=== asac_ is now known as asac
=== edwardc_ is now known as edwardc
[04:12] <hyperair> could someone sponsor libgpod's sync please? bug #755566
[04:12] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 755566 in libgpod (Ubuntu) "Sync libgpod 0.8.0-2 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/755566
[04:15] <RAOF> hyperair: Would you mind adding my less-CPU-use patch to the Banshee packages? (I can do the work, I just want your ack)
[04:27] <TheMuso> hyperair: I see you don't have an FFE for that version of libgpod...
[04:27] <TheMuso> ...unless its in another bug, but I thought they would have to be the same bug.
[04:31] <hyperair> RAOF: i don't mind, but do get it upstream first.
[04:31] <hyperair> TheMuso: it's a bugfix release. do i need a FFe for that?
[04:31] <RAOF> hyperair: Done!  In master and 2.0 branch.
[04:31] <hyperair> RAOF: ooh nice. gimme a commit hash to cherry-pick
[04:31] <TheMuso> hyperair: Having not read the docs for a while, I am not 100% sure.
[04:32] <hyperair> TheMuso: well, i don't think i need an FFe ^_^
[04:32] <hyperair> TheMuso: besides, libgpod 0.7.9x versions were prerelease versions.
[04:32] <RAOF> hyperair: rfb9cb9970cb0 on the stable branch.
[04:32] <hyperair> 0.8.0 is the final for that series
[04:33] <RAOF> hyperair: Also, rcdff2efe2575, but that's rather more cleanupy.
[04:33]  * hyperair wishes RAOF would drop the r
[04:34] <hyperair> now i can't double click on the hashes
[04:34] <hyperair> >_>
[04:34] <RAOF> cdff2efe2575 fb9cb9970cb0
[04:34] <hyperair> er why do those commits have almost identical commit messages? O_o
[04:35] <hyperair> oh wait, nevermind
[04:35] <hyperair> dobey: !
[04:38] <RAOF> DBO: You're looking for http://cgit.freedesktop.org/xorg/lib/libX11/commit/?id=fd85aca7a616c595fc17b2520f84316a11e8906f
[04:40] <DBO> RAOF, the problem is we dont *use* x in threads
[04:40] <DBO> like at all...
[04:41] <DBO> unless a client lib is doing it
[04:41] <DBO> which I would really hope is NOT the case
[04:43] <DBO> RAOF, you wanted to put this in the right channel, dont flip back :P
[04:44] <DBO> RAOF, so what else could be going on
[04:44] <DBO> the symptoms are identical
[04:44] <DBO> its just, we dont have the thread
[04:45] <DBO> RAOF, come to think of it, I think the 1.4.2 update makes things *worse*
[04:45] <DBO> since neil randomly started whining today
[04:45] <DBO> after he updated
[04:46] <RAOF> Could you downgrade and check if it still happens?
[04:46] <RAOF> That would obviously make narrowing it down easier :)
[04:47] <DBO> well I am not saying 1.4.2 is the trigger
[04:47] <DBO> I only just upgraded
[04:47] <DBO> but it might make things worse
[04:49] <RAOF> Well… if it's deadlocking, can you work out which lock it's waiting on?  gdb should be a helpful bunny here.
[04:49] <DBO> how can I work that out with gdb
[04:50] <DBO> keep in mind I know nothing of xcb
[04:50] <DBO> I mean I guess the thing is
[04:50] <DBO> i would assume locks in xcb to be re-entrant!
[04:51] <RAOF> I'm not sure whether they are or not, but thats a pretty dangerous assumption ;)
[04:53] <RAOF> What's your backtrace on the deadlock, by the way?
[04:56] <DBO> so thats kinda the weird thing
[04:56] <DBO> I have seen deadlocks in XQueryKeymap, XGetWindowProperty, and XGrabPointer
[04:56] <DBO> they all eventually end up in _XReply
[04:56] <DBO> and then into _poll
[04:57] <DBO> RAOF, ^^
[04:58]  * RAOF isn't sure if that's actually a deadlock.
[04:58] <RAOF> And is reading the relevant code.
[04:58] <DBO> well
[04:58] <DBO> it gets stuck in _poll
[04:58] <DBO> forever
[04:58] <DBO> which is somewhat annoying
[04:58] <RAOF> Right.
[04:59] <RAOF> Incidentally, I've seen something like this in DRI2WaitForMSC which I thought was a driver problem.
[04:59] <DBO> XCB went full retard there too?
[05:01] <RAOF> Well, compiz was blocked waiting in _poll in _XReply…
[05:01] <DBO> yeah!
[05:01] <DBO> thats the bug!
[05:01] <DBO> its *retarded*
[05:01] <RAOF> Got a quick way to reproduce?
[05:02] <DBO> always takes 9 months at teh quickest
[05:02] <DBO> maximize/restore windows a lot
[05:02] <DBO> that gets it for some people
[05:02] <DBO> you can also try spaming the super button to open/close teh dash fast
[05:09] <DBO> RAOF, ^^
[05:09] <DBO> gotta remember to ping the man, hes probably busy :P
[05:10] <RAOF> DBO: A winner is me
[05:10] <DBO> you discover the fixes?
[05:10] <RAOF> No, but maximising and minimising the IRC window certainly causes the deadlock :)
[05:13] <DBO> I find that less exciting than a fix
[05:13] <DBO> I fixed that deadlock in trunk btw
[05:20] <RAOF> Hm.  That doesn't actually *look* much like a deadlock, unless xcb needs to be *writing* to the other side of that fd in poll..
[05:21] <DBO> RAOF, it *acts* like one
[05:21] <RAOF> Yeah.  xcb is waiting for something to happen on the other side of the connection.
[05:22] <DBO> RAOF, what exactly?
[05:22] <RAOF> It's possible that the problem is something like some other reader has read that, ignored it, and X is waiting for a reply before sending anything new.
[05:22] <DBO> ?
[05:22] <DBO> how would that be possible?
[05:22] <DBO> without a second thread
[05:22] <DBO> there is no chance for another reader to get in there and discard data
[05:23] <RAOF> No idea.
[05:23] <RAOF> Possibly xcb *itself* is accidentally discarding stuff.
[05:23] <DBO> well uhhhh... fix it
[05:23] <RAOF> Possibly the X server is incorrectly ignoring the client.
[05:24] <DBO> it causes freezing :P
[05:24] <RAOF> Right.
[05:25]  * RAOF tests mesa fixes, then gets right on it.
[05:25] <DBO> i dont really think you can fix this one... but if you do I will donate all my owed beers in your honor next UDS
[05:26] <DBO> even if we can fix and SRU this
[05:57] <DBO> RAOF? any clues?
[06:44] <RAOF> DBO: Sorry, there.  IRC bouncer flaming destruction and a mesa build / test cycle happened.
[06:53] <DBO> RAOF, so
[06:53] <DBO> any clues?
[06:53] <DBO> because you know
[06:53] <DBO> I assume you have simply dropped everything to work on this
[06:53] <DBO> thats really the best possible outcome for me
[06:54] <RAOF> Well, will “shortly to drop everything to work on this” suffice?  There's a beta 2 freeze pending that I want to be sure I've got everything uploaded before :)
[07:18] <pitti> Good morning
[07:20] <RAOF> Howdie pitti.
[07:20] <TheMuso> Hey pitti.
[07:26] <pitti> hey RAOF, hey TheMuso, how are you?
[07:27] <pitti> RAOF: sorry for pushing, but do you think we can get in mono by the freeze?
[07:27] <TheMuso> Well thanks.
[07:27] <TheMuso> robert_ancell: Are ou working on yelp 3.0.1 at all?
[07:27] <TheMuso> you
[07:27] <robert_ancell> TheMuso, was going to
[07:28] <TheMuso> Ok thanks.
[07:28] <robert_ancell> pitti, hey, did you look at the freedesktop sound theme package I asked you about?
[07:28] <pitti> robert_ancell: I remember replying to a bug about a missing sound with a question
[07:29] <pitti> it's been a while
[07:29] <robert_ancell> pitti, ok thanks, I'll dig around.  I must have missed the email
[07:29] <RAOF> pitti: By beta 2 freeze?  I thought it wasn't a priority for b2?
[07:31] <pitti> RAOF: right, not a blocker, just a question :) (the earlier, the better)
[07:31] <pitti> robert_ancell: AFAIR the options were to add the missing sound to ubuntu-sound or to seed the entire fdo theme?
[07:31] <robert_ancell> pitti, yes, with the latter being the easiest
[07:31] <chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
[07:35] <pitti> hey chrisccoulson
[07:35] <chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
[07:35] <pitti> chrisccoulson: pretty well, thanks! great work on your Sunday shift!
[07:35] <chrisccoulson> heh, thanks :)
[07:37] <chrisccoulson> pitti - although, i didn't quite get everything finished that i wanted to. i wanted to try and fix bug 749450 for b2, but i still haven't figured out what's going on
[07:37] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 749450 in Global menubar extension "Problem with bookmark menu in Firefox 4 : changes in bookmarks do not appear in menu before restarting FF" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/749450
[07:38] <zyga> morning :-)
[07:38] <pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, there's still time post-b2
[07:38] <RAOF> hyperair: Oh, are you planning to upload banshee before the freeze?  AKA: please upload banshee :)
[07:39] <chrisccoulson> pitti - cool, thanks. i'll try and figure that one out today anyway. would be nice to get fixed as the bookmarks manager is the only way of editing bookmarks now (as we can't drag menuitems around in the appmenu)
[07:39] <hyperair> RAOF: i need to wait for gio# and libgpod.
[07:39] <chrisccoulson> so i should make sure that works properly ;)
[07:39] <hyperair> RAOF: gio# has been synced, but not libgpod.
[07:39] <hyperair> pitti: would you be kind enough to sponsor the libgpod sync? =)
[07:40] <pitti> hyperair: already picked it up from scrollback, will get to it soon
[07:45] <hyperair> pitti: ah, alright, thanks.
[08:00] <Sweetshark> morning all!
[08:01] <pitti> hey Sweetshark, how are you? had a nice weekend?
[08:10] <Sweetshark> pitti: yes, had some nice BBQ at friends who have cats and a ~1 year old kid. Its great to be there for an evening as I like cats (but am allergic to them, so I cant stay with them to long). With kids its the same: its cool to play with them, esp. if you do not have to do all the work ;)
[08:11] <pitti> Sweetshark: heh, I know the feeling when visiting my niece and nephew :)
[08:12] <pitti> we had our first BBQ this year as well
[08:12] <pitti> got pretty cold later on, but the fire helped :)
[08:12] <TheMuso> On the other side of the globe, we had a weekend of pleasant warm Sydney days, likely our last really warm weather till next pring.
[08:14] <didrocks> good morning
[08:14] <pitti> TheMuso: finally we can steal some sun from you :)
[08:14] <pitti> bonjour didrocks, ca va? had a nice weekend?
[08:15] <didrocks> pitti: yeah, excellent one, thanks! Some walks in the forest with a fantastic weather :)
[08:15] <didrocks> and you?
[08:15] <pitti> didrocks: sounds great! we went for some kiting (was pretty strong wind here), had our first BBQ, and also went downtown for some urgent shopping
[08:16] <pitti> and the usual pre-freeze Sunday afternoon shift :)
[08:16] <pitti> didrocks: oh, btw
[08:16] <pitti> didrocks: I did a commit to unity-place-{apps,files}, so please pull before today's upload
[08:16] <pitti> didrocks: or won't they be uploaded, and I should just do it now?
[08:17] <TheMuso> pitti: Yeah I am ready for cooler weather, although I do like this time of year, days are warm enough, but nights are cool enough to enjoy being rugged up in bed.
[08:17] <didrocks> pitti: they won't be places uploads, just compiz/nux/unity
[08:17] <pitti> didrocks: ok, I'll upload them then; they just drop the libzeitgeist-gio recommends
[08:17] <didrocks> pitti: oh? why? /me checks
[08:17] <pitti> didrocks: libzeitgeist-gio doesn't exist any more
[08:18] <didrocks> oh right, we put that in libgz a while ago when syncing back, hum, should have spotted that, sorry
[08:18] <pitti> didrocks: no problem at all
[08:18] <pitti> I just did some NBS cleanup last night
[08:24] <micahg_> is compiz supposed to be eating up one of my cores?
[08:26] <RAOF> micahg_: Yeah.  It's trying to keep you warm!
[08:26] <DBO> micahg_, get a trace, see whats doing it
[08:26]  * TheMuso is around for a while, so am happy to help with upload sponsoring to get things prior to the freeze.
[08:26] <TheMuso> Get things in.
[08:29] <Laney> a no-change rebuild of banshee would be good, to pick up the new gio-sharp which fixes a nasty leak
[08:29] <TheMuso> I believe there are other banshee bits in the works as well.
[08:30] <micahg_> DBO: will have to do in the morning, need to get pidgin up before the freeze
[08:31] <pitti> Laney: I can do that now, unless TheMuso knows about other urgent stuff for banshee?
[08:32] <TheMuso> pitti, RAOF and hyperair were talking about it earlier.
[08:32] <TheMuso> I think RAOF had some CPU related fixed, and hyperair was planning an upload once libgpod was synced etc.
[08:32] <pitti> Laney: would that actually work right now, since the publisher is broken?
[08:32] <TheMuso> s/fixed/fixes/
[08:32] <hyperair> Laney: wait a while. raof wants some patch in.
[08:33] <RAOF> hyperair: And you've got the package ready to upload, right?
[08:33] <hyperair> nope
[08:33] <Laney> well, if it happens before the freeze
[08:33] <hyperair> i'm kinda at work at the moment
[08:33] <Laney> otherwise we can just merge -2 later
[08:33] <pitti> RAOF, Laney: I suggest to explicitly build-dep against the new gio-sharp to ensure that it'll depwait until the mirroring problem is fixed
[08:33] <hyperair> when is the freeze?
[08:33] <Laney> today sometime
[08:33] <pitti> 0900 UTC
[08:33] <hyperair> bleh
[08:33] <hyperair> 5pm here huh
[08:33] <RAOF> 7pm here.
[08:33] <hyperair> i thought i had more time. >_>
[08:34] <RAOF> Heh.  So, you'd like me to prepare that package then :)
[08:34] <hyperair> yes please
[08:35] <RAOF> Laney: What's the gio-sharp version with the fix, so I can appropriately version the build-depends?
[08:36] <Laney> 2.22.3-1
[08:37] <Laney> it's not strictly necessary, which is I guess why it wasn't added
[08:37] <Laney> (and it was uploaded/built yesterday so I guess you'll get it anyway)
[08:37]  * Laney swooshes off to work
[09:01] <rodrigo_> morning
[09:03] <pitti> hey rodrigo_
[09:06] <rodrigo_> hi pitti
[09:09] <Sweetshark> Does anybody know were the annoying completion behaviour of our bash cames from? typing 'ls $HOME/Down<TAB>' results in 'ls \$HOME/Downloads'. That is it completes the path correctly, but escapes the variable-dollar fubaring all further completions and the path itself, which is really annoying ....
[09:34] <pitti> Sweetshark: hm, happens even without bash-completion, so it's bash itself
[09:37] <Sweetshark> pitti: Hmmm, then I must dig out a bashrc that prevents that. I gotta have that somewhere ...
[09:48] <xclaesse> How can I revert to usable scrollbars in ubuntu natty? I asked already and someone said to have LIBOVERLAY_SCROLLBAR=0 in ~/.xprofile but that does not seems to work
[09:49] <pitti> xclaesse: remove the liboverlay-scrollbar-0.1-0 package?
[09:51] <njpatel> pitti, jason fixed the resize bug with the edge reveal :)
[09:51] <pitti> \o/
[09:51] <pitti> DBO: ^ *hug*
[09:51] <DBO> :)
[09:52] <njpatel> pitti, also, got a +1 from design about the implementation so a few more translation fixes and we're good to go I think
[09:52] <DBO> which si good
[09:52] <DBO> because my sanity is fading
[09:52] <DBO> fast
[09:52] <njpatel> of what little was left
[09:52] <DBO> haha
[09:52] <njpatel> :)
[09:52]  * pitti giggles about http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity/new-options/revision/1104
[09:52] <pitti> I was indeed complaining about that one :)
[09:53] <njpatel> pitti, UnJason'ing strings? :)
[09:53] <xclaesse> pitti, ah cool, I though that would remove ubuntu-desktop too because of deps, but that seems recommended and not depend.
[09:53] <xclaesse> great
[09:53] <pitti> xclaesse: right
[09:53] <pitti> these things are another sore spot right now, as they are so horribly inconsistent
[09:54] <xclaesse> and since it is a gtk module as I understand, I wish ubuntu good luck to patch OOo, firefox, etc
[09:54] <xclaesse> as if there were not already enough work to patch them for the macos menu
[09:55] <pitti> *sigh* indeed
[09:55] <chrisccoulson> well, firefox is no bother, seeing as the appmenu work will land upstream
[09:56] <chrisccoulson> and they've already expressed interest in the scrollbar work too
[09:57] <xclaesse> chrisccoulson, for firefox mobile, makes sense
[09:59] <chrisccoulson> pitti - is there any chance we could get bug 438868 in to -updates soon please? (i know you're already busy enough with natty work too though ;) )
[09:59] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 438868 in kile "Numerous applications have focus issues after emerging from a screensaver or suspend" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/438868
[09:59] <chrisccoulson> it's breaking firefox 4 quite badly and i keep getting users reporting bugs and complaining to me about it ;)
[10:01] <Sweetshark> pitti: http://opengrok.libreoffice.org/xref/writer/sw/source/filter/ww8/ww8graf.cxx#1917 <- something to giggle at (unless you have to maintain that code)
[10:02] <pitti> Sweetshark: heh, nice comment
[10:02] <pitti> chrisccoulson: it's 6 days now, so without special arrangements it would go into -updates tomorrow
[10:03] <pitti> chrisccoulson: I can move it now if you know that a lot of people tested it
[10:04] <chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, it seems like a few people have tested it (and jo has been running it here for a few days too)
[10:05] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, bug 740126 is driving me crazy now
[10:05] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 740126 in compiz (Ubuntu) "compiz hangs randomly several times per day" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740126
[10:05] <Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: tmux is my way of keeping sane ...
[10:09] <zyga> dpm, ping
[10:09] <seb128> pitti, bug #740848 got some duplicates recently not a stopper but might be worth watching
[10:09] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 740848 in udisks (Ubuntu) "udisks-daemon crashed with SIGABRT in g_udev_marshal_VOID__STRING_OBJECT()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740848
[10:10] <seb128> chrisccoulson, is that an xorg or unity bug?
[10:10] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - not sure where it is tbh
[10:11] <didrocks> dpm: hey
[10:11] <pitti> seb128: thanks, I'll have a look
[10:11] <chrisccoulson> all i know is that compiz hangs frequently, and sometimes killing it after it's hung screws up X
[10:11] <chrisccoulson> it normally hangs every few times i close my laptop lid, but it did it just a few minutes ago whilst i was working too
[10:11] <dpm> hey didrocks :)
[10:11] <chrisccoulson> it did it probably a dozen or so times yesterday ;)
[10:12] <seb128> did that start recently?
[10:12] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - it's been doing it for a while. i reported it on 22nd march, but i can't remember exactly when it started
[10:12] <didrocks> dpm: we are going to get few new strings in unity today (desktop files and new binary)
[10:13] <didrocks> dpm: it's linked to a FFe
[10:13] <didrocks> dpm: I'll subscribe you to it when I get a chance
[10:25] <dpm> didrocks, thanks for the heads up
[10:26] <didrocks> yw
[10:36] <dholbach> hey
[10:37] <dholbach> does anyone know if bug 663001 is easy to fix?
[10:37] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 663001 in libubuntuone "My Downloads page shows incorrect status for songs with some non-English characters" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/663001
[10:37] <dholbach> is it a matter of using unicode instead of normal strings or something? O:-)
[10:48] <seb128> dholbach, you should check with the u1 guys
[10:48] <seb128> rodrigo_, you want to ctrl-l on list :p
[10:48] <seb128> (why people keep replying to the submitter directly on list discussions)
[10:55] <rodrigo_> seb128, sorry, it's just I forget, I always reply to all on lists
[10:55] <rodrigo_> seb128, will do it next time :)
[10:56] <seb128> rodrigo_, thanks ;-)
[10:56] <vish> Sweetshark: hi,re: Bug 753584, I'm not sure why you attached your screenshot, i think the reporter is talking about MIME icons, i might re-color those LibO MIME icons in Humanity colors, does copyright allow that? so if you know the copyright it would be great.. i know nothing about copyrights ;)
[10:56] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 753584 in humanity-icon-theme (Ubuntu) "New Libre office icons are used in the launcher but not in Nautilus / Dash search results" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/753584
[10:56] <vish> rodrigo_: seb128: i asked that same thing on #evolution and they said i was rude for trying to do that ;p » http://david.woodhou.se/reply-to-list.html
[10:57] <vish> thats the link they dropped on me :s
[10:57] <rodrigo_> vish, yes, the eternal discussion
[10:57] <rodrigo_> I really prefer reply-to-all, as it makes sure the person you're replying to gets the mail, if he/she's not subscribed
[10:59] <seb128> I hate having my inbox spammed with list discussions
[10:59] <seb128> like reply to the list are filtered correctly
[10:59] <seb128> but direct replies land in my inbox
[11:00] <pitti> yeah, it breaks people's "sort into different priority boxes" filtes
[11:00] <vish> rodrigo_: i just replaced the reply-to-all button with reply-to-list button, and escaped from Wrath of Seb ;)
[11:00] <pitti> I usually just delete them from my personal inbox, but it always takes time to check
[11:02] <seb128> right, same here
[11:02] <rodrigo_> seb128, then tweak your filters (if you're using evolution), I get both replies on the correct folder
[11:03] <seb128> it's also that I give an higher priority to my inbox and those get me check on what is needed to figure it's just a reply to a list discussion and that I shouldn't have stopped what I was doing for it
[11:03] <rodrigo_> seb128, :)
[11:03] <seb128> rodrigo_, well then you get duplicated emails
[11:03] <rodrigo_> seb128, yes, that's true
[11:03] <seb128> I'm using server side filtering
[11:03] <rodrigo_> but since so many people use reply-to-all, I think there's nothing you can do
[11:04] <rodrigo_> seb128, but I'll make sure you don't get 2 copies from me, don't worry :)
[11:04] <rodrigo_> seb128, ah
[11:04] <seb128> well I can complain to people for not using properly their email client ;-)
[11:04] <seb128> reply to list is made for lists :p
[11:05] <rodrigo_> yeah, the eternal discussion, so you'll have to deal with both kind of users :-)
[11:08] <seb128> ideally the email clients would be smart enough to delete the direct reply if it detects the same email went to a list
[11:08] <rodrigo_> seb128, yeah
[11:08] <rodrigo_> seb128, hmm, isnt' there a duplicate checker plugin in evolutioon?
[11:08]  * rodrigo_ looks
[11:08] <seb128> could be
[11:09] <rodrigo_> not in the ubuntu package, but iirc I've seen one in the source code
[11:09] <rodrigo_> checking
[11:10] <rodrigo_> no, I was dreaming it seems
[11:11] <rodrigo_> anyway, what I do is read mail in search folders, the "normal" folders are only for storing the mails
[11:11] <rodrigo_> so I have a 'personal mail' search folder where I get only messages sent (or CCed) to me
[11:12] <cjwatson> duplicate checking breaks the ability of people to explicitly alert you to a discussion happening on a list you occasionally read by CCing you; I for one value that
[11:13] <rodrigo_> cjwatson, yes, me too
[11:15] <seb128> cjwatson, indeed
[11:15] <Sweetshark> vish: new stuff in LO is dual licensed LGPL3+/MPL, so you can use it rather freely as long as you also publish the source along anything compiled (for images, this mostly means not only passing rendered bitmaps but making the vectors images available too)
[11:15] <seb128> I should stop complaining and just keep pressing delete on ;-)
[11:16] <rodrigo_> seb128, :)
[11:17] <Sweetshark> vish: as usual the IANAL warning applies ;)
[11:18] <lifeless> rodrigo_: theres a duplicate checker you can run in procmail, if you want that
[11:18] <rodrigo_> lifeless, I don't, it's seb128 :)
[11:19] <vish> Sweetshark: so, if I am to include i should mention it in these two places http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-art-pkg/humanity/release/view/head:/debian/copyright ; http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-art-pkg/humanity/release/view/head:/Humanity/AUTHORS  ?
[11:19] <seb128> not really in fact after thinking, I just want people to stop Cc-ing me on mailing list replies when it's an active discussion I obviously read since I'm participating in it ;-)
[11:21] <cdbs> rodrigo_: Got your mail
[11:21] <cdbs> rodrigo_: Nope, I am not, it appears kklimonda did it already on his ppa
[11:22] <rodrigo_> cdbs, ah, ok
[11:25] <chrisccoulson> thunderbird has a duplicate checker addon
[11:26] <seb128> chrisccoulson, stop trying to sell you email client :p
[11:26] <chrisccoulson> lol
[11:26] <micahg_> hehe
[11:26] <chrisccoulson> i'm subtle aren't i? ;)
[11:26] <Sweetshark> vish: please, please modify the files directly upstream at http://cgit.freedesktop.org/libreoffice/artwork/tree/ooo_custom_images/human
[11:27] <kklimonda> cdbs: what did I do? :)
[11:27] <cdbs> kklimonda: ah, I forgot to tell you about i
[11:27] <cdbs> t
[11:27] <cdbs> kklimonda: I saw the newest version of Epiphany in your ppa
[11:27] <vish> Sweetshark: oh, my changes has nothing to do with LibO, it would be in Humanity package, I'm talking about the MIME icons
[11:27] <cdbs> kklimonda: Do you plan to put it up on the GNOME3 ppa?
[11:28] <rodrigo_> kklimonda, yes, please, put it in the PPA
[11:28] <rodrigo_> kklimonda, if it's ready
[11:28]  * cdbs is using kklimonda's epiphany ATM, its flawless
[11:28] <vish> Sweetshark: if you see comment#13 on that bug, it would be changing the icons only in humanity
[11:29] <rodrigo_> kklimonda, I have a tester for the package, so what's the PPA?
[11:30] <kklimonda> rodrigo_: it's ready, but I don't have the access for PPA.
[11:30] <rodrigo_> kklimonda, ah, let me know of a branch, and I'll push it
[11:30] <vish> Sweetshark: right now, you are thinking about icons in the libreoffice-style-human package, but the OP seems to be talking about the icons for files, like the screenshot in the last comment
[11:30] <Sweetshark> vish: the MIME icons are also used in the LO startcenter. I dont think we want different icons in the LO startcenter and in nautilus. So, if you "ubuntuize" the LO icons, they should be that way in both the nautilus theme as in our libreoffice themeing IMHO.
[11:30] <vish> hmm..
[11:39] <kklimonda> cdbs: do you use epiphany? Is it possible to make tabs shrink somehow when you open too many of them? Right now I can't open more then 7 or 8 before damn button shows up, and I can't keep track of what I have opened.
[11:39] <cassidy> seb128, kenvandine: you probably want to fix https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/telepathy-idle/+bug/757373 in natty
[11:39] <ubot5> Ubuntu bug 757373 in telepathy-idle (Ubuntu) "password-prompt param should be in the manager file" [Undecided,New]
[11:39] <seb128> cassidy, thanks
[11:42] <TheMuso> chrisccoulson: I recently changed from using mutt to thunderbird for personal email, and its nice to know there is a dup check addon, and overall the experience is good anyway.
[11:52] <rodrigo_> njpatel, ping
[11:53] <rodrigo_> njpatel, unping, found the issue :)
[11:54] <njpatel> rodrigo_, heh
[11:54] <njpatel> rodrigo_, did you see my comment on the luke bug?
[11:54] <rodrigo_> njpatel, yes, was about the branch that fixed it
[11:54] <njpatel> ah, okay, it's in trunk now
[11:54] <rodrigo_> njpatel, I was wondering why it would get a non-indicator object from the list
[11:55] <njpatel> rodrigo_, I think it runs off the end of the list
[11:55] <rodrigo_> right
[11:55] <njpatel> but it doesn't make sense
[11:55] <njpatel> (i Know)
[11:55] <njpatel> but needed a fix
[11:55] <njpatel> it was late yesterday night :)
[11:56] <rodrigo_> hmm, well, g_slist_nth_data would return NULL if you pass an index out of bounds
[11:56] <TheMuso> lol on the luke bug. :)(
=== MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch
[11:56] <rodrigo_> njpatel, but yes, there's code to go to the last item if -1 is reached as index, right?
[11:56] <rodrigo_> hey TheMuso
[11:56] <TheMuso> Hey rodrigo_.
[11:57] <TheMuso> I was actually getting a strace when I checked that bug again and found njpatel's comment.
[11:57] <rodrigo_> TheMuso, could you please have a look at my comment at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/740729 please?
[11:57] <ubot5> Ubuntu bug 740729 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "The indicators for gnome-control-center should be extended with icon/accessible descriptions." [Low,In progress]
[11:57] <rodrigo_> TheMuso, yeah, cool that njpatel saved us some work :)
[11:57] <TheMuso> rodrigo_: Oh right, that slipped off my radar, will do so.
[11:58] <rodrigo_> TheMuso, thanks!
[11:58] <TheMuso> np
[12:17] <rodrigo_> TheMuso, ah ok, so the 3rd argument to app_indicator_set_icon_full is the accessible description then, right?
[12:18] <TheMuso> rodrigo_: THink so, would have to check libappindicator's docs.
[12:18] <rodrigo_> ok, I'll check
[12:25] <rodrigo_> hmm, a friend of mine testing the PPA has this on his sources.list: deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/ubuntugnometeam/gnome3/ubuntu natty main
[12:25] <rodrigo_> it seems to have the correct packages, but the url is different, so where does that come from?
[12:25] <rodrigo_> the "official" url is deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/gnome3-team/gnome3/ubuntu natty main
[12:27] <seb128> rodrigo_, https://launchpad.net/~ubuntugnometeam
[12:27] <seb128> rodrigo_, seems a different team
[12:28] <rodrigo_> hmm
[12:28] <rodrigo_> ah, it's a copy of our ppa
[12:28] <seb128> rodrigo_, they probably copy packages from the other ppa
[12:28] <TheMuso> Duplicated effort...
[12:28] <rodrigo_> yes, seems so
[12:29] <seb128> rodrigo_, https://launchpad.net/ubuntugnome
[12:30] <seb128> has a description
[12:30] <chrisccoulson> it's a group of people from ubuntuforums who spend all of their time whinging about unity and want to create a pure gnome version of ubuntu
[12:30] <chrisccoulson> i recognize one of the names in the team
[12:30] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, is he on IRC?
[12:30] <chrisccoulson> it's jcastro's friend, ronacc!
[12:31] <chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, i don't think so
[12:31] <rodrigo_> ok
[12:32]  * TheMuso isn't a fan of the forums.
[12:32] <seb128> what they don't get is that Ubuntu will ship GNOME still
[12:32] <seb128> no need of a remix
[12:32] <rodrigo_> they probably could use their time to help on the official gnome3 ppa
[12:32] <rodrigo_> I'll talk to jcastro later, when he wakes up
[12:33] <kklimonda> rodrigo_: meh, that would actually mean that they are working as part of Ubuntu, and not fighting evil Ubuntu/Canonical overlords. ;)
[12:34] <rodrigo_> ah, but they use launchpad :-)
[12:34] <rodrigo_> if they want a pure non-ubuntu distro, they should use debian then :)
[12:35] <kklimonda> in Debian no one would put up with their s%^& ;)
[12:35] <vish> seb128: ha! i just sent a mail with that project link :D
[12:35] <vish>  https://launchpad.net/ubuntugnome
[12:36] <seb128> where did you send it?
[12:36] <vish> -desktop , dont worrry you are not Cc'd ;p
[12:37] <rodrigo_> :D
[12:37]  * rodrigo_ writes a dont-CC-seb plugin for evolution :-)
[12:38] <rodrigo_> kklimonda, heh, right
[12:38] <rodrigo_> but if they want a pure gnome version, I guess they can get the CD and replace ubuntu stuff and create their own CD
[12:38] <rodrigo_> less work, I guess
[12:39] <chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, i'm not sure they're help would be *that* welcome tbh ;)
[12:39] <chrisccoulson> they're ubuntu users who seem to hate every single change which happens
[12:39] <chrisccoulson> and they seem to want a pure gnome version because they think that unity changes too much
[12:39] <chrisccoulson> (which is ironic really)
[12:39] <chrisccoulson> seeing as they're basing they're spin-off on gnome-shell ;)
[12:40] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, ok then, but we should warn users to use our PPA, not theirs
[12:40] <kklimonda> in other words Gubuntu lives on! ;)
[12:40] <vish> chrisccoulson: that group is perfect for what kklimonda wants to get done for the Stracciatella session ;)
[12:41] <rodrigo_> :)
[12:41] <chrisccoulson> vish - they would still moan, even with the stracciatella session
[12:41] <chrisccoulson> they will always find a reason to whinge and moan
[12:41] <vish> lol!
[12:41] <seb128> they probably don't understand that gnome-panel and nautilus will still be in Ubuntu and it's fine to use those
[12:43] <seb128> what we need is a way to block some ppa or display a text entry where you need to write "I know I'm going to break my system by using that ppa and I will not complain once it's done"
[12:43] <vish> seb128 loves people using nautilus-elementary ! ;p
[12:44] <seb128> ;-)
[12:44] <seb128> I've nothing against people using elementary, I've against people writing elementary rather than contributing to nautilus ;-)
[12:44] <vish> :)
[12:45] <chrisccoulson> this is the person who seems to have the biggest list of problems with unity and spends the most amount of timing complaining about all the unity bugs he has, but he's never actually reported a single unity bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/~itsmealso2/+reportedbugs
[12:45] <chrisccoulson> he's one of those contributing to that ppa ;)
[12:46] <seb128> chrisccoulson, you read forums?!
[12:46] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - if i'm really bored at the weekend
[12:46] <seb128> lol
[12:46] <chrisccoulson> i wouldn't recommend it, the forums are a really depressing place to go
[12:46] <kklimonda> I've added "ubuntuforums.org 127.0.0.1" to my /etc/hosts some time ago.
[12:46] <rodrigo_> yeah, forums are bad
[12:47] <kklimonda> this way it doesn't tempt me to go there
[12:47] <chrisccoulson> that's quite a good idea ;)
[12:47] <seb128> well, you need to go there not to want constructive discussions ;-)
[12:47] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, ok, so it seems it's probably better to leave them do what they want
[12:47] <rodrigo_> maybe jcastro wants to talk to them, just in case
[12:47] <chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, yeah, probably. although tbh, i think that all they will be doing is copying packages from the PPA ;)
[12:47] <chrisccoulson> (the official PPA)
[12:48] <seb128> we should just communicate clearly to users to not use that ppa ;-)
[12:48] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, right, that's why I think the best action is to ignore that team :)
[12:48] <rodrigo_> seb128, yes, and do that
[12:48] <chrisccoulson> are they copying binaries or just the source and doing a rebuild?
[12:48] <seb128> that should mostly sort itself next cycle when GNOME3 lands in Ubuntu proper
[12:48] <chrisccoulson> if it's the latter, then that's really annoying ;)
[12:49] <seb128> they do rebuilds it seems
[12:49] <chrisccoulson> we keep having users copying firefox source packages from our PPA, and eating up PPA time for no reason
[12:49] <seb128> they waste buildds cycles!
[12:49] <kklimonda> chrisccoulson: really? ugh..
[12:49] <kklimonda> and here I complain that every day at 4am all builders are munching on mozilla and chromium packages ;)
[12:49] <rodrigo_> that's bad yes
[12:50] <chrisccoulson> yeah. i wanted to ship translations in our firefox-stable PPA (because we are advertising it as officially supported), and my translations got stuck behind duplicated firefox builds in other PPAs
[12:50] <chrisccoulson> which was really annoying
[12:51] <chrisccoulson> launchpad should probably prompt someone if they try to copy sources when binaries already exist
[12:51] <chrisccoulson> "do you really want to do this, and waste everyone elses time?"
[12:51] <chrisccoulson> ;)
[12:51] <rodrigo_> :)
=== rodrigo__ is now known as rodrigo_
[13:16] <Martiini> anyone use Twitter ??
[13:17]  * rodrigo_ lunch
[13:22] <Sweetshark> pitti: I would like to do one final FFe update as 3.3.2-1ubuntu3 for bug 720716 and bug 740815, but I am still waiting for at least french translations. I will not merge in debian changes for that release as the changes in 3.3.2-2 seem noncritical.
[13:22] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 720716 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "Please add unity Quicklist support" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/720716
[13:22] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 740815 in xulrunner-1.9.2 (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Updates to enable us to drop xulrunner from main" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740815
[13:23] <pitti> Sweetshark: those both sound fine, but too late for beta-2, I'm afraid (builds too long on arm, and causes uninstallability)
[13:23] <pitti> Sweetshark: if we can have the upload ready around Friday, that'd be great, though
[13:24] <ogra_> pitti, friday ?
[13:24] <Sweetshark> pitti: k, I'll home in on that.
[13:24] <ogra_> pitti, dont we hard freeze on thu ??
[13:24] <pitti> ogra_: no, it's beta-2; after that, we have another week in FF/UIF
[13:24] <pitti> we do keep the freeze, yes
[13:24] <pitti> but mainly to control what's going in
[13:25] <ogra_> pitti, so "main release freeze" isnt final freeze ?
[13:25] <pitti> ogra_: right now it's beta-2 freeze
[13:25] <ogra_> yes, until thu
[13:26] <ogra_> and the schedule says "main release freeze" on 14th
[13:26] <ogra_> i read that as final hard freeze
[13:26] <seb128> everybody is getting confused you are like the third one to ask today
[13:26] <ogra_> heh
[13:26] <ogra_> it *is* confusing
[13:27] <pitti> Archive:
[13:27] <pitti> sorry
[13:27] <seb128> it would desever a clarification email
[13:27] <pitti> topic: Archive: Beta-2/Feature/UI freeze
[13:27] <Sweetshark> <- lunch
=== MacSlow|lunch is now known as MacSlow
[13:27] <ogra_> or a clearer naming
[13:27] <pitti> what would you propose instead of this ^ ?
[13:27] <ogra_> i mean on the schedule, its not the 14th yet :)
[13:27] <seb128> pitti, right, what is not clear is what happens between now and natty, when beta2 images will be out and if uploads will go in between beta2 and natty
[13:28] <ogra_> the topic one is fine and clear
[13:28] <seb128> right, the issue is not the current status but what happens between now and hard freeze
[13:28] <pitti> I guess with "Main Release Freeze" skaet means that natty will keep being frozen until the end
[13:29] <ogra_> pitti, we used to have a "hard freeze, no more uploads" entry in the schedule
[13:29] <ogra_> that missing made me think that the freeze on 14th is exactly that one
[13:30] <seb128> there is also no "beta2 is out, uploads accepted again until..." on the schedule
[13:30] <ogra_> (and thats the reason why i complained about freezing beta in the morning btw since the next three days looked like the last soft frozen days to me)
[13:30] <seb128> I will mention it to skaet when she's online
[13:30] <ogra_> yeah
[13:31] <chrisccoulson> i was confused about that too ;)
[13:35] <kenvandine> lots of updates this morning :)
[14:01] <mterry> kenvandine, hrm...  even with the new uploaded indicator-application, I still get bug 696336 which looks like a mis-free'd Application...  /me digs further
[14:01] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 696336 in indicator-application (Ubuntu) "indicator-application-service crashed with SIGSEGV in __strcmp_ssse3()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/696336
[14:01] <kenvandine> mterry, :(
[14:02] <GunnarHj> seb128: Hi Sebastien, did you give https://code.launchpad.net/~gunnarhj/gdm/profile/+merge/56426 any further thought? I'm asking because I want that the trivial guest session fix in the same MP (revision 322) makes it into Natty. Maybe I should break out that detail to a separate MP?
[14:08] <seb128> GunnarHj, no, I still don't get why you can't do ". .profile || true"
[14:09] <seb128> GunnarHj, in fact I let it for somebody who understand the issue and has better shell clues than mine
[14:11] <GunnarHj> seb128: I'm not able to explain why either. ;-)  But I take it that I should move the guest session thing to a new MP then, or would it be possible to commit only that revision?
[14:12] <seb128> GunnarHj, try pinging doko or kirkland since they are patch pilot today
[14:12] <GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, will do. Thanks!
[14:12] <seb128> yw
[14:13] <seb128> btw what is "gnome-classic-guest-restricted"?
[14:14] <GunnarHj> seb128: It's the value the DESKTOP_SESSION var gets when a guest session is launched in a classic session.
[14:14] <seb128> ok
[14:27] <rickspencer3> good morning desktoppers
[14:27] <pitti> hey rickspencer3
[14:28] <rickspencer3> pitti, would it be possible for someone to find out why Unity is so crashy for kees?
[14:28] <pitti> apport?
[14:29] <rickspencer3> I wonder if his graphics card + being 64 bit = trouble
[14:29] <pitti> well, it's not really any less crashy for me
[14:29] <pitti> today's upload fixes all the bugs I reported, though :)
[14:29] <pitti> well, s/bugs/crashes/
[14:29] <pitti> I have been on 64 bit for the last 5 years, too
[14:33] <rickspencer3> pitti, kees said he was getting several crashes a day, pitti, do you and kees have the same hardware?
[14:33] <sabdfl> hey folks
[14:33] <pitti> rickspencer3: Intel Arrandale Video, 64 bit, ThinkPad X201 here
[14:34] <pitti> hey sabdfl, how are you?
[14:34] <sabdfl> just noticed we appear to be dropping pulseaudio-raop / -zeroconf
[14:34] <seb128> hey rickspencer3 sabdfl
[14:34] <pitti> right
[14:34] <sabdfl> gut thanks pitti, you?
[14:34] <sabdfl> i think that's the module that makes my apple-tv show up in pulse, is that right?
[14:34] <seb128> rickspencer3, did he get some crashes in use?
[14:34] <sabdfl> does it work?
[14:34] <pitti> AFAIR it got added as a recommends at some point in natty, but it caused too much trouble, so it was dropped again a month or so ago
[14:35] <pitti> sabdfl: I'm fine, thanks!
[14:35] <seb128> rickspencer3, the one he mentioned on his email is the known "compiz crash when toggling options in ccsm"
[14:35] <sabdfl> ok
[14:35] <sabdfl> it's a cool feature so hopefully it stabilizes and we can bring it back in dreamy-time
[14:35] <seb128> rickspencer3, which is a bit unfortunate but that's not really an unity usage issue, ie should not happen in normal desktop use once configured
[14:36] <rickspencer3> seb128:
[14:36] <rickspencer3> This afternoon, compiz only crashed twice, and I was able to use Unity
[14:36] <rickspencer3> for a few hours (most of the time spent filing bugs, see below). I
[14:36] <rickspencer3> am still using Unity at the moment, but bug 755156 has gotten so bad,
[14:36] <rickspencer3> I may have to go back to metacity soon.
[14:36] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 755156 in compiz (Ubuntu) "alt-tab does not always work, instead is overridden by focus-follows-mouse" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/755156
[14:36] <seb128> rickspencer3, the crashes he reported seemed like ccsm triggered ones
[14:37] <seb128> rodrigo_, I closed a bunch of crash bugs in launchpad due to people mixing gtk2 and gtk3 programs, we should check the ppa and put conflicts where required
[14:37] <seb128> bug #752746
[14:37] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 752746 in nautilus (Ubuntu) "nautilus crashed with SIGABRT in g_option_context_parse()" [Medium,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/752746
[14:38] <jcastro> rodrigo_: looking for me?
[14:38] <seb128> bug #750256
[14:38] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 750256 in gnome-bluetooth (Ubuntu) "bluetooth-applet crashed with SIGABRT in g_option_context_parse()" [Medium,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/750256
[14:38] <seb128> bug #738648
[14:38] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 738648 in gnome-user-share (Ubuntu) "gnome-user-share crashed with SIGABRT in g_option_context_parse()" [Medium,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/738648
[14:38] <seb128> rodrigo_, ^
[14:38] <seb128> not sure how they get gtk2 and gtk3 to mix in those
[14:38] <seb128> likely nautilus-sendto or something
[14:38] <seb128> hey jcastro
[14:39] <seb128> jcastro, I think that was about https://launchpad.net/ubuntugnome
[14:39] <davmor2> rickspencer3, seb128: I didn't think FFM was working properly in natty?  would that not be part of the issue?
[14:39] <jcastro> seb128: oh right I saw this before
[14:39] <seb128> jcastro, do you know why those guys just copy the gnome3 ppa rather than working directly there?
[14:39] <pitti> I am also using FFM
[14:39] <pitti> apart from menus being icky, it works here
[14:39] <seb128> what is "ffm"?
[14:39] <seb128> oh, focus follow mouse
[14:39] <pitti> focus follows mouse
[14:39] <seb128> no that's not officially supported by unity
[14:40] <pitti> click-to-focus is not officially supported by my brain, so I'm keeping ffm :)
[14:40] <ogra_> ++
[14:40] <pitti> but I don't think it causes crashes
[14:40] <ogra_> :)
[14:40] <jcastro> seb128: I think their deal is they want to make an ISO out of it. I can send them a mail or something
[14:40] <rickspencer3> seb128, well, I'd just like to make sure ... kees doesn't seem happy with the stability
[14:40] <seb128> rickspencer3, right, I meant to talk with him whe he gets online
[14:41] <seb128> rickspencer3, but I've the feeling that he tweaked a lot in ccsm to make compiz work for what he's doing
[14:41] <rickspencer3> thanks seb128
[14:41] <seb128> rickspencer3, which is a bit unfortunate because ccsm tend to crash compiz still...
[14:41] <rickspencer3> that is unfortunate
[14:41] <jcastro> seb128: it just looks like a PPA copy to me.
[14:41] <jcastro> seb128: I'll send them a note
[14:41] <seb128> jcastro, thanks
[14:58] <rodrigo_> jcastro, hi
[14:58] <didrocks> rickspencer3: FYI, loicm priority for post beta2 is this ccsm crash (has most of crashes we get is due to people changing something in ccsm)
[14:58] <rodrigo_> jcastro, yes, just have a few things on my TODO for you
[14:58] <rickspencer3> didrocks, ack
[14:58] <rickspencer3> thanks man
[14:58] <jcastro> rodrigo_: I'd love to help!
[14:59] <jcastro> seb128: looks like they've been on the waiting list for the official gnome3 team for a while
[14:59] <rodrigo_> jcastro, 1st, about adding some comment in the gnome3 ppa page you wrote about gnome-tweak-tool, since lots of people complain about not being able to change themes
[14:59] <jcastro> seb128: I can just respond and CC you if you'd likee? They have questions about bugs and stuff
[14:59] <rodrigo_> jcastro, also, about http://www.gnome.org/getting-gnome/ <- we should get some mention of the PPA there, can you do something?
[14:59] <seb128> jcastro, we don't add random people like that they should start by contributing so we can review their work
[14:59] <rodrigo_> jcastro, and the other thing is what seb128 is telling you now
[14:59] <seb128> jcastro, can you Cc me and rodrigo and robert_ancell?
[15:00] <jcastro> rodrigo_: the first one is an easy fix, the 2nd is I think on purpose
[15:00] <rodrigo_> jcastro, oh, on purpose?
[15:00] <jcastro> after seeing our instructions they probably freaked out. :)
[15:00] <rodrigo_> jcastro, ah, ok
[15:00] <pitti> sabdfl: hey Mark
[15:00] <sabdfl> howdy
[15:00] <pitti> sabdfl: can we do _something_ about the scrollbars by final?
[15:01] <pitti> either remove the whitelist, or punt them? please let's not keep the current wild mix :/
[15:01] <jcastro> rodrigo_: gnome-tweak-tool is in the ppa right? I can just refer to that package?
[15:01] <sabdfl> pitti: if you are confident on stability, remove the whitelist with pleasure
[15:01] <sabdfl> i'm using it that way without issues
[15:02] <rodrigo_> jcastro, yes, it's in the PPA
[15:02] <chrisccoulson> are the scrollbars on by default?
[15:02] <pitti> sabdfl: well, we'll still not get them for firefox, LibO, or any other app, but it would at least be a little more consistent
[15:02] <pitti> chrisccoulson: yes
[15:02] <seb128> chrisccoulson, they are, they just work in almost none of the things I use ;-)
[15:02] <sabdfl> we already have inconsistencies in scrollbar rendering and behaviour between toolkits
[15:02] <chrisccoulson> i seemed to have missed out on that :/
[15:02] <chrisccoulson> it's not even installed here :9
[15:02] <chrisccoulson> :(
[15:02] <seb128> sabdfl, well, with those we have inconsistency inside applications
[15:02] <seb128> sabdfl, like xchat-gnome channel list and channel log don't have the same scrollbars
[15:03] <sabdfl> seb128: only rarely, and in the few cases i'm aware of, we have the nice ones in the places you need them most
[15:03] <pitti> chrisccoulson: it's a new recommends of ubuntu-desktop, "overlay-scrollbar"
[15:03] <sabdfl> i trust we'll get a lot of help filling out the gaps, but mostly that's true if the gaps are clearer
[15:03] <chrisccoulson> pitti - i guess that hasn't been pulled in on my machine as i haven't dist-upgraded in a while
[15:03] <sabdfl> thanks for getting it in!
[15:03] <pitti> well, it was you who FFE'ed it :)
[15:05] <rodrigo_> seb128, right, I'd say it's nautilus-sendto
[15:05] <jcastro> rodrigo_: I am reading reports of it working with 10.10 as well?
[15:05] <rodrigo_> seb128, for those bugs you pasted before
[15:05] <chrisccoulson> oh
[15:05] <chrisccoulson> hah
[15:05] <chrisccoulson> i didn't have ubuntu-desktop installed
[15:05] <chrisccoulson> pitti^ ;)
[15:05] <seb128> rodrigo_, can we get a conflict somewhere to avoid them landing in that situation?
[15:05] <rodrigo_> jcastro, what? the PPA?
[15:05] <pitti> chrisccoulson: ah
[15:05] <rodrigo_> seb128, yes, I think so
[15:06]  * chrisccoulson isn't going to miss out anymore
[15:08] <sabdfl> pitti: i think we should drop the whitelist and use it everywhere. Cimi__ ^?
[15:08] <jcastro> rodrigo_: oh I see, it's the old PPA
[15:08] <jcastro> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/gnome3-builds/
[15:08] <jcastro> ^^^ can we delete this?
[15:09] <rodrigo_> jcastro, yes, the new one only has packages for natty, and some of the deps are only in natty, so I guess it won't work
[15:09] <rodrigo_> jcastro, yes, but I don't have permissions, so seb128, pitti ^^
[15:09] <pitti> sabdfl: if anythign, I had actually expected to test without a whitelist, and only then restrict usage; right now we have zero data how it works for the non-whitelisted packages; but might still be better to squeeze that in, if we are going to stick with them at all IMHO
[15:09] <seb128> jcastro, rodrigo_: can do
[15:09] <rodrigo_> seb128, ok, thanks
[15:09] <pitti> rodrigo_: sorry, what?
[15:10] <rodrigo_> pitti, deleting this PPA -> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/gnome3-builds/
=== hggdh_ is now known as hggdh
[15:10] <rodrigo_> pitti, but seb128 is doing it, so don't worry :)
[15:10] <sabdfl> pitti: you're right, i initially thought we'd whitelist only for a day or two
[15:11] <sabdfl> so, bombs away
[15:11] <pitti> rodrigo_: done
[15:11] <rodrigo_> pitti, ok thanks
[15:11] <Cimi__> sabdfl: for example, synaptic has issues
[15:11] <pitti> sudo apt-get install time-machine!
=== Cimi__ is now known as Cimi
[15:11] <sabdfl> Cimi: blacklist then
[15:12] <rodrigo_> jcastro, about that ubuntugnometeam, maybe they should contact kklimonda, who wants to work on a straciatella version of gnome for O
[15:12] <rodrigo_> jcastro, also, if they could remove the PPA, if it's just a copy, it's just making LP rebuild lots of packages
[15:12] <jcastro> rodrigo_: I just CCed you guys with their lead person
[15:13] <rodrigo_> jcastro, ah ok, thanks!
[15:13] <jcastro> let's get them on board first and then ask to remove the PPA
[15:14] <rodrigo_> jcastro, yes, sure, whatever is best, I don't want to make them stop working
[15:30] <Sweetshark> pitti: whats your opinion on bug 756895? I feel not at all comfortable to change 160 icons three weeks after UI freeze.
[15:30] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 756895 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "Include updated Humanity style" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/756895
=== zyga is now known as zyga-food
[15:34] <seb128> kenvandine, btw reading your scrollbar apport tagging, I think "_" are not allowed in tags
[15:34] <seb128> kenvandine, not sure what would happen of it tries to set one of those tags
[15:35] <kenvandine> seb128, cimi just mentioned that
[15:35] <kenvandine> seb128, this is why i asked for a review of that... since i didn't right the hook and have little experience with them :-D
[15:36] <seb128> kenvandine, I didn't knew until now when I searched if some bugs had those tags set and launchpad sent me to the query page saying I was using an invalid tag ;-)
[15:36] <kenvandine> np
[15:36] <kenvandine> seb128, i'll upload it and beg the release team to approve it :)
[15:36] <seb128> kenvandine, can you the crash bug which is fix commited in as well?
[15:37] <kenvandine> sure
[15:40] <kenvandine> seb128, got a link?
[15:40] <seb128> kenvandine, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/overlay-scrollbar/+bug/754717
[15:40] <ubot5> Ubuntu bug 754717 in ayatana-scrollbar "ccsm crashed with SIGSEGV in os_pager_draw()" [High,Fix committed]
[15:40] <kenvandine> thx
[15:40] <seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/overlay-scrollbar/+bug/754717
[15:47] <JanC> I have a problem--compiz doesn't crash often enough anymore...
[15:48] <kenvandine> JanC, that is a great problem
[15:48] <JanC> yes, it is
[15:48] <JanC> now I have to kill & restart it manually all the time...   :P
[15:48] <kenvandine> haha
[15:49] <JanC> otherwise it eats all my RAM
[15:51] <JanC> compiz grew 100 MiB in the last hour
[15:52] <JanC> and on average grows to about 3 GiB after a day
[15:55] <Sweetshark> JanC: Would you like mine?
[15:56] <JanC> Sweetshark: your what?
[15:56] <hrw> hi
[15:57] <Sweetshark> JanC: my compiz, it crashes still frequently. Although it also eats 800MB RAM already.
[15:58] <seb128> Sweetshark, did you file a bug about the crashes?
[15:59] <Sweetshark> seb128: I havent found them to be reproducable really.
[15:59] <seb128> well that's fine, just click on the apport button to send the crash
[15:59] <seb128> the stacktrace is often a clue
[16:00] <Sweetshark> seb128: k
[16:02] <pitti> Sweetshark: hmm, tempting; it does look quite a bit better indeed
[16:03] <didrocks> JanC: what is your driver?
[16:04] <seb128> JanC, is that with today's update?
[16:06] <rodrigo_> how can I build a package without signing it?
[16:06] <rodrigo_> I'm using a virtual machine, and it's complaining always about the signing, so it never generates the .deb
[16:07] <rodrigo_> -us?
[16:07] <seb128> rodrigo_, no, that's just a warning
[16:07] <rodrigo_> ah
[16:07] <seb128> it doesn't stop the build and it's after building the debs
[16:08] <rodrigo_> seb128, hmm
[16:08] <rodrigo_> seb128, I never get the .debs
[16:08] <rodrigo_> oh, I guess they're in the build area
[16:09]  * rodrigo_ tries building
[16:09] <seb128> right
[16:10] <rodrigo_> yes, there they are
=== zyga-food is now known as zyga-grocery
[16:25] <JanC> didrocks: the open source radeon driver
[16:25] <didrocks> JanC: ok, dunno then. We have similar things that people are reporting on nouveau leaking, didn't see the open source radeon driver yet
[16:26] <didrocks> JanC: if you can have examples of what explicitely is leaking (making a search, opening the dash… and so on), that would be great
[16:28] <JanC> I'm going to upgrade & restart compiz with todays update first, then see if I can find a culprit
[16:28] <kklimonda> rodrigo_: hmm, any idea why doesn't gdm 3.0 set my locales correctly?
[16:29] <rodrigo_> kklimonda, no, haven't tried gdm 3 yet
[16:29] <rodrigo_> kklimonda, I'll install and try it later
[16:31] <seb128> didrocks, JanC: neil said earlier that the dash leaks some megs every time it's used iirc
[16:32] <didrocks> seb128: it was in a search only, 100 MiB in an hour will mean a lot of search :)
[16:33] <seb128> JanC, do you use search a lot? ;-)
[16:33] <JanC> and I hardly ever search; I think I might have searched for an application to start once or twice in that time, nothing else
=== davidcalle_ is now known as davidcalle
[16:36] <JanC> although you still have to go in person to drop off the photos apparently   :P
[16:36] <JanC> eh, wrong channel
[16:41] <rodrigo_> can someone please review/merge/upload this branch -> https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/gnome-control-center/fix-740729/+merge/57185 ?
[16:48] <seb128> rodrigo_, can do
[16:48] <rodrigo_> seb128, thanks
[17:01] <JanC> seb128: I can confirm that the dash seems to leak a couple of MiB every time it's used (now running todays updated compiz)
[17:02] <seb128> JanC, yeah, that's a "known issue", kamstrup is supposed to debug it I think if I got what njpatel was saying
[17:05] <didrocks> james_w: hey, how are you?
=== zyga-grocery is now known as zyga
[17:14] <james_w> didrocks, good thanks, how are you?
[17:16] <didrocks> james_w: I'm fine thanks. Ready for final rush which already began :)
[17:17] <didrocks> james_w: some question on new bzr-builddeb, I had to rollback because each time I try to bzr bd for unity* branch (in merge-upstream mode), I got an error:
[17:17] <didrocks> bzr: ERROR: Unable to determine the previous upload for --package-merge.
[17:18] <didrocks> james_w: I generally bzr mu … which tag the branch "upstream-<version>" and debcommit the upload which tag the branch "<debian version>"
[17:25] <james_w> didrocks, and I guess you aren't specifying --package-merge?
[17:27] <didrocks> james_w: no, I'm not even aware what it does :)
[17:33] <james_w> didrocks, you are using lp:bzr-builddeb or the package?
[17:34] <didrocks> james_w: the latest package in natty
[17:34] <james_w> didrocks, ah it looks like this has been fixed since
[17:35] <kamstrup> seb128, JanC: I am on it
[17:36] <didrocks> james_w: oh nice, so I should branch and set the PYTHONPATH?
[17:36] <seb128> kamstrup, great ;-)
[17:36] <james_w> didrocks, "bzr branch lp:bzr-builddeb /tmp/bzr-builddeb; BZR_PLUGINS_AT=builddeb@/tmp/bzr-builddeb bzr bd" I think
[17:36] <didrocks> james_w: excellent! thanks :)
[17:37] <didrocks> james_w: you're correct!
[17:37] <james_w> woop
[17:37] <didrocks> thanks again :)
[17:50] <didrocks> dpm: so, I have a small gift soon for you
[17:51] <didrocks> dpm: a unity pot file including unreleased (yet) translation because of bug #757663 (thanks seb128 for pointing it)
[17:51] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 757663 in Ubuntu Translations "should list PlacesGroup.cpp in POTFILES.in" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/757663
[17:51] <didrocks> dpm: can I directly update the pot file? should I sent it to your over email?
[18:04] <rodrigo_> ok, out for a bit, later all
[18:13] <dpm> hi didrocks, what do you mean directly update the file? You mean upload it to LP? Yeah, if you've got permission on the project you can upload it manually without having to wait for a package upload
[18:14] <didrocks> dpm: hum, is it directly again the project? no magical launchpad.net/ubuntu ?
[18:14] <didrocks> against*
[18:14] <didrocks> dpm: https://translations.launchpad.net/unity
[18:16] <dpm> didrocks, https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/unity/+pots/unity/+upload (if you can put it in a tarball with po/unity.pot it will make things easier)
[18:17] <didrocks> dpm: done!
[18:18] <dpm> didrocks, great, thanks!
[18:18] <didrocks> dpm: I'm added the translator task
[18:18] <didrocks> adding*
[18:19] <didrocks> ok, you did :)
[18:19] <didrocks> nice!
[18:20] <dpm> didrocks, I didn't, someone else must have done :-)
[18:20] <didrocks> ahah :-)
=== dpm_ is now known as dpm
=== hallyn is now known as hallyn-afk
[18:40] <kklimonda> huh, anyone else is having problems with Evolution not getting all email from GMail through IMAP? I've just discovered two days worth of mails in the gmail that never got to my computer..
[18:41] <pitti> Taekwondo time, back in some 3.5 hours
[18:45] <JanC> \o/  compiz memory usage/leakage seems to be a lot better with todays compiz upload (except for the couple of MiB leaked by the dash it seems to behave now)
[18:47] <JanC> kklimonda: I heard somebody complain about problems using Gmail IMAP with Thunderbird yesterday, not sure if that is related though
[19:23] <dobey> hyperair: just replied to your e-mail
[19:27] <mterry> tedg_, filed a couple more potential crash fixers in indicator-application
[19:31] <tedg_> mterry, Woot!  Crashers!  :-)
[19:31] <tedg_> Cool, I'll take a look at them.
[19:31] <chrisccoulson> nice, another firefox menu bug fixed \o/ (bug 749450)
[19:31] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 749450 in Ubuntu Natty "Problem with bookmark menu in Firefox 4 : changes in bookmarks do not appear in menu before restarting FF" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/749450
[19:31] <mterry> chrisccoulson, nice  :)
[19:31] <chrisccoulson> tedg_, this 5 second delay in indicator-appmenu has been causing me some issues by the way ;)
[19:32] <tedg_> chrisccoulson, 5 second delay?
[19:33] <chrisccoulson> tedg_ - isn't there a 5 second delay before you destroy menus after the window closes now?
[19:33] <chrisccoulson> to work around another bug?
[19:33] <tedg_> chrisccoulson, Oh, yes.  Why is that an issue?
[19:33] <chrisccoulson> tedg_ - extension restart in firefox. if it takes less than 5 seconds to restart, the menus are broken if firefox happens to get the same XID on the new window ;)
[19:34] <chrisccoulson> (which is nearly every time)
[19:34] <chrisccoulson> i've hit it quite a few times today already (i've had to do a lot of restarts)
[19:35] <tedg_> chrisccoulson, Hmm, I thought I have it set up so that if you reregister under the same XID it'll delete the old ones for that case.
[19:35] <tedg_> chrisccoulson, That must not be working.
[19:35] <mterry> tremolux, heyo.  got a sec for a software-center issue?
[19:35] <chrisccoulson> tedg_ - hmmm, perhaps i've hit another issue :/
[19:35] <chrisccoulson> i'll check again. it's entirely possible that i could have broken something else whilst hacking on my extension ;)
[19:36] <tedg_> chrisccoulson, Okay, check.  I believe it'll print out a message when it destroys the menus.
[19:36] <chrisccoulson> thanks
[19:36] <tedg_> chrisccoulson, So if you run the unity-panel-service on the console it'll show you that.
[19:37] <tedg_> chrisccoulson, But if it's a broken thing, it'll probably break in lots of places so I'd be a bit worried :-)
[19:37] <tedg_> FYI, the 5 second delay was to fix another issue that was with Firefox ;-)
[19:37] <chrisccoulson> tedg_ - don't panic just yet then, it's possible i broke something here whilst i was fixing that other bug ;)
[19:38] <chrisccoulson> the bug you're working around didn't just affect firefox though ;)
[19:38] <chrisccoulson> people only reported it against firefox because it seems to be the only application that people use :P
[19:38] <chrisccoulson> :)
[19:46] <tremolux> mterry: sure, what's up?
[19:46] <tremolux> mterry: p.s. hey!
[19:47] <mterry> tremolux, I ran into bug 746589 which became bug 746625 and now I'm not sure how to proceed.  But figured you software center peeps might want to know about the issue too
[19:47] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 746589 in Ubuntu One Control Panel "Permission denied SystemError when launching" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/746589
[19:47] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 746625 in apt (Ubuntu) "SystemError: E:Opening /etc/apt/sources.list.d/private-ppa.launchpad.<something>list - ifstream::ifstream (13: Permission denied)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/746625
[19:47] <mterry> tremolux, hi!  :)
[19:51] <tremolux> mterry: yeah, hmm, gonna have to think about this a little bit
[19:52] <tremolux> mterry: thanks for the head's up
[20:14] <kklimonda> JanC: hmm, I'll see if it works with TB.. :/
[20:16] <kklimonda> no, works fine with Thunderbird so it looks like some problem with Evolution..
=== htorque_ is now known as htorque
=== warp10 is now known as warp8
=== warp8 is now known as warp100
=== warp100 is now known as warp10
[21:39] <pitti> re
[21:40] <seb128> wb pitti
[21:53] <rickspencer3> didrocks, hey, still around at all?
[21:53] <didrocks> rickspencer3: yeah, I'm here :)
[21:53] <rickspencer3> kees hit bug #740897 last week
[21:53] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 740897 in compiz (Ubuntu) "compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in g_source_unref()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740897
[21:53] <didrocks> rickspencer3: right, we already discussed it
[21:53] <rickspencer3> I'm wondering if it should be milestoned
[21:53] <rickspencer3> didrocks, ok
[21:53] <rickspencer3> nm
[21:54] <didrocks> rickspencer3: it's the same issue that the ccsm crash we are planning to fix this week
[21:54] <didrocks> rickspencer3: so, in a nutshell, if the ccsm issue is fixed (no crash when you add/remove a plugin in it), it will be fixed
[21:54] <didrocks> and this one is prio #1 for next release
[21:54] <rickspencer3> didrocks, I see, is it essentially a dupe?
[21:54] <didrocks> rickspencer3: well, it's the same crash, happening in a different context.
[21:55] <rickspencer3> didrocks, ok, thanks
[21:55] <didrocks> yw :)
[21:56] <seb128> didrocks, seems kamstrup fixes the dee issue, it could be worth getting in the upload queue?
[21:57] <kees> didrocks: you think 755146 (master: 740897 SIGSEGV in g_source_unref) is really a dup of 755167 (master: 685552 ccsm-induced crashes)? they look like extremely different crashes to me.
[21:58] <didrocks> seb128: where did you see the commit? it's not in trunk
[21:58] <didrocks> kees: I don't tell it's the same issue, I'm telling, it's another way to trigger it. We can be sure that all sources are well disconnected once we know that disabling the plugin in ccsm really disconnects all signals as expected
[21:59] <seb128> didrocks, https://code.launchpad.net/~kamstrup/dee/commit-transaction-leaks/+merge/57219
[21:59] <seb128> didrocks, sorry I was just reading email, let's wait for review
[21:59] <kees> didrocks: not sure I follow, but okidoky :)
[22:00] <didrocks> seb128: yeah, I prefer relying on njpatel's review, it's not only gvariant fixes
[22:01] <didrocks> kees: basically, I'll tell you when you should not see this crash anymore (hopefully Thursday after post-beta2 upload), if you still get it, warn us :-)
[22:02] <kenvandine> seb128, didrocks: just FYI i've been playing with that dee branch, and it is working well... but definately wait for njpatel to review it :)
[22:02] <kees> didrocks: cool. so far, I've only ever seen the launcher clicking crash once. I can't reproduce that one. ccsm I've seen other people reproduce but I haven't tried it myself, and since this mornign, I disabled FFM and nothing has misbehaved yet. :)
[22:02] <didrocks> kees: yeah, let's do the dee professional :)
[22:03] <didrocks> kees: I can ensure you that if you try to enable/disable a plugin, you have approximately 100% of chances to get a crash :-)
[22:04] <kees> didrocks: hehe
[22:04] <rickspencer3> didrocks, is FFM going to be crashy for 11.04?
[22:04]  * rickspencer3 needs it boilded down to manager speak
[22:05] <didrocks> rickspencer3: not sure, kees is the first one reporting it to be crashy. It's not supported (as the global menu worflow isn't compatible) for sure.
[22:05] <didrocks> not sure if pitti still uses it
[22:05] <seb128> rickspencer3, ffm is not crashy
[22:05] <rickspencer3> well, you could disable global menu, and then use it
[22:05] <seb128> several people here use it
[22:05] <rickspencer3> seb128,  says "no"
[22:05] <rickspencer3> seb128, do those folks disable the global menu?
[22:05] <seb128> rickspencer3, you don't need to turn those off, the pitti way is to open the menus with the keyboard ;-)
[22:05] <seb128> no
[22:05] <didrocks> kees is the only one I know reporting particular crashes with ffm
[22:06] <seb128> did kees do and how?
[22:06] <kees> well, I should clarify, all my crashes happened with using FFM, but all my misbehaviors are linked to FFM, and are unfixed (alt-tab "misses", fullscreen unhiding, etc)
[22:06] <seb128> rickspencer3, you can keyboard navigate the menu if you use ffm
[22:06] <rickspencer3> seb128, I've read a few places that people disable the global menu for ffm
[22:06] <seb128> kees, "not" you mean?
[22:06] <kees> so, "FFM not supported" is valid for "alt-tab doesn't work with FFM" and "dock doesn't work with fullscreen apps with FFM" etc
[22:06] <kees> seb128: my email from friday was entirely using FFM
[22:07] <seb128> alt-tab should work with ffm for sure
[22:07] <kees> seb128: since then, I disabled FFM and have had no crashes or misbehaviors
[22:07] <kees> seb128: it does not. see my email.
[22:07] <kees> (and my videso)
[22:07] <kees> *videos
[22:07] <seb128> well pitti didn't complain about this one
[22:07] <seb128> so it's not for all ffm users
[22:08] <kees> that's certainly good to hear! :)
[22:08] <seb128> he only complained that he can't access the menus since they change when the screen is crossed
[22:08] <seb128> so he open those with the keyboard now
[22:08] <seb128> rickspencer3, are you concerned about ffm users?
[22:09] <rickspencer3> seb128, well ...
[22:09] <seb128> kees, would you be any happier if we forced ffm off in unity sessions?
[22:09] <kees> is there any reason that the "Resize Info" module isn't enabled by default?
[22:09] <rickspencer3> if ffm is crashy, it suggests to my dim manager brain that there are un-addressed stability issues in Unity
[22:09] <seb128> kees, it never was
[22:10] <rickspencer3> oth, if it's ffm workflow is not well designed for, then I am not concerned for 11.04, but I think we should consider it for 11.10
[22:10] <mvo> I use FFM (with auto-raise) here too and its not crashing on intel, its crashing a lot for me on nvidia with nouveau though (not sure how helpfuly that is)
[22:10] <kees> seb128: I would remain unhappy that FFM was not usable, but if it works for other people, then leave it as it. but I've heard repeatedly "FFM is not supported in Unity", so it seems that should be enforced maybe?
[22:10] <didrocks> rickspencer3: we already discussed about that with mpt, but seems that a second ping will be necessary :)
[22:10] <kees> seb128: "it never was" -- maybe for compiz, but from metacity, it's a regression. but again, it's just me.
[22:10] <rickspencer3> mvo, and it doesn't crash on your nvidiea machine if you aren't running ffm?
[22:10] <seb128> kees, well it's not new for compiz it's how we set it up for years
[22:10] <didrocks> mvo: nouveau is known for memleaks and crashy
[22:11] <seb128> kees, it's what default Ubuntu with GNOME,compiz had
[22:11] <rickspencer3> didrocks, so what should mvo use for his nvidia hardware?
[22:11] <mvo> rickspencer3: no, sorry. I mean, on nvidia with nouveau its crashy because of nouveau, its impressive that works, but its not very stable unfortunately
[22:11] <seb128> kees, but not sure off hand, I guess those numbers are not useful to most people and clutter the ui ... so design decision
[22:11] <rickspencer3> classic with metaciy?
[22:11] <mvo> I have a cheap nvidia 8300 (or 8400?)
[22:11] <kees> seb128: okay
[22:11] <rickspencer3> mvo, ic
[22:11] <didrocks> rickspencer3: nvidia driver, if not supported first :)
[22:12] <didrocks> mvo: not supported by the nvidia binary driver?
[22:12] <kees> mvo: so you don't see what happens to me with ffm and alt-tab in 755156 ?  (I have a video of the misbehavior)
[22:12] <mvo> didrocks: I don't know, I guess
[22:12] <mvo> didrocks: but its … proprietary
[22:12] <mvo> kees: let me check, I had some focus issues, glitches mostly
[22:13] <didrocks> mvo: yeah, nouveau isn't good enough right now unfortunately :/ we pick a choice of what to test
[22:14] <mvo> didrocks: its impressive how much works with it really, but I guess for final we need to blacklist it (at leat my card)
[22:14] <kees> mvo: I got into situations where alt-tab didn't work (it would bring my selected window up briefly and then immediately refocus to the window my mouse was over)
[22:14] <kees> mvo: but not always.
[22:14] <didrocks> mvo: yeah, would be nice to ensure what starts or not with nouveau & 3d
[22:17] <mvo> kees: I have seen focus issues too, but I can not say for sure if its the same or not, I don't use alt-tab that much, auto-raise is my alt-tab :)
[22:18] <kees> mvo: ah, I heavily use alt-tab. so much, in fact, that this change away from FFM hasn't been too terrible. I still prefer FFM, but am living okay without it.
[22:20]  * mvo likes FFM
[22:23]  * pitti too
[22:23] <mdeslaur> apparently every single person who likes FFM works for canonical
[22:23] <pitti> but apart from the slightly tricky menu behaviour it doesn't cause issues here
[22:23] <seb128> but not every persone working for canonical likes ffm
[22:23] <seb128> ;-)
[22:24] <mdeslaur> seb128: no, there are quite a few sane people also, like you and me :)
[22:24] <mvo> …
[22:24] <seb128> I hate it, it keeps doing weird things when I don't use the mouse because I push it on the way and it always finish by focussing things I don't care about while I'm using the keyboard
[22:24] <didrocks> mdeslaur: seems I'm part of the club then :-)
[22:24] <seb128> "out of the way"
[22:25] <seb128> like I hit it with the arm or something and it goes over some window I don't care about and focus it
[22:25] <seb128> the only true way to switch is alt-tab ... and the unity launcher now ;-)
[22:34] <chrisccoulson> i like FFM :(
[22:35] <chrisccoulson> i've "adapted" to live without it for now though
[22:35] <chrisccoulson> pitti - how do you still manage to use it?
[22:35] <pitti> chrisccoulson: well, I use it :)
[22:36] <pitti> I seldomly need the menu, and if so I use alt+letter to open it
[22:36] <pitti> then it stays
[22:36] <chrisccoulson> ah, ok. yeah, that would work
[22:36] <chrisccoulson> it's a good job i added alt key support to firefox a couple of weeks ago then ;)
[22:36] <pitti> :)
[22:37] <chrisccoulson> pitti - so, you must still see the untidy, extended menus in firefox all the time then, if you use the keyboard to access them ;)
[22:37] <pitti> chrisccoulson: how do you mean?
[22:38] <chrisccoulson> pitti - you get a different menu if you open it with the keyboard ;)
[22:38] <chrisccoulson> try it on the bookmarks menu for example
[22:38] <chrisccoulson> you get less menu items if you open it with the mouse
[22:38] <chrisccoulson> actually, the history menu is the most different
[22:39] <pitti> hm, in bookmarks there's one more, but I don't see which
[22:39] <chrisccoulson> "Bookmark all tabs"
[22:39] <pitti> ah, the back/forward entries are missing
[22:40] <chrisccoulson> yep :)
[22:40] <chrisccoulson> basically, it's anything that already has another way of accessing the feature in the UI
[22:40] <chrisccoulson> the extra items are displayed when you access it with the keyboard though, to not break accessibility
[22:40] <pitti> aah
[22:41] <pitti> it's subtle enough that I never really noticed
[22:41] <pitti> chrisccoulson: but as I said I hardly use it; the awesome bar does the job quite nicely
[22:41] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i couldn't live without that :)
[22:44] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: pitti: you can also use F10 under unity and then left arrow
[22:44] <didrocks> (for setting the focus to the appmenu)
[22:44] <pitti> didrocks: right
[22:45] <chrisccoulson> ah
[22:45] <chrisccoulson> now, that doesn't work properly for firefox, because it doesn't show the hidden menu items ;)
[22:45] <rickspencer3> hey RAOF I'm replying to this person on @-devel-disuss who has a natty regression in his track pat buttons
[22:45] <chrisccoulson> because unity intercepts the F10, i have no way to know whether the mouse or keyboard opened the menu
[22:45] <rickspencer3> what package should I tell him to $ubuntu-bug agains?
[22:45] <rickspencer3> bryceh_, ^
[22:53] <vish> pitti: how feasible is fixing Bug #757304 for natty itself?
[22:53] <ubot5> Launchpad bug 757304 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "package libreoffice-style-human actually contains Humanity icons and needs to be renamed libreoffice-style-humanity" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/757304
[22:54] <vish> (the package was uploaded for natty)
[22:55] <pitti> seems rather cosmetical to me---most users will never see that package name anyway?
[22:55] <vish> pitti: yup, nothing that affects users, but wrong naming and if we fix for O then we will have a weird dup
[22:55] <vish> dup package
[23:02] <pitti> vish: we'll need a transitional, yes; but we now need that anyway, for people installing beta-1
[23:21]  * didrocks waves good night
[23:22] <bryceh_> rickspencer3, ubuntu-bug xorg
[23:24] <rickspencer3> thought so
[23:28] <bryceh_> rickspencer3, trying to keep it simple for folks, just file anything X-ish against 'xorg'.  People shouldn't have to think too hard about what package is appropriate
[23:29] <bryceh_> rickspencer3, Chase has been really good about following up on input device issues.  The touch stuff brought a good bit of change in so he's been attentive to anything sounding regression-ish with input.
[23:42] <pitti> good night everyone
[23:53] <rickspencer3> 'night pitti