[00:00] <hamitron> Azelphur: it is dual core with hyperthreading?
[00:00] <hamitron> 4 threads?
[00:00] <Azelphur> hamitron: I think so yes, it's the 1.5ghz dual core atom
[00:00] <hamitron> nice
[00:00] <hamitron> my i3 only has 4 threads :/
[00:01] <ali1234> i3 is the low end line...
[00:02] <hamitron> ali1234: I like them
[00:02] <hamitron> :)
[00:03] <hamitron> it lets me play all the games Azelphur plays
[00:03] <hamitron> just not all at the same time
[00:03] <Azelphur> xD
[00:03] <hamitron> I've found the 2gb to 8gb ram the biggest bonus tbh
[00:04] <hamitron> although, the i3 did more than double my frame rates in games
[00:04] <Azelphur> http://www.google.co.uk/products/catalog?q=X201T&hl=en&client=ubuntu&cid=3308812795842845777&os=tech-specs omg :x
[00:04] <hamitron> F1 2010 runs 5x faster
[00:04] <Azelphur> that's 12.1" with an i7 and convertible and does 12-14 hours hahaha
[00:05] <hamitron> erm
[00:05] <Azelphur> but no not buying that, not quite that crazy.
[00:05] <hamitron> does that i7 really run at that clock?
[00:06] <Azelphur> apparently so
[00:06] <hamitron> the i7 in the alienware runs at 1.2ghz
[00:07] <hamitron> but it does
[00:07] <hamitron> :)
[00:07] <hamitron> but Azelphur...
[00:07] <hamitron> my i3 beats it
[00:07] <hamitron> ;)
[00:07] <shauno> the turbo stuff is strange.  it's how fast it'll max out one core if it's not using the others
[00:07] <hamitron> yeh
[00:08] <Azelphur> hamitron: lol
[00:08] <hamitron> I can see that meaning old games get the power they don't need, then new games have less cycles :/
[00:08] <hamitron> just a load of tech to benchmark on old single thread games
[00:08] <hamitron> or processes
[00:09] <hamitron> this is why I picked an i3....
[00:09] <shauno> mine claims to go to 3.3 .. never seen it do that tho
[00:09] <hamitron> 3.2ghz i3 is always 3.2ghz
[00:09] <hamitron> :)
[00:09] <shauno> http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?id=50067   this is mine :)
[00:10] <hamitron> I have read disabling hyperthreading improves gaming though
[00:10] <hamitron> shauno: posh :)
[00:11] <hamitron> http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?id=48505
[00:11] <hamitron> if I could get yours in a desktop pc for a reasonable price....
[00:11] <hamitron> loads better
[00:15] <hamitron> http://www.chaperlin.co.uk/catalogue/
[00:15] <hamitron> how I save this? ;/
[00:15] <ali1234> i bought AMD
[00:16] <shauno> yeah.  welcome to flash :p
[00:16] <ali1234> because the intel chip specs were too difficult to understand
[00:16] <ali1234> AMD just puts everything in everything
[00:16] <hamitron> AMD just run too hot for what I wanted
[00:17] <ali1234> hamitron:  what the hell is that dentists catalogue??
[00:17] <hamitron> and was not cost affective
[00:17] <hamitron> ali1234: yes
[00:17] <hamitron> well, sort of
[00:18] <shauno> you really wanna download it?
[00:19] <hamitron> yes
[00:19] <hamitron> 123mb
[00:20] <shauno> it's 343 separate png's
[00:20] <hamitron> can you see how they are named?
[00:21] <shauno> hm, my bad .. jpg
[00:21] <shauno> http://www.chaperlin.co.uk/catalogue/files/assets/pages/page0004_l.jpg
[00:21] <hamitron> cheers
[00:21] <shauno> (without the _l is the lower-quality thumbnail)
[00:21] <hamitron> how did you find it?
[00:21] <hamitron> for future reference
[00:22] <shauno> so something like for I in `seq 001 343`; do echo http://www.chaperlin.co.uk/catalogue/files/assets/pages/page${I}_l.jpg >urllist ; done
[00:22] <shauno> and then wget -i urllist
[00:22] <shauno> webkit's inspector has a resources pane that'll show every url the page hits
[00:23] <hamitron> kk
[00:23] <shauno> chrome has the same (it's just webkit), and there's a few extensions on firefox that'll do the same  (pretty sure firebug does)
[00:23] <shauno> er, and that'd be seq -w 001 343   (else it'll print 8, 9, 10 .. you want 008, 009, 010 ..)
[00:26] <shauno> fairly sure you can get imagemagick to stick them all together into one pdf and finish the job they shoulda done in the first place ;)
[00:26] <shauno> (altho if they'd just been sensible, you'd be able to do text searches.  but hey.  flash is shiny!)
[00:29] <hamitron> had to change it to >> too
[00:30] <hamitron> oh
[00:31] <shauno> yeah.  and pad another zero.  I realised that after, but got bored of talking to myself, sorry :p
[00:32] <dragonkeeper> why is chromium in the important updates
[00:33] <hamitron> I was listening, just re-typing
[00:33] <hamitron> I didn't notice the extra 0, and set it downloading in background
[00:33] <hamitron> \o/
[00:35] <shauno> I shouldn't have bought portal.  I've got stuff I actually need to get done before morning :/
[00:35] <hamitron> hehe
[00:35] <hamitron> many thanks for this shauno
[00:36] <hamitron> my Dad will be very pleased
[00:36] <hamitron> far too slow loading each page
[00:36] <Azelphur> just had some fun talking to ##hardware about other netbook tablets lol
[00:36] <ali1234> why do you want to rip a denture catalogue??
[00:36] <Azelphur> the other choices so far seem kinda crap D:
[00:37] <hamitron> ali1234: to read
[00:37] <ali1234> madness
[00:37] <hamitron> not if you make the things I suppose
[00:37] <ali1234> you should just ring them up and ask them to send you a paper catalogue. "because your website is crap"
[00:37] <hamitron> tbh, there is some cool equipment in there
[00:37] <ali1234> it's the only way they'll learn
[00:37] <shauno> that's actually a fairly sensible idea
[00:38] <shauno> I mean, as much as everyone hates pdfs.  you get to keep the printed layout, and ctrl+F works.
[00:38] <hamitron> I don't mind them offering an online flash thing, but offer a pdf also :/
[00:38] <ali1234> ctrl-f doesn't *always* work
[00:38] <ali1234> like for example when the PDF is just a bunch of images
[00:38] <hamitron> my Dad tried to read it on 56k....
[00:39] <hamitron> ;)
[00:39] <shauno> well, it should, in theory.  ofc if you just do convert *jpg catalog.pdf on those images, it won't.  but if it's rolled into the production workflow, it should
[00:39] <shauno> and in a 300-odd page catalog, making search work strikes me as more valuable than page-curl effects
[00:40] <hamitron> yeh
[00:40] <hamitron> making it a smaller download too!!!!
[00:40] <hamitron> 123mb is insane
[00:42] <ali1234> perhaps not
[00:42] <ali1234> pdf is just a container format...
[00:43] <hamitron> I mean put text and text
[00:43] <hamitron> rather than 1 huge pic
[00:44] <shauno> speaking of 1 huge pic .. http://bbryson.com/bill/2007/10/12/have-you-ever-printed-a-boarding-pass/
[00:44] <shauno> this made me chuckle.  guy prints his boarding pass on poster-sized paper.
[00:44] <ali1234> the index of the catalogue goes by section/page so you can't even use it
[00:44] <ali1234> what page does section 8 start on??
[00:46] <hamitron> I tried using the CUPS pdf print driver first
[00:46] <hamitron> it crashed
[00:46] <hamitron> ;)
[00:46] <ali1234> you're trying to make a pdf?
[00:46] <hamitron> I will put them in 1 file after, yeh
[00:47] <hamitron> the load time for a page is too long, that is the only reason for wanting to download it
[00:49] <hamitron> ali1234: I don't download this stuff for fun ;)
[00:49] <shauno> pretty sure imagemagick would do it.  really just "convert page*jpg output.pdf"
[00:50] <hamitron> will try it
[00:50] <hamitron> ty :)
[00:50] <hamitron> not got the pics yet though
[00:52] <Azelphur> http://hardware.slashdot.org/story/11/04/19/2037225/Erasing-CDs-By-Using-150000-Volts-of-Electricity
[00:52] <Azelphur> dude doesn't mess about xD
[00:53] <shauno> heh, yeah, spotted that one earlier
[00:53] <shauno> it went something like .. pfft .. yawn .. ZZZAAAAPPPPP ... do want!
[00:53] <Azelphur> indeed
[00:54] <ali1234> how about tim berners-lee slamming twitter and facebook?
[00:56] <shauno> woah.  'convert' simply couldn't do that on my vps :/
[00:56] <ali1234> imagemagick sucks
[00:56] <hamitron> shauno: you are trying it?
[00:56] <ali1234> it loads all the source into ram first
[00:56] <hamitron> :)
[00:56] <ali1234> as uncompressed bitmaps
[00:56] <shauno> tried convert *jpg afile.pdf.  got a sms telling me I had less than 5% swap left
[00:56] <hamitron> hehe
[00:56] <ali1234> 200mb of jpegs going to be around 20GB probably
[00:56] <shauno> killled convert, now I'm using 50Mb ram & 50Mb swap
[00:57] <ali1234> what you should do is turn each jpeg into a single page pdf then merge them all
[00:57] <ali1234> but even then you'll get a pdf that's slightly larger than the sum of the jpegs
[00:57] <hamitron> only want it in a pdf so he can turn the pages
[00:57] <hamitron> ;)
[00:57] <shauno> first I'll go diving into dmesg to make sure nothing got slain :/
[00:57] <ali1234> heh
[00:58] <ali1234> gotta love linux oom
[00:58] <shauno> in theory it shoulda reaped convert first.  but it's always sane to check
[01:01] <hamitron> my pdf is smaller than the jpg
[01:01] <hamitron> for page 1 anyway
[01:01] <hamitron> ;)
[01:03] <hamitron> if I pipe a command into another, what is the symbol to enter the text?
[01:06] <shauno> not sure what you mean?
[01:07] <hamitron> nvm
[01:07] <hamitron> me neither
[01:07] <hamitron> ;)
[01:07] <hamitron> I hate scripting :/
[01:09] <shauno> oh wow.  the result is a pretty ugly pdf :/
[01:10] <hamitron> how do I merge loads of pdf?
[01:10] <shauno> it should just be convert page*pdf output.pdf
[01:10] <shauno> but that exploded for me :/
[01:10] <ali1234> noooo
[01:11] <ali1234> try pdfchain
[01:11] <shauno> ah
[01:11] <hamitron> that sounds kinda to my cpu
[01:11] <ali1234> not sure what package it is in
[01:12] <shauno> !info pdfchain
[01:12] <ali1234> oh. there you go then
[01:12] <hamitron> lets hope it is in debian ;)
[01:12] <shauno> it's in universe, so it's probably "almost entirely straight from debian"  :)
[01:13] <hamitron> oh ffs
[01:13] <hamitron> some of the images didn't download fully
[01:13] <shauno> heh, pdftk is installing java ..
[01:14] <shauno> ls *jpg|wc -l
[01:14] <hamitron> scrap that
[01:14] <shauno> 343
[01:14] <shauno> worked for me :/
[01:14] <hamitron> http://www.chaperlin.co.uk/catalogue/files/assets/pages/page0342_l.jpg
[01:14] <hamitron> had me worried
[01:14] <hamitron> :)
[01:15] <shauno> lol
[01:15] <hamitron> no pdfchain is debian lenny?
[01:15] <hamitron> :/
[01:16] <hamitron> it has pdftk
[01:21] <hamitron> yey \o/
[01:21] <hamitron> single file
[01:21] <hamitron> ty guys
[01:22] <shauno> I still think phoning them up and whining is a sensible option :)
[01:23] <shauno> pdftk did work a treat tho.  the output I got from that looked a lot better, has the right number of pages, and didn't explode into 3 screens of errors
[01:23] <shauno> (of course, being a mac user, I put "looks better" first :)
[01:23] <hamitron> haha
[01:23] <hamitron> well
[01:24] <hamitron> I'm gonna have to change it
[01:24] <ali1234> how it looks is the most important thing for a pdf
[01:24] <hamitron> and insert a blank page
[01:24] <shauno> that page 342 does look well funky
[01:24] <hamitron> atm, when i view with 2 pages side by side, it isn;t the right ones
[01:27] <hamitron> sorted
[01:27] <hamitron> :)
[01:32] <hamitron> I moved page 342 to page 3
[01:32] <hamitron> perrrrrrrrrrrfect
[01:33] <hamitron> so where is this thing in chrome to look at all downloads?
[01:34] <shauno> right-click and see if you have Inspect Element in the menu
[01:35] <shauno> if you do, click it, then go to the Resources tab in the inspector that attaches to the bottom of the window
[01:35] <shauno> click Enable, then reload the page
[01:35] <hamitron> found it, ty
[01:36] <hamitron> the network tab is even more cool
[01:36] <hamitron> :)
[01:37] <shauno> I'm used to using resources to figure out what's taking so long.  but the whole inspect is really quite nifty for some jobs
[01:39] <hamitron> yeh
[01:39] <hamitron> i've always looked at html source code to get things normally
[01:39] <hamitron> but flash is just :(
[01:40] <shauno> it's not just flash.  css & javascript will both have you wading to figure out where something's actually coming from
[01:40] <hamitron> yeh
[01:40] <shauno> flash is the worst, because looking harder doesn't help.  but as a whole, it's much easier to just ask the browser now
[01:40] <hamitron> I don't like them either
[01:41] <hamitron> yeh, I see now
[01:41] <hamitron> :)
[01:41] <hamitron> you have saved me many hours of reading in the future
[01:41] <hamitron> \o/
[01:41] <shauno> I've been going nuts trying to screen-scrape something at work
[01:42] <shauno> I need one value from a page.  seems simple enough.  except the whole thing is streamed javascript.  it's insane.
[01:42] <hamitron> :/
[01:43] <shauno> but I'm determined to figure it out, just because the guy who's product it is, told me it can't be done
[01:43] <hamitron> :))
[01:43] <hamitron> oh no
[01:43] <hamitron> 59gb of 60gb used of my bandwidth
[01:43] <hamitron> :/
[01:44] <hamitron> was 58gb earlier
[01:44] <hamitron> but had to download all these jpeg and software to convert them
[01:44] <shauno> it really is awful tho. the page itself is just a grid of cells.  with a timer function that keeps making the same request to the server
[01:44] <shauno> and every time it does so, it gets a completely different answer
[01:45] <shauno> then evaluates the javascript in the replies to populate parts of the page
[01:45] <hamitron> is it a consistent cell?
[01:45] <shauno> sort of
[01:45] <shauno> it's got a different name every time the page loads
[01:45] <shauno> but it's always the same relative to what cell the timer is fired from
[01:46] <shauno> so when you're trying to do it yourself, you know what the timer is called, so you know what the resulting cell is going to be called
[01:46] <hamitron> sounds doable then
[01:46] <shauno> but to get the one value you want, you can't just ask for it.  you have to sit there polling the server over and over until one of the replies has something useful in
[01:47] <hamitron> :/
[01:48] <shauno> that's been my pet hate for a couple of weeks now.  the worst thing is, it's an internal product.  so there should be a perfectly sensible way to request the data we need.
[01:48] <shauno> but apparently not :/
[01:49] <hamitron> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/7-NETBOOK-MINI-LAPTOP-WIFI-WINDOWS-2GB-BRAND-NEW-BLACK-/250793776931?_trksid=p4340.m8&_trkparms=algo%3DMW%26its%3DC%26itu%3DUCC%26otn%3D6%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D8575023138927943348#ht_1515wt_1199
[01:49] <hamitron> coming down in price :)
[01:50] <hamitron> shauno: can't the guy modify the thing?
[01:52] <ali1234> shauno: so it's ajax?
[01:52] <shauno> they should be able to.  or just add a page that just spits out the 3 numbers we need.  but they won't
[01:52] <shauno> ali1234, yeah
[01:52] <ali1234> i will write it for you if you pay me. i'll charge half whatever they want
[01:53] <shauno> heh, I'm not getting paid for it.  I'm just trying to make my job easier at work :)
[01:53] <ali1234> oh right. internal
[01:54] <shauno> sort of internal.  it's a mess
[01:54] <ali1234> well rather than screen scrape it why not just figure out how to do the ajax call that gets the data?
[01:55] <shauno> that's what I'm doing so far.  but you can't just request the cell you want
[01:55] <shauno> you request changes, and if it's not there, it's not there.  wait a few seconds, then request changes again
[01:55] <ali1234> well there must be an original call to get the first set of data
[01:56] <shauno> it's always zero until it changes.  it's what it changes to that's important to us
[01:56] <ali1234> so if it's "not there" you can assume it's zero?
[01:56] <shauno> correct
[01:56] <ali1234> is it like "number of printers that are currently on fire"?
[01:57] <shauno> s/printers/customers/, yeah
[01:57] <shauno> it's meant to be zero.  when it goes non-zero, we need to find out in a timely manner
[01:58] <ali1234> but if it only shows changes
[01:58] <ali1234> what happens if it changes to 1 and then stays on 1?
[01:58] <shauno> we get fired :)
[01:58] <hamitron> hehe
[01:58] <ali1234> within a length of time it takes for the timer to expire and the page to update?
[01:59] <shauno> the page they've deployed polls every 2 seconds
[01:59] <ali1234> so you have 2 seconds to fix it before you get fired.....
[01:59] <hamitron> a place I did some work, they gave staff warnings if they let the phone ring more than twice
[01:59] <shauno> no, I mean they'll reflect changes within a few seconds
[01:59] <ali1234> yeah but
[01:59] <ali1234> the point is
[02:00] <shauno> 2 minutes is the SLA where it goes from being 'an alarm' to 'a HR issue'
[02:00] <ali1234> what happens if it changes to 1, then 1 second later you load up the page
[02:00] <ali1234> and then it stays on 1 for half an hour
[02:00] <ali1234> it never changed after you loaded the page so you will never be notified?
[02:00] <shauno> if it's non-zero when you first load the page, it's in the first set of changes
[02:01] <shauno> the requests that the app sends back have a sequence number, so it has some concept of state
[02:01] <ali1234> so just poll with sequence number = 0 :)
[02:01] <shauno> that might actually work.  I've been trying to emulate the app they've already got so far
[02:02] <ali1234> it's a start anyway
[02:02] <shauno> it'd be easy enough to try
[02:03] <ali1234> another possibility is to run the whole entire thing in webkit and then dynamically pull from the DOM
[02:05] <hamitron> right, off to bed
[02:05] <hamitron> am deaded :)
[02:05] <hamitron> o/
[02:24] <Azelphur> http://www.alwaysinnovating.com/products/smartbook.htm
[02:24] <Azelphur> omg...
[02:24] <Azelphur> It's a netbook, tablet, mobile phone, PC, and secondary display wtf
[02:24] <Azelphur> that's insane xD
[03:51] <ball> hello emma
[03:51] <ball> Is it stormy over by you?
[03:51] <Azelphur> yay it's night lurker time :p
[03:52] <ball> :-)
[03:52] <ball> I'm using Ubuntu Netbook. Is there some way to get Firefox put back into the dock? I seem to have lost mine.
[03:52] <Azelphur> open firefox right click it's launcher icon click keep in launcher
[03:53] <ball> Firefox is running, but I don't have a launcher icon.
[03:53] <Azelphur> I believe that's a bug, if an app is running it should show on the launcher/task switcher
[03:56] <Azelphur> ball: I keep watching this video...I'm amazed by this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWbCF1ulBPY xD
[04:00] <ball> Azelphur: My users would break that thing in a week.
[04:00] <Azelphur> haha
[04:01] <ball> What's the name for the thing that puts each X client's menu up at the top of the screen?
[04:01] <ball> "Unity"?
[04:01] <Azelphur> ball: you mean the launcher and stuff?
[04:02] <Azelphur> in 11.04?
[04:03] <ball> No, I'm using 10.something I think.  Hang on, I'll check.
[04:03] <Azelphur> yea then unless your doing hackery there is no unity
[04:04] <Azelphur> unity is new in 11.04
[04:04] <ball> Linux derelict 2.6.35-22-generic #33-Ubuntu SMP Sun Sep 19 20:34:50 UTC 2010 i686 GNU/Linux
[04:04] <ball> ^- Is that Ubuntu 10.10 ?
[04:04] <Azelphur> that's your kernel version xD
[04:04] <Azelphur> lsb_release -d
[04:22] <ball> Description:Ubuntu 10.10
[04:33] <ball> Whatever it is, it moves the menu up to the top of the screen.
[04:34] <shauno> that's the global menu, but I didn't think it's meant to be in 10.10
[04:35] <ball> I just looked at Unity on Wikipedia and it looks just like what I'm seeing on my screen.
[07:31] <ubuntuuk-planet> [Ralph Janke] Pirate Party wins debate in Kitchener Waterloo - http://drupal.txwikinger.me.uk/content/pirate-party-wins-debate-kitchener-waterloo
[08:04] <MooDoo> morning all
[08:09] <diplo> morning all
[08:26] <DJones> Morning
[08:28] <MartijnVdS> https://twitter.com/#!/Queen_UK/status/60603720345468928
[08:43] <TheOpenSourcerer> morning all.
[08:43] <MartijnVdS> \o TOS
[08:45] <TheOpenSourcerer> Hmm, Not sure about the acronym for my handle MartijnVdS ;-)
[08:45] <MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: Not a Star Trek fan? :)
[08:46] <TheOpenSourcerer> Huh?
[08:46] <MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/Star_Trek:_The_Original_Series
[08:46] <MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: "TOS"
[08:46] <TheOpenSourcerer> Ahh - I see. Thanks.
[09:02] <scoundrel50a> hi, I was doing an update earlier, Maverick 10.10 and this appeared and wont go away. I have tried changing servers, but that doesnrt help. Anybody know how to get rid? http://imgur.com/KeGOe
[09:05] <gord> scoundrel50a, have you tried checking those three items and pressing the install updates button?
[09:06] <scoundrel50a> sorry thought that was a given, yes I have.
[09:06] <scoundrel50a> It wont allow me to check them
[09:06] <scoundrel50a> The rest of the updates went fine
[09:07] <Guest17610> i have to say, unity has come leaps and bounds over the last time I installed it (unr)
[09:09] <scoundrel50a> no ideas?
[09:10] <Guest17610> whats your error scoundrel50a?
[09:10] <scoundrel50a> I was doing an update earlier, Maverick 10.10 and this appeared and wont go away. I have tried changing servers, but that doesnrt help. Anybody know how to get rid? http://imgur.com/KeGOe
[09:11] <scoundrel50a> Just did apt-get update and aopt-get dist-upgrade still nothing
[09:11] <Guest17610> why can you not install from synaptic?  refresh and mark for install so to speak?
[09:12] <scoundrel50a> I have neverf done that, ho do i install that from synaptic?
[09:12] <Guest17610> what ubuntu are you running?
[09:12] <scoundrel50a> 10.10
[09:14] <Guest17610> if you go to pref or admin then select synaptic package manager.  once you are there click on refresh for repo update then click on mark button and it should sort out the rest for you
[09:14] <scoundrel50a> ok, I'll give it a try, got synaptic open
[09:15] <Guest17610> refresh and mark for update
[09:15] <Guest17610> it should list all components that need updating including any kernel available for you :)
[09:16] <Guest17610> any luck scoundrel50a?
[09:17] <scoundrel50a> sorry, was just making sure, but that didnt work
[09:17] <Guest17610> have you tried cleaning apt apt-get autoclean ?
[09:18] <Guest17610> then updating, then upgrading
[09:18] <eoke> Could somebody kindly paste bin me the output of "id" for a sudo user as I may have forgotten the -a when adjusting my groups?
[09:18] <scoundrel50a> No I havent, I'll give that a go now
[09:18] <Guest17610> eoke its 0
[09:18] <eoke> I'm logged on and back in the sudoers groups it's all the additional groups I'm not trying to add.
[09:18] <Guest17610> /etc/sudoers?
[09:19] <Guest17610> theres also a user and group admin gui in the main menu iirc too
[09:19] <eoke> I'm currently just in admin necessary for sudo but it's the other groups I'm after for a normal user in ubuntu 10.10.
[09:20] <Guest17610> you can set sudo privillages for individual accounts if thats what your trying to do?
[09:20] <scoundrel50a> well that didnt work, a load of stuff was remoived, but when I did a sudo apt-get updgrade it says it kept those three things back, most bizarre
[09:20] <eoke> I can sudo it's just all the other group names I'm after.
[09:20] <Guest17610> try sudo apt-get -f install to fix any broken packages then try upgrading
[09:21] <scoundrel50a> ok, will do
[09:21] <Guest17610> ah right eoke.. ill just get them
[09:21] <eoke> When you install ubuntu your initial user is in a whole series of groups I'm not longer in them, the "id" command will list all of those groups
[09:22] <eoke> Cheers Guest17610
[09:22] <Guest17610> eoke : if you go to users settings, it has the ability to mod other accounts providing you have admi rights
[09:22] <Guest17610> root*
[09:22] <scoundrel50a> didnt do anything, said 0 upgraded, 0 installed 0 to remove 3 not upgraded
[09:22] <eoke> Guest17610, I just don't know which other groups are normal that's why I'm after the list.
[09:22] <shauno> eoke: I believe it's #EXTRA_GROUPS="dialout cdrom floppy audio src video lp src users"
[09:23] <shauno> per /etc/adduser.conf :)
[09:23] <eoke> Cheers shauno
[09:23] <eoke> Excellent I didn't know that's where the defaults were kept time for a man of that. Thanks all.
[09:23] <Guest17610> eoke theres loads sadly. i would boot in livecd and get them that way...
[09:24] <scoundrel50a> any other suggestions
[09:25] <Guest17610> scoundrel50a: is synaptic not updating the generic kernels?
[09:25] <scoundrel50a> how can you tell?
[09:26] <Guest17610> synaptic should download the kernel images
[09:27] <scoundrel50a> I'll have a look
[09:28] <scoundrel50a> ok, now I found something, against those three kernal there are greyed out exclamation marks, what does that mean?
[09:28] <Guest17610> means there not available for you me thinks
[09:28] <Guest17610> brb just check
[09:28] <JamesTait> 'ello 'ello 'ello!
[09:29] <scoundrel50a> ok, when I try to put mark for upgrade I get this message.....linux-generic:
[09:29] <scoundrel50a>   Depends: linux-image-generic (=2.6.35.29.37) but 2.6.35.22.23 is to be installed
[09:30] <Guest17610> this site seems to have the same problem http://superuser.com/questions/23797/grayed-out-ubuntu-distribution-updates
[09:31] <scoundrel50a> did you read my last message, it shows an error when I try to mark for update
[09:31] <scoundrel50a> different to the one you showed
[09:31] <Guest17610> what error sorry are you getting?
[09:31] <scoundrel50a> when I try to put mark for upgrade I get this message.....linux-generic:
   Depends: linux-image-generic (=2.6.35.29.37) but 2.6.35.22.23 is to be installed
[09:32] <Guest17610> ah right
[09:32] <scoundrel50a> so its not letting me update
[09:32] <Guest17610> just install that kernel via synaptic then all should be well :)
[09:33] <scoundrel50a> I'll try, one sec
[09:37] <scoundrel50a> http://imgur.com/EKawa hope that works that shows what happens when I try to install via synaptic, and if you look in the top left corner, it shows the three kernals greyed out
[09:39] <Guest17610> try sudo dpkg -configure -a && sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get upgrade wonder if reconfiguring the packages will help?
[09:39] <MartijnVdS> Guest17610: it might
[09:39] <scoundrel50a> ok
[09:40] <scoundrel50a> got an error
[09:40] <scoundrel50a> will pastebin it
[09:41] <scoundrel50a> http://paste.ubuntu.com/596443/
[09:42] <MartijnVdS> scoundrel50a: try dpkg --configure (two - signs)
[09:42] <MartijnVdS> scoundrel50a: so: dpkg --configure -a && sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get upgrade
[09:42] <scoundrel50a> ok
[09:44] <scoundrel50a> http://paste.ubuntu.com/596446/
[09:44] <scoundrel50a> but I dont have any processes open apart from this and a terminal
[09:47] <scoundrel50a> coulld it be what I have ticked in Software Sources>Other Software
[09:47] <Guest76701> other sources probs will have dependency issues
[09:50] <scoundrel50a> this is really annoying,
[09:50] <scoundrel50a> MartijnVdS: that command you gave, was it written out properly, what other processes could be blocking it
[09:52] <scoundrel50a> this just appeared http://paste.ubuntu.com/596455/
[09:53] <shauno> dpkg uses error message.  it's super effective!
[09:53] <shauno> (the -o error is because you want --configure, not -configure.  -configure  tries to use -c, -o, -n etc as options
[09:54] <scoundrel50a> so would you know why I am unable to upgrade?
[10:05] <shauno> I can't tell from that.  the complaint about locks is most likely because the graphical upgrade thingie is also using dpkg
[10:06] <scoundrel50a> I eventually got this dpkg --configure -a && sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get upgrade to work went through the process and still it says 'linux generic, linux-headers-generic, linux-image-generic' kept back, not upgraded.
[10:08] <shauno> yes.  upgrade won't pull in kernels, because thru a fun twist of packaging, they require dependencies.  if you install them by name  (apt-get install linux-generic linux-headers-generic linux-image-generic), it 'should'
[10:12] <scoundrel50a> http://paste.ubuntu.com/596471/ that is what happens when I enter what you suggested, how do you repair broken packages?
[10:13] <popey> scoundrel50a: because you're using "sudo apt-get upgrade"
[10:13] <popey> you should not do that
[10:13] <popey> you should use "sudo apt-get dist-upgrade"
[10:13] <shauno> usually if the dependencies aren't installable, you just caught the repo with it's pants down.  update again will usually clean that up
[10:14] <scoundrel50a> I think I already tried that, but will try it again
[10:14] <scoundrel50a> yep, same thing those three kept back
[10:16] <scoundrel50a> http://paste.ubuntu.com/596472/
[10:16] <MartijnVdS> scoundrel50a: sudo apt-get install linux-generic linux-headers-generic linux-image-generic
[10:18] <scoundrel50a> http://paste.ubuntu.com/596475/
[10:21] <DJones> Is it just me, or does it look as though Apple have pinched the Unity workspace switcher for the iphone based on this "prototype" report http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/39652/white-iphone-4-unearthed-64gb
[10:22] <shauno> that looks a lot like expose to me
[10:22] <shauno> if it looks familiar, it's because 90% of unity is a bad rip from osx :p
[10:22] <DJones> Heh
[10:26] <kazade> does anyone know if there is some kind of clever command that can restore Ubuntu to its default package set? (e.g. remove installed packages and reinstall removed packages)
[10:30] <Psychobudgie> kazade, not that I know of
[10:31] <Psychobudgie> kazade, all I can think of is to remove any third party repos, and do a complete reinstall of ubuntu-desktop from synaptic
[10:31] <bigcalm> kazade: feature request? :)
[10:31] <Psychobudgie> it all depends what you have installed
[10:31] <DJones> The only way I've heard of is a reinstall, I;m sure its been requested as a feature though, similar to Windows rollback
[10:32] <Neoti> finally i just got through the the core network team in Virgin media about packetloss on mine and other peoples lines ... from the new Mb and Mb services with the new modems.... and i pointed out that on people who have the old modem and old 20Mb service there is next to no packet loss.... took me and hour and 40 mins to finally get through the the right department tho ...
[10:32] <Psychobudgie> an easier route is to back up your user folder to an external device, reinstall from a cd and copy it all back
[10:32] <kazade> bigcalm, it's something I've thought about since at least Dapper :)
[10:33] <kazade> it would be nice to do: sudo apt-get dist-revert :D
[10:34] <Bulldog> im in search of a new linux distro that is lightweight for installation on a laptop. any recommendations ?
[10:35] <DJones> Bulldog: lubuntu or xubuntu?
[10:35] <bigcalm> You're asking for a distro other than Ubuntu in an Ubuntu channel?
[10:35] <bigcalm> Ah, I forgot about the variants
[10:36] <Bulldog> whats differences with the variants ?
[10:36] <popey> kazade: tried sudo apt-get install ubuntu-desktop^
[10:36] <popey> note the caret
[10:37] <Psychobudgie> popey, that might work but he would have to remove any third-party repos first
[10:37] <DJones> Bulldog: Mainly different desktop environments, xfce and lxde (I think) both lighteron memory than gnome/kde
[10:38] <Bulldog> DJones  ok ty ill have a look into them
[10:39] <bigcalm> Aparently 6 days left to apply for Olimpic tickets. I have a Visa card, but I'm somewhat disgusted that one can only get tickets with Visa. Anybody going?
[10:39] <bigcalm> Olympic
[10:39] <popey> Psychobudgie: no, he wont
[10:40] <popey> it wont remove any extra stuff though actually
[10:40] <DJones> Bulldog: I'm looking at installing lubuntu on an old laptop with only 512mb of ram as an experiment, its just about capeable with ubuntu+gnome, but struggles along a bit because of memory issues
[10:41] <Bulldog> DJones yes same issue  this laptop has 512mb
[10:41] <Psychobudgie> popey, it will if any of the files ubuntu-desktop requires are superseded by versions provided third-party
[10:42] <nbookham> I nedd a driver for a belkin f8t016 bluetooth dongle. belkin have been no help at all
[10:42] <nbookham> sorry, typo
[10:44] <Psychobudgie> nbookham, have you tried googling it
[10:44] <Psychobudgie> I'm pretty sure that typing 'f8t016 linux' would return something
[10:44] <DJones> Bulldog: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu According to that, lubuntu will "run" on an PII with 128Mb of ram as a minimum, so 512Mb could well be a luxury
[10:46] <popey> Psychobudgie: good point
[10:46] <Psychobudgie> Bulldog, I use maverick on an hp8300 series laptop which has 512mb of ram and it works nicely
[10:47] <shauno> 'run' is always a bit vague.  the difference between the DE being happy, and being able to use firefox/openoffice/etc
[10:47] <Psychobudgie> Bulldog, I had performance issues on it however due to the video drivers
[10:47] <gord> whenever someone talks about hp laptops, my brain always assums they are talking about printers
[10:47] <Bulldog> Psychobudgie i use maverick on my desktop  i was just looking for a slight change for the laptop
[10:48] <Psychobudgie> Bulldog, np, however if you are getting performance issues on the laptop, check the video drivers, especially if it's an ati gpu in it
[10:49] <Psychobudgie> Bulldog, you can save yourself weeks of headaches checking memory, dma settings, distro version, hd, etc
[10:50] <Psychobudgie> I'm speaking from experience on that part
[10:50] <Bulldog> Psychobudgie thanks will do
[10:52] <Psychobudgie> I'm currently keeping my fingers crossed that someone spins off a gubuntu
[10:53] <DJones> Psychobudgie: I had the same thing with nvidia drivers, when I upgraded to 10.10, web browsers would just hang. But a fresh install later on worked perfectly with minimal problems
[10:54] <Psychobudgie> DJones, mine was performance related. HD would be constantly polling and opening anything took an absolute age. Turned out the video had stolen all the laptops memory. OS was working with 128mb. Clean install of the latest ATI drivers and it was fixed.
[10:54] <DJones> Psychobudgie: Ouch
[10:55] <Psychobudgie> took me ages to find the problem
[10:55] <Psychobudgie> or the solution rather
[10:56] <Psychobudgie> everything pointed to dma not running but you learn something new
[10:56] <Psychobudgie> like i'm currently learning that gnome 3 is actually pretty good
[10:57] <david__> yeah! lets hear it for Gnome3
[10:57] <popey> still not got round to trying that yet
[10:57] <DJones> Psychobudgie: I'm getting used to unity, I like it /me ducks
[10:57] <popey> i quite like bits of unity
[10:57] <popey> getting used to the foilbles
[10:57] <Psychobudgie> been using it here from the ppa for a few days now and it is miles better than unity
[10:58] <david__> I've tried both unity (beta2) and Gnome3 (alpha) and in my opinion not much between them
[10:58] <Psychobudgie> to be frank it makes unity look like it was designed by a 20 year old college grad
[10:58] <Psychobudgie> g3 is far more user friendly
[10:59] <Psychobudgie> the mouse is still an integral part of the ui
[10:59] <Psychobudgie> in unity it feels like it's been bolted on
[10:59] <shauno> that might be a bit harsh, but to be fair, the gnome team have been knocking this stuff out for 10+ years
[10:59] <davmor2> morning all
[10:59] <davmor2> popey: Moo!
[10:59] <DJones> The screenshots I've seen of g3 looked similar to unity (I've only seen a couple though)
[10:59] <shauno> they've got to have figured out a few things on the way
[10:59] <david__> yes but I like the fact that you can switch between apps on different virtual desktops sinly using alt-tab
[10:59] <Psychobudgie> DJones, the screenshots don't do it justice
[11:00] <Psychobudgie> I installed it expecting to bring on the hate and I've found myself bringing on the love
[11:00] <david__> lol
[11:00] <DJones> Psychobudgie: I can understand that, it'd be like looking at a screenshot of compix & rotate cube etc, just wouldn't be the same
[11:01] <Psychobudgie> swing the mouse to the top left corner and bring up the windows and desktops then click on the one you want
[11:01] <Psychobudgie> it's a one click job
[11:01] <david__> i think the only reason ubuntu developing unity is that gnome3 doesn't do compiz
[11:01] <DJones> Are the hardware/graphics requirements for gnome 3 higher or lower than for unity, or about the same
[11:02] <Psychobudgie> david__, that's a good thing
[11:02] <Psychobudgie> david__, compiz is as stable as my marriage to be quite fair
[11:02] <david__> lol
[11:02] <Psychobudgie> DJones, about the same
[11:02] <david__> well stop using online porn and marriage might improve lol
[11:03] <Psychobudgie> the porn is all that's holding it together
[11:03] <david__> lol
[11:03] <shauno> I'm getting the odd mental image of someone taking the dropshadow to counselling
[11:03]  * Psychobudgie goes and cries in the corner
[11:04] <Psychobudgie> you should check out some of the videos on gnome3.org
[11:04] <Psychobudgie> see it actually working
[11:04] <david__> i've seen a lot of ubuntu users on forums bashing unity but I bet after a few months after release a lot of those users will like it
[11:04] <Psychobudgie> even they don't do it justice
[11:04] <Psychobudgie> david__, they won't
[11:04] <david__> how do u know?
[11:04] <Psychobudgie> david__, unity is a netbook desktop environment
[11:04] <popey> i see a lot of people who have never used unity, bashing it :)
[11:05] <Psychobudgie> it is not a desktop for desktops
[11:05] <david__> its started off for netbooks but canonical have developed it for other computers
[11:05] <popey> http://www.shermann.name/2011/04/unity-and-2x-24.html
[11:05] <Psychobudgie> it's the same thing
[11:05] <david__> is it?
[11:05] <Psychobudgie> it's too heavily keyboard centric for desktops
[11:05] <david__> but then i've never used unity on a netbook
[11:06] <david__> don't have a netbook
[11:06] <Psychobudgie> gnome have spent ages finding a happy medium between mouse and keyboard and it seems to hit the spot
[11:06] <directhex> DJones, higher. gnome shell requires a 3d accelerator
[11:06] <DJones> david__: I came to unity having read the reviews/comments and was expecting a nightmare, but I was pleasently surprised at how good it was on my laptop
[11:06] <Psychobudgie> unity is miles from being ready
[11:06] <directhex> DJones, so you can't test shell in a VM :)
[11:07] <Psychobudgie> unity is good on a laptop where a keyboard centric os is beneficial, on a desktop not so much
[11:07] <david__> well maybe when it reaches 11.10 or 12.04 unity will be mature
[11:07] <DJones> directhex: Interesting, I might have a look at a fedora live cd just to see what it looks like
[11:08] <directhex> david__, i'm installing 10.04 for nontechnical staff. by 12.04, either unity will be finished, dead, or at the very least gnome3 as an alternative fixed & ready for humans
[11:08] <david__> yeah my thoughts as well
[11:08] <popey> +1
[11:09] <scoundrel50a> I have tried twice now to ge it to work on my new laptop, and nothing. I had installed netbook edition, which is basically the same on my netbook, and I found the look ok, but it was time consuming, and restrictive. The left bar couldnt be moved, the icons were difficult to change, it took  6 clicks to get to some things you needed. Its still very buggy for a something that has just a week to be released. I may not be able to use it, if it
[11:09] <scoundrel50a>  doesnt sort the backlight problem out.
[11:09] <Psychobudgie> seriously, the first time you sweep your mouse to the top left corner and then click on the window you wish to use or desktop you wish to check, or float over the bottom right to pickup notifications you'll think ' I really want to hate that, but I don't'
[11:10] <Psychobudgie> scoundrel50a, right on the money
[11:10] <popey> it's certainly a shame that canonical/ubuntu and gnome didnt see eye to eye on UI stuff
[11:10] <david__> u talking about gnome3?
[11:10] <popey> but it's not a disaster
[11:10] <popey> for anyone
[11:11] <directhex> unity as was on 10.10 is such a huge disaster i installed kubuntu on the wife's netbook instead
[11:11] <popey> scoundrel50a: so use the classic desktop then?
[11:11] <Psychobudgie> I haven't as of yet read a favourable review of unity from any of the online sources
[11:11] <david__> wonder how long gnome2 will be packaged with ubuntu as its no longer being developed
[11:12] <directhex> david__, gone by 11.10
[11:12] <directhex> david__, gtk2 will linger for a while though
[11:12] <Psychobudgie> the register this morning actually prompted people to try fedora as an alternative as it has stuck with gnome3
[11:12] <david__> so will ubuntu start shipping unity with gnome3?
[11:12] <Psychobudgie> and theregister are ubuntu fanboys
[11:12] <scoundrel50a> backlight wont turn on even in recovery mode. Spent 4 hours last night, with help from two people on #ubuntu+1 to get it to work, and nothing, and all through, we were getting loads of people coming on with the same problems, its not ready, full stop for a lot of people
[11:12] <scoundrel50a> even installed using alternative cd, still wouldnt work
[11:13] <popey> scoundrel50a: your backlight issue is separate from unity
[11:13] <popey> i dont even know what your backlight issue is
[11:13] <scoundrel50a> no its not, ist usity problem
[11:13] <scoundrel50a> we prooved that yesterday
[11:13] <scoundrel50a> same for a lot of people coming on to #ubuntu+1 with the same problem
[11:13] <Psychobudgie> scoundrel50a, does the backlight work prior to unity loading?
[11:14] <david__> i read yesterday on forums that unity is going to be ubuntu's vista and it appears to be correct from wot you say
[11:14] <popey> if people dont think unity is ready they can:-
[11:14] <popey> a) use classic desktop
[11:14] <popey> b) use 10.04
[11:14] <popey> c) use 10.10
[11:14] <popey> d) help fix it
[11:14] <scoundrel50a> I am using the same machine to talk to you now, it works fine in 10.10,
[11:14] <popey> e) all of the above
[11:14] <Psychobudgie> popey, what they'll likely do though is use another distro
[11:14] <david__> f) use xubuntu
[11:14] <david__> g) use kubuntu
[11:15] <david__> h) use lubuntu
[11:15] <scoundrel50a> saying they can use classic desktop is was not an option, as soon as you try to load Natty, backlight goes off
[11:15] <popey> Psychobudgie: which is fine
[11:15] <directhex> david__, 11.10 will ship with gnome 3 components, but likely not shell. all the gnome apps are still part of ubuntu - tomboy, gedit, empathy, etc
[11:15] <popey> david__: yay! choice!
[11:15] <gord> the only people whoa re gonna go use another distro are the people who are being loud and obnoxious about the whole thing, people use ubuntu for a hell of a lot more than its interface
[11:15] <X3N> i) use gnome shell ;)
[11:15] <david__> yeah
[11:15] <popey> this should be a document
[11:16] <Psychobudgie> we should have a referendum
[11:16] <Psychobudgie> heh
[11:16] <Psychobudgie> unity or gnome3
[11:16] <X3N> Psychobudgie: there have been a lot of polls on ubuntu forums
[11:16] <Psychobudgie> use av for the voting
[11:16] <david__> or LXDE
[11:16] <directhex> Psychobudgie, AV == FPTP when there are only 2 choices
[11:16] <X3N> Psychobudgie: most of them come out in favour of gnome/gnome shell
[11:17] <bigcalm> Psychobudgie: we are under a dictatorship, not a democrasy
[11:17] <popey> http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/Choices
[11:17] <david__> lol
[11:17] <david__> revolution!
[11:17] <scoundrel50a> gord: that is a bit unfair, I use Ubuntu, I get a lot of problems using it, sometimes they dont get sorted, like the one I got this morning, I would say its more likely frustration that sends people to other distros. Not loaud and obnoxious.
[11:17] <directhex> david__, feel free to fork it
[11:17] <Psychobudgie> bigcalm, maybe we should demonstrate outside his house
[11:17] <Psychobudgie> get the un involved
[11:17] <Psychobudgie> at worst we'll get a food parcel and interviewed by kate adie
[11:18] <david__> lol
[11:18] <bigcalm> Psychobudgie: I'm happy with how things are going. I'll leave it to others to complain if they need to
[11:18] <david__> she no longer does interviews does she? lol
[11:18]  * shauno is gonna google katie adie before considering this
[11:18] <shauno> picketing the IOM in cannoes doesn't sound fun
[11:18] <Psychobudgie> one look at me standing there with my pitchfork and torch and she won't be able to help herself
[11:19] <gord> bigcalm, the problem with leaving it to others to complain is that you get a very one sided argument =\
[11:19] <czajkowski> gord: jammy dodgers!
[11:19] <popey> \o/ jam
[11:19] <popey> Jam trousers!
[11:19] <Psychobudgie> lets be honest here, ms is as likely to listen to us as he is to admit unity is a netbook gui
[11:19]  * popey hugs gord
[11:20] <gord> saying jammy dodgers in the middle of a work day when i can't go out and get some? added to the list twice.
[11:20] <czajkowski> pff gord there is no pleasing you I gave you two reminders now, you should have gotten some by now
[11:21] <gord> there is never an excuse for not having jammy dodgers =\
[11:21] <bigcalm> gord: I'm not complaining because I nothing to complain about :)
[11:21] <david__> custard creams
[11:21] <davmor2> czajkowski: Big hugs
[11:22] <Psychobudgie> bah, you can keep your jammie dodgers
[11:23] <DJones> If gord is the jammie dodger, does that make czajkowski Fagin?
[11:23] <Psychobudgie> there is only one king of biscuit
[11:23]  * Psychobudgie reaches for a chocolate hob nob
[11:23]  * DJones eats a bourbon cream
[11:24]  * gordonjcp has a coffee, and contemplates making a cheese toastie
[11:24] <Psychobudgie> ooh, my ps3 copy of portal 2 comes with the pc version free
[11:24] <Psychobudgie> yay for valve
[11:24] <kazade> Sigh, http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-13141986
[11:25] <Psychobudgie> now all they need to do is create a native linux engine and I'm laughing
[11:25] <gordonjcp> Psychobudgie: yeah
[11:25] <gordonjcp> Psychobudgie: to be fair, it works pretty damn well in Wine
[11:26] <gordonjcp> I'd *love* a truly native Linux port of the Source engine and Steam
[11:26] <gordonjcp> but the fact that they actually seem to *care* about not breaking Wine is the next best thing ;-)
[11:26] <davmor2> popey: why you going for restraint any way?  is it to limit the amount of time you spend on FB?
[11:26] <popey> davmor2: not replying to hate mail
[11:27] <davmor2> :)
[11:28] <davmor2> popey: But no-one can hate you your too nice, and look like elvis everyone love elvis (apparently)
[11:28] <gordonjcp> I'm going to Lidl to get some stroopwafel to celebrate five nines on one of our big scary systems ;-)
[11:29] <gordonjcp> davmor2: there is a guy who works at one of the concierge stations for one of the blocks of flats near here who looks exactly like popey but with more grey hair and an evil goatee
[11:29] <popey> davmor2: check the sounder list. I'm pretty hated there
[11:30] <gordonjcp> he's like popey's evil twin
[11:30] <popey> i have grey hair now gordonjcp :(
[11:30] <gordonjcp> well
[11:30] <popey> quite a lot
[11:30] <gordonjcp> slightly eviller twin
[11:30] <davmor2> popey: No I'm not getting blagged into joining the sounders list I get enough mail as it is :D
[11:30] <popey> davmor2: its shutdown, so you wouldn't be able to
[11:31] <shauno> I tried to google the pope to see if he had a goatee to support a bad joke.
[11:31] <gordonjcp> we've had four minutes total outage on a big radio system spread across five sites
[11:31] <shauno> but chrome autofilled it to 'popey'.  what on earth have you done to google?!
[11:31] <davmor2> popey: Meh it was only full of whiners anyway right?
[11:34] <gordonjcp> what's the sounders list?
[11:35] <popey> davmor2: thats the spirit!
[11:36] <davmor2> popey: Anything I can do to help you practise restraint I'm right there for you :D
[11:36] <popey> :)
[11:37] <MooDoo> davmor2: creep :)
[11:39] <davmor2> MooDoo: I just announced that if I can annoy popey I will,  it's a czajkowski surrogate till she's up and running proper and look at how much restraint she has now :D
[11:39] <MooDoo> davmor2: ah ok, thought you'd gone soft.
[11:41] <davmor2> MooDoo: see minutes have passed and czajkowski hasn't tried killing either of us :D
[11:41] <dogmatic69> hi all
[11:41] <davmor2> morning dogmatic69
[11:41] <MooDoo> davmor2: we're leaving her alone as she's not well
[11:41] <dogmatic69> anyone know how i can change this... apt-get update is using '[Connecting to us-east-1.ec2.archive.ubuntu.com (10.250.142.223)]'
[11:41] <davmor2> MooDoo: I know
[11:41] <dogmatic69> its on aws but ive moved the server to the eu
[11:42] <dogmatic69> was in the us
[11:42] <dogmatic69> davmor2: o/
[11:45] <oimon> my office had a £2-3million facelift...somebody crashes a car into it after 1 week...life in the east end!
[11:45] <popey> http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/digitaltv/news/a315550/virgin-media-to-trial-15gb-broadband.html
[11:45] <popey> wow
[11:46] <dwatkins> oimon: goodness me, hope people are ok and it's insured
[11:46] <MooDoo> hmmm aren't they having issues with their 30 service at the moment?
[11:46] <dwatkins> popey: I'd be amazed if it performs any better than 10 MBit.
[11:47] <dogmatic69> popey: how am i supposed to work with 150Mbps uploads?
[11:47] <popey> hah
[11:47] <popey> I'm tempted to get 30Mb
[11:47] <oimon> dwatkins: superficial damage to building (it's made of solid concrete with glass panels), lots of broken pieces of car though.
[11:47] <popey> hehe
[11:47] <shauno> dogmatic69: I think you change it the same way you always would? just change the url to eu.ec3.archive.ubuntu.com and apt-get update
[11:48] <dwatkins> oimon: sounds like a good excuse to get a fussball table
[11:48] <oimon> scoundrel50a: has the backlight issue been reported as a bug
[11:48] <dogmatic69> shauno: i dont know how to 'normally' do it :)
[11:48] <scoundrel50a> oimon: yes
[11:49] <oimon> scoundrel50a: great
[11:49] <shauno> dogmatic69: oh .. should be /etc/apt/sources.list, unless there's anything that also matches in /etc/apt/sources.list.d/
[11:49] <popey> scoundrel50a: bug number?
[11:49] <oimon> i owe it to fellow owners of the machines i use to report hardware issues
[11:49] <oimon> especially regressions
[11:49] <scoundrel50a> no idea, I just managed to get the bug reported, and didnt think to look for the bug number
[11:49] <oimon> scoundrel50a: you would have received an email
[11:50] <scoundrel50a> not had to report a bug before
[11:50] <popey> scoundrel50a: you should have an email with the number in it
[11:50] <oimon> or if you login to launchpad you can see the bugs you are active on
[11:50] <popey> https://bugs.launchpad.net/~scoundrel50a
[11:50] <popey> i see no bugs
[11:50] <scoundrel50a> um, will have to look, lost all stored e-mails on computer, one sec, need to go on the web
[11:50] <popey> assuming thats you :)
[11:51] <scoundrel50a> that is, but its not that one, I'll see if I can find it
[11:52] <dogmatic69> shauno: thanks :)
[11:52] <dogmatic69> that worked
[11:53] <Psychobudgie> Virgin will launch 150gb broadband and introduce a 30gb cap on the same day
[11:53] <Psychobudgie> that is my prediction
[11:53] <popey> bug 759194
[11:54] <Psychobudgie> 1 month later you will have the first watchdog special on Virgin customers being hit with £5000 bills for 1 month's "surfing"
[11:55] <DJones> I saw the email about 6.06 server release reaching EOL last night after 5 years and realised how long it is since I started using ubuntu, 6.06 was brand new at the time, where has the last 5 years gone?
[11:56] <oimon> scoundrel50a: somebody mamanged to turn on the backlight in bug 765438 as a workaround
[11:56] <MartijnVdS> DJones: I WANT MY 5 YEARS BACK!
[11:56] <MartijnVdS> :P
[11:56] <dogmatic69> now on apt-get update im getting 'A error occurred during the signature verification. The repository is not updated and the previous index files will be used. '
[11:56] <DJones> MartijnVdS: They're non-refundable
[11:56] <Psychobudgie> if you find the last 5 years could you ask it if it's seen my waistline or my hair and ask them to come back
[11:56] <MartijnVdS> DJones: :|
[11:57] <czajkowski> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4Wy7gRGgeA CODE MONKEY
[12:00] <scoundrel50a> oimon: didnt see that one, we did a load of other things though, but nothing worked.
[12:00] <davmor2> MartijnVdS: You can only have your five years back if you can provide us with a receipt for the purchase of said five years, other wise you us for five years
[12:01] <scoundrel50a> oimon: it wasnt just me either, quite a few people were getting the same problems.
[12:01] <gord> gord is not happy with this weeks graze box, not nearly enough chocolate
[12:02] <shauno> dogmatic69: that's a bit odd.  they should both be using the same key.  (also, minor bug: *an* error ;)
[12:02] <MartijnVdS> gord: complain! complain!
[12:02] <scoundrel50a> bug 759104
[12:02] <gord> wonder if i can convince cadbury's to start a similar service
[12:02] <dogmatic69> shauno: there is a bug on launchpad, from like 2005ish
[12:03] <dogmatic69> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apt/+bug/24234
[12:05] <scoundrel50a> there should have been two files I uploaded, both Xorg files, can only see one though.
[12:05] <popey> scoundrel50a: that doesnt look like a bug about backlights
[12:05] <scoundrel50a> well it was, because that was the problem we had.
[12:06] <oimon> this irc room is like twitter...you would think the whole world gets graze boxes, but it's just 2 or 3 vocal members on ubuntu-uk :P
[12:06] <popey> scoundrel50a: no, that bug is about a blank screen on upgrade, not a broken backlight
[12:06] <oimon> remember when everyone thought lib dems were gonna win the election? turned out to be based on some RTs in twitter ...
[12:07] <popey> scoundrel50a: there seems to be at least two separate issues.
[12:07] <popey> 1) broken backlight
[12:07] <popey> 2) blank screen on upgrade
[12:07]  * bigcalm ponders taking graze off of his highlight list
[12:08] <popey> hah
[12:08] <popey> graze
[12:08] <popey> :D
[12:08] <scoundrel50a> popey: backlight wasnt broken, it just didnt work, its working now, using 10.10, as I am using that machine
[12:08] <bigcalm> Abuse! Abuse!
[12:08] <scoundrel50a> I just put down what I was told,
[12:08] <oimon> bigcalm: how do you do highlight lists? i'm in pidgin
[12:09] <bigcalm> oimon: no idea, I use x-chat
[12:09] <scoundrel50a> what does the Xorg files show
[12:09] <bigcalm> Well, y-chat on windows
[12:09] <oimon> it's a client rather than irc thing?
[12:09] <bigcalm> Yes
[12:10] <oimon> scoundrel50a: if you plugged an external monitor in, does it work?
[12:11] <DJones> oimon: Looks like theres a plugin pack for pidgin http://pkgs.org/ubuntu-10.10/ubuntu-universe-i386/pidgin-plugin-pack_2.6.3-1_i386.deb.html which includes a hilight command
[12:12] <scoundrel50a> don’t know, because I couldnt use it I had to delete and reinstall 10.10
[12:12] <DJones> oimon: Not something I've looked for in the official repo's though
[12:13] <oimon> DJones: thanks, i will check it out
[12:14] <oimon> it's in the repo's too
[12:15] <popey> scoundrel50a: you could dual boot 10.10 and 11.04 and switch between them, if you want to test 11.04 and help get it fixed
[12:15] <oimon> or use a livecd
[12:15] <popey> thats less useful tbh
[12:15] <popey> because you can't install kernels
[12:16] <oimon> just testing my highlights..someone say graze please, without mentioning my name :P
[12:16] <popey> quick, nobody say graze!
[12:16] <popey> damnit1
[12:16] <oimon> yay
[12:16] <oimon> rememebers to remove that word from his list now
[12:16]  * oimon prefers chocolate to nuts
[12:17] <DJones> Chocolate Raisons FTW
[12:18] <scoundrel50a> ok, if I knew what UI was doing, and didnt need help when something went wrong I would willingly, but I spent 4 hours yesterday, and goodness knows how long the first time I installed and uninstalled I just cant keep coming onto here and asking all the time. I have spent more time on here the past week or so than doing anything else.
[12:18] <gordonjcp> DJones: mmmm
[12:18] <oimon> discovering lots more IRC plugins in the pidgin-plugin-pack
[12:18] <gordonjcp> I must admit, I adore dried grapes, I just absolutely live for them
[12:18] <gordonjcp> they're my raisin d'etre
[12:18] <oimon> bahdum ching
[12:20] <oimon> chocolate covered grapes are nice - when using a chocolate fountain
[12:21] <scoundrel50a> I spent 2 hours trying to work out myself why my touchpad wouldnt work, searched everywhere, and went over loads of different thigns from different forums, and nothing worked, it wouldnt even work in Windows. It was only when I went and tested pressing Fn and some of the F buttons at the top I discovered it had been turned off, and pnd pressing Fn and F6 I think it is, turned it back on again. By that time, I was prepared to throw the thin
[12:21] <scoundrel50a> g oput
[12:22] <oimon> scoundrel50a: is there a loco near you? if you're keen to learn then generally ubuntu usrs are happy to help, and it's so much easier and quicker IRL
[12:22] <scoundrel50a> I still havent managed to work out why I cant get rid of those updates, from this morning, which is interfering in my updates process, so i am hoping that sometime, in some future updates that will fix itself or I';m screwed again
[12:23] <oimon> scoundrel50a: i meant a LUG (linux user group)..although some of them tend to spend their time drinking beer it seems ;)
[12:24] <scoundrel50a> That is what happened the one I went too, most of the time it was just drinking
[12:25] <popey> scoundrel50a: why are you even trying to install linux-generic linux-headers-generic linux-image-generic?
[12:25] <scoundrel50a> I have thought about going to the Natty London party round the corner from me to see if somebody can get it to work there
[12:25] <popey> scoundrel50a: hang on. stop a moment
[12:25] <popey> scoundrel50a: please do this:-
[12:25] <popey> sudo dpkg --configure -a
[12:25] <scoundrel50a> popey, it appeared in an update I got this morning,
[12:25] <popey> NOTE: double minus sign in front of configure
[12:26] <popey> i looked at your pastebin and you typed it incorrectly
[12:26] <popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/596455/
[12:26] <scoundrel50a> I am not trying to do it deliberately
[12:26] <popey> can you please sudo dpkg --configure -a
[12:26] <popey> and pastebin the output
[12:27] <shauno> so I looked up the sounder archives to see if it was as bad as claimed.  the first thead I pulled out quickly degenerated from why unity is the antichrist, to people's various viewpoints on the israelli government.  wowzers.  and I thought I was bad.
[12:27] <scoundrel50a> popey: nothing happened
[12:28] <scoundrel50a> popey:http://paste.ubuntu.com/596499/
[12:30] <oimon> shauno: i looked it up and there was a discussion about anti-semitism and the linux mint project
[12:30] <shauno> yeah, I believe this is the same thread (or hope there's not more than one, rather)
[12:31] <shauno> it was just the first big thread I spotted in the archives.  but if I'm to tar it with the first brush I find, seems it's going to be no real loss
[12:31] <oimon> it's closing anyway
[12:31] <popey> ok good scoundrel50a
[12:31] <popey> scoundrel50a: next, "sudo apt-get update"
[12:31] <oimon> i just received a pointless email from tfl telling me to keep my password safe
[12:31] <popey> scoundrel50a: please do that
[12:32] <scoundrel50a> ok
[12:32] <scoundrel50a> done that
[12:32] <popey> pastebin?
[12:32] <scoundrel50a> do you want a pastebin of it?
[12:33] <scoundrel50a> sorry didnt see
[12:33] <scoundrel50a> http://paste.ubuntu.com/596505/
[12:34] <popey> good. now this:-
[12:34] <popey> sudo apt-get dist-upgrade
[12:34] <popey> and pls pastebin
[12:35] <scoundrel50a> ok, that changed something, more stuff updating
[12:35] <scoundrel50a> http://paste.ubuntu.com/596508/
[12:36] <scoundrel50a> didnt rem,ove it from the Update Manager though
[12:37] <popey> close update manager
[12:37] <popey> now do this:-
[12:37] <scoundrel50a> ok
[12:37] <popey> dpkg -l "linux-image*"
[12:37] <popey> and pastebin
[12:39] <scoundrel50a> popey: http://paste.ubuntu.com/596510/
[12:39] <popey> can you do it again with a wider terminal please
[12:39] <popey> it's truncated width wise
[12:39] <popey> actually do this instead
[12:40] <popey> dpkg -l "linux-*"
[12:41] <scoundrel50a> popey:http://paste.ubuntu.com/596516/ hope that woprks better
[12:42] <bigcalm> directhex: finished Portal 2 yet?
[12:42] <directhex> not yewt
[12:43] <bigcalm> Tis much fun
[12:43] <bigcalm> Not let down by the ending
[12:43] <scoundrel50a> need a pee, brb
[12:43] <bigcalm> Will be good to play the co-op
[12:43] <bigcalm> scoundrel50a: is that something you usually anouce?
[12:43] <bigcalm> :)
[12:45] <popey> scoundrel50a: I don't see what the issue is. packages being held back isn't a massive problem
[12:45] <popey> its generally not broken at all
[12:46] <scoundrel50a> I didnt know that. They appeared in the Update Manager, and give an error when you try to update via that.
[12:47] <scoundrel50a> which is what I posted earlier
[12:47] <oimon> i wonder if aptitude might be more verbose
[12:47] <oimon> e.g. sudo apt-get install aptitude;  sudo aptitude update && sudo aptitude safe-upgrade
[12:49] <popey> I'd recommend not giving people combined commands like that
[12:49] <popey> thats what led to the confusion earlier
[12:49] <popey> well, that and a typo
[12:51] <scoundrel50a> oimon: I added the commands one at a time into the terminal, and still after safe-upgrade, it says 3 not upgraded
[12:52] <scoundrel50a> I will wait to see if it does anything when I next get some updates in.
[12:52] <scoundrel50a> thank you
[12:54] <davmor2> scoundrel50a: if they're not installing it's for a reason the normal one is that there is a package missing.  If that's the case it won't install till the package is available for install.  It won't matter how many other packages get installed first till the missing one is there they will remain held back
[12:54] <popey> basically "dont worry about it" :D
[12:55] <scoundrel50a> ok, thankyou
[12:58] <popey> 12:57:54 <@rphwrk> for any joggler owners: http://birdslikewires.co.uk/articles/squeezeplay-for-joggler#articletop
[13:20] <brobostigon> good afternoon everyone.
[13:22] <brobostigon> any experience here with pac numbers and number porting?
[13:23] <oimon> brobostigon: didn't think there was a whole lot to it
[13:23] <brobostigon> oimon: inreference to the performance of networks doing it properly, and swiftly.
[13:24] <oimon> i switched from virgin to tmob, virgin gave me the number over the phone and also sent via letter 2 days after.
[13:24] <oimon> best case they will tell you or txt you, worst case a letter i guess
[13:24] <brobostigon> that is pretty quick.
[13:25] <oimon> brobostigon: who are you with?
[13:25] <brobostigon> oimon: o2.
[13:27] <oimon> i read that the OFCOM rule states they are obliged to do it within 2 business days.
[13:27] <brobostigon> yes, i read that also.
[13:27] <brobostigon> its good.
[13:31] <hamitron> my book on minix 2 has arrived \o/
[13:31] <brobostigon> :)
[13:32] <hamitron> so now I just need a 286 based machine to play with
[13:32] <hamitron> well, "need"
[13:32] <hamitron> guess it is more "wanting"
[13:34] <DJones> hamitron: Is there a www.antiquesRus.com website?
[13:35] <hamitron> I checked ebay, and 286 "vintage" machines cost loads
[13:35] <DJones> freecycle?
[13:35] <hamitron> the half local freecycle is now under some other thing
[13:36] <hamitron> but tbh, carrying a comp 15 miles is hard work
[13:36] <DJones> True, specially when the old 286's weren't exactly small
[13:37] <hamitron> I threw one away not long ago :/
[13:37] <hamitron> tbh, I'm not sure I want an old 286 anyway
[13:37] <hamitron> I'd rather get something new, but ultra low power
[13:37] <hamitron> and cheap
[13:37] <hamitron> :)
[13:38] <hamitron> I suppose I could use my 200mhz sis cpu thin client for it
[13:38] <hamitron> but I'd be spoilt with 64mb ram
[13:41] <hamitron> maybe use a Zet processor
[13:41] <hamitron> :D
[13:42] <Myrtti> oh bllaaaaa I cut myself trying to open a jar or marinated artichokes... the jar had a glass shard glued on it by some gunk and I cut my thumb quite deep
[13:42] <shauno> why would they glue glass onto artichokes?
[13:43] <shauno> :(
[13:43] <DJones> You're not having a good time lately
[13:43] <Myrtti> recently I've had quite good time
[13:43] <Myrtti> lately, no
[13:43]  * hamitron is glad he only opened a safe bag with bacon in earlier
[13:46] <DJones> I got a few cuts last night getting a hdd out of an old sky receiver, more hidden screws than at screwfix
[13:47] <hamitron> :/
[13:48] <oimon> my baby son was crying and holding his leg the other day. i took off his new trousers and found a deep scratc. then i found a sharp pin from a security tag that Next had kindly left in the jeans, pointing inwards.
[13:48] <brobostigon> :(
[13:48] <hamitron> I reckon the deaths in factorys in china has nothing to do with the working conditions... it is the dangerously poor quality equipment
[13:48] <hamitron> ;)
[13:49] <oimon> maybe they have unsafe window latches, you mean?
[13:49] <oimon> do they commit suicide at the factory, or at home?
[13:50] <hamitron> it is all DJones's Sky Boxes fault
[13:50] <DJones> hamitron: Agreed
[13:50] <hamitron> and DJones.... you supported a company doing this, buying such junk ;D
[13:51] <hamitron> as do most of us :(
[13:51] <DJones> At least I've ended up with a 300Gb hdd to stick in a computer
[13:51] <hamitron> my topup tv box only had 160Gb :/
[13:52] <oimon> are we still supposed to hate rupert murdoch or is he OK now?
[13:52] <hamitron> hate away :)
[13:52] <oimon> i can never keep up with the who's evil lists
[13:52] <hamitron> just make sure you hate everyone equally
[13:52] <hamitron> ;)
[13:53] <czajkowski> ivanka: did you get sorted yesterday ok?
[13:53] <shauno> I'm still reading thru that terribad thread on -sounder.  hating everyone equally is coming very easy atm
[13:54] <DJones> shauno: Thats a week of your life you'll never get back
[13:54] <shauno> it's okay!  I'm on the clock :)
[13:54] <oimon> shauno: so are we allowed to use linux mint or not :P
[13:55] <shauno> oimon: I'm not sure, but I just learnt a new work.  ignosticism!
[13:55] <shauno> er, *word
[13:55] <popey> http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/server-storage/asr/documentation/fault-coverage-ilom-337688.pdf
[13:55] <popey> bah, oops
[13:56] <oimon> i guess if you don't have a strong opinion about israel, it doesn't matter :)
[13:56] <hamitron> what has happened with israel?
[13:56] <hamitron> or linux mint
[13:57] <shauno> hamitron: you're better off not knowing really.  this list really isn't sane. I'm just paying far too attention to car crashes, I think
[13:58] <oimon> yeah, more like chucking bricks in greenhouses
[13:58] <oimon> hate is contagious
[13:58] <hamitron> I hate and complain about everything anyway
[13:59] <oimon> even haters of hate, hate haters
[13:59] <MooDoo> i hate this channel :D
[13:59] <davmor2> oimon: let me get this straight you hate haters of hate?
[13:59] <hamitron> MooDoo: me too sometimes :)
[13:59] <shauno> come on guys - I can't do this in two windows at once!
[13:59] <oimon> shauno: where else? offtopic?
[14:00] <DJones> Perhaps there should be a #ubuntu-sounder so people can hate each otehr in real time
[14:00]  * DJones withdraws that suggestion as a really bad idea
[14:00] <oimon> i've heard of that irc channel..trying to remmeber the name
[14:01] <MooDoo> DJones: there you do, sorted :)
[14:01] <shauno> from what I gather, there should be an #ubuntu-sounder, containing a bot who g:lines anyone who thinks entering is a good idea :/
[14:01] <hamitron> there is little point in hating hate and other things for the sake of it.... I like the productive kind
[14:01] <hamitron> haha shauno
[14:01] <MooDoo> #ubuntu-sounder created as requested ;)
[14:02] <shauno> NooDoo!
[14:02] <MooDoo> :D
[14:02] <MooDoo> and i'm ops mwaahahahahahahahah :D
[14:02] <oimon> change of topic - what/who do you love?
[14:02] <oimon> food love: worcester sauce twiglets, ribena, crisps, after eight mints :D
[14:03] <shauno> oh man.   I found these brownies at tesco.  some short, eurocentric name with dots on it.  this is my new love.
[14:03] <oimon> my wife is making me a custom-made easter egg this year
[14:03] <oimon> made of dark chocolate and peppermint oil
[14:03] <shauno> I really can't remember the name.  it was the kinda thing ikea would name brownies.  but they were goooood
[14:04] <hamitron> poo slabs?
[14:05] <hamitron> slab-o-poo
[14:05] <oimon> poovik
[14:05] <oimon> turdslab sounds rather nordic
[14:06] <hamitron> haha
[14:06] <MooDoo> wow ubuntu-sounder registered over 5 years ago :)
[14:06] <shauno> ül, or öl, or something
[14:06] <popey> o_O
[14:06] <shauno> I remember the diacritic but not the word :(  I'm destined to spend an evening walking around tesco making strange noises at the staff, trying to find them again
[14:06] <popey> MooDoo: yeah, it was one of the first lists
[14:07] <oimon> gu?
[14:07] <oimon> http://www.tesco.com/groceries/Product/Details/?id=267319756
[14:07] <shauno> yes!
[14:08] <oimon> what's nice is the gu pots of chocolate mousse that you heat up, and you get to keep the glass ramekins they come in
[14:08] <oimon> look like those brownies require eating with cream
[14:09] <shauno> they require eating with the door closed so no-one else discovers them
[14:10] <shauno> whoever thought they should be individually wrapped was a hopeless optimist.
[14:10] <popey> heh
[14:11] <shauno> and this thread is truely epic.  I've got as far as them discussing whether carl sagan "had a clue"
[14:12] <oimon> i brought home-made cupcakes to work today. it turns out that if you put sprinkles on the top, they get eaten faster
[14:15] <shauno> try putting bacon on top ;)
[14:15] <popey> bacon sprinkles
[14:15] <popey> mmmmmmm


[14:16] <oimon> subway...turkey ham lol
[14:16] <shauno> I've put bacon in choc-chip cookies.  it caramelizes.  I think it could work on cupcakes too
[14:16]  * oimon vomits
[14:17]  * hamitron spanks shauno
[14:17] <hamitron> :/
[14:18] <Myrtti> I think it's a shame Mignon eggs aren't sold too widely
[14:18] <Myrtti> they're the food of kings
[14:19] <hamitron> Myrtti: do you eat anything "normal"? ;)
[14:19] <Myrtti> http://www.suomikauppa.fi/product_info.php?language=en&products_id=2775 omnomnom
[14:19] <Myrtti> hamitron: is pasta with marinated artichokes normal?
[14:21] <hamitron> no
[14:21] <hamitron> ;/
[14:21] <Myrtti> oh
[14:21] <Myrtti> I had a hamburger yesterday
[14:21] <hamitron> but pasta isn't
[14:21] <oimon> me too, first one in over a year
[14:22] <hamitron> hamburger is normal :)
[14:22] <Myrtti> mmmm mignon egg
[14:22] <hamitron> tbh, the egg does sound nice
[14:23] <hamitron> but a row of chocolate sounds easier to eat
[14:24] <Myrtti> mignon egg isn't chocolate per se
[14:25] <hamitron> you throw the shell away....
[14:25] <hamitron> don't ya?
[14:26] <Myrtti> well, it is a real egg shell, so yeah
[14:27] <hamitron> how do they seal the hole drilled in the shell?
[14:29] <Myrtti> "The hole in the shell is ... plugged with a mixture ... consisting of sugar and a small amount of ... rice protein"
[14:29] <oimon> i.e. polyfilla
[14:30] <hamitron> :))
[14:30] <Myrtti> I always thought it was meringue of sorts but I guess it's not
[14:31] <dogmatic69> anyone know of any decent employment agencies? work is looking for a new php dev... desperate times
[14:32] <seeker> Put your CV on monster
[14:32]  * DJones wonders what they do with raw egg...Army rationed powdered scambled egg?
[14:32] <dogmatic69> i dont want a job, need another dev
[14:32] <seeker> I did about 2 years ago, stating that I didn't want to do web dev
[14:32] <dogmatic69> plus i dont use CV's ;)
[14:32] <seeker> Ah, sorry
[14:32] <seeker> Have you tried looking on monster?
[14:32] <seeker> :P
[14:32] <dogmatic69> lol
[14:33] <oimon> don't use CVs?
[14:34] <seeker> I put my CV on there overt 2 years ago, and said that I don't want web dev
[14:34] <dogmatic69> cv's are pretty much pointless
[14:34] <Myrtti> linkedin.com?
[14:34] <seeker> Im still getting weekly emails telling me about web dev jobs that need filling
[14:34] <oimon> dogmatic69: pointless unless you wanna hear what qualifications and experience someone has before intreviewing them
[14:35] <dogmatic69> oimon: ye, and want to read all the crap and lies people put in them
[14:36] <dogmatic69> or what some employment agent hacked it with stuff you know nothing of
[14:36] <seeker> dogmatic69: How do you find people to interview?
[14:37] <dogmatic69> seeker: user groups etc
[14:37] <shauno> he asks in here :)
[14:37] <dogmatic69> shauno: will do when we need a sys admin :D
[14:37] <seeker> I think you are probably limiting your search space a little
[14:37] <oimon> heh
[14:38] <dogmatic69> seeker: agents for the most part will bring .net developers when you ask for php developers
[14:39] <seeker> Throw those ones in the bin then
[14:39] <oimon> i think we've been through all this before. there are good guys and bad guys..actually i'm told there are good guys but i haven't found them before :)
[14:39] <seeker> Just because an agent gives you a CV doesn't mean you have to employ them
[14:44] <brobostigon> i think i will be going with three, their signal is better than o2, and also having unlimited data, and gives me more texts, and inclusive voice, which i didnt get with o2.
[14:46] <stetho> I live in South London. Three's signal is patchy at best.
[14:47] <stetho> It might be different where you are.
[14:47] <brobostigon> i did tests, and in most places here in banbury, the signal is singnificantly better.
[14:48] <stetho> And in the current financial climate people aren't looking for jobs. We've got 26 open jobs in the UK, 4 in my team alone.
[14:48] <brobostigon> stetho: can i ask where, and what company.
[14:49] <brobostigon> stetho: i am looking for a job,
[14:50] <stetho> West London. Company called Shazam
[14:51] <brobostigon> yes, i have heard of.
[14:51] <popey> stetho: if they're linuxy jobs, please consider posting them to the linuxjobs mailing list
[14:51] <Myrtti> I've heard of a few shazams
[14:51] <popey> https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/linuxjobs
[14:52] <Myrtti> I guess this is "SHAZAM is a powerful software package for econometric and statistical analysis."
[14:53] <Myrtti> or is it the other
[14:53] <directhex> stetho, the music tagginc company?
[14:53] <stetho> Myrtti: It is, but that's not us. http://www.shazam.com
[14:53] <directhex> so "yes" then
[14:54] <Myrtti> oh well, doesn't matter which it is, I don't bother applying anyway - I bet the telecommuting options are low to nonexistant anyway
[14:55] <directhex> i telecommute
[14:55] <directhex> except on wednesdays
[14:55] <stetho> Yeah, as a technology company with offices in 6 countries the last thing we want is people telecommuting.
[14:56] <seeker> stetho: There are companies with offices in far more countries than that which prefer you not to telecommute if possible
[14:56] <stetho> Not us. I work with people I've still never met. :-)
[14:56] <directhex> we have the cambridge office and montreal office. i'm in cambs today
[14:57] <seeker> Where do you live?
[14:57] <Myrtti> wednesdays are cake days?
[14:57] <Myrtti> or steak days?
[14:57] <directhex> Myrtti, wednesdays are "local support" days
[14:57] <directhex> otherwise i work from home
[14:57] <Myrtti> right
[14:59] <stetho> I used to work for a company that had "Frosty Fridays" (ice creams) and "Thirsty Thursdays" (Beer) - Wednesday was always a disappointment. "Timbits Wednesdays" just didn't have the same ring to it.
[14:59] <seeker> directhex: Whereabouts do you live?
[15:00] <popey> I worked somewhere where we had "five pint friday"
[15:00] <popey> not every friday :D
[15:00] <brobostigon> :)
[15:00] <directhex> seeker, banbury, so about 2 hours west of cambs
[15:00] <stetho> That sounds more like a challenge than a perk.
[15:00] <DJones> Yuch, that five pints was horrible fake milk
[15:13] <Azelphur> I'm kinda being evil to the amazon reseller that's messing me about with microsd cards now
[15:13] <Azelphur> http://ietherpad.com/mhRUYreMyz opinions? :P
[15:15] <Azelphur> yay for free grammafix :p
[15:17] <Myrtti> the first paragraph makes a limited amount of sense
[15:17] <Myrtti> word escalate is repeated a bit too much
[15:17] <Azelphur> yea, I use escalate way too much xD
[15:18] <MartijnVdS> http://jenlars.mu.nu/dilbert_escalate.gif
[15:19] <Azelphur> Myrtti: better? :D
[15:19] <Myrtti> yeah, a bit
[15:19] <Azelphur> Myrtti: on amazon the email is attached to an item, so when I say this item they know what I mean
[15:20] <shauno> I believe the word you're looking shibboleet ;)
[15:20] <Myrtti> Azelphur: it's the "I, I've, I've" that I find confusing
[15:20] <Azelphur> MartijnVdS: xD
[15:20] <Azelphur> *shrug* not sure how I could fix that :D
[15:20]  * Azelphur failed english \o/
[15:22] <Azelphur> indeed :P
[15:22] <Myrtti> I feel somewhat out of my league tho
[15:23] <Azelphur> whys that :o
[15:23] <Myrtti> feels strange to be correcting the language of a native speaker
[15:23] <Azelphur> hahaha
[15:23] <Azelphur> Myrtti: you'd be surprised how often non-natives correct my English, it's terrible and always has been :)
[15:23] <DJones> A non-native speaker probably has a better grasp of the proper language/grammer rather than the slang/shortcuts that a native user would use
[15:24] <Azelphur> indeed
[15:24] <Myrtti> irregular verbs etc...
[15:24] <Myrtti> although I have to confess that the only time I've cheated in a test was for Finnish exam
[15:24] <MartijnVdS> I think we're worse at both :P
[15:24] <Azelphur> alright then gonna send that :p
[15:25] <MartijnVdS> Most UK English slang I know I've learned from here :)
[15:25] <Azelphur> grumpy emails away \o/
[15:25] <MartijnVdS> oh and Lugradio back in the day
[15:25] <Myrtti> we had a test where we had to conjugate words according to their tense - so "conjugate the word house to singular inessive"
[15:26] <Myrtti> absolutely pointless and I have no regrets in cheating in that exam, it was one of the most useless of my 12 years of school
[15:26] <Myrtti> if not the useless
[15:26] <Azelphur> that's sent \o/
[15:27] <Azelphur> I'm usually quite friendly when it comes to issues with online trading but when you ignore my calls and emails repeatedly I get mad :p
[15:27] <shauno> same, really.  I'll work with them until it's resolved, but when they stop doing the same, revert to excrement from a great height.
[15:28] <Azelphur> indeed
[15:28] <hamitron> :D
[15:29] <hamitron> I'm still waiting for a 9V transformer from china :/
[15:30] <popey> haha
[15:30] <popey> you make pains to use the least power and recycle and then get a <1KG item shipped from china?
[15:30] <shauno> china gets annoying .. you have even less options when it stops going the way you expect
[15:30] <popey> :)
[15:30] <davmor2> hamitron: why do that, just grab a hold of bumblebee or optimus they're much bigger transformers
[15:31] <hamitron> popey: cost
[15:31] <hamitron> popey: and most things sold here have already been shipped anyway
[15:32] <hamitron> I got some bulbs for my scalextric cars too
[15:32] <hamitron> pack of 100 from china was £6
[15:32] <hamitron> pack of 2 in the UK was £10
[15:34] <popey> ouch
[15:34] <oimon> mmm scalextric
[15:34] <shauno> you have 50 cars?
[15:35] <hamitron> official scalextric ones were £15 for 2
[15:35] <oimon> regretting giving my nigel mansell canon willians honda away a couple of years back
[15:35] <hamitron> no, I only have maybe 30
[15:35] <hamitron> but I now have spares when needed
[15:35] <davmor2> who needs light for slot cars
[15:35] <popey> for driving in the dark silly rabbit!
[15:35] <hamitron> only needed 3 bulbs :)
[15:35] <bigcalm> davmor2: do you have a hobby you spend lots of time and money on?
[15:35] <hamitron> yeh damn it
[15:36] <davmor2> bigcalm: Nope
[15:36] <hamitron> endurance races.... you gotta have lights
[15:36] <bigcalm> davmor2: then I can see why you don't understand
[15:36] <hamitron> I got a dimmer switch for my race room on timer ;)
[15:36] <oimon> man i'd love to have a go on some scalextric right now
[15:37] <oimon> shame all my mates got grown up hobbies
[15:37] <davmor2> bigcalm: I have lots of expensive hobbies that I spend no money on :D
[15:37]  * oimon still makes airfix
[15:37] <hamitron> and my laptop monitors car fuel for pit stops
[15:37] <bigcalm> I had TCR as a kid. I liked making jumps (can't do that with slot cars)
[15:38] <hamitron> TCR?
[15:38] <bigcalm> Total Control Racing
[15:38] <hamitron> ah
[15:38] <hamitron> I want some more RC cars :/
[15:39] <hamitron> but things can get out of hand, when you spend too much on toys
[15:43] <DJones> hamitron: This is getting out hand with r/c toys
[15:43] <DJones> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bH94Mcajr4
[15:44] <hamitron> haha
[15:44] <hamitron> I want one !!!!!!!!!
[15:44] <hamitron> my truck is smaller :(
[15:44] <oimon> he doesn't show his face cos he's embarrassed
[15:45] <hamitron> tbh, I've really taken to steam atm
[15:45] <popey> puff puff puff puff
[15:45] <popey> CHOO CHOO!
[15:45] <hamitron> I love the smell :D
[15:45] <popey> yeah, me too
[15:45] <popey> there's some canal boats outside work, i love the smell as I walk home
[15:46] <hamitron> maybe a 1:12 scale steam train to go around the garden
[15:46] <hamitron> I've not convinced my parents yet
[15:46] <hamitron> :/
[15:47] <popey> anyone know of a text editor on windows (sorry) that can do code folding for bash files? :)
[15:47] <dogmatic69> popey: notepad ++ is awesome
[15:48] <dogmatic69> not sure on your requirements though
[15:49] <hamitron> I can't find bash in notepad++
[15:49] <hamitron> :/
[15:49] <gord> is it easy to run bash stuff on windows?
[15:50] <hamitron> never tried tbh
[15:50] <hamitron> I use notepad++ to edit config files and scripts, then send them to linux comps
[15:52] <shauno> I want to say emacs, but I can't bring myself to do it, even in jest :(
[15:53] <hamitron> :))
[15:53]  * oimon is setting up a FOG server in the hope of replacing acronis crud
[15:54]  * hamitron puts his new book on the shelf, hoping he will get some work done
[15:57] <Neoti> Hi All,
[15:58] <Neoti> just installed ubuntu 10.10 on a Toshiba satalite Pro M50 and when i log in i just get the background image and no menus etc.... but if i boot in to safe mode i get the menu and stuff.... can anyone help me... i have ran updates on the system but its not solved it .... any help ?
[15:58]  * brobostigon shakes fist at KMS.
[16:01] <brobostigon> gpu hang/lockup :(
[16:20] <Neoti> fixed my problem i think ... added radeon.modeset=0 in etc/default/grub to grub_cmd_linux_default...
[16:21] <dogmatic69> awesome, my super generic backup script worked on a new machine with out mods
[16:37] <brobostigon> so once anetwork gets mypac code, acording to ofcoms rules now, the transfer has to happen within24 hours, am i interpreting it correctly?
[16:47] <oimon> brobostigon: that was my experience
[16:47] <brobostigon> oimon: excellant, :)
[16:47] <oimon> you should get a text from the new network telling you that the switch has occurred
[16:47] <oimon> who are you switching to?
[16:47] <brobostigon> yes, they told me.
[16:48] <brobostigon> i deiced on three, due to their nice unimited internet, without fair usepolicy, andnice amount of texts and voice, for payg £15.
[16:49] <brobostigon> and my signal is better with them.
[16:49] <brobostigon> o2 has massive blackspots where idont want them.
[16:51] <brobostigon> i did my research the lastmonth or so,
[16:51] <brobostigon> and signal tests.
[16:54] <oimon> my 3g internet doesn't go fast enough to casuse FUP issues
[16:55] <brobostigon> when i have had to tether, when out adsl has been out, it has become rather bigger,
[16:57] <oimon> wondering whethre installing opera will help my 3g browsing speed
[17:01] <brobostigon> oimon: it will help abit, as all the traffic is compressed via opera's servers.
[17:01] <oimon> brobostigon: i was thinking that, just wondered if it worked in reality
[17:02] <oimon> must be some mobile opera users in here
[17:02] <brobostigon> oimon: not a clue. sorry.
[17:05] <davmor2> popey: you'll know this what the command to constantly view the end of a log I thought it was tail, is it watch or something like that?
[17:06] <oimon> tail -f
[17:07] <davmor2> oimon: thanks
[17:42] <mondoman712> hello?
[17:44] <mondoman712> hello?
[17:44] <gord> or is it me your looking for?
[17:45] <mondoman712> maybe
[17:45] <mondoman712> im having ubuntu trouble
[17:46] <mondoman712> i downloaded a program
[17:46] <mondoman712> (platinum arts sandbox game maker)
[17:46] <mondoman712> (on ubuntu 11.04 beta)
[17:46] <mondoman712> and i cant remove it
[17:46] <mondoman712> or install any other programs
[17:47] <directhex> pastebin the error.
[17:47] <mondoman712> there wasnt an error
[17:47] <mondoman712> it just doesnt
[17:47] <mondoman712> no error message
[17:48] <bigcalm> mondoman712: can you add / remove packages via the CLI?
[17:48] <mondoman712> nope
[17:48] <bigcalm> And there is no textual output at all after calling apt-get ?
[17:48] <mondoman712> it tells me to run a command which seems to try and uninstall this program
[17:48] <directhex> run "sudo apt-get -f install" in the terminal. pastebin the output.
[17:49] <mondoman712> E: Could not get lock /var/lib/dpkg/lock - open (11: Resource temporarily unavailable)
[17:49] <mondoman712> E: Unable to lock the administration directory (/var/lib/dpkg/), is another process using it?
[17:49] <directhex> you have synaptic still running, or another package manager, in another window
[17:50] <mondoman712> the sofware center
[17:50] <mondoman712> ill force quit it
[17:50] <popey> o_O
[17:50] <mondoman712> same output
[17:51] <mondoman712> :(
[17:51] <directhex> force quit? well, yeah, then you will still have a lock file
[17:51] <bigcalm> One might say "reboot the machine". But that's only if you've given up trying to fix things :)
[17:51] <directhex> sudo rm /var/lib/dpkg/lock
[17:52] <mondoman712> E: dpkg was interrupted, you must manually run 'sudo dpkg --configure -a' to correct the problem.
[17:52] <directhex> so run sudo dpkg --configure -a
[17:53] <mondoman712> E: dpkg was interrupted, you must manually run 'sudo dpkg --configure -a' to correct the problem.
[17:53] <mondoman712> sam@SAM:~$ sudo dpkg --configure -a
[17:53] <mondoman712> Setting up sandboxgamemaker (2.6.1+dfsg-3) ...
[17:53] <mondoman712> debconf: DbDriver "config": /var/cache/debconf/config.dat is locked by another process: Resource temporarily unavailable
[17:53] <mondoman712> dpkg: error processing sandboxgamemaker (--configure):
[17:53] <mondoman712>  subprocess installed post-installation script returned error exit status 1
[17:53] <mondoman712> Errors were encountered while processing:
[17:53] <mondoman712>  sandboxgamemaker
[17:53] <bigcalm> mondoman712: please use a pastebin
[17:53] <mondoman712> idk how
[17:53] <bigcalm> (if more than 2 lines of output)
[17:53] <bigcalm> !paste
[17:53] <directhex> yikes
[17:54] <mondoman712> umm
[17:54] <directhex> sudo fuser -v /var/cache/debconf/config.dat
[17:55] <mondoman712> ok
[17:56] <popey> i just tested installing that package on natty here and it installs fine
[17:56] <mondoman712> have you tried removing it?
[17:56] <directhex> popey, someone killed dpkg mid-flow. just a case of picking up the pieces now
[17:56] <popey> yup
[17:57] <popey> removed fine
[17:57] <popey> right
[17:57] <mondoman712> k
[17:59] <mondoman712> http://pastebin.com/dA623b5J
[18:00] <directhex> kill 2421
[18:00] <mondoman712> (output from sudo fuser -v /var/cache/debconf/config.dat)
[18:00] <directhex> sudo kill 2421, even
[18:00] <mondoman712> no outpu
[18:00] <mondoman712> t
[18:01] <directhex> mondoman712, sudo dpkg --configure -a ?
[18:02] <mondoman712> http://pastebin.com/SgbuQEZ2
[18:03] <directhex> mondoman712, um, you pressed ctrl-c
[18:03] <mondoman712> yeah
[18:03] <mondoman712> i tried to copy it
[18:03] <mondoman712> i'll run it again
[18:03] <directhex> ctrl-c is cancel.
[18:04] <mondoman712> its copy everywhere else
[18:04] <directhex> it's ctrl-c in GUI apps. it's been cancel in UNIX terminals since the 70s
[18:04] <mondoman712> umm ok
[18:04] <mondoman712> im running it again
[18:04] <bigcalm> In a terminal just highlight the text and it'll be coppied into the buffer
[18:04] <bigcalm> Middle click to paste
[18:05] <bigcalm> Time to drive
[18:06] <mondoman712> its saying its going to take just under an hour
[18:06] <mondoman712> ...
[18:08] <bigcalm> That's down to a) your connection b) their connection
[18:09] <mondoman712> probibly mine
[18:09] <mondoman712> cuz it sucks
[18:17] <mondoman712> http://pastebin.com/PVBZe72h
[18:19] <MartijnVdS> That's the THIRD time this cycle that Ubuntu resets my default browser to Firefox
[18:19] <MartijnVdS> without my consent
[18:19] <mondoman712> :(
[18:19] <mondoman712> firefox sucks
[18:19] <MartijnVdS> mondoman712: It's a good browser, but I prefer chromium
[18:19] <MartijnVdS> mondoman712: I think it's faster.
[18:20] <mondoman712> naaaa
[18:20] <mondoman712> opera

[18:20] <mondoman712> its faster than chrome
[18:20] <mondoman712> and has more features
[18:20] <MartijnVdS> mondoman712: I prefer my browser to work on most websites :P
[18:20] <mondoman712> opera does
[18:20] <MartijnVdS> not last time I tried
[18:20] <mondoman712> and if it doesnt you can tell the website you have firefox
[18:20] <mondoman712> and it works
[18:21] <mondoman712> :P
[18:21] <MartijnVdS> Pizza!
[18:22] <mondoman712> YAY!
[18:47] <shauno> woot.  home!
[18:51] <MartijnVdS> shauno: \o/
[18:59] <mondoman712> hello?
[19:00] <MartijnVdS> howdy
[19:01] <mondoman712> i need directhex
[19:02] <MartijnVdS> !ask
[19:02] <mondoman712> he was helping me earilier
[19:02] <MartijnVdS> Sure, but maybe someone else also knows :)
[19:02] <mondoman712> http://pastebin.com/7smte0Bw
[19:33] <ali1234> ok, i'm done with the rejoin spam now
[19:33] <ali1234> AlanBell: i found another twitter plugin for pidgin and empathy that is much better than the one in the repos
[19:33] <ali1234> it handles timeline as a multiuser chat, so it will probably suck in empathy
[19:34] <ali1234> since empathy's multiuser support is worthless
[19:34] <ali1234> but it makes it more like IRC so that's good
[19:34] <ali1234> i don't get highlighted on every message
[19:35] <ali1234> link: http://code.google.com/p/prpltwtr/
[19:43] <HazRPG> think I'm going to finally ditch the ol' server for ubuntu-server now!
[19:44] <brobostigon> good evening HazRPG :)
[19:44] <HazRPG> brobostigon: good evening :)
[19:44] <brobostigon> HazRPG: :)
[19:46] <HazRPG> hmm... is there a way I can backup some of my stuff to my VM?
[19:49] <dutchie> can you be more specific than "VM"?
[19:49] <HazRPG> dutchie: sure :)
[19:49] <dutchie> if you mean "VPS", then yes
[19:49] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG:
[19:49] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: \o/ dumping windows
[19:49] <dutchie> if you mean "machine i made in virtualbox", then the answer is "there is no point whatsoever"
[19:50] <HazRPG> Current Server: Windows 2003, Inside it is a VBox VM of ubuntu 10.10 currently only doing radvd. The server itself (windows), currently hosts httpd, mumble, mysql, etc
[19:51] <HazRPG> it has lots of other stuff, but nothing is important other than the mysql and httpd stuff
[19:51] <HazRPG> Been slowly trying to test new things out in the VM so that I can switch it over easily
[19:51] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: I'd get new hardware and install it the other way around
[19:51] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: Ubuntu with Windows in a kvm inside :)
[19:53] <HazRPG> question is... should I store the current website stuff straight to dropbox, or transfer it over to the VM... copy the VM to my actual workstation... test it to make sure everything is fine (get hash, etc)... then load up the VM inside of my workstation and proceed with the install on the server and move things as-and-when needed
[19:53] <ali1234> wat
[19:54] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: whatever works best for you
[19:54] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: dropbox might be annoying if it's huge
[19:54] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: or not-for-American-eyes :)
[19:55] <HazRPG> all its hosting is this mainly: www.hazrpg.co.uk and mc.hazrpg.co.uk
[19:55] <MartijnVdS> move to vps :)
[19:55] <MartijnVdS> also, make backups before moving stuff
[19:55] <HazRPG> they're not proper websites though lol, they're just testbed stuff really
[19:55] <MartijnVdS> and make sure  you can always take a "step back"
[19:56] <HazRPG> heh, even have my old assignment on here xD www.quickbedz.co.cc
[19:56] <AlanBell> thanks ali1234 I will have a look at that later
[19:56] <HazRPG> ah crap apparently that domain has gone :P
[19:57] <HazRPG> MartijnVdS: hmm... can kvm be used by itself? Or does it have to be placed inside something first?
[19:58] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: it runs on a linux kernel/system
[19:59]  * HazRPG trying to work out the best way to backup mysql :/
[19:59] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: mysqldump
[19:59] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.1/en/mysqldump.html
[20:01] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: also, next time, set up PostgreSQL instead of MySQL :P
[20:02]  * HazRPG is slightly scare of doing this
[20:02] <HazRPG> (the merge)
[20:02] <HazRPG> (or switch) lol
[20:03] <dwatkins> I use mysqldump to backup a wordpress database, it creates a nice easily processed text file.
[20:03] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: The Migration
[20:03] <HazRPG> MartijnVdS: indeedy
[20:03] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: that's why I said: try it first on some separate hardware :)
[20:04] <dwatkins> MartijnVdS: what is PostgreSQL better at compared to MySQL, I'm curious.
[20:04] <MartijnVdS> dwatkins: Sanity :)
[20:04] <HazRPG> means going into the shed and grabbing some old computers out... too lazy
[20:04] <dwatkins> MartijnVdS: ah ok :)
[20:04] <MartijnVdS> dwatkins: (and data integrity)
[20:04] <MartijnVdS> dwatkins: and SQL standard compliance
[20:04] <dwatkins> always sanitise...
[20:04] <dwatkins> oh right, I didn't realise mysql was bad at being compliant
[20:04] <MartijnVdS> dwatkins: sure, but allowing 30th of February? or 00-00-0000?
[20:05] <dwatkins> I see what you mean, MartijnVdS.
[20:05] <MartijnVdS> also, referential integrity is.. "interesting" and has weird corner cases in MySQL
[20:05] <MartijnVdS> everything works properly (and according to SQL spec) in PostgreSQL
[20:06] <dwatkins> I guess I have a lot to learn about databases, I didn't know that phrase.
[20:07] <dwatkins> Back later, I have to cook and learn about referential integrity... ;)
[20:09] <MartijnVdS> dwatkins: :)
[20:23] <Laney> can anyone recommend an arduino starter kit?
[20:24] <HazRPG> ooo, just connected to my current windows server with workbench...
[20:24] <HazRPG> could I do a dump this way?
[20:29] <hamitron> Laney: Azelphur got one
[20:30] <willy1977> evening.
[20:31] <AlanBell> Laney: for you or someone else?
[20:33] <Laney> AlanBell: for me and the missus to play with
[20:33] <hamitron> there are things already available on the market.....
[20:33] <hamitron> ;/
[20:34] <Laney> what?
[20:34] <hamitron> sorry
[20:34] <willy1977> lol
[20:35] <AlanBell> Laney: maybe go for the lillypad and make wearable stuff
[20:37] <Laney> that's a good idea
[20:37] <Laney> there's good stuff on instructables
[20:39] <AlanBell> I think the soft circuits/wearable stuff is an interesting thing anyway because then you end up with stuff you couldn't buy
[20:39] <MartijnVdS> or wash 8-)
[20:39] <AlanBell> that too :)
[20:40] <DJones> Hmmh, is there a way in unity on natty of having the menu bar on the left not autohide on workspaces 2,3,4 etc?
[20:40] <AlanBell> a lot of arduino projects end up being devices you can get smaller, cheaper and better quality from the far east on ebay
[20:42] <DJones> Found it
[21:06] <hewbass> Hi all -- quick Unity related question (am running Natty Beta) : what is alt-tab meant to look like (I get a very gnome2 looking selection of running applications, which jars a bit when compared to the beauty of the rest of unity or super-w or super-s...) Just want to check to see if I have some old compiz settings that might be upsetting things
[21:06] <HazRPG> totally hyped!
[21:07] <HazRPG> Currently backing up EVERYTHING!
[21:08] <DJones> hewbass: I get a screen with a small(ish) representation of each app that I've got running
[21:08] <HazRPG> now I just need to find a way to backup my unfinished projects from SVN...
[21:09] <HazRPG> (shows how much I knew back when I picked SVN 4 years ago!)
[21:09] <AlanBell> hewbass: it is meant to look prettier than that
[21:10] <hewbass> DJones: thanks. I guess that is the same as I get. Maybe I am getting overcritical... I just checked again and I am getting active thumbnails of the windows
[21:12] <hewbass> AlanBell: maybe I am being a bit critical: perhaps it does not look as good as super-w because it displays the windows in less space...
[21:12] <AlanBell> I will try and take a screenshot
[21:13]  * hewbass steps out for a moment...
[21:14] <DJones> hewbass: Just realised, thats not what I get, my keyboard is slightly odd in that I have to press fn+f2 to get the same effect, if I press alt + fn+f2, I get the run dialog
[21:14] <DJones> Arg, wrong keys anyway
[21:14] <AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/alttab.png
[21:14] <AlanBell> hewbass: ^^
[21:20] <hewbass> AlanBell: OK-- I am being too critical, and possibly have too many windows open (for alt-tab to look nice). Thanks!
[21:20] <DJones> Thats similar to what I get
[21:22] <popey> evening all
[21:22] <AlanBell> yeah, it isn't exciting, but there are window images, window icons, drop shadows on things etc.
[21:23] <AlanBell> tried super+tab?
[21:23] <exobuzz> evenin popey et al
[21:24] <AlanBell> and it does slide the list along and bring up the relevant window as it does it and adjust opacity
[21:24] <DJones> super+tab does nothing on mine
[21:25] <AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/supertab.png
[21:25] <willy1977> Grammar question... <snip> the business model in effect/affect at the time. so Efffect or Affect?
[21:26] <AlanBell> effect
[21:26] <DJones> Heh, looks good, possibly a setting in compiz settings needs changing on mine, pretty much a fresh install so I've not played with much yet
[21:26] <AlanBell> DJones: yeah I might have turned on shift switcher or something
[21:27] <willy1977> AlanBell: thanks - I thought it was but always bugger those two up...
[21:28] <HazRPG> man I love having a gigabit lan :D
[21:28] <HazRPG> transfer of 4.7GB VM file... 1minute :)
[21:28] <DJones> Yep that was it shift switcher
[21:29] <hewbass> AlanBell: DJones: super-tab does nothing on mine either
[21:29] <DJones> That is beautiful as a display effect
[21:29]  * DJones sheds a tear at the beauty
[21:29] <hewbass> It is more what I was expecting from alt-tab to be honest.
[21:30] <DJones> hewbass: Just enabled the shift switcher in compiz config settings & it works for me
[21:31] <AlanBell> I wonder if gord knows why shift switcher isn't on by default
[21:32] <AlanBell> as I understand it win+tab does a kind of 3d effect thing on vista/windows 7
[21:32] <hewbass> Bah- can't install compiz config due to unmet dependencies. I may have busted something earlier.
[21:33] <AlanBell> I wonder if anyone here has got a friend who might have windows installed who can check that
[21:33] <hewbass> AlanBell: it's possible it might be meant to be, but I have fiddled with compiz-settings in the past. May have left some old configuration that does not quite work (hence the original question)
[21:34] <DJones> AlanBell: Give me a minute or two, I'll reboot & have a look
[21:35] <AlanBell> well I know I turned it on, but I also did unity --reset which I thought moved every compiz setting to what the design team decided to choose was best for everyone
[21:36] <willy1977> sorry missed that, what's the win7/vespa query?
[21:36] <AlanBell> willy1977: what does super+tab do?
[21:37] <willy1977> a 3d task switcher.
[21:37] <KINGOFSWORDS> hi
[21:37] <AlanBell> so like compiz shift switcher, but less awesome?
[21:37] <willy1977> I can fire up a laptop and get a screenshot... if it'll help?
[21:38] <DJones> AlanBell: Yes, very similar (super+tab)
[21:39] <AlanBell> Aero flip 3d they call it
[21:39] <willy1977> yep...
[21:39] <HazRPG> windows doesn't like copying files around does it :/
[21:39] <AlanBell> so by default in unity super+tab does *nothing* but it could do the same as an ex-windows user might expect, only better
[21:40] <DJones> But caused putty to disappear & not reappear
[21:40] <willy1977> http://res1.windows.microsoft.com/resbox/en/Windows%207/main/c/7/c7507caf-e2f4-48c9-9e68-eb124737de9d/c7507caf-e2f4-48c9-9e68-eb124737de9d.jpg
[21:40] <HazRPG> apparently its going to take 144mins, 13mins, 44mins, 32mins... to finish
[21:40] <AlanBell> this seems intentionally sub-optimal
[21:40] <DJones> Ugh, win 7 pile of ......
[21:41] <HazRPG> I don't think the mod4+tab should ever do that personally :/
[21:41] <willy1977> HazRPG: aahhhhhhhhhh Microsoft time
[21:44] <Azelphur> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/screenshots/April%202011/2011-04-20_21.32.01.png suddenly random pink cobblestone in minecraft? o.O
[21:44] <popey> hah
[21:45] <Azelphur> popey: I'm on an unmodified 1.4 client and I'm on SMP haha, how on earth does that happen xD
[21:46]  * popey jumps on his private server for a bit
[21:46]  * AlanBell asks about unity compiz defaults in #ayatana
[21:46] <HazRPG> willy1977: T_T sadly
[21:46] <HazRPG> willy1977: currently migrating my server to ubuntu-server, but I need to get everything off it in a state so that I can just shove it back into ubuntu-server :P
[21:52] <hewbass> Oops. That did not quite go to plan.
[21:56] <willy1977> HazRPG: makes sense... I installed ubuntu server at the weekend here thinking of setting up a few things e.g. DNS and DHCP server both over kill for a couple of machines but a good learning experience with the server version ;)
[21:56] <hewbass> Bother. I am unable to set the shift-switcher in unity without killing compiz/unity...
[21:58]  * hewbass has to go to bed now
[21:58] <scoundrel50a> I know you probably dont want to hear this, but that problem I had this morning with the kernels not updating, I did a apt-get update and apt-get dist-upgrade. and its fixed it,
[22:02] <willy1977> well thanks to the grammar master my blog post is finished my ramblings on the android honeycomb debate...can think about bed now ;)
[22:11] <HazRPG> woo, time for a beer... some indian food... while I wait for this to backup 80GB of stuff :/
[22:11] <HazRPG> willy1977: yeah, I've been having great fun with my VM of ubuntu-server inside windows recently :) - great learning experience :)
[22:17] <brobostigon> http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/v2.6.39-rc4-oneiric/
[22:17] <brobostigon> the we go, next ubuntu, kernel starting to take shape.
[22:41]  * HazRPG goes to check backups
[22:48] <HazRPG> if I cry out in pain in the next couple of hours, its because I've done something horribly wrong :/
[22:48]  * HazRPG preps up a ubuntu-server disc
[22:49] <brobostigon> ok, HazRPG  i will try and remember.
[22:50] <HazRPG> typical... thought I had an ubuntu-server disc pre-made :/
[22:50] <HazRPG> brobostigon: 10.10 should be okay right?
[22:51] <brobostigon> HazRPG: i dont know, as a server, but as a desktop, it is considered stable.
[23:14] <brobostigon> good night everyone, sleep well.
[23:16] <HazRPG> brobostigon: night dude, sleep well
[23:16] <brobostigon> HazRPG: good night, sleep well.
[23:18] <HazRPG> Well I've done everything I could possibly do... only one thing left right? (this thing hasn't been turned off in 2 years!)
[23:40] <Azelphur> ali1234: you know a lot about ARM right? have you seen the Smartbook? it looks pretty interesting.
[23:40] <Azelphur> I'm not sure how it'd perform though :p
[23:44] <ali1234> Azelphur: it's pointless
[23:45] <ali1234> who ise going to take their computer apart and turn it into a phone? and why?
[23:45] <Azelphur> yea, I'm not too amazed by the phone part myself
[23:45] <Azelphur> but the price for a tablet PC is interesting
[23:46] <ali1234> the specs aren't that good
[23:46] <Azelphur> had a feeling they wouldn't be
[23:46] <Azelphur> I wonder if there's any decent spec'd arm tablets though?
[23:46] <ali1234> yeah
[23:46] <Azelphur> 15 hours battery sounds pretty sweet if the specs was good
[23:46] <ali1234> it's called an ipad
[23:46]  * Azelphur slaps ali1234 around a bit with a large trout
[23:47] <Azelphur> tablet pc I mean, and for the love of god not apple :D
[23:48] <Azelphur> ali1234: have you been inside the inspiron duo by chance?
[23:48] <ali1234> no
[23:48] <Azelphur> non-removable battery puts me off the idea of the inspiron duo :p
[23:49] <ali1234> lol that sucks
[23:49] <Azelphur> it does
[23:49] <Azelphur> and only 4 hours max on default battery too
[23:49] <Azelphur> everything else about the inspiron duo is great but the battery situation isn't so good
[23:50] <ali1234> the thing is
[23:50] <ali1234> you'll never get good battery from x86
[23:50] <ali1234> and you'll never get the freedom of a PC from arm
[23:50] <ali1234> choose
[23:50] <Azelphur> ali1234: my Asus EEE 1001P did like 8 hours :D
[23:51] <Azelphur> ali1234: I'm actually quite interested in taking an ARM, I only want it for browsing, IM, etc
[23:51] <Azelphur> I pretty much just want it to run stock Ubuntu with ubuntu-restricted-extras installed
[23:52] <Azelphur> I have my XPS M1730 for when I want something more beefy to do games/other stuff that isn't web browsing and other such basic things.
[23:52] <Azelphur> I'm pretty sure for my tablet PC I'd be ok with an ARM providing it wasn't slow.
[23:52] <ali1234> stock ubuntu is not good for those things
[23:52] <ali1234> not on a tablet anyway
[23:52] <ali1234> it's too heavy and guess what... unity hates touch screens
[23:53] <Azelphur> ali1234: I thought 11.04 had touch screen / multi touch improvements
[23:53] <Azelphur> o.O
[23:53] <ali1234> it has improvements and regressions
[23:53] <Azelphur> fun
[23:54] <ali1234> like for example so much of the UI relies on mouse hover or keyboard shortcuts
[23:54] <Azelphur> ali1234: my 1001p could run ubuntu reasonably fast and did everything I wanted, it was a 1.6ghz atom N450 :p
[23:54] <ali1234> neither of which is available on a tablet
[23:54] <Azelphur> ali1234: what would you recommend? :
[23:55] <ali1234> wait for meego tablet
[23:55] <Azelphur> but I want a tablet PC o.O
[23:55] <ali1234> ok then get a tablet PC
[23:56] <ali1234> personally i'd rather have a tablet
[23:56] <Azelphur> haha, why?
[23:56] <Azelphur> I like the optional keyboard
[23:56] <ali1234> because tablet PCs are too heavy
[23:56] <Azelphur> pfft, you havn't seen my XPS M1730
[23:57] <Azelphur> ali1234: XPS M1730 base weight is 10 pounds :D
[23:57] <ali1234> big ass laptops are stupid
[23:57] <Azelphur> and that's before you add a second hdd haha
[23:58] <Azelphur> ali1234: not really, I take it when I go away for a day or longer, dump it on a table when I arrive at my destination
[23:58] <Azelphur> it's a portable PC pretty much :p
[23:59] <ali1234> but it weighs 10 pounds