=== orngjce223 is now known as Guest96847
=== Guest96847 is now known as orngjce223_
orngjce223Hmm, this is just weird. I get xruns when I have significant disk activity, but it seems not to be correlated with how much load the processor is under or how much memory's free (for the record, that's generally at least 1GB). What gives?03:53
ailoorngjce223, Could be a jack thing. I would join #jack and discuss it with them.03:54
ailoorngjce223, I seem to remember something about that, but I reallu have no definite idea03:56
holsteinwith internal cards04:01
holsteini find you really have to just accept some interference04:02
orngjce223They say something about hardware interrupts being shared between hard disk and sound card. Okay.04:02
holsteinyou can check that04:02
holsteinin a terminal04:02
holsteincat /proc/interrupts04:02
holsteinsometimes, you can isolate the sound device04:03
holsteinin the bios04:03
holsteinbut, if its a lappy04:03
holsteinmaybe not :/04:03
orngjce223I wouldn't hope for as much, considering it's a teensy little thing that is an "Entertainment PC" that - and here's the really horrid part - it has the "function" buttons overlaid over F1-F12 so that I have to use the Fn-shift to get to the original F1-F12.04:04
holsteinits worth looking into it04:04
holsteinreally just depends on the bios04:04
orngjce223Mm. I'll do some research before digging.04:06
holsteinyeah, just hit F2 or whatever it is04:06
holsteinwhen the machine is booting04:06
holsteinand you'll see real quick if its possible to change IRQ settings or not04:06
orngjce223Yeah, I think I'll go look into it - I've done such fiddling before to swap the priority of boot drives to get my thumbdrive installations working, so I assume it wouldn't be impossibly hard if it was present.04:07
holsteinits a lot like that04:07
holsteinonboard device config?04:08
holsteinsomething like that maybe^04:08
holsteindifferent per machine04:08
ailoorngjce223, Could be that the kernel 2.6.39 will help. Since it can give your device higher priority. Also, you could try realtime kernels. Have you done that?04:09
orngjce223I'm using lowlatency, not realtime, but I'm told realtime would be worse for a laptop's battery life and that's a bit of an issue.04:10
ailoorngjce223, What you get with realtime kernel is your audio device will get higher priority, together with the rtirq script04:11
ailo-lowlatency also uses more power than a normal kernel04:11
ailoDon't know how big the difference is between the three04:11
ailoorngjce223, Usually, when there is an irq share problem, you go for a realtime kernel. But, now when 2.6.39 is including that realtime feature, you can even us a normal kernel with the rtirq-init script to let your device get higher priority04:13
* orngjce223 is currently sifting through the IRQ listing trying to find the sound card04:13
ailoThis is impossible with kernels before 2.6.39, unless they are realtime patched04:13
holsteinwith laptops04:13
holsteini usually have several kernels04:13
holsteinlike dual booting04:13
holsteinand choose -realtime as needed04:14
orngjce223Okay, Googling is not telling me what "io-apic-fasteoi" is in that table. Anyone else have any answer?04:19
holsteinorngjce223: it is a qualifier04:19
holsteinnot a device04:19
holsteini was looking that up the other day04:20
holsteinand thats as far as i got04:20
holstein 23:     145379         10   IO-APIC-fasteoi   ehci_hcd:usb1, uhci_hcd:usb204:20
holsteinnot so good ^04:20
holstein 17:    9780510     384193   IO-APIC-fasteoi   ath9k04:20
orngjce223Okay, then I dunno, my sound card seems to be sharing with said "qualifier" and a couple USB controllers (I don't currently have any USB stuff plugged in).04:21
holstein^ thats just my wifi04:21
holsteinorngjce223: if you can get it off to its own04:21
holsteini would04:21
orngjce223On the other hand 7 seems to be open.04:21
orngjce223I'll try that.04:21
holsteinif its just sitting there04:23
holsteinyou might as well04:23
orngjce223Or maybe 5 though I'm led to believe it's not possible to have more than 16 of these assigned at one time, so 7 is probably better since it hasn't been triggered at all, despite "io-apic-edge" sitting on it.04:24
holsteinorngjce223: did it help?04:35
holsteinit might not04:35
orngjce223See, the thing here is, it's a BIOS thing04:35
orngjce223My other friend who knows something about computers says if I don't have a way to recover if I accidentally brick it I oughtn't try. And since I can't presently crack open this thing and replace the motherboard if i do something wrong, I think I'll hold off.04:36
holsteinorngjce223: ?04:36
holsteindo what you feel comfortable with04:37
orngjce223Fair enough.04:37
holsteinbut, dont let your friend scare you04:37
holsteinyou're not flashing the bios04:37
holsteinyou are just sitting a device to a differnt IRQ port04:37
holsteinthats not dangerous04:37
holsteinand totally un-doable04:37
orngjce223Mm, I understand that much.04:37
holsteinflashing the bios though04:38
holsteini get nerous with that04:38
orngjce223I think I'll search to see if this firmware version has any known bugs before I do it though, just to be careful.04:38
holsteinbut, i do it when its necessary04:38
holsteinorngjce223: the bios firmware?04:39
holsteini would hope its well tested04:39
orngjce223Yeah, I assume so, but if I'm going to do this I may as well check.04:40
holsteinsure, but im sure you'll find some post about something quirky happening04:40
holsteinbut, you never know exactly the case04:41
holsteinorngjce223: i say, if you dont feel comfortable04:41
holsteindont do it04:41
ailoorngjce223, Anything you do from within Linux will be soft.04:41
orngjce223Fair enough.04:41
holsteinbut, i have changed IRQ settings literally hundreds of times04:41
holsteinin bioses04:41
holsteinand thats never itself borked anything04:41
holsteinonly helped really04:42
holsteinwith sharing issues04:42
ailoorngjce223, You can always change back. It won't do any harm changing irq04:42
ailoSo, was the audio device sharing irq? Did you establish that?04:43
ailoorngjce223, Is it pci, usb..?04:43
holsteinwith a couple USB ports04:43
holsteinif i read correctly04:44
holsteini had a laptop04:44
orngjce223Yeah, USB. Despite the fact that I don't currently have any plugged in. But it might help to move it across.04:44
holsteinCOULDNT change the settings in the bios04:44
holsteinand it was very bad04:44
holsteinwith sharing USB and audio device04:44
ailoUsually on PC's you're able to change irq at least for pci devices. Don't know about usb04:46
ailoSo, if some of the usb ports aren't sharing irq, orngjce223 would just need to pick the right one, right?04:47
orngjce223Well, there's an interrupt 5 that shows as not having interrupted, ever, despite apparently having IO-apic-edge stuck on it, so that seems a decent choice.04:49
orngjce2237, sorry, not 5.04:49
orngjce223My card's on 16, which has only been interrupted a few hundred thousand times in this thing's lifetime. o_o04:49
holsteinyeah, IO-apic-edge is a qualifier04:50
orngjce223{20:53:17}<orngjce223>I'm trying to learn to work with modifying my perception of probabilities so as not to be over- or under-scared by any one event.05:02
orngjce223{20:54:58}<orngjce223>I'll estimate the probability of a fairly well-tested but low-level procedure going wrong is approximately the same order of magnitude as the failure of any other part in this machine in the next day or so.05:02
orngjce223{20:57:37}<orngjce223>I'm not rebooting now but I'll look to see if the option exists, /without changing it/, the next time I have to reboot.05:02
orngjce223{20:58:07}<orngjce223>Once I know the option exists, I'll look more into the possible ramifications of the way this particular model happens to manage these things, and only then that will be a final decision.05:02
orngjce223This cautious decision is because this is the only machine I currently have access to, and it is also the one I happen to use to access schoolwork.05:03
holsteinget you a spare box05:03
orngjce223So there's that.05:03
holsteingo to the charity shop05:03
holsteinOR better yet05:03
holsteinfind a borked one05:03
holsteinand straigten it out05:03
orngjce223Well, I'll see if the neighbors put any out with the trash in the next few weeks. The people in this neighborhood are affluent enough to believe that computers just "lose steam" (i.e. get infested with malware) after a year or so, and replace them.05:04
holsteini just got one a couple weeks ago05:05
holsteinold sony viao05:05
orngjce223This means I should be able to just wipe and reinstall OS and not have to do any significant work, anyway.05:05
holsteinwell, you can flash the bios05:05
holsteinand mess with it05:06
holsteina lot05:06
holsteinand get comfortable with it05:06
holsteinwhats a drag is the way apple does it05:06
holsteinyou do a key combination to kinda reset the 'bios'05:06
orngjce223Oh yeah there's another old laptop in the basement; the power supply and battery are both borked, so that's kind of out as an option until I get a semi-working box.05:06
holsteinyou never see any of it05:06
holsteinmy girlfriends CDrom drive would just eject05:07
holsteinevery couple minutes05:07
holsteinand i did the pram reset keyboard shortcut to sort that out05:07
ailoI was using a Pentium 3 for live audio processing just under a year ago, and I could still do it, but there were a few problems. It made a lot of noise, but the performance was good05:15
holsteinyeah, by P4 with a gig of ram05:18
holsteinit really did fine05:18
holsteinmore than enough05:18
ailoI got by with 512MB, using puredyne05:21
orngjce223Hmm. This is interesting. My father uses a 512MB P3 Tablet PC as his backup box, and I might be able to get it off him if I provide a replacement (I also draw occasionally so the tablet might be useful).05:22
orngjce223The problem being that the replacement would need to already come with a version of Windows (ugh), so I'd need to buy that.05:22
orngjce223I wonder how well he'd take it if I handed him $50 and a backup box with no OS, since I would rather not touch Windows.05:23
holsteinid get something from the trash05:23
holsteina desktop05:24
holsteinsoemthing cheaper, and easier to play with05:24
orngjce223Fair enough05:25
holsteinlike that laptop in the basement05:27
holsteinif it were a desktop that you needed a power supply for05:27
holsteinyou could get one for 5 bucks at a charity shop05:27
orngjce223Also, one of my friends is taking a clip of TTGL and editing Morgan Freeman's face over every face in the anime. There's a good explanation for this, I swear.05:31
ailoIt's a balancing act for me. At home, I couldn't use an old PC for long periods of time. I'd get tinnitus from the noise05:31
psionicsinI'm SO wanting to switch over to Ubuntu Studio (from Windows 7), but there are some ESSENTIAL things that I need. And by need, I mean that they can't be subbed with other programs. Has anyone gotten Reaper, Reason, and Photoshop CS5 to work on 10.10? I need these programs fully functioning before I switch over. I'm hoping I don't get disappointed.06:13
ailopsionicsin, Seems like you are moving an arsenal of Windows programs to Linux, which is not optimal06:14
holsteini would look at winehq06:14
ailopsionicsin, You could have a look at Linux programs that do the same thing06:14
holsteinand if you can, try not to think about it as substituting apps06:14
holsteinbut rather, learning a new workflow06:14
holsteinand if you can, try not to think about it as substituting apps06:15
psionicsinI've looked at winehq, but I can't find anything solid. Poeple say "Oh yeah I've done this", but no one wants to elaborate.06:15
holsteinbut rather, learning a new workflow06:15
holsteinlike, how to get whatever job done06:15
holsteinwe have lots of native tools06:15
holsteinbut, they have learning curves06:15
psionicsinholstein: if ardour could open and operate with reaper program files...I'd be all for it. It can't however and I have over 100 productions that would be useless.06:15
holsteinyou have to export them06:16
holsteinas audio06:16
holsteini still have some cubase sessions06:16
holsteinbut, if i need them06:16
holsteini'll export them as audio06:16
psionicsinAnd then there's the subject of VST/VSTi's. I use the Native Insturments Komplete 7 exclusively for a lot of things.06:16
holsteinand bring them into ardour06:16
holsteinpsionicsin: you got a lot of windows apps06:17
holsteinthe way i did the transition06:17
holsteini had a laptop06:17
holsteinfor my day to day stuff06:17
holsteinwith mepis on it06:17
holsteinthen ubuntu eventually06:17
holsteinbut, the studio was still running windows for a while after that06:17
holsteintil i got comfortable with the basics06:17
holsteinafter i stopped trying to find replacements for apps06:18
holsteinand just started learning the tools06:18
holsteinthings went a lot smoother06:18
psionicsinholstein: I am on a windows machines, so I would have a lot of those lol. I know I do NOT want to dual boot. And I'm also very comfortable with the Linux OS. This won't be my first time using it at all. It's just that the first time I switched someone promised me I could do all of this with Wine alone...and 3 months later I couldn't and took a hit.06:18
holsteinpsionicsin: someone?06:19
holsteinsomeone from wineHQ ?06:19
psionicsinSo there's either a couple processes people are purposly leaving out, or poeple are liars.06:19
holsteinor the vendors?06:19
psionicsinIt was someone from another board.06:19
holsteinwell, i dont think its fair to say liar06:19
holsteini mean, someone with wine and linux might say that06:20
holsteinyou can run windows apps in wine06:20
holsteinbut, thats different that trying to run some of those apps06:20
holsteinall i can suggest is trying them in wine06:20
holsteinor moving forward06:20
psionicsinholstein: yeah. like I've reduced my need for graphics down to photoshop. But for the music...I can't stress enough how essential VST/VSTi's are (the ones that I bought and currently have). Do you know of anyone who has successfully installed those?06:21
holsteinyou would need to join #kxstudio06:22
holsteinand hang for a bit06:22
holsteinthose guys do a lot of that06:22
holsteini think you should call the company you bought them from06:23
holsteinand ask for linux support06:23
holsteinor a refund06:23
holsteinbut, thats over the top i realize06:23
psionicsinWhat's #kxstudio? Is that a special distro of linux or just a channel?06:23
holsteinkxstudio is an ubuntu based distro06:23
holsteinthe dev has tweaked a couple things to work in there06:23
holsteinnot sure what though because i personally dont use those tools06:23
holsteinbut i see them talking about them sometimes06:24
holsteini think it was reaper06:24
psionicsinHmm ok I'll look into that and talk to some people from there. Thank you so much for your help.06:24
holsteini couldnt imagine going back to the tools i used pre-linux06:25
ailopsionicsin, The thing is, at least for me, that when you work from withing a Windows environment, coming to Linux might even mean that you start making music differently. At least I do.06:25
holsteini also remember being very concerned about losing a few plugins that i was really comfortable with06:25
holsteinailo: i agree06:26
psionicsinailo: wel the thing for me is that I rely heavily on the kontakt interface and it's sample packs. To make music differently would mean to forfeit my sound, as nothing in the linux world can compare to Kontakt.06:26
psionicsinOr rather the soundpacks for it06:27
holsteinpsionicsin: check out #opensourcemusicians06:27
holsteinwhen you get a chance06:27
holsteinthere are electronic guys over there06:28
psionicsinholstein: ok. what are they good for? Or do you want me to ask these questions in there as well?06:28
holsteinmore MIDI minded folk06:28
holsteinpsionicsin: you can06:28
holsteinyou can say that06:28
holsteinnothing in the linux world can compare to  Kontakt.06:28
ailopsionicsin, There are ways to get vst to work natively from within Linux, but not everything works06:28
holsteinsee if you can get any takers on it06:28
ailopsionicsin, But, DAWs may be a little trickier06:29
psionicsinOk. If i can get Reason, Reaper, Photoshop & the NI Komplete VSTi's to work...then everything else will be cake.06:29
holsteinwhy not dual boot?06:30
holsteinor run windows?06:30
psionicsinBecause I, personally, find that to be too troublesome. I'd rather have everything all in one. Now if I'm forced to stay with Windows then I will. But I'd give it up in a heartbeat.06:30
psionicsinThat and also Windows likes to put it's mark on everything you plug into it. Linux minds it's own business.06:31
holsteinwell, at least now you can purchase devices and software with linux support06:32
ailopsionicsin, One thing you could do is send mails to the products you use and let them know you want to use them on Linux.06:33
psionicsinWell NI's user base is split between Windows and Mac. They'r enot going to make a linux version. At least not in my lifetime. Reaper I know can work in Linux with some tweaking. And my soundcard is fully supported as well.06:35
holsteinNI will do whatever is lucrative06:35
holsteinthey run a buisness06:35
psionicsinExactly. Although if they made a linux version, people would swarm.06:35
holsteini think enough to notice would swarm06:36
holsteinits too bad06:36
psionicsinSame with Propellerhead for Reason06:36
=== frederickjh is now known as frederickjh_away
meganerdI moved away from Windows on my Daw in 2004, the hardest part was adapting my workflow.  I never thought I would be able to give up the NI stuff, but tying yourself to the tools also ties you to the platform.14:38
meganerdoh wait this is a really old conversation, I should grab a coffee.14:39
holsteinmeganerd: hehe15:52
phed__meganerd: never irrelevant stuff that, tho16:16
phed__i am especially worried when you tie yourself to an inner platform, such as protools and such16:16
phed__its like having a great studio, but all the equipment has alien connectors16:17
meganerdNo argument from me there.16:36
meganerdNI does have some nice products, but the overall cost in being tied to Windows is just too high IMO16:37
orngjce223Also, the option doesn't exist.18:31
meganerdhas anyone here built linuxsampler recently?19:27
AutoStaticNo, last time I did so was about 6 months ago :(19:27
meganerdI noticed that on my 10.10 installs it was not there, so I checked it out via cvs, just having some weird issues.  Currently "error: cannot run /bin/bash ./config.sub", which makes sense since config.sub does not exist.19:29
meganerdhad to use autoconf to generate configure.  It has been a long time since I have had to debug this sort of thing.19:30
AutoStaticAh, that kind of stuff19:30
AutoStaticAnd apparently nobody has a recent version of LS in his/hers PPA for AMverick19:31
AutoStaticMaverick ^^19:31
meganerdI noticed that as well19:32
meganerdI found a how to, but it suggested downgrading jack19:32
AutoStaticLS is a PITA to package, also because of those compilation issues19:32
meganerdI figured as much.  bristol used to be like that, I used to have to build it myself.  This is the first major rebuild of my DAW for a couple of years.19:34
meganerdIt has been a major headache, though no fault of UBS19:35
meganerdbad RAM + Sandy bridge made troubleshooting difficult early on19:35
AutoStaticWhy 10.10?19:37
meganerdlatest stable19:38
meganerdthat and 11.04 would not install19:39
meganerdIt was probably the bad RAM, but once I sorted out the hardware issues 10.10 was installed and humming nicely.  I had to add an nVidia GPU to get dual monitors, but that will likely come out once 11.04 is released.19:40
AutoStaticIf you like compiling everything yourself 10.10 might work well19:49
AutoStaticFor the moment I still prefer 10.0419:49
meganerdDid not know that.  I moved from 64Studio, the last version of which was based on 8.0419:50
meganerdwhat else am I missing with 10.10?19:52
AutoStaticNo real-time kernel19:55
AutoStaticOr at least, not an official one19:55
AutoStaticApparently people who need a real-time kernel for 10.10 are advised to use a natty one19:55
meganerdI built my own kernel based on upstream.19:56
AutoStaticIf you're using FireWire then 10.10 is a bit of an in-between release as it offers both the old and the new stack19:56
AutoStaticAk, kernel-wise you have no problems then  :)19:57
meganerdI have avoided firewire as much as possible, currently I have an RME 965219:57
AutoStaticHe he, no issues there too then :)19:57
AutoStaticI do use FireWire and I'm a lazy ass unwilling to build kernels myself19:57
meganerdThe kernel was an old habit from my Debian and 64Studio days, those kernels tended to be too old for my hardware19:57
meganerdI spent a lot of time on research before I settled on the RME.  I have been using Linux since the 90s, hardware support is far better these days.  The only problem is that it is a PCI card, which is going away soon (it is missing on a number of Sandy Bridge boards)19:59
meganerdThe kernel building was something I used to have to do since I have been using a laptop with Linux as my day to day machine for the better part of a decade.  Lots of hardware issues so I had to track fairly bleeding edge kernels.  It seems to be the other way around these days, my laptop has no issues but my desktop is a PITA :)20:00
AutoStaticHe he, shit happens20:02
meganerdHeh, ya, I can't complain too much, Linux and FLOSS in general has been good to me.20:03
AutoStaticSame here20:04
AutoStaticDid you ever do any msuic production stuff on other platforms?20:04
AutoStaticmusic ^^20:04
meganerdWindows, and some Mac20:05
meganerdI gave my copy of Cubase SX to my best friend who has been keeping it up to date.  I shudder to think how much NI has made from him.  Ironic since has been mostly unemployed for the 15 years I have known him.  My old roomate is a heavy Sonar user20:06
meganerdSo Cubase and Sonar.  I used to love the propeller head stuff.  Rebirth was one of my all time favorite pieces of software.20:06
meganerdI left Windows before I could get hooked on Reason like all my friends.20:07
AutoStaticI'm now looking at the book 'Cubase SX Power!'20:08
AutoStatic462 pages20:08
AutoStaticAnd we still couldn't record properly with it20:08
AutoStatic(it = Cubase 4 I think)20:09
AutoStaticAnd it was all cracked stuff on a Windows XP license of my work so we ditched it20:10
ailo_AutoStatic, Did you have irq share problems? I forget20:11
AutoStaticYes, on my notebook20:11
ailo_Was thinking if you've had time to test the latest kernel20:11
ailo_Just curious to hear about results20:12
AutoStatic16:        153     272248   IO-APIC-fasteoi   uhci_hcd:usb3, ohci1394, mmc0, eth1, jmb38x_ms:slot0, nvidia20:12
ailo_I'm sure you heard about it being able to adjust irq priority20:12
meganerdnvidia, ouch.  My nemesis on RT kernels20:13
AutoStaticCan't you already do that ailo_?20:13
ailo_AutoStatic, not on vanilla kernels, not until 2.6.3920:13
AutoStaticmeganerd, on my audio installs I use nouveau20:13
ailo_So, now the rtirq-init script works with the vanilla kernel20:14
AutoStaticI know, 2.6.39 has forced IRQ threading WOOHOO!20:14
AutoStaticLinux probably bought himself a nice soundcard but it didn't work he he20:14
ailo_For me it has no effect, since I have no problems20:14
AutoStaticI mean20:14
meganerdcool.  I have not yet messed with noveau,20:14
ailo_Don't know who we should thank, but he or she deserves a kiss for sure20:15
AutoStaticSo prbably Linus himself merged it20:15
meganerdI should check it out.  Though the nVidia is coming out as soon as 11.04 is released20:16
AutoStaticFor me personally it probably means I won't be needing a real-time kernel anymore20:16
ailo_AutoStatic, Well, I guess Linus is one of those who decides which stuff he accepts, but I don't know if he has any opinions on the code20:18
ailo_Someone has pushed the code, but who?20:18
ailo_AutoStatic, If you happen to install Natty, abogani has compiled the kernel as -lowlatency20:19
ailo_AutoStatic, https://launchpad.net/~abogani/+archive/snmp++20:19
ailo_I get very nice results, but the rtirq-init does nothing for me20:20
AutoStaticailo_, I won't be installing Natty until it has been officially released, sorry :(20:20
ailo_Well, not long now20:20
AutoStaticThe 29th right?20:21
AutoStaticBut the I probably still won't install it, way too happy with 10.0420:21
AutoStaticthen ^^20:21
meganerdI will be moving to it, if for no other reason than support for my integrated GPU20:22
ailo_Natty may have some problems, small ones, annoying ones. Hard to know for me now. I need to do a fresh install later20:22
meganerdI can get that noisy nVidia out of this machine20:22
ailo_Nothing serious though20:22
ailo_Unity is not bad, I think.20:22
ailo_But, gnome2 is still on it, so you get to choose20:23
ailo_Ah, they all have problems. It's always annoying when something worked flawlessly on a previous release and then didn't20:30
charlie-tcaAnyone in that works on the actual images here?21:07
holsteincharlie-tca: ?21:59
holsteini have worked on images before21:59
holsteinif you mean does anyone do professinal graphics on ubuntu21:59
holsteinwith opensource tools21:59
holsteinsure :)22:00
charlie-tcano, cd images22:02
charlie-tcathe things that we are building for beta222:02
holsteinO I C22:02
=== frederickjh_away is now known as frederickjh
holsteincharlie-tca: are you in #ubuntustudio-devel22:02
charlie-tcagot it worked out, I think22:02
charlie-tcano, but maybe I should have been, huh?22:03
holsteinfeel free to join the devel channel22:03

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