[00:00] <charlie-tca> Because not everyone wants to wait. torrents are dependant on how many feed back, aren't they?
[00:00] <arand> Since it requires an additional application.
[00:01] <seidos> an additional application that is installed by default
[00:01] <seidos> if the main server is seeding, it could only get faster in theory
[00:03] <yofel> but you still need to update the torrent file every day, and since probably not everyone is going to replace theirs every day they don't bother providing that option
[00:03] <yofel> if you want checksummed download use zsync
[00:07] <seidos> yofel: the link would be on a centralized website though
[00:25] <Superstar> Does anyone know how to get XChat under the Mail icon?
[00:30] <Superstar> I figured it out - install xchat-gnome-indicator
[00:51] <svu> is it a known fact that jhbuild that workd with 10.10 does not work with 11.04?
[00:51] <svu> or is it me?
[00:55] <c_k> beta2 in 5 minutes :o
[00:55] <rww> or not.
[00:56] <c_k> ?
[00:56] <c_k> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+milestone/ubuntu-11.04-beta-2 says expected in 5 minutes :S
[00:56] <c_k> well, 3 minutes now
[00:57] <skyjumper> anyone else with a synaptics touchpad unable to change certain settings?
[00:57] <rww> c_k: That page is not accurate.
[00:57] <skyjumper> 'sensitivity' in mouse prefs doesn't seem to do anything
[00:57] <skyjumper> gpointing-device-settings seems buggy all around
[00:57] <rww> Launchpad for some reason has a countdown to the day that the milestone is expected (but not guaranteed)
[00:58] <rww> so congratulations, the 24-hour period during which beta 2 will probably come out starts in 2 minutes :|
[00:58] <Superstar> Does SSH command line support keep alive?
[00:58] <c_k> hehe, it's midday on the 14th here
[00:58] <c_k> I guess I should just wait another day then
[00:58] <Jerub> Superstar: yes, man ssh_config
[00:59] <drc> clear
[00:59] <ceed^> Natty has now run stable without any hiccups for three days. Last week was a nightmare.
[01:01] <Superstar> jerub thanks i skimmed it before but -o TCPKeepAlive
[01:03] <ceed^> skyjumper, got synaptic, checking now.
[01:15] <Superstar> Can you manipulate a program from command line to think you're not using root when you are?
[01:15] <seidos> i can't
[01:16] <skyjumper> ceed^: how's it working for you?
[01:16] <ceed^> skyjumper, circular scrolling isn't working. It can be set though. Other than that it all seems to work...
[01:17] <skyjumper> what kind of machine?
[01:17] <ceed^> It's an Asus laptop
[01:17] <torchie> YOU'RE an asus laptop
[01:17] <skyjumper> seems weird on this thinkpad t61p, was weird on a t400 also
[01:18] <ceed^> torchie, I am? :)
[01:18] <torchie> :D
[01:19] <ceed^> skyjumper, I will try it a bit more and let you know if I run into problem. If I'm quite it works :)
[01:19] <ceed^> *quiet
[01:22] <magn3ts> Anyone have 3d accel, aka Unity, working with vbox currently?
[01:25] <skyjumper> ceed^: appreciate the help
[02:12] <seidos> i'm writing this from a beta2 liveusb
[02:12] <seidos> it looks...better
[02:16] <vacho> guys
[02:16] <vacho> will I be able to upgrade ubuntu 11.04 beta to 11.04 final when it comes out?????
[02:16] <izinucs> I just booted from the live cd for 11.04 Beta.. all looks the same as 10.10 with the exception of the "Big" button on the upper bar.. no notification that unity was dropping back to 2d mode.. so what's up ?  is there something I need to turn on?
[02:17] <izinucs> vacho: yes just keep doing your updates and you'll be there.. no need to reinstall
[02:17] <vacho> izinucs: I have the same problem, let me know if you find a solution
[02:17] <seidos> i'm am running beta2
[02:17] <vacho> i am running latest just installed it
[02:18] <izinucs> seidos: me too
[02:18] <rww> vacho: yes
[02:18] <yayoj1> random question, how is 11.04 performing?  I've heard various complaints about the new unity interface.  Do you think it will worth the hard drive space, or is the wait for the next lts the best bet?
[02:18] <izinucs> yayoj1: next LTS will also have unity.. might want to get use to it now
[02:19]  * rww doesn't see an 11.04 b2 release notice, shrugs
[02:19] <izinucs> well whatever todays iso is.. . :)
[02:20] <vacho> i just installed the 11.04 on my hp deskop
[02:20] <ubuntu007> Would it be a bad idea to upgrade to ubuntu 11.04 now?
[02:20] <vacho> it does even start after installation
[02:20] <ubuntu007> I mean, it's going to beta 2 tomorrow
[02:20] <ubuntu007> is it such a bad idea?
[02:20] <rww> ubuntu007: depends on whether you mind beta-quality software.
[02:21] <ubuntu007> How stable is it
[02:21] <ubuntu007> stable enough?
[02:21] <ubuntu007> I just need web browser and libreoffice and software center, that's all
[02:22] <rww> It starts up when I log in in the morning most of the time :\
[02:22] <izinucs> ubuntu007: stable enough for that
[02:22] <ubuntu007> Alright, I'll upgrade now
[02:22] <ubuntu007> bored of 10.10
[02:22] <frankwe> ubuntu007: you could test with a live cd if your graphic card works
[02:22] <ubuntu007> Yeah, everything works
[02:24] <ubuntu007> ugh, trying to find upgrade manager, keep getting error saying directory couldn't be found
[02:27] <ubuntu007> Why is when I try to run update manager I get some error saying directory couldn't be found
[02:27] <vacho> can someone pelase help me? I see the the bootstrap but when I get into ubuntu interface, my monitor turns off..why?
[02:29] <ubuntu007> Vacho
[02:29] <ubuntu007> WHat kind of monitar?
[02:29] <vacho> viewsonic 21 inch?
[02:30] <ubuntu007> sec
[02:30] <ubuntu007> Ask on the ubuntu fourms, you'll get more help
[02:31] <ubuntu007> ubuntuforums.org
[02:31] <ubuntu007> make sure yo ustate your monitar
[02:32] <vacho> ustate?
[02:32] <ubuntu007> typo
[02:32] <ubuntu007> sorry
[02:32] <ubuntu007> you*
[02:32] <ubuntu007> state*
[02:32] <HMRC_> Is it possible to force outbound traffic of a specific user or group to a particular nic?
[02:34] <rww> HMRC_: Which version of Ubuntu are you using?
[02:35] <c_k> you probably can in 55.04
[02:38] <HMRC_> rww: 10.04. I have webmin installed, can I do it through the Firewall module? It controls IP Tables
[02:38] <rww> HMRC_: 10.04 isn't supported in #ubuntu, and webmin isn't supported period.
[02:38] <rww> !webmin
[02:39] <rww> !crossposting
[02:39] <rww> in #ubuntu+1, sorry.
[02:40] <ubuntu007>  gnome classic is stable right?
[02:43] <ubuntu007> Anyone here?
[02:43] <ubuntu007> Is gnome classic stable
[02:43] <ubuntu007> and do I have to back up my ideas before upgrading?
[02:43] <ubuntu007> Are will all my thigns transfer?
[02:43] <Sovek> Hey, I have a question on 11.04 Xorg issues
[02:43] <ubuntu007> things*
[02:44] <ubuntu007> Sovek
[02:44] <ubuntu007> is ubuntu 11.04 stable enough?
[02:44] <Sovek> yes?
[02:44] <Sovek> dunno
[02:44] <Daekdroom> Enough for what?
[02:44] <Sovek> I can't use the keyboard
[02:44] <ubuntu007> :O
[02:44] <ubuntu007> For use
[02:44] <Daekdroom> Sovek, that sort of answers it.
[02:44] <ubuntu007> everyday use until release
[02:45] <Sovek> I need to use a USB keyboard in order to get something useable
[02:45] <Daekdroom> ubuntu007, for what matters, I have to go to tty1 and kill and restart unity quite often.
[02:45] <Sovek> its been suggested that Xorg is whats causing the problem
[02:45] <ubuntu007> Dangs
[02:45] <ubuntu007> but the classic is stable right
[02:45] <Daekdroom> Quite stable.
[02:45] <ubuntu007> Cool, thanks
[02:45] <ubuntu007> and I don't have to back up my stuff
[02:45] <Sovek> I'm currently going to do a fresh install of 10.10 Netbook Remix alongside 11.04
[02:45] <ubuntu007> as I'm upgrading
[02:45] <ubuntu007> correct?
[02:46] <Daekdroom> ubuntu007, I'd test the LiveCD first to check if it gets along with your hardware.
[02:46] <ubuntu007> It does
[02:46] <Daekdroom> Sovek, 10.10 Netbook remix is a bomb.
[02:46] <ubuntu007> I already did that
[02:46] <Sovek> But I just want to verify that removing Xorg isn't going to cause issues
[02:46] <kevin5574> ubuntu007: just set yourself up with separate /home and / partitions
[02:46] <ubuntu007> Excuse me?
[02:46] <Sovek> yeah I know, but I need to get used to unity since its going to be in 11.04
[02:47] <kevin5574> ubuntu007: just install with separate / and /home partitions, and format / but leave /home alone when you install again
[02:47] <Daekdroom> Sovek, unity is quite changed.
[02:47] <kevin5574> clean install, without removing /home
[02:47]  * Sovek prefers Gnome over Unity
[02:47] <thiebaude> Sovek, using gnome3 now :)
[02:47] <Sovek> how?
[02:47] <ubuntu007> Nah, I rather upgrade
[02:47] <ubuntu007> I'll clean install some other time
[02:48] <thiebaude> gnome3 ppa's
[02:48] <Sovek> meaning?
[02:48]  * Sovek is a linux noob
[02:48] <dmenear> Hello
[02:48] <thiebaude> all i did was a search on google and found how to
[02:49] <thiebaude> install gnome3 on ubuntu 11.03
[02:49] <thiebaude> :)
[02:49] <thiebaude> 11.04
[02:49] <Sovek> do I have to do the alternate install to get Gnome?
[02:49]  * Sovek is stuck with WiFi only
[02:49] <yofel_> !gnome3
[02:50] <Sovek> riiiight
[02:50] <Sovek> is it really unstable?
[02:50] <thiebaude> exactly the first 2 times it did break my system a few days ago
[02:50]  * Sovek is using a netbook
[02:50] <Sovek> right, I'll be using Unity thank you
[02:50] <thiebaude> but i tried it today, and i guess i was lucky,lol
[02:50] <thiebaude> yw
[02:51] <Sovek> are there plans to allow us to choose between Gnome and Unity?
[02:51] <Sovek> like 10.10
[02:51] <thiebaude> gnome classic
[02:51] <ubuntu007> Yes
[02:52] <Sovek> BTW, who do I talk to in here to report a bug if I can't report a bug while under the problem OS
[02:52] <thiebaude> !launchpad
[02:53] <thiebaude> Sovek,
[02:53] <Sovek> tried it, it WILL NOT let me report a bug without going through the damned program under Ubuntu
[02:54] <yofel> !bugs
[02:54] <yofel> there *are* instructions on how to file the bug without apport, read the *whole* page
[03:01] <Sovek> Umm, what do I put under package?
[03:01] <Sovek> it says Kernel not found
[03:01] <rwhittle> how is everyone liking beta2 ?
[03:01] <rww> beta 2 isn't out yet
[03:01] <rwhittle> ooh ok
[03:02] <Sovek> .....
[03:02] <Sovek> does Beta2 work on a dell mini 1018?
[03:02] <dmenear> Yes, but you definitely want to install available updates after installing the beta. Solved a lot of issues I was having.
[03:02]  * Sovek doubts this since no one else has reported said bug
[03:02] <rwhittle> i didn't get many updates today.
[03:02] <yofel> Sovek: package for the kernel is 'linux'
[03:02] <Sovek> right
[03:03] <dmenear> Yes, I meant fresh after install
[03:03] <Sovek> finally https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/760385
[03:03] <yofel> we're in beta freeze, so not many updates until beta2 is out
[03:04] <Sovek> so its possible the keyboard and touchpad work after installing updates?
[03:05]  * Sovek needs a USB hub BAD
[03:05] <Sovek> 2 working USB ports sucks
[03:11] <Sovek> anyone?
[03:12] <penguinbait> I have a process that needs to run prior to X, I see X starts in rcS.d at S70 and I placed a framebuffer install script prior at rcS.d/S49 and in  rc2/3/4/5 I am working with a netbook armel image and it never starts my script, I can then switch to console and start up the script.  How can I force it to run ASAP in the boot ?
[03:12] <DanaG> Say, I'm trying to UEFI-boot Natty.
[03:13] <DanaG> When I do "boot from EFI file" to boot the loader on the CD, it works (though has trashed consoles until KMS kicks in)...
[03:13] <DanaG> But when I try to efi-boot the installed Grub, it just hangs at a not-even-blinking cursor, even before the Grub menu appears.
[03:14] <DanaG> So, how do I troubleshoot Grub?
[03:15] <genii-around> !grub2
[03:16] <DanaG> Note that grub-pc works fine... it's only grub-efi-amd64 that's broken.
[03:21] <russjr08> Natty Beta 2 comes out tomorrow :D
[03:21] <DanaG> And that page doesn't mention EFI even once.
[03:23]  * Sovek will just wait to do everything after tax day
[03:24] <rwhittle> tomahawk media player packages are now in the tomahawk ppa built for natty.  has genius playlists which you set the criteria for.  online streaming and sharing of music playback through jabber, last.fm scrobbling.  and nermal mode.
[03:25] <rwhittle> echonest does the genius track picking
[03:25] <rwhittle> its efficient
[03:26] <DanaG> Okay, it gets weirder:
[03:26] <DanaG> If I boot with serial-over-lan attached (which puts the laptop in text mode), it works.
[03:27] <kevin5574> when does unity start in the boot process?  before gdm?
[03:30] <rww> kevin5574: with compiz after login
[03:35] <kevin5574> rww: thanks
[03:39] <semitones> so i guess
[03:39] <semitones> april 14
[03:39] <semitones> is when things get stable up around here
[03:39] <DanaG> UEFI seems not well supported...
[03:39] <semitones> or is that when features get frozen up around here
[03:51] <rww> !schedule
[03:54] <semitones> rww, that's where i got the 14th from -- now is that when it gets stable, or is that when they stop adding features?
[03:55] <rww> semitones: They stopped adding features at feature freeze on the 24th. The freezes on the 14th are when updates stop unless they're required for release or exceptional
[03:56] <rww> February 24th, that is
[03:56] <semitones> rww, oh, awesome!
[03:56] <semitones> so things might get more stable then :P
[04:02] <fuzzybunny69y> hey guys I am trying to install Natty on my brothers laptop with windows 7 and it is on the resizing partitions part but I am not sure if it is actually doing anything. The little indicator on the mouse is spinning and I can move the window but the progress bar at the bottom isn't moving.
[04:05] <bluefox83> why does fusion-icon crash D:
[04:05] <bluefox83> i can't get any effects to work :(
[04:06] <mahfrk> Hi, I downloaded natyy beta iso and booted it into an USB stick. then it on my HDD. But i am getting classic gnome instead of Unity. I am using Nvidia card. So how to remove noveau drivers and install proprietary driver to get unity? Can anyone guide with detailed steps?
[04:07] <ubuntu007> Man, it's taking forever to upgrade
[04:07] <torchie> is there a way to save libreoffice toolbar settings?
[04:08] <torchie> like I always have to close a toolbar when I start it up
[04:08] <bjsnider> mahfrk, simpy use hardware drivers manager to activate the recommended driver
[04:09] <mahfrk> bjsnider: no. from some threads in ubuntuforums i get to know that it will not work, because open source noveau driver is still there and system will use it instead of proprietary driver
[04:10] <bjsnider> mahfrk, i don't care what these threads say
[04:10] <bjsnider> what card do you have?
[04:10] <mahfrk> bjsnider: okay. can any other get me some detailed instructions or link to a page?
[04:10] <mahfrk> bjsnider: Nvidia 3 serie
[04:11] <bjsnider> more detailed than that. lspci |grep VGA
[04:13] <bjsnider> mahfrk, run this command in a console: lspci | grep VGA
[04:14] <mahfrk> bjsnider: nVidia Corporation C68 [GeForce 7025 / nForce 630a] (rev a2)
[04:17] <bjsnider> mahfrk, run: sudo jockey-text -e xorg:nvidia_current
[04:17] <mahfrk> bjsnider: currently i am not in natty
[04:17] <mahfrk> is it ok?
[04:17] <bjsnider> huh?
[04:19] <bjsnider> that is the command to enable the correct driver in natty. do what you want.
[04:20] <mahfrk> bjsnider: you are getting angry. sorry if I said something wrong!
[04:25] <abiss27> guys can someone help me do a manual upgrade ... I have 3 partitions /, /home and swap I still want to keep my /home partition with its files but use a newer OS.
[04:28] <mahfrk> bjsnider: so when we install with that command, what about removing noveau?
[04:30] <semitones> abiss27, just remember to chown afterwards
[04:30] <torchie> nvidia bros are you guys on noveau or proprietary
[04:31] <mahfrk> torchie: i want to remove noveau and install proprietary. so i will get unity with all its glory
[04:32] <abiss27> semitones:ok sure thanks
[04:32] <rwhittle> that is what helped me with my ati to stop the compiz crashes
[04:32] <rwhittle> beta 2 is tomorrow tho
[04:32] <rwhittle> you might want to wait
[04:33] <rwhittle> nouveau has advantages that propietary does not.  propietary nvida accels at 3d i think
[04:33] <semitones> abiss27, i did an upgrade like that once, and afterwards I was like "why isn't anything working?" :P
[04:34] <rwhittle> does ubuntumusicstore have audiobooks ?
[04:34] <rwhittle> audiobooks is a bummer for ubuntu
[04:34] <torchie> I get full unity with noveau
[04:34] <torchie> 7150m
[04:35] <torchie> except I get freezes of all but the cursor; on proprietary I got incidents where windows would turn white and if I put the system to sleep it would just turn the whole screen white
[04:35] <torchie> this thing where the Empathy window gets wider as you type a message; is that supposed to happen?
[04:36] <torchie> looks cool but it just extended past my view
[04:39] <semitones> rwhittle, are they free?
[04:39] <bluefox83> seriously...how do i get fusion-icon or compiz to work? i got no effects at all D:
[04:40] <rwhittle> semitones, is what free ?
[04:41] <midhuno> hi anybody help me
[04:41] <rwhittle> audiobooks tend not to be free
[04:41] <bluefox83> if it's in synaptic or ubuntu software center, it's free
[04:41] <semitones> audiobooks are free on archive.org :)
[04:41] <rwhittle> ubuntmusicstore is free its in banshee and rhythmbox
[04:41] <midhuno> i upgrade to ubuntu 11.04 now...but the sound and videos are not working properly
[04:41] <rwhittle> the music you pay for
[04:41] <semitones> the narrators aren't as suave though
[04:41] <rwhittle> there's always amazonmp3
[04:42] <midhuno> there is some disturbances in sound during playing avi files
i upgrade to ubuntu 11.04 now...but the sound and videos are not working properly
[04:44] <bluefox83> midhuno: sorry, i don't know how to help you with that...i have problems getting fusion-icon working and i haven't even tried getting sounds and stuff working yet
[04:44] <bluefox83> i don't even know if i can play mp3's yet
[05:13] <Scotty> w00p w00p for 11.04
[05:13] <semitones> DATS DA SOUND OF DA POLICE
[05:13] <Scotty> yes lol
[05:18] <hellslinger> haha
[05:32] <cbilljones> am i supposed to have menus when a window is not maximized?
[05:33] <semitones> the menus are in the top bar
[05:33] <semitones> if you mouse over
[05:35] <cbilljones> i know, i just wasnt sure if they were supposed to be in the window when not max, it breaks on me occasionally and i have no menus, understandable as its beta :)
[05:36] <cbilljones> also, ive already added ccsm, are they unity options available without it?
[05:58] <ubuntuguy> How do you change scrooling option in ubuntu 11.04
[06:04] <ubuntuguy> Question
[06:04] <ubuntuguy> How do I change the way you scroll in ubutnu 11.04?
[06:04] <ubuntuguy> I hate the way it is now
[06:10] <netcitizen> I am trying to uppgrade from Ubuntu 10.10 to 11.04 beta . when i try "sudo do-release-upgrade -d" in the terminal, i get "No new release found" message. how to upgrade now?
[06:39] <kavoor> hi, I'm running natty beta1. I accidentally pressed something(I don't know what) and the global menu bar is now disabled. I get the menu bar in each window. How do I enable the global menu bar?
[06:45] <ubuntuguy> Any add-ons so you can avoid scrolling down the ubuntu bar all the time?
[06:48] <naknomik> I want to upgrade to 11.04 from 10.10 but I get error message BAD signature from "Ubuntu Archive Automatic Signing Key <mailto:ftpmaster@ubuntu.com>"
[06:53] <len> If I do an upgrade from maverick right now, will I get beta 2?
[07:10] <ChrisBuchholz> Morning
[07:13] <ChrisBuchholz> Yesterday i was usig a Logitech mouse with Ubuntu (on my laptop) to play Urban Terror, and when i went to bed, i just, as usually, closed the lid (without removing the mouse from the USB port). Today, i open the lid, login and the mouse is stuck on the botton of the screen, only moving horizontally. Somtime it will go to the top also. If i remove the Mouse from the usb port, my trackpad works fine. Whats up with this? Some easy fix or ...
[07:13] <ChrisBuchholz> ... should i report ?
[07:17] <ChrisBuchholz> If the cursor is somewhere in the screen and i pop the mouse in the usb port, it just jumps down to the screen edge and stays there
[07:31] <eruditehermit> hey, is fglrx working properly in natty betas?
 i just upgraded to natty, and a lot of icons in the notification area are still red circles with a slash after a reboot
 anybody know how to fix this?
[07:56] <forrestv> (reposted from #ubuntu :p)
[08:01] <gordonjcp> here's a great bug for you
[08:01] <gordonjcp> fire up evolution
[08:01] <gordonjcp> reply to an email
[08:01] <gordonjcp> select a bit of text in the original email
[08:02] <gordonjcp> delete it and start typing your reply
[08:02] <gordonjcp> select a bit of your reply that you want to change and begin overtyping as though you'd changed your mind about how you wanted to say something
[08:02] <gordonjcp> boom
[08:02] <gordonjcp> one dead Ubuntu
[08:03] <gordonjcp> will not respond to the keyboard until you kill X
[08:32] <arand> do-release-upgrade -d is enabled currently isn't it?
[08:36] <natalie_> Greetings, I am having a bit of an issue with compiz on my nvidia gtx 260. When I move the window, it stutters a bit and is not fluid whatsoever. Anyone willing to help?
[08:41] <mihneadb> hell
[08:41] <mihneadb> o
[08:41] <mihneadb> do you know when will the beta 2 be released?
[08:42] <arand> !schedule
[08:42] <mihneadb> it's supposed to be today
[08:42] <mihneadb> i meant what time today
[08:42] <arand> Before tomorrow.
[08:43] <mihneadb> thank you
[08:43] <arand> There never is a specified time, so that's as specific as one can be, pretty much..
[08:44] <mihneadb> okay, i figured i'd ask here, maybe someone knew. It would've been helpful to know :)
[08:44] <natalie_> Is anyone else having problems with laggy and stuck windows when moving them with compiz enabled?
[08:45] <mihneadb> but.. a beta1 install with a full update will be equivalent with beta2, right?
[08:45] <arand> mihneadb: Yes.
[08:46] <mihneadb> arand: ty
[09:25] <pvh_sa> hey there, i see there is an ubuntu powerpc release. we've got an IBM p690 which uses POWER4+ processors, i'm wondering if that is supported by this release
[09:51] <To> hi
[09:55] <gnomefreak> hi
[09:57] <nijabo> Question about updating: When I do an update from 10.10 to 11.04 is there a risk to mess up my system?
[09:58] <Severian> nijabo, Do you mean after the release of 11.04, or are you trying now?
[09:58] <nijabo> After the release
[09:58] <nijabo> I read you can update through sudo update -d (or something similar to that)
[09:59] <nijabo> I wondered how safe it is (I usually do clean installs but this time I really don't want to go through the trouble)
[09:59] <Severian> Ther is some risk, but I have found it to be quite reliable.  I do hear about problems every once in a while.  I am sure the official answer would be to backup, first.
[09:59] <Severian> I don't speak for Canonical.
[10:01] <Severian> If you want to be a bit safer, I'd say wait for one month after release and then upgrade.  Any bugs are usually worked out by then.
[10:02] <nijabo> Cheers, sounds like a plan (I am in no hurry to upgrade anyway)
[10:02] <nijabo> Gives me enough time to backup some stuff (just in case) ;)
[10:13]  * gnomefreak brb, still trying t figure out why im on-line :(
[10:36] <psypher246> hi all, can anyone confirm whether the nvidia proprietary drivers are working yet or must i still use nouveau?
[10:38] <perscitus> Please tell me there is a way to force global menu to stay active?
[10:49] <gord> psypher246, nvidia binary blobs work fine
[10:50] <psypher246> gord cool so if i install from the binary driver app it will work ok
[10:50] <gord> psypher246, as long as nvidia supports your card, yep
[10:51] <psypher246> works on maverick so yeah i reckon so. awesome, installing natty on my latop for the first time, been testing it in virtualbox for a couple of weeks, can't wait, it is da bomb!
[11:07] <scoundrel50> Hi, I just wondererd, has anybody been able to get over the lack of back light in Natty, when you get past the Grub? Have there been any updates or Upgrades in the past couple of days?
[11:16] <ssn> hi guys
[11:17] <ssn> my natty installation mistakes my touchpad for a touchscreen (absolute vs relative). how to i change this?
[11:21] <ssn> i dont even know how to report the bug...
[11:24] <coz_> ssn,  mm not sure about this one  let me check something
[11:25] <ssn> there is no bug reported as far as i know, it might be related to my asus ul30vt
[11:26] <ssn> the unity mouse settings dont allow for any changes in touchpad behaviour
[11:26] <coz_> ssn,  I am not finding anything,, so I suggest hanging around here and also,, even thought not a support channel,, you may want to go to #ayatana  where many of the developers are
[11:28] <ssn> how do i report this bug, i dont really know what package is affected
[11:28] <coz_> !bug touchpad
[11:28] <coz_> lets see if that brings anything up
[11:28] <coz_> no I guess not
[11:29] <coz_> !bug
[11:29] <coz_> ssn, there you go
[11:29] <ssn> but i dont know what package is affected
[11:30] <coz_> ssn,   hold on
[11:32] <coz_> ssn,  ok you could go here    https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/linux    "Report a bug"  upper right,,,  and just describe what you did here,, any additional info would help
[11:47] <jml> sometimes the launcher doesn't hide
[11:47] <jml> I don't know when the "sometimes" is, but I think it has to do with when I drag things.
[11:47] <coz_> jml,   open ccsm... click on the ubunt Unity plugin
[11:48] <coz_> jml,   there is a pull down list  with several options,,  test each one
[11:48] <jml> coz_: test each one for what exactly?
[11:49] <coz_> jml,   to see how the panel reacts
[11:49] <dupondje> I have some small question. I backupped (rsync) all my data from my harddisk to an external harddisk. Now the source gives me 2081190728 bytes in use, the destination 2204250808
[11:49] <coz_> rather the launcher
[11:49] <dupondje> thats like a big difference ?
[11:50] <jml> coz_: when the launcher gets stuck, then something will eventually unstick it. If I don't know what causes the sticking and can't reliably unstick it, then how would I test?
[11:50] <coz_> jml,  it's stuck doing what?
[11:52] <coz_> jml,  if you mean stuck that it wont hide  then I am not usre
[11:52] <coz_> sure
[11:53] <coz_> jml,   may be a "glitch of the moment"   and will be fixed most likely,,, or something up on that end
[12:06] <ven1ce> hi I'm running the current natty version and after an update last night it refuses to boot after selecting it in grub with the error message "error: couldn't read file"
[12:08] <ven1ce> i'm kind of lost :/
[12:10] <robin0800> ven1ce, hold right shift at boot to get the grub menu
[12:10] <ven1ce> yeah i mean i can get the menu no problem there. i can even boot the windows system on the thing
[12:11] <robin0800> ven1ce, can you select and run the recovery option
[12:11] <ven1ce> the problem happens after selecting natty as boot system from the grub launcher
[12:11] <ven1ce> crashes too
[12:12] <ven1ce> even tough it seems to proceed a bit further than the other option
[12:13] <ven1ce> the older .7 kernel seems to work
[12:13] <ven1ce> (somehow)
[12:14] <robin0800> ven1ce, if tha t boots run sudo update-grub in a terminal
[12:15] <ven1ce> hm okay i booted to the rescue sceen with the old kernel and did a grub update
[12:15] <ven1ce> didnt work :/
[12:16] <ven1ce> still the same error: couldn't read file. and press any key :/
[12:18] <robin0800> at the rescue screen reinstall grub think the command is sudo install-grub /dev/sda
[12:22] <robin0800> ven1ce, just checked its grub-install
[12:23] <ven1ce> kk
[12:26] <ven1ce> hm okay it reports installation finished. no error reported
[12:29] <ven1ce> it didnt help
[12:29] <ven1ce> still the same situation
[12:33] <robin0800> ven1ce, you may need to run update-grub again
[12:36] <ven1ce> still the same :/
[12:38] <ven1ce> are there any useful diagnostics for finding out what is actually happening?
[12:39] <robin0800> ven1ce, then you need to boot a cd and try to repair from there suspect you may need to reinstall beta2 is out today
[12:41] <ven1ce> hehe the stuff is quite reproducible ;) it happens everytime i install beta1 and do the update ;)
[12:42] <ven1ce> and somehow machine independent i get it on my notebook too ^^
[12:42] <robin0800> ven1ce, for alpha & beta software the best update is sudo aptitude safe-upgrade
[12:43] <ven1ce> okay i'll remember it ^^
[12:44] <robin0800> ven1ce, try beta 2 when it's out
[12:44] <arand_> full-upgrade / dist-upgrade is a method of forcing, should only be necessary in specific cases or when moving from releases using a manual method ;)
[12:45] <ven1ce> there already seem to be beta 2 isos
[12:47] <arand_> Yea, well they normally take the latest daily and label them "beta2" simply, when they have been tested for faults, so the isos that will end up bekcoming the beta will likely have been available for a day or wo already...
[12:48] <ven1ce> hehe i'll give it one more try ;)
[12:51] <babai> how to enable overlay scrollbars?
[12:59] <xzcvczx> does anyone else run natty as a guest on vmware and after rebooting gets the top bar and bottom bar unthemed?
[12:59] <xzcvczx> and require a nuking of the .gnome2_private folder to fix it?
[13:02] <pvh_sa> hey there, in the past i've used tracker to index my files. is there a better alternative these days?
[13:18] <zniavre> good afternoon
[13:18]  * cryptk is excited to get home from work in an hour and see what updates there are for natty and gnome3
[13:19] <zniavre> im looking for a kind of weather-indicator without all mono /desktop-couch deps and much more lighter ?
[13:19] <bazhang> !find weather
[13:20] <cryptk> zniavre, there are lots of ways and examples online on how to put weather data into conky
[13:20] <cryptk> if you use conky that is
[13:20] <elb0w> So theres not going to be an offical ubuntu with gnome3?
[13:20] <psalden> say folks is it possible to install packages anyway when the software center indicates them as 'bad quality'?
[13:20] <bazhang> !info gkrellweather
[13:20] <elb0w> inst unity the netbook os?
[13:20] <zniavre> bazhang,  cryptk  ok thank you
[13:20] <zniavre> maybe conky is a good way to do that
[13:21] <cryptk> yep, you can do it in gkrellm also, but I personally prefer conky over gkrellm
[13:21] <ven1ce> well if the isos for beta 2 not change the problem is still there with beta 2 ;) robin0800
[13:21] <cryptk> zniavre, if you catch me online in about an hour after I get home I will give you my conky config to get you started
[13:21] <bazhang> conky great beginners guide at ubuntuforums
[13:21] <cryptk> then you will have something good to start with, but it will need a litle modification to match your system though, but it should give you a head start
[13:22] <zniavre> im sure there is a lot of howto to add conky variable or script (im  a bit used to)
[13:22] <bazhang> bunch of shared conkyrc there as well
[13:22] <cryptk> yep, there is indeed some great beginners guides there
[13:22] <bazhang> err /.conkyrc
[13:22] <bazhang> first link to conky beginners is that thread
[13:22] <cryptk> but I also have a nice lua script to dray a nice background under conky with transparency, makes it easy to read conky on desktops that aren't just a solid color
[13:22] <zniavre> by the way does ${mixerbar} is working in yuor conky stuff?
[13:23] <cryptk> actually... hang on, I have my conky config right here!
[13:23] <bazhang> hehe
[13:23] <zniavre> it supposed to fill a bar related to audio voolume but mine stays empty
[13:23] <cryptk> http://pastebin.com/VDPphVB7
[13:24] <zniavre> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/conky/+bug/755540
[13:24] <cryptk> and the LUA script to draw the BG
[13:24] <cryptk> http://pastebin.com/pnKuPh8p
[13:25] <cryptk> just grab one of the many weather examples on the internet, throw it in there somewhere, and then modify the conkyrc file to match your system and needs and your off to the races
[13:25] <elb0w> Has anyone installed gnome3 on ubuntu 10.10 yet?
[13:26] <patdk-wk> I sure hope not
[13:26] <elb0w> why
[13:26] <patdk-wk> oh 10.10, that wouldn't be in this channel
[13:26] <Jerub> elb0w: there's a ppa but it's currentl broken.
[13:26] <patdk-wk> this channel is for 10.04 only
[13:26] <patdk-wk> 11.04 :)
[13:26] <Jerub> 11.04 perhaps?
[13:26] <patdk-wk> damn I can't keep 11 and 10's straight :)
[13:27] <elb0w> so wait for 11.04 install it then?
[13:27] <elb0w> ok has anyone done it in 11.04?
[13:28] <cryptk> elb0w, I am running gnome3 on 11.04
[13:28] <zniavre_> cryptk,  thank you
[13:28] <cryptk> used the PPA
[13:28] <elb0w> cryptk, how is it?
[13:29] <cryptk> I like it so far
[13:29] <elb0w> buggy?
[13:29] <cryptk> I have had a few minor issues, but then again, I am a paid Ubuntu administrator so a minor issue to me may be major to someone else
[13:29] <elb0w> hmm
[13:30] <cryptk> lately I have had gnome-settings-daemon crash on login
[13:30] <cryptk> but it isn't taking down the OS or anything
[13:30] <cryptk> the workflow is definitely different, no minimizing, heavily stresses the use of multiple workspaces
[13:31] <cryptk> you aren't locked into maximize or anything liek Unity on a netbook though
[13:31] <elb0w> Theres no minimizing?
[13:31] <cryptk> nope, why do you minimize?
[13:31] <elb0w> Yeah thats cool
[13:31] <cryptk> tell me your number 1 reason for doing it
[13:31] <cryptk> probably, if I had to guess, to get a window out of the way
[13:31] <cryptk> just put it on a different workspace
[13:31] <elb0w> Yeah I liked how they did that
[13:32] <elb0w> from the vid
[13:32] <elb0w> We currently us ubuntu workstations as our dev boxes here, but we arent crazy about going to unity
[13:32] <cryptk> I think you can turn the minimize button back on, but all it really does is hide it, then you can go into the overview and show it again
[13:32] <cryptk> yeah, I would stick with your current setup for a bit longer though until 11.04 and gnome3 get more stable though
[13:33] <elb0w> so im just trying to gauge if we should install gnome3 over 11.04 or go to a diff distro
[13:33] <elb0w> yeah, thats what im thinking
[13:33] <cryptk> considering that you never know when it is going to break
[13:33] <cryptk> or maybe look into the Debian based version of Mint
[13:33] <elb0w> oh nice they are having gnome3
[13:33] <elb0w> by default?
[13:33] <cryptk> I don't think so, but it won't have unity
[13:34] <elb0w> yeah, I tried it on my netbook. I just really didnt enjoy it
[13:34] <cryptk> gotta remember, gnome 3 literally JUST released, gonna take a bit for major distros to adopt it
[13:34] <cryptk> brb
[13:36] <Lorthirk> sorry if i dive in the discussion...
[13:36] <Lorthirk> so, there will be a time in which we could install gnome3 as an alternative, in the future?
[13:36] <Lorthirk> it's still not perfectly clear to me
[13:36] <cryptk> Lorthirk, there is a PPA available already
[13:37] <cryptk> that you can add to your software sources
[13:37] <Lorthirk> ok
[13:37] <cryptk> and then install gnome3 from that
[13:37] <cryptk> that is how I installed mine
[13:37] <Lorthirk> missed that part :)
[13:37] <Lorthirk> thanks :)
[13:37] <cryptk> I considered just building it from scratch, but that is a lot of work, and I do enough of that admin stuff at work, I don't want to do it at home as well...
[13:38] <Lorthirk> there's no problem for me to wait
[13:38] <Lorthirk> you see i use ubuntu just to enjoy something different from time to time
[13:38] <jo-erlend> I'm testing unity and I have a few questions: 1) why are some of the icons grey? Are they special in any way? 2) when I have more than ten applications in the launcher, how do I switch using super-shortcuts?
[13:41] <elias> how can i get back scrollbars if i somehow managed to make them disappear?
[13:43] <cryptk> the more I read about Gnome3, the more I see people making comments about how they aren't going to try it because it is different
[13:43] <elias> instead if i hover where the scrollbar should be, i get some arrow symbols, really weird
[13:43] <cryptk> I wish half of them would jsut give it a shot for a week
[13:43] <cryptk> elias, that's normal
[13:43] <cryptk> there is a "scroll indicator", and when you mouse over it you get a scrobber
[13:44] <cryptk> opens up more of the window to being usable space while not limiting the scroll functionality
[13:44] <elias> it's only in some apps though, e.g. firefox works like always
[13:44] <Jerub> i'm against different things because i've got a finely honed set of tools and techniques that work for me now. to change to something drastically different without a coherant story as to why i will like the change, i don't see the point.
[13:44] <cryptk> depends on what gui toolkit the program is using
[13:44] <elias> cryptk: do you know if there's an easy way to get the old behavior?
[13:45] <cryptk> elias, I have personally never looked into it as I like the new behavior
[13:45] <elias> hm, i don't like when different apps behave differently, it confuses me
[13:45] <zniavre_> remove scrollbar overlay ?
[13:45] <elias> and since i use firefox the most... i'd rather have other apps follow its behavior
[13:47] <cryptk> on my setup I think firefox has the new scrollbars, but then again my setup is not a stock natty install
[13:47] <cryptk> and I am not at home to know for sure
[13:47] <cryptk> work comp still on 10.10
[13:48] <elias> you're lucky, my work comp is win7 :P
[13:48] <cryptk> so was mine when I first got it
[13:48] <cryptk> but I am free to install whatever I want to use as long as it is legal
[13:49] <cryptk> we have people running Win7, people with MacBook Pros, people running every distro from Fedora, to Ubuntu, to Arch, Gentoo, you name it
[13:49] <cryptk> even a few that run straight Debian
[13:49] <cryptk> and I think down the hall is a guy using CentOS as his standard desktop
[13:50] <cryptk> just found out that Linux Mint 11 will use Gnome 3, but will not use Gnome shell
[13:51] <Lorthirk> cryptk: i will for sure try gnome3... as said, I use ubuntu for fun and I love to experiment new things
[13:52] <gurlkeee> hi can sb help
[13:52] <cryptk> depends, what's your question
[13:52] <gurlkeee> ok
[13:52] <gurlkeee> uehm
[13:53] <gurlkeee> can you change UNITY thought normally gnome 2 in ubuntu 11.10 or not
[13:53] <cryptk> you mean 11.04?
[13:53] <gurlkeee> so then i would install kde
[13:53] <gurlkeee> no 11.10 ;)
[13:53] <gurlkeee> the over next version
[13:54] <cryptk> the next version is 11.04, 11.10 isn't even on the books yet
[13:54] <cryptk> there is no decided or announced feature set for it, so nobody can answer that question yet
[13:54] <gurlkeee> ok
[13:54] <gurlkeee> cryptk last question
[13:54] <arand_> gurlkeee: My guess would be no, it could proably be installed alongside though
[13:54] <gurlkeee> do you use kde or gnome
[13:55] <cryptk> at work 10.10 with Gnome2, at home I am currently using 11.04 with Gnome3 and gnome shell
[13:55] <gurlkeee> ok
[13:55] <Jerub> i hope ubuntu classic aka gnome 2 will be retained as an option.
[13:55] <Lorthirk> gurlkeee, sorry -- but why don't you consider kubuntu?
[13:55] <gurlkeee> Lorthirk what ??
[13:56] <cryptk> kubuntu, that is the KDE variant of Ubuntu
[13:56] <Jerub> unity isn't a viable desktop and gnome3 is still very fresh
[13:56] <gurlkeee> Lrtirk: i like gnome
[13:56] <Lorthirk> kubuntu, is ubuntu packed with kde instead of gnome (or unity)
[13:56] <gurlkeee> yes and i like gnome more then kde but kde is also okay
[13:56] <Lorthirk> ok then, sorry, I completely misunderstood your request
[13:56] <gurlkeee> ok
[13:56] <cryptk> you can still boot into gnome2 without Unity in 11.04 though, but honestly nobody knows yet if that will be possible with 11.10
[13:57] <cryptk> but it is linux, you can take parts out, put in other parts, change it however you want
[13:57] <elias> hm, does this mean natty has gnome3?
[13:57] <cryptk> that's the best part, it is an OS that is built like Legos!
[13:57] <cryptk> no, natty has gnome2 and Unity
[13:57] <gurlkeee> natty yes
[13:57] <gurlkeee> a question
[13:57] <gurlkeee> cryptk: how can i get gnopme 3 under nattyy
[13:57] <elias> ah, yeah, what i thought... else i'd have switched to gnome3 tonight :)
[13:57] <cryptk> there is a gnome3 PPA available
[13:58] <gurlkeee> ok can i get an screenshot
[13:58] <gurlkeee> before i switch
[13:58] <gurlkeee> :D
[13:58] <cryptk> add it to your software sources, and install it, but the PPA isn't completely stable or locked down yet
[13:58] <gurlkeee> ok thx
[13:58] <cryptk> I wouldn't recommend it unless you know what you are doing
[13:58] <gurlkeee> ok
[13:58] <cryptk> I personally run it, but I am "more experienced" than your average linux user
[13:58]  * cryptk is trying to be modest so as to not come off like a jerk, lol
[13:59] <zniavre_> :o)
[13:59] <elias> i don't know what i'm doing, i kinda regret switching my home desktop to 11.04 a few weeks ago :P
[13:59] <Lorthirk> cryptk, since you already installed gnome3, just a question
[14:00] <Lorthirk> will it sit side by side with gnome2 or it will overwrite it?
[14:00] <cryptk> yeah, running a beta release is definitely more for people who not only want to be on the cutting edge, but also are capable of fixing it when it breaks, lol
[14:00] <cryptk> Lorthirk, I haven't checked to see if gnome2 is still available in my sessions on my Gnome3 box
[14:00] <cryptk> catch me in about 30-45 minutes after I get home and I will tell ya ;)
[14:01] <Lorthirk> no problem, i will be here for another 3 hours :)
[14:01] <cryptk> heh
[14:01] <gurlkeee> cryptk: i have my own linux distro ...
[14:01] <gurlkeee> so i am experienced too
[14:02] <gurlkeee> hi letothe2nd
[14:03] <gurlkeee> but my real question is:
[14:03] <gurlkeee> anytime you MUST use gnome 3 / unity. i am right ?
[14:03] <cryptk> gurlkeee, your name isn't terran by chance is it?
[14:03] <cryptk> that depends on what you mean by must
[14:03] <gurlkeee> uehm i think
[14:04] <gurlkeee> at least at the over over next release gnome 2 isnt (easily) compatbile to ubuntu 12.04
[14:04] <Jerub> 12.04? that's a year away
[14:04] <gurlkeee> yes
[14:04] <gurlkeee> but i can change to kde
[14:04] <UndiFineD> no, even sooner
[14:05] <gurlkeee> yes sooner
[14:05] <UndiFineD> it is targeted for 11.10
[14:05] <cryptk> well, there is no determined and locked down feature set for 11.10, and 12.04 hasn't even been considered yet, lol
[14:05] <gurlkeee> oh yes
[14:05] <cryptk> yeah, you can have gnome and KDE side b side
[14:05] <cryptk> ok, time for me to go home, bbiaf
[14:05] <gurlkeee> cu
[14:05] <gurlkeee> uehm
[14:05] <gurlkeee> so i would change to kde
[14:05] <gurlkeee> but only if it is recommend
[14:06] <arand_> gurlkeee: I would presume the status of gnome3 in the future in ubuntu will be somewhat like KDE is now, I assume the will try to fix it so that unity and gnome2 can coexist in oneiric
[14:06] <arand_> *gnome2 and gnome3
[14:06] <gurlkeee> arand_ so you think unity/gnom3 will be better ?
[14:07] <arand_> What which one I think is better?
[14:07] <gurlkeee> sorry i dont understand your sentece because my bad english
[14:07] <gurlkeee> i meant: i like the gnome feeling, panel at the bottom and so on. kde is the same.
[14:07] <gurlkeee> but unity is completely different and makes a lot work
[14:08] <gurlkeee> i would change to kde if gnome 3 is only available
[14:08] <UndiFineD> i dont understand why people choose a pulldown menu at the bottom
[14:08] <arand_> gnome3 won't have a bottom panel, kind.of
[14:08] <gurlkeee> because i  used it since 3 years
[14:08] <gurlkeee> gnome3 won't have a bottom panel, kind.of >> thats my problem
[14:08] <gurlkeee> i want the old look
[14:09] <gurlkeee> and i only find the old look in kde
[14:10] <gurlkeee> i have a question
[14:10] <gurlkeee> today comes ubuntu beta 2
[14:10] <gurlkeee> !natty
[14:11] <gurlkeee> !schedule
[14:13] <gurlkeee> http://releases.ubuntu.com/releases/natty/ubuntu-11.04-beta2-desktop-amd64.iso
[14:13] <Lorthirk> wow, it's out
[14:13] <gurlkeee> yes :)
[14:13] <gurlkeee> do you think i can use it for my main PC
[14:13] <charlie-tca> It is out when the official announcement is made
[14:14] <charlie-tca> gurlkeee: Xubuntu also uses a bottom panel, and the panels in it can be configured any way you want them.
[14:14] <gurlkeee> Xubuntu dont use a bottom panel
[14:14] <gurlkeee> its a transparency
[14:14] <charlie-tca> Since when?
[14:14] <gurlkeee> 11.04
[14:15] <charlie-tca> IT is a panel
[14:15] <gurlkeee> and is XFCE better then gnome ?
[14:15] <charlie-tca> and you can remove the panel there and create your own.
[14:15] <gurlkeee> ah ok
[14:15] <Jerub> to call one thing better than another is a very large and sweeping value judgement.
[14:15] <charlie-tca> I don't know if it is better than gnome for you
[14:16] <gurlkeee> charlie-tca what do you use
[14:16] <Jerub> personal choice is a large part of it.
[14:16] <charlie-tca> I use Xubuntu, but then, I am pretty much involved with that project.
[14:16] <gurlkeee> oh ok
[14:16] <gurlkeee> my only problem is
[14:16] <charlie-tca> Xubuntu still leaves much of the configuration up to the user.
[14:17] <gurlkeee> since 2 weeks i am looking for an operating system and cant find one
[14:17] <gurlkeee> i tested ubuntu, debian xubuntu kubuntu cant decide xd
[14:17] <gurlkeee> so i ordered two CDS ubuntu 10.10 kde and gnome
[14:17] <charlie-tca> I don't think anyone else can decide for you
[14:18] <gurlkeee> can i use 11.04  on main pc
[14:18] <gurlkeee> or is it still tooo buggy
[14:18] <Jerub> i upgraded to 10.04 and run gnome 2 without any problems.
[14:18] <gurlkeee> 10.04 ?
[14:18] <gurlkeee> or 11.04 ?
[14:19] <Jerub> natty
[14:19] <gurlkeee> ok
[14:19] <Jerub> 11.04
[14:19] <Jerub> sorry,
[14:19] <gurlkeee> np
[14:20] <charlie-tca> gurlkeee: it is still development version, until the final release.
[14:20] <charlie-tca> I find my way through most issues myself, and have used natty since beta1
[14:20] <charlie-tca> no, since alpha1
[14:20] <gurlkeee> charlie-tca: so what do you recommend me ? ;)
[14:20] <charlie-tca> If you can fix problems, use it., If you need help installing and fixing things, don't
[14:21] <gurlkeee> oh
[14:21] <Lorthirk> gurlkee
[14:21] <Lorthirk> can't you really wait for two weeks? :)
[14:21] <gurlkeee> no i am quitee experienced in / with in linux
[14:21] <gurlkeee> no because i need my computer today
[14:21] <gurlkeee> not in two weeks
[14:21] <gurlkeee> :D
[14:21] <Lorthirk> ok, but something is stopping you to use your computer with 10.10 in the meantime?
[14:22] <elias> i wonder if the ubuntu devs really will be able to fix all the natty bugs within two more weeks :)
[14:22] <gurlkeee> elias yes me two
[14:22] <gurlkeee> me 2
[14:22] <gurlkeee> i change earliest two moths after release
[14:34] <alvin> gurlkeee: I would not recommend it. I started testing recently and have reported several bugs that look very severe to me.
[14:34] <gurlkeee> beta 2 ?? @ alvin ?
[14:35] <alvin> Well, the up-to-date natty, yes.
[14:35] <gurlkeee> okt thanks and what do you recommend me then ? ;)
[14:35] <gurlkeee> 10.10 gnome, 10.10 kde, 10.04 gnome, 10.10 kde or other ?
[14:35] <alvin> Smells more like alpha than beta. The system must have crashed +10 times today. I keep forgetting that I shouldn't resize the Konsole (bug 760632)
[14:36] <gurlkeee> bug 760632
[14:36] <gurlkeee> ok
[14:36] <gurlkeee> and what do you recommend me now
[14:36] <alvin> gurlkeee: In my opinion: Debian stable. I'm only testing Kubuntu because we have a bunch of machines running it that I don't want to change right now.
[14:36] <gurlkeee> ok
[14:36] <alvin> Natty is still not officiale released
[14:37] <alvin> So, bugs can be expected. (We can only hope they get fixed before release, but history teaches another lesson)
[14:38] <gurlkeee> ok
[14:38] <gurlkeee> and gnome i think
[14:38] <gurlkeee> :)
[14:39] <alvin> Well, I don't like gnome. KDE (my opinion of course) has the right direction of thought. If only it was more stable.
[14:39] <Kev3124> Does anyone know when Beta 2 will be released today?
[14:39] <gurlkeee> it is
[14:40] <Kev3124> it is?
[14:40] <gurlkeee> yes
[14:40] <alvin> (For exampkle: Akonadi = a great idea. I only wished it would stop crashing)
[14:40] <gurlkeee> http://releases.ubuntu.com/11.04/ubuntu-11.04-beta2-desktop-amd64.iso
[14:40] <gurlkeee> http://releases.ubuntu.com/11.04/ubuntu-11.04-beta2-desktop-i386.iso
[14:40] <gurlkeee> xD
[14:40] <Pici> Its not yet released.
[14:41] <Pici> I highly suggest awaiting the release announcement and release notes.
[14:41] <gurlkeee> Pici do you change to 11.04 ?
[14:41] <gurlkeee> or still 10.04 ?
[14:41] <alvin> hey, it's beta :-) we know it can go wrong. There's always zsync to update the images
[14:41] <delac> why are the isos there?
[14:41] <Pici> gurlkeee: I've been running it since alpha something.
[14:41] <gurlkeee> ok
[14:42] <Pici> delac: Because the ISOs get created and tested before we publish the release dontes.
[14:42] <gurlkeee> yes
[14:42] <gurlkeee> but why dont they test them yesterday
[14:42] <gurlkeee> cant understand such a thing o. O
[14:42] <Kev3124> I was hoping beta 2 would fix the issue i am having with the unity desktop freezing on log in
[14:42] <charlie-tca> gurlkeee: why don't you help get the tested?
[14:42] <Pici> gurlkeee: why didn't we just do everything on one day, no need to test or even have 6 months between releases.
[14:42] <UndiFineD> smooth charlie-tca
[14:43] <alvin> I tried Unity a month ago. On a very fast computer. It was a painful experience.
[14:43] <delac> Pici: is there a chance they might alter them before the officaial release (of the beta2)?
[14:43] <Pici> Ubuntu release everyday.
[14:43] <bg16_in> Hey guys, I have a blocker boot issue with Natty
[14:43] <Pici> delac: Sure.
[14:43] <bg16_in> It goes into a reboot loop just after GRUB
[14:43] <bg16_in> doesn't even execute the kernel, as far as I can tell
[14:43] <delac> Pici: ok, so those are pretty much only daily builds then?
[14:44] <bg16_in> the Daily Live ISO (the one I installed from) works just fine
[14:44] <alvin> I have a blocker shutdown issue (bug 760494 , but yours is better :-)
[14:44] <Pici> delac: It depends how much testing they have gotten.
[14:44] <bg16_in> How come the Live ISO works, but won't boot after I install it?
[14:44] <Pici> delac: http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/
[14:45] <bg16_in> I even chrooted and replaced GRUB2 with GRUB legacy
[14:45] <bg16_in> updated the initramfs
[14:45] <bg16_in> but still no joy
[14:46] <alvin> Reboot loop? What would cause an automatic reboot?
[14:46] <bg16_in> BTW the hardware is a Dell Vostro 1088
[14:46] <bg16_in> ATI Radeon HD 4330
[14:46] <bg16_in> alvin: beats me
[14:46] <bg16_in> loading kernel
[14:46] <bg16_in> loading initrd.lz
[14:46] <bg16_in> then bios screen
[14:46] <bg16_in> memtest ran fine
[14:47] <alvin> I did have the same issue (before natty). Let me dig into my memory (bug reports)
[14:47] <bg16_in> alvin: sure. thanks for your concern :-)
[14:48] <alvin> Well, it's a large pile of bug reports. "One does not simply boot into Ubuntu", you know. New releases tend to break the boot/reboot/shutdown process a lot.
[14:48] <charlie-tca> bg16_in: you removed splash and quiet from the boot line?
[14:49] <bg16_in> charlie-tca: Nope
[14:49] <bg16_in> as I said, I don't think the kernel even begins to execute
[14:49] <charlie-tca> Try editing grub menu, remove them and you can see the messages. You no longer have to guess if it starts anything
[14:49] <alvin> bg16_in: Do you have a separate /boot partition?
[14:49] <bg16_in> alvin: No
[14:50] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[14:50] <alvin> bg16_in: What is your harddrive controller?
[14:50] <bg16_in> charlie-tca: ICH8 Mobile
[14:51] <bg16_in> sorry, that was for alvin
[14:51] <bg16_in> correction: ICH9 Mobile
[14:51] <bg16_in> SATA controller: Intel Corporation ICH9M/M-E SATA AHCI Controller (rev 03)
[14:52] <bg16_in> I have a hunch
[14:53] <bg16_in> Is the kernel binary copied from the ISO image or installed from a DEB file?
[14:58] <bg16_in> Is there any way to check whether the vmlinuz file is corrupt or not?
[15:04] <alvin> LiveCD and compare? I can't find the issue I had :-(
[15:04] <alvin> There was a positive discussion on the ubuntu-server mailinglist about the need for useful boot logs.
[15:05] <jorgp> interesting, unity crashes atlot inside of vmware
[15:10] <bg16_in> alvin: I'm downloading the liquorix kernels. let's see if that makes the issue go away. that would mean something wrong with the kernel packages
[15:15] <lcb> is there any problem in creating a xorg.config in /etc/X11 on 11.04 with ' sudo Xorg -configure ' ? this mouse is behaving erratically and scroll wheel not working at all.
[15:15] <genii-around> lcb: So long as you don't have any X server running is fine
[15:16] <lcb> genii-around, sure. thanks
[15:16] <lcb> xrandr do nothing on this issue
[15:17] <genec> jorgp: which VMware product?  Workstation?
[15:17] <jorgp> genec: fusion 3.1.2
[15:18] <genec> jorgp: ahh.  ok.
[15:19] <jorgp> on osx 10.6.6
[15:20] <genec> darn, bg16_in ran off.
[15:35] <alvin> Crash. ... I wiggled the Konsole. I just can't help it!
[15:45] <cryptk> ok, finally home from work
[15:45] <cryptk> got pulled into a meeting right as I was on my way out the door
[15:48] <cryptk> ok, that can't be right... almost 24 hours since I last updated and only one package has an update?
[15:48] <charlie-tca> froze the uploads to get the beta2 out
[15:49] <cryptk> ahh, that would be why
[15:49] <cryptk> odd though that even the gnome3 PPA didn't have any updates
[15:49] <cryptk> unless whoever is working on that one is also working on the natty release, then it would make sense
[15:49] <cryptk> as that person would likely be busy about now
[15:50] <cryptk> !timeline
[15:51] <Pici> !schedule
[15:51] <cryptk> that's the one
[15:51] <cryptk> thanks Pici
[15:51] <Pici> np
[15:52] <thiebaude> no gnome3 updates for me also :)
[15:52] <cryptk> so it looks like there will be no more natty updates until the 21st if I am reading that right
[15:52] <cryptk> except for maybe language packs
[15:53] <cryptk> now... who was it that wanted me to see if I could still login to a gnome2 session with the gnome3 PPA installed...
[15:53] <cryptk> brb, don't think I can, but I will log out and check
[15:53] <thiebaude> cryptk, i cant
[15:53] <alvin> I doubt that very much. It looks like there is still a lot to do. Is kernel freeze in effect yet?
[15:53] <thiebaude> there is only a gnome3 option for me
[15:53] <alvin> Oh, that's today. This is bad.
[15:54] <thiebaude> which is ok, cos gnome3 is all im going to use
[15:54] <lcb> no too many updates at this stage also denotes you don't have too many extra packages installed - as it must be under testing. most of times ppl complain about things not working well, but nothing to do (and in certain way complicating) with the ongoing work of 11.04. am i right?!
[15:54] <cryptk> ok, so I still have Ubuntu Classic listed in my sessions, but I cannot successfully log in to it
[15:55] <cryptk> yep, I don't have my system hardcore loaded down
[15:55] <cryptk> 11.04, gnome3, conky, guake, wine and proprietary nvidia drivers
[15:55] <cryptk> oh and virtual box
[15:55] <cryptk> that's about all I need
[15:56] <cryptk> oh and xChat of course
[15:56] <lcb> i don't have the proprietary drivers installed yet.
[15:56] <thiebaude> i just use 11.04 and gnome3, thats all i need :)
[15:56] <cryptk> I am running the latest one from the X dev PPA
[15:56] <thiebaude> and the nvidia propietary drivers that i already have installed
[15:56] <lcb> at least on this daily build install, desktop interface
[15:56] <cryptk> resolves the issues with the lag/stutter of going into overview in gnome3 with legacy icons
[15:56] <thiebaude> but i really dont need them for gnome3,lol
[15:57] <cryptk> I only installed those to get rid of the overview lag which was caused by a bug in the "latest stable" driver version
[15:58] <alvin> But it needs to be tested beyond a default install. People connect to servers all the time. Crashes might be related to using NFS/IMAP,...
[15:58] <lcb> cryptk, about the xchat.. i used a bit pidgin for IRC but nothing compares with xchat, indeed. even gnome-xchat is not so good
[15:59] <thiebaude> xchat is what i use too :)
[15:59] <thiebaude> and a few days when i could not log in i used irissi
[16:01] <cryptk> I run xChat locally, which connects to a ZNC server, which in turn connects to freenode
[16:02] <lcb> and finally to us :) (to complete the cycle)
[16:02]  * cryptk is thinking about setting up a demo Ubuntu 11.04 with gnome3 server that people can connect to via VNC just to check it out
[16:03] <cryptk> yep
[16:03] <cryptk> that's the reason that when I go away, I stay in the channel and my nick just changes to cryptk|OFFLINE
[16:03] <cryptk> and when I connect, it plays back in my IRC window everything everyone said while I was gone
[16:04]  * genec uses xchat/znc but prefers away rather than nick change
[16:04] <myk_robinson> Morning.. I need help getting Simple Scan to detect my networked HP 6500 printer/scanner/copier  I can print just fine, but Simple Scan doesnt detect the scanner
[16:05] <cryptk> whoops! found a bug
[16:05] <lcb> kill it!!!!
[16:06] <cryptk> set your IRC window to always on top, position it in the middle of the screen, then do something that pops up a prompt that should be on to
[16:06] <cryptk> it isn't, it is under the always on top window, but it gets worse
[16:07] <cryptk> since that prompt window has the focus locked to it, you can't focus the always on top window to be able to move it
[16:07] <lcb> those bugs are only malformed on the "fly" mutations :)
[16:07] <cryptk> haha
[16:07] <cryptk> my test case consisted of guake which is always on top, then from within guake I SSH'd into a server of mine, which popped up a password prompt for my SSH private key
[16:08] <cryptk> the private key prompt was under guake (pre-11.04 it was on top of everything)
[16:08] <cryptk> then I replicated again by doing the same process, but with setting ZNC to always on top
[16:08] <cryptk> only thing is I am not sure if it is an 11.04 bug or a gnome3 bug
[16:09] <cryptk> hrm, setting xchat to always on top, then Alt+F2 and running `gksudo gedit` to pop up a password prompt does not do the same thing
[16:10] <myk_robinson> how can i edit a launcher result in Unity?
[16:10] <myk_robinson> in the dash, i mean?
[16:10] <cryptk> may be an ssh-agent bug
[16:11] <tomreyn> hey, i'm trying to compile some software on natty amd64. the software i'm trying to build is looking for libraries in /usr/lib/ which used to exist in this location in maverick (possibly just as symlinks), but now (natty) only exist in /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/
[16:12] <tomreyn> is this an issue with natty, or do the makefiles of this software i'm trying to build need to be adjusted for natty?
[16:12] <tomreyn> here's one example: http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?suite=natty&arch=any&mode=exactfilename&searchon=contents&keywords=libm.so
[16:13] <tomreyn> http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?suite=maverick&arch=any&mode=exactfilename&searchon=contents&keywords=libm.so has it in /usr/lib/, natty no longer has it there
[16:14] <lcb> i'm always learning. didn't know about that ZNC server cryptk talked about. one of these days i went to /#/ubuntu irc asking for clothing and ppl in there didn't realized i just want to protect the ip. in meanwhile i decided to go for SASL
[16:14] <cryptk> odd, seems it may have moved... not a very friendly decision, but technically ldconfig should be handling the finding of libraries
[16:14] <cryptk> lcb, you should have been asking for cloaking, not clothing
[16:14] <lcb> yes :)
[16:14] <cryptk> haha
[16:14] <cryptk> my account has a cloak on it as well
[16:15] <lcb> it's summer here already, no need of more clothing
[16:15]  * cryptk wishes there was a webos-internals cloak...
[16:17] <charlie-tca> tomreyn: I think some libs got moved in natty, when they went to multi-arch, I think it is called.
[16:18] <cryptk> brb
[16:19] <tomreyn> charlie-tca + cryptk: yes this seems to be the cae, and it will surely cause quite some trouble. it would be good to have it mentioned in the release notes at least
[16:20] <tomreyn> i'm just creatng symlinks massively to work around this, which seems wrong.
[16:20] <charlie-tca> um, we don't have release notes for beta2 yet, since it is not out yet
[16:20] <genec> charlie-tca: PM?
[16:20] <charlie-tca> sure
[16:21] <tomreyn> charlie-tca: this was more of a suggestion (but I could have put it in better words), and i didn't mention natty explicitly.
[16:21] <tomreyn> charlie-tca: this was more of a suggestion (but I could have put it in better words), and i didn't mention natty _beta 2_ explicitly.
[16:21] <charlie-tca> I agree with you, it should be noted, though
[16:22] <flopex> I know Ubuntu 11.04 beta 2 has been released and I've done all of the updates. By now the global menu should have been disabled under ubuntu classic, but it still shows up. Do I have to manually disable it?
[16:25] <charlie-tca> flopex: no, it has not been released yet
[16:27] <robin0800> charlie-tca, some isos are out all except the alternate ones
[16:27] <genec> but may change before announcement
[16:31] <charlie-tca> tomreyn: I saw it on one of the mailing lists, either ubuntu-devel or ubuntu-devel-discuss
[16:31] <flopex> charlie-tca, I mean the second beta
[16:32] <charlie-tca> It is not officially out.
[16:32] <genec> flopex: there are ISOs but it's pre-announcement so the ISOs may change
[16:33] <flopex> charlie-tca, never mind figure it out. I just restarted gconftool
[16:33] <charlie-tca> It is very possible that while you download it and call it beta2, it will be changed
[16:33] <genec> I seem to recall a final (8.10 or 9.10 I think) that had a release-critical update that caused some stress for Ubuntu.
[16:35] <perscitus> What options are there for Appmenu?
[16:41] <perscitus> What options are there for Appmenu?
[16:44] <perscitus> Anyone know how to disable appmenu Window controls for maximized windows?
[16:46] <luite> is there a good manual or introduction for how to use the unity shell?
[16:47] <semitones> daily build... y u no update .iso?
[16:48] <perscitus> Anyone know how to disable appmenu Window controls for maximized windows?
[16:48] <charlie-tca> semitones: we have beta2 coming out today, so things go on hold
[16:48] <perscitus> its very irritating the appmenu
[16:48] <semitones> charlie-tca, oh ok that's what's going on
[16:49] <semitones> I was using zsync to try to grab it
[16:49] <semitones> where is beta2 being put up?
[16:49] <charlie-tca> It will go to the regular mirrors the beta1 went to
[16:51] <perscitus> looks like i have to remove appmenu from natty.
[16:51] <charlie-tca> luite: try http://askubuntu.com/questions/10228/whats-the-right-terminology-for-unitys-ui-elements
[16:51] <charlie-tca> gives a little info, at least
[16:52] <perscitus> and appmenu is the global menu
[16:54] <luite> charlie-tca: I've been using it for a day and it works ok, but I have the feeling that I might be missing a few things :)
[16:54] <perscitus> Unity launcher really does suck. It doesnt giver App categories
[16:54] <luite> thanks for the link
[16:54] <charlie-tca> luite: there will be a few changes yet, I think.
[16:54] <luite> by the way, what's the default theme in natty?
[16:55] <charlie-tca> I don't know.
[16:55] <perscitus> Why are people ignoring me?
[16:55] <charlie-tca> perscitus: because it is easier to ignore ranting than to respond to it
[16:55] <luite> I have the feeling that it has changed, and that I still get the maverick theme, because I upgraded
[16:55] <yofel> perscitus: and most of us don't know the answers to your questions either
[16:56] <charlie-tca> luite: the background change is very minor
[16:56] <perscitus> charlie-tca,  not ranting  and thats disrespectful
[16:56] <charlie-tca> Sorry, It sounded like it to me...
 looks like i have to remove appmenu from natty.
 Unity launcher really does suck. It doesnt giver App categories
[16:57] <charlie-tca> That isn't anything contstuctive to my way of thinking
[16:57] <perscitus> and im trying to use Unity interface but its failing big time
[16:58] <genec> perscitus: if you had said "needs improvements" rather than "really does suck", it'd be a different story
[16:58] <lcb> luite, check this one too -> http://askubuntu.com/questions/28086/unity-keyboard-mouse-shortcuts
[16:58] <luite> charlie-tca: oh ok. anyway it looks good :) though perhaps a bit more os x than I'd like
[16:59] <luite> lcb: ah great, that's just what I was looking for
[16:59] <perscitus> genec,  Unity takes longer to get so app i want to start. I cant get any kind of App category running. And I always get Available to download crap
[17:00] <genec> perscitus: "Available to download" sound like you haven't tuned your system to your common use yet by installing non-default packages.
[17:01] <genec> perscitus: I think I'm up into the 10-20 package selection (and a lot more packages total) that are non-default.
[17:01] <perscitus> genec, uh no. and in on live usb but it still keeps settings.
[17:02] <perscitus> I already know i will probably have to remove appmenu indictator.
[17:06] <perscitus> There is no settings for appmenu that i can find
[17:14] <perscitus> genec,  im not ranting. I can rant if you want but I just want to change few things.
[17:14] <saege> is the beta 2 not released yet?
[17:15] <perscitus> genec,  I can tell you two annoying features in Unity Launcher that dont belong there.
[17:15] <genec> perscitus: it's your choice of words that made it seem so.
[17:15] <genec> saege: not yet
[17:15] <Hukka> I have vlc configured so that left arrow seeks back, right arrow forward. Up seeks in larger jumps forward and down back. Now, when I have video playing on bg, and gnome-terminal on front, even when the focus is on the terminal, the left and right arrows move the video and do not go to terminal
[17:15] <Hukka> Up and down, and any other key I could imagine to test goes to terminal
[17:15] <perscitus> genec,  and trying to decide on whether to switch to Kubuntu or stick with Ubuntu
[17:15] <Hukka> Happens with metacity too
[17:16] <Hukka> So for what package should I write the bug report?
[17:16] <genec> perscitus: I've been running Kubuntu for several years and have preferred KDE over Gnome for much longer
[17:17] <perscitus> genec,  it has a learning curve going from gnome to kde
[17:18] <perscitus> genec,  I cant seem to change things i found annoying in Natty Unity.
[17:19] <perscitus> why is metacity still in natty?
[17:20] <semitones> i'm about to make a liveUSB
[17:20] <semitones> confused about how big I should make reserved extra space
[17:20] <semitones> so programs I install go in that?
[17:20] <arand_> perscitus: gnome-classic is the fallback, it is used there
[17:21] <Hukka> Which is good, because compiz eats all the ram too often
[17:21] <Hukka> Hopefully it's ok by release time
[17:22] <arand_> Compiz? Is that specific to Natty then?
[17:22] <perscitus> Unity Launcher right click menu doesnt match Unity launcher background.  Unity windows have thick useless  border. Now thats rants.
[17:23] <semitones> unity is powered by compiz?
[17:23] <perscitus> semitones,  yes
[17:24] <semitones> let me rephrase my original question... for ubuntu startup disk creator, is the "reserved extra space" used for installing programs? Or do installed programs go somewhere else?
[17:25] <semitones> oh ty arand_ :)
[17:25] <arand_> semitones: =)
[17:26] <habanany_> anybody know how to add hot97 radio station to banshee radio ?
[17:26] <tomreyn> charlie-tca: regarding the library location changes due to multi-arch, you said: "I saw it on one of the mailing lists, either ubuntu-devel or ubuntu-devel-discuss". Do you know some search terms I could look for?
[17:26] <tomreyn> charlie-tca: also, is there a way to file a bug against the release notes to ensure it makes it there?
[17:26] <abiss27> hey guys I have a /, /home and swap partitions on my hdd, and I want to upgrade to a newer OS and keep my /home and its files, but heres the qouestion I have a dual boot with windows 7 will it affect my MBR?
[17:27] <charlie-tca> tomreyn: multi-arch
[17:27] <semitones> habanany_, try asking in #ubuntu
[17:27] <habanany_> ok
[17:27] <perscitus> Looks like ill be switching to Kubuntu
[17:27] <semitones> y?
[17:27] <semitones> why
[17:28] <charlie-tca> tomreyn: give me a minute
[17:28] <perscitus> semitones,  Too many unfixable annoying issues in Ubuntu
[17:28] <TheEvilPhoenix> perscitus:  "unfixable"?
[17:29] <perscitus> Launcher icons are to big. 32px is to large
[17:29] <semitones> in ubuntu or in gnome?
[17:29] <semitones> yeah -- where are unity's preferences
[17:29] <TheEvilPhoenix> semitones:  i think he means in unity :/
[17:29] <semitones> and i don't mean those stupid two options
[17:29] <trism> perscitus: you can change the icon size in ccsm
[17:29] <TheEvilPhoenix> oop ignore last statement
[17:29] <trism> perscitus: oh wait sorry
[17:29] <perscitus> trism,  Minimum is 32
[17:29] <trism> perscitus: didn't notice you said 32
[17:30] <charlie-tca> tomreyn: here is the start of the discussion
[17:30] <charlie-tca> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2011-March/032750.html
[17:30] <perscitus> Global Menu shouldnt be showing Window title when its not maximized
[17:30] <cryptk> I personally am not a fan of KDE, nor am I a fan of Unity, but man, 11.04 is nice so far once you throw Gnome 3 on top of it
[17:30] <cryptk> and the more I play with, and learn about, and get used to, and hack at Gnome 3 the more I like it
[17:31] <cryptk> just now starting to dig into the inner workings, looking for cool little hidden things
[17:31] <perscitus> cryptk,  Gnome3 doesnt support compiz
[17:31] <cryptk> ok, that doesn't mean that you will never see wobbley windows in it
[17:31] <cryptk> and actually, you are mistaken, Gnome Shell doesn't support compiz
[17:31] <perscitus> cryptk,  KDE has more features w/o compiz then gnome3
[17:32] <abiss27> anyone
[17:32] <cryptk> and KDE is heavy and slow
[17:32] <cryptk> and chock full of features and add-ins that I don't need and can (in some cases) be hard to get rid of
[17:32] <cryptk> when I sit at a computer, I am typically sitting at it to do work, I don't need nor want much of what KDE offers
[17:33] <arand_> Excellent, the DE wars that kind of settled down a couple of years ago is now alive and kicking again :D
[17:33] <perscitus> It takes me longer to launch an app in Unity then it does in Classic or older Ubuntu features.
[17:33] <cryptk> competition breeds excellence
[17:33] <perscitus> And that shouldnt happen
[17:33] <cryptk> yep, and I hate Unity as well
[17:33] <cryptk> hence why I am not suing it
[17:33] <BluesKaj> cryptk, hmm, KDE seems to be running fine here , the slowness maybe a different issue with yoiur setup
[17:33] <cryptk> s/suing/using/
[17:34] <cryptk> BluesKaj, it isn't that KDE doesn't run well on my rig (trust me, it has the hardware to run KDE or anything else you could throw at it)
[17:34] <cryptk> it is that it is resource intensive for what it is
[17:34] <arand_> Kubuntu I think, has been a bit notorious for being a heavy implementation of KDE, In the past, I#m not sure how things are now though...
[17:34] <cryptk> out of every DE I have ever used, it required the most resources even when it is jsut sitting idle
[17:35] <cryptk> that is true, KDE that ships with Kubuntu is indeed heavier than a "stock" KDE install
[17:35] <cryptk> but I have also used just about any DE that you can name, I am not afraid of change, I will try it... I tried Unity, and it lost
[17:36] <cryptk> So far I am enjoying Gnome 3, but we will see how it stands the test of time once the "newness" has worn off
[17:37] <perscitus> I dont like Unity right off the bat because i cant move launcher to bottom. But then I cant find app with point and click without searching. thats big issue.
[17:38] <tomreyn> charlie-tca: awesome, thanks
[17:38] <cryptk> the vast majority of times that I launch an app I use Alt+F anyway
[17:38] <perscitus> i dont use keyboard to launch an app
[17:39] <cryptk> for two reasons, I work on command line all day at work, so I am used to typing... which leads into the second reason that it is faster (at least for me)
[17:39] <arand_> Well it seems that both gnome3 and unity tends towards a system where searching for an application shouldn't be done using point & click except in rare cases
[17:39] <cryptk> meant Alt+F2*
[17:39] <cryptk> also, I think the whole point of the favorites menu in Gnome3 and the launcher in Unity is more to hold your commonly used apps, not every app on your system
[17:40] <KM0201> is there a way to add some of the panel applets back to the panel.. i really miss the dictionary and the weather applet.
[17:40] <perscitus> arand_, and it will fail to gain outside users from windows because of that
[17:40] <eagles0513875> anyone else using wpa2 successfully with natty
[17:40] <eagles0513875> every time i try to connect to something with wpa2 encryption
[17:40] <eagles0513875> kernel panic occurs
[17:41] <arand_> eagles0513875: Fun... Report a bug ;) See if it works on newer/older kernels
[17:41] <fdsfdfs> hello
[17:41] <fdsfdfs> i installed ppa gnome 3 ubuntu 11.04
[17:41] <KM0201> eagles0513875, probably stating the obvious, but have you tried disabling security.. to see if the problem is really wpa2
[17:41] <DreamsofanEagle> Oh, can I edit a bug thats already been reported?
[17:41] <cryptk> eagles0513875, I am using WPA2 in 11.04 with no issues
[17:41] <eagles0513875> KM0201: yes it is wpa2 issue cuz on campus i connect using wpa enterprise just find
[17:41] <fdsfdfs> but window borders are broken
[17:41] <fdsfdfs> why ??
[17:41] <arand_> perscitus: I'm not actually sure about that...
[17:42] <eagles0513875> KM0201: did you upgrade from maverick to natty?
[17:42] <cryptk> fdsfdfs, what do you mean they are broken?
[17:42] <KM0201> eagles0513875, negative, i did not.. clean install
[17:42] <eagles0513875> humm i wonder if its the upgrade process
[17:42] <fdsfdfs> i installed ppa gnome 3 ubuntu 11.04
[17:42] <fdsfdfs> but window borders are broken
[17:42] <perscitus> arand_,  There is two things that are certain; Windows is point and click, and Window users DO NOT like change.
[17:42] <eagles0513875> think im gonna have to do a clean install KM0201
[17:42] <cryptk> eagles0513875, I am using WPA2 on 11.04, upgraded from 10.10
[17:42] <fdsfdfs> how can i fix
[17:42] <genec> eagles0513875: it may also be specific to your WNIC
[17:43] <KM0201> eagles0513875, hmm, that seems strange an upgrade would bork that... does it work on the live cd/usb?
[17:43] <cryptk> fdsfdfs, yes, you already said window borders are broken, what do you mean they are broken?
[17:43] <eagles0513875> genec: wpa2 works fine in mav
[17:43] <cryptk> can you be more descriptive than broken?
[17:43] <KM0201> genec, i don't know.. it works fine for me in natty
[17:43] <eagles0513875> KM0201: upgrades for me i have a very low success rate though
[17:44] <genec> eagles0513875: yes, it may be specific to WPA2 and the driver in the kernel you're running
[17:44] <fdsfdfs> how can i fix gnome 3
[17:44] <eagles0513875> genec: ok
[17:44] <fdsfdfs> it broke all
[17:44] <KM0201> hmm, i'd try downloading the 11.04 live cd/usb, and see if it works there.. if it does, then you know your problem is either a bad upgrade, or 11.04
[17:44] <cryptk> fdsfdfs, if you do not tell us what you mean by "broken" then we cannot help you at all
[17:44] <cryptk> I am running gnome3 on 11.04 and my windows look fine
[17:44] <cryptk> tell me what you mean by broken, or perhaps a screenshot
[17:44] <eagles0513875> ya im gonna download and reinstall
[17:44] <fdsfdfs> http://img820.imageshack.us/i/bildschirmfotoa.png/
[17:44] <fdsfdfs> look at the window borders
[17:45] <arand_> perscitus: Well that kind of reasoning wouldn't really help innovation though :)
[17:45] <fdsfdfs> how can i fix gnome 3
[17:45] <cryptk> fdsfdfs, thanks, that's a theme conflict with the stock gnome2 accessibility themes
[17:45] <fdsfdfs> ok how can i fix :)
[17:45] <fdsfdfs> :)
[17:45] <cryptk> reboot to recovery mode and run these two commands
[17:45] <cryptk> calm down man
[17:46] <cryptk> give me time to type
[17:46] <fdsfdfs> ok
[17:46] <eagles0513875> !enter
[17:46] <eagles0513875> genec:  KM0201what i find on wpa2 works when the wired is plugged in then i connect
[17:46] <cryptk> apt-get remove gnome-accessibility-themes && apt-get dist-upgrade
[17:47] <cryptk> rebooting to recovery mode first is optional, but that is what I have heard works best
[17:47] <KM0201> eagles0513875, wpa2 is a wireless protocol, so if you're plugged in, you're not using it...  you mean you plug in your ethernet, and you can connect to your wireless network, and actually be on wireless(ie, you see bars showing signal strength)
[17:47] <cryptk> but you could likely just run that command and then log out and back in
[17:47] <tomreyn> charlie-tca: so according to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cmake/+bug/737137 cmake in natty should be able to find the libraries in /usr/lib64/x86_64-linux-gnu since cmake 2.8.3-3ubuntu4. I'm on cmake 2.8.3-3ubuntu7 and it does not seem to find them here...
[17:48] <eagles0513875> KM0201: yes exactly
[17:48] <eagles0513875> KM0201: which is strange how it doesnt cause the kernel to panic
[17:48] <tomreyn> charlie-tca: let me know if you're the wrong person to discuss this with and/or i'm wasting your time (sorry then).
[17:48] <KM0201> eagles0513875, that is weird
[17:48] <eagles0513875> ya waiting on iso to download
[17:48] <eagles0513875> actually screw that
[17:49] <eagles0513875> why wait for 694MB
[17:49] <eagles0513875> lol when i can use net install
[17:50] <eagles0513875> there is no netinstall is there for beta of natty
[17:50] <KM0201> hmm
[17:50] <KM0201> well i figured out the weather indicator in natty... now i just watn the panel dictionary back, and the system monitor in my panel, and i'll be fine w/ gnome 3
[17:51] <arand_> eagles0513875: That sounds very characteristic of a kernel bug in fact, weird combinations can have those effects
[17:51] <charlie-tca> tomreyn: I don't more than the messages said, actually. I think you would be
[17:51] <charlie-tca> better off asking in #ubuntu-devel
[17:52] <charlie-tca> tomreyn: sorry I can't help more.
[17:52] <tomreyn> i'll try, thanks
[17:52] <genec> eagles0513875: here's one for ya: I pretty much have to boot this laptop with the wireless off then switch it on when the login manager starts
[17:53] <eagles0513875> ouchie
[17:54] <genec> (haven't tried rmmod/modprobe yet)
[17:54] <perscitus> There is one universal truth i know about Unity and Natty. You CAN NOT customize it to your taste. I have looked and looked.
[17:55] <KM0201> perscitus, thats what i'm finding out;
[17:55] <KM0201> i don't mind the indicator applets, and needing to install them, but i would like to be able to add some panel applets to, that don't have indicators
[17:55] <perscitus> KM0201,  I can only few options in ccsm but thats it.
[17:56] <KM0201> system monitor is really the deal breaker for me... i like the dictionary panel applet, but i can install an app for it.
[17:56] <KM0201> but system monitor.. thats critical.
[17:57] <perscitus> system monitor is there.
[17:57] <KM0201> where?
[17:57] <KM0201> i know its installed, but i can't see how to put it on the panel.
[17:57] <perscitus> not as applet but Panel is part of Unity now.
[17:57] <KM0201> so how do i add it to my panel?
[17:58] <perscitus> Panel is different
[17:58] <KM0201> i understand.
[17:58] <KM0201> that.
[17:59] <DreamsofanEagle> Ok
[17:59] <KM0201> ok, so basically, no matter how it's done, how do i make system monitor where i can watch it.. rather than loading it up
[17:59] <DreamsofanEagle> I tried to redo my partitions and set it up so Natty and Maverick each has 10GB with 200+GB going for the /home partition, after I reinstalled 10.10 it refuses to boot saying "file not found" in grub, and any subsequent installs will not allow to progress any further than the "who are you screen", even when the letters are lower case
[17:59] <KM0201> 200gig home?..lol
[17:59]  * DreamsofanEagle shrugs
[17:59] <KM0201> DreamsofanEagle, any spaces?
[18:00] <DreamsofanEagle> nope
[18:00] <DreamsofanEagle> this goes for either Maverick or Natty installers
[18:00] <KM0201> type exactly what you have as your username.
[18:00] <saby> hey everyone
[18:00] <saby> is there anyway to check if i am using beta 1 or beta 2 ?
[18:00] <DreamsofanEagle> "david" minus the " "
[18:00] <cryptk> KM0201, have you considered using a real system monitor such as conky or gkrellm instead of panel applets?
[18:01] <KM0201> i'm not that familiar w/ conky... maybe i should do that.
[18:01] <charlie-tca> saby: any updates in update manager?
[18:01] <KM0201> DreamsofanEagle, is that the username, or the "Name of person using computer"
[18:01] <saby> nopes
[18:01] <perscitus> KM0201,  im going to end up switching to kde
[18:02] <charlie-tca> saby: no updates = beta
[18:02] <charlie-tca> 2
[18:02] <cryptk> conky, while it has a learning curve to get a really nice config, is very powerful, and with some work can look amazing
[18:02] <KM0201> perscitus, i hate, HATE, LOATHE, kde..lol.. that will not happen
[18:02] <eagles0513875> i loathe gnome
[18:02] <eagles0513875> find things i rather out of the ordinary places
[18:02] <saby> charlie-tca, does beta 1 automatically update to beta 2 through update cos i had updated the system last night and there were about 200mb of updates so i need to check if its beta 1 or 2
[18:02] <KM0201> lol, youre' a sick man eagles..lol
[18:03] <eagles0513875> saby: yes updates will bring u up to the latest beta and eventually release version
[18:03] <perscitus> gnome3 shell wont with compiz and i want most of the features in Compiz So KDE it is. And Unity shell just doesnt work for me
[18:03] <eagles0513875> KM0201: am not
[18:03] <charlie-tca> saby: yes, if you installed beta1 and update it, it is equal to beta 2
[18:03] <saby> alright
[18:03] <saby> thanx
[18:03] <charlie-tca> !final
[18:03] <Pici> saby: There is no such thing as being on beta 1 or beta 2. Those are just arbirary labels that reference the state of the repositories and CD images at a particular point in time.
[18:03] <DreamsofanEagle> thats for everything KM0201
[18:04] <DreamsofanEagle> I have no password either, but doesn't matter when I do
[18:04] <KM0201> thats another thing i've noticed, i'm not getting update/upgrade notifications... i just run apt-get upgrade && apt-get dist-upgrade
[18:04] <perscitus> People always ask if things automatically update. Blame Windows
[18:04] <DreamsofanEagle> its just sitting here saying "ready when you are..."
[18:04] <saby> ok Pici, cos i thought there might have been major changes in unity so they might have released just a new dvd instead of sending the updates
[18:04] <Pici> saby: It doesn't work like that.
[18:04] <KM0201> DreamsofanEagle, try making an id.. something like abcde.. one letter at a time, and see if you eventually get a checkmark
[18:05] <DreamsofanEagle> and I can't click forward or press forward
[18:05] <saby> alright Pici
[18:05] <DreamsofanEagle> everything has check marks
[18:05] <KM0201> DreamsofanEagle, there's something about your nick... just not sure what it might be.
[18:05] <perscitus> Appmenu [global menu] is redundent.
[18:05] <saby> still needs lot of improvement regarding power usage and other stuff
[18:05] <saby> brb sys restart
[18:05] <DreamsofanEagle> I've tried other nicks
[18:06] <DreamsofanEagle> everything I try changes shit
[18:06] <luite> wheren can I customize drop shadows and other compiz effects?
[18:06] <Pici> DreamsofanEagle: What username are you specifying?
[18:06] <DreamsofanEagle> wow
[18:06] <DreamsofanEagle> now I can
[18:06] <DreamsofanEagle> after putting in a pasword,
[18:06] <trism> luite: the drop shadows are configured in the metacity theme (in unity)
[18:07]  * DreamsofanEagle is now installing Natty
[18:07] <DreamsofanEagle> now, if only I can get it to boot
[18:07] <trism> luite: except for the panel shadow, I'm not sure if you can configure that yet
[18:07] <DreamsofanEagle> BTW, can I change a bug report after its been filed?
[18:07] <perscitus> DreamsofanEagle,  Why install Unity?
[18:08] <saby> back
[18:08] <trism> luite: other compiz effects can be configured in compizconfig-settings-manager
[18:08] <genec> DreamsofanEagle: you can definitely comment on it.
[18:09] <luite> trism: where can you customize those? I can't find it in the appearance settings in Control Centr
[18:09] <saby> finally installed 11.04 for testing yesterday
[18:09] <trism> luite: which, the drop shadows or the other effects?
[18:11] <KM0201> is there a way to make gkrellm panel dock.. and if i need it, click it?
[18:11] <luite> trism: I can change the general settings, change the window border to another theme etc, but not individual settings like the drop shadow or window animations. perhaps I'm looking at the wrong place
[18:12] <saby> the drop shadows are just a png atm not actuall shadows
[18:12] <trism> luite: yeah for the drop shadow, it appears you need to actually edit the theme. they are configured in the metacity-1/metacity-theme-1.xml file in the shadow tags
[18:13] <luite> trism: ah thanks. I've now installed compizconfig settings manager, and the rest of the settings seem to be there :)
[18:14] <charlie-tca> DreamsofanEagle: normally it is better to add a comment than change the report filed
[18:17] <cryptk> since there is so much talk about system monitors... here is mine http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb50/crypt1029/Screenshot.png
[18:17] <cryptk> no need to dock it... no need to drag a window around
[18:17] <cryptk> has tons of information, unobtrusive, there when I want it, and easily ignorable when I don't...
[18:17] <rwhittle> any idea on ETA for beta 2 to hit united states server ?
[18:17] <cryptk> KM0201, ^^^ link mainly for you
[18:17] <KM0201> cryptk, i just like system monitor... gonna have to figure out a way around this... i don't like conky or gkrellm
[18:18] <cryptk> ahh, well, good luck then!
[18:18] <KM0201> cryptk, main thing i like about system monitor, is when an app has become a memory hog, or whatever, i can open system monitor, find it, right click, kill.. and thats it.
[18:19] <cryptk> ahh, granted my POV on things is different than the normal person... I work on servers all day, so to me it is more natural to use command line tools like top, ps, etc
[18:19] <rwhittle> cryptk, could you pastebin your conkyrc ?  also, does that work with xeox processors modelled after the i7 intel chip ?
[18:19] <cryptk> rwhittle, I have no clue how much of my config will and will not work with it
[18:19] <rwhittle> cryptk, you using gnome3 on natty ?
[18:19] <rwhittle> np
[18:19] <rwhittle> what kind of cpu might you have ?
[18:20] <luite> hmm, this didn't go as planned, I changed some compiz setting and xorg locked up completely
[18:20] <cryptk> and that config has more requirements than just the conkyrc, but I will work with you over PM to get you all set up with it if you like
[18:20] <cryptk> and yes, gnome3 on natty, AMD Phenom
[18:20] <rwhittle> luite, hurry and fix before something horrible happens
[18:20] <rwhittle> cryptk, ok.  thank you.  nm.  different animal.
[18:20] <trism> KM0201: there is https://launchpad.net/indicator-sysmonitor although it is text instead of the nice graphs of the system monitor panel applet
[18:20] <cryptk> I don't really see any reason why it wouldn't work with an i7 though
[18:21] <cryptk> all of the CPU stuff is polled the "normal" conky way, so it should work with it
[18:21] <KM0201> trism, hmm, i'll try that
[18:21] <eagles0513875> that was a quick download
[18:21] <rwhittle> cryptk, i dont' mind giving it a shot
[18:21] <cryptk> ok, I will work with ya over PM
[18:22] <rwhittle> hiya eagles0513875
[18:22] <eagles0513875> hey rwhittle
[18:22] <Datz> hello, I'm wondering if Unity on 11.04 beta will work with my mobility ATI x1400 card yet? There was some driver issue about a month ago when I tried it last.
[18:23] <Pici> Datz: Its been working for me.  I'm using the open source drivers.
[18:23] <Datz> Pici: ah, you have the same card, or another ATI?
[18:23] <Pici> Datz: Same card, on a Thinkpad T60
[18:23] <luite> rwhittle: can't reproduce it, I'll see if I can find something in the logs
[18:24] <Datz> Pici: excellent. I'll give it a try. thanks a lot. :)
[18:24] <Pici> Datz: although, I'm not using Unity myself, just compositing in 'Classic' Gnome.
[18:24] <Datz> Pici: but you've tried unity, and it worked?
[18:24] <Pici> Datz: I think so.
[18:24] <Datz> hehe, ok
[18:25] <UbuntuFanatic> Hey.
[18:25] <Datz> well, maybe I'll just wait for 11.04
[18:25] <UbuntuFanatic> I am wondering if I did update-manager -d, and updated my maverick system,
[18:25] <UbuntuFanatic> am I likely to have issues?
[18:25] <Datz> not that big of a deal. I just wanted to try out unity
[18:25] <KM0201> UbuntuFanatic, there's always the possibility.
[18:25] <UbuntuFanatic> Also,
[18:25] <UbuntuFanatic> If I did,
[18:26] <UbuntuFanatic> Would I recieve all of the latest natty updates
[18:26] <UbuntuFanatic> with a simple sudo apt-get update/upgrade?
[18:26] <arand_> Is the -d commnds enabled by the way?
[18:26] <UbuntuFanatic> ?
[18:26] <arand_> They should be by now, right?
[18:26] <UbuntuFanatic> update-manager -d is.. :P
[18:27] <yofel> update-manager -d is enabled since alpha1
[18:27] <arand_> Ok, I hadn't tried it, and I know it tends to get enabled by later alphas or so normally
[18:27] <UbuntuFanatic> ^
[18:27] <yofel> UbuntuFanatic: and apt-get update/upgrade/dist-upgrade will work to keep it updated
[18:27] <UbuntuFanatic> alright.
[18:27] <UbuntuFanatic> I might give it a shot.
[18:28] <P05TMAN> Hello! Should I be able to upgrade to 11.04 through Update Manager one release is official?
[18:28] <P05TMAN> Edit: one=once
[18:28] <Datz> P05TMAN: afaik, yes
[18:29] <yofel> yes
[18:31] <P05TMAN> Datz, yofel: thanks..would you recommend testing on a vm first? I am fairly new to Linux but have some skill
[18:31] <vick> guys..
[18:31] <vick> I am having a lot of bugs with my 11.04 and I am reporting all of them from now on.
[18:31] <Datz> P05TMAN: once it's released it should be fine
[18:31] <yofel> P05TMAN: rather use a live disk to test, I think most issues are mostly hardware related now so a vm won't help much
[18:32] <P05TMAN> Datz: Excellent
[18:32] <yofel> as many of us use VMs for regular testing, so *that* hardware has pretty good test coverage :P
[18:32] <penguinbait> I am working with an armel image, is there a root password set in the image,  and if so what is it?
[18:32] <P05TMAN> yofel: Ah, great advice, I hadn't even considered the live cd
[18:33] <yofel> !root | penguinbait
[18:33] <genec> yofel: LOL
[18:33] <yofel> ^^
[18:34] <penguinbait> I am at a login window and I have NO user or password set, so before I reboot and do a chroot to set a password on something, I was hoping there was one set
[18:34] <yofel> penguinbait: not sure then, the live disks have a ubuntu user with password ubuntu
[18:35] <yofel> but no idea how the arm images work, no such hardware here yet, maybe ask in #ubuntu-testing if there are testing instructions for those
[18:35] <penguinbait> thanks, I guess its back to chroot :)
[18:35] <gnomefreak> anyone having issues booting the latest kernel? i dont remember the version but it was the one after 2.6.38-7-generic-pae so i guess it is 2.6.38-8-generic-pae
[18:36] <gnomefreak> everytime i try to boot it either sticks on plymouth or it just reboots system on its own. when i try to start/restart gdm i get GUI but it is broken
[18:37] <gnomefreak> and chromium is only update atm
[18:38] <cryptk> gnomefreak, are you using a 32 bit machine with more than 4GB of ram?
[18:38] <gnomefreak> yofel: do you know if you can add a launcher to the dock (like a terminal icon and it run a script when launched)
[18:39] <gnomefreak> cryptk: 32bit with 4gig
[18:39] <yofel> nope, I don't use unity
[18:39] <gnomefreak> hence the -pae
[18:39] <gnomefreak> yofel: oh
[18:39] <cryptk> ahh
[18:40] <gnomefreak> you choose classic rather than desktop? or is it a system reason?
[18:40] <cryptk> was gonna say my 2.6.38-8-generic kernel works great, but it is an AMD64 kernel, not the pae one
[18:40] <yofel> I'm a KDE user :P
[18:40] <gnomefreak> sorry to hear that  ;)
[18:40] <cryptk> gnomefreak, there are many people in here on 11.04 that don't use unity
[18:40] <gnomefreak> cryptk: i know
[18:40]  * yofel throws a konqi statue after gnomefreak :P
[18:40] <cryptk> (but not all of us non-unity-ers are on KDE either)
[18:41] <yofel> 2.6.38-8 non-pae work fine on my eeePC, as does the amd64 one on my thinkpad
[18:42]  * gnomefreak has KDE XFCE E17 lubuntu and 1 other just drawing a blank
[18:42] <gnomefreak> so maybe it is the pae :(
[18:42]  * cryptk just spins up a cloud server at work when he wants to use a different distro...
[18:42] <cryptk> or even... gasp... windows server...
[18:43] <gnomefreak> yofel: are you able to run flash in KDE? :P
[18:43]  * genec runs Flash in Kubuntu
[18:43] <gnomefreak> i need someone to confirm a bug for me
[18:44] <yofel> sure, though I haven't tried it in a while on my eeePC
[18:44] <luite> does anyone experience occasional temporary lockups with unity? sometimes the launcher stays in half-hidden state, and the system doesn't respond to anything for a few seconds
[18:44] <gnomefreak> the reporter is using maverick but i would like someone to confirm on natty
[18:45] <cryptk> gnomefreak, instructions on how to test/re-create?
[18:45] <arand_> gnomefreak: You are somewhat asking to ask here.. ;)
[18:45] <gnomefreak> luite: nope but this is a fairly fast system, i went from a P41.7 and 256mb ram to dual core AMD with 4gig ram   so lockups are no longer noticed by me
[18:45] <genec> gnomefreak: or an LP bug reference?
[18:46] <gnomefreak> arand_: no not really :) bug 657586
[18:46] <luite> gnomefreak: mine is a 2GHz core 2 duo with 4GB RAM, it might be caused by the nvidia driver
[18:47] <gnomefreak> arand_: with flash bugs i ask first since not everyone uses it or installs it from our archives
[18:48] <gnomefreak> luite: it can be caused by nvidia. someone around 12 hours ago said something about nvidia driver problems but that was ~2am
[18:48] <cryptk> 2.6GHz OC to 3.4GHz, quad core, 8GB ram... nothing slows me down...
[18:48] <gnomefreak> im using an ati card atm
[18:48] <gnomefreak> be back in a few, the only thing that slows me down is my smoking
[18:48] <cryptk> I did see some flash bugs on my system, I swapped from the 32 bit flash to the 64 bit and they went away
[18:49] <cryptk> never seen a flash video play fast and with no audio though, it was more just the video not rendering correctly, random white boxes, things like the slider on videos not rendering at all (just a black rectangle) etc
[18:49] <luite> gnomefreak: it doesn't happen very often, but it does detract from the otherwise smooth experience :)
[18:50] <rwhittle> cryptk, they have pentium d's that are 3.4ghz not overclocked you often have to get them from asia but they are very inexpensive
[18:50] <luite> but natty seems to tax the gpu quite a bit more than maverick :)
[18:50] <cryptk> mine started as an AMD Phenom 9950 BE, I buy cheap and OC, gotta put that watercooling to work somehow
[18:51] <rwhittle> yep.
[18:51] <cryptk> and just about no matter what processor you are talking about, Pentiums are almost ALWAYS much more expensive than AMD's
[18:51] <yofel> gnomefreak: flash works fine for me..
[18:51] <rwhittle> my case is tiny but so i couldn't do an all in one oc but i could do a decent fan.  its a xeons, so resellability is diminished greatly.
[18:52] <rwhittle> sorry for offtopic
[18:53] <rwhittle> hows $34.00 for a pentium d 3.4ghz functional including shipping at buy it now prices from america i think
[18:53] <rwhittle> dual core
[18:54] <luite> the pentium d is a pretty slow cpu though
[18:54] <gnomefreak> thanks yofel
[18:54] <rwhittle> duos do do better
[18:54]  * gnomefreak wonders why we went backwards rather than forwards with the desktop edition
[18:55] <cryptk> dual core, slow FSB, not anywhere near as fast as what is in here not
[18:55] <rwhittle> np
[18:55] <gnomefreak> i can add a laucher to desktop for what i want and drag it to the dock however if i remove the desktop launcher the dock one also goes away
[18:56] <gnomefreak> s/laucher/launcher
[18:57] <trism> gnomefreak: you can copy it someplace else, I've been keeping mine in ~/.local/share/applications/
[18:58] <gnomefreak> chrisccoulson: are you still around. i get this feeling you would know the answer to this question. how do i edit a launcher in the dock? example i want an icon to run irssi in term. i also have a script i would like to run from icon also
[18:58] <gnomefreak> trism: ah, that is worth a try. thanks
[19:00] <trism> gnomefreak: it seems you'll need to drag it back after you move it though
[19:00] <vick> i find beta 3 11.04 to buggy to be in beta 3..are there hopes for 11.04?
[19:00] <Pici> beta 3?
[19:01] <gnomefreak> trism: what do you mean? i just made one on my desktop i drag it to dock than move other to a file. but i have to copy it back to what?
[19:01] <gnomefreak> i thought we were skipping b3
[19:02] <trism> gnomefreak: oh I just meant after I moved the one on the desktop to another directory just now, it disappeared from the launcher, so I had to drag it back
[19:02] <trism> gnomefreak: to the launcher
[19:02] <maxb> Is there any way to adjust the "how long to press  mouse to left edge to reveal unity" time?
[19:02] <gnomefreak> oh
[19:03] <vick> Pici, the latest..I downloaded it yesterday
[19:03] <gnomefreak> trism: so i should copy it to another folder than drag it to launcher right
[19:03] <trism> gnomefreak: yeah
[19:03] <gnomefreak> vick: /topic says we are in b1
[19:03] <Pici> vick: Beta 2 is being released today.
[19:03] <gnomefreak> trism: thanks im trying it now
[19:03] <vick> can I upgrade my B1 to B2 ?
[19:03] <vick> or I have to reinstall?
[19:04] <Pici> !final
[19:04] <vick> u are the man
[19:04] <gnomefreak> trism: thanks it looks like it worked
[19:05] <gnomefreak> lets see if it works be back
[19:05] <cryptk> ok, gotta run, have a raid I hafta fix
[19:05] <vick> what time is the beta 2 being released? I want to make sure I get it.
[19:05] <Pici> vick: When its done.
[19:05] <KM0201> lol
[19:06] <KM0201> !isitoutyet
[19:06] <KM0201> lol
[19:16] <Help12345> hello
[19:17] <Help12345> how can i run tracerout in natty?
[19:17] <Help12345> the tracepath is useless as it can't detect mtu to google and shows no reply
[19:17] <genii-around> Help12345: sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get install traceroute
[19:18] <Help12345> genii-around thank you
[19:20] <Pici> Help12345: I personally find mtr to be more useful in those cases.
[19:21] <edgy> Hi, I want to install a new version gnucash so I browsed to http://www.getdeb.net/software/Gnucash but don't know how to download it!
[19:21] <gnomefreak> dont we have that in repos?
[19:22] <gnomefreak> edgy: what is wrong with our version
[19:22] <gnomefreak> and yes we do have it
[19:23] <gnomefreak> edgy: getdeb is an archive IIRC so you would add thier repo to /etc/apt/sources.list and than update and install or upgrade
[19:23] <DjMadness> Hi, Is there any way to disable desktop effects while still using unity ? some apps have troubles working with desktop effects (ie amsn) screen blinks all the time
[19:23] <edgy> gnomefreak: It's 2.4.2 whereas the latest is 2.4.5 and I am facing problems like can't put logos in my invoices and thought may be it's resolved
[19:23] <gnomefreak> DjMadness: no
[19:23] <gnomefreak> DjMadness: not that i know of
[19:24] <gnomefreak> edgy: not sure but you would have to check upstream changelog to be sure before you go and possibly messs something up. i have heard bad things about getdeb but i have never used it
[19:25] <gnomefreak> give me a minute please
[19:25] <Help12345> Pici i know mtr is great but i needed tracerout now thank you
[19:25] <gnomefreak> edgy: they dont have a version for natty or maverick for that matter
[19:26] <edgy> gnomefreak: yes, but why?
[19:26] <yofel> getdeb seems to use apturl now, so clicking on the install now link brings an app up that will install the package
[19:26] <gnomefreak> edgy: we dont support getdeb so you would have to ask them
[19:26] <gnomefreak> oh cool. but still only have lucid from what i can see
[19:26] <yofel> most vendors don't support natty until it's released
[19:27] <yofel> gnomefreak: they seem to think the lucid version works on mav too
[19:27] <Sovek> Ok, now under 11.04, how can I post a bug about the interface?
[19:27] <gnomefreak> hell medibuntu still doesnt have maverick packages or at least didnt at the staert of natty
[19:27] <yofel> Sovek: run 'ubuntu-bug -w' click on whatever you want to file the bug about and continue
[19:27] <gnomefreak> Sovek: what interface?
[19:27] <edgy> gnomefreak: I couldn't find the line I should add in sources.lst for getdeb!
[19:27] <Sovek> Unity
[19:27] <gnomefreak> yofel: -w?
[19:28] <gnomefreak> Sovek: need a package
[19:28] <Sovek> the Launcher doesn't allow a right click when a window is maximized
[19:28] <yofel> gnomefreak: get package by windowid from X
[19:28] <gnomefreak> you can file it under unity but it may not be a unity bug
[19:28] <Sovek> whats the package? Unity?
[19:28] <gnomefreak> yofel: cool
[19:28] <Sovek> well then its a feature that should be changed
[19:28] <yofel> Sovek: as I said, use -w and let apport guess the package
[19:28] <gnomefreak> Sovek: ubuntu-bug unity
[19:29] <gnomefreak> it sounds like he is talking about the dock
[19:29] <Jibadeeha> if i upgrade to ubuntu 11.04 will my encrypted home directory still work and be recognised
[19:29] <tt> how can i enable unity on ubuntu 10 without upgrading to 11?
[19:29] <Sovek> so ALT+F2 apport -ubuntu-bug unity
[19:29] <tt> 10.10
[19:29] <Sovek> netbook remix tt, don't
[19:29] <gnomefreak> Jibadeeha: should. afaik the option for that on installer is messed up but should keep what you have work
[19:29] <Sovek> it was a bomb
[19:29] <yofel> Sovek: no, ALT+F2 ubuntu-bug unity
[19:29] <Sovek> thank you
[19:30] <Jibadeeha> okay thanks gnomefreak
[19:30] <gnomefreak> cool ive been using ubuntu since breezy devel and never used alt+F2
[19:30] <Sovek> that doesn't work
[19:30] <edgy> gnomefreak: I couldn't find the line I should add in sources.lst for getdeb! any hint, please?
[19:31] <gnomefreak> Sovek: it worked here
[19:31] <Sovek> just sends me to apport
[19:31] <yofel> Sovek: yes
[19:31] <yofel> Sovek: follow the apport instructions and apport will send you to launchpad
[19:31] <maybethistime> Is there a way to make the left side (not-a-)panel/icons smaller?
[19:31] <Sovek> AMEN TO THIS
[19:31] <gnomefreak> edgy: no but as yofel said you should beable to use apturl (click on a .deb package and it should install it. however i would not use lucid version on natty
[19:32] <yofel> Sovek: we have our reasons for making the process being as it is, please follow it
[19:32] <Sovek> I'm trying and its not letting me do it
[19:32] <tt> @Sovek i installed it on netbook
[19:32] <gnomefreak> between maverick->natty has had a lot of design changes including the gui libs now going with lucid to natty is that much worse
[19:32] <yofel> Sovek: well, where does it fail? as it works fine here
[19:32] <edgy> gnomefreak, yofel: I tried clicking on it but nothing happens. I want to take the risk of installing lucid package in natty but how?
[19:32] <Sovek> I do that and it just sends me to apport
[19:32] <tt> i wanted to know can i install unity on ubuntu 10.10 without upgrading to 11.4?
[19:33] <yofel> Sovek: yes, and did you tell apport to send the report?
[19:33] <gnomefreak> edgy: best bet, 1. build it yourself. 2. file a wishlist bug or 3. ask someone to help you build it or ask them to build it
[19:33] <Sovek> not unless you run the Netbook remox
[19:33] <Sovek> remix
[19:33] <gnomefreak> tt: no
[19:33] <yofel> edgy: could be a bug in SC or whatever handles apturl in gnome then, worked fine here in KDE
[19:34] <gnomefreak> tt: you can build it but you facing a big problem with libraries alone
[19:34] <edgy> yofel: I am using KDE too
[19:34] <tt> i think i should stick with gnome3
[19:34] <tt> then
[19:34] <tt> kde sux
[19:34] <gnomefreak> tt: gnoem3 isnt in maverick
[19:34] <yofel> edgy: odd, here it took a minute, but then apturl-kde opened and asked me if I wanted to  install it
[19:34] <tt> i add the repo
[19:34] <frankwe> maybethistime: install compizconfig-settings-manager and start ccsm and search for the unity plugin, there you can change it
[19:35] <edgy> yofel: yes, I also get that but if you continue it would install nothing
[19:35] <yofel> oh :/
[19:35] <maybethistime> frankwe, Thank You.
[19:35] <yofel> it probably verifies if you're on lucid/maverick then and simply does nothing on natty
[19:35] <gnomefreak> tt: you mean gnome-shell?
[19:35] <achimtrf> frankwe: But he will run in trouble :)
[19:36] <frankwe> achimtrf: why that?
[19:36] <gnomefreak> tt: as i recall noone made a deb repo for gnome3 because of the massive changes
[19:36] <achimtrf> frankwe: Bug en/disabling plugins in ccms
[19:36] <Pici> !gnome3 | gnomefreak
[19:36] <yofel> Pici: we're talking about maverick
[19:37] <achimtrf> frankwe: Thats why i'm waiting for Beta2 :)
[19:37] <Pici> yofel: Well, I assumed the discussion in the natty channel was about natty ;)
[19:37] <frankwe> achimtrf: it's just changing settings, isn't it?
[19:37] <yofel> Pici: it was about nattys unity on mav, then strayed to gnome3
[19:37] <gnomefreak> Pici: i was told the desktop team was not going to release a PPA for gnome3 below natty but that was a few months ago. ill look and see
[19:37] <Pici> gnomefreak: Its for Natty only.
[19:37] <achimtrf> frankwe: I did it - see my bug reports and the developer-response
[19:38] <frankwe> achimtrf: i just changed the size and i don't see anything wrong yet
[19:38] <gnomefreak> ah its rico
[19:38] <gnomefreak> Pici: thanks
[19:38] <achimtrf> frankwe: Okay, congratulations!
[19:38] <frankwe> achimtrf: what's your bug?
[19:38] <gnomefreak> for people wanting to the affects of gnome 3 on maverick use gnome-shell
[19:39] <gnomefreak> its alot safer
[19:39] <tt> how can i s
[19:39] <gnomefreak> and lighter
[19:39] <gnomefreak> how can you s?
[19:39] <tt> how can i install photoshop?
[19:39] <yofel> !wine | tt
[19:40] <gnomefreak> tt: i doubt wine will run that
[19:40] <achimtrf> frankwe: Really every time i touch anything in there - the bug report appears. As i tried to make the icons in launchbar smaller (32px) - everything was gone. Nothing anymore on the desktop. Restart didn't help -> unity -reset did, but the icons were 48px again
[19:40] <yofel> gnomefreak: wine is regularily tested against photoshop, so the chances aren't that bad
[19:40] <gnomefreak> yofel: oh damn
[19:41] <frankwe> achimtrf: i see, when was that beta or alpha, or when did you try it?
[19:41]  * gnomefreak doesnt see anything wrong with gimp but hey thats just me
[19:41] <tt> i saw it run wine but it stuck in middle of the setup
[19:42] <achimtrf> frankwe: Not even Ctrl-Alt-T worked after this. Only Ctrl-Alt-Del - so i could restart it clean. The only way to get into a terminal was to make a link to it on the desktop (that works...)
[19:42] <maybethistime> frankwe: Thank you that did what I wanted.  But trying to install the ccsm thru the software center gave a dependancy error...synaptic worked however.
[19:42] <tt> stuck where u want to do next --> next ...
[19:42] <achimtrf> frankwe: 2 days ago, a few hours later as we talked about the two comma in date panel
[19:43] <frankwe> maybethistime:yea, installing though software center might not always work until the final release
[19:43] <KM0201> who was having the trouble w/ th einstaller not recognizing their name?
[19:43] <gnomefreak> ccsm+unity are have compatibility issues
[19:43] <maybethistime> frankwe, As long as something works.....
[19:44] <gnomefreak> see bug 685552
[19:44] <gnomefreak> chances are if you are able to install it you would hit this bug
[19:45] <maybethistime> gnomefreak, Was this for me?
[19:45]  * gnomefreak goes back to thinking of an alias
[19:45] <achimtrf> frankwe: Are you using gnome commander?
[19:46] <frankwe> achimtrf: no
[19:47] <eruditehermit> gnome shell is only in a ppa?
[19:47] <arand> Yes
[19:49] <achimtrf> frankwe: Okay. But you are not far from me - could you verify a bug with video playing on a site that uses flash player?
[19:49] <eruditehermit> arand, did gnome 3.0 not make it into natty?
[19:49] <arand> eruditehermit: No.
[19:51] <KM0201> arand, it didn't?.. sure looks like gnome3 to me
[19:51] <eruditehermit> just unity
[19:51] <eruditehermit> widgets and all look gnome 2ish
[19:52] <gnomefreak> eruditehermit: it should be in repos too. in maverick it was and early natty it was
[19:53] <gnomefreak> achimtrf: any chance you are seeing bug 657586
[19:53] <zniavre> good evening
[19:54]  * gnomefreak cant download a video to test with an external player (not even sure what one plays flash) but that is easier to find out 
[19:55] <eruditehermit> gnomefreak, looks like it was removed
[19:55] <eruditehermit> unity is slow
[19:55] <KM0201> it is a little
[19:55] <gnomefreak> eruditehermit: yeah i saw that. you can always use the PPA
[19:55] <achimtrf> gnomefreak: No, it isn't. Please look at this screenshot: http://goo.gl/9gUJP
[19:56] <eruditehermit> gnomefreak, yeah, just annoying for new users
[19:56] <eruditehermit> have to add ppas for them
[19:56] <gnomefreak> achimtrf: not really in the mood for sex chat sorry
[19:56] <KM0201> how do i make empathy start w/ all accounts disabled, so i can choose which ones i want online?
[19:56] <achimtrf> gnomefreak: What?!
[19:57] <gnomefreak> achimtrf: i got sites for sex chat come up from that link 3 of them
[19:57] <gordonjcp> achimtrf: that's a really offensive website
[19:57] <gnomefreak> might want to find somewhere else to post them. imageshack is always a good place
[19:57] <gordonjcp> achimtrf: don't link that stuff in here please
[19:58] <achimtrf> gnomefreak & gordonjcp: That is a screenshot from my firefox showing what is happening, when i hover the mouse over it. Nothing but that!
[19:58] <gordonjcp> achimtrf: o_O
[19:58]  * zniavre is waiting for 173.14.xx legacy nvidia drivers....
[19:58] <gordonjcp> achimtrf: yeah
[19:59] <gnomefreak> achimtrf: not what i got here. dont do it again please.
[19:59] <gordonjcp> achimtrf: the adverts, though, are not a screenshot from firefox
[19:59] <achimtrf> That you both jump on me cause i am describing a bug is worse!
[19:59] <gnomefreak> achimtrf: use a cleaner site
[19:59] <gordonjcp> achimtrf: a bloody great big layered div with an extremely loud NSFW advert for a porn site here...
[20:00] <eruditehermit> gnomefreak, I'm a little afraid that there is no downgrade process
[20:00] <KM0201> achimtrf, it's the site you used, it's got more or less, pornographic popups.
[20:00] <gnomefreak> now please change subject. if you want to use a cleaner site without bad advertisments use imageshack
[20:01] <KM0201> achimtrf, but to answer your question, not sure what the white bars are.
[20:01] <bullgard4> How to enter a Debug mode in Banshee 2.0.0?
[20:01] <KM0201> (i also saw your actual image)
[20:01] <achimtrf> imagehack is better than banana?! Okay, now i'm going in a psychiatric hospital.
[20:02] <gnomefreak> i asked you to please change the subject and get back to support.
[20:02] <KM0201> where is support for empathy
[20:02] <gnomefreak> bullgard4: there are a few --debug options
[20:03] <gnomefreak> bullgard4: http://paste.ubuntu.com/594168/
[20:03] <gnomefreak> those are some of the options. i dont know how many there are but please refer to man bansee
[20:05] <gnomefreak> KM0201: i assume in here as with most natty support. but you may have found a time where know one knows the answer to your questions. you can also try #ubuntuforums
[20:05] <KM0201> gnomefreak, i didn't ask my question, wasn't sure it was apropriate here.. but anyway... how can i set accounts to be disabled upon startup?
[20:05] <KM0201> i'm trying to get off the pidgin tit, but empathy isn't as good
[20:06] <bullgard4> gnomefreak: Thank you very much for your help.
[20:06] <gnomefreak> np
[20:07] <gnomefreak> KM0201: i tried empathy once and that was a long time ago
[20:08] <KM0201> might have to go back to pidgin, was trying to avoid that
[20:08] <KM0201> brb
[20:09]  * gnomefreak uses pidgin, instantbird, irssi, xchat, and used to use bitchx but not even sure if it is in repos anymore
[20:10] <Pretto> is unity able to run on a nVidia Corporation G98 [GeForce 9300M GS] by default?
[20:10] <gnomefreak> ok i really need to finish this one thing before it gets too late
[20:10] <gnomefreak> Pretto: yes but a few people have had complaints with nvidia recently but i dont remember what they were
[20:10] <Pretto> gnomefreak: I am one of them so
[20:10] <gnomefreak> Pretto: ah
[20:11] <gnomefreak> sorry
[20:11] <Pretto> gnomefreak: here I only get the gnome2
[20:12] <gnomefreak> nvidia has been an issue for a while with needing upstream to release newer drivers but that has been fixed but some people (including you) are seeing issues with nvidia. not heard many with ati this release
[20:12] <gnomefreak> Pretto: is compiz running in classic desktop edition?
[20:13] <gnomefreak> if it is than it is likely compiz+unity crashing normally compiz crashes unity at least it seems more bugs are that way rather than unity crashing first
[20:13] <Pretto> gnomefreak: not by default, i tried on LiveCD
[20:14] <yofel> it would seem those nvidia issues are compiz/unity only, as kwin works perfectly fine on both my nvidia systems
[20:14] <yofel> I did get compiz crashes on my nvidia system though, none on my eeePC. Haven't tried both in a while though
[20:14] <gnomefreak> Pretto: did the drivers install? im not sure where you are in this problem
[20:15] <Pretto> gnomefreak: it seems that it is using the vesa driver
[20:15] <yofel> Pretto: live disk uses nouveau, whose accelleration support doesn't seem to support everything unity needs
[20:15] <gnomefreak> im using ati still and im very pleased with it. this is the first time i have used ati since ~breezy
[20:15] <penguinbait> I see these kernel/initrd images here, but where is the cdrom image to install from?   http://ports.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-ports/dists/natty/main/installer-armel/current/images/omap/cdrom/
[20:16] <Pretto> gnomefreak: I am not sure because now i am on 10.10
[20:16] <gnomefreak> Pretto: than you dont have an issue with nvidia yet sinc eyou havent tried it yet
[20:16] <Pretto> gnomefreak: tried using a livecd
[20:16] <gnomefreak> hint. see a problem than worry, try not to worry before you see a bug
[20:17] <yofel> Pretto: as we said, the live disk doesn't use the nvidia driver
[20:17] <gnomefreak> livecd doesnt use nvidia drivers
[20:17] <gnomefreak> ok brb smoke and still trying to think of /alias
[20:17] <Pretto> yofel: so, how can I try it without install?
[20:17] <yofel> Pretto: persistent live USB should work, as you should be able to install the drivers there
[20:18] <Pretto> yofel: I will try it right now
[20:22] <tt> how can i set proxy in terminal?
[20:22] <gnomefreak> yofel: you are using nspluginwrapper with flash right?
[20:22] <yofel> no
[20:22] <gnomefreak> oh
[20:23] <gnomefreak> anyone know how to get gedit to use bash higlighting without using the shebang
[20:24] <gnomefreak> for some reason using # or ## to indicate comments no longer get highlited
[20:29] <Sovek> Ok, you guys have outdone yourselves :p
[20:29] <Sovek> 11.04 is DEFF better than 10.01
[20:29] <Sovek> err .10
[20:30] <gnomefreak> its also buggier well at least unity is
[20:30] <gnomefreak> ok so i have 2 things left to figure out than i can go back to the shop and finish my car
[20:31] <gnomefreak> than i will be "outdone"
[20:32] <gnomefreak> yofel: you were using konq when you tested flash earlier?
[20:33] <yofel> no, that was with firefox on 32bit and repos flashplugin, but flash64 works fine in firefox and chromium here on my thinkpad right now
[20:34] <yofel> I did hear about flash issues with konq and rekonq in the past, haven't tested that in ages though
[20:34] <BajK> lol it's funny, on windows when there's a new version, they all say "ohh xp was so much better" or "ohh windows 200 was so much better" and in ubuntu you cant wait to get a new version because the newer the more it rocks :D and natty definitly rocks :)
[20:34] <matt__> Hey guys nebody have a quick second?
[20:34] <matt__> I have an alienware laptop 5700, it has two 80 gig hd's. Neways i downloaded the 11.04 desktop and it never got past the loading screen. So i went ahead and did the alternate cd. I get to the point where it asks if i should enable raid....i say yes. then it goes and goes and gets to well where do you want the grub? well i tried so many flipping times it would install and then boom nothing would work....so i finally got it going but had to
[20:34] <matt__> di
[20:34] <matt__>  sable raid and now im stuck using one harddrive of 80 gigs....is there any way we can correct this from my installed distro now?
[20:36] <matt__> ?
[20:38] <gnomefreak> i have a dell insporion with a 750gig and a 240gig but not raid and i have never had
[20:38] <gnomefreak> on any pc
[20:38] <Reinis> Hi everyone, i have a bug, but i am not sure for  which package to report it.
[20:38] <Reinis> I am running Xubuntu Natty. I have btrfs partition since Lucid, where all my data resides and since few days the partition is checked every boot time.
[20:38] <Reinis> Could the package be btrfs-tools?
[20:39] <matt__> Yeah its really wierd....idk It wanted me to do a grub loader and well i dont need one, and i was able to skp that part during the install with no raid.
[20:39] <ikonia> you do need grub to boot
[20:39] <Lorthirk> cryptk, sorry for the hassle, have you checked about gnome 2/3 overwritings?
[20:39] <matt__> but trying to combine the drivers and doing grub just killed the system, after reboot it didnt work.
[20:40] <matt__> Its installed now on one of my harddrives. My other 80gig is just useless :S, and I think it may be disabled in bios.
[20:40] <matt__> idk if theres a way to fix this, or what is the proper steps. When it asks to install grub it shows a destination of dev/mapper
[20:40] <Rich__> Hi, I recently tryed to install Natty as a dual boot with Windows 7 on my MESH pc and the install went fine. My problem is that Windows 7 will not show up on grub2? Please help
[20:40] <matt__> and then it fails, i tried doing hda1 i think :s, but all failes.
[20:41] <matt__> fails*
[20:42] <gnomefreak> !grub > matt__
[20:42] <gnomefreak> damn sorry matt__
[20:42] <gnomefreak> !grub > Rich__
[20:42] <Lcawte> !grub > Lcawte
[20:43] <matt__> lol I didnt lose windows. I formated the hardrives
[20:43] <matt__> I hate windows :), been using ubuntu for years
[20:43] <ikonia> why are you making these pointless comments when people are trying to help youy
[20:43] <matt__> Psht not enough though I guess to figure this out :|
[20:44] <gnomefreak> matt__: i used your nick by mistake see my comment that started with "damn sorry"
[20:45] <Lcawte> !grub2 > Lcawte
[20:47] <matt__> All I want to know. I have two 80gig hardrives in my laptop. I was not able to install using raid to combine them. When i tried it would get to the point to install grub. It gave a destination of dev/mapper. That failed. So i tried one of the suggestions, dev/hda0 I bleive. It went through and installed. When I reboot it wouldnt load anything. I tried several times. The last try I disabled raid, and it installed on one harddrive. Then did
[20:47] <matt__> the grub part by itself. So my question, can i recover my other hardrive and make it ONE. Oooooor can I reinstall, and if so, what destination do i point grub in :S. Ive read all the forum boards and stuff, that is why i am here to talk to a person who is experienced in this situation.
[20:51] <gnomefreak> isnt there a raid channel?
[20:52] <matt__> :|
[20:52] <Reinis> Ok, i repoerted it btrfs-tools and found it is already reported, good.
[20:52] <levu> i've installed natty in januar and upgraded since that, so now i think, i'm at the state of beta2, but how do i enable overlay scrollbars? I use classical desktop, but neither in classical desktop nor in unity i can enable it
[20:52] <gnomefreak> !final | levu
[20:53] <gnomefreak> so you are up to date. im guessing overlay scrollbars is an option in ccsm?
[20:53] <Reinis> no its not
[20:53] <gnomefreak> Reinis: where is it?
[20:54] <frankwe1> levu: also notice that they don't appear in all applications, only in banshee and nautilus, for example
[20:54] <gnomefreak> i have never seen them AFAIK
[20:55] <rww> I use Terminal and Firefox 99% of the time, so... yeah...
[20:55] <levu> i've tried using  LIBOVERLAY_SCROLLBAR=1 gedit and (and also with banshee) and i just can't turn them on but many blogs out there tell me that overlay scrollbars are enabled by default in beta2
[20:55] <ikonia> matt__: could you join #ubuntu-ops for a moment please
[20:56] <matt__> im in, should i repost?
[20:56] <frankwe1> levu: do you see the old gtk scrollbars or nothing?
[20:56] <Saamm> is there a way to change unity launcher color?
[20:56] <Rich__> Hi, I recently tryed to install Natty as a dual boot with Windows 7 on my MESH pc and the install went fine. Now I have a windows 7 entry but when I select it i comes up with a black screen no errors just a blinkine cursor, whhat shoulf I do?
[20:57] <Superstar> Rich_ how long have you waited? Any HD activity?
[20:57] <Reinis> Ievu: create file ".profile" in your home dir
[20:57] <Reinis> and put this line in
[20:57] <Reinis> export LIBOVERLAY_SCROLLBAR=1
[20:57] <levu> frankwe1: i see the old gtk scrollbars, so i have scrollbars, that's not the problem, but i want to test the cool new stuff ;)
[20:58] <Rich__> I have left it for quite a long time maybe 10 - 20 mins and it seems there is some harddrive activity but not much
[20:58] <Reinis> it works for me and I am really loving it
[20:59] <frankwe1> Reinis: that should not be necessary. it works out of the box here
[20:59] <gnomefreak> isnt .profile there by default?
[20:59] <Reinis> I see. could be
[20:59] <Rich__> Do you have any ideas what I could do?
[20:59] <Reinis> .profile wasnt here by default
[20:59] <gnomefreak> it is here
[21:00] <yofel> .profile is there on new recent installs, but it wasn't there by default in the past
[21:00] <levu> with LIBOVERLAY_SCROLLBARS=1 gedit run from the terminal there should be no difference
[21:00] <Rich__> Superstar?
[21:00] <gnomefreak> Reinis: http://paste.ubuntu.com/594193/
[21:01] <Superstar> Rich_ I'm researching for you bare with me
[21:01] <gnomefreak> mine is an upgrade not new install
[21:02] <Rich__> Superstar Ok thanks :)
[21:03] <xjunior> hello everybody!
[21:03] <xjunior> how do I make the Alt+F2 run dialog resizable like here: http://cdn.omgubuntu.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/grey-500x312.jpg
[21:04] <gnomefreak> adding export LIBOVERLAY_SCROLLBAR=1 makes no difference here lauching gedit from term or from filemanager
[21:05] <levu> which package provides overlay scrollbars?
[21:05] <rww> xjunior: it resizes by default when you search...
[21:06] <frankwe1> levu: overlay-scrollbar
[21:06] <gnomefreak> i guess that would help
[21:06] <gnomefreak> thanks
[21:06] <gnomefreak> brb
[21:07] <frankwe1> levu: perhaps try creating a new account and see if it works for that? perhaps you've messed up some settings
[21:07] <levu> frankwe1: aaaah, k, that isn't installed when upgrading, it's just shipped with beta2 by default :D
[21:07] <xjunior> rww: no, here it's fullscreen
[21:07] <levu> now i'm installing it and i hope it works :)
[21:07] <Reinis> gnomefreak: that is now the default .profile content, yes?
[21:07] <frankwe1> levu: damn, I had such issues too when upgrading, because it's all not dependencies but recommendations
[21:08] <matt__> I have an alienware laptop 5700, it has two 80 gig hd's. Neways i downloaded the 11.04 desktop and it never got past the loading screen. So i went ahead and did the alternate cd. I get to the point where it asks if i should enable raid....i say yes. then it goes and goes and gets to well where do you want the grub? well i tried so many flipping times it would install and then boom nothing would work....so i finally got it going but had to di
[21:08] <matt__>  sable raid and now im stuck using one harddrive of 80 gigs....is there any way we can correct this from my installed distro now?
[21:08] <frankwe1> apt-get doesnt install them, even when doing a reinstall or ubuntu-desktop
[21:08] <frankwe1> *of
[21:09] <levu> frankwe1: is there a way to get a list of all packages that are not installed but recommended?
[21:09] <matt__> If anybody can help or aaaaaaaaaaanything i would appreciate it above all things.
[21:09] <ikonia> matt__: I advise you not to use fakeraid technology on linux - it's a weak technology with poor support
[21:09] <xjunior> rww: got it?
[21:09] <frankwe1> levu: apt-get depends ubuntu-desktop
[21:09] <levu> frankwe1: thanks
[21:10] <levu> yeah it works, they're great :)
[21:10] <frankwe1> levu: sorry, apt-cache
[21:10] <levu> frankwe1: ok, thanks :)
[21:10] <xjunior> how do I make the Alt+F2 run dialog resizable like here: http://cdn.omgubuntu.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/grey-500x312.jpg
[21:11] <delac> xjunior: are you using netbook or some other device with small screen?
[21:11] <levu> xjunior: there is a gconf setting that tells if the dash should be minimized or maximized, it's something with "netbook" and "desktop"
[21:12] <levu> xjunior: have a look into gconf-editor or at ccsm :)
[21:12] <xjunior> delac: nop, I'm on a laptop with 15" screen
[21:12] <matt__> Well I mean if I reinstall again, and enable the raid. When I get to the point for grub, where would I direct it to install? See when Its disabled it states that it relizes this is the only operating system and that I shouldnt need a grub installed at this point yada yada, then i continue and it installs its thing. When I enable raid, it just wants to know where to put grub....so where do i put it? dev/x , x as the variable.
[21:12] <delac> xjunior: for small screens (1024x600) it will always be maximized
[21:12] <ikonia> matt__: I strongly advise you not to use fake raid
[21:12] <xjunior> delac: the screen is bigger then this
[21:13] <xjunior> it's like 1366xsomething
[21:13] <delac> xjunior: but as those former post tell, you can try to change the behaviour
[21:13] <xjunior> delac: no options for this on ccsm
[21:13] <delac> xjunior: but for my 1024x600 it is always full screen, regardles of the settings mentioned above
[21:13] <matt__> :/ 76 gigs just isnt an option for me right now.
[21:14] <delac> xjunior: hang on, I'm checking where the settings are
[21:14] <xjunior> delac: the screen is bigger here
[21:14] <xjunior> thanks
[21:14] <ikonia> matt__: you can still use 2 disks, just don't use them in fake raid,
[21:14] <matt__> ok ok, well Its not detecting my other harddrive now.
[21:15] <matt__> do i have to mount it>
[21:16] <ikonia> not for the installer no
[21:16] <matt__> my other hd
[21:16] <gnomefreak> Reinis: it is and i added the exp[ort line at the bottom
[21:16] <ikonia> matt__: not for the installer no
[21:17] <gnomefreak> Reinis: you said the overlay scrollbars only worked on a couple of apps?
[21:18] <delac> xjunior: ok. it's not in the ccsm. you need dconf-editor which is not installed by default
[21:18] <xjunior> dconf or gconf, delac ?
[21:19] <Reinis> I am using xubuntu and it works for all xfce setting windows, then many gnome apps, filezilla, synaptic...
[21:19] <delac> xjunior: dconf, it is very similar to gconf
[21:19] <delac> xjunior: going to replace it, I think
[21:19] <xjunior> delac: ok, so, in there, where I do the change?
[21:19] <gnomefreak> Reinis: oh ok. thanks
[21:19] <delac> xjunior: desktop->unity
[21:21] <xjunior> how does it must look like
[21:21] <xjunior> ? delac
[21:21] <majnoon> can still install reg gnome ,right ??
[21:21] <delac> xjunior: what should look like what?
[21:21] <xjunior> the configurations
[21:21] <xjunior> it's now:
[21:22] <xjunior> form-factor: desktop
[21:22] <xjunior> home-expanded: Expanded
[21:22] <gnomefreak> Reinis: it doesnt work in synaptic
[21:22] <delac> xjunior: form-factor is the one. it is usually: automatic
[21:22] <gnomefreak> at least not here
[21:23] <delac> xjunior: take a look of this: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2011/03/quick-tip-enable-full-screen-dash-in-natty-desktop/
[21:23] <gnomefreak> majnoon: regular gnome is called classic desktop edition you can change to it using the login screen
[21:23] <majnoon> oh so it included ,just not default ??
[21:23] <xjunior> it's weird
[21:24] <xjunior> because my laptop has a higher resolution but the dash is always fullscreen
[21:24] <gnomefreak> majnoon: right
[21:24] <mstp> Hi everyone, I'm looking to create a custom version of natty for myself with UCK, I was just wondering is there anyway of finding out the bare minumum package list needed to run ubuntu natty with unity
[21:24] <xjunior> Oh, I think I found why
[21:24] <majnoon> i can live with THAT :)
[21:24] <xjunior> it's768 height
[21:24] <ikonia> mstp: is' not even stable yet, why are you trying to customise it
[21:25] <delac> xjunior: yes, I was going to ask about that :)
[21:25] <majnoon> what that status on naty wubi ??
[21:25] <gnomefreak> majnoon: broken still please see the link in the topic
[21:25] <majnoon> they say broken ,but no updates :(
[21:25] <mstp> ikonia: I want to use it without bloat basically so i just want to cook a quick livecd to install on my laptop
[21:26] <gnomefreak> mstp: unity == bloat
[21:26] <Guest79971> Hey this is matt__ idk how im logged in as guest but i am.
[21:26] <gnomefreak> you cant have both
[21:26] <ikonia> without bloat.......oh dear
[21:26] <Guest79971> I do I get my other hardrive to be recognized.
[21:26] <Guest79971> how*
[21:26] <ikonia> Guest79971: the installer should recognise it as long as you're not trying to use a raid mode
[21:27] <gnomefreak> less bloat == classic desktop edition. unity is all bloat and is desgned that way
[21:27] <mstp> hmm, is there such a list for maverick meerkat?
[21:27] <Guest79971> I didnt use raid at all. The installer did recognize both of them. So i chose one and installed the distro which I am using now. When I go to my computer I only see one harddrive.
[21:27] <ikonia> Guest79971: then you need to mount the second one
[21:27] <gnomefreak> ok it seems so far only gedit uses the overlay scrollbares
[21:27] <Guest79971> :) yay!!!! How do I mount....it.
[21:28] <ikonia> Guest79971: you're using a beta distribution, why when you are struggling to deal with the basics ?
[21:28] <gnomefreak> hint you would use the mount command to mount  something
[21:29] <gnomefreak> man mounth should help
[21:29] <gnomefreak> mount
[21:29] <c_k> cool, downloading beta 2 now!
[21:29] <Guest79971> Well like I said Ive used it for years, I was much better at one point. Have a child and then a couple years later when your ready to start hobbies again see how quick you are to help....now ubuntu.com advertises these channels for support. Not slanderous remarks and people that are very unprofessional.
[21:30] <Guest79971> Hows ubuntu going to get ANYWHERE. CUSTOMER CARE! Even though its not funded, psht, gimmie a break.
[21:30] <gnomefreak> Guest79971: use the mount command or use man mount
[21:30] <Guest79971> thnku
[21:30] <gnomefreak> Guest79971: stop your rant please
[21:30] <Guest79971> its stopped.
[21:30] <c_k> congrats on the kids btw
[21:30] <Guest79971> Thnku
[21:32] <guntbert> Guest37767: btw, all helping here are volunteers, so please keep polite
[21:33] <Guest79971> so it says /dev/sda1 is already mounted, i tried sda2 and ...yeah etc. What might my second drive be?
[21:33] <ikonia> Guest79971: it's not slanderous if it's true - it's advice
[21:34] <ikonia> Guest79971: 2 is the second partition on the first drive
[21:34] <ikonia> sdb is the second drive
[21:34] <Reinis> gnomefreak: http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot-20110414-233301.php
[21:35] <Guest79971> Thankyou but it says it cannot find sdb
[21:35] <charlie-tca> Is there an sdb1?
[21:35] <majnoon> installing in virtual box now ,i LIKE the part where can see what exactaly going on
[21:36] <Guest79971> No theres not
[21:36] <Guest79971> tried it.
[21:36] <ikonia> Guest79971: think it through sda1 is the first partition on the first disks, sda2 second partition on the first disk....
[21:36] <ikonia> Guest79971: pastebin the output of "sudo fdisk -l " please
[21:36] <Guest79971> ok ok
[21:37] <Guest79971> Disk /dev/sda: 80.0 GB, 80026361856 bytes
[21:37] <Guest79971> 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 9729 cylinders
[21:37] <Guest79971> Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes
[21:37] <Guest79971> Sector size (logical/physical): 512 bytes / 512 bytes
[21:37] <Guest79971> I/O size (minimum/optimal): 512 bytes / 512 bytes
[21:37] <Guest79971> Disk identifier: 0x0002f8cd
[21:37] <Guest79971>    Device Boot      Start         End      Blocks   Id  System
[21:37] <Guest79971> /dev/sda1   *           1        9599    77101056   83  Linux
[21:37] <Guest79971> /dev/sda2            9599        9730     1047553    5  Extended
[21:37] <Guest79971> /dev/sda5            9599        9730     1047552   82  Linux swap / Solaris
[21:37] <Guest79971> Disk /dev/sdb: 80.0 GB, 80026361856 bytes
[21:37] <Guest79971> 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 9729 cylinders
[21:37] <Guest79971> Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes
[21:37] <Guest79971> Sector size (logical/physical): 512 bytes / 512 bytes
[21:37] <Guest79971> I/O size (minimum/optimal): 512 bytes / 512 bytes
[21:37] <ikonia> Guest79971: I said paste bin
[21:37] <Guest79971> Disk identifier: 0xe1800060
[21:37] <guntbert> where is floodbot?
[21:37] <ikonia> bots are MIA
[21:37] <guntbert> :(
[21:38] <guntbert> !pastebin | Guest79971
[21:38] <gnomefreak> Reinis: i have to tend to dog but here is what i get http://img827.imageshack.us/f/overlayscrollbars.png/
[21:38] <ikonia> Guest79971: you can talk again, I've unmuted you
[21:39] <Guest79971> Gotch ya.
[21:39] <Guest79971> So my bad about paste bin. Did not know. Last time I used irc was like 5 years ago, and it was cool to paste outputs then.
[21:40] <danielf> when can I download Beta2 ?
[21:40] <Guest79971> maybe 4 idk. Well since I took up how many lines. Did you by any chance read it.
[21:40] <Reinis> gnomefreak: and in others, like gedit, it works?
[21:40] <ikonia> danielf: if you can't find it - I don't feel it's a good idea to use it
[21:40] <danielf> ikonia: I'm on beta1
[21:40] <danielf> today is 14th
[21:40] <ikonia> danielf: so ?
[21:40] <danielf> but, time of releasing?
[21:41] <ikonia> what ?
[21:41] <danielf> time, hour, minutes
[21:41] <danielf> when!
[21:41] <Guest79971> ?oh wait, says sbd doesnt contain a valid partition table....is this something I can addresss
[21:41] <charlie-tca> danielf: if you update using update manager or dist-upgrade, yo are at beta2 already. No
[21:41] <ikonia> Guest79971: paste on your paste output, it doesn't have a partition table
[21:41] <charlie-tca> No need to reinstall to get beta2 in natty
[21:41] <ikonia> Guest79971: yes, you'll need to put a partition table on it and a file system to be able to mount it
[21:41] <danielf> i'm, not going to reinstall
[21:42] <charlie-tca> Okay, you started with beta1, you are at beta2 already
[21:42] <Guest79971> Ok ok, would norton ghost be alright to use just to get a basic file system, is there a different way I can do this?
[21:42] <danielf> but no packages were updated today
[21:42] <danielf> 17:42 UTC-3
[21:43] <charlie-tca> and they did not need to; Quality Assurance has been trying to get beta2 ready, and we froze the update stuff
[21:43] <guntbert> Guest79971: better use the linux tools - disk utility    or   gparted
[21:43] <danielf> so, later today?
[21:44] <Guest79971> okie dokie
[21:45] <c_k> danielf: it's out.
[21:45] <c_k> danielf: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/natty/beta-2/
[21:45] <danielf> okay so I will ignore kpackage manager and use aptitude
[21:46] <Guest79971> ok using the utility it is very nice. Now...should I do a format of it or a ext4 format....eeeer what?
[21:46] <c_k> oh you can in-place upgrade?
[21:46] <Guest79971> "volume"
[21:46] <c_k> can we do the same to go from beta2 to release?
[21:46] <charlie-tca> yup
[21:46] <ikonia> Guest79971: ext4 is the standard file system, so no issue with that
[21:47] <charlie-tca> !final > c_k
[21:47] <Guest79971> Thank you. Thats what I thought I should do. So I'll make it a volume then....alrighty. Thank you once again for all the trouble.
[21:47] <c_k> excellent, many thanks guys
[21:48] <Lorthirk> !final > Lorthirk
[21:49] <gordonjcp> in the classic desktop how do I get rid of all the compiz effects?
[21:49] <gnomefreak> Reinis: gedit it works. i havent tried much anything else. if you give me a few apps i can try
[21:50] <gnomefreak> i have a few more minutes than i have to finish my transmission so i can get it in the car in the morning
[21:50] <guntbert> gordonjcp: there is "classic-plain" too
[21:50] <gordonjcp> gnomefreak: fun ;-)
[21:50] <gordonjcp> guntbert: ugh, so I have to log out and log back in again with yet another setting?
[21:51] <gnomefreak> gordonjcp: that is what i get when i go from a mechanic to owning my own shop
[21:51] <Reinis> it works in Transmission :D
[21:51] <guntbert> gordonjcp: sorry, I really don't know, not playing very intensive with natty
[21:51] <gordonjcp> gnomefreak: the cobbler's children have no shoes
[21:51] <gnomefreak> there is a classic-plain?
[21:51] <gordonjcp> gnomefreak: this is why my 2m FM radio is still in bits on the front seat of my van
[21:51] <gnomefreak> you can disable compiz in classic
[21:51] <Kyle__> Lo.  Grub q.  How do you permenantly change your boot options?
[21:52] <gordonjcp> gnomefreak: where do you do that?
[21:52] <Kyle__> I found /etc/grub.d/10_linux, and frankly, it's not obvious where ot make changes.
[21:52] <Reinis> and VLC, and i think in any other Qt app
[21:52] <gnomefreak> gordonjcp: i hae a building next door to my house
[21:52] <gnomefreak> !grub2 > Kyle__
[21:52] <gordonjcp> gnomefreak: no, I mean disabling compiz ;-)
[21:52] <gnomefreak> gordonjcp: oh
[21:52] <gnomefreak> oops
[21:53] <guntbert> gnomefreak: its called classic - no effects
[21:53] <gnomefreak> gconf-editor is one place. you can also do it from ccsm if you installed it
[21:53] <gnomefreak> the above is IIRC
[21:54] <gordonjcp> gnomefreak: yeah
[21:54] <gordonjcp> I just ran metacity --replace from alt-f2
[21:54] <gordonjcp> there really should be an easier way to do it though
[21:55] <gordonjcp> gnomefreak: what kind of car are you doing the gearbox in?
[21:55] <gnomefreak> gordonjcp: from the appearance menu as long as you dont have ccsm as i recall
[21:56] <gnomefreak> 05 monte carlo, please stick with support
[21:56] <gordonjcp> gnomefreak: ah; I installed ccsm in a failed attempt to get rid of the horrible drop shadows
[21:56] <gordonjcp> maybe that's why it's not in the appearance menu
[21:56] <gnomefreak> Reinis: maybe the theme?
[21:56] <gnomefreak> gordonjcp: that is why
[21:57] <Kyle__> gnomefreak: Read through that page, doesn't have what I need.
[21:57] <Kyle__> gnomefreak: I just need to add two flags to the kernel parameters, and that sort of edit isn't shown in the page.
[21:58] <gordonjcp> Kyle__: it used to be easy in Grub
[21:58] <gordonjcp> grub2 is just one of the many terrible, terrible mistakes in Natty
[21:59] <Kyle__> gordonjcp: Should be, but the grub.cfg is autogenerated in ubunut, and comes with _huge_ warnings about not editing the file, to edit the contents of /etc/grub.d/ instead.
[21:59] <gordonjcp> Kyle__: yes
[21:59] <gordonjcp> Kyle__: it's a total mess
[21:59] <gordonjcp> Kyle__: welcome to 1995
[21:59] <gnomefreak> you should be able to use grub cml and you should be able to save it but i havent tried in a long time
[21:59] <Kyle__> Me, I loved lilo, and still like it better than grub[12], but I _know_ grub doesn't have to be anywhere near this complicated.
[22:00] <Kyle__> grub cml?  I'll look it up.
[22:00] <gordonjcp> I'm giving Ubuntu until saturday, because then I will have been running it for two weeks
[22:00] <gordonjcp> but I can't see myself liking it any more by then
[22:00] <gnomefreak> when you boot i think you enter the command line using the e key. i would have to do it to make sure
[22:01] <Kyle__> gordonjcp: It's easy to bitch& moan about ubuntu, and it does _tons_ of things I hate...but if you just want a linux desktop/laptop that works, at the end of the day, it's pretty awesome.
[22:01] <gordonjcp> Kyle__: yeah, that's the problem
[22:01] <gordonjcp> it *doesn't* work
[22:01] <gordonjcp> it's totally unusable as it comes
[22:01] <gnomefreak> gordonjcp: it becomes second nature after a while. most things i dont need to look up how to do anymore but like with grub grub 2 is almost a full overhaul from grub
[22:02] <Kyle__> gnomefreak: I kindof need to make it permenant.  I have a stack of 20 mac minis that will run headless, and those kernel options need to be there.
[22:02] <gordonjcp> gnomefreak: I really, really can't get used to Unity
[22:02] <Reinis> gnomefreak: I am using Aurora-Midnight that i copied from Linux Mint, but i just tested other themes and it still works
[22:02] <gordonjcp> gnomefreak: and the big ugly drop shadow blurs around everything give me eyestrain
[22:02] <Kyle__> gordonjcp: Errr, I will point out this is the channel for 11, which is in beta :) it could be the whole beta thing that's killing you.
[22:02] <gordonjcp> gnomefreak: when I tried Unity at first I could only use that for about ten minutes at a time
[22:03] <gordonjcp> Kyle__: okay, so they're going to completely redesign every aspect of 11.04 for the release?  Cool!
[22:03] <gnomefreak> gordonjcp: well unity takes a while to get used to. they really tie your hands by not being able to customize certain things
[22:03] <gordonjcp> gnomefreak: I can't get used to it
[22:03] <Kyle__> gordonjcp: Heh, sorry.
[22:03] <gordonjcp> gnomefreak: it's so slow and clumsy
[22:03] <Kyle__> Is unity the one they use on the netbook remix of 9 & 10?
[22:03] <gordonjcp> in "normal" Gnome, I have something running in a window, it's on the taskbar
[22:04] <gordonjcp> if I want to see that window, I click on its thing in the taskbar
[22:04] <gordonjcp> simple
[22:04] <gnomefreak> thats the bloat and the system. i have a fairly strong pc so its not slow here
[22:04] <gnomefreak> Kyle__: yes
[22:04] <gordonjcp> in Unity, I have to mouse up to the top left, then mouse over each square individually to see what it is, then click on it, or right click on it, or middle click on it
[22:04] <gordonjcp> or *something*
[22:04] <gnomefreak> Kyle__: its not exactly the same as i remember
[22:04] <Kyle__> gnomefreak: Ah.  I switched to standard desktop ubuntu because of that, on my netbook.  I wasn't a fan, wonder if it's gotten better.
[22:04] <gordonjcp> eventually it might decide to launch another app the same as the first, or just show me the one I already have
[22:05] <gordonjcp> how are you supposed to tell what anything is in that stupid sidebar thing?
[22:05]  * Kyle__ starts up his vm of natty.
[22:06] <gnomefreak> i guess if you dont know what icons go with what app it can get confusing but you can always use the icon in upper left of screen or the apps icon in the dock
[22:06] <gordonjcp> gnomefreak: which is the apps icon?
[22:07] <gnomefreak> the + magnifing glass
[22:07] <Kyle__> Eh, it looks a little rough around the edges, but not that bad.
[22:07] <gordonjcp> gnomefreak: I don't know what that is
[22:07] <Kyle__> A bit more mac-like in ways.
[22:07] <gordonjcp> Kyle__: I can't use Macs
[22:07] <gnomefreak> should be 2nd from bottom. at least it is here
[22:07] <gnomefreak> ok night everyone
[22:08] <gordonjcp> oh, I was going to go back into Unity and see
[22:08] <gordonjcp> oh well
[22:08]  * Kyle__ shrugs
[22:08] <gordonjcp> I guess I could write what the squares are on a post-it note and stick it on the side of the monitor
[22:08] <Kyle__> We all have our religious prohibitions.
[22:09] <atc3030> Hello All. I just updated my Ubuntu 10.10 installation with the Natty 11.04 beta and im having a real pain trying to get my wifi broadcom 4311 chip to play nicely with it. any suggestions?	
[22:10] <sburwood1> How is Natty coming along?  I had downloaded the Beta 1 and found that the window decorations were missing.  (it didn't have the bar on top nor the "X", minimizing, and full screen things to click on
[22:10] <DasEi> !broadcom | atc3030
[22:10] <atc3030> thank you very much.
[22:12] <_|pegasus|_> sburwood1: You know about unity...?
[22:12] <sburwood1> I imagine that the final release will have LibreOffice, but will I be able to run both Open and Libre?
[22:13] <Kyle__> sburwood1: I don't see why it wouldn't let you switch between: you can with java.  But you do know 10 has libreoffice, not openoffice.  Right?
[22:13] <sburwood1> _|pegasus|_: Is that a program?  I am no expert yet to all the tech stuff
[22:13] <sburwood1> Kyle__: I can't find Libre for 10.10
[22:13] <_|pegasus|_> sburwood: No, the Desktop has changed in Natty. It was Gnome/KDE - now it's unity in Beta1
[22:14] <majnoon> naty no like virtualbox
[22:14] <_|pegasus|_> sburwood: That's why the look and feel changed
[22:14] <Kyle__> sburwood1: Actually I could be wrong, it's reporting as an oracle build of ofpenoffice in 10.10 for me.  But in my vm of natty it installed libreoffice by default.
[22:14] <sburwood1> _|pegasus|_: Will that change anything for me?
[22:15] <sburwood1> Kyle__: I know that Natty will have Libre, but I can't find it for Maverick
[22:15] <W3ird_N3rd> beta2 now available on usenet too :P
[22:16] <sburwood1> _|pegasus|_: Will the way to close windows change between Gnome / KDE and Unity?
[22:16] <_|pegasus|_> sburwood: Now, it looks quite different. That, what you feel a little bit 'irritated' about is maybe the change in it. I would recommend you look at the HP of ubuntu ;)
[22:16] <sburwood1> _|pegasus|_: HP of Ubuntu?  What's the HP?
[22:16] <Kyle__> sburwood1: I really thought it was actually libre in Maverick, but I guess I was wrong.  NOt sure how you'd go about getting it.
[22:16] <_|pegasus|_> sburwood: Now, in Gnome you had the panel and the title of a window was on the windo itself. Now all that is in the panel. Hover your mouse over it ;)
[22:17] <_|pegasus|_> HP is the homepage.
[22:17] <sburwood1> Kyle__: Besides, if Natty is stable - really stable, I'm gonna upgrade to Natty on April 28th
[22:18] <atc3030> no dice. already used that page to no avail
[22:18] <sburwood1> _|pegasus|_: Sorry, I'm not a wiz with all the abbreviations
[22:18] <Kyle__> sburwood1: It could be.  I'm goign to keep it a VM on my work box, until I'm confident it's stable.  Then updgrade.  But then again, this is the machine on which I need to do real work.
[22:18] <_|pegasus|_> sburwood1: You tried it?
[22:19] <sburwood1> Kyle__: Any way to set up a VM without it costing any or very much?
[22:19] <sburwood1> _|pegasus|_: I did Live CD with Natty.  Haven't installed it yet
[22:19] <sburwood1> And in 64 bit, please
[22:19] <Kyle__> sburwood1: Totally.  apt-get install virtualbox-ose
[22:20] <_|pegasus|_> sburwood1: Okay. Now when you have a window, you get the menu and the controls in the panel at the top ow your desktop. It starts all next to the ubuntu-logo.
[22:20] <Kyle__> sburwood1: there are other free vm systems for linux, but virtualbox A) has an easy to use GUI that requires little in the way of explination, and B) works pretty well even if your hardware doesn't support hardware virtualization.
[22:21] <arand> Though it will be tricky to run unity in a virtual machinethough...
[22:21] <sburwood1> _|pegasus|_: You were talking about what with controls, etc?
[22:22] <Kyle__> arand: Nah, it's easy.  I've got 50 machines in computer labs running a stripped down ubuntu that students use VMs of windowsXP, windows7, Debian and FreeBSD on.  Virtual machiens are easy now days.
[22:22] <yofel> well, you can get unity to work in virtualbox by installing some addon in the VM, not sure which of the virtualbox packages that was though
[22:23]  * Kyle__ is still waiting for his VM to finish updating, hasn't seen a thing that would cause issues yet.
[22:23] <_|pegasus|_> sburwood1: The Menu, you know: File | Edit | View | Help and so on. It's in the panel, where you see the title of the activ window. If you take your mouse to that title, it changes to the menu. Also the X, minimize and maximize controls appear now.
[22:24] <arand> I was thinking about getting 3D acceleration to go in vbox, dunno really what the status of that is currently...
[22:24] <Kyle__> yofel: What parts of unity don't work without the vb packages?  Just curious...
[22:24] <_|pegasus|_> Kyle__ write a review in Software Centre ;)
[22:25] <cuppsy> Does anyone know if there's a way to add more workspaces in the current beta?
[22:25] <Kyle__> _|pegasus|_: I need to do a whole writeup of it honestly.  I've got the only computer lab that I've ever seen students ask me how to duplicate.  Usually students lament the labs, and ask how to destroy them.
[22:25] <yofel> Kyle__: virtualbox doesn't support 3D without you installing a driver for that first (one of the guest addition packages) - and unity requires compiz as we all know
[22:25] <sburwood1> Kyle__: I'm in Virtualbox-ose.  I'm at the part about Boot Hard Drive, Create Hard Disk, Use existing drive.  What do I do?
[22:25] <Kyle__> yofel: Ahh, yes.  There is that :)
[22:25] <maco> create hard drive
[22:25] <Kyle__> sburwood1: Tell it to create a new hard disk.  Use the defaults, they'll be fine.
[22:25] <yofel> anyone got an idea how to run a unity session in Xephyr?
[22:25] <sburwood1> It won't mess up my present hard drive?
[22:26] <maco> sburwood1: no, its making a file on your hard drive that the VM will *pretend* is a hard drive, because...virtual
[22:26] <Kyle__> sburwood1: NOpe.  It will just create a big file that acts as a virtual-drive.
[22:26] <yofel> sburwood1: those are virtual disks which are stored as a file on your real system
[22:26] <Kyle__> BIG files.
[22:26] <Kyle__> But just files.
[22:26] <mwhudson> so i have a fun unity problem: the launcher and dock (is that the right term?) are appearing below regular windows
[22:26] <_|pegasus|_> Kyle__ lament...? Isn't that the nice part in the beeing of a student? *g*
[22:27] <maco> mwhudson: have you updated in the last few days?
[22:27] <sburwood1> Kyle__: Next step, install Natty on Virtualbox-ose
[22:27] <Kyle__> _|pegasus|_: Heh.  True true.  I just wish I had better hardware for them to work on.  over half the machines are still 64bit-p4 based dells.
[22:27] <sburwood1> right?
[22:27] <Kyle__> sburwood1: Yup!
[22:27] <sburwood1> thx
[22:27] <sburwood1> bye
[22:28] <Kyle__> sburwood1: good luck.
[22:28]  * yofel goes setting up a VM too...
[22:28] <sburwood1> Kyle__: And Happy IRS day tomorrow ... loll
[22:28] <mwhudson> ah hah https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/743834
[22:28] <maco> sburwood1: monday
[22:28] <mwhudson> maco: i upgraded yesterday
[22:28] <_|pegasus|_> Kyle__ Tell 'em that i've running an old TerraTV from '98. Nothing but that in my computer knows me that long ;)
[22:28] <Kyle__> Oooh!  Lets see how long it takes them this time...
[22:29] <maco> tax day was pushed off to monday this year because of Emancipation Day
[22:29] <mwhudson> (from maverick)
[22:29] <Kyle__> TerraTV?
[22:30] <yofel> hm, cool, first time using VB 4, and it automatically sets the OS version to 'ubuntu (64 bit)' if I name the machine 'Natty x86_64', nice...
[22:31] <_|pegasus|_> Kyle__: An real old analog TV-Card. The good: It knows color *lol* - the bad: It cant really do nothing but that. And it's really really old. But works! *wonder*
[22:32]  * _|pegasus|_ is thinking: Should i update now?!
[22:32] <Kyle__> _|pegasus|_: Analog tv in card?  Heh.  Now useless in the US, Canada, Europe, Japan.  Where are you that they still do analog broadcast?
[22:33] <W3ird_N3rd> Dutch cable maybe
[22:34] <W3ird_N3rd> Kyle__, or Belgium cable!
[22:34] <W3ird_N3rd> or just use it to hook up a VCR or DVB-settopbox or some games console
[22:35] <_|pegasus|_> Kyle__: Im in germany and it is still not useless - because: I've cable. No box no nothing - transferred through a normal antenna-cable (for normal/old TVs). That's why i need this card in my pc. No digital signal - and as long as much older people are living next to me - nothing will change, cause rocked da hell out them, if they come up with (new) digital stuff ;)
[22:35] <cuppsy> Does anyone know if it's possible to add more workspaces in the current beta?
[22:36] <W3ird_N3rd> _|pegasus|_, living in Germany, you could just hook up a satellite dish or DVB-T antenna to your PC and get everything FTA?
[22:36] <Kyle__> _|pegasus|_: Sweet!  I'm still having trouble getting my atsc ('mericas version of dtv) tuner working in linux.  It's on eof the things I'm hoping will work in narwall.
[22:36] <_|pegasus|_> cuppsy: I guess... Wait a moment, i figure it out, where it was
[22:37] <DasEi> _|pegasus|_: you try to use a tv-card, analog ?
[22:37] <_|pegasus|_> W3ird_N3rd: I have more programs with that old stuff than with the DVB-T. And: I pay for it - it's in the normal costs of my flat.
[22:37]  * W3ird_N3rd has a DVB-T/analog hybrid card
[22:37] <cuppsy> _|pegasus|_ Thanks... I've been looking everywhere for a way to get more space, haha.
[22:38] <W3ird_N3rd> yes but DVB-T/S looks better :D
[22:38] <W3ird_N3rd> and nowadays I think there are more programs supporting DVB than analog
[22:38] <_|pegasus|_> DasEi: No, im not trying - i Do. Viewing via TvTime.
[22:38] <DasEi> _|pegasus|_: ah, ok, was what I was about to suggest :)
[22:38] <_|pegasus|_> cuppsy: as long as i type, i'm not able to figure this out... brb
[22:39] <W3ird_N3rd> I use tvtime too, still the best :)
[22:39] <DasEi> less hassle least, wuahh, mythtv
[22:39] <_|pegasus|_> DasEi: Of course i had to write the bttv and so on. W3ird_N3rd: See, it works - better than DVB-T in my opinion
[22:40] <W3ird_N3rd> hmmm, depends on what aspects you look at
[22:40] <DasEi> depends on stick, but if card is supported , it's fine
[22:41] <DasEi> I don't use my old haupage at all, just zattoo, _|pegasus|_
[22:42] <lassegs> Hi! i cant seem to enable nouveau gallium3d with natty beta2 . installed through additional drivers, (i guess it installed libgl1-mesa-dri-experimental) but  no 3D support from glxinfo. Is there a guide or some way to troubleshoot this?
[22:42] <lassegs> i did not remove the nvidia-blob
[22:43] <yofel> lassegs: you do realise that the nvidia packages blacklist nouveau?
[22:44] <lassegs> yofel: so i should look to get rid of nvidia packages?
[22:44] <yofel> yes, as they provide their own GLX libs too
[22:45] <_|pegasus|_> cuppsy: No, i didn't find it. I was reading in the net: It is limited to four workspaces in natty.
[22:45] <lassegs> yofel: its ok to remove them through Additional Drivers GUI then?
[22:45] <yofel> yes
[22:46] <luite> is it possible to limit the gpu clock speed to one of the lower performance levels (nvidia)? my laptop gets uncomfortably hot running natty+unity, more so than with maverick
[22:46] <yofel> lassegs: how exactly were you trying to use nouveau if you didn't remove them?
[22:46] <_|pegasus|_> DasEi: You know, one thing is very suspicious: I got all TV-Senders und - let's say a "very clicky OS". But in Linux RTL is gone. I don't find it with no soft. Not in another distro - nowhere. That's the quiz of the week ;)
[22:47] <_|pegasus|_> und = under, in
[22:47] <lassegs> yofel: I just went in to the additional drivers GUI. listed both nvidia and "experimental". default installed is nvidia, but i clicked activate on "experimental". it didnt remove nvidia it seems
[22:47] <lassegs> yofel: got a little frustrated when i didnt find an xorg.conf to change drivers in. guess im just a noob a bit out of date
[22:47] <_|pegasus|_> cuppsy! - you got it?
[22:48] <DasEi> _|pegasus|_: it's for legal reasons, I'm a saurkraut, too, it's not in "free" no more, but cable n sattellite
[22:48] <yofel> lassegs: you could file a bug about that if you want as it's unclear about what it does, but there *should* have been a xorg.conf if the nvidia drivers were installed
[22:48] <DasEi> _|pegasus|_: ;) lies halt keine bild
[22:48] <lassegs> yofel: will do
[22:48] <lassegs> here I go
[22:48] <_|pegasus|_> DasEi: That is it: I have that cable and under win with DScaler i got it. Changed to linux - RTL is gone. From now to then with no reason.
[22:49] <lassegs> yofel: well this is embarrasing... how do you restart X these days?
[22:49] <DasEi> _|pegasus|_: decision of rtl
[22:50] <arand> lassegs: alt+sysreq+K
[22:50] <_|pegasus|_> DasEi: Hehe, i don't miss RTL. But i wanna know, why it's not there... If i know it - i'm sure that i do not even think about watching RTL.
[22:50] <yofel> lassegs: usually 'sudo service gdm restart'
[22:50] <cuppsy> _|pegasus|_ That's what I was thinking. Thank you for finding out for me!
[22:50] <yofel> arand: erm, *that*'s the cannon way to do it...
[22:50] <W3ird_N3rd> _|pegasus|_, maybe in the VHF band?
[22:51] <DasEi> _|pegasus|_: you could, it's crypted, wrong chan here, and I'm off support now, nice time all
[22:51] <arand> lassegs: yofel: Of course, provided one has acces to a terminal.
[22:52] <_|pegasus|_> W3ird_N3rd: I ran the whole tvtime-scanner with all frequencies enabled. i get all the tv-senders around rtl. But right in this frequency not even with the finetuner i get it. It's a ghost......
[22:55] <delac> anyone know remedy for: SystemError: InstallArchives() failed
[22:56] <W3ird_N3rd> _|pegasus|_, sounds strange. About as strange as my case, I have one frequency on satellite that's very weak for no reason
[22:57] <W3ird_N3rd> maybe I just need to re-align it a bit..
[22:57] <yofel> delac: in what context?
[22:58] <_|pegasus|_> I'm in trouble: My IRC-Client is sent to the tray - but there is no tray no more. I'm writing through its notify-popup. *lol*
[22:58] <W3ird_N3rd> euhm, re-add the notification area?
[22:59] <_|pegasus|_> Hui, i'm back...
[23:00] <_|pegasus|_> W3ird_N3rd: No, not the panel... I have this trouble often, cause it seems another kind of tray than in gnome. Many programs that sat in the tray arent able to do this in unity
[23:00] <delac> yofel: trying to install broadcom drivers for my wlan
[23:01] <yofel> delac: ah, so that comes from jockey? hm...
[23:01] <delac> yofel: yes
[23:01] <_|pegasus|_> e.g. i miss the System Monitor Panel, Tom-Dings-Notizen etc...
[23:01] <delac> yofel: fresh install
[23:01] <yofel> delac: can you check your /var/log/jockey.log (I think) for what actually happened?
[23:02] <_|pegasus|_> W3ird_N3rd: Which sender?
[23:02] <ubuntuguy> Beta 2 is so much more stable than beta 1
[23:02] <ubuntuguy> !
[23:02] <_|pegasus|_> ubuntuguy: You got it?!
[23:02] <ubuntuguy> Yeah
[23:02] <ubuntuguy> It's stable
[23:03] <ubuntuguy> feels like a full release
[23:03] <W3ird_N3rd> _|pegasus|_, just noticed there are a few more now. Some transponders at Astra 19.2 east
[23:03] <ubuntuguy> a couple of bugs though
[23:03] <_|pegasus|_> Wait a minute....
[23:03] <ubuntuguy> but I haven't come across them yet
[23:03] <_|pegasus|_> W3ird_N3rd: But you dont run a tvcard under ubuntu?
[23:04] <W3ird_N3rd> I have some settopboxes and a for Ubuntu I have some Technotrend cards
[23:04] <lassegs> anyone got anything on how to resolve overscan issues on nouveau?
[23:04] <W3ird_N3rd> but both have trouble and I just noticed it's more than one frequency, so it's time to get up on the roof :-(
[23:04] <_|pegasus|_> wasn't the syntax for upgrading ubuntu sudo apt-get upgrade -d ????
[23:05] <_|pegasus|_> W3ird_N3rd: Get your cash back ;)
[23:05] <W3ird_N3rd> what cash?
[23:05] <yofel> _|pegasus|_: it's update-manager -d
[23:06] <_|pegasus|_> yofel... uh, it's getting late ;) But that's my motivation to be up until now: Getting Beta2
[23:06] <_|pegasus|_> Thnx @ yofel
[23:07] <delac> yofel: well, the log doesn't contain the error message or any part of it and is full of stuff, so I really don't know even what to look for
[23:08] <_|pegasus|_> W3ird_N3rd: Okay, you're right. There's no provider for it, right?
[23:08] <_|pegasus|_> Guys - good night!
[23:08] <delac> and why am I missing Lock Screen and Change User from my shutdown menu?
[23:09] <delac> they were there right after the install, but not after second boot
[23:10] <yofel> delac: does /var/log/apt/term.log have any errors at the end?
[23:12] <yofel> hm... how do I launch a second instance of a running application in unity o.O?
[23:12] <delac> yofel: middle click?
[23:12] <yofel> incredibly un-intuitive...
[23:13] <delac> yofel: yes
[23:13] <Omega> Or you could, you know, launch the application again?
[23:14] <yofel> esp. if people have old mouses that don't have a middle button. I hope that the pressing both keys at the same time emulation works there at least
[23:14] <Kyle__> I have a three button sun mouse here somewhere....
[23:14] <Kyle__> Way before they had these wimpy scroll mice.
[23:14] <yofel> Omega: I don't consider that being very usable if I already have a button on the launcher for that application
[23:14] <yofel> or very nice at least
[23:14] <Omega> All you need to do is launch the application again, middle click is just a conveniece.
[23:15] <yofel> Omega: and how many new users are going to understand that they need to launch something called "Nautilus" to open a second instance of something called "Home folder" ?
[23:16] <yofel> clicking on applications and searching for 'home folder' at least doesn't show nautilus as a possibility
[23:16] <delac> yofel: actually, the emulation of middle button in two button mouses has been removed from the drivers. it is mentioned in the release notes
[23:16] <yofel> *headdesk*
[23:17] <ubuntuguy> Why does ubuntu never show how much battery I have, it always says estimating?
[23:18] <Kyle__> ubuntuguy: Laptops are _always_ estimating when they tell you how much time is left.  Or is that not what you're seeing?
[23:18] <ubuntuguy> That's what I'm seeing
[23:18] <ubuntuguy> It's always saying estimating
[23:18] <ubuntuguy> I want to know how much time I have left
[23:18] <Omega> delac: Uh, that
[23:19] <Omega> delac: Uh, that's a lie.
[23:19] <Omega> I middle click all the time without a middle click button.
[23:19] <Omega> yofel: They open a new tab?
[23:19] <yofel> Omega: and what if you want a second instance to use drag&drop?
[23:20] <yofel> can't do that with tabs
[23:20] <tetsuo55> ubuntuguy: i have a similar problem, in my case it has to do with the kernel, and i can only used patched official ubuntu kernels
[23:20] <Omega> You can drag and drop with tabs.
[23:20] <Omega> Yes you can.
[23:20] <ubuntuguy> k
[23:20] <Omega> Please, don't spread FUD around here.
[23:20] <tetsuo55> ubuntuguy: but i do see an error for batteries in my dmesg logfiles, so you could take a look there
[23:20] <yofel> ah ok, true, sorry
[23:20] <ubuntuguy> How do I get there?
[23:20] <yofel> still a very unintuitive way to do it
[23:21] <Omega> yofel: I think you should spend some more time with the platform before forming an opinion of it.
[23:21] <Omega> Because, most of the points you have raised are non-issues.
[23:21] <yofel> Omega: not saying it's bad, unity has improved a lot since I tried it last. But yes, that is my very subjective point of view on unity
[23:22] <delac> Omega: well, I wasn't being exact but: http://paste.ubuntu.com/594243/
[23:22] <tetsuo55> ubuntuguy:  search for the "log file viewer" and then navigate to the dmsg section, you can do it from terminal too somehow and actually search for specific warnings, but i dont know how that works, maybe someon eelse can help, im about to log out
[23:22] <ubuntuguy> Alright, thanks for the help
[23:23] <yofel> Omega: once you know how to use it it's ok actually, better than I thought. I'm just saying that a lot of things just don't work as I would expect them to, so I end up spending more time on figuring out on how to do things than I would like to need
[23:23] <zniavre> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/761201
[23:25] <P05TMAN> Am I able to upgrade to 11.04 beta 2 from Update Manager yet? If so , how?
[23:25] <Omega> yofel: It's because this is a whole new experience, and you are not used to it.
[23:26] <yofel> true
[23:26] <yofel> P05TMAN: alt+f2: gksudo update-manager -d
[23:29] <P05TMAN> I guess it's not available.
[23:29] <yofel> P05TMAN: what are you running?
[23:30] <P05TMAN> Ubuntu 10.10 on  Dell Inspiron N5010, Intel i5, 8
[23:30] <P05TMAN> GB RAM
[23:31] <yofel> odd, it should show it
[23:32] <P05TMAN> I thought so too, I made sure that Long Term Support releases weren't selected also... It's seet on Normal releases. That is how it should be, yeah?
[23:32] <yofel> yes, that should work, maybe try to refresh the package cache and try again
[23:32] <hd2> sudo upgraded itself and alerted me to put my custom changes in /etc/suders.d, but I didn't realise that the IncludeDir /etc/sudoers.d line is commented out, can I fix this without reinstalling?
[23:32] <ubuntuguy> Why does my battery in uity always say estimated?
[23:32] <ubuntuguy> unity*
[23:33] <P05TMAN> ubuntuguy: because it is constantly in use
[23:33] <ubuntuguy> I don't understand
[23:33] <ubuntuguy> Samething happened in windows
[23:34] <yofel> hd2: that's actually the case for everyone, the way to edit the file is 'sudo visudo'
[23:34] <ubuntuguy> I see got estimation
[23:34] <P05TMAN> ubuntuguy: are you on a laptop?
[23:34] <ubuntuguy> Correct
[23:34] <yofel> erm, you can't configure the top panel at all in unity?
[23:35] <delac> yofel: no
[23:35] <delac> yofel: http://paste.ubuntu.com/594244/   At the first try it did throw crash reports for the bcmwl-kernel-source and initramfs-tools, but I couldn't report them because there were no log files. However they seem to be installed anyway.
[23:35] <ubuntuguy> Nope yofel
[23:35] <yofel> delac: does bcmwl-kernel-source install by hand?
[23:35] <Kyle__> ubuntuguy: You can't measure the charge of a battery without changing its state.  Any measurement will change it, theirfore it's always an estimate.  Add onto that that it's being drained from a computer that is using power at a non-constant rate, and it compounds the issue.  It's _always_ an estimate.
[23:36] <delac> yofel: they are installed. should I reinstall?
[23:36] <yofel> delac: what does dkms status say?
[23:36] <ubuntuguy> That really makes no sense, if that was the case, then why wasn't this happening when I was using windows xp a year back?
[23:37] <delac> yofel: I should check what?
[23:38] <yofel> delac: run 'dkms status' and check what it says about bcmwl
[23:38] <hd2> strange... no changes and it works
[23:39] <P05TMAN> ubuntuguy: In windows, it just shows a percentage of battery power, but battery levels are still estimates because your computer battery power fluctuates while in use or charging
[23:40] <P05TMAN> yofel: Normal releases should be set in Settings on the Update Manager in order to see the 11.04 upgrade, correct?
[23:41] <yofel> P05TMAN: as far as I know, yes
[23:41] <delac> yofel: bcml, 5.100.82.38.+bdcom, 2.6.38-8-generic, i686: installed
[23:41] <yofel> delac: that sounds like it's installed fine
[23:41] <yofel> delac: run 'sudo update-initramfs -u -k all' to make sure the initrd is ok
[23:41] <P05TMAN> yofel: just making sure... I still don't have an option to upgrade to 11.04
[23:41] <yofel> if that runs fine the driver should work I think
[23:42] <P05TMAN> Oh well, soon enough
[23:42] <yofel> P05TMAN: should still work, does it say anything if you run 'sudo update-manager -d' in a terminal?
[23:42] <P05TMAN> Nope
[23:43] <yofel> then I'm out of ideas why it doesn't show it...
[23:44] <charlie-tca> Try the other method, I had Xubuntu do that to me, and    sudo do-release-upgrade -d    worked
[23:44] <P05TMAN> Yofel: typo'ed tried commnad again=works     You're the man
[23:44] <yofel> :)
[23:45] <yofel> hm, you're obviously not supposed to change anything in CCSM or compiz crashes
[23:47] <delac> yofel:ok, so the update-initramfs gave me lzma: Encode error, which apparently means my little usb-stick is too full... :)
[23:47] <yofel> ouch
[23:48] <yofel> how do I switch to a TTY in virtualbox?
[23:48] <arand> Isn't it leftctrl+F1 or something like that?
[23:49] <charlie-tca> or Right-control+F1, what ever your vbox key is
[23:49] <delac> I still seem to have 2.5GB free space on my usb-stick (persistent storage). Is this thing trying to hold everything on RAM?
[23:49] <charlie-tca> or maybe Ctrl+Alt+F1,
[23:50] <yofel> hm, seems my VM is completely crashed then
[23:50] <charlie-tca> That vbox control key replaces your alt/ctrl+alt for most functions