[03:45] <jbicha> mimico: I'm thinking about stubbing the booklet pages from Ubuntu's help for this release
[03:46] <jbicha> because LO doesn't need it
[03:49] <mimico> jbicha, you mean take them out completely?
[03:50] <mimico> I think they mainly pertain to Evince anyways.
[03:51] <Captainkrtek> hello
[03:52] <jbicha> mimico: basically, maybe they could be cleaned up for a later release
[03:53] <Captainkrtek> interested in getting involved with the doc. team
[03:53] <Captainkrtek> reading up on it
[03:55] <jbicha> Captainkrtek: have you used bzr before?
[03:55] <mimico> jbicha, it was written initially with only Evince in mind, so taking it out is okay by me.
[03:56] <Captainkrtek> jbicha, I'm afraid I have not
[03:56] <jbicha> mimico: ok, thank you
[03:56] <Captainkrtek> but I have experience in MediaWiki, technical writing, and open source documentation and development
[03:56] <Captainkrtek> mostly for Android
[03:59] <jbicha> unfortunately we don't use MediaWiki
[03:59] <Captainkrtek> yeah
[03:59] <Captainkrtek> but I have the writing experience
[03:59] <Captainkrtek> I have also written for a portal with over 3-4 Million views a month
[03:59] <jbicha> there's 2 parts to docs, the wiki & the user help
[03:59] <Captainkrtek> on technical topics
[03:59] <Captainkrtek> yeah
[03:59] <Captainkrtek> I'd be interested more in the wiki
[04:00] <Captainkrtek> spent lots of time in wikis
[04:01] <Captainkrtek> what about the documentation onboard the OS?
[04:01] <Captainkrtek> or do you have to first prove yourself
[04:02] <jbicha> no, for the system docs, you'll just need to learn bzr :-)
[04:03] <Captainkrtek> ive used GIT before
[04:03] <Captainkrtek> and gerrit
[04:03] <jbicha> and the docs are written in mallard (older docs are written in docbook)
[04:03] <Captainkrtek> so i've used revision control before
[04:03] <Captainkrtek> gotcha
[04:03] <Captainkrtek> lots to learn :-)
[04:04] <jbicha> yeah, bzr is similar to git but different
[04:04] <jbicha> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/GettingSetUp
[04:05] <jbicha> you need a GPG key and do the stuff in setting up your dev environment
[04:05] <Captainkrtek> trying to setup my key right now
[04:06] <Captainkrtek> is it a huge learning curve from GIT?
[04:09] <jbicha> I've used bzr more so I couldn't tell you
[04:09] <jbicha> I think newer bzr users don't like git because it's more complex, git users don't like bzr
[04:09] <jbicha> because it's slower & doesn't do everything git can
[04:10] <Captainkrtek> hmm
[04:10] <Captainkrtek> ill have to check it out
[04:10] <Captainkrtek> I'd love to give back through this community :)
[04:13] <Captainkrtek> generating the key
[04:13] <Captainkrtek> this is taking a bit :P
[04:18] <Captainkrtek> so what do you work on jbicha ?
[04:20] <jbicha> I've been getting the user guide into shape for Natty, basically changing the Gnome 3
[04:20] <jbicha> stuff to describe Unity instead
[04:20] <Captainkrtek> cool :-)
[04:20] <Captainkrtek> I have not upgraded to natty yet
[04:21] <Captainkrtek> probably should do that
[04:32] <Captainkrtek> k gpg and ssh keys setup
[04:39] <Captainkrtek> jbicha, K I went through that whole guide
[04:40] <jbicha> ok, the pbuilder part isn't needed for documentation
[04:40] <Captainkrtek> oh okay
[04:40] <Captainkrtek> still did it hehe
[04:40] <Captainkrtek> so where can I get started?
[04:41] <Captainkrtek> looking at some pages...
[04:41] <jbicha> https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/natty/gnome-user-docs/natty
[04:41] <jbicha> oops, that's not it
[04:42] <Captainkrtek> hehe
[04:42] <Captainkrtek> my launchpad id is steven.richards btw
[04:42] <jbicha> https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-doc/gnome-user-docs/natty
[04:43] <jbicha> so as you can see on that page, you'll need to run
[04:43] <jbicha> bzr branch lp:~ubuntu-core-doc/gnome-user-docs/natty
[04:43] <Captainkrtek> yeah
[04:43] <Captainkrtek> running :)
[04:43] <jbicha> let me know when it's done downloading
[04:43] <Captainkrtek> okay!
[04:44] <Captainkrtek> thanks for getting me set up I appreciate it :)
[04:52] <Captainkrtek> jbicha, it's done
[04:53] <jbicha> ok, conveniently the help doesn't require compilation to be viewed
[04:53] <Captainkrtek> k
[04:53] <jbicha> so you can just cd into gnome-help/C/
[04:53] <jbicha> and then run yelp .
[04:53] <jbicha> to view the help as of right now
[04:54] <Captainkrtek> very cool
[04:55] <jbicha> but it won't look quite right if you're not using yelp 3 which is in natty
[04:55] <Captainkrtek> gotcha
[04:55] <Captainkrtek> m running 10.10
[04:55] <Captainkrtek> im*
[04:55] <Captainkrtek> so go through the files
[04:55] <Captainkrtek> edit them
[04:55] <Captainkrtek> save em
[04:55] <Captainkrtek> how would I submit the change using bzr?
[04:56] <jbicha> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/SystemDocumentation/Submitting
[04:56] <jbicha> either bzr bundle and email the mailing list
[04:56] <Captainkrtek> and then for
[04:56] <Captainkrtek> bzr push lp:~yourusername/ubuntu-docs/branchname
[04:56] <Captainkrtek> Id to
[04:57] <Captainkrtek> bzr push lp:~krtek/natty/gnome-help/C
[04:57] <Captainkrtek> s/to/do
[04:58] <jbicha> I do it more like bzr push lp:~jbicha/gnome-user-docs/display-typos
[04:59] <Captainkrtek> oh
[05:00] <Captainkrtek> what's the difference?
[05:00] <Captainkrtek> if im working in /C
[05:00] <jbicha> because the final part is your branch name and you can pick whatever you like
[05:00] <Captainkrtek> ahh
[05:00] <Captainkrtek> so no difference really
[05:00] <jbicha> might as well make it easy to recognize what that branch does
[05:01] <Captainkrtek> yeah
[05:01] <Captainkrtek> and then the files tagged .stub
[05:01] <Captainkrtek> arent done yet
[05:01] <jbicha> right, so not visible to users, but you can do yelp --editor-mode .
[05:02] <jbicha> if you really want to see them or read comments
[05:02] <Captainkrtek> Unknown option --editor-mode
[05:03] <Captainkrtek> that only in yelp 3?
[05:03] <jbicha> I guess, you can check yelp --help
[05:04] <jbicha> it doesn't actually edit, it just shows some extra stuff
[05:09] <Captainkrtek> hey jbicha sorry about that
[05:09] <Captainkrtek> wifi cut out
[05:09] <jbicha> np
[05:09] <Captainkrtek> what editor do you use
[05:11] <jbicha> gedit actually
[05:11] <Captainkrtek> me too :)
[05:12] <Captainkrtek> and what is the syntax called we are writing in?
[05:12] <Captainkrtek> need to find a guide
[05:12] <jbicha> http://projectmallard.org/
[05:13] <Captainkrtek> bookmarked
[05:13] <Captainkrtek> time to get to work
[05:13] <Captainkrtek> thanks again for the help!
[05:20] <jbicha> I pushed an update, so you can do bzr pull to get the latest
[05:20] <Captainkrtek> very cool, updating now :)
[05:20] <Captainkrtek> Im going to try to make a change
[05:22] <Captainkrtek> quick question if you don't mind
[06:42] <Captainkrtek> hello mimico
[06:43] <Captainkrtek> do you have a minute to help answer a question?
[06:46] <Captainkrtek> or anyone
[06:47] <Captainkrtek> jbicha, you still around?
[06:47] <jbicha> Captainkrtek: yes, for a bit longer
[06:47] <Captainkrtek> okay great
[06:47] <Captainkrtek> so I just edited display-2monitors.page.stub
[06:48] <Captainkrtek> ran the check_validation.sh
[06:48] <jbicha> ./check_status.sh is useful
[06:48] <Captainkrtek> said it validates
[06:48] <Captainkrtek> no return on check_status
[06:48] <Captainkrtek> I can't yelp display-2monitors.page.stub either.
[06:49] <Captainkrtek> any idea?
[06:50] <jbicha> bzr mv display-2monitors.page.stub display-2monitors.page
[06:50] <jbicha> and then yelp . will show it
[06:51] <Captainkrtek> he requested URI "display-2monitors.page" is invalid
[06:51] <Captainkrtek> The*
[06:51] <jbicha> um, are you sure it validates then?
[06:52] <Captainkrtek> krtek@krtek:~/natty/gnome-help/C$ ./check_validation.sh display-2monitors.page
[06:52] <Captainkrtek>  --Validating display-2monitors.page ...
[06:52] <Captainkrtek> display-2monitors.page validates
[06:52] <Captainkrtek> :/
[06:52] <jbicha> just do yelp . don't try specifying the specific page
[06:53] <Captainkrtek> then search for it?
[06:53] <jbicha> yes, there's a trick to do a specific page in yelp 2.32 but I'd have to google it
[06:53] <jbicha> everything I own is running Natty at the moment
[06:53] <Captainkrtek> hmm
[06:54] <Captainkrtek> can I pastebin the file?
[06:54] <Captainkrtek> see if it looks right to you?
[06:54] <jbicha> did you get it to open yet?
[06:54] <Captainkrtek> nope :/
[06:54] <Captainkrtek> http://pastebin.com/M9FpmjD6
[06:54] <Captainkrtek> couldn't find it
[06:54] <Captainkrtek> oh wait
[06:55] <Captainkrtek> hmmm
[06:55] <Captainkrtek> can't find it...
[06:56] <Captainkrtek> oh
[06:56] <Captainkrtek> found it :)
[06:57] <jbicha> good
[06:57] <Captainkrtek> wasn't easy
[06:57] <Captainkrtek> is there a way to submit an update but not a final one?
[06:57] <Captainkrtek> like I will make changes to this one
[06:57] <jbicha> it would be better to get it mostly final before submitting
[06:57] <Captainkrtek> yeah
[06:57] <Captainkrtek> did the pastebin look okay?
[06:58] <Captainkrtek> need to read the style guide...
[06:58] <jbicha> well it needs more work, you'd probably find it easier to read or edit existing pages instead of creating a stub
[06:58] <Captainkrtek> okay
[06:59] <Captainkrtek> I just found that one
[06:59] <Captainkrtek> that was an existing stub
[06:59] <jbicha> you picked an important topic but it's ok if it doesn't get done in time for 11.04
[06:59] <Captainkrtek> I can get it done tomorrow hopefully
[06:59] <jbicha> yes, the stub is from Gnome
[06:59] <Captainkrtek> how long will it take to get approved?
[07:00] <jbicha> review shouldn't take more than a couple days at most, maybe much faster
[07:00] <jbicha> approval depends on quality :-)
[07:01] <Captainkrtek> okay
[07:01] <Captainkrtek> any tips for me
[07:01] <jbicha> we appreciate the help
[07:01] <Captainkrtek> based on that pastebin?
[07:01] <jbicha> don't use tabs, use spaces
[07:02] <jbicha> spellcheck, compare to already existing pages for tricks like guiseq
[07:02] <Captainkrtek> okay
[07:02] <Captainkrtek> so like download an old branch?
[07:02] <jbicha> no, compare to other pages in the guide
[07:02] <Captainkrtek> what about detail? is that long enough
[07:02] <Captainkrtek> okay
[07:02] <jbicha> to learn how to use the syntax
[07:02] <Captainkrtek> yeah
[07:02] <Captainkrtek> is there a way to include images?
[07:02] <Captainkrtek> like screenshots
[07:03] <jbicha> yes, but space is limited so I'm not sure if we actually need one
[07:03] <Captainkrtek> okay
[07:03] <jbicha> the gnome-user-guide is shipped on the CD
[07:03] <Captainkrtek> ahh
[07:03] <Captainkrtek> wow
[07:03] <Captainkrtek> :)
[07:04] <Captainkrtek> maybe I can get something on there before release :)
[07:04] <jbicha> 11.04's CD is basically done though
[07:04] <Captainkrtek> oh
[07:04] <jbicha> no, they'll only rebuild the CD image for urgent bugfixes
[07:04] <Captainkrtek> darn
[07:04] <Captainkrtek> but there are updates
[07:05] <jbicha> yes
[07:05] <Captainkrtek> :)
[07:05] <Captainkrtek> very cool
[07:06] <jbicha> yes, it's neat to see your name in the changelog
[07:07] <Captainkrtek> yeah
[07:07] <Captainkrtek> it's a cool project
[07:07] <Captainkrtek> how long have you been doing this?
[07:08] <Captainkrtek> also, is this, http://pastebin.com/4Z9XgnaR , what should be in the guide?
[07:09] <jbicha> about 3 weeks for the user guide, I had a bunch of free time
[07:11] <jbicha> comments aren't visible to end users, it was just notes from Gnome about what they thought should be on the page
[07:12] <jbicha> a significant amount of Gnome's guide was only written in March
[07:12] <jbicha> http://j1m.net/2011/03/19/gnome-3-documentation-hackfest/
[07:14] <jbicha> but I was interested in Gnome help for a year, I should have jumped in sooner
[07:18] <Captainkrtek> hey
[07:18] <Captainkrtek> sorry had to reconnect
[07:19] <jbicha> but I was interested in Gnome help for a year, I should have jumped in sooner
[07:19] <Captainkrtek> cool
[07:19] <Captainkrtek> I have a friend who does some gnome work
[07:19] <Captainkrtek> think he does design
[07:19] <jbicha> it's a bit easier to write & edit the new help once more of it is written
[07:19] <jbicha> back then, Mallard was quite new
[07:19] <Captainkrtek> yeah
[07:20] <Captainkrtek> how do you edit the sub title text on yelp for an item?
[07:20] <Captainkrtek> like this
[07:20] <Captainkrtek> http://i.imgur.com/ax6Qu.png
[07:21] <Captainkrtek> see there is no text below second monitor
[07:21] <jbicha> that's the desc field
[07:22] <Captainkrtek> got it :)
[07:22] <Captainkrtek> thanks
[07:27] <Captainkrtek> shouldn't dual displays go under hardware?
[07:27] <Captainkrtek> oh nvm
[07:29] <Captainkrtek> if you're still here just have one final thing
[07:30] <jbicha> ok
[07:30] <Captainkrtek> the comment section
[07:31] <Captainkrtek> is that a request, like "please include details on blah blah blah"
[07:34] <jbicha> if you're able to include the important stuff then you don't need to write comments
[07:34] <Captainkrtek> k
[07:34] <Captainkrtek> might  be able to get this one close to done tonight
[07:34] <jbicha> it is a note to other writers and editors
[07:34] <Captainkrtek> gotcha
[07:44] <Captainkrtek> Think I have this one done :)
[07:46] <jbicha> I'm done for tonight, talk to you later!
[07:46] <Captainkrtek> okay me as well, goodnight!
[08:13] <Captainkrtek> hey dpm
[08:17] <dpm> well, that was a short conversation
[22:37] <jbicha> mdke: howdy
[22:37] <mdke> jbicha: heya
[22:38] <jbicha> I thought it would simpler to link to an app than telling users to search for one or
[22:39] <mdke> I think the instructions should be app independent really
[22:39] <jbicha> telling them to click through Get Software, down arrow, Canonical Partners
[22:39] <mdke> ideally there would be a check box in software sources for the partner repo, as there was in previous releases, but I didn't see one when I tested so I used the apt line
[22:40] <jbicha> oh, there's a check box
[22:40] <mdke> perhaps it was added after the version I have got
[22:40] <mdke> I'm a week or two out of date
[22:41] <jbicha> it could be because you've been upgrading for a while
[22:42] <mdke> I haven't upgraded at all, I have a daily live usb from the daily snapshot a week or two ago
[22:42] <mdke> but I haven't kept it up to date as that takes up a lot of disk space
[22:42] <jbicha> interestingly, if you delete the "Canonical Partners" repo from Software Sources, the "Use This Source" button can add it back for you
[22:43]  * mdke nods
[22:43] <mdke> jbicha: to change the subject briefly, have you by any chance gone over the topics which you reviewed prior to getting commit access and marked them as final? If not that would be useful.
[22:43] <mdke> You've made amazing progress over the last few days
[22:44] <mdke> == SUMMARY ==
[22:44] <mdke> None: 		 0
[22:44] <mdke> Stub: 		 6
[22:44] <mdke> Incomplete: 	 1
[22:44] <mdke> Draft: 		 3
[22:44] <mdke> Review: 	 23
[22:44] <mdke> Candidate: 	 10
[22:44] <mdke> Final: 		 92
[22:44] <mdke> Outdated: 	 92
[22:44] <mdke> pretty awesome :)
[22:44] <mdke> bbl
[23:44] <Captainkrtek> hello
[23:44] <Captainkrtek> jbicha, you here?
[23:44] <jbicha> Captainkrtek: hi
[23:44] <Captainkrtek> hello
[23:45] <Captainkrtek> so last night I finished a doc
[23:45] <Captainkrtek> committed locally
[23:45] <Captainkrtek> and emailed the mailing list
[23:45] <Captainkrtek> but I dont think anyone has seen it
[23:46] <jbicha> no, we saw it
[23:46] <Captainkrtek> oh okay :)
[23:46] <jbicha> you should upgrade to 11.04
[23:46] <Captainkrtek> yeah
[23:46] <Captainkrtek> I was going to last night
[23:47] <Captainkrtek> I will in about 20 minutes, is it good though?
[23:47] <jbicha> the user guide is written based on the Unity desktop, so System>Preferences>Monitors isn't how we do it now
[23:47] <Captainkrtek> oh....
[23:47] <Captainkrtek> whoops
[23:48] <Captainkrtek> so I'll rewrite it
[23:48] <Captainkrtek> once I upgrade
[23:49] <Captainkrtek> other than that issue, how is it style wise? I tried using some syntax from the mallard docs
[23:52] <jbicha> use status="review" instead of making up a status
[23:53] <Captainkrtek> oh
[23:53] <Captainkrtek> I didn't make that up
[23:53] <Captainkrtek> I saw it somewhere in the editing guide
[23:54] <jbicha> the wiki? the wiki talks about docbook so it's out of date
[23:54] <Captainkrtek> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/SystemDocumentation/Checking
[23:55] <Captainkrtek> on the bottom
[23:55] <Captainkrtek> I used "writing" if I remember right
[23:55] <jbicha> that page was last edited 2 years ago :-)
[23:56] <Captainkrtek> whoops
[23:56] <Captainkrtek> hehe
[23:56] <Captainkrtek> didn't know where else to look
[23:56] <jbicha> basically projectmallard and already existing docs are where you should look
[23:57] <Captainkrtek> okay gotcha
[23:57] <Captainkrtek> thanks for all the help
[23:57] <Captainkrtek> sorry for bothering
[23:57] <jbicha> we're going to update the wiki but because we're trying to finish up natty's docs it might not get done this week
[23:57] <Captainkrtek> okay
[23:57] <jbicha> no, you're not a bother at all
[23:58] <Captainkrtek> well thanks for your patience in helping a nuub :-)