[00:22] wiki: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Projects/UbuntuHours edited === Algo1 is now known as Algo [01:53] http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2044285/oracle-hands-office-community [01:53] Too little, too late [01:53] especially as the community went and did that alone already [01:54] but, can anyone say RHL and Fedora? [11:30] okay, so tomorrow's/today's thing at Starbucks in La Jolla: what time does UTC translate to? [11:30] i plan to be there; i just gotta figure out what time it'll be at [11:31] i can never remember how PDT converts to UTC [11:33] i was thinking of bringing a couple of small bits of musical equipment and my laptop to show folks; "see, you can use ubuntu to make music, too! not just for your desktop!" [11:36] uh....12PM? [15:55] mornin [16:43] nightmorph: the UTC on the LoCo directory is a bug, since it doesn't support local time zones yet. Ubuntu Hour San Diego tonight will be from 7pm-9pm PDT. :) [16:56] hi aak [16:57] hi projectdp [16:57] akk* :) [16:57] isn't there a name for a mistake like that? [16:57] a neurological term [16:59] undoubtedly :) [17:09] Re the discussion yesterday about apps and when they read from disk: I just remembered how if you upgrade firefox while you're running firefox, things gradually start breaking in weird ways. [17:10] does anyone here use Zoho email? [17:10] hm, interesting [17:10] I've never understood why a firefox that's been running for 6 hours already would still be going to the disk to re-read its libs/jar files. [17:10] iheartubuntu: never really used zoho products [17:10] All that stuff *should* be long since cached in memory. [17:10] akk: maybe it detects a change and marks the cache as dirty. [17:11] nhaines: That could be. But since it causes the running firefox to break, maybe that's not what it should be doing. :) [17:12] (I guess that depends on whether "it" is the kernel or firefox) [17:12] akk: I don't disagree. :) [17:12] "It" must be firefox. [17:13] And by "must be" I mean "groundless assertion." :D [17:13] :) [17:13] Makes sense, though. It's hard to imagine the kernel replacing libs in memory with something suddenly read off disk. [17:15] Actually, you're supposed to be able to keep running any program... the kernel keeps all the libraries around until all processes that used to use it have stopped [17:15] I think it was the XUL chrome files changing that caused Firefox to break. [17:16] Yeah, I could imagine firefox noticing and reloading its jar files more easily than I could imagine the kernel doing such a silly thing. [17:16] Inside the jars, I'd expect JS as a more likely culprit than XUL, but that's another "groundless assertion." [17:17] I'm just glad the browser alerts you now. Very clean. [17:18] Alerts you that files have changed and you need to restart? [17:18] "Your browser has been updated and needs to be restarted" with a restart button. [17:19] It's an info bar. :) [17:19] Nice! [17:19] nhaines: the loco directory actually does handle local timezones, they just need to be set on the venue, I fixed SD's venue [17:19] pleia2: did they get that working finally? [17:19] nhaines: for events yeah, not meetings :( [17:19] since meetings are on IRC, no venue [17:19] I hadn't hit that yet (just installed natty Sunday). I did get one alert at the end of apt-get that "you will need to restart firefox if it's running". [17:19] Timezones are tricky. :) [17:19] But it was a text alert, not something inside firefox. [17:20] akk: yeah, it notifies you there but if Firefox is actually running it tells you. [17:20] nhaines: yeah, and it wasn't built with them in mind so shoehorning is tricky [17:20] pleia2: that's another reason the LoCo Directory is disappointing. :/ [17:20] It's coming from apt-get? Does that mean I can send any notification I want to a running firefox? [17:21] * akk tries to think of why I'd want to do that, aside from "it sounds like a cool thing to do" [17:21] akk: there's something either in the post-installation tool or in Firefox that detects the change and triggers the notification, but it's not a free form message thing. :) [17:21] i notice all the flyers i put up at CSULA and Caltech are still up :) [17:21] iheartubuntu: Now you have to put up flyers that electronically update their date to the next event. :) [17:22] haa! i suppose those will all be removed at some point or people will eventually staple over them [17:23] I think somebody must clean those boards off periodically. At least, I've been putting up MakerFaire flyers in Mountain View and it's not all "staple things on top of older flyers". [17:23] (BTW, you can get free passes to Maker Faire by posting flyers -- see their "street team" page) [17:28] i'll donate a laptop lcd for the electronically updating flyers [17:37] just signed up for maker faire street team :) [17:45] hey seidos [18:41] hey projectdp [18:45] nhaines: ah, okay, thanks for clarifying. 6PM it is! [18:45] nightmorph: 7pm! [18:46] er, right, 7 [18:46] hello, typo [18:46] :) [18:46] so...what all goes on? this'll be my first [18:46] drink coffee, eat muffins, talk about ubuntu [18:47] if you scroll down to the bottom you will see some photos from other ubuntu hours: http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/global/609/detail/ [18:49] mmm, muffins [18:51] as with most new ubuntu releases i notice more programs in the software center. for all the gals running Natty already, you can do a search on "cycle" to monitor your cycles. very simple program that can also be password protected [18:52] * pleia2 cli person, prefers mencal ;) [18:53] do u have a link to that [18:53] package is mencal, http://www.kyberdigi.cz/projects/mencal/english.html [18:54] is it in software center? [18:54] yep [18:54] it is [18:54] (blog post material) [18:54] Huh, I immediately assumed you were talking about CPU cycles and almost made a TRON light cycle joke. [18:55] "gals" is what tipped me off :) [18:55] Sounds like useful programs, though. [18:55] i thought "mencal" was to track mens moods or something [18:55] cause , ya know, we dont have moods :D [18:55] yeah, but they are unpredictable ;) [18:55] haha [18:57] mencal is thru terminal, the cycle one (which is old) is graphical [18:57] im surprised cycle wasnt in software center long ago [18:59] there aren't a ton of women doing debian development (statistics! http://wiki.debian.org/DebianWomen/Statistics) and such things tend to get overlooked by guys, these days the debian-med maintains mencal [19:00] (amaya@debian was the original packager of mencal, ana@debian does cycle) [19:16] i would think that would be a big plus in getting more women using linux... more apps for the gals [19:16] eh, i showed my wife a couple such apps, but after some vague interest, was met with "meh" [19:17] apparently the little pillstrip is an adequate calendar [19:18] iheartubuntu: I am not sure I'd say "big plus" :) but it doesn't hurt [19:19] and there is an app now in chrome called strawberry op something [19:19] or [19:20] i prefer apps that are offline if i can help it [19:21] still wish i had an easy way to use evolution and keep it synced between my home comp and work comp [19:22] That's a tough problem that I never see anyone address. [19:23] I guess most people don't care because they just keep their mail in the cloud on gmail or wherever, and depend on being always-online. [19:23] (or they have good email discipline and don't keep 100 unread messages sitting in their mailboxes :) [19:23] there used to be google gears for gmail, so you could sync offline, but that was abandoned by google for some reason (sadness!) [19:24] i really like evolution and *want* to use it [19:25] that sucker's way too slow. plus having to run it all the time just to get mail notifications in the appindicator tray... [19:26] the alternatives are thunderbird and claws, though; neither of which i'm happy with. i stick to claws on gentoo, though, since it's a smaller compile. [19:26] thunderbird is slow for me on any computer [19:27] that, too; it was okay for a few years, but it started bogging down far too much, even on an SSD [19:30] apparently the only other gtk mail client these days is Postler, but it's not much more than a glorified offline interface for gmail. and it doesn't have thread stacking the way gmail does, so i'm not attracted to its presentation [20:12] have u heard of atmail? i would love if single users could use it [21:09] i want to use mutt, but apparently it's not easy to configure (surprise surprise) [21:09] gasho :) [21:36] hmm, should i bring a monome and little portable speakers to tonight's meetup, or just bring a laptop [21:37] i'm just looking to demo what all ubuntu can be used for, but since i've never been to one of these things... === erichammond1 is now known as erichammond [22:37] Just started running Natty on my primary laptop used for all personal and work tasks. [22:40] so how is it going? [22:41] pretty smooth sailing so far. [22:41] Something I didn't expect is that I am using the keyboard a bit more for things I used to mouse click. [22:42] Interesting! I'd seen some people complain that there were fewer keyboard bindings. [22:42] Do you print? Printing is the only big showstopper I've hit on natty so far. [22:44] i won't be able to use unity, since i do music production, which means i need a bunch of windows visible all the time [22:44] thankfully, ubuntu studio made the decision to stick with the default gnome desktop for the forseeable future [22:55] Printing under natty works fine for me to a network printer. [22:56] I am hurting with only 4 workspaces, though. I can't find a way to increase that which could make unity unusable for me. [22:56] I haven't had any trouble printing to my network HP CJ C5499 either. [23:19] Installed compizconfig-settings-manager and increased the number of workspaces (desktop virtual size). [23:26] erichammond: what was your install source? [23:26] download & burn CD [23:26] my HP m2727 works, even my canon inket works at home (with some special debs out on the net) [23:26] erichammond: Beta 2 or daily? [23:27] nhaines: Good question. Not sure but I did update/upgrade. Woud that not bring it up to date either way? [23:27] erichammond: Yes, but I'm asking for a specific reason. Is your workspace switcher icon gray or purple? [23:28] purple [23:28] Great, thanks. :) They've been switching that and the trash icon back and forth in the last two weeks. [23:28] But yeah, keep updateing and in 9 days you'll have Ubuntu 11.04 final. :) [23:28] tash is gray [23:30] I had been running Lucid, but really messed up my CPAN packages, so figured I'd do a fresh install and beat the rush. [23:31] Unity is feeling a little like the old NeXTSTEP which I guess makes sense if it has an Apple influence. [23:31] erichammond: Trash has been moving from a lovely glass trashcan with chrome top back and forth to a stylized "neon glow" icon. [23:32] sabdfl finally decided to keep the glass/chrome icon for this cycle, though. [23:32] I've always removed trash icons in the past. Doesn't seem to be offered as an easy choice here. [23:35] both unity and gnome3 seem to be taking away normal configuration options for folks [23:35] especially window-management-wise [23:35] there's not really a comfortable middle between the two, except "stick with gnome2". or move to a different DE, which is its own bag of issues. [23:37] In the 80's I used to make many dozens of personal customizations to my X window manager. Every time I install or upgrade a system I drop one or two of the customizations I used to make until now I'm almost using the default given me. [23:37] I can see that Unity is going to make it hard for me to use rollover-focus with that application menu moved to the top bar. [23:40] Perhaps it's just another thing pushing me to use the keyboard (Alt brings up menu)