[00:10] <GrueMaster> Is anyone here testing the armel release images?
[00:40] <rbelem> GrueMaster, did you test the images? i dont have how to test, since my device is only an old beagleboard :'(
[00:41] <GrueMaster> I'll start on them soon.  Will do desktop first, as mobile is still a tech preview (iirc).
[00:43] <rbelem> GrueMaster, oki np :-)
[00:43] <rbelem> GrueMaster, it is tech preview
[00:45] <rbelem> GrueMaster, in 11.10 it will left the tech preview status :-D
[00:45] <GrueMaster> Excellent!
[00:46] <GrueMaster> On a side note, in 11.10, we will be looking at adding hardware pack capabilities for people using the SOC on unsupported hardware (i.e. n900, Blaze, etc).
[00:47] <GrueMaster> The only things that should really be swapped are platform specific x-loader & u-boot, and maybe specific deb packages like your n900 support deb.
[00:48] <rbelem> groovy :-D
[00:48] <ScottK> It'd be nice for there to be more clarity about what the Ubuntu kernel will and won't support.  n900 is using the Linaro kernel because it was our understanding that the Ubuntu arm kernel would only support omap4 this cycle.
[00:57] <GrueMaster> ScottK: Yea, there was a major disconnect that got straightened out at the Rally.
[00:58] <ScottK> Then when we found out, it was too late since the porting work was already done.
[00:58] <GrueMaster> The reason we can't use linaro kernels is there won't be any SRU updates.
[00:58] <ScottK> Exactly why I'd prefer we weren't.
[00:58] <GrueMaster> I take it you have hw specific patches in the kernel?
[00:59] <ScottK> I don't recall how he did it, if it's a hwpack or a code copy, but it's based on linaro.
[01:00] <ScottK> I haven't tested it on n900 since I gave mine away to the guy doing the kernel work so he'd have the target hardware.
[01:03] <GrueMaster> So why does the mobile image keep bouncing from a rootfs only to a full SD image and back?
[01:04] <ScottK> No idea.
[01:21] <rbelem> GrueMaster, it is better to have a rootfs than an image with fixed image size
[01:22] <GrueMaster> The image resizes on first boot.
[01:22] <rbelem> GrueMaster, how?
[01:23] <GrueMaster> We have a tool that gets inserted into the initramfs on the boot partition.  On first boot, it looks at the SD card and resizes the rootfs to fill it.  It also reformats to boot partition ot match the chs for the SD card used.
[01:23] <GrueMaster> The scripts are part of jasper-initramfs.
[01:23] <rbelem> :-O
[01:23] <rbelem> I didn't know about that
[01:24] <GrueMaster> You and I discussed this during beta 1 & beta 2.
[01:24] <GrueMaster> :P
[01:26] <rbelem> i think i misundestood what you said :'(
[01:27] <GrueMaster> The idea is the buildd generates a rootfs, then the post-build in d-i generates a 2+G SD image with that and a vfat boot partition that contains the bootloader & kernel.
[01:28] <GrueMaster> Then the user can just dd to an SD card and boot.  Pretty painless.
[01:30] <rbelem> do we have how to change the partition scheme?
[01:30] <GrueMaster> We've been doing this since Maverick.  I'm surprised you didn't know that.
[01:30] <rbelem> :'(
[01:32] <rbelem> GrueMaster, well... let's use that next release
[01:33] <rbelem> GrueMaster, are you going t uds?
[01:33] <rbelem> *to
[01:34] <GrueMaster> Yes.  Only reason I missed UDS-N was at UDS-M, I had to get permission for vacation for a Cruise my wife was planning.  After she bought our tickets, they announced the date for UDS-N in Orlando.
[01:34] <GrueMaster> Are you going?  We'll have to hook up for a beer.
[01:35] <rbelem> GrueMaster, yup :-)
[01:35] <rbelem> GrueMaster, yeah :-D I owe you some beers
[01:36] <GrueMaster> Pfft.  We'll share the load.  :P
[01:36] <rbelem> eheheh :-D
[04:18] <c2tarun> apachelogger: ping
[04:52] <ScottK> maco: Will galley need an SRU to go with the new kdebindings or is it good as built with just the SRU?
[04:53] <ScottK> (for bindings)
[05:01] <maco> ScottK: no-change rebuild
[05:02] <ScottK> You ought to be able to go ahead and upload it now for it's own SRU.
[05:07] <maco> ok
[05:08]  * maco wonders if she should make a more-useful manpage at the same time
[05:10] <valorie> that is one of the best sentences I have ever heard a developer utter
[05:10] <valorie> maco ++
[05:10] <ScottK> ok?
[05:10] <ScottK> Or am I lacking context?
[05:10] <maco> ScottK: the part about the manpage :P
[05:12] <maco> right now its like "hi, im a manpage, because debian says i need to exist"
[05:12] <ScottK> It should to better than that.
[05:12] <maco> but should probably have info about acquiring lesson files...as this bug i have sitting in debian tells me
[07:26] <jussi> in case any of you didnt see it: Just as a heads-up for KDE developers, the current release plan for KDE SC 4.7 has Thursday 28 April as the deadline to have desired features added to the 4.7 Feature Plan, otherwise they have to wait for the next release.
[08:11] <valorie> eek, I just volunteered to do a session Introducing Kubuntu in Open Week
[08:43] <agateau> Riddell: morning, sorry I left before reading your last messages yesterday evening,
[08:44] <agateau> Riddell: thanks for the upload! It is going to be a bit complicated to write a test case for the bug though, but will see what we can do
[08:48] <jussi> hrm, where do I find qt4-linguist in maverick?
[09:18] <bigbrovar-sgs> hi guys, i have been having issues with my kubuntu natty install. mainly after a while it refuses to hangs at boot. had this problem on 32bit, then i switched to 64 bit and i am having the same issues. it just hangs at but and nothing else reponds.  when i even try to use safe mode. it hangs at safe mode console menu. 
[09:19] <valorie> bigbrovar-sgs: have you tried asking in #ubuntu+1 ?
[09:19] <valorie> they are the natty specialists
[09:21] <bigbrovar-sgs> my machine is an hp probook 4420s, core i5 with intel arrandale chip 
[09:21] <bigbrovar-sgs> ok i will head over there thanks 
[09:46] <apachelogger> c2tarun: pogo
[10:20] <Riddell> agateau: by test case I don't mean a formalied unit test, just "run unity-2d, notice that memory isn't being eaten up" would do
[10:20] <Riddell> it already has a test case in the patch anyway
[10:21] <agateau> Riddell: ok, we're all set then
[10:21] <steveire> Riddell: There's a wetab blog that keeps appearing on platen kde
[10:21] <steveire> planet
[10:21] <bambee> morning
[10:21] <steveire> If we remove the feed will that stop until the author fixes it?
[10:34] <c2tarun> apachelogger: if I want to look into any project related to phonon for SoK, can you please tell me from where should I start my research to prepare report?
[10:37] <Riddell> steveire: wetab blog?
[10:38] <Riddell> oh, saigkill
[10:44] <steveire> Yeah
[10:44] <steveire> I talked to sysadmin
[10:44] <steveire> I think bcooksley is handling it
[10:44] <Riddell> he just sent out a grumpy e-mail
[10:44] <steveire> Going to email him or somethng
[10:45] <steveire> who bcooksley?
[10:45] <apachelogger> c2tarun: talk to kde game developers or amarok/dragon/kaffeine/tomahawk developers
[10:45] <apachelogger> ask them for what they are missing in phonon
[10:46] <apachelogger> or what they dislike partcularly
[10:46] <apachelogger> then write a proposal to fix that ^^
[11:27] <Riddell> rbelem: ping, doing any testing of kubuntu mobile?
[14:16] <Riddell> all new DVDs to test
[15:48] <GrueMaster> Riddell: Did the armel images get respun as well?
[15:58] <Riddell> GrueMaster: nope
[15:59] <Riddell> GrueMaster: although kubuntu mobile images could do with being tested (boot only, no install needed)
[15:59] <GrueMaster> Ok.  Wanted to make sure before I dove in.
[15:59] <ryanakca> ScottK: Will do as soon as I find the passwords
[16:09] <c2tarun> which is the best voip framework for kubuntu?
[16:39] <GrueMaster> Why do the mobile armel images keep changing?  While I haven't tested since Beta 2, dailies have been complete preinstalled images until 20110425, when they reverted back to rootfs only.
[16:45] <GrueMaster> See http://paste.ubuntu.com/599850/ to know what I am referring to.
[16:45] <GrueMaster> The images with the x86 boot sector are ready to run.
[16:53] <rbelem> Riddell, i will test today the image in the n900
[17:15] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: ping
[17:46] <c2tarun> anybody here familiar with application development using Qt4Telepathy?
[18:01] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: ping
[18:07] <GrueMaster> rbelem: plasma-mobile.desktop is still not in /usr/share/autostart.
[18:08] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: syn
[18:09] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: hey, I want to make a VoIP plugin for kontact using telepathy, is it possible?
[18:09] <shadeslayer> wot
[18:09] <shadeslayer> oh
[18:09] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: SoK ?
[18:10] <Riddell> GrueMaster: it shouldn't be, it should be in /usr/share/kubuntu-mobile-default-settings/ and $KDEDIRS set
[18:10] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: Yup :)
[18:10] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: best to ask telepathy guys in #kde-telepathy if someone is not working on that already
[18:10] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: well, noone proposed that project in GSoC. So I thought of taking it to SoK
[18:11] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: yeah, but someone *might* have proposed it in the GSoC proposals and might not have made it
[18:11] <GrueMaster> Riddell: Well, unless it is moved as I noted, it fails to start.
[18:11] <shadeslayer> ( altho afaik .. no one proposed it, but you can never be too sure ^_^ )
[18:12] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: but still no one got it :) thats is I am sure ;)
[18:12] <GrueMaster> As the images sit now, there are too many failures to go forward without a lot of intervention.
[18:13] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: I asked valorie and she said to write a report and submit it, I was doing my research on asterisk when I found about telepathy. I heard on channel once that you are doing something on telepathy, so I pinged you
[18:14] <shadeslayer> yeah i've worked on a couple of bug fixes for telepathy, nothing major tho :)
[18:14] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: + I saw a video presentation given by McQueen and he told that VoIP applications can be build using telepathy. 
[18:15] <shadeslayer> yep
[18:15] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: Can you please direct me to some tutorial or development manual on telepathy
[18:15] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: there's the "How to build telepathy KDE" page
[18:15] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: you could start off by suggesting a new name ^_^
[18:16] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: yeah thats a good idea :) and one more help please, can you tell me what is the difference b/w Qt programming and Kde programming language?
[18:17] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: well.. you can sort of visualize that graphically ... KDE is built on the Qt toolkit
[18:17] <shadeslayer> and loads of the Qt functions have been modified/overloaded to fit KDE's needs
[18:18] <shadeslayer> Riddell:  apachelogger: ^^ anything i should add to that?
[18:19] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: I mean what is the difference between http://techbase.kde.org/Development/Tutorials#Introduction_To_KDE_4_Programming and Qt?
[18:20] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: different classes 
[18:21] <shadeslayer> visually they look pretty much the same
[18:21] <shadeslayer> but, if you look at the included classes, those differ by a huge amount
[18:22] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: yup, there are differences. The problem is kontact is in this kde- prgramming language. Is it possible to make a plugin for it in Qt?
[18:22] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: an in hello world program, prerequisites include Qt O_O
[18:23] <c2tarun> /s/an/and
[18:23] <shadeslayer> well .. if you implement it via DBus ...sure ... not entirely sure how it's going to be implemented
[18:23] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: where?
[18:24] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: well I was reading about telepathy and D-Bus first time, but what I thought is I'll make a plugin using telepathy development and it will take care of messing with D-Bus. am I wrong?
[18:24] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: did you read what D-Bus is?
[18:25] <shadeslayer> it's not *that* easy :PO
[18:25] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: yup, just the introductory part
[18:25] <shadeslayer> s/O/
[18:25] <c2tarun> :(
[18:25] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: right, so explain it to me ....
[18:25] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: s/functions/classes
[18:25] <shadeslayer> right ^^
[18:26] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: dbus is a system for interprocess communication.
[18:26] <apachelogger> KDE just adds a desktop integration focus to Qt
[18:26] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: by a long shot, do you happen to have a presentation of sorts on the 802.11 standard?
[18:26] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: presentation?
[18:26] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: yes, a slideshow etc
[18:27] <apachelogger> nopes
[18:27] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: right, and what do you understand by IPC?
[18:27] <shadeslayer> :S
[18:27] <apachelogger> plus you would not want slides from me anyway
[18:27]  * shadeslayer looks at ieee
[18:27] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: whai?
[18:27] <apachelogger> there are no more than 5 of them evar and they contain no more then 3 useful words :P
[18:27] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: interprocess communication, how can two processes on same or different machines can send messages to each other.
[18:28] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: " ... on different machines ... " that's RPC
[18:28] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: lemme guess, Phonon, Webkit and Pink
[18:28]  * apachelogger notes that communication is not just sending but processing too, which makes things fun :P
[18:28] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: aye
[18:28] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: that actually sums up my fosdem presentation
[18:28] <apachelogger> fun
[18:28] <apachelogger> :D
[18:29] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: well may be I am wrong but, its written somewhere that dbus can be used for processes on different system, if there is no encryption involved
[18:29] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: oh that must have been fun
[18:30]  * apachelogger also points out that RPC is a special version of IPC
[18:30] <shadeslayer> yep
[18:30] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: more awesomer version of IPC
[18:31] <apachelogger> generally speaking IPC is also when you use a pipe in a shell
[18:31] <apachelogger> whereby stdin/stdout provide the IPC framework
[18:31] <shadeslayer> didja see the patch with QtDBus peer to peer support?
[18:31] <apachelogger> no
[18:31] <shadeslayer> didja hear about it?
[18:31] <apachelogger> no
[18:31] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: you're getting old
[18:31]  * apachelogger was watching .prn ever since he won gsoc
[18:32] <apachelogger> that is why I am already half way done and you are not :P
[18:32] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: hmm.... in short this is not as easy as I thought :(
[18:32] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: nope :)
[18:32] <c2tarun> god :( I need a mentor who can at least tell me what to look for ;(
[18:32] <apachelogger> RPC dbus?
[18:33] <c2tarun> apachelogger: what?
[18:33] <apachelogger> nvm
[18:34] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: does your team of awesome have a name already?
[18:34] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: quite like ... File transfers without a google server
[18:34]  * c2tarun shooting at nothing :(
[18:34] <apachelogger> mine still did not reply :(
[18:34] <shadeslayer> aw
[18:34] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: #kde-telepathy i tell you
[18:34] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: wanna swap? :P
[18:34] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: mine is too busy fiddling around names
[18:35] <apachelogger> you cannot be too busy to find silly names
[18:35] <shadeslayer> they came up with Kryptonite and stuff
[18:35] <apachelogger> then again I already found the siliest of them all
[18:35] <apachelogger> Oo
[18:35] <apachelogger> G
[18:35] <apachelogger> kde cheeseballs ftw!
[18:35] <apachelogger> c2tarun: http://community.kde.org/GSoC/2011/Ideas
[18:35] <apachelogger> c2tarun: http://community.kde.org/GSoC/2010/Ideas
[18:35] <apachelogger> c2tarun: http://techbase.kde.org/index.php?title=Projects/Summer_of_Code/2009/Ideas
[18:35] <c2tarun> apachelogger: I took one from there only :(
[18:35] <c2tarun> 2010?
[18:35]  * c2tarun looking
[18:36] <apachelogger> c2tarun: http://techbase.kde.org/index.php?title=Projects/Summer_of_Code/2008/Ideas
[18:36] <apachelogger> c2tarun: http://techbase.kde.org/index.php?title=Projects/Summer_of_Code/2007/Ideas
[18:36] <c2tarun> hmm.......
[18:36] <c2tarun> apachelogger: got it :/ I gotta dive in history
[18:36] <apachelogger> if you cannot find inspiration there I fear we might have a problem
[18:37] <c2tarun> apachelogger: inspiration cannot substitute lack of knowledge :(
[18:37] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: what are your Komrades working on?
[18:37] <apachelogger> c2tarun: you just need to find the right scope fo rhte inspiration :P
[18:38]  * apachelogger starts writing phonon head0rs
[18:38] <c2tarun> apachelogger: an idol will help a lot ;)
[18:39] <apachelogger> I hear apachelogger has a fan club
[18:40] <c2tarun> :D :D :D
[18:40] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: good question .... i don't remember
[18:41] <shadeslayer> Mercurial plugin for dolphin
[18:41] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: there are very few guys in kde-telepathy, can you please tell me what should I ask? "How can I build a VoIP plugin using telepathy?" <-- is this good?
[18:41] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: you are not very good at community bonding, are you? :P
[18:41] <shadeslayer> and the other on working on plasma educational desktop
[18:41] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: more like .. i have too much coursework piled up that makes me forget
[18:42] <apachelogger> oh, yeah, the excuse paradigm
[18:42] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: more details would go a long way in helping people out how to help you
[18:42] <apachelogger> http://aplg.kollide.net/tmp/output.mkv ole!
[18:42] <c2tarun> hmm....
[18:42]  * shadeslayer wgets
[18:43] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: if I remove telepathy out of picture can I just implement this plugin via D-Bus?
[18:44] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: i think you *only* need to deal with DBus and Kontact
[18:44] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: that is one hell of help :) thanks a lot
[18:45] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: look at the dbus interface of telepathy kde and what it offers
[18:45]  * shadeslayer is yet to look at it
[18:45] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: unlike Western countries, they give us shitloads of coursework here :(
[18:46] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: still I think I should read about dbus first. knowing it better will help me in understanding the working of telepathy (I guess)
[18:46] <shadeslayer> i mean like ... assignments that run into 40 pages which have to be written by hand
[18:46] <shadeslayer> c2tarun: yep
[18:46] <c2tarun> shadeslayer: thanks :)
[18:46] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: clearly you should have studied in the empire of west then
[18:46] <shadeslayer> *nod*
[18:46] <apachelogger> now
[18:46] <apachelogger> by hand
[18:46] <apachelogger> like
[18:46] <apachelogger> by friggin hand?
[18:46] <apachelogger> with pencil and stuff?
[18:47] <shadeslayer> pen and stuff
[18:47] <shadeslayer> yes
[18:47]  * apachelogger blinks
[18:47] <apachelogger> and you are sure you are studying computer science?
[18:47] <shadeslayer> no .. i'm studying Electronics
[18:47] <apachelogger> oh
[18:47] <apachelogger> that makes sense then
[18:47] <shadeslayer> what
[18:47] <shadeslayer> how?
[18:47] <bambee> lol
[18:48] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: but CSE students don't have it easy as well
[18:48] <apachelogger> around here one also needs to write a shitload of stuff by hand if studying electronics
[18:48] <shadeslayer> pretty much the same stuff over there too
[18:48] <shadeslayer> ouch
[18:48]  * shadeslayer goes back to IEEE 802.11 n
[18:48] <apachelogger> in computer science at my university there are like 5 courses that have assignments with hand writing stuff
[18:49] <apachelogger> everything else is the digital0rizer
[18:51]  * bambee still does not understand why exams are not on machines... it's silly
[18:51] <bambee> (for computer science)
[19:11] <livcd> Is kde compiled using a SSP ?
[19:18] <apachelogger> livcd: please define SSP
[19:19] <livcd> apachelogger: with what flag is KDE (and his parts) compiled...like -fstack-protector or -all 
[19:20] <maco> stack smashing prevention
[19:20] <livcd> protector
[19:20] <livcd> :P
[19:20] <maco> i found someone actually breaking the acronym down into words on the 2nd page of my googling
[19:21] <maco> livcd: do you mean something like a canary?
[19:21] <apachelogger> livcd: I believe all of ubuntu defaults ot stack smashing protection
[19:21] <yofel> according to gccs manpage -fstack-protector is on by default in ubuntu, -all isn't from what I see
[19:21] <apachelogger> maco: SSP has about 5000 meanings
[19:22] <apachelogger> at least 1k of them are computing related :P
[19:22] <maco> multimedia.cx/eggs/heroic-defender-of-the-stack/ says prevention :P
[19:22] <livcd> some parts are not protected
[19:22] <livcd> like
[19:22] <livcd> firefox parts
[19:22] <livcd> they want to have it fast 
[19:22] <apachelogger> they *need* to have it fast because the software is already insanely slow as it is :P
[19:23] <livcd> security > usability
[19:23] <livcd> for me :)
[19:24] <apachelogger> well, it is about usability in the most original meaning :P
[19:24] <livcd> i was asking for friend cuz he wants to use replace thunderbird by kmail
[19:24] <apachelogger> I'd imagine firefox not being usable (as in not at all) with stack protection :P
[19:24] <livcd> bah
[19:24] <maco> livcd: i know a stack canary is used all over ubuntu
[19:25] <apachelogger> well, I don't recall us unsetting stack protection
[19:25] <maco> there's also an #ubuntu-security channel
[19:25] <livcd> i dont like when im thinking about something and then i write half of text
[19:25] <apachelogger> so considering it is default for gcc, all of KDE is stack protected on ubuntu
[19:25] <maco> oh look a 404
[19:25] <micahg> maco: should fwd to #ubuntu-hardened
[19:25] <livcd> thought k/ubuntu are different projects
[19:26] <maco> micahg: the 404 i was looking at was http://www.ubuntu.com/usn/server/features/security
[19:26] <livcd> different packages creators
[19:26] <apachelogger> livcd: they are not
[19:26] <apachelogger> they are different products
[19:26] <apachelogger> made by the same community
[19:26] <maco> livcd: we use the same build servers, same archives, etc.
[19:26] <micahg> maco: thanks, I'll get someone to look at that
[19:26] <apachelogger> well, different teams within the community actually ^^
[19:26] <yofel> livcd: we share the same archive and thus the same compiler, just the shipped package set is different
[19:26] <apachelogger> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/69910117/buildlog_ubuntu-natty-i386.kde4libs_4%3A4.6.2-0ubuntu4_BUILDING.txt.gz
[19:26] <apachelogger> we do not unsest stack protection
[19:26] <livcd> Im using ubuntu only for my familiy computer
[19:27] <livcd> still learning LFS
[19:27] <apachelogger> hence all of KDE is stack protected by default
[19:27] <apachelogger> (of course I would not dare claiming that every package obeys to that)
[19:28] <micahg> maco: where's that link from?
[19:28] <livcd> apachelogger: For all the security stuff there is Ubuntu security team ...well maybe mainly Kees Cook ?
[19:28] <maco> micahg: http://www.ubuntu.com/usn/
[19:28] <micahg> maco: thanks
[19:28] <micahg> livcd: there's #ubuntu-hardened if you want to ask the security team questions
[19:29] <Riddell> to be fair on the rest of the security team there several wonderful people on it as well as Kees
[19:29] <maco> like beattie
[19:29] <maco> i usually ask beattie when i have questions
[19:29] <livcd> micahg: But they are using grsec mainly i think...and security in mainstream ubuntu is different :)
[19:29]  * apachelogger usually refreains from having questions :P
[19:30] <maco> grsec? thats only compatible with a few kernels, and only every now and then when the author catches up with upstream linux
[19:31] <livcd> maco: there are packages 
[19:31] <livcd> Julien Tinnes of google i think
[19:31] <livcd> did that for ubuntu/debian
[19:40] <maco> Riddell: in oneiric, can kaccessible be installed by default? its the screenreader for kde
[19:40] <maco> apparently it now has one, it's just not at-spi compatible, so you need to run kaccessible & orca at the same time to cover all your apps
[19:41] <maco> (assuming a mix of gnome & kde, which i think is pretty common)
[19:42] <Riddell> maco: depends on disk space as ever, of course I'm not around for oneiric so it's up to those who are
[19:42] <maco> oh right
[19:42] <Riddell> maco: the Accessibility option on the CD boot screen hasn't dont anything in Kubuntu since KDE 4 came along, it would be a nice project to see if something could be done with it
[19:43] <maco> ouch
[19:43] <maco> ok
[19:43] <maco> step one would be getting kaccessible on the cd then
[19:43] <maco> as that's what's needed to make ubiquity be speakable
[19:43] <Riddell> it is?
[19:43] <Riddell> how does it do that?
[19:44] <maco> im not sure yet what other changes (if any) i'd need to make to pykde ubiquity frontend 
[19:44] <maco> kaccessible is the kde screenreader
[19:44] <maco> its new in 4.6
[19:45] <maco> qt-at-spi is apparently about making a bridge so that the stuff kaccessible would read can be passed on to dbus for at-spi2 screenreaders to use
[19:45] <maco> but is not really done yet
[19:45] <maco> in the meantime, ive gotten kaccessible to read *some* stuff in kde, though i havent tried it with ubiquity yet
[19:45] <maco> it works dandily with menus, but its treatment of konsole & konqueror leaves something to be desired 
[19:46] <maco> but certainly the first step to getting ubiquity to be read aloud is having something to do the reading!
[19:47] <maco> (im intending to spend a good chunk of oneiric time fixing up the pygtk frontend of ubiquity to say useful things instead of just things)
[19:49] <Riddell> maco: what do you need to do to get kaccessible to read stuff?
[19:50] <maco> Riddell: you need to have QT_ACCESSIBITY=1  in your env
[19:50] <maco> Riddell: so youd want to set that in your session startup (which some kde session startup config thingy can do but i forget what its called)
[19:50] <maco> or just do QT_ACCESSIBILITY=1 kate
[19:50] <maco> well, after starting kaccessibleapp
[19:50] <maco> which is in /usr/lib/kde4/exec/ i think?
[19:50] <maco> dpkg -L kaccessible to double check
[19:51] <maco> we'd want the accessible option in the menu to set QT_ACCESSIBLITY in the env before starting the session with ubiquity in it
[19:51] <Riddell> I think I'm missing a text-to-speach programme
[19:51] <maco> espeak?
[19:52] <maco> ok step one for testing it:  start kaccessibleapp
[19:52] <maco> you should get a little blue circle with white man in it in your tray
[19:52] <maco> see that?
[19:53] <maco> /usr/lib/kde4/libexec/kaccessibleapp  <-- oh thats the path
[19:53] <maco> if you wanted it for permanent, then you'd use the kaccessible service
[19:53] <Riddell> golly, it works
[19:54] <maco> yeah! thats why this has to go into oneiric
[19:54] <maco> but like i said, still some weirdness with konsole and konqueror
[19:54] <maco> like, it recites numbers, and i don't know why
[19:54] <maco> oh, and konqueror is not keyboard-usable afaict
[19:55] <maco> (i did "ls" and it said "42")
[19:55] <maco> (in konsole, i mean)
[19:55] <Riddell> we default to rekonq of course
[19:55] <maco> kde.org in konqueror read off a string of numbers
[19:55] <maco> i suspect in the case of ls it was telling me how many files had been output, but it didnt read their names
[19:59] <Riddell> rbelem: kubuntu mobile is waiting for your sign off on https://wiki.kubuntu.org/NattyNarwhal/ReleaseManifest
[20:00] <Riddell> Tm_Tr: powerpc really needs some love http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/
[20:07] <Tm_T> Riddell: ye, I'm fighting with hardware issues here, but I'll have some results in a few minutes
[20:23] <arpan> hi
[20:24] <arpan> can anyone help me with nvidia drivers causing this-> http://imagebin.org/150465
[20:25] <Tm_T> Riddell: live boots, apps gets launched
[20:26] <Tm_T> ...and because of apparently broken hardware (I/O errors from cdrom device) at some point I got plasma-desktop being rather unresponsive
[20:48] <Tm_K> Riddell: works, as you see
[23:05] <Riddell> Tm_T: lovely thanks
[23:37] <Riddell> rbelem: ping
[23:37] <rbelem> Riddell, pong
[23:40] <Riddell> rbelem: yo, do we have a plan to sign off the mobile images?
[23:40] <Riddell> actually, I think the arm ones are being rebuilt
[23:40] <rbelem> Riddell, yup, i'm testing the i386 right now
[23:41] <rbelem> Riddell, and will test omap3 on n900 in a couple minutes
[23:43] <Riddell> groovy, make sure you get the 20110427 image
[23:44] <Riddell> I wonder why kubuntu mobile doesn't like being run on virtualbox, I just get funny colours
[23:45] <rbelem> Riddell, me too
[23:45] <rbelem> Riddell, i'm checking that too
[23:51] <rbelem> Riddell, i dont understant why it is waiting for the enter key to be pressed so X starts
[23:52] <rbelem> Riddell, do you have an idea?
[23:53] <Riddell> mm, nope
[23:54] <Riddell> rbelem: in virtualbox or on real hardware?
[23:54] <rbelem> Riddell, /etc/default/nodm is nice
[23:54] <rbelem> Riddell, virtualbox
[23:54] <rbelem> Riddell, i will test on n900 now