical apps usually
[21:21] <pitti> cyphermox: so I guess local squid and iptables in VM should work?
[21:22] <cyphermox> yeah
[21:22] <cyphermox> even iptables is probably not necessary
[21:23] <cyphermox> I'd usually look at what happens with tcpdump to make sure things go through the right interfaces, it's pretty evident if it does since it will not go trhough port 443, but through whatever your proxy uses
[21:23] <pitti> or that
[21:24] <pitti> just thought it'd be easier than grepping long straces
[21:25] <cyphermox> true... then it's easy to see it doesn't work
[21:25] <cyphermox> pitti, cr3 spoke to me before about an issue with urllib or whatever speaking https through a proxy
[21:26] <pitti> cyphermox: right, that's what I'm looking at
[21:26] <pitti> it was fixed in later python2.6 and 2.7
[21:26] <pitti> but they said it'd still not work without a little help in apport itself
[21:26] <pitti> cyphermox: I recently fixed jockey to fully work with proxies (but that does a lot more), so I want to test this now and see what's missing
[21:27] <cyphermox> ok
[21:27] <cr3> pitti: hi there, I'll just lurk around in case the https proxy fix to apport might apply to checkbox too. one of the few advantages of working near cyphermox :)
[21:27] <bryceh> pitti, would it be too late to update fglrx for beta1 at this point in the release?
[21:27] <cyphermox> cr3, compared to the numerous disadvantages? :)
[21:28] <pitti> bryceh: no, as it's not on any of the images
[21:28] <cr3> cyphermox: don't get me started on those, I'd get k/b from this channel for flooding :)
[21:28] <pitti> bryceh: however
[21:28] <bryceh> pitti, what about updating jockey's blacklists?
[21:28] <pitti> bryceh: jockey handler has fglrx disabled ATM, as the amd64 package doesn't have a proper ABI dependency
[21:29] <pitti> bryceh: I was already talking to tseliot, and it seems this problem also happens in his PPA
[21:29] <bryceh> pitti, ok
[21:29] <pitti> bryceh: I'm afraid it's a little late to get a fixed jockey into the b1 images, but of course people can upgrade after install (or use the checkbox to download upgrades during install)
[21:30] <pitti> bryceh: no problem with updating fglrx itself, of course; I'd just be happy if amd64 could get a proper abi dependency, then I can drop the jockey blacklist once and for all
[21:30] <pitti> bryceh: (already happened for nvidia)
[21:30]  * bryceh nods
[21:30] <pitti> bryceh: then people could e. g. add a PPA in a situation where the ubutun driver is incompatible, and it'd magically work
[21:30] <bryceh> pitti, is that something tseliot is going to take care of or do you need my help to get it taken care of?
[21:31] <pitti> bryceh: tseliot said he'd look at it, although it was a bit unclear why it happens; his local build in a natty chroot does have the abi dep on amd64
[21:32] <pitti> cyphermox: ok, got my little proxy virtual network set up, with iptables; that was rather easy actually (once I dug out my ancient iptables fu)
[21:35] <pitti> cr3: hm, urllib.open() itself should actually handle this transparently, doesn't it for you?
[21:36] <pitti> cr3: I suppose apport fails becuase I construct my own opener, as I want progress reports during upload
[21:36] <pitti>     opener = urllib2.build_opener(HTTPSProgressHandler, multipartpost_handler.MultipartPostHandler)
[21:36] <pitti> stuff like that
[21:38] <cr3> pitti: I don't use urllib2, I use httplib.HTTP*
[21:38] <pitti> that'd be too high level for progress reporting, I think
[21:40] <cr3> pitti: it's been a while since I looked into httplib but I believe connection.request can take an iterator or pseudo-file object as argument, which can be wrapped into showing a progressbar
[21:40] <cr3> pitti: I doubt it would be worthwhile to rip out the way use use urllib2 in favour of httplib though
[21:42] <pitti> cr3: so does that work with https proxies transparently?
[21:45]  * didrocks waves goodnight
[21:46] <cr3> pitti: I have a transport module that handles proxies, both http and https, transparently. the api is something like: transport = HTTPTransport(url); transport.exchange(body=None, headers={}, timeout=0)
[21:47] <cr3> pitti: if you'd like to have a quick look, the module is checkbox.lib.transport and it has all the junk to handle http and https which is not trivial sadly
[21:47] <pitti> cr3: cool, thanks for the pointer
[21:48] <cr3> pitti: if I recall, I have the exchange method wrapped in my user interface module in a thread to display progress in gtk for example
[21:49]  * cyphermox -> eod
[21:54] <pitti> argh, this was just local pebcak; apport works fine
[21:56] <seb128> pitti, that's what happens when you are on the computer after the end of your work day ;-)
[21:56] <pitti> yeah
[21:57] <pitti> I changed the proxy, but didn't close/reopen bash to re-read the $http_proxy vars
[21:59] <pitti> bryceh: tseliot just mailed me, bounced it to you as well FUI
[21:59] <pitti> FYI, even
[22:00] <seb128> pitti, is that about nvidia and cairo?
[22:00] <seb128> (just curious)
[22:00] <pitti> no, about fglrx not having a proper video abi dependency on amd64
[22:00] <seb128> ok
[22:01] <seb128> let me know if you get news on nvidia and cairo ;-)
[22:02] <bryceh> pitti, yep thanks
[22:02]  * TheMuso kicks unity-window-decorator... Damn focus issues... :S
[22:12] <TheMuso> 8/c
[22:14] <kklimonda> TheMuso: do you have a moment? I've had pulseaudio quitting on me for some time and I don't know how to track it.
[22:15] <kklimonda> I was wondering if maybe you are aware of some issues with it in natty
[22:16] <kklimonda> it doesn't crash, but when I launched it from terminal I got "Killed" message printed.
[22:17] <kklimonda> I've tried running it with --log-level=debug but I didn't find anything weird in logs, and it doesn't seem to happen since I've launched it in the gdb
[22:17] <TheMuso> kklimonda: No issues I am aware of. Have you tried logging out, dropping to a terminal, killing pulseaudio, removing all pulse related files, and starting fresh?
[22:17] <TheMuso> I have been running natty for weeks, and have not had a single pulse crash.
[22:17] <kklimonda> TheMuso: it has been happening for weeks, very irregularly, I can't even pinpoint it to anything
[22:17] <TheMuso> kklimonda: Are you using indicator-sound much? I wonder if that is killing it somehow...
[22:17] <kklimonda> I'll try removing files from ~/.pulse/
[22:18] <TheMuso> Make sure you do it when pulse is not running.
[22:18] <kklimonda> TheMuso: not that much, but I do use it every day.
[22:18] <kklimonda> also, indicator-sound doesn't notice when i restart PA, but that's probably a different bug :)
[22:19] <TheMuso> Right.
[22:21] <kklimonda> ok, I've removed all files and started fresh - lets see if it helps.
[22:28] <TheMuso> Ok.
[22:44] <pitti> good night everyone!
[22:45] <seb128> 'night pitti
[22:59] <seb128> robert_ancell, slacker!
[22:59] <seb128> heh, I mean "hey" ;-)
[22:59] <robert_ancell> seb128, :P
[22:59] <seb128> robert_ancell, how are you?
[22:59] <robert_ancell> seb128, one meeting not good enough for you?
[23:00] <seb128> do you guys have a meeting when jasoncwarner is not there?
[23:00] <seb128> you seem not very well organized ;-)
[23:00] <bryceh> did you come just to mock? ;-)
[23:01] <RAOF> There's not so many of us.  Organisation looks a lot like headless chickening with so few people :)
[23:04] <bryceh> shall we start then?
[23:04] <TheMuso> And there is the small matter of iso testing to deal with.
[23:04] <robert_ancell> sure
[23:04] <bryceh> regarding X the main news is fglrx has (finally) arrived and will be uploaded shortly
[23:05] <TheMuso> Cool. I personally don't see the point, since my cards work fine with open drivers.
[23:05] <bryceh> however too late to update jockey for beta1 so users will have to do one system update before they can easily install it
[23:05] <bryceh> TheMuso, it warms the cockles of my heart to hear that :-)
[23:06] <bryceh> we narrowed down some of the intel gpu lockup bugs...  on amd64 we discovered ia32-libs has an old copy of mesa (that has some bugged intel bits) so that explains at least some portion of them
[23:06] <RAOF> Sadly the open drivers don't support enough to make windows games in wine work well, but apart from that…
[23:06] <TheMuso> RAOF: Right
[23:06] <TheMuso> bryceh: Ia32libs was refreshed recently and uploaded.
[23:07] <bryceh> we're still seeing some vesafb-related bugs so that's not completely fixed, although the recent plumbing changes seem to have helped some
[23:08] <bryceh> there is an arrandale-specific bug but we're still getting our arms around it
[23:10] <RAOF> And there's an infrequent, probably pageflipping related compiz freeze on intel, that we're likewise investigating.
[23:10] <bryceh> upstream thinks that the config tool needs to disable compiz when setting screen sizes bigger than what compiz can handle texture-wise.  but I'm not sure that's the right diagnosis.
[23:11] <bryceh> in non-bug news, I started prototyping a simple GUI for turning on/off kernel drm debug messages (tick-a-checkbox simple)
[23:11] <bryceh> other than that, lotta bug triage
[23:12] <bryceh> RAOF, over to you for anything else?
[23:14] <RAOF> I don't have anything much to add; other than the infrequent intel compiz freeze (bug #740126).  It would be interesting if other people who hit that could also attach their gpu_dump.
[23:14] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 740126 in compiz "compiz hangs randomly several times per day" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740126
[23:15] <TheMuso> Right, I am not using intel on my thinkpad enough to hit that atm. :)
[23:15] <RAOF> I *am* using intel enough on my thinkpad; I'm just not hitting it :)
[23:16] <bryceh> sounds like we're done with X stuff.  TheMuso over to you.
[23:17] <TheMuso> 7748Nothing to add really, other than classic GNOME is likely going to be the default DE for some a11y profiles.
[23:18] <TheMuso> Unity accessibility is coming along, and it will mostly be done by release, but I am concerned with overall stability.
[23:18] <TheMuso> So it will be there for users to play with if they want, but I think GNOME will provide a more comfortable experience for now.
[23:19] <TheMuso> Thats all from me.
[23:22] <bryceh> robert_ancell, over to you, then!
[23:22] <robert_ancell> bryceh, ah, usual stuff, package updates, bug fixes, some more GNOME3 packages
[23:24] <robert_ancell> that's it for me, anyone else?
[23:25] <bryceh> guess not, ok, AOB?
[23:27] <bryceh> okie dokie, sounds like we're done.  :-) EOM
[23:27] <RAOF> Thanks for chairing :)
[23:27] <TheMuso> thanks
[23:28] <bryceh> RAOF, oh hey btw wanted to ask if you noticed any worthwhile looking fedora patches we should investigate more?
[23:29] <RAOF> There didn't seem to be anything we should take.
[23:29] <bryceh> RAOF, ok great, thanks for checking