[15:31] <Nivex> I know it's not recommended, but how much of a problem would it be to upgrade to current_release+2 by hand with apt?
[16:10] <holstein> Nivex: lol
[16:10] <holstein> as long as reinstalling from scratch doesnt scare you in any way as a backup plan
[16:10] <holstein> i say go for it
[16:11] <holstein> usually, i have my stuff backed up, and only do the verion upgrades as a test
[16:11] <holstein> when they work, i usually still end up re-installing
[16:11] <holstein> installing from CD these days takes like 15 minutes
[16:12] <holstein> upgrading.... that still takes a while
[16:12] <holstein> sometimes 6 or 7 hours
[16:38] <Nivex> holstein: well the other option is go to n+1 then n+1+1
[16:38] <Nivex> takes longer, but is safer
[16:40] <holstein> i find only safety in lucid ;)
[16:42] <Nivex> that's what I'm still running on my laptop and netbook, but there are some improvements in the newer kernels that would be nice to have in those environments
[16:42] <holstein> like?
[16:42] <holstein> im testing some kernels for ubuntustudio
[16:42] <holstein> in maverick and natty
[16:42] <Nivex> I was going to upgrade to maverick but the annoying Alt modifier bug in vte that still isn't solved stopped me
[16:43] <holstein> i think we are really close to just having the -generic kernel do the job :)
[16:43] <holstein> so far, theres no show stoppers for lucid for me
[16:44] <holstein> i have a very nice PPA for audio apps
[16:44] <holstein> i use*
[16:44] <Nivex> I upgraded my media PC because I wanted the newer players, and the backports (specifically VLC) wanted to bring along a bunch of core stuff, so I figured I might as well
[16:55] <Nivex> hmm, looking back over the kernel stuff, the helpful stuff is in .37 and .38, which is why I'm looking at natty.  .37 gets SMP improvements on ext4 and .38 gets the process queueing "wonder patch"
[17:09] <holstein> Nivex: maybe before reinstalling or upgrading
[17:09] <holstein> you coule just try that kernel in lucid
[17:21] <akgraner> holstein, I've been using test drive this week and installing/updating and trying out various versions of 11.04
[18:14] <holstein> akgraner: cool
[18:14] <holstein> i just updated my natty install last night
[18:14] <holstein> testing a couple kernels for ubuntustudio with firewire
[18:15] <holstein> akgraner: whaddaya think?
[18:16] <akgraner> oh cool
[18:16] <akgraner> I haven't tested ubuntustudio yet
[18:16] <akgraner> however I am about to snag GNOME 3.0 and check it out
[18:17] <holstein> akgraner: we're just on gnome2 for now
[18:17] <holstein> talking about maybe XFCE for 11.10
[18:17] <holstein> no reason to test it really
[18:18] <holstein> we are also kicking around a live CD/DVD
[18:18] <holstein> hopefully by 12.04
[18:18] <akgraner> GNOME 3.0 released today and from the screen shots I saw it's looking sweet
[18:18] <akgraner> plus I am digging Unity now...so what the heck
[18:21] <holstein> unity is looking good
[18:21] <holstein> its not for me though
[18:21] <holstein> im not liking the launcher bar hiding right now
[18:21] <holstein> but, they got some time :)
[18:23] <akgraner> nods
[18:23] <akgraner> I think hiding is part of it though
[18:23] <akgraner> when not in use it goes away
[18:23] <akgraner> to keep the desktop clean
[18:23] <holstein> sure
[18:24] <holstein> but, i thought it was a crash for a couple minutes
[18:24] <holstein> til i figured out what to hover over
[18:24] <holstein> and then, how exactly to hover over it to get it fully back
[18:24] <holstein> not very intuitive
[18:55] <akgraner> nods
[18:55] <akgraner> I was frustrated the first time I tried it in Alpha 2 I think
[18:55] <akgraner> so then I waited til Beta 1 and life is good now :-)
[18:56] <holstein> well, im running 10.04 on everything important
[18:56] <holstein> so im not worried :)
[18:56] <holstein> ill figure something out by 12.04
[18:56] <holstein> im really missing fluxbox these days
[18:56] <holstein> it just took *so* long to get it all tweaked out the way i wanted it
[19:07] <akgraner> :-)  who is working on fluxbox these days
[19:07] <akgraner> paultag I think
[21:06] <holstein> akgraner: paultag is helping us with ubuntustudio right now :)
[21:11] <Nivex> I thought OpenBox was the current incarnation of that line
[21:13] <holstein> Nivex: flux is still around
[21:13] <holstein> ive only used openbox with LXDE
[21:13] <holstein> not really the same thing
[21:13] <Nivex> I miss WindowMaker from time to time
[21:13] <holstein> :)
[22:00] <_marx_> hum, afterstep and fluxbox
[22:20]  * _marx_ dl'd natty beta last night fixin' to do a vbox install now
[23:15] <akgraner> holstein, paultag is awesome!