[00:00] hittade cairo dock så nu känns unity inte lika dumt längre [00:56] * spacebug- småstylar skrivbordet lite ;) [01:07] Hehe, kul med omoderna licenser, tekniskt sett bryter man GPLv2 om torrentar GPLv2-program =D (c.f. @bkhun identi.ca & debian-legal) [01:08] hu? [01:09] Du förmedlar ingen källkod, eller något erbjudande för källkod... [01:10] Så *tekniskt sett* Så bryter de flesta distros även mot detta :D [01:10] om du inte skickar med den menar du ja [01:12] Och under v2 räcker inte internet som "källkodserbjudande" Om det inte kommer med mjukvaran måste du erbjuda att skicka det fysiskt. [01:13] ett .deb paket inehåller ju inte källkoden exempelvis :þ === lilleman72 is now known as Lilleman|nanar [01:17] "Known bug, fixed in GPLv3 ;)" [01:19] hehe ok [01:19] * spacebug- tänker fortfarande i .tar.gz format (sen slackware) där är ju allt med :) [01:22] iphone använder ju lite GPL-saker i sina lurar. Så man borde ju kunna kräva dom att skicka källkoden mot betalning för fysiska mediet + frakten då. Men sen en sak till, om jag fattat GPL rätt så om man använder GPL-kod som en del av ett anna projekt så måste även hela det bli GPL. Vad man nu menar med del av projekt då. Som jag fattat det är det tex om man implementerar koden i sin egen kod i stället för att [01:22] Yes, distros som kör med source distribution kommer ju undan, men samtidigt, om man laddar ner en slackware-iso, finns verkligen källkoden för allt GPLv2-material med, e.g. kernel? Skulle gissa inte... [01:22] tex kompilera en modul för att tex dekoda mp3 osv [01:22] är jag rätt ute? [01:23] på slackware-dvd:n gör det det, och/eller om man tar ner soruce-cd:na [01:23] så dvd:n borde va ok men inte cd? =) [01:24] Yes, men isåfall bryter CD-varianten... Yep [01:24] hehe lol [01:24] fast den laddas ju även den ner från nätet. Köper man slackware får man ju alla skivor [01:25] Jag tror inte man hittar någon copyrightinnehavare för enforcment på det här dock... [01:25] så en tar cvzf all_slack.tar.gz slackware-cd*.iso och sen lägga upp dne på nätet vore ok? [01:25] Hmm, all källkod borde ju vara med, så ja [01:26] eller göra en torrent av det hela för då kan ju användaren välja att bara klicka de filer han/hon vill ha från torrenten medans torrenten alltid erbjuder alla filer som standard [01:27] eller bryter då jag mot GPL om jag bara tar ner den filen jag vill ha? [01:27] Problemet som drog upp debatten nu igen (senaste dygnet), är att en erson i Tysklan blivit anklagad för att bryta mot uphovsrätten genom att torrenta Debian 5. Av en helt fristående advokat (detta är möjligt i Tyskland, uppenbarligen). [01:28] spacebug-: Inte du, den som skickar filen till dig gör det. [01:29] fast han/hon erbjuder ju alla filer i torrenten som default. Jag måste ju göra ett aktivt val när jag lägger till torrenten i tex transmission att bara ta ner tex cd1 (ej source) [01:29] fortfarande inte ok? [01:30] Men jagtror att en torrent som per default drar ner allt, hmm, jag vet inte riktigt, det är ju på gränsen till samma sak som att lägga upp ett antal olika filer på en hemsida där användaren kan välja att ladda ner en enda eller det hela.. [01:30] hehe [01:31] jag kan ju välja att avbryta nedladdningen av all_slackware.tar.gz efter exakt antar byte oxå för att bara få cd1 :D [01:31] men jag förstår om det kan va svårtolkat ibland sånt där [01:32] Advokaten i tyskland (försöker avkräva torrentaren 700€) ifråga är ett pucko och en idiot, men enligt vissa har hen teknisk sett, vilket skapar huvudbry... [01:33] lite som den parkeringsvakten som lappade ett utryckningsfordon i aktion. Rätt för den va ju felparkerad men fel för va fan de släkte ju en brand liksom ;) [01:33] Jo, v2 var skapat i en tid då internet inte ansågs som ett "stabilt" erbjudande för källkod, och då torrent inte existerade.. [01:34] om man inte anger version så får man välja själv sen va? om jag fattat det rätt. Vilket är då bäst? Att inte skriva version eller välja 3? Står det inte i alla? eller kanske bara i 3:an att programmet som använder den här licensen även kommer följa alla andr versioner efter av licensen som kommer? [01:35] Sen kan man ju tycka att Tysklands legalaa system är något skruvat om advokater kan stämma folk utan att upphovsrättspersonen ville eller ger sitt medgivande till det :/ [01:35] ja det låter sjukt [01:36] spacebug-: "GPLv2 or later" används ju ganska ofta [01:37] kan då inte den stämda personen hävda att han/hon väljer att se det som v3 då man får välja den om man vill och i den är det ok att inte skicka med källkoden (utan det räcker med internet? ? [01:37] Att bara säga "GPL" ka ju tilkas att mena GPLv1 till och med.. [01:38] spacebug-: Problemet är "ofta", inte "alltid", det finns mycket i Debian som är v2-only, linuxkärnan till exempel ;) [01:39] aha ok [01:39] är linux det i alla fall eller har bara debian valt att skicka med den som v2-only? [01:40] hej igen Stirner_ [01:43] spacebug-: Linux verkar genomgående ha problem med v3 [01:45] Den är GPLv2 only och det ska mycket till för att andra det vid det här laget.. [01:45] Voila! Beskåda pottkanten. [01:49] ok [02:03] !ping [02:03] pinga dig själv ;-) dioderna på min vänstra sida ömmar verkligen [02:03] nice [02:06] hum [02:35] g?????sp === Stirner_ is now known as stirner [02:35] hum [02:35] fel på ä? ;) [02:37] rofl just ja kor en vmwere img av backtrack for att fa irssi :-P [02:38] irssi <3 [02:38] hehe [02:39] sitter och kor lite MW2 ;-) [02:49] ? === administrator is now known as Guest29765 === Guest29765 is now known as maxjezy [04:51] ANYONE ALIVE [06:31] Vad gör jag uppe så här dags? *gäsp* [06:36] whuffor: morgonstund har guld i mun? :) [06:38] Hmm. Har aldrig sett något guld i min mun... Jag är ju ledig för sjutton. Borde ju sova [06:45] any english speakers? [06:45] I suppose so, but why not ask in #ubuntu if you prefer english? :) [06:47] för att signal/brus-förhållandet är (något) gynnsammare här? [06:47] Mmm. Kanske det. [06:48] i want to learn swedish [06:48] and i want to learn about the swedish culture [06:48] i want to move out of the US, but can't decide where to go [06:49] Well. the world is a big place [06:49] Sounds like a big decision, dunno if basing that on a bunch of loonies on IRC is the best thing ;) [06:50] But yeah, most of us here dos speak english to a varying degree.. [06:50] it's between germany france and sweden [06:51] (i want to study abroad before moving) [06:51] you'll be colder here [06:51] lol what is the average temperature? [06:52] Yeah. And around December we have around 6 hours of daylight here at the latitude of Stockholm, less further north ofc. [06:52] somewhere between italy and siberia [06:53] ... [06:53] that's a huge span [06:53] Summertime it's around 22 - 28 C perhaps, occasionally creeping over 30C [06:54] btw. You better learn metric if you are planning to come here :) [06:54] metric is easy imo [06:54] (the basics anyway) [06:54] is the economy decent? what is its structure and what are the people's opinions on the economy and the government as a whole [06:55] mmm. The system is easy, it just takes time to get a feel for what the numbers stand for if you are used to inches/feet/pounds etc [06:55] Definition of "winter" is average day temperature below 0, winter varies ~10->-25 Kinda [06:56] so it's like northern canada [06:57] During some winters, the southernmost third of Sweden hardly has any snow, but the last two winters it's been way more than usual. [06:57] I think Swedish are in general quite trusting of their government, We've lately manaaged to stay quite on top of the eceonomy, I guess. [06:58] * whuffor is no fan of snow and darkness [06:58] TViYH: check a map to get an idea of expected climate [06:58] is it democracy/monarchy? [06:58] We do the whole "Very high taxes, free education/healthcare" thing.. [06:59] TViYH: both [06:59] Good morning. [06:59] wat...both? what are the laws like? [06:59] Sweden has a constitutional monarchy with the king as titular head of state, but it's purely ceremonial [06:59] Constitutional monarchy, i.e. democracy, but we have a king who waves at people and do ceremonies on tv =) [07:00] :D [07:00] morn [07:00] is internet piracy legally? [07:00] Nope. [07:00] legal* [07:00] why english !!! [07:00] 1st of July 2006 it became illegal I think. [07:00] coobra: Just a bit refreshing an early Monday morning! [07:01] :p [07:01] I've slept about 3.5h this night. [07:01] cahoot: what do you like most about sweden [07:01] Sweden is like most any western country in terms of laws and politics I think. Higher taxes than most countries, shorter prison terms than most countries... stuff like that [07:02] TViYH: Where are you from btw? [07:02] US, wanting to move out [07:02] ah [07:03] Yeah, Sweden is a good country. [07:03] what do you like the most about it? [07:03] But remember that you can only buy alcohol over 3.5% when you are over 20 yrs of age and in state owned liqour stores. :) [07:04] same as america [07:04] hm [07:04] tobacco? [07:04] 18 yrs. [07:04] And you can go to bars and stuff from 18 yrs. [07:04] same then [07:04] But not all bars have that sheit. [07:04] It's up to the bar itself to decide which age limit. [07:04] bars in america, you have to be 21 i think [07:05] Mkay. [07:05] even to sit [07:05] lol [07:05] Haha [07:05] what do you like the most about sweden [07:05] You are considered an adult at 18 in the eyes of the law here. [07:06] Hm, free health care and now since the moderate party (liberal conservatives) have been in power since 2006 it's less state monopoly and a bit more private owned things. [07:06] But atm I'm quite tired of Sweden. :p [07:06] what would you like better? [07:06] That why I moved abroad as well. [07:06] That things would stop to be so f*cking political correct. :D [07:07] And that alcohol could be sold in stores. [07:07] what is your political view? [07:07] (s) [07:07] Liberal with a hint to the right. [07:07] I avoid politics or religion on the internet :) [07:07] http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2593/3769074258_bb579294df.jpg [07:07] bhha [07:07] feeeeel [07:07] (I just think it's silly that the alcohol must be sold in special stores) [07:08] DONT LOOK 2ON THAT [07:08] america is so right-wing brainwashed :| that's what i'm trying to get away from tbh [07:08] Haha [07:08] ^ That's probably a good thing (we've got enough politics in technical subject...) [07:08] Yes, it's not like that at all in Sweden. [07:08] we're not even taught politics in school here (highschool) [07:08] only american government [07:08] o.o [07:09] in my state anyway [07:09] But I love that Sweden still has quite strong laws around censorship. [07:09] so Markslap what is the outlook for people in the field of information technology in sweden [07:09] You can still say what you want more or less. [07:09] Well The "Conservatives" of sweeden would likely be accused of being comunists in the US, I think the whole spectrum is quite shifted.. [07:09] is there a large demand [07:09] arand: Yep. [07:10] TViYH: Hm, the thing is that the salarys are a bit too high for having IT-people in Sweden. [07:10] And the things that can be outsourced are more or less outsourced. [07:10] IT jobs can't be outsourced lol [07:10] most of them anyway [07:10] I'm working on a Swedish helpdesk (At HP) in Dublin. [07:10] Supporting Swedish people. [07:11] It depends in what. [07:11] on* [07:11] help desk type jobs are outsourceable [07:11] Yes. [07:11] network administration is what i'm in college for [07:11] with a shitton of certifications [07:11] Ah, yeah, that's a bit hard to outsource. :) [07:11] (microsoft a+, network+, security+, cisco CCNA CCENT) [07:11] haha [07:12] HP will pay that if I stay. [07:12] i am working at a hospital right now [07:12] and my brother runs an ISP's NOC for the eastern US [07:12] ah [07:13] so you live in ireland currently (northern)? [07:13] yes. [07:13] But in the real Ireland (Republic of Ireland). [07:13] good lol [07:13] :) [07:13] how is it there? [07:14] compare it to sweden [07:14] But yes, Sweden is a good country to start with if you are tired of the states. [07:14] It's a really good way to widening (?) your views. [07:14] It's bloody sheit. [07:14] :) [07:14] lol [07:14] Can't see how this even can be called a country. [07:14] But it's different and it's a good way to get a perspective. [07:15] what do you think of germany and netherlands? [07:15] I love them both. [07:15] germany has extremely high taxes doesn't it [07:15] like 45% income [07:15] I wanted to move to Berlin first, but the taxes are a bit to high. [07:15] Yes. [07:15] what is sweden's [07:15] I have like 13-20% in tax here. [07:15] About 30-33% depending on where in Sweden you live. [07:16] what is netherlands tax rate [07:16] do you know [07:16] No, sorry. [07:16] i know netherlands is cramped [07:16] lol [07:16] I have a couple of friend from Netherlands, but havn't talked taxes with them. [07:16] :) [07:16] Can ask a colleague. [07:17] "The Netherlands has a partly progressive tax rate. In the past the highest income bracket in the Netherlands was 72%, but in 1990 the highest income bracket was changed to 60% and in 2001 it became 52%. The brackets are now 2.35%, 10.85%, 42% and 52%" [07:17] Wow [07:17] so between 10% and 40% lol [07:17] :D [07:17] That's sheit. [07:18] But one thing with Germany is that they are quite sheit at English. [07:18] switzerland has lowest i know of [07:18] (aside from US) [07:18] Swedish people can atleast speak it in some means. [07:18] by some* [07:18] what country do you think is best in all of EU [07:19] Hm [07:19] Germans still have movies dubbed to German. Seems odd to hear american actors "speak German" :) [07:19] It's hard to say. [07:19] whuffor: Yes, that too. :) [07:20] TViYH: I personally like Germany, Portugal, Netherlands, UK and Sweden, but I like them all for different reasons. [07:20] So it's hard to say. [07:20] which do you recommend to someone wanting relatively low taxes with high salary for IT field [07:20] :P [07:20] Hm [07:20] who also wants non-republifag government [07:20] Sweden has really good salarys. [07:20] That's one thing for sure. [07:21] And for that taxes you pay you get things back. [07:21] what is the price of a house [07:21] small house [07:21] That depends on where, really. [07:21] hmm.. [07:21] lol. [07:21] It's all about location :) [07:21] Yep. [07:22] It's a loooong country. [07:22] And closer to cities == expensive. [07:22] Around Stockholm, a house can be very expensive, at other places it can be a third of that price [07:22] Yes. [07:22] Or less [07:22] what is the best place for IT? [07:22] there has to be a lot of places in one area [07:22] Stockholm, I'd say. [07:22] how about huddinge? [07:23] Stockholm is the hub for commerce, but other metropolitan areas have work for it as well [07:23] Huddinge is fine. [07:23] :D [07:23] if you don't mind my asking, where do you guys live [07:23] Huddinge is a southern suburb to Stockholm [07:23] what areas that is [07:23] bhha [07:23] They have commuter trains in Huddinge. [07:23] I live in Stockholm, smack dab in the city center. [07:23] I lived in Kista (Swedens Silicon Valley ;) ). [07:24] It's a neat place to live imo. [07:24] TViYH: Djurholm / Östermalm / Lidingö is where its ok to live [07:24] Hahaha [07:24] -_- [07:24] Lidingö is quite sheit imo. [07:24] bjurholm municipality? [07:24] Mmm. I've been to Kista a few times for solaris sysadmin training [07:24] Just a bunch of people who thinks it's cool. [07:24] bjurholm municipality -> djurholm? [07:24] Nope. [07:24] Bjurholm is something else. [07:25] google maps is failing the translation then or something [07:25] Bjurholm is in the north. [07:25] djursholm? [07:25] TViYH: yuo need a hose in Nice/FRance to [07:25] lol [07:25] Djursholm is a place in northen Stockholm. [07:25] What is Djurholm? Do you mean Djursholm maybe? [07:26] so what do you guys recommend to me so that i can start planning [07:26] sweden sounds nice to me [07:26] I would recommend a flat in Kista if you're in to IT. [07:26] It's about 16-17 mins with subway to Stockholm City. [07:26] no Lidingö [07:27] Yeah, there is so much IT-related stuff in Lidingö. [07:27] kista reminds me of a place in florida [07:27] Haha [07:27] Lidingö? [07:27] Stocksund !!! [07:28] KTH is on Östermalm soil !!! [07:28] THATS WHAT I CALL IT MOFOS [07:28] TViYH: http://www.hitta.se/LargeMap.aspx?z=1&mp=%3Cpts%3E%3Cpt%20i%3D%22http%3A//www.hitta.se/images/point.png%22%20y%3D%226588442%22%20x%3D%221621750%22%3E%3Ct%3E%28ny%20punkt%29St%E4ng%3C/t%3E%3C/pt%3E%3C/pts%3E [07:28] Press "Gatuvy" in the top. [07:28] That's Kista. [07:28] Oh [07:28] Gatubild [07:28] Sorry [07:28] o i see [07:28] KISTA :/ [07:28] nice [07:29] (Street view) [07:29] Markslap: http://shorturl.com <--- hint, hint :) [07:29] hammarbysjöstad !!! [07:29] whuffor: Äh. :) [07:29] coobra: yeah, that's neat too. [07:29] Markslap: what is it like to drive a car there [07:30] Safe. [07:30] is parking decent? [07:30] the longer urls the biger E-penis [07:30] Yes, I would say so. [07:30] hm [07:30] But it's meaningless with a license in Stockholm area. [07:30] I'd say. [07:30] there are things to take pictures of in stockholm? [07:31] is it hilly? mountainous? [07:31] TViYH: get private jet + maybach and its free :p [07:31] klol [07:31] Haha [07:31] Somewhat hilly, no mountains [07:31] TViYH: A bit hilly, yes. [07:31] Lots of water [07:31] does it flood? [07:31] Flood? [07:31] Stockholm is basically built on several Islands except the northern part [07:31] does water go everywhere when it rains a lot [07:31] into basements, etc [07:31] Nah [07:32] We have no earthquakes or floods. [07:32] Or tornadoes. [07:32] No extreme weather here [07:32] deer? [07:32] turkey? [07:32] Deers are in the country. [07:32] ahh nice [07:32] Biggest animal is bear and moose I think [07:32] Everything is pretty mild in Sweden, even the weather is political correct. [07:33] sounds like i need to learn svenska [07:33] Yep. :) [07:33] You'll get around on English, no worries. [07:33] i wonder how much a flight costs :P [07:33] the only thing i really worry about is driving, as i would have no car [07:34] I think you could get away with $500 for a ticket. [07:34] Public transport is really good compared to almost any place in the US [07:34] Yep. [07:34] Quite cheap as well. [07:34] there is 0 public transport around me [07:34] Haha [07:34] >50 miles away [07:34] There is buses, subway, commuter trains and some trams as well in the Stockholm area. [07:34] do you know a lot about america? [07:34] 6-10 minutes between buses and an extensive metro system in the Stockholm area [07:34] Nope, but enough to not want to go there. [07:35] :P [07:35] Exept for SF. [07:35] i think we are brainwashed, really [07:35] But no big urge really. [07:35] yep, atleast some of you. [07:35] it's hard to tell if what we are learning in school is being taught just because we won the wars [07:35] You seem like a good person. [07:35] I've been to 11 states in the US, visiting friends [07:35] That can see that something is fucked up. [07:35] and to 3 districts in Canada [07:36] everything noticably bad here started with ronald reagan [07:36] trickle down theory [07:36] ... [07:36] is pure shit [07:36] Haha [07:36] the CEO of goldman-sachs ran the government then [07:36] and now bankers are being bailed out by the people they screwed over [07:36] TViYH: that's actually the present theory here [07:36] yet people continue to vote for the same party [07:37] and the thing i hate most.........it makes me SOOO ANGRY. people say they hate the president no matter what he does, but when the next president comes along, they LOVED the last one [07:37] It's always like that. :) [07:37] That's cuz "the greatest democracy in the world" has a 2-party system. *cough* [07:37] so hypocritical [07:37] Never happy for what they have and it's was always better before. [07:37] i know right? i have hated the bicameral system since birth [07:38] : [07:38] :)* [07:38] Nah, time for some breakfast. [07:38] It's going to be a calm day at work. [07:38] what do you recommend for learning swedish [07:39] basics, that is [07:39] No clue. I learned Swedish as a toddler the usual way :) [07:39] :p [07:40] i thought about reading wikipedia in english, then reading in swedish [07:40] but that may not help [07:40] TViYH: You should talk to _sara_ that is in here sometimes. [07:40] She's british and living in Sweden. [07:40] I think hearing the language helps, hearing and repeating out loud. [07:40] She might have some tips along the way. [07:40] ahh that is good [07:40] TViYH: The best thing is to take a course I'd say. [07:40] i'm glad this channel likes americans, nobody would even recognize my existence in the german channel [07:41] I don't like people based on their origin. Everyone can be nice or a*holes, regardless of where they come from in my experience :) [07:42] i try to represent my [shitty] countrymen as well as possible [07:42] lol [07:42] one thing easy about swedish is its similarities to dutch, english, german [07:42]