[04:11] ailo, i'm hoping to test the -generic and -lowlatency kernels tomorrow morning before anyone wakes up [04:11] ailo, any suggestions on what you would like to see? [04:11] ScottL, You mean 2.6.39? [04:11] ailo, any specifics you might want? [04:11] yes for the -lowlatency 2.6.39 [04:12] i don't even know if 2.6.39 -generic is available at this point [04:12] They were built wrong, so they are actually -generic kernels [04:12] oh, okay, maybe not then [04:12] ScottL, They are a little unstable too. I get some crashes with them, so it might be a good idea to wait a little [04:13] i'll wait, i'll spend the time playing with the ubuntustudio plymouth theme and see if i can suss out why it isn't working (at least for me) [04:14] ailo, someone filed a bug about -controls not building for natty, i kinda laughed a little when i read that [04:15] ScottL, The original -controls? [04:15] i'll respond to the bug report to say that -controls are no longer in the natty seeds and report the state of -controls [04:15] ailo, i expect the original -controls [04:16] bug 756080 [04:16] Launchpad bug 756080 in ubuntustudio-controls (Ubuntu) "ubuntustudio-controls version 0.4.7build1 failed to build on i386" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/756080 [04:16] i might just change the importance at this point so nobody gets worried about something that isn't even going on the image for natty [04:17] maybe this is because of the new gcc, maybe not, just thinking about all the trouble falktx has been having [04:17] ScottL, I can take that bug, if you don't mind, since I'm already doing two others on that [04:20] ailo, oh sure :) [04:20] ailo, if you can't change the importance just let me know [04:22] ScottL, That I can't. But, I did change it to invalid, and made a comment [04:24] Though, perhaps invalid is not right, after all? [04:59] i'm not really sure myself [05:02] ScottL, I will take another look later. At least I will have to explain why it shouldn't be built for Natty. [05:02] Unless, one is changing the source [05:03] And, what is that they are building? It's python, so he must only be trying to build the package [05:08] ScottL, I deem it invalid, because he is trying to build a package for Natty that won't be included in Natty. [05:46] hello folks [05:54] Hey Kokito [06:03] hey ailo [06:03] sup? [06:09] not much ailo [06:10] relaxing after having a good plate of spinach ravioli for dinner [06:11] * ailo had some waffles before with coffee, while working on some puredata code [06:15] ailo: am I right to assume that you are somewhere in Europe? [06:17] Kokito, Gothenburg, Sweden [06:17] Kokito, Kokito sounds Japanese [06:18] ah, cool. I am in northern California, about 100km east of San Francisco [06:18] ailo: Kokito is the diminutive of Koki, which was my nickname when I was a child :) [06:19] although I am kind of half-Japanese, not ethnically, but in spirity, because I lived there for about 23 years :) [06:20] Kokito, Wow. Then you must be. I find there is some resemblance between my country men and Japanese people. I'm really a Finn, but grew up in Sweden. [06:21] No samurais in Finland, though [06:22] hehe :) [06:23] I did hear something to the effect that finns and Japanese have some commonalities, but I am not sure what they are [06:25] Kokito, The language is somewhat similar. But, not directly. Also, there are some cultural peculiarities that show in statistics. Higher suicide rate amongst other things [06:26] The language may be related, but the trail goes back really far. Turkish and Japanese are probably related, and Finno-Ugric is probably related to Turkish [06:27] The grammatics is what makes them similar [06:30] interesting [06:31] that would make it easy for me to learn the Finnish language then :) [06:33] Kokito, I would think so. They are phonetically similar too. I saw a Japanese comedy show where they would call up Finnish people using a phone book, laughing at their last names, cause they meant something funny in Japanese [06:34] Kokito, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QeCOzpYXrKE [06:35] * Kokito is watching [06:35] ailo: it is funny [14:13] ailo, gnome3 "superkey and start typing app name" way of opening a file has good things and bad things [14:13] to start firefox was quick :) [14:13] to start terminal was not :( [14:14] for firefox i hit "super" "fire" and pushed the enter key...viola, firefox was up -> nice :) [14:14] for terminal i hit "super" "terminal" and pushed enter....booo, i got terminal services -> argh :( [14:15] I was able to use the word terminal, and it's searching at the same time I type, on Unity. I can then use the arrows to choose the terminal [14:15] i tried "super" "terminal" tab key, then enter (thinking it might jump over to terminal from terminal services...didn't work [14:15] ah, didn't try the arrow key, i can do that after it installs the studio packages [14:15] The lauchers appear under the search field for me [14:16] But, I would want those functions to be even smarte [14:16] smarter* [14:16] it does under gnome3, just in the small panel on the left instead of the main screen [14:16] Also, I realized that I need to choose a category, before apps that weren't installed appear as search results. [14:16] if i'm going to the trouble to take my hand of the mouse i want to make sure i can complete my task without putting it back on the mouse :/ [14:17] I feel I can do that, but not with perfect smoothness [14:17] i'm still leaning towards the thought that having a small set of definable icons that the use can change their visibility based on a "category" that only requires one click (perhaps two at most) to launch an applicaiton is better, faster, easier [14:18] I don't feel one needs to exclude the other, but I don't know what quick-launcher-bars will work under these systems [14:19] wbar didn't seem to work under Unity [14:19] i'm also worried that the gnome3 that i'm using is a generation or so behind the gnome3 that was released this week [14:20] therefore, to make an accurate test of gnome3 i might have to wait until it is released properly for natty [14:21] Waiting for Alpha 1 is a long wait. One would want to try on the system before that, but then it won't probably be very stable. [14:23] but i would hope it's feature set would be more complete, even if unstable [14:24] i just realized that i did not just try to search for gnome3 packages in synaptic while under natty, i kept trying "tutorials" on the web that suggested various PPA's [14:24] i might find gnome3 just under synaptic in natty now :P [14:25] ScottL, Since Gnome3 will include the classic desktop, that is also an option for Oneiric [14:25] At least, I think it will include it [14:29] that's a good question, it's unfortunate that shuttleworth and the "inner circle" aren't very vocal about what their direction is :/ [14:30] i suppose it is possible that they don't have a definitive directions and are waiting to see how things "develop" (sorry for the pun) [14:31] ScottL, I'm sure they need some user experience [14:32] i don't know, i'm starting to read some criticism of canonical not including community in decisions from quarters that have been, unto now, quite biased towards ubuntu/canonical [14:33] i don't want to be misunderstood, i believe wayland is a good move ultimately, x is old and retains crap loads of legacy code [14:34] but i don't like being blindsided by some of the decisions, especially when we are trying to develop an officially recognized flavour of ubuntu [14:34] It's like they are being a little bold, and making waved. I hope this will lead to faster progress. After all, the changes seem to be pretty big [14:34] waves* [14:35] right [14:35] but my point is that if they are making long term decisions, it would be nice to be involved slightly, even if just a courtesy email as a "head up" [14:36] i realize we are such a niche flavour, we don't get mentioned much in magazines unless it's a special about ubuntu studio, i routinely see the rote "ubuntu, kubuntu, xubuntu, mythbuntu" tag [14:37] but i also wonder how much consideration the other flavours received in the decision making process, i'm presuming not much [14:37] which i understand for kubuntu and xubuntu for the most part, they use different DE's [14:38] Yeah, don't think KDE is affected in any way. [14:38] And perhaps not XFCE either [14:40] if we could get the documentation in order and really, really organized and effective [14:40] if we could update the website so that it is suave and new and compelling [14:41] if we could blitz the media with emails, blogs, maybe even interviews (and i mean even emailing published magazines) [14:41] even sending emails to linux outlaws, canonical or jono [14:41] i think we could step up respect for ubuntu studio [14:41] get more people involved and active [14:41] ScottL, It would be really great if Oneiric was a release where US turns a leaf and becomes a truly well supported multimedia system [14:42] but the distro would need to be lean, efficient, and effective [14:42] ailo, yes, it would [14:42] :) [14:42] ScottL, I'm on the boat and determined to get documentation and -controls in order. [14:42] that's awesome! [14:43] i really, really, really (really!) appreciate you involvement [14:43] you and old holstein are the two most involved people [14:43] alessio is too, but it's rather specific of course ;) [14:44] if we could get a better grip on the other multimedia parts of studio i bet i could even setup an interview with libre grahics magazine [14:44] ScottL, Well. I'm really happy to be involved. Once you see what needs to be done, you just to get it done. The unfinished work is like a bad dream, you want to get rid of ;) [14:44] they have already offered us a full-page advert for free :) [14:45] ailo, aye, it's the "getting it done" part that troubles most people [14:45] they have good intentions but it seems that most of them require someone to tell them how to do it step-by-step [14:45] which is not bad if it's one or two people :P [14:46] This time around, I'm ahead of what I need to know in order to work things out. Natty was too much at once for me [14:46] So, I can forgive myself on account of that [14:46] lol, yeah it was a lot to do in one cycle :) [14:48] hmmm, i just realized that i probably broke my gnome3 install by installing ubuntustudio-default-settings [14:48] it will try to adjust the menu and panels :( [14:48] i should have just installed ardour and let it pull in the required dependencies :/ [14:49] ScottL, Did you see Ralfs last post? I think he might be warming up on the idea of using a preempt kernel without the realtime patch :P [14:49] Since Rui had good things to say about it, if nothing else [14:49] i saw that i had email and that he was one of them [14:50] ralf seems very smart, just seems to have some trouble interfacing with people sometimes [14:52] He has an unusual way of getting his point across. [15:02] he certainly seems very, very knowledgeable [15:31] eh, all the studio apps installed okay on gnome3, but it's still a pain to switch between the apps [15:33] but of course that is the gnome3 on maverick which may not be the best testing platform [15:43] ScottL, If I have an objection against Unity (and will have to try Gnome3 to find out) its' not being able to switch apps easily. [15:44] I use Alt + Tab, but it's a little slow and hard to identify the open windows [15:44] I would rather it just brought up a window on top, instead of showing a list of small windows [15:45] I'll be gone for most of the day. See you later.. [23:47] evening [23:52] ScottL: ping