| doctormo | popey, popey, popey: rule one of not understanding doctormo's "Understanding" blog entries: Post a comment saying it's still too confusing. | 00:18 |
|---|---|---|
| doctormo | Just listening to the UK podcast now :-) | 00:19 |
| doctormo | nigelb, pleia2: Like my groklaw tribute? http://doctormo.deviantart.com/art/Groklaw-PJ-Tribute-204801749 | 02:03 |
| jcastro | I didn't even know that site was still around | 02:06 |
| doctormo | jcastro: Groklaw? sure is. | 02:12 |
| doctormo | Well for another month or so | 02:12 |
| akgraner | doctormo, that's cool | 02:14 |
| doctormo | akgraner: Thought it good to do a tribute. Quite pleased with the drawing skill practice too ;-) | 02:15 |
| doctormo | How has your day been? | 02:15 |
| akgraner | bruce byfield's article about it was picked up by slashdot Monday | 02:15 |
| akgraner | doctormo, humbling | 02:15 |
| akgraner | re my day | 02:16 |
| doctormo | akgraner: Oh? I forget which bruce byfield article, can you link? | 02:16 |
| doctormo | I've had a bit of a long day with a job interview and a bunch of project work. | 02:17 |
| akgraner | I posted a blog post (in a hurry) and it was the first time my boss exercised the use of Bold in an email to me :-/ | 02:17 |
| akgraner | let's just ouch... | 02:18 |
| akgraner | say even | 02:18 |
| * Pendulum hugs akgraner | 02:18 | |
| akgraner | doctormo, Eulogy for Groklaw - http://www.linuxpromagazine.com/Online/Blogs/Off-the-Beat-Bruce-Byfield-s-Blog/Eulogy-for-Groklaw | 02:19 |
| doctormo | Ah right, I did read that one... slashdotted you say? I didn't know slashdot was still around. | 02:19 |
| akgraner | Pendulum, she was right :-) but I was embarrassed...(to say the least) | 02:19 |
| * doctormo hugs akgraner too | 02:20 | |
| akgraner | Pendulum, but I'll take the hug and say thanks! | 02:20 |
| akgraner | yep it's still around...slashdot that is | 02:20 |
| akgraner | but I learned what 'NRFPT' meant today :-) | 02:21 |
| Pendulum | akgraner: even if it's deserved, hugs are still appropriate! | 02:22 |
| akgraner | :-) | 02:30 |
| paultag | anyone seen nigel? I need to pester him about a pet project :) | 02:30 |
| akgraner | he went to bed last I talked to him | 02:32 |
| paultag | rad, thanks akgraner :) | 02:32 |
| akgraner | paultag, no problem - oh and holstein was talking about how cool you are | 02:40 |
| akgraner | I think he has about decided to seek Ubuntu membership | 02:40 |
| paultag | akgraner: haha, awesome. He's a wicked cool guy, I hope he goes for it! | 02:41 |
| paultag | smart, too | 02:41 |
| akgraner | have you heard him play? | 02:42 |
| paultag | akgraner: no! Have you? | 02:42 |
| akgraner | yep - online but Pete, JFo, and the kids have seen in play at one of the local bars here | 02:43 |
| paultag | damn, cool | 02:43 |
| paultag | akgraner: he plays the git-fiddle, aye? | 02:43 |
| ScottL | i think holstein has a man-crush on paultag ;) | 02:43 |
| paultag | ScottL: awwww :) | 02:43 |
| akgraner | bass | 02:44 |
| paultag | oh right | 02:44 |
| paultag | me too :) | 02:44 |
| ScottL | akgraner, i hope holstein does go for membership, i started pushing him after you told me too | 02:44 |
| akgraner | :-) cool | 02:44 |
| ScottL | paultag, yeah, we need to record some songs for ocelot...i'll make sure they get on the image :P | 02:44 |
| akgraner | ScottL, he talks about you as well | 02:44 |
| paultag | ScottL: dude, for sure! | 02:44 |
| paultag | ScottL: I can lay down some accordion, bass or a bit of keyboard :) | 02:44 |
| akgraner | well brags on you as well I should say | 02:44 |
| ScottL | akgraner, awww, that's sweet :) | 02:46 |
| akgraner | it was his idea to revive the wnclug... | 02:46 |
| paultag | akgraner: how's that going? | 02:46 |
| akgraner | sometimes it's more ubuntu but that's cool too | 02:46 |
| * paultag *coughs* LoCo *cough* | 02:47 | |
| akgraner | honestly the LUG group is doing better than the local team | 02:47 |
| akgraner | LoCo I mean | 02:47 |
| paultag | akgraner: damn. looks like holstein needs to kick the loco's ass | 02:47 |
| akgraner | he has... | 02:47 |
| akgraner | :-) the NC LoCo team lead needs to get off her slacker arse and do something encouraging and motivational :-P | 02:48 |
| paultag | :) | 02:49 |
| akgraner | looks like the Raleigh area will have a release party :-) talked to one of the guys up that way this morning | 02:49 |
| akgraner | we'll make go/no-go decision on Friday | 02:50 |
| doctormo | akgraner: We've had our MA event for the year, paultag are you coming back? Would you come back if I said I had a man-crush? ;-) | 02:51 |
| paultag | doctormo: actually.... one moment | 02:51 |
| akgraner | hahaha...you all make me smile! | 02:51 |
| paultag | doctormo: damn! I head back from MA on the 25th. Tea man-date in leau? | 02:52 |
| doctormo | paultag: Yep, Harvard Sq for some much needed Tealux? | 02:52 |
| paultag | doctormo: did they move to harvard square? | 02:52 |
| paultag | that's the red line IIRC, yeah? | 02:53 |
| paultag | yeah, rd == harvard | 02:53 |
| paultag | doctormo: yeah, I can do that, np! | 02:53 |
| paultag | wow, sed s/rd/red/g | 02:53 |
| paultag | doctormo: let's chat a bit later on, I've got to run. It's settled, though, mandate between 4/21 -> 4/25 | 02:56 |
| doctormo | paultag: They closed down the Newbury street tealux man. | 02:56 |
| paultag | doctormo: for good?! | 02:56 |
| doctormo | yes | 02:56 |
| paultag | doctormo: I was there when they closed it because of the lease | 02:56 |
| paultag | doctormo: but they said they'd move to another place on newbury | 02:56 |
| doctormo | No heard if there's a new place yet. I've been asking tho | 02:57 |
| paultag | doctormo: aye, well shucks! | 02:57 |
| paultag | doctormo: no thai basil (bay/sill) this time, methinks | 02:57 |
| doctormo | paultag: Oh why? there's a really nice pet mak alloy mak mak tuk tuk place near by. | 02:57 |
| paultag | doctormo: oh jeez, now everyone's wondering why i'm chortling | 02:58 |
| paultag | doctormo: sure, sounds good | 02:58 |
| doctormo | email me when interrupting my diary! | 02:59 |
| paultag | doctormo: will do :) | 02:59 |
| paultag | akgraner: much love, catch you later! | 02:59 |
| paultag | ScottL: you're the man now, dawg | 02:59 |
| paultag | later, all, one love | 02:59 |
| akgraner | laters | 03:00 |
| * nigelb hugs JFo | 06:56 | |
| nigelb | morning ara :) | 07:34 |
| ara | morning nigelb, all | 07:34 |
| nigelb | hola dpm | 07:51 |
| dpm | hey nigelb | 07:51 |
| dpm | good morning all | 07:51 |
| nigelb | rocking uadw :) | 07:53 |
| nigelb | I've had a few people getting very excited about the qt sessions :) | 07:54 |
| dpm | oh, that's really cool - you should tell them that there are lots more coming up :) | 07:54 |
| nigelb | yup, I did :) | 07:55 |
| dpm | excellent :) | 07:55 |
| nigelb | Maybe because we're at this very interesting point of gnome3 release, unity coming to standard desktops, I've found lots of interest this time. | 07:56 |
| nigelb | Or maybe this is the third time and we're really rocking uadw :P | 07:57 |
| dpm | probably a combination of the two ;) | 07:59 |
| * dpm goes and wikifies the logs | 07:59 | |
| popey | hahah doctormo | 08:03 |
| dholbach | good morning | 08:10 |
| dpm | hey good morning dholbach! | 08:10 |
| dholbach | hey dpm | 08:11 |
| nigelb | hey doctormo | 08:17 |
| nigelb | hello popey! | 08:17 |
| dpm | UADW logs are now wikified for your viewing pleasure - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuAppDeveloperWeek/Timetable - spread the word! :-) | 08:31 |
| duanedesign | morning all | 08:40 |
| * nigelb laughs in the general direction of popey ;) | 08:45 | |
| kim0 | Morning | 09:00 |
| nigelb | hey kim0 :) | 09:03 |
| kim0 | nigelb: hey o/ | 09:04 |
| * popey tickles nigelb | 09:13 | |
| * nigelb hugs popey | 09:24 | |
| dpm | hey kim0, hey duanedesign and popey | 09:32 |
| === daker_ is now known as daker | ||
| AlanBell | what do you think of this? http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/sessionprototype.html | 11:04 |
| AlanBell | my thought is that it could be something generated by summit | 11:05 |
| AlanBell | at http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-n/sessions/session-slug | 11:06 |
| AlanBell | or similar. With embedded link to an etherpad with the nano theme so you just get the editable area in a summit page | 11:06 |
| AlanBell | I have that glass! | 11:07 |
| AlanBell | and it includes a QR code pointing at the page, my thought is that the page itself (without the embedded etherpad) would be printable and would be the sheet stuck on the door | 11:09 |
| jussi | AlanBell: I like! | 11:09 |
| AlanBell | so walk into room, scan QR on the way in, have session description and notepad in front of you by the time you sit down | 11:09 |
| nigelb | AlanBell: /very/ nice | 11:11 |
| AlanBell | view the source, I just knocked it up in gedit in 2 minutes | 11:11 |
| nigelb | Its probably just an iframe right? | 11:11 |
| AlanBell | it is | 11:11 |
| AlanBell | pad url?_theme=nano | 11:12 |
| jussi | AlanBell: that content you have got there, where does that come from? is the pad empty, or is there stuff on it ? | 11:13 |
| AlanBell | I pasted in some random stuff from last UDS | 11:13 |
| jussi | ok, perhaps you can script it to pull in the blueprint content? | 11:13 |
| AlanBell | the pad could be prepopulated a little bit | 11:13 |
| AlanBell | maybe, or there could be a blueprint link in the top | 11:14 |
| AlanBell | things I would try to prepopulate would be the session title and hash tags | 11:14 |
| AlanBell | hopefully jcastro will get all excited about this and command a minion to implement it | 11:17 |
| AlanBell | my opinion is that this is what turns Etherpad from an alternative equivalent to Gobby that works a bit better, to something fundamentally superior in terms of the integration we can do with it. | 11:19 |
| popey | i cant see the point of the QR code | 11:20 |
| popey | people don't take photos of qr codes with their laptops do they? | 11:20 |
| AlanBell | it is slightly questionable | 11:20 |
| AlanBell | tablet devices might be able to take advantage of it | 11:20 |
| AlanBell | if they support contenteditable | 11:20 |
| * popey wonders which tablet devices these might be | 11:21 | |
| AlanBell | which basically means Android as the ipad is just for buying pretty hats | 11:21 |
| AlanBell | http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/business/shiny-thing-make-it-all-better-201001282420/ | 11:23 |
| popey | well there's two issues | 11:29 |
| popey | 1. the ipad has no camera | 11:30 |
| popey | 2. etherpad doesn't work in safari on the ipad | 11:30 |
| * nigelb resisits trolling popey on that. | 11:30 | |
| popey | which makes me think that QR codes are kinda a pointless addition right now given only a very small number of people will actually be able to use it | 11:30 |
| popey | smart move nigelb | 11:31 |
| AlanBell | so drop the QR code | 11:31 |
| AlanBell | only did it because I could | 11:31 |
| popey | :) | 11:31 |
| popey | does pad.lv support blueprints? | 11:32 |
| popey | if so a pad.lv link on the door might be as useful | 11:32 |
| jussi | why not have it there? those that can take advantage, will those that dont neeed it, who cares? | 11:32 |
| popey | and pasted into the irc channel | 11:32 |
| * jussi wonders if we can do ascii art QR codes :P | 11:32 | |
| popey | jussi: merely thinking time is a pressure, and if people focus on doing stuff that 0.1% of people can use will possibly detract from actually making the rest of it work | 11:33 |
| nigelb | popey: not yet I think. pad.lv page doesn't say anything baout blue prints | 11:33 |
| popey | bummer | 11:33 |
| nigelb | we could request it | 11:33 |
| * nigelb does just that | 11:33 | |
| popey | or just use some other shortening service | 11:33 |
| AlanBell | the QR code is just: https://chart.googleapis.com/chart?chs=150x150&cht=qr&chl=http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/sessionprototype.html&choe=UTF-8.png | 11:34 |
| nigelb | popey: that means doing that manually for every blueprint, painful ^-^ | 11:34 |
| AlanBell | i.e. put what you want the QR to point to inside that google charts URL, get an image with the QR in it | 11:34 |
| popey | nigelb: no, it doesnt | 11:34 |
| popey | shortening services have APIs | 11:34 |
| nigelb | loop through all of them,true. | 11:34 |
| * nigelb has code somewhere for bit.ly and goo.gl | 11:35 | |
| nigelb | and python code that too. | 11:35 |
| nigelb | so it should be actually trivial. | 11:35 |
| nigelb | oh, who wants to help theme etherpad tonight? | 11:36 |
| AlanBell | http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/sessionprototype.html gave it some divs and floats to use space better at the top | 12:06 |
| Pici | Poing, anyone else having problems with the images on http://www.ubuntu.com/community/countdown ? | 13:35 |
| Pici | I filed #760618, just want confirmation before I go bug someone else. | 13:35 |
| nigelb | Poing? | 13:36 |
| Pendulum | it's a ping and a pong all in one | 13:36 |
| Pici | ping/pong/poing | 13:36 |
| maco | wouldnt it be ping poing pong, like syn synack ack? | 13:36 |
| * maco googles to doublecheck that's right | 13:37 | |
| nigelb | bug 760618 | 13:37 |
| Pici | https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-website/+bug/760618 | 13:37 |
| vish | haha! Pici caused a riot ;p | 13:37 |
| maco | woo wikipedia agrees | 13:37 |
| nigelb | oh, new bot called Pici :p | 13:37 |
| vish | Pici: cant see them here on FF4 | 13:38 |
| * vish tries chrome | 13:38 | |
| nigelb | Pici: I can confirm a 404 | 13:39 |
| AlanBell | http://www.ubuntu.com/countdown/banner1.png is the image URL | 13:39 |
| vish | Pici: yup, broken there too.. i think it is showing last cycles countdown | 13:39 |
| vish | there == chrome | 13:40 |
| Pici | AlanBell: Do you see anything at that link? | 13:40 |
| AlanBell | a 404 error page | 13:40 |
| vish | Pici: thorsten did the banner for last cycle, not for Natty | 13:40 |
| vish | and iirc, the other winners were different this time too | 13:41 |
| AlanBell | vish: those were the images for this cycle, I put one on http://ubuntuaccessibility.wordpress.com/ a couple of days ago | 13:42 |
| Pendulum | AlanBell: it's not there anymore :-/ | 13:42 |
| AlanBell | yup | 13:43 |
| vish | AlanBell: the winners this time were ยป , Riku Lu, Anatoliy Babchuk (takashtuka) and Dave (I Heart Ubuntu). > http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2011/04/ubuntu-natty-release-countdown-banners-chosen/ | 13:45 |
| vish | thats the old Maverick page.. something borked | 13:45 |
| nigelb | and someone seems to have restored from backup | 13:46 |
| * vish agrees with jcastro ; OMG is news! :D | 13:46 | |
| Pici | Okay, I've done enough damage this morning, time to get back to work ;) | 13:47 |
| * jussi zaps nigelb | 13:49 | |
| * nigelb cuts down jussi with lightsaber | 13:50 | |
| jcastro | AlanBell: preopoluation would be cool | 14:13 |
| jcastro | AlanBell: I would just tell people to make the URL when they file the blueprint | 14:13 |
| AlanBell | no need really | 14:13 |
| AlanBell | if you don't create the URL then the page will be there with a create a pad button in it | 14:14 |
| AlanBell | refresh to see what I mean | 14:15 |
| AlanBell | I am just pointing it at primarypad because that has a bunch of interesting plugins installed like the image URL one | 14:16 |
| jcastro | refresh on which page? | 14:22 |
| AlanBell | http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/sessionprototype.html | 14:51 |
| AlanBell | I pointed it at a pad that doesn't exist yet | 14:51 |
| jcastro | ok | 14:52 |
| jcastro | cool | 14:52 |
| jcastro | how did you do this? | 14:52 |
| AlanBell | so the first person who wants to presses the button and it creates the pad | 14:52 |
| AlanBell | view source:) | 14:52 |
| AlanBell | 2 minutes in gedit | 14:52 |
| jcastro | oh | 14:53 |
| jcastro | I thought you had like spidered the BPs in LP and autogenerated it | 14:53 |
| AlanBell | no, but it is all information that is on the session blocks in summit | 14:53 |
| jcastro | right | 14:54 |
| jcastro | this is slick | 14:54 |
| AlanBell | so with some django magic make a URL like http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-n/sessions/session-slug | 14:54 |
| AlanBell | and generate a similar page for each session, and have it linked from the blocks in the timetable | 14:55 |
| mhall119 | Daviey: can you review https://code.launchpad.net/~mhall119/summit/guidebook-rebrand/+merge/57591 ? we might want to put this out before too many people install the old app | 14:55 |
| AlanBell | so you would go to the page of the day like this http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-n/2010-10-25/ and click on a session to get to the details and notes page for that session | 14:58 |
| jcastro | yeah | 15:11 |
| jcastro | or just put the URL in the blueprint | 15:11 |
| jcastro | that was my plan for my sessions | 15:11 |
| AlanBell | you mean on the whiteboard of the blueprint? | 15:13 |
| jcastro | AlanBell: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/community-o-unity-developer-participation | 15:39 |
| jcastro | for example | 15:39 |
| jcastro | see "Set URL for this specification" | 15:39 |
| AlanBell | yeah | 15:43 |
| AlanBell | so you were going to put etherpad URLS there | 15:43 |
| jcastro | right | 15:45 |
| jcastro | normally people put the wiki page there | 15:45 |
| jcastro | from back in the day when we used the wiki for specs | 15:45 |
| jcastro | dholbach: hah man, remember what /crap/ that used to be? | 15:45 |
| AlanBell | well this would not conflict with that plan at all | 15:46 |
| jcastro | I am for whatever is best | 16:42 |
| jcastro | <--- late lunch | 17:13 |
| cjohnston | jcastro: get me some! | 17:19 |
| mhall119 | you need to use sudo | 17:51 |
| cjohnston | lol | 17:55 |
| nigelb | mhall119: good one | 17:56 |
| nigelb | today I made classbot not work because of a typo. sigh. | 17:56 |
| dholbach | alright my friends - I call it a day - see you all tomorrow *HUGS* | 18:04 |
| dpm | see you dholbach! | 18:08 |
| dholbach | bye dpm | 18:11 |
| daker | @launchpadbugs should be updated so it use pad.lv instead of bit.ly | 18:12 |
| === daker is now known as daker_ | ||
| AlanBell | so to implement my cunning plan it seems I need to add a pattern to the urls.py, then do something schedule/views.py | 18:19 |
| mhall119 | AlanBell: what cunning plan is this? | 18:27 |
| doctormo | popey: ping | 18:53 |
| AlanBell | mhall119: extending summit to have a per-session page | 19:02 |
| AlanBell | http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/sessionprototype.html | 19:03 |
| AlanBell | bit like that perhaps | 19:03 |
| AlanBell | including undecorated etherpad in an iframe | 19:03 |
| AlanBell | and possibly freenode webchat to the room channel alongside | 19:03 |
| AlanBell | what do you think mhall119? | 19:19 |
| AlanBell | Daviey too | 19:20 |
| Daviey | AlanBell, i like. | 19:21 |
| Daviey | AlanBell, Attendees section won't scale | 19:21 |
| mhall119 | AlanBell: we're planning a per-room page | 19:31 |
| mhall119 | I can see the benefit of per-session though | 19:33 |
| Daviey | mhall119, a per room page with iframed etherpad? | 19:33 |
| mhall119 | Daviey: we were going to embed the webchat | 19:33 |
| mhall119 | per-room etherpad doesn't sound terribly useful | 19:33 |
| Daviey | mhall119, webchat is less exciting to me than etherpad tbh. | 19:34 |
| mhall119 | but for the in-room projectors it would be nice | 19:34 |
| mhall119 | which was the purpose of the per-room pages | 19:34 |
| Daviey | we already have a working solution, ablest hacky , for projector irc | 19:34 |
| mhall119 | I say we do both | 19:34 |
| mhall119 | we still have 3 weeks until UDS | 19:34 |
| mhall119 | which means we don't even need to get started for another 2.5 weeks | 19:35 |
| mhall119 | ;) | 19:35 |
| Daviey | mhall119, we'll have to meta refresh, and have hooks for displaying other content | 19:35 |
| AlanBell | good point about the attendees section | 19:35 |
| Daviey | "I pitty the foo" | 19:35 |
| Daviey | mhall119, hell, landing features during the week has been known :) | 19:36 |
| mhall119 | yeah, it happened 6 months ago | 19:36 |
| Daviey | and 16, 18, 24 | 19:37 |
| mhall119 | 16 months ago huh? | 19:37 |
| * AlanBell hands Daviey a copy of the 6 times table | 19:37 | |
| Daviey | lol | 19:38 |
| popey | doctormo: pong | 20:12 |
| doctormo | popey: Re uk podcast, you guys didn't mention that it was my blog post. Or that my attempted clarification was a failure. | 20:50 |
| doctormo | It sounded like my thing was some official post. | 20:50 |
| popey | doctormo: the whole thing is a failure | 20:50 |
| doctormo | popey: The podcast wasn't that bad ;-) | 20:50 |
| popey | IMHO | 20:50 |
| popey | hehe | 20:50 |
| popey | good! | 20:50 |
| popey | it never ceases to amaze me that people actually listen to it! | 20:50 |
| doctormo | Well when you link to my blog, I admit I do listen more keenly :-P | 20:51 |
| popey | heh | 20:51 |
| popey | feedback is always welcome! in any kind | 20:51 |
| popey | we can take negative critisism :) | 20:51 |
| doctormo | Remember to mention the authors of posts when they're saying something that isn't official canonical canon. | 20:52 |
| popey | wilco! | 20:52 |
| popey | i think the issue this week was we discussed it before we went live | 20:52 |
| popey | trying to figure out what we were going to say | 20:52 |
| popey | laura said that she didnt understand it 'even with the blog' | 20:53 |
| popey | 'what blog' | 20:53 |
| popey | 'martin owens blog' | 20:53 |
| popey | 'yeah, i didnt understand it either' | 20:53 |
| popey | and thus the conversation didnt happen 'on record' | 20:53 |
| popey | when we discuss stuff pre-show usually someone shouts 'SAVE IT FOR THE SHOW!' | 20:53 |
| doctormo | Ah yeah, that makes more sense, few words filled in the gaps. | 20:53 |
| popey | to shut people up so such incidents dont happen, that didnt happen this week | 20:54 |
| doctormo | IMO copyright assignment without payment is theft by social organization; I don't like it. But anything that incourages understanding is important. So if I can grab laura on irc to talk about the post, I can post a new one which hopefully will be more understandable. | 20:56 |
| popey | feel free to contact us via any one of the means outlined on the website ;) | 21:12 |
| popey | also #ubuntu-uk-podcast | 21:12 |
| mhall119 | "copyright assignment without payment is theft by social organization | 21:18 |
| mhall119 | " | 21:18 |
| mhall119 | really? wow | 21:19 |
| czajkowski | Aloha | 21:27 |
| JanC | doctormo: "copyright assignment" without payment is legally dubious in some jurisdictions too ;) | 21:27 |
| JanC | that's why they have the alternative thing in there too | 21:27 |
| doctormo | mhall119: I'm fairly strong on the issue, other people aren't so much. | 21:29 |
| doctormo | JanC: Alternative thing? | 21:30 |
| JanC | the thing where you license the code to them to do whatever they want | 21:30 |
| JanC | let me check the exact wording ;) | 21:30 |
| doctormo | Ah effective public domain, I find that actually slightly more acceptable. | 21:30 |
| JanC | more like some sort of CC0 | 21:31 |
| mhall119 | i don't see how voluntary copyright assignment is any more "theft" than voluntarily using a permissive license | 21:31 |
| JanC | although it only gives them the rights CC0 would give everybody | 21:31 |
| JanC | mhall119: that ^^^ | 21:32 |
| doctormo | mhall119: Because it's not voluntary, not really. If you want your code to be relevant and used, then you pretty much have to agree to have your copyright taken from you. | 21:32 |
| doctormo | Of course I guess we do have a choice not to be involved in those projects. | 21:32 |
| doctormo | Or fork them. | 21:32 |
| mhall119 | doctormo: okay, so how is that different from contributing to a GPL or BSD code project? | 21:32 |
| JanC | mhall119: "the same rule for everybody" ? | 21:33 |
| mhall119 | not for BSD | 21:33 |
| doctormo | mhall119: a) you get to keep your copyright, moral rights and other properties, b) you get guarentees that the other contributors can't use your code outside of the GPL. | 21:33 |
| doctormo | *without permission first | 21:34 |
| maco | you can also submit the same or derivative code to two different places | 21:34 |
| mhall119 | doctormo: you don't lose your copyright when you sign a contributor agreement | 21:34 |
| maco | once youve signed over the copyright on one, you cant send the same thing elsewhere | 21:34 |
| doctormo | mhall119: have you read it? (the Canonical one, not the FSF one) | 21:34 |
| mhall119 | doctormo: I did a while ago | 21:34 |
| JanC | if you live in a place that allows losing your author's rights, you lose them | 21:35 |
| mhall119 | hmmm, I'll have to go back and read it again, I don't recall it saying that | 21:35 |
| doctormo | mhall119: Copyright assignment is not dual copyright ownership, check the wording again. The FSF agreement is more palatable in that it allows you to keep rights. | 21:35 |
| doctormo | Unless it explicitly says what rights you keep, you loose them. IANAL | 21:36 |
| JanC | Canonical licenses your code back to you to do whatever you want (but only your code) | 21:36 |
| JanC | IIRC | 21:36 |
| doctormo | maco: That's actually why I like the public domain option, because it allows anyone to take the patch as a single work and reuse it. | 21:36 |
| mhall119 | JanC: okay, I see that now | 21:37 |
| JanC | s/public domain/CC0/ please | 21:37 |
| mhall119 | maybe I was thinking of the FSF or Sun contributor agreements | 21:37 |
| JanC | or similar to CC0, like the WTFPL ;) | 21:38 |
| doctormo | Maybe I was thinking of the previous wording, I see it that text there now. | 21:38 |
| doctormo | What does IIRC mean? I've always wanted to ask. | 21:39 |
| mhall119 | okay, so Canonical requires that you give up your copyright claims to code you contribute to their projects | 21:39 |
| JanC | Michael Meeks gave an interesting talk about LibO at FOSDEM which included some interesting stuff about licensing | 21:39 |
| mhall119 | I can see the problems people might have with that | 21:40 |
| mhall119 | but in practice, it's not required for very many projects | 21:40 |
| doctormo | mhall119: It wasn't required for anything critical until Ubuntu 11.04, it's getting harder to contribute. | 21:41 |
| mhall119 | I don't think there are any projects that require a contributor agreement where you might be submitting the same code somwehere else | 21:41 |
| mhall119 | doctormo: you talking about Unity? | 21:41 |
| doctormo | Unity, Indicators, bunch of different things. Jockey has been there for a while of course. | 21:41 |
| doctormo | mhall119: To me, it's the principle of the matter. We're not considered equal and trust worthy partners, and given no guarentees about misuse of our works. | 21:42 |
| mhall119 | all stuff that originated from Canonical from the looks of it | 21:42 |
| mhall119 | doctormo: you think there's any guarantee they can give that won't just draw more criticism? | 21:43 |
| doctormo | mhall119: That's the only stuff they could possible have copyright assignment on. | 21:43 |
| mhall119 | technically they can have copyright assigned for anything the authors want to give it up on | 21:44 |
| doctormo | mhall119: If they said that it was acceptable to copyright assign to the ubuntu foundation and that the text included a 2v passage to only use foss licenses. That would draw praise I believe. | 21:44 |
| doctormo | mhall119: Technically I could mug you with a banana, code could go directly upstream. | 21:45 |
| mhall119 | I don't think the ubuntu foundation exists in any meaningful sense anymore | 21:45 |
| doctormo | No, I know | 21:45 |
| AlanBell | mhall119: wasn't it always supposed to be dormant, sitting on a pile of cash in case Canonical goes away? | 21:47 |
| mhall119 | AlanBell: I don't know, I thought it was supposed to be more of a layer between Canonical and the community | 21:48 |
| mhall119 | or between Canonical and Ubuntu itself | 21:49 |
| AlanBell | nah, it has $10,000,000 squirreled away in a trust fund or something | 21:49 |
| mhall119 | yeah, it does have that | 21:49 |
| mhall119 | but I thought it was supposed to be more active | 21:49 |
| AlanBell | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ubuntu_Foundation | 21:50 |
| doctormo | mhall119: It's a will and tesiment thing I think. | 21:50 |
| mhall119 | ok | 21:51 |
| mhall119 | just out of curiosity, has Canonical ever taken something open and made it closed? | 21:51 |
| akgraner | yo yo yo - guess who is speaking at OSCON this year? woot woot woot! | 21:59 |
| AlanBell | \o/ yay, subject? | 22:01 |
| akgraner | * Volunteers Aren't Always Contributors; Contributors Don't | 22:02 |
| akgraner | Always Volunteer. | 22:02 |
| akgraner | I am sooo freaking happy and to think 30 minutes ago I summed up my day today as "Suckage seeping from my fingertips to web pages like raw sewage from a septic tank." | 22:06 |
| doctormo | akgraner: Aw, surely it couldn't have been that bad. | 22:09 |
| akgraner | it's what happens when you rush and are distracted :-) | 22:11 |
| akgraner | and by you I mean me | 22:11 |
| maco | congrats amber | 22:24 |
| mhall119 | akgraner: where is oscon? | 22:38 |
| AlanBell | is there a mailing list for the Millbank office? | 22:38 |
| AlanBell | Daviey: ^^ | 22:39 |
| paultag | howdy | 22:54 |
| paultag | man, i've got such a headache. I've not eaten all day. I just got out of the cleveland clinic, watched open heart surgery. super leet. | 22:56 |
| AlanBell | ah yes, but it is not exactly rocket science | 22:57 |
| paultag | AlanBell: last week I saw neurosurgery, that's flipping awesome | 22:57 |
| paultag | on the top of the brain | 22:57 |
| AlanBell | paultag: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=THNPmhBl-8I | 22:58 |
| Daviey | AlanBell, Yes, and a -uk. | 22:58 |
| paultag | AlanBell: haha, this is grand | 22:58 |
| paultag | AlanBell: I need to do this with computer science | 22:59 |
| paultag | hahaha | 23:00 |
| paultag | AlanBell: that was great. What show is that? | 23:00 |
| AlanBell | That Mitchell & Webb Look | 23:01 |
| paultag | Not exactly computer science, now is it? | 23:01 |
| AlanBell | they do the I am a Mac and I am a PC adverts | 23:02 |
| paultag | ahh, aye | 23:02 |
| AlanBell | this django stuff seems to make a certain amount of sense at last. | 23:23 |
| AlanBell | should have something working tomorrow | 23:23 |
| paultag | huzzah :) | 23:23 |
| paultag | I need to do my daily pestering of nigelb | 23:24 |
| paultag | pester pester pester | 23:24 |
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