| === CensoredBiscuit is now known as sadface | ||
| === sadface is now known as CensoredBiscuit | ||
| === CensoredBiscuit is now known as Gorbachev | ||
| === Gorbachev is now known as CensoredBiscuit | ||
| === API is now known as Guest31307 | ||
| AlanBell | Pendulum: should be an email from yaili to approve in a sec | 12:06 |
|---|---|---|
| Pendulum | ok | 12:08 |
| Pendulum | AlanBell: do you mean to the ML? | 12:09 |
| Pendulum | because I don't have ML access | 12:09 |
| Pendulum | *admin | 12:09 |
| AlanBell | ah, ok | 12:09 |
| AlanBell | just TheMuso who is asleep | 12:10 |
| AlanBell | yaili: did it get held for approval? | 12:10 |
| TheMuso | Whats up? | 12:11 |
| AlanBell | oh, not asleep! | 12:12 |
| TheMuso | Nope. | 12:12 |
| TheMuso | Its 9:12PM here atm. | 12:12 |
| AlanBell | should be a mail to the mailing list from Inayaili | 12:13 |
| AlanBell | or will be soon | 12:13 |
| TheMuso | ok thanks. | 12:13 |
| * AlanBell says G'day to TheMuso | 12:14 | |
| TheMuso | I appreciate a heads up like that, because the vast majority of stuff that hits the moderatino queue is spam, and I have a habbit of dumping the entire lot, even though there was a legit message in there that I do remember seeing. | 12:14 |
| TheMuso | Ok coming through any minute. | 12:16 |
| AlanBell | the thrust of the mail is that yaili will be going through some ubuntu.com changes with us at 2:30 UK time (that is in 2:15 from now) | 12:17 |
| Pendulum | AlanBell: I did just get the mail :) | 12:17 |
| Pendulum | UndiFineD: hajour ^^ | 12:17 |
| TheMuso | Right, I'll be in bed by then. | 12:17 |
| * AlanBell is off out for lunch, laters all | 12:18 | |
| === jackneill is now known as Jackneill | ||
| yaili | AlanBell: hello? | 14:38 |
| AlanBell | hello | 14:39 |
| yaili | AlanBell: shall we do this? | 14:39 |
| AlanBell | yes, lets | 14:39 |
| AlanBell | Pendulum: charlie-tca o/ | 14:40 |
| charlie-tca | good morning | 14:40 |
| yaili | ok, so the gist of this is that we're redesigning some sections of ubuntu.com and we know there's been some problems with accessibility | 14:40 |
| yaili | although we can't make all the changes necessary to improve the site, as we're dealing with a lot of legacy code and bad implementations | 14:41 |
| yaili | it's time we have a proper chat about the main issues that have been identified | 14:41 |
| yaili | and take a quick look at the the new designs to see what concerns you might have regarding that | 14:41 |
| yaili | does this make sense? | 14:41 |
| Pendulum | hiya | 14:41 |
| AlanBell | does to me | 14:41 |
| Pendulum | yaili: just as an FYI, this is a logged channel | 14:41 |
| hajour | o/ | 14:42 |
| yaili | yes, AlanBell informed me :) | 14:42 |
| Pendulum | (someone pointed out that I should make sure you knew it had public logs) | 14:42 |
| yaili | Pendulum: thanks :) | 14:42 |
| Pendulum | sounds good to me :) | 14:42 |
| hajour | sorry just awake | 14:42 |
| yaili | right, so here is one of the new designs, not 100% finalised, mind you: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/103530/features-overview-12.png | 14:43 |
| yaili | two notes: 1. the font size has been increased to 13px, we still can't make sizes relative for this release | 14:43 |
| yaili | the background has been changed, and I know you've had concerns with the contrast before | 14:44 |
| yaili | most of the text is on white though, and with the font size increase I'd like to know a bit more about this issue, if possible | 14:44 |
| AlanBell | text on white is good | 14:45 |
| UndiFineD | hello | 14:45 |
| yaili | something we thought about was alternate stylesheets, does anyone have an opinion on these? | 14:46 |
| yaili | UndiFineD: hello | 14:46 |
| Pendulum | I like alternate stylesheets :D | 14:46 |
| charlie-tca | That reads much better | 14:46 |
| hajour | is the font size able to increase more?/ | 14:46 |
| yaili | Pendulum: what do you think would be important on an alternate stylesheet? | 14:47 |
| Pendulum | yaili: choice of font size and a couple options for colour combinations | 14:47 |
| yaili | hajour: what do you mean? make it larger overall? or is it in %s or ems? | 14:47 |
| Pendulum | for example, there's a condition called Irlen's Syndrome where you can't read a white background so a pale purple (or even a very pale orange) is better | 14:47 |
| hajour | app for to be able choose colour and front sizes | 14:48 |
| Pendulum | also, on the main theme, is there any way to make the white on orange text stand out a little more? | 14:48 |
| yaili | Pendulum: you mean on the navigation? | 14:48 |
| UndiFineD | it is tough to be WCAG compliant, but alternate stylesheets would help | 14:49 |
| hajour | the orange need to be darker if you use white fonts.i could not read it and still not | 14:49 |
| yaili | hajour: I think we're trying to move away from white on orange, especially for big blocks of text | 14:50 |
| UndiFineD | she finds that a big relief | 14:50 |
| yaili | UndiFineD: when we were looking at the palette, we did test this colour combination, on Snook's contrast checker, and it passes all 3 levels, what I was told is that automatic tests are of course not the same as a user with visual impairments | 14:51 |
| UndiFineD | yeah it absolutely depends on the individual | 14:52 |
| Pendulum | yaili: yes | 14:53 |
| hajour | sorry i am saying to UndiFineD what i want to say.my meds do not wwork yet and its very hard to write now and i write very slow now | 14:53 |
| yaili | hajour: no worries | 14:53 |
| hajour | so UndiFineD write what i say sometimes | 14:53 |
| yaili | hajour: ok | 14:54 |
| yaili | ok, so I think we have an idea of what the biggest issues on the site are, font-resizing, colour contrast | 14:55 |
| yaili | but that's the visual layer | 14:55 |
| yaili | do you have any comments regarding the actual markup? | 14:55 |
| yaili | we know that it isn't as clean as we'd like | 14:56 |
| charlie-tca | The line starting with overview? Is that really a line of links in black text? | 14:56 |
| yaili | also, we need to create a proper print style sheet :) | 14:56 |
| UndiFineD | hajour, is having difficulties reading sentences after one another | 14:57 |
| yaili | UndiFineD: yes, that has been left as it is now. I think we'll need to do some testing because we're afraid thos emight go unnoticed | 14:57 |
| yaili | UndiFineD: which sentences? | 14:58 |
| charlie-tca | There is no change of contrast to define the links vs text at all? | 14:58 |
| UndiFineD | Super-fast and great-looking, Ubuntu is a secure, intuitive operating system that powers desktops, servers, netbooks and laptops. Ubuntu is, and always will be, absolutely free. | 14:58 |
| yaili | so, except for navigation, which still needs to be sorted, the links rationale is orange is it's headings, loose text, etc., if it's inline with text, we're adding a bottom border, rather than underlined, but I don't think that is visible in this mockup | 14:59 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: ^ | 14:59 |
| UndiFineD | yaili, you just lost hajour | 15:00 |
| UndiFineD | to much in one sentence | 15:00 |
| yaili | UndiFineD: in the homepage of the current site? | 15:00 |
| charlie-tca | The links appear to be much smaller fonts the the text, which is going to make them much harder to read | 15:00 |
| UndiFineD | no in your previous sentence | 15:00 |
| yaili | UndiFineD: oh sorry, I'll make them shorter :( | 15:01 |
| UndiFineD | :) | 15:01 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: correct, thanks for pointing that out, making a note | 15:01 |
| charlie-tca | What is the possiblity of looking at maybe bold fonts for links? | 15:02 |
| yaili | what is your view on in-browser alternate style sheets vs. in-website? | 15:02 |
| UndiFineD | yaili, and what about spoken text ? | 15:02 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: it might be an option | 15:02 |
| yaili | UndiFineD: what do you mean? | 15:03 |
| charlie-tca | If it allows me to have the text grow better, and change the links to something visible, I have no preference on where or how it happens. | 15:03 |
| UndiFineD | so a visitor can listen to the text on the site | 15:03 |
| charlie-tca | Does in-browser style sheet mean I could easily change things to make it easier for me, individually? | 15:04 |
| UndiFineD | pages should be read as a book | 15:04 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: I think with in-browser you basically have a few options of different style sheets | 15:05 |
| hajour | blind people need on this moment very much help to install ubuntu. if you make a spoken audio or vid. they dont need so much help to go read or they use ubuntu | 15:05 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: you change it in the View option, I think, for example in Firefox | 15:05 |
| yaili | hajour: on the install page? | 15:06 |
| charlie-tca | That would be fine, if those who need it the most can get to it easily. | 15:06 |
| hajour | this also is needed on the install page | 15:06 |
| charlie-tca | There seems to be something that says "if you really need this, we will hide it for you". | 15:06 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: what do you mean? | 15:07 |
| AlanBell | there are some strange links in the tab order on ubuntu.com around the banner slider thing | 15:08 |
| yaili | AlanBell: ah I see | 15:08 |
| charlie-tca | If there is an alternate style sheet in the browser, and those with visually disability have to search all over to find it, we are catering to the able body person. | 15:08 |
| AlanBell | just going through it in firefox with orca | 15:08 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: I see | 15:09 |
| charlie-tca | It leave the partially blind with the difficulty of trying to search for it | 15:09 |
| yaili | AlanBell: the homepage is being redesigned too | 15:09 |
| hajour | is there a option to choose style sheet ? i not have found it . | 15:09 |
| charlie-tca | hajour: doesn't exist yet | 15:10 |
| hajour | a ok | 15:10 |
| charlie-tca | If we make an alternate style sheet, it should be very easy to find | 15:10 |
| hajour | o and a spoken audio like spoken book by classes info should be very nice to | 15:12 |
| yaili | in Firefox that is under View > Page Style | 15:12 |
| hajour | i also mean by the program classes | 15:12 |
| yaili | hajour: can you think of a website that does that nicely, it would be good to see good examples | 15:13 |
| hajour | i don't think its somewwhere allready | 15:13 |
| charlie-tca | Should that happen, I would hope the reference for it would be on this page also. | 15:14 |
| hajour | but it would be awesome if it would come by ubuntu | 15:14 |
| yaili | :) | 15:14 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: you mean the homepage? | 15:14 |
| charlie-tca | Yes, sorry. Where you have the paragraph about accessibility being there, a sentence about style sheets in the browser would be helpful. | 15:15 |
| charlie-tca | (if it comes about) | 15:15 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: so if we do add one or a couple of alternative stylesheets, what colour combinations do you think should take priority? low contrast, high contrast, …? | 15:16 |
| charlie-tca | I would think we want low contrast, high contrast, and high contrast inverted to start with | 15:17 |
| charlie-tca | That gives combinations that cover about 90% of the visually disabled | 15:17 |
| leoquant | : http://www.nvbs.nl/ lees voor | 15:18 |
| UndiFineD | yaili, I am in the process of developing these pages: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7607669/SC/index.xhtml | 15:18 |
| leoquant | or uitgebreid voorlezen | 15:18 |
| === Cheri703_ is now known as Cheri703 | ||
| UndiFineD | nice example leoquant | 15:18 |
| UndiFineD | that page reads to the user | 15:18 |
| UndiFineD | at "lees voor" | 15:18 |
| yaili | thanks | 15:19 |
| hajour | is there also a english version from that? | 15:19 |
| hajour | you need to ppay for that leoquant | 15:20 |
| leoquant | hajour, sure, there are also sites how to build audio into websites | 15:20 |
| hajour | ok nice | 15:20 |
| hajour | because we can understand that but many from ubuntu don't | 15:21 |
| leoquant | hajour, you need to be a member to play the read/audio part of the site? hmmm | 15:21 |
| yaili | have you had any problems with using different browsers? | 15:21 |
| hajour | the search engine would be more improved | 15:22 |
| yaili | hajour: ah yes, that is on the list :) | 15:22 |
| yaili | it is terrible | 15:22 |
| hajour | its very hard to find a wiki from a person. | 15:22 |
| charlie-tca | yaili: yes, different browsers are an issue. Firefox is the overall best one so far. | 15:23 |
| charlie-tca | midori did away with the menu bar | 15:23 |
| hajour | also it costed me very much time to find the pages from classes | 15:23 |
| charlie-tca | chromium is failing badly | 15:23 |
| charlie-tca | epiphany I haven't tried this release | 15:23 |
| hajour | for example | 15:23 |
| hajour | last from chromium had freeze very often my notebook. | 15:24 |
| leoquant | <hajour> you need to ppay for that leoquant thats not true by the way | 15:24 |
| hajour | because of that i could not do internet banking | 15:24 |
| hajour | it says by me for to be able to use that you need to pay 32 euro a year leoquant | 15:25 |
| hajour | i now only use firefox at the moment | 15:26 |
| leoquant | no you could hear the info without costs, i hear it loud and clear | 15:26 |
| hajour | yes the info from what it do | 15:26 |
| yaili | hajour: we've been testing on Firefox 3+, Safari, Chrome, Opera—latest versions, IE6+ | 15:27 |
| yaili | not everything looks exactly the same though, surely | 15:27 |
| hajour | the problem whit chromium comes on the moment there comes a frame in a frame | 15:27 |
| hajour | then the trouble start | 15:28 |
| hajour | i think its a problem whit some older pc s and notebooks | 15:28 |
| hajour | because my daughters use unbuntu and i lubuntu . | 15:29 |
| hajour | we have the same problems whit chromium browser | 15:29 |
| hajour | so it have nothing to do with lubuntu | 15:29 |
| hajour | i have test it out | 15:29 |
| yaili | I need to go soon, if you had to list the top 3 things that could be improved in our sites | 15:30 |
| yaili | re: accessibility | 15:30 |
| yaili | what would those be? | 15:30 |
| hajour | the only one here at home who had not that problem was UndiFineD but he cot a new pc | 15:30 |
| charlie-tca | as they exist or that new page? | 15:30 |
| hajour | 1 app for choose colour fonts. | 15:31 |
| hajour | 2 audio hit explane how to install ubuntu | 15:31 |
| hajour | 3 possibility choose sdtyle sheet | 15:31 |
| charlie-tca | resizable page, instead of fixed width | 15:31 |
| charlie-tca | contrast between text and background | 15:31 |
| hajour | good one charlie-tca | 15:32 |
| charlie-tca | When I grow the fonts big, the fixed width page screws the text readability up | 15:32 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: do you mean setting the width in relative size or making it go full width? | 15:32 |
| hajour | o and i hope you go try to get audio by classes info . | 15:32 |
| charlie-tca | Making the width variable, so when text grows to, say 25 or 30pt, I don't have words split between lines because the page is too narrow | 15:33 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: but if the CSS is made well enough, will the split lines be a problem? | 15:34 |
| hajour | yes that problem i have to charlie-tca | 15:34 |
| yaili | because sometimes wouldn't the user want to just resize the text? | 15:34 |
| UndiFineD | 1. stylesheets, 2. fontsize, 3. spoken text | 15:34 |
| yaili | without adding horizontal scrolling? | 15:34 |
| charlie-tca | yes, because the a long word won't fit the narrow page, no matter how good the css is | 15:34 |
| hajour | and that can be solved by not use so much long lines | 15:35 |
| charlie-tca | try hitting Ctrl++ about 10 times on the page | 15:35 |
| hajour | and not attache lines to each other | 15:35 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: is that a scenario that happens often? | 15:35 |
| charlie-tca | yes | 15:35 |
| hajour | also do not use to much difficult english words. | 15:35 |
| charlie-tca | My minimum fonts are set to 16pt now | 15:35 |
| charlie-tca | and yet, many times, I have to zoom to see the words | 15:35 |
| hajour | not all people who want to use ubuntu can read very good english | 15:36 |
| UndiFineD | yaili, http://achecker.ca/checker/index.php | 15:36 |
| hajour | size 16 here to | 15:36 |
| charlie-tca | Your page is written in 12 and 13pt fonts, I have to start at 16pt | 15:36 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: so you think the horizontal scrolling that comes with completely zoomed in pages is not a problem in itself? | 15:36 |
| charlie-tca | The horizontal scrolling is not as much of a problem as a word that splits itself into two lines | 15:37 |
| charlie-tca | It is very hard to read words that are not all on the same line. | 15:37 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: ok | 15:37 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: I see | 15:38 |
| charlie-tca | it is like reading ac | 15:38 |
| charlie-tca | ce | 15:38 |
| charlie-tca | ss | 15:38 |
| charlie-tca | or | 15:38 |
| charlie-tca | ie | 15:38 |
| charlie-tca | s | 15:38 |
| yaili | hajour: you said "i hope you go try to get audio by classes info" | 15:38 |
| yaili | hajour: I don't understand :( | 15:38 |
| hajour | yes | 15:38 |
| hajour | people who want to learn design or program by example . but not can read good or have eye problems. use on schools sopken books | 15:39 |
| hajour | in classes in ubuntu all comes later on wiki s for remember | 15:40 |
| hajour | but very hard to read for a part of the people | 15:40 |
| UndiFineD | Known Problems(10) Likely Problems (0) Potential Problems (468) HTML Validation (0) CSS Validation (562) | 15:40 |
| Pendulum | hajour: that's not really the same issue as what we're talking about with the website. | 15:41 |
| hajour | it will make the wall smaller to walk over.for to do more in ubuntu.and get the feeling to can help really more | 15:41 |
| charlie-tca | yaili: I apologize if I am come across as just complaining. | 15:41 |
| UndiFineD | Known Problems(4) Likely Problems (25) Potential Problems (364) HTML Validation (0) CSS Validation (562) | 15:41 |
| UndiFineD | that is from WCAG and Stanca Act | 15:42 |
| hajour | for to be able learning by eexample solve bugs | 15:42 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: not complaining, you're being helpful | 15:42 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: I have to apologise because we won't have time to make many of these changes in time for release, but we want to know what we should include in our plans | 15:42 |
| charlie-tca | If we can get some things done, we are happy for the most part. | 15:43 |
| hajour | btw yaili try to make why tto use ubuntu in so easy as possible english words.a child must be able to read it.ubuntu is world wide. | 15:43 |
| yaili | in terms of the background/contrast, is there a more reliable tool that we can refer to? | 15:43 |
| UndiFineD | yaili, I think it is already great having you here, it means things can improve | 15:43 |
| charlie-tca | We just find it frustrating when we can't read the official website without great difficulty | 15:43 |
| erkan^ | which software can I install for a speaking training ? | 15:43 |
| hajour | not all people can read good english | 15:44 |
| charlie-tca | I have not found any reliable tool for contrast. | 15:44 |
| charlie-tca | AlanBell: do you know of any? | 15:44 |
| yaili | UndiFineD: thanks :) | 15:44 |
| erkan^ | Over two days come guidedog-school and guide dog on visit by me | 15:44 |
| AlanBell | charlie-tca: it can probably be done with compiz filters | 15:44 |
| hajour | sorry for having so much remarks on the site yaili | 15:47 |
| yaili | hajour: no, I think we should be sorry :) you've been trying to help and providing feedback, we just need to start incorporating that in the processes rather than making it an afterthought | 15:48 |
| yaili | oh | 15:48 |
| yaili | sorry for the long line :( | 15:48 |
| hajour | np my meds starting to work and it is going some easier now | 15:49 |
| hajour | also typing.its still not very fast because i type whit only 1 finger | 15:50 |
| UndiFineD | yaili, as I pointed out with the checker, there are many issues with the current css for ubuntu.com | 15:50 |
| UndiFineD | the html issues are mostly easily resolved | 15:50 |
| === jono_ is now known as jono | ||
| yaili | UndiFineD: yes, that's something we need to do gradually though, as it is tied with the implementation of drupal, and that needs to be updated | 15:51 |
| yaili | UndiFineD: same for CSS, as you can see it's importing many unnecessary style sheets | 15:52 |
| yaili | so no online contrast checker that is reliable? that would be extremely helpful… | 15:53 |
| UndiFineD | yaili, http://achecker.ca/checker/index.php | 15:53 |
| UndiFineD | that helps me a lot | 15:53 |
| yaili | UndiFineD: ah of course, thanks :) | 15:53 |
| UndiFineD | it also checks for contrast a bit | 15:53 |
| hajour | UndiFineD, is also busy to make a full accessible website for speechcontrol :) | 15:54 |
| yaili | :) | 15:54 |
| yaili | ok, I need to go now, this was great, thank you | 15:56 |
| hajour | o for i forget Pendulum i can be less around tomorrow because i need to arrange things like meds passport and passport for to go to uds in may | 15:56 |
| yaili | I'll be on the channel anyway | 15:57 |
| UndiFineD | yaili, feel free to drop back in any time | 15:57 |
| hajour | i hope i have helped | 15:57 |
| yaili | UndiFineD: sure | 15:57 |
| yaili | hajour: immensely, thanks | 15:57 |
| charlie-tca | yaili: thanks for giving us the opportunity to discuss this with you | 15:57 |
| hajour | ok nice .was a lisstle felling like only complaining :) | 15:57 |
| hajour | little i mean | 15:57 |
| hajour | bah i not must try to type faster | 15:58 |
| yaili | hajour: no worries :) | 15:58 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: thanks! | 15:58 |
| charlie-tca | I agree, hajour | 15:58 |
| Pendulum | yaili: thank you so much for coming! | 15:58 |
| charlie-tca | It is very difficult to discuss such things without feeling like I am complaining more than helping. | 15:58 |
| yaili | Pendulum: thank you :D | 15:58 |
| hajour | thank you for listen yaili | 15:59 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: well, on my side, I feel like we could do a lot more, baby steps :) | 15:59 |
| yaili | you'll have to bear with us | 15:59 |
| charlie-tca | We will try to be patient | 15:59 |
| hajour | btw yaili if the accessibility is better i am able to get ubuntu to be used by primary schools 18 from it in netherland | 16:00 |
| hajour | for to start | 16:00 |
| charlie-tca | I think it is a lot to throw at you, and yet, we sometimes feel like things are crawling too slow. | 16:00 |
| yaili | charlie-tca: so do we, there's things we can definitely do more easily than others | 16:01 |
| yaili | well, I'm off for today, have great day, and thanks | 16:02 |
| hajour | because i am also busy to get schools go use ubuntu/edubuntu | 16:02 |
| hajour | ok have a nice day by yaili | 16:03 |
| hajour | erkan^, you allready had get a answer on your question from which software to use for speaking training ? | 16:18 |
| erkan^ | fyes | 16:18 |
| erkan^ | *yes | 16:18 |
| erkan^ | sorry | 16:19 |
| erkan^ | no, hajour | 16:19 |
| hajour | sorry for the delay in answering erkan^ but needed to concentrate wile my meds not where working almost | 16:19 |
| erkan^ | i don't care, i have seen that you had busy with another cliënt speak (-: | 16:20 |
| charlie-tca | erkan^: the guide-dog is great news for you | 16:20 |
| hajour | ok just wanted to let you now the reason erkan^ :) | 16:20 |
| erkan^ | yes, that is quick. i thought that next years , charlie-tca (-: | 16:21 |
| hajour | yes very good that you get a guide dog erkan^ | 16:21 |
| erkan^ | I will wait normal 2 years , but i take a guide dog after 11 mouths | 16:21 |
| charlie-tca | Wonderful! | 16:21 |
| hajour | what can the guide dog do for you out side the walking part | 16:22 |
| hajour | erkan^, ^ | 16:22 |
| charlie-tca | Sometimes things do work out for us. | 16:22 |
| erkan^ | commando | 16:22 |
| hajour | by example ? | 16:22 |
| erkan^ | yes, but i have problem speak --> commando )-: i take a logopedie. but i want on computer too for speaking traing | 16:23 |
| erkan^ | over, vooraan, links, rechts, rechtsom, ook naam noemen, enzovoort | 16:23 |
| erkan^ | zoek paal | 16:23 |
| hajour | UndiFineD, says congrats erkan^ | 16:23 |
| erkan^ | thank you :) | 16:23 |
| erkan^ | but first see or i and guide dog fit good | 16:24 |
| hajour | charlie-tca, and AlanBell is there already a speak program what is able for simple commands to speak out ? | 16:25 |
| hajour | yes i understand erkan^ | 16:25 |
| erkan^ | (-: | 16:26 |
| hajour | we still wworking on speechcontrol erkan^ | 16:26 |
| erkan^ | yes i know | 16:27 |
| hajour | when you will need it erkan^ ? | 16:27 |
| erkan^ | but i want simple speaking, without difficult words | 16:27 |
| erkan^ | no idea, next week i have an appointment with a logopedie | 16:27 |
| hajour | yes i have ask for that above erkan^ :) | 16:28 |
| erkan^ | above? | 16:29 |
| hajour | just stay logged in erkan^ they read back later | 16:29 |
| hajour | eerder in chat / hier boven = above erkan^ | 16:30 |
| erkan^ | ja | 16:30 |
| erkan^ | hajour: I'm going to eat soon afterwards I go to visit. I'm at about 9 hours back, okay? | 16:31 |
| charlie-tca | hajour: I don't know the applications that well. | 16:32 |
| hajour | ok erkan^ then i am also around again.i need to go to cook so | 16:32 |
| AlanBell | yaili: thanks very much (sorry, got called away for a bit at the end) | 16:33 |
| erkan^ | ok (-: | 16:33 |
| yaili | AlanBell: no worrries | 16:34 |
| hajour | and ok charlie-tca :) | 16:35 |
| erkan^ | i go eat now laters | 16:35 |
| === JasonO_ is now known as JasonO | ||
| === JasonO_ is now known as JasonO | ||
| === API is now known as Guest2711 | ||
| erkan^ | I am back (-: | 20:14 |
| erkan^ | oh nee ik ga effe wasmachine aanzetten brb (-: | 20:14 |
| erkan^ | hajour, | 20:29 |
| erkan^ | ik ben terug | 20:29 |
| erkan^ | (-: | 20:29 |
| erkan^ | en ? | 20:29 |
| erkan^ | oeps sorry for dutch | 20:29 |
| erkan^ | I remember | 20:29 |
| erkan^ | I am back | 20:29 |
| erkan^ | and ? | 20:29 |
| erkan^ | (-: | 20:29 |
| hajour | hi erkan^ | 20:31 |
| hajour | i do not know what kind of software you need .thats why i had asked it to AlanBell | 20:32 |
| hajour | maybe he knows it erkan^ | 20:33 |
| hajour | but he is on away | 20:33 |
| hajour | charlie-tca, ddo you know who erkan^ can asked it about the software? | 20:34 |
| charlie-tca | AlanBell knows the software the best | 20:34 |
| hajour | btw i am very tired and i just was preparing to go to sleep | 20:34 |
| charlie-tca | Ask him specifically here, he will probably answer before long | 20:35 |
| hajour | erkan^, see charlie-tca answer | 20:35 |
| hajour | sorry all but i ggo sleeping | 20:35 |
| hajour | goodnight | 20:35 |
| erkan^ | ok | 20:36 |
| erkan^ | goodnight, hajour | 20:36 |
| erkan^ | charlie-tca, : http://www.intaal.nl/site/intaal_shopprod.php?artcode=400001 | 20:36 |
| erkan^ | 370 euro :/ | 20:36 |
| hajour | goodnight erkan^ :) | 20:36 |
| === Cheri703_ is now known as Cheri703 | ||
| AlanBell | then hi all | 20:37 |
| Pendulum | o/ AlanBell | 20:39 |
| charlie-tca | Hello, AlanBell | 20:39 |
| charlie-tca | Is there any software for speech therapy/learning? | 20:39 |
| AlanBell | what sort of speech therapy? | 20:40 |
| charlie-tca | learning how to speak | 20:40 |
| AlanBell | for children? or for fixing a speech impediment? | 20:41 |
| charlie-tca | Teaching a spoken language | 20:41 |
| charlie-tca | erkan^: ^ ^ | 20:41 |
| erkan^ | yes | 20:42 |
| charlie-tca | what are you trying to do? learn spoken words? | 20:42 |
| AlanBell | teaching an adult a foreign language? | 20:42 |
| charlie-tca | I think he has to learn a few spoken commands for a guide dog | 20:43 |
| erkan^ | AlanBell: Over two days come a guide dog visit by me. I want learn that I can speak words as left, right, go, stop, etc. i have a software on computer need, than can computer control or i speak good. i am deaf too. i have a speech teacher too, but i want a software on pc. | 20:43 |
| erkan^ | yes charlie-tca | 20:43 |
| AlanBell | ok, so you can see, but are deaf? | 20:44 |
| charlie-tca | and needs to learn simple word speech | 20:44 |
| erkan^ | i can littel see | 20:44 |
| erkan^ | but on computer i have not problem | 20:44 |
| erkan^ | yes i am deaf AlanBell | 20:44 |
| erkan^ | have you expierence with deaf people, AlanBell ? :S | 20:45 |
| AlanBell | some people use Audacity for some speech therapy work, mainly copying others and dealing with stutters and stammers and timing issues | 20:46 |
| AlanBell | I used to work with a deaf person and one of my friends has deaf parents | 20:47 |
| erkan^ | ok | 20:47 |
| AlanBell | and when I set up astoryforbedtime.com there was quite a bit of interest from the deaf community which surprised me | 20:47 |
| AlanBell | but deaf parents really liked the idea of their kids listening to a mixture of voices of hearing people | 20:48 |
| AlanBell | because speech development for CODAs is often a bit disrupted even if the children have no hearing issues | 20:48 |
| erkan^ | i know CODA | 20:49 |
| AlanBell | Child Of Deaf Adult for those not familiar with the abbreviation | 20:50 |
| erkan^ | i ask you | 20:50 |
| erkan^ | can deaf people learn speak for a software on computer, AlanBell ? | 20:50 |
| AlanBell | really not sure | 20:51 |
| erkan^ | easy speak example "left" "right" etc.. | 20:51 |
| erkan^ | ow ok | 20:52 |
| maco | i suspect youd need something that tells you how to position your lips and tongue and which ways to move them | 20:52 |
| maco | (i find that useful when im learning another language and can't figure out how to make my mouth form the sounds necessary for the language) | 20:53 |
| erkan^ | when I speak, my voice probably deaf language :-S | 20:54 |
| JanC | speech command software can work with whatever sound you make, as long as you have a different sound for every command | 20:56 |
| JanC | but learning to say things correctly is also useful when you are around other people of course ;) | 20:58 |
| AlanBell | I would expect a dog would be able to reprogram itself too :) | 20:58 |
| erkan^ | JanC, ik wil een eenvoudige woorden kunnen oefenen zoals links, rechts, vooraan, stop enzovoort zonder zin uitspreken, want de zin is erg ingewikkeld voor me. )-: | 21:00 |
| JanC | I guess you can see if you say it more or less right by comparing the sine waves (e.g. in Audacity, like AlanBell said) of a recording of yourself and a correctly pronounced version | 21:04 |
| AlanBell | nah, that won't work | 21:04 |
| AlanBell | you would be able to visually see volume and timing, tone is more detailed than you can do in your head | 21:05 |
| JanC | hm, maybe after applying some "effect" on the data? | 21:06 |
| AlanBell | well if you did a fast fourier transform you would be able to see the component sine waves (roughly speaking) but it isn't really going to help you learn to copy or say a particular waveform | 21:08 |
| AlanBell | http://manual.audacityteam.org/man/Analyze_Menu | 21:12 |
| AlanBell | http://manual.audacityteam.org/man/Track_Drop-Down_Menu | 21:14 |
| AlanBell | all interesting stuff that I am sure a therapist could use, but I don't think it is stuff that you can use to self-teach easily | 21:14 |
| JanC | well, he's not going to self-teach I think, but wants to use it in between or after sessions with his speech therapist? | 21:17 |
| JanC | I remember the audio lab at the college where I worked for some time had expensive Windows software :-( | 21:18 |
| JanC | and of course it was written for Win 9x :P | 21:19 |
| === JasonO_ is now known as JasonO | ||
| erkan^ | I go sleep now | 21:22 |
| erkan^ | i am tired | 21:22 |
| === erkan^ is now known as zippo^ | ||
| === zippo^ is now known as erkan^ | ||
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