[00:02] <jasoncwarner> TheMuso RAOF bryceh robert_ancell
[00:02] <jasoncwarner> you guys ready?
[00:02] <jasoncwarner> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-04-26
[00:02] <TheMuso> Hey folks.
[00:02] <TheMuso> Hope your weekend was good to you.
[00:03] <jasoncwarner> Hope everyone had a restful few days....and now...
[00:03] <jasoncwarner> we are off!
[00:03] <jasoncwarner> Ok...[TOPIC] X update...
[00:03] <TheMuso> Yeah it was nice, by the end of yesterday I was starting to feel I didn't want to return. :)
[00:04] <RAOF> I've hunted down the random compiz hangs and should have an SRUable kernel patch todayish.
[00:05] <jasoncwarner> RAOF: cool...anything you need support on?
[00:05] <RAOF> Well, a faster system to build kernels on would be nice :)
[00:05] <jasoncwarner> ;)
[00:05] <DBO> aaaand my deck is now covered in an inch of hail
[00:05] <DBO> awesome
[00:06]  * RAOF should look into harnessing the kernel team's mammoth build resources, actually.
[00:06] <jasoncwarner> ANything else of note worth talking about just a couple of days before the release?
[00:06] <DBO> RAOF, wait
[00:06] <DBO> really!
[00:06] <DBO> the hangs
[00:06] <DBO> they are all dead!?
[00:06] <DBO> RAOF, you deserve much kudos and praise
[00:07] <RAOF> DBO: Not yet, but I know what's causing them and two different ways to fix it :)
[00:07] <DBO> it is clear yourself and anyone associated with you is both a gentleman and a scholar
[00:07] <DBO> so you're saying it's as good as fixed :P
[00:08] <jasoncwarner> Ok...sounds like not much else of note...so [END MEETING]
[00:09] <jasoncwarner> yay for getting close to release! and for beers in budapest (I would have said wine cooler, but I still want people to think of me as an ok person)
[00:09] <DBO> is anyone else afraid of going to Hungary?
[00:09] <Sweetshark> DBO: Cant be worse than last year.
[00:09] <DBO> just me then? *goes and curls up in a corner to cry himself to sleep*
[00:10] <RAOF> DBO: Why?  Have I missed some eastern European news?
[00:11] <DBO> Im american, I am trained from birth to fear everything that doesn't speak english and eat hamburgers
[00:11] <DBO> this, btw, explains why jasoncwarner chose to move to australia :P
[00:12] <RAOF> Weren't you in Prague?
[00:12] <RAOF> The sprints, they all blur together in a haze of indoorsness.
[00:13] <DBO> I was yes
[00:13] <DBO> dont worry
[00:13] <DBO> I cried myself to sleep there too
[00:14] <DBO> and in spain, brussels, and worst of all, texas
[00:14] <RAOF> Yeah.  Dallas was scary!~
[00:14] <RAOF> Hurray for OpenGL extensions completely oblivious to dual-head.
[00:16] <bryceh> heya, sorry my wife came in and distracted me just as the meeting kicked off
[00:16] <DBO> bryceh, you were voted off the island
[00:16] <bryceh> jasoncwarner, I posted my update to the meeting wiki.  Finally solved one of the major GPU lockups
[00:18] <bryceh> also I think I've got the arrandale bug cornered, although not bisected down to a specific patch yet
[00:19] <bryceh> jasoncwarner, terri apologizes for my absence, and blames her pregnant nesting angst
[00:24] <bryceh> problem I'm running into is that once I have people test with newer kernels, it's hard to find someone willing to do some git bisection work :-P
[00:24] <TheMuso> Yeah that can be rather daunting for some.
[00:24] <TheMuso> s/some/many/
[00:25] <jasoncwarner> bryceh: uhm...understood and, well, very much understand ;)
[00:26] <bryceh> jasoncwarner, rickspencer3, the overlay scrollbar thingee kinda sounds like something that people will assume to be an X bug
[00:26] <rickspencer3> bryceh, yeah
[00:26] <rickspencer3> even mdz did
[00:32] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, firefox + valgrind = pain
[00:52] <RAOF> Not the nippy fox?
[00:53] <chrisccoulson> RAOF - it took more than 5 minutes to start up in valgrind
[00:53] <RAOF> Meep.
[00:53] <chrisccoulson> i couldn't really do anything useful with it
[02:04] <jbicha> hi I reported 771562 but I don't know where to submit a merge proposal
[02:05] <jbicha> to Unity trunk or the ubuntu-desktop packaging?
[02:05] <jbicha> bug 771562
[02:05] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 771562 in unity "[UIFe] Whitelist system-config-printer-applet" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/771562
[02:08] <TheMuso> jbicha: If its not fixed in unity trunk, I'd propose a merge there, and then worry about getting it into natty. I'd say getting the fix in trunk will make it easier for didrocks to cherry pick the patch and include it in the packaging.
[02:09] <jbicha> TheMuso: ok, thanks
[02:09] <TheMuso> np
[03:19] <jcastro> jasoncwarner: https://launchpad.net/sprints/uds-o
[03:19] <jcastro> jasoncwarner: you need to click "register yourself" in the top right
[03:19] <jcastro> jasoncwarner: and the other thing, on each one:
[03:19] <jcastro> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-unity2d-qt-cdspace
[03:20] <jcastro> where it says sprint, you need to "Propose for Sprint" and pick UDS-O
[03:20] <jcastro> jasoncwarner: if you click register from this page: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/sprints/uds-o it auto proposes it to the sprint if you want to do it that way for all the newer ones
[03:31] <kenvandine> dobey, i've got a branch of indicator-weather which makes desktopcouch optional :)
[04:18] <wick94> hi
[04:18] <wick94> guys is this a channel to ask for gnome 3 help?
[04:19] <RAOF> No.
[04:19] <wick94> is there a chanel for gnome?
[04:19] <RAOF> Unless it's help for packaging bits of gnome 3 :)
[04:19] <RAOF> Well, there's #gnome on gimpnet.
[04:19] <wick94> nah its not abt tht
[04:19] <wick94> thnx
[04:20] <wick94> :)
[04:23] <wick94> RAOF my question's abt how to install an extension in gnome shell
[04:23] <wick94> i need to install the "user theme" extension
[04:29] <RAOF> I've got no idea, and since gnome-shell isn't actually packaged in the latest Ubuntu release, it's unlikely that anyone here is going to be particularly familiar with it :)
[04:41] <kenvandine> wick94, you want #gnome-shell on gimpnet
[06:38] <hyperair> ````
[06:38] <hyperair> whoops
[07:30] <didrocks> good morning
[07:32] <pitti> Good morning
[07:32] <didrocks> guten morgen pitti
[07:32] <pitti> Cimi_: I accepted a new overlay-scrollbar into natty-proposed last night
[07:33] <pitti> Cimi_: if you have another one on top of that, the uploader needs to include the previous changelog with -v, otherwise this works
[07:33] <pitti> bonjour didrocks, ca va?
[07:33] <didrocks> pitti: I'm fine, thanks, and you? Still lost in packing? ;)
[07:34] <pitti> didrocks: heh, yes; it's still a ton of work
[07:36] <Sweetshark> bonjours a tous
[07:39] <didrocks> Sweetshark: bonjour! :-)
[07:42] <pitti> Sweetshark: bonjour Monsieur Michaelsen!
[07:46] <kenvandine> good morning guys
[07:46] <kenvandine> pitti, i'll upload the new overlay-scrollbars in the morning
[07:46] <pitti> kenvandine: please use -v<natty version>
[07:46] <kenvandine> will do
[07:49] <Sweetshark> launchpad is not very grateful today -- telling me that my libreoffice packaging membership is about to expire ...
[07:51] <pitti> Sweetshark: can you renew it yourself?
[07:52] <Sweetshark> pitti: it said I should ask doko, which I did.
[07:56] <didrocks> pitti: on bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/771562, I'm requesting design feedback first
[07:56] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 771562 in unity "Whitelist system-config-printer-applet" [Undecided,Incomplete]
[07:56] <Sweetshark> Hmmm, only 4 LibreOffice GSoC projects ...
[07:58] <pitti> didrocks: but this clearly breaks printer setup and job feedback..
[07:59] <didrocks> pitti: right, but as design clearly wanted that whitelist telling important apps are aready ported, it's a way to make them conscious it's not the case…
[08:03] <Sweetshark> jasoncwarner: /win 5
[08:03] <Sweetshark> ups
[08:14] <chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
[08:15] <pitti> hey chrisccoulson
[08:15] <chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
[08:16] <pitti> pretty well, thansk!
[08:16] <chrisccoulson> RAOF, you are my hero!
[08:17] <RAOF> chrisccoulson: Oh, if you're on i386 then http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~sarvatt/raof/ contains a kernel that should work for you :)
[08:17] <chrisccoulson> RAOF, i'm on amd64 ;)
[08:17] <RAOF> Well, you can always build the kernel from source :)
[08:18] <chrisccoulson> heh, i might try that
[08:18] <chrisccoulson> it can't be any more painful than running firefox in valgrind!
[08:18] <RAOF> The patch you're after is http://cooperteam.net/patchme.patch
[08:18] <RAOF> Heh.  The kernel might be built before you've finished testing firefox :)
[08:18] <chrisccoulson> yeah, it might be finished before firefox even starts ;)
[08:19] <didrocks> hey chrisccoulson!
[08:19] <chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, how are you?
[08:19] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'm fine thanks, seems than soon you will have a freeze-free natty thanks to RAOF :-)
[08:19] <chrisccoulson> yes, hopefully :-)
[08:20] <RAOF> It could do with a round of actual kernel-hacker review, but fundamentally I think it's sound :)
[08:26] <didrocks> @everyone: I'm making the 0-day SRU unity and nux release (then packaging and pushing to -proposed). All testing appreciated!
[08:34] <pitti> yay
[08:51] <rodrigo_> morning
[09:06] <seb128> hey desktopers
[09:06] <rodrigo_> hi seb128
[09:06] <seb128> hey rodrigo_
[09:06] <seb128> how are you?
[09:06] <rodrigo_> seb128, fine and you?
[09:07] <RAOF> Good morninging seb128!
[09:07] <seb128> hey RAOF
[09:07] <seb128> hey chrisccoulson
[09:07] <seb128> rodrigo_, I'm fine thanks!
[09:07] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, weird. i just logged in to my session and i have no theme, but g-s-d is running normally :/
[09:07] <chrisccoulson> hi seb128
[09:08] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, g-s-d 2.32 I guess?
[09:08] <chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, yeah
[09:08] <seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, we get some bugs about that issue, if you can investigate that would be useful
[09:09] <rodrigo_> seb128, oh, what bug #?
[09:09] <seb128> bug #771308 is a recent example
[09:09] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 771308 in gnome-settings-daemon "unity top bar using incorrect color scheme and icon set intermittantly" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/771308
[09:09] <chrisccoulson> it seems to be running normally. the process is owned by me and it's connected to my display, and it's running it's event loop
[09:09] <chrisccoulson> i think the only thing i can do is make it run with --debug in future sessions and hope it happens again :(
[09:10] <seb128> bug #733253 as well
[09:10] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 733253 in gnome-settings-daemon "gnome-settings-daemon freezes, desktop theming disappears (dup-of: 649809)" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/733253
[09:10] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 649809 in gnome-settings-daemon "the session settings manager can try starting before the login screen one exits" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/649809
[09:10] <seb128> chrisccoulson, nothing in .xsession-errors?
[09:10] <lucazade> rodrigo_ about 649809 i'm here if you need :P
[09:10] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - oh, it is this: "You can only run one xsettings manager at a time; exiting"
[09:11] <seb128> chrisccoulson, that's the one rodrigo_ tries to debug for a while ;-)
[09:11] <rodrigo_> lucazade, yes, will get back to it soon, and ping you :)
[09:11] <seb128> chrisccoulson, ie 649809
[09:11] <lucazade> rodrigo_ ok!
[09:11] <chrisccoulson> ah
[09:11] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, oh, on a virtual machine?
[09:11] <chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, no, this is on a normal machine
[09:11] <chrisccoulson> does that make a difference?
[09:12] <rodrigo_> yes, so far it was only on virtual machines :(
[09:12] <lucazade> I get only in virtualbox, not in normal machines
[09:12] <seb128> chrisccoulson, it was a supposition it could have to do with some xrandr issues with the virtualbox xorg driver
[09:13] <chrisccoulson> how does g-s-d in the gdm session stop running?
[09:13] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, gnome-session kills it
[09:13] <chrisccoulson> does it? :/
[09:13] <rodrigo_> and gdm kills gnome-session
[09:13] <rodrigo_> it's supposed to, yes, but seems in some cases it doesn't
[09:13] <chrisccoulson> i didn't realise that g-s-d ever registered as a client
[09:14] <rodrigo_> so it seems, from bug #733253, it might have indeed something to do with some video drivers, not only virtualbox
[09:14] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 733253 in gnome-settings-daemon "gnome-settings-daemon freezes, desktop theming disappears (dup-of: 649809)" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/733253
[09:14] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 649809 in gnome-settings-daemon "the session settings manager can try starting before the login screen one exits" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/649809
[09:17] <lucazade> rodrigo_ i've tried with nvidia 250gts, intel gma500 and radeon 7500mobility.. no issues and same setup on all machines
[09:17] <rodrigo_> lucazade, right
[09:18] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, what video driver are you using?
[09:18] <chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, intel
[09:18] <chrisccoulson> 1 sec, brb
[09:22] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, and you have the latest g-s-d right?
[09:22] <seb128> bah, bug #771562
[09:22] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 771562 in unity "Whitelist system-config-printer-applet" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/771562
[09:22] <chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, 2.32.1-0ubuntu13.1
[09:23] <rodrigo_> ok
[09:23] <seb128> didrocks, design feedback?!
[09:23] <didrocks> seb128: right, mpt at least. This is clearly showing the whitelist issues…
[09:24] <chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, so, i just logged out of my session, and g-s-d isn't killed by gnome-session
[09:25] <chrisccoulson> it only dies when it loses the connection to the display
[09:25] <chrisccoulson> (i looked in my ~/.xsession-errors)
[09:25] <rodrigo_> ok
[09:25] <seb128> didrocks, well let's say I disagree with mpt about breaking our default installation and our users experience ;-)
[09:26] <didrocks> seb128: you are not the only one ;)
[09:30] <pitti> didrocks: any chance you can include the s-c-p fix into today's 0-day SRU?
[09:30] <didrocks> pitti: as a distro-patch, yeah
[09:30] <didrocks> pitti: I'm preparing the SRU right now
[09:31] <seb128> re
[09:32] <seb128> didrocks, let me know if I can help testing the sru before you upload
[09:34] <didrocks> seb128: yeah, that's my point, I'm doing the final test and will upload to -proposed, then round of testing :)
[09:34] <seb128> ok
[09:34] <didrocks> 09:26:02      didrocks | @everyone: I'm making the 0-day SRU unity and nux release (then packaging and pushing to -proposed). All testing appreciated!
[09:34] <didrocks> seb128: great minds :-) ^^
[09:34] <seb128> ;-)
[09:39] <mpt> didrocks, seb128: done
[09:40] <seb128> mpt, thanks!
[09:40] <didrocks> mpt: thanks
[09:42] <seb128> mpt, is there a list somewhere tracking those bits that will need some design work?
[09:43] <mpt> seb128, yes, unfortunately it's private for now but I expect to publish it by UDS
[09:43] <seb128> mpt, ok
[09:44] <mpt> system-config-printer is the easiest because it's not a Qt app :-)
[09:44] <mpt> Once Qt upstream can do application indicators we can tackle Mumble and HPLIP too.
[09:46] <seb128> mpt, indeed ;-) but doesn't that re-enforce the ideas that we work in reverse order? like we block client applications when there is no technical solution available for some toolkits yet
[09:46] <didrocks> mpt: FYI, we saw a script when some upstreams apps starts to modify the list themselves on install to whitelist them
[09:46] <seb128> mpt, I'm not sure it's a real win for Ubuntu to notice those applications through unhappy users and then go to whitelist them, it just create increasing frustration and annoyance against us
[09:47] <mpt> seb128, I didn't know there was no technical solution available. That was a mess-up by the DX team.
[09:47] <mpt> didrocks, yes, I saw that a few weeks ago, we'll fix that.
[09:47] <seb128> mpt, "fix"?
[09:50] <mpt> seb128, I'm fending off certain people who say "abolish it altogether and the applications can go hang". I'm on your side here. :-)
[09:54] <didrocks> nux released and waiting for approval in -proposed
[09:58] <cassidy> Cimi_, hey; around ?
[10:01] <Cimi_> cassidy: yes
[10:03] <cassidy> Cimi, I was going to ask you about an issue I have with the Ambiance theme but I opened a bug https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/light-themes/+bug/771701
[10:03] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 771701 in light-themes "Very hard to see the selected tab in gnome-terminal with the ambiance theme" [Undecided,New]
[10:04] <Cimi> cassidy: ok maybe I could change the color for the inactive tab, thx
[10:05] <cassidy> Cimi, would be cool; this is really confusing atm
[10:08] <rodrigo_> lucazade, chrisccoulson: around form some quick testing?
[10:09] <chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, sure
[10:09] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, lucazade: ok, please build lp:~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/gnome-settings-daemon/really-fix-649809 and install it, to make sure it's the xrandr plugin in g-s-d
[10:10] <rodrigo_> I just removed the xrandr part of the indicator plugin, which is what was causing the problem, at least for lucazade
[10:12] <lucazade> rodrigo_ going to try   .. which was the debuild command you told me?
[10:13] <rodrigo_> lucazade, bzr bd -- -b
[10:22] <lucazade> rodrigo_ $ bzr bd -- -b
[10:22] <lucazade> bzr: ERROR: unknown command "bd"
[10:22] <GunnarHj> pitti: Hi Martin, Noticed https://launchpad.net/bugs/771661 and couldn't help thinking of my hack in Xsession that guesses if it's $USER's first login ever by testing for .xsession-errors.old. Suppose that most users can be assumed to not create such a symlink, and that I don't need to start looking for another way to do the 'first login test'.
[10:22] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 771661 in gdm "Allow .xsession-errors to be a symlink" [Medium,Confirmed]
[10:25] <lucazade> rodrigo_ it was bzr-builddeb  missing
[10:26] <seb128> didrocks, ok, done with email catchup, what needs testing?
[10:26] <seb128> nux, unity from trunk?
[10:26] <didrocks> seb128: nux is in -proposed, just need ack
[10:26] <seb128> didrocks, can you just dput to the ubuntu-desktop ppa as well as natty-proposed maybe?
[10:26] <didrocks> seb128: unity will be shortly
[10:27] <didrocks> seb128: oh sure
[10:27] <seb128> didrocks, thanks
[10:42] <seb128> rodrigo_, can you check on bug #771710
[10:42] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 771710 in evolution "Evolution: Merging contacts deletes them" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/771710
[10:42] <seb128> ?
[10:46] <rodrigo_> seb128, yes
[10:46] <seb128> rodrigo_, thanks
[10:47] <didrocks> unity released and uploaded in -proposed
[10:47] <didrocks> both nux and unity uploaded in the ubuntu-desktop ppa as well
[10:47] <didrocks> pitti: s-c-p systray is a distro-patch for now, FYI
[10:47] <pitti> didrocks: ah, thanks
[10:48] <pitti> GunnarHj: I agree; it's a special case on a special case :)
[10:55] <lucazade> rodrigo_ not fixed unfortunately
[10:56] <rodrigo_> lucazade, ok, that's why my previous fixes didn't work, it's not the xrandr part then
[10:56]  * rodrigo_ looks at the other parts of the patch
[10:56] <lucazade> rodrigo_ when you want ping me
[10:56] <rodrigo_> lucazade, yes, I will :)
[11:08] <seb128> dpm, "Label Empty" is likely a libdbusmenu thing when it can't parse the labels
[11:08] <seb128> not sure if those issues could be incorrect encoding or something
[11:20] <chrisccoulson> "Label Empty" is just the default label which is set in dbusmenu if an application doesn't specify any other label
[11:25] <dpm> ok, thanks seb128 and chrisccoulson
[11:26] <rodrigo_> lucazade, can you please bzr pull and build / install again?
[11:46] <lucazade> rodrigo_ ok .. i'm at launch now! :)
[11:47] <rodrigo_> lucazade, no hurry, do it when you can
[12:21] <mpt> pitti, hi. Does/should <https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-clean-up-language-support> include porting the "Language Support" window to be a System Settings panel?
[12:22] <mpt> Or should that be a separate topic?
[12:26] <lucazade> rodrigo_ tried but no luck
[12:26] <fagan> kenvandine: got a interesting bug in the broadcast box in the me menu for natty
[12:26] <rodrigo_> lucazade, ok
[12:28] <fagan> kenvandine: sometimes it lets me type sometimes it doesnt I cant really debug why its not working some times but its pretty strange
[12:28] <chrisccoulson> mpt - does the new control-center support settings panels written in python?
[12:28] <chrisccoulson> perhaps rodrigo_ knows ;)
[12:28] <mpt> chrisccoulson, I have no idea, sorry
[12:30] <pitti> mpt: that would be separate; I meant this spec for the structure of the language packs and packages which provide language specific support (spell dictionaries, etc.)
[12:32]  * mpt launches Computer Janitor for a dose of depression
[12:33] <mpt> thanks pitti
[12:34] <pitti> heh
[12:34]  * fagan tries to remember that there is other timezones that the EU 
[12:37] <mpt> seb128, what do you think of having one session for porting the various custom settings we've accumulated? * Language Support (gnome-language-selector); * Login Screen (gdmsetup); * Time & Date (indicator-datetime-preferences); * "Apply System-Wide" in gnome-keyboard-properties.
[12:42] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, no, it doesn't
[12:42] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, in fact, for 3.2, the library for writing panels will be private, so no 3rd party panels

[12:44] <chrisccoulson> urgh
[12:44] <chrisccoulson> that's not good :/
[12:45] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, what panel are you thinking about?
[12:46] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, if it's a generic thing, it can go into g-c-c itself, if not, it should be in the app's preferences, not in the control center
[12:47] <rodrigo_> that's why the library is going private, to not repeat the mistakes in previous versions, where the control center had lots of stuff, most of which was related to specific apps
[12:47] <mpt> rodrigo_, the Ubuntu One control panel for example. It's not an "app", it's a service that plugs in to various other components.
[12:47] <chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, language-selector is a good one. but also, where do things like jockey-gtk go?
[12:48] <rodrigo_> mpt, it's specific to an app, so should go with that app
[12:48] <mpt> rodrigo_, it's not specific to an app, because it's not an app.
[12:48] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, there's already a region panel to select that in 3.0
[12:48] <rodrigo_> mpt, it's not "general desktop settings", that is
[12:49] <rodrigo_> mpt, although for 3.2 we are discussing a 'web accounts' panel, so u1 could go there
[12:49] <mpt> Software Sources would be another.
[12:50] <rodrigo_> that's system admin tasks, but yes probably could have a place in the control centetr
[12:51] <seb128> rodrigo_, syncing is a service
[12:51] <seb128> rodrigo_, it's like printing
[12:52] <rodrigo_> seb128, right, it's a 'web account' thing, just like twitter, facebook, flickr, etc
[12:52] <seb128> not really
[12:52] <seb128> those are accounts for communication
[12:53] <seb128> where u1 is configuring what you want synced
[12:53] <seb128> like syncing your datas, bookmarks, contacts,
[12:53] <rodrigo_> although for u1, we are discussing integration of couchdb into 3.2, and I'm making sure u1 fits in
[12:53] <seb128> hate couchdb
[12:53] <seb128> (sorry ;-)
[12:53] <chrisccoulson> heh
[12:53] <rodrigo_> well, couchdb is ok, it's desktopcouch what makes things really bad
[12:54] <seb128> I installed it back last week and it's again back to the top of cpu users on my laptop while i'm doing nothing with it
[12:54] <seb128> right
[12:54] <rodrigo_> seb128, beam.smp, or desktopcouch processes?
[12:54] <seb128> beam.smp
[12:54] <seb128> but that came with the lot :p
[12:54] <rodrigo_> oh, that's bad indeed
[12:54] <chrisccoulson> it's not crashing is it?
[12:55] <chrisccoulson> actually
[12:55] <chrisccoulson> couchjs isn't crashing is it? ;)
[12:55] <seb128> no clue, but apport didn't trigger ;-)
[12:55] <chrisccoulson> that will cause beam.smp to use a lot of CPU ;)
[12:55] <rodrigo_> seb128, I guess it tries to sync everything as soon as you start it? does it take the cpu always, or just for a while after starting it?
[12:55] <chrisccoulson> if it is, then i'm going to hide in a corner and cry ;)
[12:56] <seb128> mpt, would be nice to have a such session, I wanted to discuss "things that GNOME3 dropped or that we distro patched on ui that got refactored" to see which ones we care about and should try to get back in some way
[12:56] <mpt> seb128, are there any of those that aren't related to settings?
[12:56] <seb128> chrisccoulson, I don't think it crashed, it was not using a lot of cpu
[12:57] <seb128> mpt, no, that's mostly the gnome-control-center redesign so it's mostly settings
[12:57] <chrisccoulson> appearance ;)
[12:57] <seb128> mpt, but like do we care about being able to set a theme
[12:57] <seb128> mpt, or do we care about being able to set a system keyboard layout
[12:57] <rodrigo_> seb128, both of those are possible, 1st with gnome-tweak-tool and the 2nd with g-c-c itself
[12:58] <didrocks> pitti: thanks :)
[12:58] <seb128> rodrigo_, I don't consider gnome-tweak-tool as a proper first class citizen on the default install thing
[12:58] <rodrigo_> I agree though that theme setting should be in g-c-c though
[12:58] <seb128> nice for the keyboard layout thing, that was not the case in 2.32 we distro patched for that
[12:59] <chrisccoulson> it would be nice if gnome-tweak-tool installed a nice tweak panel, but i guess if the g-c-c library is going to be private then it wouldn't be possible ;)
[12:59] <seb128> but in any case I'm all for a session about those mpt
[12:59] <mpt> ok
[12:59] <chrisccoulson> so it will just feel like a bit of a bolt-on like ubuntu-tweak
[12:59] <seb128> mpt, I also like your suggestion about autostarts ;-)
[13:03] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, does libunity have any documentation whatsoever?
[13:04] <seb128> the source is your documentation!
[13:04] <chrisccoulson> lol
[13:04] <seb128> there is a wiki page about it with examples
[13:05] <chrisccoulson> i guess this is what i'm after: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/LauncherAPI
[13:05] <seb128> right
[13:09] <mpt> seb128, should the Approver be you or Jason?
[13:10] <mpt> chrisccoulson, http://unity.ubuntu.com/projects/unity/ has links for C and Python
[13:11] <chrisccoulson> mpt - cool, thanks
[13:11] <seb128> mpt, jason
[13:11] <seb128> we will shuffle things in the team next week I think
[13:13] <seb128> rodrigo_, mpt: btw speaking about new c-c and option there is also a balance to find between simplicify and features we need, tkamppeter said for example that the printer config case will need to be discussed
[13:14] <seb128> the GNOME3 capplet is much simplet that s-c-p and not sure it cover everything users might need
[13:14] <rodrigo_> seb128, ok
[13:14] <mpt> seb128, do you want a separate session for s-c-p then?
[13:16] <seb128> tkamppeter, ^ do you want a session about that at UDS?
[13:16] <seb128> mpt,  let's see if tkamppeter want that to be discussed at UDS and register one if that's the case
[13:16] <xclaesse> seb128, if you know who did the adium-theme-ubuntu: https://bugs.launchpad.net/adium-theme-ubuntu/+bug/771777
[13:16] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 771777 in adium-theme-ubuntu "Should use focus and/or firstFocus message class" [Undecided,New]
[13:17] <seb128> mpt, I'm not deciding on whether we should be proactive and review each capplet between 2.32 and 3 and see what got dropped and what we would care about or just upgrade and deal with bugs
[13:17] <seb128> xclaesse, no but kenvandine uploaded it and probably knows
[13:18] <mpt> seb128, https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-system-settings
[13:19] <seb128> mpt, thanks
[13:28] <rodrigo_> ok, lunch time, bbl
[13:34] <tkamppeter> seb128, let us do a session for scp vs. cc on the UDS. Will you prepare a Blueprint and make me an essential participant?
[13:34] <mpt> I can do it, my time is less valuable than seb128's :-)
[13:35] <mpt> (especially this week)
[13:35] <seb128> tkamppeter, can you register the blueprint rather since it's the mostly your topic
[13:35] <seb128> or mpt if he wants to do it
[13:35] <seb128> mpt, thanks
[13:35] <seb128> oh, and there is no less valuable time, but I still appreciate the offer so thanks ;-)
[13:35] <tkamppeter> seb128, OK, we should also arrange for Tim Waugh calling in (where are the instructions for call-in participation?).
[13:36] <seb128> tkamppeter, http://uds.ubuntu.com/participate/
[13:36] <seb128> tkamppeter, http://uds.ubuntu.com/participate/remote/
[13:39] <tkamppeter> seb128, thanks.
[13:44] <mpt> tkamppeter, https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-printer-settings
[13:44] <kenvandine> xclaesse, i can dig out his name, he is the upstream renkoo guy
[13:45] <kenvandine> seb128, i have a branch of indicator-weather with optional desktopcouch
[13:45] <xclaesse> kenvandine, ubuntu could ask him to update the theme using the new adium specs
[13:45] <seb128> kenvandine, hey
[13:45] <seb128> kenvandine, \o/
[13:46] <kenvandine> xclaesse, ah... i can do that
[13:47] <xclaesse> kenvandine, I think for 3.2 cassidy is going to make adium mandatory for empathy and drop other GtkTextView based themes
[13:47] <xclaesse> but that would need a theme suitable for chatrooms too
[13:47] <xclaesse> would be great if that guy that work a bit with us for next cycle
[13:47] <xclaesse> didn't canonical contracted him for that?
[13:48] <kenvandine> nope
[13:48] <kenvandine> turned out he is a bit of a ubuntu fan :)
[13:48] <xclaesse> why give a contract, when he can work for free :D
[13:48] <kenvandine> and was pretty excited to be included in ubuntu
[13:48] <kenvandine> hehe :)
[13:48] <xclaesse> well, that's even better actually, so we can ask him directly :)
[13:49] <kenvandine> xclaesse, do you have details on what needs to be done to support chat rooms?
[13:49] <xclaesse> I personally would like something xchat-like
[13:49] <xclaesse> but that needs to be discussed with designers, etc...
[13:50] <kenvandine> xclaesse, Torrey Rice is his name
[13:57] <cassidy> xclaesse, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=645920
[13:57] <ubot2> Gnome bug 645920 in Chat themes "Provide a default Adium theme" [Normal,New]
[13:59] <xclaesse> cassidy, thanks. kenvandine ^
[14:00] <kenvandine> xclaesse, np
[14:06] <kenvandine> xclaesse, cassidy: i emailed him and CC'd both of you
[14:09] <didrocks> pitti: thinking about the nvidia crash on nux (that the -proposed version is blacklisting), does the 0-day SRU means it's in -updates in the 0-day or that's it's just staging as usual in -proposed for regression testing (once all bugs confirmed to be fixed)
[14:09] <xclaesse> kenvandine, thx
[14:10] <pitti> didrocks: it's a normal SRU; it's just accepted before release
[14:10] <didrocks> pitti: ok, thanks for confirming ;)
[14:17] <pitti> rodrigo_, dobey: do you know if bug 571286 is still an issue? it still has a release-notes task, is closed on the client side, but has an open U1 server task
[14:17] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 571286 in couchdb-glib "Data loss of postal addresses between Evolution and Ubuntu One's Funambol exchange/web UI" [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/571286
[14:23] <dobey> pitti: i have no idea about that. rodrigo_ ?
[14:25] <kenvandine> seb128, if you want to test out indicator-weather without desktopcouch
[14:25] <kenvandine> ppa:ken-vandine/notifiers
[14:25] <seb128> kenvandine, thanks
[14:26] <kenvandine> and remove desktopcouch and python-desktopcouch-records
[14:26] <kenvandine> seb128, it doesn't migrate any of the settings
[14:26] <kenvandine> i assume if you are using it now with desktopcouch
[14:26] <kenvandine> you won't remove desktopcouch :)
[14:26] <pitti> oh, it kept its settings in couchdb?
[14:26] <pitti> I was already wondering why a simple weather app would pull in 50 MB of dependencies
[14:27] <kenvandine> pitti, yes
[14:27] <kenvandine> i ported it to make couch optional :)
[14:27] <kenvandine> without desktopcouch it doesn't cache
[14:27] <kenvandine> so you have a few seconds on startup where you don't see the weather
[14:28] <kenvandine> pitti, i want to beat on it for a couple days before proposing it upstream
[14:28] <pitti> dbarth, didrocks: for BPs like https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/appdevs-dx-n-unity-places-api where a lot of items are postponed, how do you prefer to handle this?
[14:28] <seb128> we should open a bug upstream for not use desktopcouch anyway
[14:29] <pitti> dbarth, didrocks: should we just re-target it to oneiric and flip the postponed ones to 'todo', or do you want to copy them to a new BP?
[14:29] <seb128> I don't care what else they would use, simple db, key file, gsettings
[14:29] <didrocks> pitti: we will retarget it
[14:29] <kenvandine> seb128, just dumping a json file to disk for the cache would be fine :)
[14:29] <kenvandine> that is all they do in desktopcouch anyway
[14:29] <pitti> didrocks: it's in the -dx- domain, so I don't want to stomp on them (only if you guys ask me to)
[14:29] <didrocks> dbarth: can you handle this, you should have the rights on it? ^^
[14:32] <seb128> if someone is interested by easy desktop sru updates there are bug fixes version of shotwell and file-roller out there
[14:32] <dbarth> pitti: didrocks: well, actually most of it has been delivered; i'd prefer creating a new bp; i've created a few in preparation for uds already
[14:32] <pitti> dbarth: ok, thanks; so you will look over the -dx- ones?
[14:32] <dbarth> pitti: the old ones you mean? yes, i will mark them closed and will create new ones
[14:32] <didrocks> dbarth: think about copying the WIs
[14:33] <pitti> dbarth: I'm picking out all BPs with postponed items on our report page; you are doing the same on http://people.canonical.com/~platform/workitems/natty/canonical-dx-team.html ?
[14:33] <seb128> telepathy-gabble as well maybe worth update
[14:33] <pitti> dbarth: cool, thanks
[14:33] <seb128> gvfs
[14:33] <kenvandine> seb128, i am doing an SRU for glib-networking too, fixes some leaks
[14:33] <seb128> kenvandine, ok
[14:33] <seb128> kenvandine, do you want to check on gabble and maybe telepathy-glib?
[14:33] <seb128> not sure if those are bug fix version
[14:33] <kenvandine> i can check
[14:33] <seb128> kenvandine, do you know if there was anything in the indicator or libdbusmenu stack?
[14:34] <kenvandine> not that i know of
[14:34] <seb128> mterry, want to do the shotwell and file-roller ones?
[14:34]  * kenvandine is doing yet another SRU for overlay-scrollbar :)
[14:34]  * mterry reads back
[14:34] <seb128> kenvandine, another one?
[14:34] <seb128> kenvandine, what's new since yesterday?
[14:34] <mterry> seb128, oh sure
[14:34] <seb128> kenvandine, btw wait for the first on to go to updates maybe
[14:34] <kenvandine> several more bugs fixed
[14:34] <kenvandine> and updated blacklist
[14:35] <kenvandine> seb128, nah, it includes a fix Cimi is very anxious to get out
[14:35] <seb128> mterry, thanks
[14:35] <pitti> dbarth: whoa, what happened with the trend line there..
[14:35] <Cimi> kenvandine: 0.1.12
[14:35] <Cimi> kenvandine: :P
[14:35] <kenvandine> Cimi, yes... i know
[14:35] <kenvandine> :)
[14:36] <Cimi> seb128: with 0.1.11 I fixed many apps (included evolution) that were showing a grey color instead orange
[14:36] <pitti> dbarth: (fixed in the WI configuration, the manual trend start override was way off)
[14:36] <Cimi> seb128: with 0.1.12 I fixed anjuita
[14:37] <Cimi> seb128: I don't have more important stability fixes for the moment, so I'd say let's get this/test it
[14:37] <Cimi> seb128: then I'll ask another SRU with features implemented
[14:37] <seb128> Cimi, you can't queue versions in proposed, one version need one week testing to move to update, if you do updates you reset the timer and restart the verification process for each bugs in any of those version
[14:37] <Cimi> seb128: I've split features from stability
[14:37] <seb128> so if you do an upload every 3 days you will never reach updates
[14:38] <Cimi> seb128: so let's say just test 0.1.12?
[14:38] <seb128> well it means it any of the fix in any of those 3 versions is buggy you will get nothing in updates
[14:38] <seb128> but your call
[14:38] <seb128> usually it's better to go with incremental selected fixed
[14:38] <seb128> selected fixes
[14:39] <seb128> if you try to get a stack in one go and one has an issue you will get the updates dropped and nothing in updates
[14:39] <Cimi> seb128: 0.1.12 will pass every test
[14:39] <Cimi> kenvandine: go for 0.1.12 ;)
[14:39] <kenvandine> Cimi, after 0.1.12 i really want to slow down the SRUs, lets try to get the updates through before another :)
[14:40] <Cimi> kenvandine: I understand, but since the severity of the updates and the fact natty is coming out tomorrow
[14:40] <didrocks> kenvandine: oh btw, I think I'm still the maintainer from the experimental packaging
[14:40] <Cimi> kenvandine: imho it's best to ship security fixes asap
[14:40] <didrocks> kenvandine: can you remove pleaseeeeee? :-)
[14:40] <didrocks> me*
[14:40] <kenvandine> Cimi, security?
[14:40] <Cimi> kenvandine: after 0.1.12 I'm quite happy for the stability we have
[14:40] <kenvandine> didrocks, humm... i'll think about that
[14:40] <kenvandine> :)
[14:40] <Cimi> kenvandine: stability, whatever you call
[14:41] <seb128> Cimi, well in any case you reset the testing period, it will not be in natty-updates before next wednesday if uploaded today
[14:41] <didrocks> kenvandine: nooooooooooooooooooooooooo ;-)
[14:41] <kenvandine> Cimi, regardless it takes a week before users get it
[14:41] <seb128> Cimi, oh, also no features in stable updates
[14:41] <Cimi> seb128: just one
[14:41] <seb128> neither now nor later
[14:41] <seb128> no
[14:41] <seb128> no feature in stable updates
[14:41] <didrocks> one is > 0 :-)
[14:42] <Cimi> seb128: mask and rick told me we will have a small bugfix
[14:42] <seb128> bugfix != feature
[14:42] <Cimi> seb128: I guess they spoke with martin too
[14:42] <Cimi> seb128: "hide the thumb when selecting text", is a feature or a bugfix?
[14:42] <Cimi> seb128: you decide, for me is almost the same or both
[14:42] <seb128> it's a behaviour change
[14:43] <seb128> which we usually don't so on stable updates
[14:43] <seb128> but since those scrollbars are nothing of what we usually do anyway I will not say anything about it and let pitti decide ;-)
[14:43] <Cimi> seb128: well david rick and mark agreed it would have been a sru
[14:43] <Cimi> :P
[14:44] <seb128> well neither david or rick or mark review srus :p
[14:44] <Cimi> but the latter pays our salary ahah
[14:45] <pitti> do they get in the way when selecting text?
[14:45] <Cimi> pitti: when the window is maximized, yes
[14:45] <Cimi> pitti: I already have a safe and working branch
[14:46] <pitti> I guess I need to see a more detaillen description (which the SRU bug needs to provide anyway), but if they get in the way we could consider it a bug fix
[14:49] <kenvandine> Cimi, that change isn't in 0.1.12 is it?
[14:49] <Cimi> kenvandine: no
[14:49] <tkamppeter> mpt, sorry, shortly before seeing your message here I have also submitted a Blueprint and now we have a duplicate. How should we proceed?
[14:49] <Cimi> kenvandine: I'll do 0.1.13 next week
[14:50] <tkamppeter> mpt, seb128: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-system-config-printer-vs-gnome-3-control-center
[14:50] <rickspencer3> pitti, seb128 what's the word on the street? (correct channel ;) )
[14:50] <seb128> hey rickspencer3
[14:50] <didrocks> morning rickspencer3
[14:51] <rickspencer3> hi didrocks
[14:51] <seb128> rickspencer3, seemes people are dancing in the street
[14:51] <kenvandine> Cimi, ok, make sure there is a very detailed description for that bug
[14:51] <kenvandine> :)
[14:51] <kenvandine> Cimi, also, there isn't really a detailed test case for the existing SRU bugs
[14:51] <kenvandine> Cimi, can you add steps to test for these bugs?
[14:51] <mpt> tkamppeter, you marked Tim Waugh as an "Essential" subscriber. If he's not attending UDS, I think that means the blueprint won't be scheduled for UDS at all.
[14:51] <seb128> rickspencer3, or "natty looks great and we already are testing the first unity sru" ;-)
[14:51] <kenvandine> Cimi, bug 771511 and bug 771563
[14:51] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 771511 in overlay-scrollbar "some apps show grey overlay instead orange even if the window is focused" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/771511
[14:51] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 771563 in overlay-scrollbar "anjuta doesn't display scrollbar after resetting the layout" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/771563
[14:52] <rickspencer3> seb128, nice
[14:52] <kenvandine> Cimi, for SRUs we need a comment in the bug detailing how to test the fix
[14:52] <kenvandine> Cimi, because we depend on users to validate the fix before they go to natty-updates
[14:53] <tkamppeter> mpt, can one fix this, like removing the "essential" bit?
[14:53] <mpt> tkamppeter, yes, I just guessed how to fix it
[14:54] <Cimi> kenvandine: ok
[14:54] <pitti> hey rickspencer3; reasonably quiet, except for some trouble/rebuilds with wubi and kubuntu DVD
[14:54] <kenvandine> Cimi, thx
[14:54] <tkamppeter> mpt, thanks, I did not know that.
[14:54] <pitti> rickspencer3: but these are under control
[14:54] <Cimi> kenvandine: where shall I put those info?
[14:55] <rickspencer3> pitti, yeah, I saw the wubi bug last night
[14:55] <didrocks> mterry: hey, I know that you're bored now that you totally rocked the indicator stack this cycle, but seems there is just *one* more issue with it ;) bug #751175 seems to particularly hate some french people (I don't get it though)
[14:55] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 751175 in indicator-datetime "Time and Date Settings don't load (Natty Beta 1)" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/751175
[14:55] <kenvandine> Cimi, just as comments on the bugs
[14:55] <rickspencer3> I hope the fix has been well confirmed :)
[14:55] <mpt> tkamppeter, I've marked mine as superseded by yours.
[14:55] <Cimi> kenvandine: not something like this? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/QA/CompizReleaseProcess
[14:56] <didrocks> Cimi: this one is internal to the ayatana team before a release, we shaped that to ensure we have a nice quality. However, what you want it the traditional SRU process there
[14:56] <kenvandine> Cimi, no
[14:56] <didrocks> Cimi: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
[14:57] <didrocks> see the procedure
[14:57] <kenvandine> didrocks was faster than me ;)
[14:57] <didrocks> kenvandine: \o/ the chromium bar sometimes find what I look for
[14:57] <didrocks> kenvandine: ok, only sometimes ;)
[14:58] <kenvandine> hehe
[14:59] <kenvandine> i have come to love the awesome bar in firefox
[15:00] <pitti> chrisccoulson, micahg: FYI, I registered https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-xulrunner-deprecation for the postponed natty bits, but didn't add it for UDS; I suppose it doesn't need to be rediscussed? if so, please yell, and I'll add it
[15:00] <kenvandine> i guess i never used to type in there expecting anything magical :)
[15:00] <pitti> oh, it's, well, awesome! you can search for titles, bookmarks, non-consecutive substrings in URLs, etc.
[15:01] <kenvandine> i guess that is why they call it the awesome bar :)
[15:02] <didrocks> if only it was working with nvidia and launchpad…
[15:02] <didrocks> (firefox in general)
[15:02] <dobey> it is so not awesome
[15:02] <dobey> they should rename it to "really slow to process bar"
[15:02] <kenvandine> dobey, but that doesn't sound cool at all
[15:02] <kenvandine> not marketing friendly :)
[15:03] <dobey> also, bars without liquor and beer are not very awesome.
[15:03] <kenvandine> indeed
[15:03] <rickspencer3> dobey, liquor AND beer, dude it's only 7am here
[15:03] <rickspencer3> I mean, liqor OR beer, I could understand
[15:03] <kenvandine> rickspencer3, haha :)
[15:04] <dobey> rickspencer3: well, you are in the unfortunate -0800 time zone
[15:04] <Cimi> didrocks: seb128 pitti kenvandine : I've commented the two bugreports
[15:04] <kenvandine> liqor in your coffee, you are in coffee country :)
[15:04] <kenvandine> Cimi, thx
[15:04] <rickspencer3> kenvandine, goes without saying
[15:05] <dobey> a little rum and red stripe is the caribbean way!
[15:05] <didrocks> isn't that more irish (liqor in coffee)?
[15:05] <dobey> didrocks: depends on the liquor
[15:05] <didrocks> wiskey at least ;)
[15:06] <dobey> didrocks: why did you think they called it irish creme? :)
[15:07] <didrocks> dobey: heh :-)
[15:08] <didrocks> oh "coffee time" btw, let's not play irish though ;-)
[15:08] <dobey> also, the Ben & Jerry's Dublin Mudslide has a lot of Bailey's in it.
[15:10] <rickspencer3> quite a lot in proposed, bring it!
[15:11] <dobey> oh it'll be brought, soon.
[15:14]  * ogra_ curses upstreams that decide that browsers need to have a stop button that turns into reload ... the silliest design decision ever...
[15:15] <seb128> why would anyone need a stop button anyway
[15:16] <seb128> webpages should just load ;-)
[15:16] <chrisccoulson> w00t
[15:16] <rodrigo_> pitti, bug #571286 was an issue for karmic, I think, it's not anymore
[15:16] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 571286 in couchdb-glib "Data loss of postal addresses between Evolution and Ubuntu One's Funambol exchange/web UI" [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/571286
[15:16] <chrisccoulson> i have firefox creating a progress indicator and counter in the launcher now :)
[15:16] <chrisccoulson> all with a few lines of javascript
[15:17] <chrisccoulson> i <3 ctypes
[15:17] <pitti> rodrigo_: thanks!
[15:17] <dobey> ogra_: uhm, why do you need a stop button if nothing is happening?
[15:17] <ogra_> seb128, well, if you run out of ram (like i do on my 512M machine from time to time)  and accidntially click twice on stop it indeed reloads the page
[15:18] <chrisccoulson> pitti - i created this blueprint, which might overlap slightly with the xulrunner-deprecation one: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-mozilla-rapid-release-maintenance
[15:18] <seb128> I don't think I click on stop in a browser for yaers
[15:18] <seb128> years
[15:18] <ogra_> dobey, i wouldnt call bringing my system to a halt actually "nothing" :)
[15:18] <chrisccoulson> i thought that would be a good place to discuss language pack stuff too
[15:18] <pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, I can move the WIs from mine to your's
[15:18] <seb128> close the tab ;-)
[15:18] <ogra_> its takes its time to swap :)
[15:18] <pitti> chrisccoulson: indeed
[15:18] <dobey> ogra_: i think you're complaining about the wrong problem there :)
[15:19] <ogra_> seb128, then i lose the url and have to open a new tab etc etc ... i would muchly prefer to just be able to stop it from loading until i actually need that tab
[15:19] <ogra_> dobey, do i ?
[15:19] <chrisccoulson> pitti - we can use it as a dumping ground for everything that's affected by the rapid release process. i'm not sure we need 3 blueprints (and 3 sessions at UDS) for those
[15:19] <dobey> ogra_: well, sounds like you should be complaining about the browser using all your RAM :)
[15:19] <ogra_> dobey, my system is in the ubuntu requirements proper (384M minimum)
[15:19] <pitti> chrisccoulson: no, that's right; I didn't see your's before
[15:19] <chrisccoulson> and i pretty much know what we're going to do with translations, we just need to work out how we're going to transition old releases to the new update process
[15:19] <dobey> ogra_: i think we need to change that to be 4G minimum
[15:19] <pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, it's not targetted or proposed to oneiric, doing that now
[15:19] <seb128> ogra_, seems like you have a rather corner case use
[15:20] <ogra_> and i already switched to chromium because FF is totally unusable with that amount of ram
[15:20] <dobey> ogra_: just for firefox :(
[15:20] <chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks :)
[15:20] <dobey> ogra_: *GNOME* is unusable with that little RAM
[15:20] <ogra_> but guess what ... chromium copies the silly design idea of turning stop into reload :)
[15:20] <ogra_> dobey, not at all
[15:20] <ogra_> gnome uses 120MB standalone
[15:21] <ogra_> unity-2d uses about 160-180 ...
[15:21] <dobey> ogra_: it certainly is on my Fujitsu laptop with 512M
[15:21] <ogra_> both work just fine
[15:21] <dobey> chrome/chromium aren't great with memory usage either :(
[15:22] <dobey> and have lots of other problems
[15:22] <ogra_> chromium is a lot snappier than FF here
[15:22] <pitti> chrisccoulson: done
[15:22] <chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks
[15:23] <dobey> ogra_: it is at first, but JS-heavy pages will kill it quickly too
[15:23] <seb128> mterry, btw do you know if the poppler sru patch went upstream or to debian?
[15:23] <ogra_> yes, but at least it doesnt have find as you type ... that even grinds my dual core 1GHz CPU to a halt
[15:23] <kklimonda> hmm.. does Unity keeps the state of windows/applications somewhere?
[15:23] <seb128> mterry, popple is one of those source where we are close to be sync with debian so it would be nice to get closer from that than further if we can ;-)
[15:23] <mterry> seb128, the patch went upstream, not applied yet
[15:24] <seb128> ok
[15:24] <seb128> do you have a bug reference?
[15:24] <dobey> ogra_: it did when i used it last.
[15:24] <kklimonda> my Firefox lost its decorations, and is always taking entire desktop for itself, I cant also use alt+tab to switch to it..
[15:24] <dobey> anyway
[15:24] <ogra_> not in the way FF does it
[15:24] <seb128> the one indicated in the comments has another patch
[15:25] <seb128> kklimonda, no, seems you should restart compiz
[15:25] <seb128> kklimonda, do you have a way to trigger the issue? does it happen often?
[15:25] <kklimonda> seb128: i did, it stays this way..
[15:25] <seb128> close firefox, restart compiz start firefox?
[15:26] <kklimonda> seb128: I've already restarted computer (well, I've broken it last week, and now I'm back home, and it still doesn't work)
[15:26] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, http://people.canonical.com/~chrisccoulson/unityfox.png ;)
[15:26] <dobey> ogra_: eh, if gobject-introspection stuff weren't entirely broken, you'd be using encompass anyway :)
[15:26] <seb128> kklimonda, that's surprising, compiz doesn't store such infos
[15:26] <kklimonda> It may have something to do with the Fx full screen option, I would test it, but I have to restore it back to normal first :)
[15:27] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: nice integration in the launcher icon \o/
[15:27] <seb128> shame for you that we will use dilo or whatever gtk based browser next cycle ;-)
[15:28] <didrocks> kklimonda: it's maximize as maximized or as fullscreen (F11)
[15:28] <chrisccoulson> lol
[15:28] <seb128> chrisccoulson, nice work! ;-)
[15:28] <kenvandine> didrocks, i changed the maintainer :)
[15:29] <didrocks> kenvandine: thanks! I feel so relieved now :-)
[15:29] <kklimonda> didrocks: it was maximised - I could still switch to the fullscreen mode (but it didn't change much)
[15:30] <kklimonda> resetting all settings has helped
[15:30] <rickspencer3> didrocks, I just installed unity from proposed, anything I should try?
[15:30] <didrocks> hum, weird :/
[15:30] <kklimonda> didrocks: I can reproduce it though
[15:30] <seb128> rickspencer3, #753971 #759744 #762120 #763883 #771562
[15:30] <kenvandine> Cimi, uploaded, waiting for the sru team now
[15:30] <kklimonda> didrocks: launch Firefox, go into the fullscreen mode (F11), close firefox completely (alt+f4), start it again
[15:31] <seb128> rickspencer3, those are the bugs that need verification, they have testcases
[15:31] <didrocks> rickspencer3: well, most of the bugs are already confirmed: the list is at https://launchpad.net/unity/+milestone/3.8.12
[15:31] <Cimi> kenvandine: thanks a lot
[15:31] <didrocks> but seb128 already answered, so :-)
[15:31]  * rickspencer3 looks
[15:31] <seb128> didrocks, rickspencer3: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/pending-sru.html lists the bugs for each update
[15:31] <seb128> easy to click on and see what is already green
[15:31] <didrocks> rickspencer3: some are nux fixes btw, be sure to have the latest and greatest
[15:31] <JanC> there is a compiz bug with applications that are started full-screen
[15:32] <tkamppeter> mpt, you have unmarked yourself as essential participant, too?
[15:32] <didrocks> kklimonda: oh interesting, can you file a bug with that? I'll give it a look
[15:33] <pitti> cyphermox: are the wpasupplicant udeb bits on https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-n-network-stack still relevant, i. e. should they be copied into an oneiric BP?
[15:33] <kklimonda> didrocks: sure
[15:33] <JanC> kklimonda: does LP bug #765422 describe what you see?
[15:33] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 765422 in compiz "apps started fullscreen in unity can never unfullscreen" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/765422
[15:34] <didrocks> kklimonda: JanC: do you reproduce this in the classic session?
[15:34] <JanC> classic with compiz, yes
[15:34] <kklimonda> JanC: yes, it does sound like what I'm seeing. Thanks.
[15:34] <cyphermox> pitti, afaik it will get taken care of in debian... there's still the issues with pcsclite in wpasupplicant, and there's been discussion about having d-i speak to NM or whatever.
[15:35] <pitti> cyphermox: so we can drop the WIs?
[15:35] <cyphermox> pitti, yeah
[15:35] <pitti> cyphermox: good, thanks for confirming
[15:36] <pitti> kenvandine: I registered https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-gwibber-enhancements for catching the postponed WIs; please let me know if you want to target this to uds-o for further discussing (and perhaps more changes)
[15:36] <pitti> kenvandine: right now it's not for uds and in 'drafting"
[15:36] <kenvandine> pitti, i will
[15:36] <kenvandine> thx
[15:36] <didrocks> kklimonda: ok, not sure if it's due to firefox or compiz. but compiz doesn't store window size normallly
[15:37] <kklimonda> didrocks: comments in this bug suggest compiz as a culprit (and there is a small test case attached, compiling it now)
[15:38] <didrocks> kklimonda: what would be interesting is to test with metacity
[15:39] <JanC> I tested that test case in a unity session, in a classic session with compiz, and in a classic session with metacity, and it failed in both cases with compiz, but not with metacity
[15:39] <kklimonda> didrocks: well, it should work - it just calls gtk_window_unfullscreen ()
[15:39] <kklimonda> JanC: :*
[15:40] <JanC> well, I tested that at the time Akkana filed that bug report (and I commented to it)
[15:40] <didrocks> JanC: kklimonda: thanks for the feedback :)
[15:40] <didrocks> I'm adding that to the possible SRU list
[15:40] <didrocks> it has a test case and everything needed
[15:40] <JanC> oh, and this bug doesn't happen with the compiz in maverick
[15:40] <JanC> so it's a regression in compiz 0.9
[15:41] <rickspencer3> seb128, if I confirm that a test now passes, is there a way for me to report that?
[15:41] <didrocks> JanC: the unity task I'm adding it just for helping tracking
[15:41] <didrocks> rickspencer3: just comment on the bug
[15:41] <rickspencer3> okee
[15:41] <didrocks> we will remove the tag afterwards :)
[15:41] <JanC> didrocks: okay, I'll tell Akkana too  ;)
[15:41] <seb128> rickspencer3, you can add a comment saying so and change the verification-needed to verification-done in the tags
[15:42] <didrocks> JanC: thanks :)
[15:42] <rodrigo_> hmm, a friend of mine who works at a university is asking for companies/projects to get some students (like google summer of code)
[15:42] <rodrigo_> would we be interested in that?
[15:47] <mpt> tkamppeter, yes, I un-essentialed myself deliberately. :-) I would prefer that we ended up with only one configuration panel, but I don't really need to be in the room for planning that.
[15:49] <pitti> chrisccoulson: [chrisccoulson] write messaging menu extension: POSTPONED (in https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-desktop-n-thunderbird-messaging-indicator)
[15:50] <pitti> chrisccoulson: is that still relevant? if so, want me to add it to an existing spec, or open a bug, or a new spec?
[15:53] <chrisccoulson> pitti - that's WIP (by mike conley)
[15:53] <pitti> chrisccoulson: so no need to track it for oneiric?
[15:56] <tkamppeter> mpt, OK, and thank you for your help.
[15:57] <fagan> kenvandine: ping?
[16:01] <kenvandine> fagan, pong
[16:01] <fagan> kenvandine: did you get my message earlier it was before you came on id say
[16:01] <kenvandine> fagan, no, sorry
[16:02] <fagan> the me menu broadcast box doesnt work half the time for me in nattty
[16:02] <fagan> I cant figure out what exactly is causing it though
[16:03] <fagan> I think its an issue with switching between indicators and then trying to type in the box
[16:03] <kenvandine> fagan, do you click in the entry then mouse out?
[16:04] <fagan> kenvandine: nope I click the the box type for a sec and then click another indicator then click the box again and it doesnt work
[16:04] <fagan> like it doesnt take focus
[16:05] <kenvandine> oh... interesting
[16:05] <kenvandine> can you file a bug against indicator-me?
[16:05] <fagan> kenvandine: sure
[16:05] <kenvandine> this is still light years better than how it behaved in maverick :)
[16:05] <kenvandine> but this might not be as hard to fix :)
[16:06] <fagan> yeah I found a way of getting around it though. If it stops working you can use the keyboard navigation to get back in and it works
[16:06] <fagan> so it must be something just left out
[16:09]  * fagan loves having the extra time to break stuff not even in u1 :)
[16:10] <dobey> i think the indicators or unity panel or something are mouse-grab-happy
[16:11] <fagan> dobey: probably
[16:11] <fagan> its something fishy anyway
[16:11] <dobey> i've noticed a couple times in unity that my mouse gets 'stuck' when i click on an indicator
[16:11] <dobey> and clicking on indicators some more will 'unstick' it
[16:11] <fagan> Bug #771863
[16:11] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 771863 in indicator-me "Message box becomes un-editable if you switch between indicators and back" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/771863
[16:11] <fagan> kenvandine: ^
[16:12] <kenvandine> fagan, thx
[16:12] <seb128> dobey, kenvandine: the ubuntuone-client recommend on the unity gir fix doesn't work
[16:12] <seb128> you might need mvo's or update-manager help there or to move it to a depends
[16:13] <seb128> I think apt doesn't see it as a new recommends and act like if it was something that you didn't install before on purpose
[16:13] <seb128> so it doesn't bring it in
[16:14] <pitti> mterry, didrocks: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-quickly can't be both "pending approval" and "discuss at uds-o"; does it need discussion or not?
[16:14] <dobey> huh
[16:14] <mterry> pitti, oh maybe I misunderstood the "pending approval" field.  I thought it was approval of the spec to be discussed.  ;)
[16:14] <dobey> where is mvo?
[16:14] <didrocks> mterry: you basically take back all opened WI from natty, isn't it?
[16:15] <seb128> dobey, holidays
[16:15] <pitti> mterry: no, it's for reviewing a spec by the approver after it's done with drafting
[16:15] <dobey> guess it is hard to ask him then :)
[16:15] <mterry> didrocks, there's a bit more in the spec now.  We should talk about keeping up with the joneses (pygi, gtk3) and future stuff (IDE plugins)
[16:15] <pitti> mterry: set to "discussion"
[16:15] <mterry> pitti, gotcha
[16:15] <kenvandine> seb128, we talked about it in #ubuntu-release the other day
[16:15] <didrocks> mterry: right, discussion then ;)
[16:15] <kenvandine> it won't come in by default
[16:15] <seb128> does anybody has a graphical sqlite db browser to recommend?
[16:16] <fagan> oooooh and kenvandine does gwibber auto shorten urls from the broadcast box?
[16:16] <kenvandine> but... update-manager will bring it in when there is the kernel SRU
[16:16] <kenvandine> fagan, no
[16:16] <seb128> kenvandine, that seems buggy, any reason to not depends on it?
[16:16] <kenvandine> fagan, well i don't think so
[16:16] <fagan> kenvandine: is there any reason why not?
[16:16] <kenvandine> because it is optional...
[16:16] <kenvandine> fagan, not really
[16:16] <kenvandine> seb128, we know it kind of sucks...
[16:17] <kenvandine> but considering it was discovered so late... :/
[16:17] <mterry> pitti, thanks for fixing that on the deja-dup one too
[16:17] <dobey> how does update-manager know there needs to do the dist-upgrade magic?
[16:17] <seb128> kenvandine, well I failed verification the sru in any case
[16:17] <fagan> kenvandine: hmmmmm I was wondering since it would be pretty handy I just realised a link was almost the entire char limit :D
[16:17] <seb128> kenvandine, if you rely on a kernel update for it to work that should be described on the sru page but that seems broken to me
[16:18] <dobey> seb128: there is other stuff we need to SRU, and i will be uploading today too, so we can make a small change there if we need to
[16:18] <seb128> kenvandine, I'm also curious to know why a kernel upgrade bring other recommends in
[16:18] <kenvandine> seb128, they said there is some release thing updated for such updates
[16:18] <kenvandine> like the kernel is special cased for update-manager
[16:19] <kenvandine> so  in that process, it does a dist-upgrade instead of an upgrade
[16:19] <seb128> well I would change it to Depends to workaround the issue
[16:19] <dobey> seb128: i think because the kernel update would cause update-manager to do the distro upgrade path instead of regular update
[16:19] <seb128> the gir is small
[16:19]  * kenvandine doesn't have strong opinions either way :)
[16:20] <kenvandine> dobey, check in #ubuntu-release how they feel about making it a depends, see if they are ok with that
[16:21] <dobey> i'm confused
[16:26] <dobey> well, need to get lunch, bbiab
[16:29] <didrocks> ok, time to make some install testing (iso testing already done) on my main laptop
[16:29] <didrocks> be back on a shiny new natty! (let's hope ;))
[16:43] <micahg> pitti: well, I think the main discussion will be how to support firefox/xulrunner in general which already has a blueprint, I was hoping to SRU some of the remaining fixes as we get closer to the EOL date for xulrunner-2.0
[16:44] <pitti> micahg: right, I moved them over (see discussion with chrisccoulson above)
[16:45] <pitti> http://people.canonical.com/~platform/workitems/oneiric/canonical-desktop-team.html -> 74 to go; team, can we do them by EOW?
[16:45]  * pitti borrows rick's whip
[16:45] <seb128> hum
[16:46] <seb128> pitti, you can use the whip on rick as well he has 10 workitems ;-)
[16:48] <chrisccoulson> EOW? I'll have mine done by EOD!
[16:48] <pitti> extra beer for Chris
[16:48]  * pitti hugs the team
[16:48] <chrisccoulson> :)
[16:48]  * chrisccoulson hugs the team too
[17:03] <didrocks> ok, was quick to reinstall with nvidia/vim/bzr/chromium :p
[17:05] <chrisccoulson> mpt, if i indicated download progress in the firefox launcher, would it really be obvious that the progress bar is actually displaying download progress?
[17:06] <chrisccoulson> ie, how would a user know that it's not page-load progress or something else?
[17:06] <chrisccoulson> i just thought about it, and realised that the progress bar could really be indicating anything in firefox :/
[17:07] <seb128> ideally firefox would have a different icon for the download dialog I guess
[17:07] <mpt> chrisccoulson, you're right, that is a problem. One solution would be to have a separate "Downloads" launcher item that has its own progress overlay.
[17:07] <seb128> nautilus has a similar issue which leads for example to be unable to open a nautilus dialog while a copy is in progress
[17:07] <chrisccoulson> mpt - that's possible. there is a separate download window, although i actually want to avoid showing that :)
[17:08] <seb128> libknewstuff2-4
[17:08] <seb128> lol, nice lib :p
[17:08] <mpt> chrisccoulson, I think it would require a new API in the launcher for downloads in general, as opposed to Firefox downloads in particular.
[17:09] <chrisccoulson> mpt - that would be interesting. i'm just playing around with the current implementation in firefox atm, when i realised that i could indicate more than just download progress with it
[17:10] <mpt> chrisccoulson, another thing to consider is that unlike the Windows taskbar or Mac Dock, the Unity launcher is hidden much (perhaps most) of the time. So it can't be the main way of showing progress of something, unless the launcher reveals itself whenever an app has a progress overlay.
[17:10] <mpt> I was thinking about the same thing this morning, wondering whether a launcher item could show printing progress (instead of the uncommunicative system-config-printer icon).
[17:11] <chrisccoulson> the other thing i thought about too is - what happens if you run more than one instance of an application?
[17:12] <didrocks> pitti: oh btw, I never asked you (because I was using terminator not gnome-terminal before, but I'll try to stick with g-t again), do you have any tweak so that alt + A is used by weechat rather than g-t?
[17:12] <chrisccoulson> i took a look in firefox a few days ago, and it seems like the taskbar integration for windows is all per-window
[17:15] <chrisccoulson> mpt - anyway, seems like something we should try and figure out at UDS :)
[17:16] <mpt> chrisccoulson, not me, I'm not involved in the design of the launcher
[17:16] <mpt> but "we" in general, yes :-)
[17:28] <chrisccoulson> mpt, who looks after the design of the launcher btw?
[17:28] <mpt> chrisccoulson, JohnLea afaik
[17:29] <chrisccoulson> mpt, thanks
[17:38] <pitti> didrocks: alt+a does work in weechat, I'm using it all the time ; what does it do for you?
[17:39] <didrocks> pitti: it opens the g-t menu (Affichage)
[17:39] <pitti> didrocks: ah, alt doesn't work at all for the menu in g-t for me
[17:39] <didrocks> but I guess you don't have a "Alt + a" menu shortcut in german :)
[17:39] <didrocks> yeah
[17:40] <didrocks> hum… that would mean that I have to use terminator just for weechat :/ (no menu, problem solved)
[17:43] <pitti> didrocks: I do, "Ansicht"
[17:45] <didrocks> pitti: shouldn't it trigger the "Ansicht" for you then (alt + a)?
[17:50] <pitti> didrocks: right, but it doesn't, as I said
[17:50] <pitti> didrocks: not for any of the other menus either
[17:50] <pitti> seems g-t 'grabs' the alt key somehow
[17:52] <didrocks> ok, I'll revert to terminator or try to reassign the key here
[17:53] <seb128> didrocks, uncheck the "display the menubar"
[17:53] <seb128> I guess that's what pitti use
[17:53] <seb128> without the menu bar it doesn't grab the keybindings
[17:53] <seb128> it doesn't make a difference with appmenu anyway since we strip the menus for the main dialog
[17:54] <hggdh> cyphermox: hi got a question for you if you are available
[17:54] <didrocks> seb128: right, and so it's still grabbing it
[17:54] <didrocks> let me try with the env var
[17:54] <seb128> not for me
[17:54] <seb128> when I uncheck the option alt stop opening menus
[17:56] <didrocks> seb128: oh, the one in shortcut (there is a similar option in profiles)
[17:56] <didrocks> seb128: ok, that works, thanks!
[17:56] <didrocks> :)
[17:56] <seb128> yw
[17:56] <pitti> seb128: I do use the global menu bar, though
[17:56] <pitti> seb128: oh, you mean the per-window menu
[17:56] <seb128> pitti, right, but if you uncheck the view, display menubar
[17:56] <pitti> yes, I have that disabled
[17:57] <seb128> right, that's why it stopped grabbing alt for you
[17:57] <pitti> no scrollbars, no menus, no other stuff; just the terminal
[17:57] <didrocks> there is also an option in shortcut "activate keyboard shortcuts in menus"
[17:57] <didrocks> works well :)
[17:58] <didrocks> thanks pitti, seb128!
[18:00] <pitti> I need to leave earlier today, still need to stop by the train main station for some ticket stuff
[18:00] <pitti> see you tomorrow!
[18:01] <seb128> pitti, see you!
[18:01] <seb128> didrocks, yw ;-)
[18:01] <didrocks> see you pitti!
[18:01] <didrocks> seb128: it's nice to not launch a python app and wait for multiple seconds each time you need a terminal :)
[18:02] <seb128> didrocks, so is your new install working great? ;-)
[18:02] <seb128> pedro_, hely
[18:02] <seb128> hey
[18:02] <didrocks> seb128: oh yeah, I really feel like I've a new machine :-)
[18:02] <didrocks> with exactly the same user configuration, no cleanswap
[18:02] <didrocks> it's amazing
[18:02] <pedro_> hello seb128!
[18:03] <didrocks> hey pedro_
[18:03] <pedro_> salut didrocks
[18:03] <didrocks> seb128: for a maching having the graphical card put in the hoven a month and half ago, it's not that bad ;-)
[18:04] <seb128> pedro_, how are the news from your side? users seem happy?
[18:04] <seb128> didrocks, lol
[18:06] <seb128> jibel: is some discussion happening offline on those indicators empty label bugs?
[18:06] <seb128> jibel: you set those to incomplete without comment?
[18:06] <pedro_> seb128, no big complains here , looks like major things are already being tracked
[18:06] <seb128> was that confirmed by anybody?
[18:06] <seb128> pedro_, ok ;-)
[18:07] <jibel> seb128, I was discussing with patrickmw asking him to attach screenshots
[18:07] <seb128> jibel: did anybody test with the same locale to confirm or not?
[18:07] <jibel> no confirmation yet
[18:08] <patrickmw> seb128, yes.  I've been talking with dpm
[18:08] <patrickmw> we will be working on it more tomorrow
[18:08] <seb128> ok
[18:08] <jibel> I can try but I'm not comfortable with chinese
[18:08] <seb128> does it seem like a broken translation?
[18:09] <seb128> jibel: well it's likely a matter or installing the langpack, picking the language on the gdm screen and clicking on the indicators to see if you get text or not
[18:09] <seb128> or you might be able to try on the liveCD directly
[18:11] <dobey> kenvandine: i wonder if davidz's thing validates certs. i bet not! :)
[18:11] <kenvandine> dobey, what is davidz's thing?
[18:11] <dobey> kenvandine: http://davidz25.blogspot.com/2011/04/gnome-online-accounts.html
[18:12] <dobey> also, it's horrible for a million other reasons, but alas :)
[18:14] <kenvandine> dobey, i doubt it does
[18:14] <dobey> kenvandine: i know. i immediately thought of you when i saw that :)
[18:15]  * kenvandine grumbles about webkitgtk
[18:16] <kenvandine> one of those things i'll probably have to do for oneiric
[18:16] <kenvandine> move all the auth stuff out of webkit webviews and into an external browser
[18:17] <kenvandine> for gwibber that is
[18:18] <kenvandine> although it would be really nice to be able to drop gwibber-accounts completely and rely on gnome online accounts :)
[18:18] <kenvandine> but not if it ignores ssl
[18:26] <dpm> patrickmw, jibel, seb128, I'm downloading the iso myself, but I need to go soon, so I won't be able to report back until tomorrow. Someone from the Simplified Chinese team is going to test it too, but he says he didn't see any issues on beta2
[18:26] <patrickmw> dpm, I discovered something interesting
[18:26] <seb128> dpm, there is a special iso?
[18:27] <seb128> dpm, shouldn't it be a matter to start any natty iso with the buggy locale?
[18:27] <dpm> seb128, yeah, but I first have to download the iso :)
[18:27] <seb128> dpm, you are saying that in week of iso testing you had no iso yet? ;-)
[18:28]  * dpm hides
[18:28] <seb128> dpm, I'm sure you are using a mac for work!
[18:28] <seb128> I knew it!
[18:28] <seb128> ;-)
[18:28] <dpm> seb128, what, you're using this Ubuntoo thing?
[18:28] <seb128> those community people, you can't trust them ;-)
[18:28] <seb128> ;-)
[18:28] <patrickmw> gdm had the correct lang pack selected by default, but it didn't seem to be loading it.  I logged out and selected a different pack to login with.   Then I logged out again and selected the default pack in gdm at it worked!
[18:30] <dpm> hm, weird, perhaps another case of language-selector and gdm not playing well together? Although I thought this had been fixed
[18:32] <patrickmw> dpm, it only occurs with simplified Chinese
[18:34] <seb128> can you check the .dmrc local when you get the issue?
[18:39] <patrickmw> seb128, yes.  I will try with a clean install so I can replicate it.  Now that its set, I don't think it will break again
[18:49] <nessita> pitti: hey there, have a few minutes? joshua mentioned that SRU for maverick bug #709494 is approved, and that we can upload the package. Would you be available to sponsor the upload or approve the SRU so I can request a sponsor to someone else?
[18:49] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 709494 in ubuntu-sso-client "[SRU] Missing user's name field" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/709494
[18:52] <dobey> nessita: i think everyone is concentrating on 11.04 release right now. maybe friday or early next week would be easier to get that dealt with?
[18:53] <seb128> re
[18:53] <seb128> nessita, what do you need?
[18:53] <nessita> dobey: perhaps. I was asking since Joshua said he alrady spoke with pitti ;-)
[18:53] <seb128> nessita, hi btw ;-)
[18:53] <nessita> seb128: hey there!
[18:54] <nessita> seb128: I'm chasing pitti since I have this SRU for maverick that is important to have moving forward: bug #709494. Joshua Hoover said that pitti approved it, that we can upload the package branch proposed. But the bug itself does not have his approval
[18:54] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 709494 in ubuntu-sso-client "[SRU] Missing user's name field" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/709494
[18:54] <nessita> seb128: so I'm not sure how to proceed
[18:55] <seb128> oh ok, pitti is off for the evening I think but ping him tomorrow
[18:55] <nessita> seb128: thanks :-)
[18:55] <dobey> nessita: hrmm, nobody approved the merge proposal yet.
[18:55] <nessita> dobey: right, all I have is an email from Joshua, that's why I was pinging pitti directly
[18:56] <seb128> well I think people were focussed on natty
[18:56] <nessita> right
[18:56] <nessita> (makes sense)
[18:56] <seb128> but we will not have a respin now so tomorrow is an ok time to ping pitti
[18:56] <dobey> nessita: yeah i see now. i have some maverick SRUs to do too, but have to deal with 11.04 issues first
[18:57] <dobey> seb128: sure we can't have a respin to fix that recommends? ;)
[18:58] <seb128> lol
[18:58] <nessita> :-)
[19:00] <dobey> seb128: any idea who to talk to other than mvo about update-manager behavior?
[19:01] <seb128> dobey, no really, but you should go with the depends
[19:01] <seb128> or wait for mvo to be back
[19:01] <seb128> dobey, calendar says he will be back tomorrow
[19:02] <dobey> i guess we could do depends for an update, then switch back to recommends later
[19:02] <seb128> right
[19:02] <didrocks> seems reasonable to go that road
[19:02] <seb128> it's not like the gir was going to break anything or take space
[19:02] <kenvandine> dobey, talked to davidz, it is of course plagued with the same ssl problem
[19:02] <kenvandine> but he wants to try to solve that in a general way
[19:02] <dobey> kenvandine: of course
[19:02] <kenvandine> so epiphany and all get fixes
[19:03] <kenvandine> reusing some of the gnome-keyring stuff
[19:03] <kenvandine> he has ideas
[19:03] <kenvandine> so that is good
[19:03] <dobey> ugh
[19:03] <kenvandine> this could mean i can get rid of gwibber-accounts completely :)
[19:03] <didrocks> ok, have a good evening everyone! :-)
[19:03] <dobey> what a horrible mess/design
[19:03] <kenvandine> good night didrocks
[19:03] <dobey> cheers didrocks
[19:03] <seb128> didrocks, thanks, same here
[19:03] <didrocks> kenvandine: dobey: see you!
[19:03] <kenvandine> dobey, just glad someone else is trying to solve it
[19:04] <didrocks> seb128: thanks, you too ;)
[19:04] <kenvandine> dobey, we can't just keep re-writing everything :)
[19:04] <kenvandine> we'll call it "Dobey OS"
[19:04] <kenvandine> :)
[19:04] <dobey> kenvandine: well, except that is all this 'solution' is going to lead to :)
[19:04] <kenvandine> that's evolving :)
[19:04] <dobey> more people rewriting the same junk over and over
[19:05] <kenvandine> he isn't sure that is what he will do
[19:05] <kenvandine> but there are some dialogs there that can at least be re-used
[19:05] <dobey> ugh, dialogs
[19:06] <kenvandine> but he sees there needs to be a general cert handling mechanism
[19:06] <kenvandine> for epiphany, midori, etc
[19:06] <kenvandine> webkitgtk/libsoup/gio anything uses
[19:06] <kenvandine> which is the right attitude
[19:06] <dobey> i think i am just going to install skynet on my computer
[19:06] <kenvandine> don't solve the problem 10 different ways
[19:07] <dobey> attitude and implementation don't always go down the same path though
[19:07] <dobey> lots of good ideas get implemented wrong all the time
[19:07] <dobey> like health care
[19:07] <kenvandine> sure
[19:37] <kenvandine> bcurtiswx, we're in a tornado watch here too, lets hope it doesn't get interesting :)
[19:38] <bcurtiswx> Nothing here yet. Keyword: yet
[19:39] <bcurtiswx> Storm wise
[19:42] <bcurtiswx> kenvandine: How bad is it there?
[19:42] <kenvandine> nothing here either
[19:42] <kenvandine> loud thunder about an hour ago
[19:42] <kenvandine> but that has passed
[19:43] <dobey> same here
[19:43] <dobey> thunder, clouds, a tiny spot of rain, and poof, sunlight
[20:17] <dobey> pedro_: hey. "Your membership to 'ubuntu-bug-control' is about to expire." :)
[20:18] <pedro_> dobey, mine? :-P
[20:18] <dobey> pedro_: mine
[20:18] <pedro_> dobey, i'll have a look, is dobey also your id on lp?
[20:19] <dobey> pedro_: yep
[20:19] <pedro_> dobey, renewed
[20:20] <dobey> pedro_: thanks
[20:20] <pedro_> you're welcome
[20:48] <chrisccoulson> nice. approximately 19 minutes (35%) battery life remaining
[20:48] <chrisccoulson> STOP EATING ALL MY BATTERY!
[20:49] <chrisccoulson> :)
[20:51]  * JFo eats all chrisccoulson 's battery
[20:51] <chrisccoulson> heh
[20:51] <chrisccoulson> something is eating all my battery
[20:51] <JFo> kill -9 JFo
[20:51] <johanbr_> chrisccoulson, 35% of your battery equates to 19 minutes? that doesn't sound very good
[20:52] <chrisccoulson> johanbr_, no, my battery life in natty is horrendous. and my laptop runs very hot (too hot to sit on my knee)
[20:52] <johanbr_> did you check with powertop?
[20:52] <dobey> chrisccoulson: do you have a dell xps?
[20:53] <chrisccoulson> johanbr_, i'm uessing it's related to bug 760131
[20:53] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 760131 in linux "Power consumption raised significantly in natty" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/760131
[20:53] <chrisccoulson> dobey, it's a latitude
[20:54] <chrisccoulson> my battery is actually dying too (61% capacity)
[20:54] <chrisccoulson> but it's using over 25W whilst doing nothing
[20:55] <dobey> nice
[20:55] <dobey> it's probably firefox
[20:55] <dobey> :)
[20:55] <johanbr_> I just realized I'm affected by this too :( my laptop is usually plugged in, so I didn't notice before...
[20:55] <johanbr_> (also a Dell, FWIW)
[20:56] <chrisccoulson> dobey, it uses that without firefox open ;)
[20:56] <JanC> johanbr_: AFAIK everybody is affected by it
[20:56] <dobey> my dell duo is actually fine, escept for the fact that the battery life on the dell duo sucks anyway
[20:56] <JanC> not only Ubuntu, everybody using a 2.6.38 or later kernel
[20:56] <chrisccoulson> yeah, the battery life on my dell has always sucked too, but it's never sucked this bad before
[20:58] <Sarvatt> chromium causes a nice 20k+ wakeups/second now :)
[20:58] <Sarvatt> oh hey, its down to around 5k now since updating from last week's
[20:58] <chrisccoulson> that's a lot of wakeups!
[20:58] <chrisccoulson> are you sure that's not every minute? ;)
[20:59] <Sarvatt> got to admit I'm not seeing the power problems at all, I've got it down to an amazing 7.3w idle on a dell e6420. uses less power than my atom netbook
[20:59] <Sarvatt> yeah positive its a bug in the chromium dailies for the past few weeks
[21:00] <Sarvatt> http://code.google.com/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=77625
[21:02] <johanbr_> yep, my wakeups go from ~ 1000 to fewer than 100 after quitting chromium too... guess I don't have this bug after all
[21:06] <walters> remember, you run websites, not browsers
[21:12] <dobey> walters: it feels a lot more like websites run you.