rickspencer3my fault, sorry guys00:00
* bryceh grabs coffee00:02
* RAOF will need to get milk before coffee is a viable option.00:07
jasoncwarnerTheMuso bryceh RAOF robert_ancell00:09
jasoncwarnerback...ready for https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-04-0500:09
RAOFWooo!  My long, long delayed patch to make dh_clideps error out when it can't resolve dependencies has landed!00:09
TheMusoRAOF: nice.00:09
RAOFTheMuso: Yeah.  Now things will fail to build rather than fail to run on systems without the appropriate -dev packages installed :)00:10
jasoncwarnerRAOF: nice :) (not that I know what that is, but I'm happy you're happy)00:10
TheMusoIts mono related.00:10
jasoncwarneranyway...jumping into meeting00:10
jasoncwarner[TOPIC] X.org00:10
brycehbugs consuming most of the time these days00:11
RAOFBugs, bugs, bugs, bugsā€¦00:11
brycehI've been focusing heavily on -intel gpu lockup bugs since they're still coming in at a high rate00:11
brycehmostly been trying to push them upstream quickly, so we can get patches to give to the kernel team00:12
RAOFI'm testing libdrm 2.4.24; it's got a bunch of intel bugfixes which resolve some bugs.00:12
brycehRAOF, for the one bug we know about, I cherrypicked and uploaded the patch00:12
bryceh2.4.24 has some other fixes but they look to me less relevant for natty00:13
TheMusoI really should hammer my recently acquired intel GPU more...00:13
brycehand there were some instances of fixes-for-the-fixes ;-)00:13
TheMusoBut when at home and working, I tend to prefer my desktop...00:13
brycehRAOF, anyway so I'm wondering if maybe we should just hold off on updating libdrm and just pull in specific fixes if/when needed?  but I don't have strong feelings00:14
RAOFbryceh: Yeah.  Some of the 2.4.24 fixes are for new userspace on old kernels, which we don't much care about.00:14
brycehtoday I also went through all of the -ati bugs and pushed about half upstream, and made a pass through -fglrx but most bugs there are invalid things from weird self-installs or whatnot00:14
TheMusoI thought things had to be rather tightly in sync for intel...00:15
brycehTheMuso, sometimes00:15
RAOFIf you want it to *work* :)00:15
brycehTheMuso, libdrm 2.4.24 is mainly just a small handful of bug fixes00:15
TheMusoAh ok.00:15
jasoncwarnerhey bryceh, is the new fglrx driver included for those systems? I have a system running radeon and would like to try latest binary driver00:16
brycehjasoncwarner, yes you should be able to update to latest and then use jockey to install fglrx00:17
brycehsince fglrx arrived with so little time before beta1 we were able to get it in, but not update jockey00:17
jasoncwarnerbryceh: awesome!00:17
brycehso you need to update past beta1 and then can install it normally00:17
jasoncwarnercool...I'm upto date as of this morning so I should be fine...computer is media center upstrairs so I'll give that a go when we are done here00:18
brycehanyway, the rate of incoming bugs is starting to exceed my capacity to keep up with them00:18
brycehhelp would be appreciated.  I figure by beta2 the rate will just be too high to be able to stay on top of the bugs any further00:18
RAOFI'll do some more bug work, then.00:20
jasoncwarnerYikes! Ok...anyone that can give bryceh a hand, that would be awesome...seems that trend line is going crazy00:20
RAOFThat's a terribly impressive graph, though.00:20
brycehRAOF, thanks; in particular I haven't kept up with mesa, nouveau, or input drivers.00:21
brycehalthough numbers for those are small00:21
brycehI figure once we shut off the apport gpu and crash hooks that'll ease a little bit of pressure00:22
brycehbut probably should wait until post-beta2 to do that00:22
TheMusoActually interesting you should mention that, for natty beta there hasn't been the super influx of audio bugs like usual, so thats good news. :)00:22
brycehjasoncwarner, anyway I'm rambling now.  I'm done :-)00:22
jasoncwarnernext topic [TOPIC] AOB00:23
jasoncwarneranythign else anyone wants to talk about?00:23
RAOFHave other people noticed moderately high CPU usage in Banshee?  ~10% when playing with the window open?00:25
jasoncwarnerRAOF: ;) you know I did yesterday :)00:25
* TheMuso doesn't use banshee, there are still a11y issues with that, I really ort to dig into that a bit deeper.00:25
TheMusoBut I was personally happy with rhythmbox.00:25
RAOFThere's no smoking gun in the profile, but since it doesn't seem to occur when the window is closed there are some good leads.00:26
jasoncwarnerthanks, RAOF....keep digging..seems weird that it would jump to that much CPU just to play music...weird...00:27
jasoncwarnerSounds like we are about done...Anything else before we call the meeting?00:27
TheMusoIts mono. What else do you expect? :)00:27
* TheMuso ducks.00:27
jasoncwarnermicahg: ?00:27
micahgI wanted to ask about webkit 1.400:27
jasoncwarnermicahg: go ahead00:27
micahgis robert_ancell planning on working on that?00:28
robert_ancellmicahg, yes, there's a problem with the documentation build, working on that today00:28
micahgrobert_ancell: ok, great thanks00:28
robert_ancell1.3.13 that is, still waiting for 1.4.0...00:28
* micahg thought 1.4.0 would come with GNOME3 this week00:29
TheMusoDo I read the release schedule incorrectlyk, or is there no beta freeze for beta 2?00:29
micahgjasoncwarner: that's it, thanks :)00:29
micahgTheMuso: apr 1100:29
TheMusoAh makes sense.00:30
TheMusoThats kinda cool, because it means I have some, if not all of Monday to do work. :)00:30
micahgactually, I think almost everyone has all of monday00:30
TheMusoah ok.00:31
TheMusoSo its EOD Monday.00:31
* micahg thought freeze was 23:00 UTC monday00:31
TheMusoCould very well be.00:31
RAOFOh, so I'll have time to work on my birthday, too. :)00:31
micahgrobert_ancell: I'm assuming there haven't been any unplanned ABI breaks for webkit?00:32
robert_ancellmicahg, in 1.3.13?00:32
jasoncwarnerRAOF: nice...now none of us have excuses for not remember your bday ;)00:32
micahgrobert_ancell: yes00:32
robert_ancellmicahg, I didn't see any00:33
TheMusojasoncwarner: My thoughts exactly.00:33
jasoncwarner( RAOF : not saying we will...we just don't have excuses)00:33
RAOFjasoncwarner: It's a cunning ploy!00:33
micahgrobert_ancell: also, could 1.2 be installed alongside 1.4?00:33
jasoncwarnerOk...going to call the official meeting...[END MEETING]00:33
seb128hey robert_ancell00:34
robert_ancellmicahg, looking, I think not though00:34
robert_ancellseb128, hey00:34
seb128robert_ancell, just a reminder, if you update gvfs it uses merge-upstream so don't just run dch ;-)00:34
robert_ancellseb128, yeah, I know!  I'll probably just do something wrong though...00:35
robert_ancellseb128, so the process is to run merge-upstream, then debcommit -r? or just bzr commit?00:35
seb128robert_ancell, debcheckout gvfs; cd gvfs; bzr merge-upstream --version 1.8.0 tarball_url00:36
robert_ancellmicahg, no, they would conflict00:36
seb128robert_ancell, then dch -i, do you packaging tweaks00:36
seb128debcommit -r, push, upload00:36
robert_ancellseb128, yeah, I think I keep forgetting the -r, then it doesn't tag and it gets confused00:37
seb128robert_ancell, if you do gvfs maybe include http://bugzilla-attachments.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=18518000:37
seb128robert_ancell, it's an upstream patch for bug #68285000:37
seb128 00:38
seb128otherwise out of gvfs00:38
robert_ancellbug 68285000:38
seb128no bot?00:38
robert_ancellseb128, you're the bot today?00:38
seb128no :p00:39
seb128well we can as well wait for that on to land in git00:39
seb128so don't bother maybe for that update00:39
micahgrobert_ancell: ugh, that will make migrating away from xulrunner a little harder in the stable releases00:39
robert_ancellmicahg, didn't upstream just say "no more xulrunner?". So hopefully everyone will be migrating away from it anyway!00:39
seb128robert_ancell, other topic while I'm still around, did you figure the documentation index ?index... error thing? I saw you fixed it for nautilus but other components have similar bugs00:40
robert_ancellseb128, which other components?  gedit seemed fine, and I haven't seen any others00:40
seb128robert_ancell, it was reported on gnome-panel at least00:40
robert_ancellthe issue seemed to be anything accessing documentation from gnome-user-guide (which is V3 now)00:41
micahgrobert_ancell: yes, so I was going to try to backport some of the newer versions of apps based on webkit, but most require some version of 1.3 as the minimum, I was thinking to rename 1.4 to like webkit-1.4 or something in the stable releases so these apps can basically be forklifted in00:41
robert_ancellmicahg, renaming causes so many ongoing issues...00:41
micahgrobert_ancell: well, it would just be for lucid and maverick and only for xul rdepends, I wouldn't want to touch the regular webkit aside from upgrading it :)00:42
micahgupgrading from the same branch 1.2.x00:42
seb128robert_ancell, urg, side effect of upgrading I guess, but it means we have user documentation describing GNOME3 on a GNOME 2.32?00:42
robert_ancellseb128, yes it's a bit of a mess. I'm hoping our doc people will modify it to fit.  In the case of nautilus some deprecated feature documentation was gone, but that's not a big issue for us00:44
seb128it's not like the documentation was uptodate or than users read it anyway...00:44
=== lamlex is now known as lamalex
RAOFAh.  *That's* why the overlay scrollbars are ugly on banshee!02:00
RAOFIncidentally, if we felt like making banshee start up faster we should really look into AOT compilation for some mono stuff; Banshee spends a bit more than 2 seconds JITing code on my machine.02:03
TheMusoRAOF: Something for next cycle.02:06
TheMusoI can only imagine how mono performs on atom CPUs.02:06
TheMusoOr arm for that matter.02:06
RAOFNot all of that is during startup, though; that's for an entire run.  Much of it will be during startup, though.02:07
RAOFYeah.  They'd *really* want AOT wherever possible.02:07
TheMusoWow, I wonder if the international issues are biting others on here... Appears to be between US/EU, or somewhere in the US.02:35
RAOFTheMuso: What are you seeing?  Unable to resolve canonical.com again?02:36
TheMusoRAOF: Yeah. From what I've been reading, there are some major issues with a teer 1 provider in the US, level 3 or another of the big providers.02:36
TheMusoThey were ok overnight it seems, but are falling over again, as evidence by me no longer being able to resolve ubuntu/canonical.com again.02:37
TheMuso...and my several freenode and other IRC network dropouts.02:37
RAOFEh.  Whatever it is, it's not hitting my internode connection.02:37
TheMusoNo, since Internode takes other paths out of Oz.02:38
TheMusoSOmething which I wish Telstra would do...02:38
TheMusoBut overall I am on a good bundle with telstra atm for phone/mobile/net, and can get cable so, that makes things difficult if I want to move.02:38
TheMusoI'd go internode in a heartbeat if the line I had here was deacent quality/speed.02:39
=== smspillaz|zzzzzz is now known as smspillaz
TheMusoI actually find it weird that for Telstra, we go via the US to get to EU.02:44
RAOFI find it a bit weird that there are different routes for different carriers.02:51
RAOFIt's not like we've got a huge web of intercontinental links.02:51
TheMusoYeah. A deacent provider should depend on multiple routes.02:51
TheMusoTrouble is, Telstra half owns Reach, one of the major teer 1 providers for Aus, so...02:52
TheMusoThey aren't likely to use anybody else.02:52
=== asac_ is now known as asac
=== Amaranth_ is now known as Amaranth
=== tjaalton_ is now known as tjaalton
=== ivanka is now known as ivanka-train
didrocksgood morning08:02
jasoncwarnermorning didrocks!08:06
pittigood morning everyone!08:06
jasoncwarnermorning pitti08:06
pittihey jasoncwarner, how are you?08:06
jasoncwarnerpretty good.., you ?08:06
jasoncwarnerbtw...looks like with you springing forward, and me falling back...the 1:1 is now 2 hours earlier ;) what do you think? want to jump on mumble?08:07
pittijasoncwarner: sure08:08
pittijasoncwarner: I'm in08:08
jasoncwarnerjust realizsed...never setup mumble after installing SSD...give me a few minutes08:08
didrocksmorning jasoncwarner, pitti!08:10
ricotzpitti, good morning08:34
ricotzpitti, could you take a look at https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libgtop2/2.28.3-0ubuntu108:35
desrtrodrigo_: hihi08:41
rodrigo_hey desrt08:42
ricotzrodrigo_, hey08:44
rodrigo_hi ricotz08:46
ricotzrodrigo_, feel free to update some ppa packages :), i will stop for now, but i will take care of gedit08:47
glatzormoring mvo08:48
pittiricotz: what about it? (sorry, was on phone)08:48
mvohey glatzor!08:48
pittiricotz: you want it NEWed?08:48
glatzormvo, I am not sure which lintian tags to use by default.08:48
pittimeh, LP going down?08:49
rodrigo_ricotz, I have updated a few in some spare moments, but I'm bug fixing, so going slowly08:49
didrocksrodrigo_: hey08:49
ricotzpitti, hi, yes ;)08:49
glatzormvo, I already added the option to load distro specific tags files08:49
rodrigo_hi didrocks, pitti08:49
didrocksrodrigo_: any idea why a gobject_new can crash apart from "no more memory"? https://launchpadlibrarian.net/68241093/Stacktrace.txt08:49
didrocksrodrigo_: the line is   child = g_object_new (NA_TYPE_TRAY_CHILD, NULL);08:49
rodrigo_didrocks, looking08:50
mvoglatzor: oh, I did not see that in the code08:50
didrocks(and yeah, it's not a computing error, we are using that functions hundreds of time)08:50
mvoglatzor: look at the data/lintian-checks from my branch, its a subset of the ftp-master tags from lintian08:50
mvoglatzor: but I removed the ones that where obviously not good08:50
mvoglatzor: like /opt in the package08:51
mvothats fine for us08:51
xclaesseargh, postinst of the new kernel has a stupid typo08:51
ricotzrodrigo_, no problem, i wont upload to it for some hours08:51
xclaesse&& die08:51
xclaesseinstead  of || die08:51
rodrigo_didrocks, hmm08:51
didrocksrodrigo_: puzzling, isn't it? ;)08:51
mvoglatzor: just fyi, I look at #742935 next08:51
pittiricotz: done08:51
ricotzpitti, thanks08:52
mvoglatzor: looks like a double release of a fd or something08:52
rodrigo_didrocks, if it's not a coding error, it's either out of memory or memory corruption08:52
glatzormvo, I would like to make the changes more transparent. so not removing checks but commenting them out. But how to handle overrides? should we call lintian twice? once with --no-override and the fatal tags and once with the non-fatal ones?08:52
rodrigo_although the object pointer (0x1000000) looks weird indeed08:52
mvoglatzor: that sounds sensible08:52
mvoglatzor: did you merge my other stuff as well? like the exitcode check ? currently we report bad-quality even if its lintian itself that is failing :)08:53
rodrigo_didrocks, can you easily replicate?08:53
didrocksrodrigo_: not at all08:53
rodrigo_didrocks, memory corruption then?08:54
didrocksrodrigo_: yeah, the new object pointer adress is what tell me it's out of memory08:54
didrocksrodrigo_: I would say so08:54
didrocksrodrigo_: will confirm with Neil as well, thanks :)08:54
rodrigo_didrocks, no problem :)08:54
rodrigo_didrocks, if someone can replicate, running it with valgrind will give the answer08:54
didrocksrodrigo_: yeah, but it seems $random, even if I try to add/remove a lot of apps appearing in the systray08:57
rodrigo_hi seb12809:02
seb128hey rodrigo_, how are you?09:02
rodrigo_seb128, I'm fine, and you?09:04
seb128I'm a bit tired today, I stayed up quite late, but otherwise ok09:04
seb128getting some coffee so it should be better after that ;-)09:05
rodrigo_yeah, saw last night you were late working09:07
seb128pitti, hey09:20
pitti bonjour seb12809:21
seb128pitti, how are you?09:21
pittiseb128: pretty well, thanks! et toi?09:22
seb128I'm a bit tired but fine otherwise09:22
seb128pitti, did you already see the retracers crash on what is current in the amd64 log?09:22
seb128in get_source_tree09:22
pittiI didn't, no09:22
seb128pitti, do you want apport bugs for such cases or should I just declare the bug buggy untag and restart?09:23
pittiAssertionError: could not determine source tree root directory09:23
=== Sweetsha1k is now known as Sweetshark
seb128(well restart when launchpad will be back to rw)09:23
pittiseb128: I think this is worth fixing09:23
pittiseb128: in particualr, it should just skip the source stack trace here, as it usually seems to work09:24
pittiseb128: I'll fix it right now09:24
seb128pitti, ok, thanks a lot!09:24
pittihm, hang on09:25
pittithis assertion is really justified, I guess it's a special case with a weird naming09:25
pittiPYTHONPATH=. python -c 'import apport; print apport.packaging.get_source_tree ("indicator-weather", "/tmp/x", "11.03.27+repack-0ubuntu1")'09:29
pittihm, that doesn't crash here :/09:29
* pitti tries in teh chroot09:29
pittiImportError: /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.6: version `GLIBCXX_3.4.14' not found (required by /tmp/tmpfREm2I/usr/lib/libapt-pkg.so.4.10)09:30
pittile huh?09:30
pittiapt-get itself is broken now :/09:31
pittiah, ignore me; was in the lucid dchroot09:31
pittiseb128: meh, NFC I'm afraid; I can't reproduce it in the chroot either :/09:33
pittiand now we need to wait for LP to come back anyway, once it does I'll try a manual apport-retrace09:34
seb128pitti, ok09:34
=== czajkows1i is now known as czajkowski
seb128does anyone know if geoclue will activate on demand?09:44
seb128bug #740484 is a crasher that some users seem to get when it start but the computer is not online yet09:45
seb128but that's a non issue if it get respawned later I guess09:45
seb128other polkit-gnome has an assert quite some users are running into: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/policykit-1-gnome/+bug/74142509:46
seb128could be a crash on logout though09:46
chrisccoulson_good morning everyone09:50
glatzormvo, since lp is down I will merge the lintian branch in the evening.09:53
mvoglatzor: thnx09:53
mvoglatzor: yeah, its a bit anoying for me as well, if only bzr would stay up09:53
glatzormvo, you can now ship a separate data/lintian-nonfatal.tags.Ubuntu and data/lintian-fatal.tags.Ubuntu09:54
seb128hey chrisccoulson_09:54
seb128hey glatzor mvo09:54
chrisccoulson_hi seb128, how are you?09:54
glatzormvo, I recently discovered "import lsb_release; lsb_release.get_distro_information()". Makes life easier.09:54
seb128chrisccoulson_, I'm fine though a bit tired, what about you?09:54
glatzorhello seb128 !09:55
glatzorseb128, mvo, see you guys! have to go to work now.09:55
seb128have fun ;-)09:55
chrisccoulson_seb128 - yeah, a bit tired too. bug 663294 is giving me a real headache now09:56
rodrigo_oh, lp in read-only mode09:57
mvoglatzor: great work!09:57
mvoglatzor: thanks and see you09:57
glatzormvo, I plan to revert 596.1.1 and just switch to a non-interactive session if the controlling terminal cannot be attached09:59
glatzormvo, it was a stupid idea to keep the tty open all the time.09:59
glatzorhave a nice day!10:00
GunnarHjpitti: Good day, Martin!10:00
GunnarHjpitti: Even if you seem to be busy, do you have time to sponsor the l-s side of bug 742857? Basically you already read to document last Friday.10:00
GunnarHjpitti: While I think the document should be uploaded for Natty, I suggest that translations are postponed as explained in comment #7.10:00
mvodpm: hello! sorry if I missed your answer yesterday, but when is the next natty langpack upload planned?10:11
mvodpm: there is a file overwrite issue (with packagekit.mo) in the current ones10:11
pittimvo: do you need one urgently? I was planning to do a new -base one for beta-210:12
mvonot urgently, just would be nice to know when to expect the auto-upgrade-tester to go more "non-red" again10:12
dpmmvo, sorry, it was me who missed the question, pitti can answer this one best ^10:12
pittimvo: bug 744831 you men?10:12
pittihey GunnarHj10:12
didrocksSweetshark: hey, did you get to the static unity Quicklist bug on libreoffice?10:13
pittiGunnarHj: oh, sure, I'll be happy to10:13
pittiGunnarHj: let's see how far I get while LP is readonly10:14
pittissh: connect to host bazaar.launchpad.net port 22: Connection refused10:14
pittiGunnarHj: I'll do that as soon as it comes back online10:14
Sweetsharkdidrocks: bug 720716?10:14
GunnarHjpitti: Thanks!10:14
pittiGunnarHj: it's still sitting in my mailbox, was planning to do that anyway today (was busy with a rather big patch/debugging session Mo/Tu, sorry)10:15
TommehHi all. Currently having fun with gnome-shell, but missing all the themes (and no apparent application to switch themes either)10:15
Sweetsharkdidrocks: I will give it a try today.10:15
TommehCurrently have gnome-shell installed via the gnome3 ppa, on Natty 11.04 Beta.10:15
seb128launchpad is back10:15
didrocksSweetshark: yeah, this is important to design and we should give time to translator10:15
GunnarHjpitti: No problem. I understand that you always are busy with about 100 things. :)10:15
TommehThe following packages have unmet dependencies:10:15
Tommeh  gnome-themes: Depends: gtk3-engines-pixbuf which is a virtual package.10:15
Sweetsharkdidrocks: backports were a bit nasty this time around.10:16
TommehThat's what I get when I try to install gnome-themes from the PPA.10:16
didrocksI think natty > backports :)10:16
seb128Tommeh, hi, try #ubuntu for user questions but basically GNOME dropped the appearance capplet and there is only one theme available for the new gtk10:16
desrtTommeh: and gnome-tweak-tool is your friend10:17
seb128right, natty > backports, I agree with didrocks10:17
Sweetsharkdidrocks: me too. But my inbox disagrees usually.10:17
desrtTommeh: you can just check it out of git and run it directly from the checkout.  no need to compile.10:17
Tommehdesrt/seb128: thanks.10:18
desrtTommeh: it lets you change quite a lot of things, including the theme10:18
didrocksSweetshark: check with chrisccoulson_ and dpm for translation btw, they dealt with that in the same case than yours (meaning: translation not in launchpad)10:18
seb128pitti, I'm restarting the i386 retracer and let the amd64 down for you to debug10:18
pittiseb128: oh, LP back up?10:18
desrtTommeh: changing the theme of the shell itself is somewhat more complicated -- it involves replacing a directory in /usr... but it is possible10:18
pittiseb128: I'm currnetly logged into the amd64 one10:18
TommehCurrently I'd be happy with the stnadard theme10:18
seb128pitti, yes, it's back10:18
TommehI'm on some form of horrid 'fallback' gnome theme at the minute :)10:19
desrtTommeh: oh.  install the gnome-themes-standard package10:19
desrtit has adwaita in it10:19
TommehAh, I've done that since removing a conflicting package (gnome-accessibility-themes)10:19
TommehBut gnome-themes won't install from the PPA10:19
TommehIt's still the natty version.10:19
TommehDue to the error above10:19
desrtdon't worry about that one.  gnome-themes-standard is what is necessary10:19
TommehDepending on a package that isn't in the PPA10:20
TommehAhh, OK10:20
TommehLogout time -- brb :)10:20
desrtjust logout -> back in10:20
desrtya :)10:20
pittiseb128: hm, did you just rm the log file?10:20
seb128pitti, rotated it sorry10:20
seb128pitti, it's log_20110406.gz10:20
pittiyep, thanks10:21
TommehBang, I has a theme.10:21
TommehMany thanks desrt :)10:21
seb128pitti, I want a clean log will make easier to run my "get recent bugs which get duplicates"10:21
desrtTommeh: no problems :)10:24
pittiGunnarHj: great job!10:25
TommehIt doesn't seem to like letting me manage two screens .. I have one screen that I can switch between workspaces, and one that's just 'stuck' with one workspace... Almost like it was never intended to be managed.10:25
pittiGunnarHj: one question, why did you add a no-op on_button_load_help_clicked()?10:25
pittiGunnarHj: isn't setting the uri button propery enough?10:25
TommehBut that's almost nice, as I can have persistant applications (like xchat) in on screen, whilst switching others.10:25
pittiGunnarHj: it works fine without; do you mind if I remove the dummy handler while merging?10:28
GunnarHjpitti: If it works, I don't mind at all.10:29
GunnarHjpitti: GTK is another area I know very little about. :(10:29
pittiGunnarHj: uploaded, thanks a lot!10:30
desrtTommeh: multi-monitor is a sore spot in the shell. a bunch of changes landed recently (a couple of weeks ago) to vastly improve the situation but it still leaves quite a bit to be desired10:30
desrtTommeh: i sense that it's not a priority for them right now10:31
Tommehdesrt: I guess so! Well, at least it's not just me :)10:38
TommehI'm happier to know things are weird/broken for everyone, rather than just on my machine.10:38
desrtTommeh: the gnome3 PPA is, frankly, one of the worst ways to try gnome3 at the moment10:39
desrtit's very deeply broken10:39
TommehYep :(10:39
desrtwhich is quite understandable, given that the people behind it have their concerns in other places at the moment10:39
desrti expect it will get quite a lot better after the ubuntu release10:39
TommehFinger's crossed :)10:40
pittidesrt: FWIW, currently writing GNOME30-Live-latest.iso to an USB stick; I'm curious :)10:40
desrtpitti: i understand the fedora 15 beta is one of the best choices...10:41
cassidyseb128, since I updated to Natty, Evolution took the bad habit to be confused with some of my imap mails: the title of the mail is correct, but when I click on it it displays a unrelated old mail. Is that a known issue ?10:44
seb128not that I know about10:44
seb128like the preview doesn't match you select in the list?10:45
seb128what protocol do you use?10:45
desrtpitti: let me know what you think, in any case10:45
pittidesrt: the mini 10 touchpad still sucks even with gnome 3!10:45
cassidyseb128, imap+.  The preview is correct but the displayed mail is not10:45
desrtpitti: and the trackpoint on my thinkpad is still red!  i thought this new CSS theme would allow me to customise that!10:46
desrtwhere is my refund?!10:46
seb128cassidy, like if you double click to open it?10:46
seb128cassidy, I never open email I just read them in the preview10:46
cassidyseb128, oh yeah. By preview I meant the title in the treeview10:47
cassidyseb128, the mail is wrong in the pane displaying the full mail and if I double click on it10:47
seb128cassidy, then no, works correctly there10:47
seb128check on #evolution on the gnome irc maybe10:47
cassidyseb128, how hard are you patching evolution? ie, should I open an upstream or lp bug ?10:48
seb128or ask on #evolution if you want to start10:49
seb128we do patch a bit but only for ui tweaks10:49
seb128we don't do anything which has to do with the mailer10:49
pittidesrt: hm, I see the initial throbber, then nothing happens any more, got some trouble booting10:49
seb128pitti, wait a bit I guess10:49
seb128pitti, how much did you wait?10:50
pittia minute or so10:50
pittibut the first time I tried it it booted in some 15 s10:50
pittibut then I tried suspend, and it crashed, so I rebooted10:50
pittiand now it doesn't come back10:50
seb128I need to try it again as well10:50
pittilet me fiddle a bit10:50
seb128but I think I'm going to miss having a launcher on screen with GNOME310:52
pittiah, coming back now; took a lot longer, though10:52
pittidesrt: so, works pretty well here! not too much fun without wifi, though (bloody broadcom chipset..)10:56
pittidesrt: by now I got used to Windows - search term - enter to launch apps, so that's pretty familiar :)10:56
desrtpitti: did you at least take a peek at the new networkmanager integration?10:57
pittithe theme is too generous with spacing/sizing for a small netbook screen, but otherwise this looks quite nice :)10:57
desrt(even without networks)10:57
desrtpitti: yes.  i agree quite a lot on the theme.  i just switched to another -- inset.10:57
pittidesrt: I did, yes; I really like the status message there10:57
desrtpitti: i mean about the menu10:58
desrtnetwork-manager with the translucent shell theme for menus10:58
desrtpretty neat10:58
pittidesrt: the "wired - cable unplugged" and "wireless - firmware missing", that's quite clean10:58
desrtpitti: actually, those notifications are still annoying in some cases10:58
pittidesrt: yeah, very glossy10:58
pittidesrt: I didn't get any notification yet10:58
desrtyou still often see the "disconnected from network xyz" when opening your laptop after having disconnected from the network a long time ago10:59
desrtand the "don't show this again" button doesn't actually work :/10:59
pittithe black translucent windows look very elegant (I'm just not a big fan of dark themes, but still)10:59
desrtpitti: i agree quite a lot.  the black is just too... black10:59
desrtbut the gloss isn't so bad10:59
pittidesrt: is there a way to quick launch your favourite apps? such as Windows+1 or so?10:59
desrti think the idea was so that it would fade into the background and let you focus on the work11:00
desrtpitti: no.11:00
desrtthis is a point that unity wins on, i think11:00
desrtat the same time, it's not so important11:00
desrtsince windows+f+enter is sufficient to get firefox11:00
desrtand the search gives higher preference to items that you've marked as favourites (ie: on the dash)11:00
pittidesrt: work flow wise they are really quite similar to me11:00
desrtso that helps11:01
pittithe indicator layout, the windows/overlay dash handling, etc.11:01
pittihow do I opena nautilus window, though?11:01
desrtthere are quite some similarities11:01
desrtpitti: add 'files' to your dash11:01
desrt(should be there by default?)11:02
pittiapparently I'm too blind to see a 'Home' button or so11:02
desrtpitti: i think it's not there, actually11:02
desrtand the apparent lack of meaningful desktop is also somewhat distressing11:02
pittiwin+hom+enter works11:02
pittioh, I can't dnd to the background11:03
desrtno.  the desktop is no longer shown as the background11:03
desrtit's just some folder in ~ now, with no special meaning11:03
desrtyou can turn the desktop back on with gnome-tweak-tool but apparently the designers found the idea of a desktop to be distracting11:03
pittiah, I saw a notification now, from RB11:03
desrtso it's off by default11:03
seb128I like having a desktop ;-)11:04
desrtseb128: ya... no kidding11:04
desrti also like having a minimise button11:04
seb128that I don't care much about11:04
desrtfortunate it's still possible to get both of them back again11:04
pittiwell, it tends to make people not care about where they put their files, though11:04
pittimy mother's desktop looks horrible11:04
pittibasically everything she ever touched11:04
desrtpitti: that's sort of the point, actually11:04
desrt3.2 is going to bring some tracker/zeitgeist love11:05
pittiI think the zeitgeist approach and search is a better long-term strategy11:05
pittidesrt: I've never been a big fan of these tracker/indexer/etc. stuff, I know where my stuff is11:05
pittibut admittedly zeitgeist feels pretty good and magic to me11:05
desrti almost get the impression that the desktop was disabled to increase the pain-level to push us in that direction faster11:05
pittiit even digs out some images I recently looked at from the evolution cache (email attachment), etc.11:05
desrtmagic is magic!11:06
pittidesrt: well, if people need to be taught to get used to a new workflow, why not do it all the way through :)11:06
desrtpitti: i won't comment on the motiviations of the designers of the shell11:06
pittibeing an old fart in this the concept of files and folders is deeply molten into my brain11:06
desrtbecause they're a bit of a mystery to me, to be honest11:06
pittibut then again, on my Android phone I never think in terms of files and folders11:06
pitti(where I'm only a user, not a developer)11:07
pittiand it really feels right11:07
desrtthus far i've managed to avoid getting a smartphone11:07
desrtbut i guess that will end quite soon -- nexus S is in canada on april 1411:07
pittidesrt: that's the problem -- once you have one, you won't ever go back :)11:08
desrtwhich means that from april 14 to april 24th or so, i'll get no work done because of angry birds11:08
pittithat would have been a nice bday present :)11:08
desrtfunny you should mention that because my birthday is quite soon11:08
desrtbut i don't think i can wait :)11:08
pittidesrt: so I think the biggest thing that I miss from the current live image is a good files/document search/log integration (or maybe I haven't found it yet)11:08
pittidesrt: when?11:09
pittimine is April 14th11:09
desrtpitti: i think you don't miss it -- it's just not there11:09
desrtmay 311:09
pittinatty beta 2, nexus S11:09
desrtsame as david barth :)11:09
pittidesrt: hm, I thought pushing people to work more document and less app centric was a major goal?11:10
desrtpitti: ya.  i think that's complete BS to be honest11:10
desrtgnome-shell SCREAMS app-centric11:10
pittithere should at least be some links to the standard XDG dirs11:10
desrt(as does unity)11:10
desrti'm not a fan11:10
pittiunity+zeitgeist is sort of a hybrid11:10
pittiif you search stuff, it comes up with files and apps11:11
pittistill no xdg dir links, though11:11
desrtthis is not usually what i think of when i think doc-centric11:11
pittiyes, I agree11:11
desrtfinding docs is one thing, sure11:11
desrtbut the *identity* of what is open already, and what you're working with11:11
desrtin both unity and g-s, it's very much tied to the application icon11:11
pittiI mean, I don't need/want it to find all my source checkouts etc., but finding music or LibO files would be great11:12
desrtwhich i think is extremely wrong on a very fundamental level11:12
pittiwindows + floyd wall enter11:12
pittishould kick me right into RB with The Wall playing11:12
desrtyou could pick a better album :)11:12
pittiwindows + apo should show me my Apocalyptica albums, etc.11:13
desrtah.  that's good stuff, now!11:13
pittior windows + tagname all my photos which are tagged with that11:13
pittibut I guess that's still a looong way to go11:13
desrti think we'll see this happening quite soon11:13
desrt(or things like this)11:13
desrtit's a big feature item for 3.211:14
pittithat sounds all very zeitgeist/trackerish indeed11:14
seb128you guys are keyboard freaks, I'm wondering what normal user want ;-)11:14
desrti think i want to kill the dash11:14
desrtnot sure what i'd replace it with, though11:14
desrtmaybe nothing11:14
desrtthe window switcher applet was actually sort of nice :)11:15
desrtit listed the windows you had open (ignoring tabs, this is equivalent to documents)11:15
desrtso.. quite good!11:15
pittidesrt: the alt+tab one looks suspiciously like the XFCE one :)11:15
desrtya.. don't get me started on alt+tab11:16
desrtthat's the other thing on my gnome-shell hate list :)11:16
desrtagain -- application centric.  lame.11:16
pittidesrt: I guess I'm enough of a design philistine to not care too much :)11:16
desrti fail to understand how gmail is any more related to facebook than it is to my word processor document11:16
desrt(which to drive the point home could very easily be either google docs or libreoffice)11:18
seb128pitti, hum, the i386 retracer crashed on the same assertion11:19
pittiseb128: ok, I'll stop playing with gnome3 now, and turn my attention to this :)11:19
seb128pitti, thanks11:19
pittiseb128: I can reproduce it in the chroot, now need to track it down11:19
desrtpitti: thanks for your opinions, btw11:19
rodrigo_pitti, what was the nvidia's GL problem you talked about yesterday?11:20
rodrigo_pitti, http://paste.ubuntu.com/590160/ <- could it be this?11:20
seb128rodrigo_, what problem? the cairo one?11:21
cassidyseb128, #evolution has been surprisingly  helpful. I fixed the issue by dropping my mail cache and opened https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=64689811:21
rodrigo_seb128, yes11:21
seb128cassidy, they usually are ;-)11:21
pittidesrt: so in summary, I really like the simplified network/bluetooth/a11y settings and the general design; more netbook friendly theming/window sizes and better file/XDG dir access are the main quirks that I see11:21
seb128rodrigo_, the nvidia binary driver create quite some ram use for each process using gl11:22
seb128rodrigo_, which is basically every gtk application when cairo is built with gl11:22
desrtpitti: nice to hear from positive words from "the other team" :p11:22
pittirodrigo_: I'm afraid not; I was talking about bug 72543411:22
pittidesrt: well, it's not like we wouldn't have these problems :)11:23
rodrigo_pitti, but a cairo app (evo in this case) might crash with out-of-memory conditions because of that bug, right?11:24
pittirodrigo_: ah, yes11:24
rodrigo_pitti, ok, thanks11:25
=== MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch
cdbsrodrigo_: Your work on the PPA looks nice, now that GNOME 3 is close to release. You can take a look at my own packaging of gdm at ppa:bilalakhtar/gnome-builds11:46
cdbsrodrigo_: I don't think that version of gdm is okay, but somehow it builds and runs11:47
cdbshence I didn't upload it to the PPA11:47
cdbswhere the PPA is the GNOME3 ppa11:47
rodrigo_cdbs, cool, and yes, we need more testing, so keep it there for now11:51
rodrigo_cdbs, I'll install and test it as soon as I've got a minute free11:51
cdbsrodrigo_: thanks11:51
cdbsrodrigo_: don't add that PPA, just manually download the package and try it11:51
rodrigo_cdbs, yes11:54
rodrigo_can someone please merge this -> https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/evolution-couchdb/correct_cache_dir/+merge/56551 (already uploaded)12:25
seb128pitti, do you still work on the retracers?12:38
seb128rodrigo_, ok12:39
rodrigo_seb128, thanks12:39
seb128rodrigo_, you're welcome12:39
=== MacSlow|lunch is now known as MacSlow
pittiseb128: yes, it's quite a bit more difficult than I thought, I'm afraid13:04
pittiseb128: was at lunch now, and had some IRC discussions before, too13:05
seb128pitti, ok, is that specific to a bug? it started before the launchpad update so shouldn't be it13:05
seb128hello mterry13:05
mterryseb128, hi!13:06
seb128mterry, thanks for the geoname update email, nice to see that you managed to get locations filtered ;-)13:06
mterryseb128, yeah, i was excited13:07
pittiseb128: if the i386 retracer crashed as well, it doesn't sound too specific13:07
pittiseb128: did the i386 one crash on indicator-weather as well?13:08
seb128pitti, it's weird it just started today13:08
Sweetsharkdidrocks: Could you give me a hint on how the mapping of application windows to desktop entries works? I removed the libreoffice-javafilter.desktop file here (which is problematic in itself it seems) and ran update-desktop-cache. Unfortunately, my writer windows have now neither a name, nor a icon in the launcher.13:08
seb128pitti, dunno, I haven't check the bug it crashed on13:08
pittiit's certainly mvo's fault!13:08
seb128it's always mvo's fault13:08
pittiseb128: the fun thing is that it shouldn't even get that far13:09
pittiwe don't currently have deb-src lines in the chroots13:09
pittiso apt-get source should already fail13:09
seb128oh, so it is mvo's fault!13:09
pittistill too early to point blame, let me dig deeper13:10
* pitti hugs mvo13:10
seb128mvo, no worry, retracers crashing again, nothing special ;-)13:10
* mvo hides, just in case13:11
seb128mvo, but pitti suggested the apt-get source behaviour could have changed if you don't have a deb-src source13:11
seb128mvo, but well let him confirm it before investigating ;-)13:11
mvothat might be possible, there were changes in this area. from what version to what version?13:11
seb128mvo, that started this night so something uploaded yesterday?13:12
seb128they update daily13:12
didrocksSweetshark: the mapping is made by bamf, there is a debug interface to know where the mapping is done. Anyway, just edit the default desktop files we set it the launcher (you don't need libreoffice to be running for that)13:13
mvoseb128: hm, there is a new apt and a new python-apt but it *should* only affect multiarch setups13:14
mvoseb128: can I see the trace of the crash?13:14
seb128mvo, well as said it might be something else, it's just what pitti wrote before13:14
* rodrigo_ lunch13:15
seb128mvo, it's not "crashing", it's that apt-get source should fail because there is no deb-src source but it doesn't apparently13:15
seb128mvo, where "fail" might be the return value changed13:16
seb128mvo, but wait for pitti to debug it before spending time on that13:16
seb128nessita, hola seniorita ;-)13:17
pittia mere apt-get source exits with 100, that looks fine13:17
nessitaseb128: bon jour monsieur!13:17
seb128nessita, how are you?13:17
nessitapretty good! having some net issues, but good :-)13:17
seb128I'm fine thanks ;-)13:17
pittimeh, as soon as I add some debugging it crashes13:18
pittior hangs, or immediately exits with 013:19
Sweetsharkdidrocks: well, my writer window showed up as "LibreOffice Small Device Import Filter", which it seems to get from /usr/share/applications/libreoffice-javafilter.desktop. So I removed that and ran update-desktop-cache hoping I would now get the entry from /usr/share/applications/libreoffice-writer.desktop. Unfortunately, now I get neither an icon nor a title.13:19
seb128Sweetshark, how do you start those?13:20
didrocksok, letting seb128 dealing with it, back to hack! ;)13:20
seb128didrocks, ;-)13:21
seb128didrocks, that's the spirit!13:21
didrocksseb128: well, I hate X, it's definitive :)13:21
Sweetsharkseb128: Launcher->Applications->LibreOffice Writer (in "Most Frequently Used")13:21
seb128can you try to double click on an odt from nautilus for example13:22
seb128just to see if it behaves the same?13:22
Sweetsharkseb128: still "LibreOffice Small Device Import Filter"13:24
seb128did that issue start recently?13:24
Sweetsharkseb128: no, I think its older.13:25
* Sweetshark builds LO much more than using it.13:26
Sweetsharkboth libreoffice-javafilter.desktop and libreoffice-writer.desktop suspiciously have the same "Exec:" line.13:27
seb128right, it tries to match running binaries to .desktop13:27
seb128but when started with something gio it should get the information on what .desktop to use from gio directly13:28
seb128Sweetshark, bug #75102513:29
seb128mterry, do you feel like debugging the crash you just reported? it seems like bug #434825 and a downstream crash likely13:30
seb128mterry, the call is coming from libindicate13:30
mterryseb128, sure, I can look at it13:31
seb128mterry, thanks13:31
seb128mterry, do you have things to do otherwise or do you want extra bug?13:32
seb128mterry, if I don't ping you with anything specific maybe just tackle indicator bugs if you feel like working on13:32
mterryseb128, I've got a couple things, but if you have extra bugs just lying around, I can queue them up13:32
seb128mterry, ok, I've nothing specific right now but I will do another indicator stack bug review today so I might bounce a few your way13:33
pittiseb128: erk, I ran it locally on bug 751695, which worked, so I now killed the core dump; but the i386 crashed on teh same problem, so I'll now move on to that and will restart the amd64 one in the meantime13:34
seb128mterry, having the geonames translation thing sorted would be nice but I'm not sure how doable that is for natty13:34
seb128pitti, ok13:34
seb128pitti, let me know if I can help there13:34
seb128Sweetshark, so yeah, seems there is an unity bug there, I will get Jason to join the channel to discuss it when he comes online (he's in the U.S)13:35
mterryseb128, I feel like it's close13:35
seb128mterry, btw ev said yesterday he would do a db update and ask I.S to roll it13:36
seb128mterry, I want to see if that fixes case like san francisco or lima not having any matching result13:36
mterryseb128, oh ok.  hopefully after merging my filter branch?13:36
seb128mterry, he said your review was on his list for today13:36
seb128so yeah, that should land as well13:37
mterryseb128, I think my filter will.  I *think* lima for example was just dropping off after too many hits.  Sorting by population brings it to the top13:37
Sweetsharkseb128: #751025 is close on it. I also get the window show up as "LibreOffice Small Device Format Importer". If I "apt-get remove libreoffice-filter-mobiledev" I get no title to the window at all. Calc on the other hand just works fine.13:37
seb128mterry, oh, great!13:37
seb128Sweetshark, https://code.launchpad.net/~pitti/bamf/libreoffice-705461/+merge/4924513:38
seb128Sweetshark, if that's of any use that's the commit pitti did to get libreoffice to work13:38
pittiI might have missed a few cases, I more or less just adapted teh OO.o bits13:39
pittiseb128: hm, how can the i386 one have crashed in the log and yet the process is still running?13:40
pitti1000     25626  0.0  0.0  25632  1940 ?        D    00:08   0:00 apt-get --assume-yes source indicator-weather=11.03.27+repack-0ubuntu113:40
pittithat thing has hanged for 14 hours now13:40
seb128pitti, weird13:40
* pitti kills all stuff and starts over13:41
seb128Sweetshark, I've a suspicion something broke broke the gio .desktop matching logic13:41
seb128Sweetshark, but in any case seems an unity issue, not one on your side13:41
Sweetsharkseb128: well, it seems to work for Calc windows, but fails for writer. The desktop files look the same though.13:44
=== dobey_ is now known as dobey
Sweetshark(modulo the issue with the libreoffice-javafilter.desktop file, but I still get no icon after uninstalling libreoffice-filter-mobiledev)13:46
=== maxb_ is now known as maxb
ameyJhi, where should I look for,14:15
ameyJif I want indicator applet session apis14:15
seb128ameyJ, hey, what api exactly? what are you trying to do?14:16
ameyJ@seb128, I want to set MeMenu to away when I am locking my computer either via menu or via ctrl+alt+L14:16
seb128there is no indicator specific api for that14:17
seb128your im client likely has dbus apis to do that though14:17
ameyJok, so you mean to say. I should look for dbus event14:18
ameyJok cool14:18
ameyJthansk seb128. will work on this direction now14:18
pittiseb128: this is really driving me mad.. I run "apport-retrace -uvo /tmp/x.crash --auth /tmp/auth 752174" and get that crash, with a dubious debugging output14:25
pittiI run it again, and it exits (with 0!) immediately14:25
pittikenvandine, didrocks, seb128: do you know what needs to happen to make the new overlay scrollbars the default?14:27
pittibesides the GTK patch (which we have now), there's liboverlay-scrollbar-0.1-dev, but merely installing the library won't magically enable them, or will it?14:28
pittido we need to build something against liboverlay-scrollbar-0.1-dev?14:28
seb128pitti, nothing, just install overlay-scrollbar14:28
kenvandinethat is it14:28
seb128pitti, gtk will open it and use it available14:29
pitti*scratches head*, which package is that?14:30
pittithe overlay-scrollbar source only builds the library14:30
pittiPackage: overlay-scrollbar14:30
pittiBinary: liboverlay-scrollbar-0.1-0, liboverlay-scrollbar-0.1-dev14:30
didrocksliboverlay-scrollbar-0.1-0 is enough for the current gtk14:31
didrocksliboverlay-scrollbar-0.1-dev isn't needed because it's a dlopen14:31
pittiah I remember that hack (aside from the fact that I missed the bad packaging (non-SONAME-specific files in the library)14:32
TeTeTseb128: hi, would you know anything about a replacement for vinagre in 11.04 or 11.10?14:32
pittididrocks: do you have time to fix it, or want me to?14:33
pittiso anyway, I'll deal with the MIR and seeding14:34
didrockspitti: go on with it, of course :) what about the soname?14:34
seb128pitti, talk to kenvandine about those please14:34
pittididrocks: /usr/share/apport/general-hooks/ayatana-scrollbar.py14:34
seb128pitti, didrocks has enough to do with unity he doesn't work on scrollbars14:34
pittiwe can't ship that in a soname package14:34
pittiseb128: *nod*14:34
seb128pitti, kenvandine is handling the scrollbars14:34
seb128kenvandine, ^14:34
didrockspitti: I didn't add the apport hook, so yeah, kenvandine :p14:34
* kenvandine reads back14:34
kenvandinepitti, ok, so we want a separate binary with the apport hook?14:35
pittikenvandine: so, we could do a proper "overlay-scrollbar" package which ships the apport hook and depends on the library (to avoid having to seed a particular abi of the library), or rename the hook to be ayatana-scrollbar-0.1.py14:35
kenvandinei'll do that14:35
pittithe latter is easier, the former cleaner IMHO14:36
pittibut like that it won't pass MIR14:36
kenvandinei'll do the former14:36
kenvandinemakes more sense14:36
pittikenvandine: awesome; please let me know when you upload, I'll shepherd it through NEW then14:36
kenvandinewill do14:36
pittiand I'll do the MIR review in the meantime14:36
pittikenvandine: cheers!14:36
seb128Sweetshark, is the matching bug blocking you for other things?14:42
pittiroot@osageorange:/# apt-get --assume-yes source update-manager=1:0.147.114:53
pittiReading package lists... 0%14:53
pittiseb128: ^FYI, I think I'm getting closer..14:53
pittiit just stays at 0% without any progress14:53
seb128so it's mvo's fault!14:54
pittiwhen I downgrade to 0.8.13ubuntu2, it works14:54
pittiE: You must put some 'source' URIs in your sources.list14:54
pittiand immediately returns14:54
pittiroot@osageorange:/# apt-get --assume-yes source update-manager=1:0.147.114:55
pittiroot@osageorange:/# s... 0%14:55
chrisccoulson_ok, this -pie issue with firefox is driving me crazy now, time to look at something else ;)14:55
pittithat looks even funnier14:55
pittichrisccoulson_: doesn't work with gcc 4.4?14:55
chrisccoulson_pitti - i'm not sure it's entirely a gcc issue14:55
seb128chrisccoulson_, how come we don't get the stable version in natty btw? it's still red on versions ;-)14:55
chrisccoulson_it might be partly a binutils issue14:55
chrisccoulson_seb128 - the version we have is stable already ;)14:56
seb128chrisccoulson_, I'm surprised you don't get lot of users complaining about the version ;-)14:56
chrisccoulson_seb128 - i do ;)14:56
seb128they usually tend to do that14:56
mvopitti: hm, I just tried to reproduce on my natty box but I don't get this error14:56
seb128even if the code is the same ;-)14:56
seb128mvo, did you use a non available version?14:56
pittimvo: I don't get it either locally, just in the retracer chroots :/14:56
chrisccoulson_seb128 - it's just not worth a new upload to change the version number ;)14:57
chrisccoulson_i'll probably do it before release, but it means i have to upload a new tarball too14:57
chrisccoulson_and they're big ;)14:57
pittimvo, seb128: the version is fine, the chroot jsut doesn't have any deb-src14:57
pittibut I tried that locally as well14:57
seb128pitti, which makes it "non available" ;-)14:57
pittiin fact this is the only apt-get call that I have in apport14:57
pittithe rest is python-apt14:57
pittibut when I wrote that, there was no python-apt way of downloading a source package14:58
pittioh, I figure installing debug packages somehow causes it to act up14:59
pittiafter logging into the chroot it works14:59
pittibut not after retracing something (which installs packages)14:59
pittimvo: is there a python-apt way of doing apt-get source?14:59
kenvandinepitti, overlay-scrollbar uploaded15:00
pittimvo: so it's not really your fault, just the new apt seems to have become a lot more sensitive to broken packages15:00
pittikenvandine: \o/ thanks15:00
mvopitti: sorry, on the phone, I follow up in a minute15:03
pittiok, not related to apport-retrace after all, the chroots previously had an older apt, and as soon as I upgrade to things fall over15:11
seb128pitti, we can pin the old one for now maybe?15:11
pittiyes, that's what I'll do right now15:11
seb128mterry, one other thing you can to your buglist if you want that would be nice is the gvfs, libgnome-keyring sibabort issue15:17
mterryseb128, bug me?15:18
mterrybug number me rather :)15:18
seb128mterry, the one you opened15:18
seb128mterry, 74349715:18
mterryseb128, heh, I'm a fire and forget bug reporter15:18
seb128mterry, if you don't fix it at least maybe try to open an upstream bug with the debug info upstream mentioned15:19
mterryi'll give it a pass15:19
seb128mterry, upstream is stefw on #gnome-hackers if you want to talk to him about it15:19
pittiseb128: ok, I think I have reasonably clean chroots again with pinned apt; restarting, cross fingers :)15:22
seb128pitti, \o/15:25
pittiseb128: seems to work15:29
pittikenvandine: mind to upload a followup which adds the necessary Replaces:Breaks: (<< 0.1.5-0ubuntu1)?15:33
rodrigo_hey Laney15:33
kenvandinepitti, whoops15:33
kenvandineyeah, sorr15:33
pittikenvandine: (and perhaps fix the overlay-scrollbar desscription while you are at it -- it's not a devel package)15:34
rodrigo_jcastro, ping15:42
jcastrorodrigo_: hi!15:43
rodrigo_jcastro, about http://askubuntu.com/questions/22946/how-do-i-install-the-latest-version-of-gnome-315:43
rodrigo_jcastro, it's better if people just run apt-get dist-upgrade15:44
rodrigo_jcastro, and maybe a separate 'apt-get install gnome-shell' if the want g-shell15:44
jcastrois there one metapackage or does the dist-upgrade just take care of that?15:44
rodrigo_jcastro, dist-upgrade should take care of that15:44
rodrigo_jcastro, that's why we didn't add the metapackage15:44
jcastrook fixed15:45
jcastroI added a scarier warning up top too15:45
kenvandinepitti, uploaded15:45
jcastrosince downgrading looks like, horrible15:45
rodrigo_jcastro, yes, good idea15:45
rodrigo_jcastro, hmm, on the UI, no way to do a dist-upgrade?15:46
pittikenvandine: thanks!15:48
Sweetsharkseb128: Im on bug 720716 . But I will test it with Calc and hope it will work for writer the same way.15:49
* Sweetshark starts on patch 18 for libreoffice packaging.15:50
seb128Sweetshark, you can try to downgrade bamf to 0.2.80-0ubuntu115:50
jcastrorodrigo_: the button works that out as far as I know.15:50
seb128Sweetshark, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bamf/0.2.80-0ubuntu115:50
rodrigo_jcastro, ok then15:51
seb128Sweetshark, if you downgrade it and restart bamfdaemon and unity and let me know if that fixes your issue that would be nice15:51
seb128Sweetshark, well no hurry but when you will have some time15:51
Sweetsharkseb128: heh.15:52
Sweetsharkseb128: but yes, I will try.15:52
ftaseb128, hi, didn't you say last week that the weird locations dialog of the datetime applet was fixed? or did I dream it?15:54
seb128fta, what about it? mterry said that the "no listing any result during typing issue" was fixed15:55
ftaseb128, it's not here, "san francisco" shows nothing between "san" and the "o", then i only get unknown (to me) location, nothing in california15:56
mterryfta, san francisco is a known bug, I believe due to us not sorting by population yet15:57
ftasame for sydney.. it have to add "airport" or "international airport", and i end up with a list of hotels or universities close to those airports :P15:58
ftahence, very long names, making the indicator too wide :P15:59
seb128mterry, is the server limiting the number of returns?16:00
seb128mterry, because http://geoname-lookup.ubuntu.com/?query=san francisco doesn't list it either16:00
mterryseb128, yes16:00
mterryseb128, that's why the filtering and sorting branch should make this a lot better16:00
mterryno more hotels, and better results on top16:00
seb128right, I got those advantage16:00
mterryfta, ^16:00
seb128but I didn't know we were dropping locations because of the lack of sorting16:01
mterryfta, basically, a fix is in, we just wait for it to be deployed server side16:01
mterryseb128, it's a big limit, like 1000 or so, but yeah16:01
mterry(I think, would have to look at code)16:01
seb128mterry, "http://geoname-lookup.ubuntu.com/?query=san francisco" returns a small list16:01
mterryseb128, then maybe the limit is smaller :)16:01
seb128but anyway I will try when the server update is rolled16:01
ftaanother weirdness of that datetime indicator, the calendar. the highlighted/selected day is the day of the last desktop restart (useless imho), it used to be the current day16:03
tedgseb128, Can you mark the appmenu-gtk part of this as Invalid for Natty?  I can't seem to :-/  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wxwidgets2.8/+bug/72237516:04
seb128tedg, done16:05
tedgseb128, Thanks!16:05
seb128fta, known bug as well, karl is working on it16:05
seb128it might be fixed in trunk16:05
seb128tedg, yw16:05
ftamterry, after a restart/reboot, i have to open the locations dialog 2 or 3 times to be able to use it, the 1st call, i get nothing, the 2nd, it disappears immediately, the 3rd time, i see it for a few seconds then pooff, after that it works fine. is that known?16:12
seb128fta, seems like it crashed?16:13
mterryfta, huh...16:13
jcastrorodrigo_: does the dist-upgrade include gnome-shell?16:13
rodrigo_jcastro, no16:13
jcastroor does the user have to install that explicitly?16:13
mterryfta, if you click elsewhere in the dialog, the locations dialog disappears16:13
seb128fta, did you try to start it before being online?16:13
rodrigo_jcastro, so add a 'apt-get install gnome-shell' to the instructions16:13
ftalets see if it crashed...16:14
mvopitti: still in a meeting (its meeting day today). but you can get the urls for the source via python-apt16:14
ftanope: http://paste.ubuntu.com/590294/16:15
mvopitti: I can write some test code in a bit (please kick^Wremind me if I doN't do it)16:15
pittimvo: don't worry for now; apt itself is broken in the chroots, so the python-apt source code retrieval isn't urgent at all16:15
ftaseb128, i'm always online ;)16:16
rodrigo_jcastro, ok, I think they look great now16:17
rodrigo_jcastro, let's see what people report16:17
jcastroI'm asking a guy to test right now16:17
ftadifficult to see anything in .xsession-errors. i wish everything was timestamped16:17
jcastrorodrigo_: I'll watch this with great attention today to make sure it's kept up to date16:18
mvopitti: ok16:18
rodrigo_jcastro, ok, cool16:18
seb128rodrigo_, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evolution-data-server/+bug/75066016:36
seb128rodrigo_, is that the evolution-couchdb issue you fixed the other day?16:36
seb128rodrigo_, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evolution-data-server/+bug/74446416:36
rodrigo_seb128, no, but seems related to a problem rye (on #ubuntuone) is having16:37
seb128rodrigo_, can you add those to your buglist?16:37
seb128seems frequent crashers16:38
seb128rodrigo_, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evolution-data-server?field.searchtext=e-addressbook-factory&orderby=-datecreated16:38
rodrigo_they are duplicates, right?16:38
seb128if you want to review, clean it a bit as well16:38
* rodrigo_ looks for the 2nd one16:38
seb128rodrigo_, they seem similar yes16:38
seb128rodrigo_, let's use bug #744464 for it, I assign it to you16:39
seb128cyphermox, hey16:39
seb128cyphermox, did you say you were working on e-d-s crashers? did you work on those e-addressbook-factory ones? just to make sure rodrigo doesn't start on something you already work on16:39
seb128fta, what about it?16:41
seb128fta, you need to hit 0,0 for the launcher to stick16:41
rodrigo_seb128, wow, lots of e-d-s crashes, I'll go over the list16:43
cyphermoxseb128, I have a merge up for the addressbook ldap bug, looking into the google one now16:45
seb128rodrigo_, those are only the addressbook ones ;-)16:45
rodrigo_seb128, oh :)16:45
seb128cyphermox, ok, I will review and merge that later on, I will probably wait for other fixes before uploading though16:46
cyphermoxrodrigo_, seb128, not necessarily looking at crashers per se, but I'll look at the evo/eds bugs in general to make sure we're not dropping the ball16:46
cyphermoxseb128, sure16:46
seb128cyphermox, thanks16:46
seb128if you stop couchdb or contact synced issue ping rodrigo_ about those16:46
cyphermoxI'd like to include the fix for google if possible, but i think it will be in eds, not evo16:46
rodrigo_cyphermox, ok, leave this list -> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evolution-data-server?field.searchtext=e-addressbook-factory&orderby=-datecreated to me if you want16:48
rodrigo_seb128, along with the evo-couchdb branch I pasted before, can you also merge this https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/couchdb-glib/enable-debug-messages/+merge/56597 ? (already uploaded also)16:49
cyphermoxrodrigo_, ok. well, looks like there may be a few overlaps there -- let me know if down the road you see that we could split them up between us to fix it all ;)16:49
rodrigo_cyphermox, ah, you're looking at those bugs also?16:50
rodrigo_cyphermox, since seb128 said those were only the addressbook crashes, I assumed there are lots of other e-d-s bugs16:50
seb128rodrigo_, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evolution-data-server?field.searchtext=crashed&orderby=-datecreated16:51
seb128rodrigo_, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evolution-data-server?field.searchtext=SIG&orderby=-datecreated16:51
cyphermoxrodrigo_, ok. I was going to look at them, but I'll leave them to you and look at the other e-d-s crashers16:51
seb128rodrigo_, try that url16:51
rodrigo_seb128, why do you make this to me??? :)16:51
rodrigo_lots of crashes man!16:51
rodrigo_cyphermox, yes, unless you want some explicti addressbook ones, leave those to me16:51
rodrigo_there are plenty for both of us :)16:52
cyphermoxyes, there are ;)16:52
rodrigo_cyphermox, do you want me to leave the google related ones to you?16:52
cyphermoxah, up to you16:52
seb128lot of noise and duplicates likely16:52
cyphermoxI was going to ask whether you wanted to look at the issue with google addressbook at the same time16:52
seb128well don't bother cleaning old ones16:52
seb128but seems that most of recents crashes are e-addressbook-factory ones16:53
rodrigo_cyphermox, ok, let's use the last list16:53
rodrigo_cyphermox, ok, let's use the last 2 lists seb128 posted for both of us16:53
rodrigo_cyphermox, just assign to you the bugs you're working on and I'll do the same16:53
seb128those didn't work ;-)16:53
seb128but just type SIGSEGV in the search entry and sort by newest16:54
rodrigo_seb128, hmm, it works for me, 182 bugs16:54
seb128ok great ;-)16:55
seb128well don't try clean the buglists, just try to spot things worth fixing for natty16:55
seb128we have pedro to clean ;-)16:55
seb128hey pedro_! ;-)16:55
seb128I should start running before pedro throw something in my direction ;-)16:56
rodrigo_ugh, we have a lot of patches in the evo package16:58
rodrigo_what do you think about doing some patch upstreaming/cleaning days when natty is released?16:59
rodrigo_it makes upgrading packages a lot harder16:59
cyphermoxrodrigo_, yes, but I think there may be quite a few which are backports17:01
rodrigo_those are ok, as they are removed when we move to the next major version, right?17:01
cyphermoxafaik they should be well identified as such in changelog and even the file name, so when we're at uploading 2.91. whatever or 3.2 we can drop them17:01
rodrigo_yeah, right17:02
rodrigo_I remember in opensuse we had packages with more than 20 patches, so we upstreamed/cleaned a lot of them, and upgrades were much easier17:02
rodrigo_evolution had, iirc, over 100 patches!17:03
Sweetsharkrodrigo_: well, LO still has >500 "shared patches" used by all distros. The 18 patches are just our private debian/ubuntu patches on top of that (some patching the patches).17:24
=== Cimi__ is now known as Cimi
=== smspillaz is now known as smspilla|zzz
seb128dobey, bug #724882 is getting some duplicates recently17:30
seb128rodrigo_, evo doesn't have a lot of distro patches17:31
rodrigo_Sweetshark, ugh17:35
seb128does anybody has interest in geoclue?17:43
seb128bug #73858417:43
seb128hum no bot17:44
seb128that's an assert crash which seens to happen on resume17:44
seb128it's likely not a real user situation issue if it respawn when needed though17:44
seb128kenvandine, cyphermox: ^17:44
seb128if one of you want to have a go to it that would be nice17:45
ryok, i'm using the small apple aluminum bluetooth keyboard, and it's lacking an insert key, i'm wondering how i can make a shortcut to issue "insert" as if i was hitting the key-- like ctrl+shift+i (random example)17:46
ryubuntu 10.10/2.6.35.x/gnome/pc17:47
seb128try #ubuntu for user questions17:47
ryok, thanks17:47
cyphermoxseb128, sure, I'll take that too17:51
seb128cyphermox, thanks17:51
cyphermoxisn't it indicator-datetime which uses geoclue?17:52
bcurtiswxcyphermox, eventually empathy will (i would assume)17:53
cyphermoxbcurtiswx, cool17:53
cyphermoxI know redshift does not, but not in the natty package ;)17:53
cyphermoxnot, = now,17:53
seb128right the indicator use it17:54
seb128mvo, #74137017:59
seb128mvo, it's an aptdaemon bug with quite some duplicates17:59
seb128tremolux, bug #72871318:00
seb128can you check on it? it's a s-c crash with some duplicates18:00
tremoluxseb128: yep, we've been watching that one, I will check on it18:03
tremoluxseb128: thx18:03
seb128tremolux, can you make sure it's assigned to somebody?18:03
tremoluxseb128: yep18:03
dobeyseb128: ok, i'll look at it18:19
nessitapitti: hey there, would you have some minutes? I have a question regarding feature freeze18:37
pittinessita: about to run out, but shoot18:38
seb128nessita, others can reply18:38
seb128just ask18:38
nessitaso, we're having an internal discussion about what is an API change and what isn't. We need to add a new parameter to an internal method in syncdaemon, we're saying is not an API change but others disagree18:38
nessitaso, from our point of view, syncdaemon API is the dbus api only18:39
nessitabut the whole implementation is somehow available in /usr/lib18:39
seb128nessita, well it's an internal api chance, not an external one then?18:39
nessitaseb128: right18:39
seb128is whatever provide the api public?18:39
seb128you say it's in /usr/lib18:39
pittinessita: I think the question here is: can it break anything that both consumers in Ubuntu as well as third-party developers are using?18:40
nessitaseb128: syncdaemon implementation is in ubuntuone/syncdaemon module as a python module, but end users are not supposed to use that18:40
pittinessita: i. e. can they call the function you are about to change?18:40
nessitapitti: they can call it, in the sense that is publicly accessible code18:40
nessitapitti: but anyone is supposed to use those things outside syncdaemon18:41
seb128do you know of anybody using it?18:41
nessitano, I don't18:41
seb128nessita, "anyone" -> "no one"?18:41
pittinessita: i. e. the official API is the d-bus one, and that's also what our ubuntu packages use?18:41
nessitaseb128: yes :-)18:41
nessitapitti: yes18:41
pittinessita: sounds fine to me then18:41
nessitagreat, thanks18:41
pittiPython code is by nature very "open", but that doesn't mean that everything is public API automatically18:42
pittianyway, Taekwondo o'clock, see you tomorrow!18:42
seb128seems like it's a private api not supposed to be used and those who (abu)sed it will get what happens in such cases ;-)18:42
seb128pitti, see you18:42
dobeyi prefer my solution to that problem; just avoid python18:42
nessitapitti: thanks!!!18:42
* nessita hugs seb12818:42
* seb128 hugs nessita18:43
seb128nessita, you trapped me with your u1 btw, even didrocks made fun of me because I share bug screenshots by publishing them on u1 now!18:43
didrocksnessita: you finally won \o/18:44
* nessita happily dances18:47
cyphermoxseb128, I haven't been able to reproduce the geoclue crash, but I guess I have a fix that makes some sense anyway.18:59
cyphermoxi'll do some more testing and checking first though -- but now, lunch time :)19:00
seb128cyphermox, ok thanks19:00
cyphermoxdid you personally experience it?19:00
bcurtiswxseb128, any trivial empathy bugs you've run across?19:28
seb128bcurtiswx, no19:33
bcurtiswxseb128, OK thanks :)19:33
bcurtiswxkenvandine, everytime i bring up the gwibber window it eats CPU, but when its minimized, it doesn't....20:03
bcurtiswxseen this?20:03
kenvandinebcurtiswx, does it keep eating CPU while it is up?20:03
bcurtiswxonly when the window is unminimized20:03
bcurtiswxit takes a little bit too, but it does eventually20:04
bcurtiswxyup, now at 100% CPU20:05
bcurtiswxmaybe since i have a refresh rate in the quick end... seems to me20:05
kenvandineyou mean the gwibber client window right? not the lens?20:05
bcurtiswxi dont' use the lens20:06
kenvandinei can't see why the client would use CPU20:06
kenvandineit doesn't do anything, except when it gets the signal to refresh the WebView20:06
bcurtiswxhmm, i have a lot of services it checks with facebook having a TON of friends.. i wonder if its shear quantity causing it..20:07
bcurtiswxwhich is my own fault TBH20:07
bcurtiswxi need less friends... <hangs head in shame>20:07
bcurtiswxyup thats it, gwibber-service on a refresh20:08
bcurtiswxkenvandine, ^^20:09
kenvandineoh, it isn't the client then20:09
kenvandinerickspencer3, fix for bug 739923 being uploaded now :)20:09
bcurtiswxyes, sorry for the lack of -service :X20:09
kenvandinebcurtiswx, how big is your db?20:09
kenvandinels -lah ~/.config/gwibber/gwibber.sqlite20:10
kenvandinethat is why :)20:11
kenvandinewhat version of gwibber?20:11
kenvandinethat number should be much lower20:11
kenvandinehow many accounts do you have?20:11
bcurtiswxTwitter, Facebook, Identi.ca20:11
kenvandineit should keep the latest 2000 posts for each account20:12
kenvandineand purge the rest20:12
kenvandineso it shouldn't be nearly that big20:12
kenvandinebcurtiswx, can you post your log somewhere?20:12
bcurtiswxsure, which log?20:13
bcurtiswxkenvandine, sent in IM20:15
kenvandinegot it20:15
kenvandinedude... what is your interval set to?20:17
* kenvandine should really cap the interval at like 5 or 10m20:17
kenvandinei've added protect in so it doesn't overlap anymore, but you still have basically a constant state of refreshing20:18
kenvandinebcurtiswx, ^^20:19
bcurtiswxkenvandine, 1 O:-)20:19
kenvandineplease bump that up20:19
bcurtiswxkenvandine, OK20:20
kenvandinepitti, do you think i would need a FFE to prevent people from setting their refresh interval so low?20:20
kenvandinein gwibber that is20:20
kenvandine1) change the selector in preferences so it bottoms out at 5m and migrate existing settings of less than 5m to 5m20:21
kenvandinethis intervals i think cause a fair number of problems20:21
bcurtiswxkenvandine, can i play devils advocate for a minute?20:22
bcurtiswxthere's a lot of us that like quick refresh rates, (like the auto-updating twitter).. is saving 2000 really needed?20:23
kenvandineyeah... you'd be surprised how few that is20:23
kenvandineregardless though... it isn't about how much is being saved20:23
kenvandineyour are beating on it constantly20:23
kenvandinemultiple parallel threads download data, doing stuff with it and insert/updating the db20:24
kenvandineand as soon as it is done, it does it again20:24
bcurtiswxkenvandine, what causes the high CPU? it has to read the 2000 and do something with it?20:24
kenvandinemultiple parallel threads... blah blah20:24
kenvandineit is the refreshing20:24
kenvandineand actually a db that big doesn't cause a problem for the service20:25
kenvandinenot CPU wise20:25
bcurtiswxwell, if i delve any deeper into the cause we'll get into stuff that can be mentioned at UDS (so i won't go any further). :)20:25
kenvandineit was causing slowness for the client though20:25
kenvandinei think regardless of any future improvements, preventing intervals < 5m would alleviate a fair bit of pain20:27
kenvandinebcurtiswx, i have ideas how we can get the twitter realtime feed pretty easily for 3.220:27
kenvandinewe'll talk about that at UDS20:27
bcurtiswxkenvandine, i can't wait to be involved then :)20:28
bcurtiswxi agree, no need to argue <5 mins should be discouraged for natty :)20:29
* kenvandine prepares a branch with the interval tweak20:30
rickspencer3bug #73992320:38
kenvandinerickspencer3, the bot isn't very happy now21:03
kenvandinerickspencer3, the pango_overlay thing in GwibberPosterVBox :)21:03
kenvandinerickspencer3, after i get out of this meeting, i'll post an example21:08
nperryAre you aware of   gnome-icon-theme-symbolic: Depends: gnome-icon-theme (< 2.92) but 3.0.0-0ubuntu1~build1 is installed.21:14
nperryIN the gnome3 stack?21:15
nessitahi there, any ideas why a launchpad build is failing with:22:00
nessitadpkg-deb: error: control directory has bad permissions 700 (must be >=0755 and <=0775)22:00
dobeynessita: ask on #launchpad instead22:03
cyphermoxnessita, there is something about umask being discussed on #ubuntu-devel, seems like it might be relevant22:31
chrisccoulson_tedg, did mterry's changes to dbusmenu to provide a menu closed signal ever land?22:35
chrisccoulson_i couldn't find it here, unless i just need to update my machine ;)22:35
tedgchrisccoulson_, Honestly, I'm loosing track.  I think so :-)22:35
nessitacyphermox: thanks!22:35
tedgchrisccoulson_, This week the parser side should land, but I dont' think you'll need that.22:36
chrisccoulson_tedg - yeah, i don't use the parser22:38
* nessita -> eods23:22

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