kdub_http://gnome3.org/ is coming down the pipes soon00:20
nhainesAnd so it has.00:34
iheartubuntugnome3 looks nice. i wonder how it will work in real life though.00:52
kdub_i'm gonna try it out today00:55
nhainesI would try it if there were any way to run it from a Live CD.00:56
* iheartubuntu still does not understand why university blocks IRC02:06
kevin37353088484random.randrange(1,100000000000,1) :P02:48
iheartubuntuHOLY COW.... someone else is using Ubuntu here at the university! Their name popped up in Empathy as "users nearby"03:06
iheartubuntuno!!! the girl is using a mac03:10
iheartubuntuif they can see me then my name is iheartubuntu ")03:10
iheartubuntuthats too bad. would have been fun to connect with someone else using ubuntu.03:13
akkWhat does "users nearby" show? Maybe just people using any chat protocol?03:16
iheartubuntuthis i dont know03:17
iheartubuntuwell, at work it does not show say, my wife using icq, or my sis using yahoo03:17
iheartubuntubut in empathy there is a "people nearby" that picks up anyone on the local network i guess03:18
akkOf course I also wonder what "nearby" means in the internet age ... same subnet?03:18
iheartubuntui guess they have to have their chat client running too03:18
iheartubuntuso maybe ichat in a mac works similar to empathy03:19
iheartubuntuhas anyone played Penumbra on ubuntu? i got it with the humble indie bundle, but never been able to run it (resolution probs)03:19
iheartubuntu"henry" is also a mac user... although it wont let me communicate with him03:20
iheartubuntuso two people now... both mac users03:20
kevin37353088484oh hey, iheartubuntu i lost that link to the comic creating program.  do you still have it.03:33
kevin37353088484i drew a maverick meerkat from that sticker i got at SCaLE for my niece today03:33
iheartubuntuuno momento03:33
kevin37353088484it turned out not so bad03:33
kevin37353088484the drawing03:34
akkA GSOC student applied today to GIMP to fix the comic-book filter. That would be a fun project, if it gets approved.03:34
kevin37353088484i'm not sure what a comic book filter is03:35
akkTurn a photo into something that looks like a comic.03:35
akkExcept it doesn't -- it works very poorly, right now.03:35
kevin37353088484ah, i see03:36
kevin37353088484speaking of comics, i was at UCLA the other day and they had Marvel vs. Capcom there, and i was wondering why they didn't make cartoons with the art they used in that game03:36
iheartubuntuakk , there is a plugin in gimp or is it already in gimp?03:43
akkalready there03:44
* iheartubuntu waiting desperately to get home so i can brew some espresso03:45
iheartubuntuany clue why a university would block irc??03:46
iheartubuntuthey arent blocking some chat clients like yahoo messenger, icq, gmail chat, etc. i wonder why they block irc03:46
pleia2a lot of them do, there are lots of irc channels for doing questionable things like sharing illegal files, etc03:46
pleia2freenode is exceptional in its usefulness :)03:47
pleia2people used to host filesharing bots, and run their own (xdcc was the most popular)03:48
pleia2they took up loooots of bandwidth over dcc, so schools shut of all access03:49
iheartubuntuohh i see. DANG03:49
iheartubuntudoing irc via webchat isnt very fun or easy03:50
iheartubuntu_Italy gave you the boot!04:26
kevin37353088484was it Sarcozzi?04:27
kevin37353088484i think that's his name04:27
kevin37353088484"The Heel of Italy"04:28
kevin37353088484wrong country04:29
kevin37353088484i and i04:29
iheartubuntu_dang, 30 minute warning at library here04:31
iheartubuntu_so i hung out friday night with 6 women... my wife and five IRS auditors. Let me tell you stories :)04:32
kevin37353088484i should go to good will when i'm in LA, see if they have any long ethernet cables.  they sell them for like $104:32
kevin37353088484no vga cables though04:32
iheartubuntu_i'm melting! i'm melting!04:34
* iheartubuntu is installing gnome3 in VB07:34
iheartubuntuohhh wow, its pretty nice!07:38
iheartubuntui feel like im on a star trek computer07:38
iheartubuntuburning to disc. will try it out as a live cd. doesnt render well in virtualbox07:46
kdub_ghost kdub16:14
kdub_whoops, at least i didnt put the pw out :)16:14
=== kdub_ is now known as kdub
kdubDarkwingDuck: we're thinknig the next ubuntu hour SD will be 4/19, if you can make ti18:08
kdubi'm gonna print up my flier, put it up around UCSD/USD and see who we can get to come out18:09
iheartubuntuthat reminds me, i need to whip up a flyer to put around Cal State LA and maybe around CalTech about Ubuntu Hour18:11
DarkwingDuckkdub: awesome.18:15
DarkwingDuckkdub: advertise it as a Ubuntu Hour and Install party18:15
iheartubuntuone hour seems like not enough :)18:17
* iheartubuntu considers starting an Ubuntu Marathon :) j/k18:18
nhainesPlease do not do install parties running for less than 5 hours.18:18
pleia2yeah, it's easy to think you can get an install done in an hour but it never works out like that18:19
iheartubuntuI tried to run a daily build of Natty LiveCD last night and it would get going18:19
pleia2you end up getting kicked out of your venue with a half installed machine left in a horrible state18:19
pleia2kicked out == they close, etc18:19
pleia2we had 5 hours planned for our last installfest and we were there for 6 debugging a RAM issue18:20
kdubI don't know if I want to be there for 5 hours :)18:20
pleia2people tend to come to installfests because they tried and had problems, so they want help and it takes a while to debug18:21
iheartubuntuGNOME3 is very interesting. It seems very basic, yet powerful.18:21
kdubi tried it out too, i like gnome318:21
* kdub has always been a graphics type person18:21
iheartubuntuI have my dads old desktop here with a "low memory" problem.18:22
iheartubuntuim thinking to redo the bios maybe to fix the prob18:22
iheartubuntuits an ubunut system that takes like 10 reboots to ever boot into ubuntu18:22
iheartubuntui never had a prob on that computer until recently upgrading from 10.04 to 10.1018:23
iheartubuntumaybe there is a grub setting that got changed18:23
kdubDarkwingDuck: i think i'm gonna distribute the fliers and location for april at SDSU, as its a strong engineering school...18:25
DarkwingDuckAye, where are we going to hold it?18:26
kdubi'm thinking at the starbucks at La Jolla Shopping Center, its walking distance from the campus18:28
kdubI haven't seen that particular location yet though, will swing by it on the way back from work today to check it out18:29
kdubif its a good location, i'll make the announcement, print the fliers, etc today18:33
pleia2fwiw I offer to give tips about issues with ubuntu at every ubuntu hour, you don't need to call it an installfest to give 15 minutes of help :)18:33
pleia2so people bring laptops and things with weird problems and we can try to debug18:33
pleia2also, why is it only tuesday? :(18:34
DarkwingDuckOkay kdub.18:57
kdubi've also been keeping my antennae up for the other hackers groups around here18:59
kdubfound 12-15 who meet once a month out by the 15/5218:59
kdubin addition to kplug18:59
DarkwingDuckI think there are a couple of hackerspaces here in SD19:00
kdubthere's one i know of, relatively new (november). still havent made it out there, but i think they have a warehouse. clairemont area if i remember19:01
DarkwingDuckkdub: there are two listed here... http://hackerspaces.org/wiki/List_of_People19:05
kdubnucleon has a physical space though, the other group is more of a coffeehouse coders group19:08
* kdub always associates hackerspaces with physical hardware hacks19:08
=== Guest460372 is now known as seidos
=== seidos is now known as kevin50047419529
iheartubuntuhow about... kevin867530919:18
kevin50047419529i'm using random.randrange(1,100000000000,1) to generate the number19:19
kevin50047419529in python19:19
kevin50047419529hey do you have experience with ecommerce iheartubuntu?19:19
jledbetterkevin50047419529, We share a lot of channels.19:20
iheartubuntuwhat sort of ecommerce?19:20
kevin50047419529jledbetter: 319:22
akkIf you'd drop about 4 zeroes from that, it would disturb the xchat separator line a lot less.19:22
jledbetterSeems like more.19:22
* kevin50047419529 laughs19:23
kevin50047419529big numbers are fun though :(19:23
* akk wants an xchat setting to say "automatically adjust the separator line but not for any nick longer than 12 chars"19:23
jledbetter+1 akk19:23
kevin50047419529iheartubuntu: like, you click a link it says "give me 5 cents for that"19:24
kevin50047419529i'll get on that akk19:24
iheartubuntuquite an interesting link for me... my music biz back in '95 used the thawte security protection (thawte was founded by shuttleworth). i used it because my GF at the time had connections to shuttleworth. small world! she bought me the domains and the thawte service (which i couldnt afford!)19:24
kevin50047419529jledbetter: it is transparent that you don't really like me19:24
kevin50047419529to be blunt19:24
kevin50047419529you must think i'm an ignoramus, i can assure you i am trying19:24
jledbetterkevin50047419529, Untrue. You are sometimes very random and confusing.19:25
iheartubuntuback then in 95 my whole shopping cart system was set up for me. nowadays i use websites like payloadz or e-junkie for shopping carts19:25
=== kevin50047419529 is now known as kevin4942941
kevin4942941jledbetter: untrue, it all makes perfect sense to me19:25
jledbetterkevin4942941, Perhaps I am alone in feeling that it is disruptive at times.19:25
kevin4942941iheartubuntu: what about paypal?19:25
kevin4942941jledbetter: i doubt you are19:26
pleia2no, she's not19:26
kevin4942941maybe i'll get voted off the island19:26
iheartubuntupaypal works fine if you have an item to send. they dont handle digital downloads... say of a a ZIP file, a PDF book, a DEB file for sale, etc19:26
kevin4942941well, my cat loves me :|19:27
kevin4942941ah, interesting iheartubuntu, thanks19:27
kevin4942941so does my neighbor's dog19:27
kevin4942941payloadz or e-junkie i'll keep that in mind19:27
pleia2kevin4942941: disruptive and random doesn't mean "don't like you"19:28
iheartubuntuthere is no island kevin867530919:28
akkright, +1 pleia219:28
akkand jledbetter19:28
iheartubuntuwe are all on the same boat :)19:28
jledbetter+1 pleia219:29
* kevin4942941 blinks19:29
* kdub buys boatload of sparkfun 19:30
kevin4942941aren't random19:31
kevin4942941they are quite frequently "weird"...19:31
iheartubuntulike my connection to anna chapman for example19:31
iheartubuntui'll be visited by the cia tomorrow19:33
kevin4942941any relation to the IRS?19:33
iheartubuntuInternets Running Slow19:34
kevin4942941no, brain is19:34
kevin4942941for a 2nd i'm thinking "does he really know anna chapman"19:34
kevin4942941what a maroon19:34
* iheartubuntu laughs hysterically under his breath while kevin isnt looking19:35
kevin4942941does anna chapman work for the iRS?19:35
iheartubuntuactually my wife has to field all the anna chapman questions ever since that happened.19:35
kevin4942941who is anna chapman dating, anyway?19:35
kevin4942941not that i follow celebrity gossip19:35
iheartubuntuI think she works for FSB actually, the russian cia now19:36
kevin4942941i wonder who her male counterpart is19:36
kevin4942941what?  that's weird19:36
kevin4942941so like Putin is her boyfriend?19:36
iheartubuntui tihnk she worked for them all along, its just out in the open now19:36
iheartubuntui wonder how russia is going to transition to ubuntu coming soon.. what is it 2012? or 2014?19:38
iheartubuntuthats a big task19:38
iheartubuntumost russians in russia i know have never even seen ubuntu19:38
kevin4942941it's easy to learn imho19:39
kevin4942941but it does have some limitations19:40
iheartubuntueven the SysAdmins there dont use ubuntu. everything is WinXP stuff19:40
iheartubuntuand everything is pi-rat-ed there19:40
iheartubuntui mean everything19:40
kevin4942941"everything"?  that sounds crazy19:40
iheartubuntui bought the entire Beatles collection for $119:40
* iheartubuntu thinks it was legal there tho19:40
kevin4942941i've used russian websites to buy music19:40
kevin4942941i thought it was legal19:41
kevin4942941and yeah, it was that inexpensive19:41
iheartubuntuso for russia to switch to ubuntu is going to be HUGE19:41
iheartubuntuand i think it will help the country too19:41
kdubi think they're just switching to linux b/c they don't trust american microsoft19:42
* kdub doesn't either :)19:42
iheartubunturussia is changing and the old mindset of copying things will dissappear eventually if OS and software is free19:42
iheartubuntutons of great programmers there too19:42
kevin4942941more competition19:42
kdubat the highest levels of the descision though, i'm sure there was concern about MS/CIA backdoors19:42
kevin4942941i just read a tweet from _capitalism_ about how there are 800 chinese that can do my job for me19:42
iheartubuntutons of russian games for WinXP ive seen there that ive never seen here... so once russia switches to open source i bet we'll have an influx of new free software and games. games!19:43
kevin4942941i'm not sure why every country doesn't have their own linux o.s.19:43
kdubiheartubuntu: thats true, should be good!19:43
kevin4942941well, every industrialized country19:43
iheartubuntuarent the facebook and google founders russian?19:44
iheartubuntudont know if they were born there tho.19:44
iheartubuntubut everyone i met there is like 10x smarter than myself.19:44
iheartubuntunot uhhhhh saying im not smart or anything :)19:44
kevin4942941Zuckerberg is russian?19:44
iheartubuntui dont know19:45
kevin4942941Serge Brin and Larry Page?19:45
kevin4942941Serge Brin may be a russian name19:45
kdubsergei is russian born19:45
kevin4942941dang, and he went to Stanford19:45
kdublarry was michigan born like me :D19:45
kduband U-Michigan19:45
kevin4942941all right kdub, you went to U-Michigan like Larry Page, you can be captain for a day19:46
iheartubuntuso i think that will be pretty good once russia makes the move.19:46
kevin4942941o captain my captain19:46
kdubsweet, captain of the boat!19:46
kevin4942941i'll need a cutlass captain, there may be a mutiny19:47
kevin4942941might i propose a first mate, me.19:47
iheartubuntuim trying to get my 20 yo inlaw to switch to ubuntu. he is stuck on winxp and he wont move because he is a gamer. and no incentive for him to switch with games costing a buck19:47
kevin4942941captain, heavy is the head that wears the crown...or...captain hat as it were19:47
kevin4942941yeah i looked up u michigan stats, their graduation rates were on par with UCLA and Cal Tech19:48
kevin4942941i should've took my education more seriously in high school, but i really didn't like high school much.19:48
kevin4942941i didn't start enjoying college really until recently19:48
kevin4942941yeah, you can't really be lazy and use ubuntu19:49
akkGaming is probably one use case where Linux isn't quite ready yet.19:49
kevin4942941it's too bad, since it's the recruitment tool19:49
akkTelling people to stop playing the games they like and play different games isn't a convincing argument.19:49
kevin4942941i was thinking of pressed cd's had a graphic of a meerkat, lynx, narwhal, etc. it might be possible to get more young people interested19:50
kevin4942941or even to play their games in wine19:50
kevin4942941i mean, i know there is a performance hit19:50
kevin4942941it may not matter on some systems though19:50
kevin4942941just use more power19:50
kdubakk: linux is as ready as any other system for games, in terms of capability19:50
kdubinvestment from publishers, not so much19:51
akkkdub: I'm not a 3D programmer, but what I hear is that the 3D APIs are awful and it's hard to make them work reliably.19:51
kdubyou probably heard that from the direct 3d crowd, who is stubborn about using anything opengl19:51
akkkdub: Someone from Mozilla, I think it was, had an article recently about how web 3d didn't work right on linux except on certain nvidia cards.19:51
* kdub writes graphics cards for a living :( 19:52
kevin4942941o captain my captain19:52
kdubX is something of a mess, wayland is pretty cool19:52
kevin4942941i wonder what 3d api WoW uses19:52
kevin4942941i doubt direct 3d since there is a mac version19:53
akkdarn, I can't find the article. It was just a week or two ago.19:53
kevin4942941i wonder why the mac version wouldn't work on linux...19:53
kevin4942941it would have to be compiled :|19:53
kevin4942941i think...19:53
kdubthere's all sorts of architectural things that might have to change between mac & linux that would make it tough19:54
akk"We tried enabling OpenGL on Linux, and discovered that most Linux drivers are so disastrously buggy (think ‘crash the X server at the drop of a hat, and paint incorrectly the rest of the time' buggy) that we had to disable it for now,"19:54
kevin4942941ah, right the Mac doesn't use the linux kernel19:54
akkand that was from Boris Zbarsky, who has been a huge and untiring linux advocate at mozilla for about a decade19:54
kevin4942941what was i thinking19:55
* kevin4942941 walks the plank19:55
akkWhen Boris says something like that, I pay attention.19:55
kdubi don't think thats a fair article19:56
kevin4942941the funny thing is, i tend to think in terms of 2d games lately.  i mean warcraft 2 is 2d, it is still a fun game to play for me19:57
kevin4942941starcraft also19:57
akkkdub: What's wrong with it?19:57
kdubi guess my anecdotal experience conflicts with his, so i don't like it19:58
akkI know I've had huge problems getting google earth to work under Linux, but that could just mean that google hasn't bothered to make it work.19:58
kdubthe big headache is how drivers are split up19:59
akkWhat graphics cards do you use/develop for, kdub?19:59
akkI know I've had trouble with several older ATIs and several Intel graphics chips (the newest Intels seem better).19:59
kevin4942941i wonder if it's because there are so many video cards and not enough developers writing open source drivers for them20:00
kevin4942941i mean, i know drivers are often used for hardware that haven't been specifically written for it20:01
kevin4942941like my intel g960/965, it uses the i915 driver, which may not be optimal20:01
kdubakk: mobile ones, not the usual suspects20:01
kevin4942941i guess it could have some kind of "unified driver architecture" and i wonder if that implies that the drivers for all architectures are included in a single "package"20:02
kevin4942941kdub: who makes mobile graphics chips?20:05
kevin4942941hmm, i thought the ati cards were working well with open source drivers20:06
kevin4942941looks like toshiba, nvidia...perhaps ati20:09
=== rbarot__ is now known as rbarot_
iheartubuntudoes anyone know where the MBR is stored? on the hard drive or ram or ??20:22
akkIt's the first part of the disk. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Master_boot_record20:23
iheartubuntuso formatting should wipe it20:39
iheartubuntuim getting some low memory errors and i think its from some info on the mbr, i was just going to format the HD and reinstall ubuntu20:40
akkInstalling will overwrite the mbr if you tell the installer to install grub2 to the mbr.20:42
akkPartitioning in the installer won't.20:42
iheartubuntui cant even get into this drive right now using an ubuntu disc. im using parted magic on ultimate rescue disc... after backing up the data i was going to format the hard drive from parted magic and then reboot and try to install ubuntu with a fresh drive20:43
iheartubuntufor some reason im unable to boot a ubuntu livecd20:44
iheartubuntubut can use the rescue disc20:44
kevin4942941that is kind of strange21:00
kevin4942941i've never used a rescue disc21:00
kevin4942941well, i used a rescue disc awhile back to change a windows passwd i forgot21:00
kevin4942941that was back when i was using windows though21:01
nhainesiheartubuntu: formatting does not touch the MBR at all.21:03
iheartubuntuhow do i touch the mrb then21:03
iheartubuntui wonder why the ubuntu disc hangs, but a rescue disc (linux) boots into it fine21:03
iheartubuntuim going to try a 10.04 disc instead of 10.1021:03
nhainesiheartubuntu: use a partitioning tool like Disk Utility (palimpset) or GNOME Partition Editor.21:03
kevin4942941iheartubuntu: different kernel versions?21:04
nhainesThe MBR has absolutely nothing to do with memory.  Is there a specific reason you suspect the MBR?21:04
kevin4942941i thought you were using gparted iheartubuntu21:04
nhainesiheartubuntu: to me that literally sounds like someone saying "I'm getting bad reception on my TV.  I think it's from some info in the TV Guide listings."21:07
nhainesExcept maybe it's bad radio reception because of the TV Guide listings.  That sounds like a better analogy.21:07
* akk agrees with nhaines21:08
iheartubuntui was getting a low memory error21:09
akkAnd why do you think that points to an mbr problem?21:09
kevin4942941to me, i think the analogy is uncalled for.21:09
nhainesiheartubuntu: sounds like you don't have enough memory then.  How much RAM is in the system?21:09
iheartubuntusomeplace on the internets i read about changing something in the boot record21:09
iheartubuntu1GB maxed out21:09
akkIt might be a bad RAM chip -- when I see memory errors I usually try running memtest first.21:09
iheartubuntuthis computer ran fine with 10.0421:10
nhainesThe MBR just defines the way the disk is partitioned.21:10
iheartubuntuafter upgrade to 10.10 i was getting low mem error21:10
iheartubuntu"memory corruption detected in low memory"21:10
nhainesThat's not an out-of-memory error, that's a memory corruption error.21:11
nhainesRun memtest to see if it can narrow it down to a specific DIMM, then toss that DIMM and replace the memory in the computer.21:11
iheartubuntubut strangely i didnt have the error before the upgrade21:11
nhainesWhere does the MBR come in?21:11
kevin4942941hopefully it's not a bug in 10.10 the caused the memory problem21:11
iheartubuntunhaines... i have no idea21:11
nhainesiheartubuntu: coincidence is not causation.  :)21:12
iheartubuntusomething i read21:12
nhainesiheartubuntu: I'd love a link to that page or article.21:12
kevin4942941i'm just paranoid after my battery, and i heard there's a bug that is borking ssds in #ubuntu-beginners and #ubuntu-nz21:13
iheartubuntucannot find a page. i had so many open last night. there was a bug or two filed about this, but i dont think it was version specific21:15
kevin4942941is it a system76 system iheartubuntu?21:16
iheartubuntuno, an old sony viao21:16
kevin4942941i am wondering because i am thinking hardware that doesn't have linux in mind should be avoided like the plague if at all possible21:16
kevin4942941i had a vaio at an old job.  nice little 14" notebook21:16
iheartubuntumy dad just bought a brand new slimline gateway for $500 on the weekend. it is AWESOME with ubuntu21:17
akkI've had several nice vaios.21:17
iheartubuntuthis viao is pretty old :) like 200221:17
akkOnly buying from linux-friendly companies is great in principle, but they're all so small that you don't get much selection.21:17
iheartubuntua P4 2.40ghtz21:17
akkIf they don't have what you're looking for, you have to look elsewhere.21:17
kevin4942941gateway is weird, i don't know why i've heard such good things about them21:17
iheartubuntuafter i stopped building my own computers ive bought only gateway. never a prob.21:18
kevin4942941i wonder, why they would any better, perhaps kernel hackers buy gateways21:18
iheartubuntuall my gateways with ubuntu work great21:18
iheartubuntu2 old laptops and 2 newer desktops21:18
kevin4942941when i bought my toshiba i assumed linux worked awesome on everything21:18
nhainesNo hardware is really made with Linux in mind.  As long as it's standards compliant it should be fine.21:18
kevin4942941i would have spent a little more for hardware that is more compatible21:19
akkZeareason is made with linux in mind ... at least for some models, Cathy went to Taiwan and had machines explicitly speced.21:19
akk(specced? specked?)21:19
kevin4942941i wonder why you believe this nhaines21:19
kevin4942941specced i guess21:19
nhaineskevin4942941: because it's true.21:20
kevin4942941specification doesn't have a k21:20
akkIt doesn't have two cs either, though. :)21:20
kevin4942941akk just pointed out an example where it is not21:20
nhainesakk: I think it's more likely she went and had hardware built with specific chipsets in mind.21:20
kevin4942941i know, i was going to say speced, or perhaps spec'ed21:20
nhaineskevin4942941: I don't think she did.21:20
akkno apostrophes for plurals, ick21:20
akknhaines: What's the difference between specing a chipset and specing other hardware in the machine?21:21
kevin4942941yeah, that's why i went with specced21:21
akkSeems like what matters is that the machine is designed (parts chosen) with linux compatibility in mind.21:21
nhainesakk: nothing, really, and that's why I don't think there's a significant difference.21:21
kevin4942941iow, it isn't true that some hardware isn't built with linux in mind21:22
nhainesakk: the value add is that Kathy did the work for you.  Which is way awesome and totally worth it.  :)21:22
kevin4942941i wouldn't be surprised if hardware specs aren't collaborated with software developers in the linux community21:22
kevin4942941sony could simply be working closer with microsoft than with linux developers, i suspect that's what happened with my toshiba21:23
kevin4942941and considering the latest windows ads...21:23
kevin4942941i'm lucky it works as good as it does21:24
akkSony is pretty evil. I love my Vaios but I don't like the company much.21:24
akkThey're even more MS-centric than most companies, and also make repair and parts difficult.21:24
nhainesThe only hardware I know that was built with Linux in mind was the HDTV 5000 card I bought.21:24
iheartubuntuso for some STRANGE reason, 10.04 finally booted into the live disc after sitting for 20 minutes21:24
iheartubuntuim attempting to install it now. but i wonder if there is an underlying memory problem21:25
akknhaines: "built" meaning chips designed from the silicon level, not just assembling components into a consumer product?21:25
kevin4942941i would do a memtest from the livecd21:25
iheartubuntui did a mem test sunday for about 45 minutes and had no errors21:25
nhainesakk: in this case, more like "we specced it out and wrote Free Linux drivers, but couldn't be bothered to write Windows ones."21:25
kevin4942941the corrupt memory error would freak me out enough to run one iheartubuntu21:25
iheartubuntui was also getting the same error with 500mb ram installed (two different chips)21:25
kevin4942941but you're probably more of a risk taker than i am21:26
akkAh, built meaning the company that built the silicon also wrote drivers. Gotcha.21:26
akkIntel writes drivers for some of their hardware (though sadly, the linux drivers are usually inferior to the windows ones).21:26
kevin4942941as more tech is outsource to india and china, perhaps that will change21:27
akkI've been buying machines with Intel hardware lately for that reason, hoping they'll run linux better (and they do, but not entirely without glitches).21:27
kevin4942941i would think AMD would run better21:27
nhainesHere's another example.  None of Western Digital's hard drives are supported by the company in Linux.21:27
kevin4942941i mean, they right drivers for the ati cards21:28
nhainesBut they're ATA-compliant and run beautifully.21:28
akkIt would be great if all hardware followed specs as well as hard drives.21:28
akkCan you imagine, a generic video card driver where you could take any video card and everything would just work?21:28
kevin4942941well, that's probably not really "support".  that probably just means people can't call you guys for software support21:28
iheartubuntuso doing some more google searches on my low mem error... sounds like i could have edited the boot options to increase memory error setting21:28
nhainesThis is where, for the permanent Google record, I state that I work for Western Digital, however the opinions expressed on this topic are my own and do not reflect the opinions of Western Digital.21:28
akkOr a wi-fi card standard that every wi-fi chipset followed? <wistful sigh>21:29
iheartubuntui'll do that if i still have install probs21:29
nhainesakk: that's called VESA.  ;)21:29
kdubakk: thats somewhat of a gross oversimplification of graphics stacks21:29
kevin4942941i wonder about the fujitsu drive that used to be in this system21:29
kevin4942941it was a little flaky21:29
nhaineskevin4942941: we'll help make sure your drive is physically installed and jumpered correctly and that's it.21:29
akknhaines: uh, yeah :)21:29
kevin4942941iheartubuntu: it's a corrupt memory error, now low memory...though i guess i can see your point.  "this segment of memory is corrupt, therefore you have less memory now"21:30
kevin4942941perhaps that's what youre thinking21:30
kevin4942941dang...i can't type21:30
nhainesiheartubuntu: "low memory" means the first 640K built into the motherboard.21:31
kevin4942941the fingers have a mind of their own21:31
akkiheartubuntu told us the error message, "memory corruption detected in low memory"21:31
akkThe "low" doesn't mean "out of memory", it means "low memory addresses"21:31
iheartubuntuok i found this at the bottom of the bug... https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/324894/21:32
kevin4942941i didn't read that.  i just thought it was "memory corruption detected"21:32
kevin4942941empathy doesn't have logs :(21:32
iheartubuntuempathy has logs21:32
kevin4942941let me search for them21:32
iheartubuntuunder view21:32
iheartubuntuprievious conversations21:33
iheartubuntuit even has search21:33
iheartubuntuso if you said "dick tracy" 17 days ago it will find it21:33
kevin4942941dang i was hoping i could use grep :|21:33
kevin4942941cool, thanks iheartubuntu i was looking for a log file in ~/21:34
kevin4942941it is kind of nice to have more expressive emoticons too21:36
iheartubuntui am getting more into just using what ubuntu offers. empathy instead of pidgin. ubuntuone instead of dropbox, etc21:43
kevin4942941hmmm, so wayland isn't going to be supported by nvidia, that narrows hardware down21:43
iheartubuntuempathy matches gwibber too IMO and they all work well with the indicator too21:43
kevin4942941i wonder if the future is just going to be integrated hardware companies like apple, and microsoft to an extent21:43
kevin4942941considering they have their xbox, why they don't just sell pc's...21:43
kevin4942941hmmm, maybe they just have a deal with toshiba, and perhaps sony21:44
kevin4942941yeah, i don't like gwibber21:44
kdubwayland wont have to "be supported" by nvidia, nvidia already supports DRI21:44
akkI was going to ask whether that was any different from nvidia's past support of X.21:44
kevin4942941oh gods...that makes no sense kdub21:44
=== rbarot__ is now known as rbarot_
kevin4942941i'll look up DRI21:44
akkkdub: DRI is standard enough that wayland won't need separate drivers for different cards?21:45
nhaineskevin4942941: you don't think what kdub said makes any sense but you don't know what DRI is?21:46
kdubkrh thought about what the driver developers would do, and i'm pretty sure DRI is the only requisite for wayland21:46
kevin4942941nbaines:  i don't see what the problem is, aside from own ignorance, which i already acknowledged21:47
kdubits an exciting time for graphics21:47
iheartubuntui like gwibber. hotot is pretty nice too21:47
kevin4942941but if you're just doing it to stroke your own ego nhaines...then *pat* *pat* *pat*21:48
kevin4942941gwibber wasn't getting feeds in, so i just use twitter in a pinned tab21:48
kevin4942941DRI = dopamine reuptake inhibitor21:49
kevin4942941i use DRI for my depression21:49
nhaineskevin4942941: yes, my confusion at your statement (paraphrased "I claim kdub's assertion is logically deficient, by the way I don't know what he said") is to stroke my ego.21:52
nhainesGood call.  That makes even more sense.21:52
kevin4942941nbaines (sic):  you don't understand my reference point.  you are thinking i am saying his words were logically deficient absolutely, i never made such a claim, that is your interpretation of it.  for clarification, it was supposed to be taken as "it doesn't make sense to me" which isn't a stain on kdub's character, but my own.  but thank you for trying to make me feel like a bigger ass than i already am.21:54
kevin4942941and as sarcasm oftentimes doesn't come across text, i am not really thankful.21:55
nhaineskevin4942941: I'm generally content if people feel like as much of an ass as they actually are.21:55
kevin4942941now i'm going to do some tai chi, for some reason i'm feeling bad vibes dude21:56
nhainesAlthough I don't usually consider it my job to catalyze that.21:56
nhainesOn a mostly unrelated note, I could really use some chai tea.21:56
kevin4942941and yet you do it so well21:57
kevin4942941you probably don't consider it your job, because you aren't getting paid for it21:57
nhaineskevin4942941: you'd probably find that you'd get less "bad vibes" by not reading malice into things said in IRC.21:58
kevin4942941nhaines:  you should take your own advice21:58
nhaineskevin4942941: I always do.21:59
nhaineskevin4942941: on the other hand, I do get annoyed when people assume the worst and then attack me for it.  I usually don't have a lot of time for that.21:59
kevin4942941nhaines:  so you say21:59
nhaineskevin4942941: I was surprised at what you said and asked you to clarify, and you said I made you feel like a bigger ass than you usually do.22:00
kevin4942941there was no attack on my part, just defense22:00
pleia2kevin4942941: some tai chi sounds like a good idea :)22:00
akkkevin4942941: "stroke your own ego" wasn't an attack?22:01
akkCame across as one.22:01
kevin4942941i suppose i should just let him say what he wants22:01
nhaineskevin4942941: I actually was just hoping for some kind of clarification.  I'm sorry if it came across as an attack.22:01
kevin4942941i consider kdub a friend nhaines, so you saying i am criticizing his logic i didn't take too kindly to22:02
kevin4942941especially since it was false22:02
nhaineskevin4942941: it was a question, not an assertion.22:02
akkFrom a third party view, it looked like there was some attacking/insulting on both sides.22:03
* nhaines doesn't let his friends get away with bad logic.22:03
kdubits all good everyone :)22:03
* iheartubuntu whips out his violin. dont shoot me since ive never played one.22:03
akkMaybe we should all make up and try to clear up the tech misunderstanding. :)22:03
erichammondI'd like to welcome everybody to the Ubuntu community :) http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct22:03
* kevin4942941 tries to treat his friends with kindness22:03
nhainesiheartubuntu: the round part goes under your chin.  :)22:03
iheartubuntuohh thats how you do it. i had it on my foot like a hillbilly22:04
kevin4942941i played violin, not well mind you22:04
iheartubuntuardour is the next violin22:04
* akk has a sony laptop named vaiolin, does that count?22:05
kevin4942941no kidding, iheartubuntu22:05
iheartubuntutruce everyone22:05
iheartubuntuits 5pm someplace22:05
iheartubuntu(isnt that a song?)22:05
* kevin4942941 has no clue22:06
kevin4942941do you want the truth or the marketing propaganda?22:06
kevin4942941truth is, i frequently have no clue.  the upsell is, i make *millions* of Julian fries!22:07
kdubback to wayland though :) (hopefully not digging anything back up)22:16
kevin4942941i couldn't really find anything on DRI22:17
kevin4942941oh yeah, would you buy an nvidia card?  or recommend an nvidia card to a friend for wayland?22:17
kevin4942941my initial reaction is no, i mean, just based on them not "supporting" it officially, according to wikipedia22:18
* akk wonders what kind of graphics chips the wayland developers use22:18
kdubX needs a lot of X-specific mechanisms to let applications run in an X environment with openGL22:18
akk(developers plural? I think I read somewhere that it's just one person)22:18
kdubits largely krh22:18
kdubbut intel is the recommended atm22:19
akkDoes it matter which intel? or will all of them work pretty comparably? (subject to limitations in capabilities, of course)22:19
kevin4942941i'm wondering if i could find an apprenticeship somewhere.  it would be cool to be able to shadow one of these guys.22:19
kevin4942941assuming they didn't find me annoying22:19
kdubakk: i've been trying to get it running with my GMA965, should be able to work22:20
kevin4942941it's a nice day out in so cal22:20
kdubyoutube keeps getting in the way though22:20
akkkdub: Great -- my laptop's something near that, so hopefully it will work too.22:20
akkyoutube because of getting the adobe flash plugin to run?22:21
kdubno, just watching videos and not doing work when I'm home :)22:21
kevin4942941i have gm965/gl96022:21
akkoh, haha22:22
kevin4942941i wonder what you're watching on youtube that is so interesting22:22
kevin4942941i can't even watch the daily show anymore :(22:22
kevin4942941i'm tired of their grey goose commercials22:22
kdubthe cool thing about wayland though is that every application has really powerful and flexible access to what it renders22:22
kevin4942941that's an issue of content, not youtubeness22:22
kevin4942941oh yeah, i watched some noam chomsky stuff that was interesting on youtube22:23
akkI'll miss xlib a little (I have quite a few xlib programs) but I'll cope, and rewrite, assuming it offers a simple drawing API.22:23
akkI do fear the window manager situation, though, haven't seen anything written about that.22:24
kevin4942941i'm wondering if wayland uses code from X, or if it's a complete rewrite22:24
kdubits not a rewrite of X at all22:25
kdubwhich, is whats so cool22:25
kevin4942941so it stands alone22:25
kdubright, and ubuntu version #1 will mostly still be X driven while everybody catches up22:26
kevin4942941or it's a standalone22:26
kevin4942941that's just crazy to me22:27
kdubwell, with the plans ive seen for ubuntu, the first version will run wayland on the baremetal and still run an xserver as a wayland client22:27
akkWow, implementing X inside wayland?22:27
nhainesAs long as the integration is good, that should be an excellent way to transition.22:27
akkI guess that's a good migration scheme, but it sounds like a lot of extra work.22:28
nhainesakk: they said it like it wasn't a lot of extra work.  :)22:28
kevin4942941have you looked at the source kdub?22:29
kdubits not that much, at the end of the day, X needs is a buffer to render to and wayland provides that22:29
akkI'd guess this is just the basic X protocol, and not all the elaborate details about modeswitching and GL windows and things.22:29
kevin4942941gotta' go pick up the nephews22:29
akk(I hope ... sure would be great to see all that stuff go away!)22:29
kdubthats the plan22:29
nhainesUnity with a maximized GNOME Terminal and byobu is my new definition of happiness.22:30
nhainesIf they get the new Ayatana-style scrollbars into natty that'd be even better.  Not in terms of UI freeze better, though.  :P22:31
pleia2I haven't even looked at byobu, screen is so simple and "works fine" :)22:31
* crashsystems is loving 11.0422:32
akkOnly thing I don't like about screen is that it sometimes decides its size is 80x2422:35
akkand then no act of god besides restarting will get it out of that mode22:35
akk(I use it to talk to plug computers over a serial line, and their busybox vi causes this, so once you've edited anything, you're forever stuck at 24 lines)22:36
nhainespleia2: byobu makes screen a lot more useful when you're on a remote terminal.  Tells you the host and a lot of system stats.  :)22:42
pleia2ah, interesting22:48
nhainespleia2: http://ubuntuone.com/p/k4g/22:55
kevin4942941i wanted to apologize to the channel, that whole conflict could have been avoided had i chosen my words more carefully from the beginning.23:02
kevin4942941i'll be more careful23:02
pleia2thank you kevin494294123:05
iheartubuntu... yah and that when i split my pants and had to walk around Tijuana with my underwear showing the whole day! hahaaa!23:24
iheartubuntuwrong chat box23:24
* iheartubuntu EMBARRASSED23:25
* iheartubuntu has turned a dark shade of Ubuntu Eggplant23:25
iheartubuntuwow. beer time.23:26
pleia2isn't that the kind of thing that's supposed to happen in Tijuana?23:26
iheartubuntunot by accident :)23:26
iheartubuntuit was an old pair of pants23:26
iheartubuntui didnt notice my pants were COMPLETELY split down the center until i looked down while sitting at a bullfight.23:27
pleia2nice one23:27
iheartubuntui topped wearing butt huggers from that day forward23:27
iheartubuntunever forget that one23:27
iheartubuntuno photos thankfully23:28
nhainesiheartubuntu: at a bullfight?  Just be glad you weren't wearing red boxers!23:36
nhainesI'm trying to think whether or not the new Ubuntu logo for the Unity launcher makes me think differently about the button.23:38
nhainesOr feel differently, rather.23:40
nhainesI guess it looks more button-like because of the proxmity to the window controls.23:40
iheartubuntui tried running 11.04 from a live disc last night and it had all sorts of errors when it booted up. not fun. shut it down and went to bed.23:47
iheartubuntunhaines - no but my face was red23:49
iheartubuntuit was not a good day for a very shy 14 yo boy :)23:50
iheartubuntusure was breezy and i couldnt figure out why23:50
akkThey probably all thought you were demonstrating a new cutting-edge fashion23:51
akklike Madonna23:51
iheartubuntu"like a virgin" would have been a fitting song23:56

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