[03:19] <rickspencer3_> RAOF, TheMuso hey guys
[03:19] <RAOF> Hey.
[03:19] <TheMuso> Hey rickspencer3_.
[03:19] <rickspencer3_> I need a better nick
[03:20] <RAOF> :)
[03:20] <rickspencer3_> RAOF, TheMuso so, Natty goes out tomorrow
[03:20] <rickspencer3_> thoughts?
[03:20] <TheMuso> Its another release, things work better, a11y is incrementally better... I have been involved with so many releases now that one doesn't necessarily feel any more special than the other.
[03:21] <RAOF> It'll be fun.
[03:21]  * JerryGarcia rips some licks, mostly mixolydian and dorian
[03:21] <JerryGarcia> TheMuso, how do you feel it compares quality-wise?
[03:21] <RAOF> I don't think X will explode or cause Unity to look bad.
[03:22] <RAOF> I think Unity itself looks pretty good.
[03:22] <TheMuso> Overall uality is fine, but I think unity could have done with 6 months more baking after the rewrite personally, and that will happen for oneiric, but 6 months more only in testing mode may have been better.
[03:23] <JerryGarcia> interesting
[03:23] <JerryGarcia> well, I think it's been a relatively intense release cycle in some ways
[03:23] <TheMuso> Yes it has.
[03:23] <JerryGarcia> I know some folks worked a bit even extra hard
[03:24] <TheMuso> I guess my thoughts re unity above are in relation to a11y not getting completed. If unity wasn't such a moving target, a11y enablement would have been easier./
[03:24] <JerryGarcia> TheMuso, for sure
[03:24] <JerryGarcia> let's not back off of that
[03:24] <TheMuso> Of course not.
[03:24] <JerryGarcia> make sure it's done done for 11.10
[03:24] <JerryGarcia> and also, we've got to get Qt accessible as well
[03:24] <TheMuso> Thats the plan. I have a lot more dbusmenu/indicator work to be done too.
[03:25] <TheMuso> Yep, thats going to be difficult, since afaik unity 2D uses QML.
[03:25] <JerryGarcia> yup
[03:25] <JerryGarcia> we've got to fix that, make Qt/QML work for everyone
[03:25] <RAOF> And QML isn't accessible?
[03:25] <micahg> JerryGarcia: you're nick is making me hungry for ice cream :)
[03:25] <micahg> *your
[03:26] <TheMuso> RAOF: Not yet. The qt at-spi bridge works with some/most conventional QT widgets, but QML support is still in the early stages.
[03:27] <CherryGracia> QML is a weird beast, it's not quite like a traditional widget toolkit
[03:27] <broder> CherryGracia: that's just cruel
[03:27] <CherryGracia> cruel indeed
[03:27] <CherryGracia> but Ben and Jerry's is so good
[03:29] <TheMuso> CherryGracia: Do you know if there are plans to eventually merge unity and unity 2D?
[03:29] <TheMuso> Because that would make much more sense.
[03:29] <CherryGracia> TheMuso, none that I know of
[03:29] <CherryGracia> well ...
[03:29] <bryceh> rickspencer3, how are you feeling about it?
[03:29] <CherryGracia> I don't know
[03:29] <TheMuso> Then we just tie in atk/at-spi to the unity backend, and its toolkit abnostic then, and will just work a11y wise.
[03:29] <CherryGracia> I wouldn't underestimate what the Unity team will be able to do with nux
[03:29] <TheMuso> Right, more work duplication then... :S
[03:30] <CherryGracia> well, only the view is duplicated
[03:30] <CherryGracia> hey bryceh, what do *you* think?
[03:31] <bryceh> hey rick
[03:31] <CherryGracia> :)
[03:32] <bryceh> CherryGracia, looking only at X, I feel like there was a humongous amount of progress, and I especially got through a lot of Intel driver bugs
[03:32] <CherryGracia> sweet
[03:32] <CherryGracia> bryceh, how about the release as a whole?
[03:32] <bryceh> the gpu freeze situation is definitely a couple orders of magnitude better than we've done in the past
[03:32] <CherryGracia> bryceh, for sure
[03:33] <CherryGracia>  lots of investments on your part starting to pay off
[03:33] <bryceh> CherryGracia, well, I'd echo what TheMuso says that more testing of unity could have benefitted us, although it's impressive how well it came together by the end
[03:33] <CherryGracia> yeah
[03:34] <CherryGracia> although, it is rock solid for me
[03:34] <RAOF> It always is.
[03:34] <CherryGracia> I mean, from every point of view
[03:34] <RAOF> Developers don't run into bugs.
[03:34] <RAOF> First law of programming.
[03:34] <CherryGracia> I find it so much easier to use than old gnome
[03:34] <CherryGracia> RAOF, I am hardly a developer :)
[03:34] <bryceh> RAOF, unless it's code they're not involved in, in which case they run across weird random issues no one else in the world can reproduce
[03:35] <CherryGracia> hah
[03:35] <bryceh> CherryGracia, I'm using it on my -intel systems, but found it was just slightly too laggy for my -ati box so went back to non-compiz there
[03:35] <CherryGracia> dang it
[03:36] <CherryGracia> I have been well served by sticking to intel graphics
[03:36] <CherryGracia> let's see if in 11.10 we can make it sing with nvidia
[03:36] <bryceh> but aside from the lagginess it worked well; few graphics issues, no crashers or lockups
[03:36] <RAOF> In my experience it *does* sing on nvidia.
[03:36] <TheMuso> If Intel made discrete cards for desktops, I'd use them, but since they don't, ATI cards are my next best choice./
[03:36] <RAOF> Then again, I don't normally use my nvidia system :)
[03:37] <bryceh> I had a lot of trouble doing without gnome-panel though (ended up just loading it atop unity, then was fine)
[03:37] <broder> CherryGracia: i've been using it on nvidia-current for the past few days and it seems to be working fine. granted, i only use chrome and gnome-terminal on this machine :)
[03:37] <CherryGracia> huh
[03:37] <CherryGracia> hey broder yeah, I think nvidia with the proprietary driver is working well, or so I hear
[03:37] <CherryGracia> (and notice in the bug reports)
[03:38] <CherryGracia> personally, I suspect that 11.04 represents a significant step forward for the project
[03:38] <TheMuso> I'd agree with that.
[03:38] <CherryGracia> I believe that Unity is well position to capture a lot of users who wouldn;'t have considered a free desktop in the past
[03:38] <TheMuso> I know I will enjoy using Unity when its fully a11y enabled./
[03:39] <CherryGracia> TheMuso, fully enabled is part of making it a consumer grade product
[03:39] <TheMuso> Yep.
[03:39] <CherryGracia> Consumer Grade Quality by 12.04!
[03:39] <CherryGracia> I think that with what we accomplished in 11.04, and then some innovation in how we do QA, we could really bring Free software to a lot more users
[03:39] <CherryGracia> I mean A LOT
[03:40] <TheMuso> Yep.
[03:40] <CherryGracia> even my wife begrudgingly admitted that Unity looked both cool and easy to use ;)
[03:40] <RAOF> :)
[03:40] <bryceh> I've not yet put it on my wife's system
[03:40] <bryceh> CherryGracia, qa innovations?
[03:40] <CherryGracia> bryceh, yeah
[03:41] <bryceh> do tell
[03:42] <CherryGracia> well ... the QA team is in a position to wipe the slate clean, and help us figure out better ways to manage quality
[05:03] <ale1965> hi all... ;-)
[05:03] <ale1965> bye...
[07:48] <didrocks> good morning
[07:49] <pitti> Good morning
[07:50] <pitti> dobey: 709494 SRU> as I said, just upload the package; uploads will be reviewed from the queue
[07:53] <didrocks> hey pitti
[07:53] <pitti> hey didrocks
[07:53] <pitti> the new unity seems to have a regression :/ the launcher stays on the screen even when there are windows moving under it
[07:53]  * pitti will try to construct a reproducible test case
[07:54] <didrocks> pitti: oh really? isn't it a stacking issue? I didn't get that at all
[07:55] <didrocks> pitti: if you are in that state again (even if you don't have a reproducible test case, can you please: dbus-send --print-reply --dest=com.canonical.Unity.Launcher /com/canonical/Unity/Debug com.canonical.Unity.Debug.Introspection.GetState string:'Launcher'
[07:55] <didrocks> pitti: the value next to hide-quirks is the one interessing me
[07:55] <pitti> didrocks: stacking is fine, it's just not going away when it should
[07:55] <pitti> didrocks: sure, I'll try that
[07:56] <didrocks> pitti: sometimes, compiz stacking is screwed in some way that isn't visible (because we force the launcher to be repainted above), and compiz doesn't tell "there is a window below"
[07:56] <didrocks> but well, this debug info will still give us an help :)
[07:57] <didrocks> pitti: there is one case with qt app dnd which doesn't release the Xorg info, but it's already in the current natty version :/
[08:04] <pitti> didrocks: erm, this d-bus command just crashed unity
[08:04] <didrocks> ?
[08:04] <didrocks> how come!
[08:04]  * didrocks tries
[08:05] <pitti> didrocks: anyway, I think I can reproduce it; I'll file a bug, and mark the current SRU as regression
[08:05] <didrocks> no crash here, I have the debug output as usual
[08:05] <didrocks> pitti: ok, nice! :-)
[08:08] <didrocks> pitti: just hilight me with the bug number then please, so that I can at least have a quick look
[08:08] <pitti> didrocks: ok, got the debug output, too
[08:09] <didrocks> pitti: sweet!
[08:09] <didrocks> what the magical number? :-)
[08:09] <didrocks> what's*
[08:09] <pitti> gimme a minute to file it :)
[08:15] <pitti> didrocks: bug 772185
[08:15] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 772185 in unity "[3.8.12 regression] launcher sometimes doesn't hide when there are windows beneath it" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/772185
[08:15]  * pitti downgrades to confirm
[08:16] <pitti> didrocks: darn, this isn't a reproducer apparently; that test case also fails with 3.8.10
[08:17] <didrocks> pitti: seems that unity thinks your move is over the bfb
[08:17] <didrocks> even the trigger
[08:17] <didrocks> (the 5x5 topleft corner)
[08:18]  * pitti will restart session a couple of times to play with this
[08:19] <didrocks> pitti: so yeah, to sum up, it sees there is a window under, but the mouse is over the trigger and bfb for it
[08:19] <didrocks> hence the fact it's shown
[08:19] <pitti> didrocks: what is the bfb?
[08:19] <didrocks> (and I can't reproduce)
[08:19] <didrocks> pitti: the ubuntu logo
[08:20] <pitti> didrocks: not even in a guest session?
[08:20] <didrocks> big friendly button :)
[08:20] <pitti> lol
[08:20] <didrocks> let me try that, I'm generally swapping, so better to restart in a fresh session
[08:20] <didrocks> brb
[08:20] <didrocks> I just try on an empty ws
[08:20] <pitti> didrocks: it seems to clean up its state after a bit
[08:21] <pitti> also, it seems to go away once I open an indicator menu
[08:21] <didrocks> ok, let me try restart, brb
[08:23] <didrocks> pitti: interesting
[08:24] <didrocks> pitti: it's before the first show/hide
[08:24] <didrocks> pitti: I know why, I can fix this
[08:25] <pitti> didrocks: I found another and better test case which has even worse results, but it's not a regression either
[08:25] <pitti> so I wonder what part of my gsession script triggers the regression :/
[08:25] <didrocks> pitti: oh? which one? (still need the magical number from the debug output)
[08:26] <didrocks> pitti: if you put your mouse over the bfb, all is magically reset, isn't it?
[08:26] <didrocks> (or over the launcher even)
[08:27] <pitti> didrocks: no, not here; but let me upgrade to 3.8.12 again first
[08:27] <pitti> I even get the bubble help (for e. g. nautilus) staying around permanently
[08:28] <didrocks> pitti: this one should be fixed in 3.8.12, there was a commit for that
[08:28] <pitti> right, apparently it is
[08:30] <pitti> didrocks: I added an alternative test case (alt+f2, gnome-terminal --maximize)
[08:30] <didrocks> pitti: alt + F2 is also in the fresh session, isn't it?
[08:31] <didrocks> anyway, all those issues are because the values aren't rightly initialized
[08:31] <didrocks> so, main case, when you start a session
[08:31] <didrocks> click on the launcher
[08:32] <didrocks> that resets all states
[08:32] <didrocks> I'll just give saner default first ;)
[08:32] <pitti> didrocks: yes
[08:33] <pitti> didrocks: and I confirmed it's not a regression, it just seems to be a race condition which my gsession script triggers
[08:33] <didrocks> pitti: yeah, it's just because you automate everything and don't "click click" :-)
[08:33] <didrocks> shouldn't be long, do you want to test that in a ppa then?
[08:34] <pitti> bug updated
[08:34] <pitti> didrocks: it's not a biggie, so no hurry; I'll be happy to test a PPA, of course
[08:35] <pitti> didrocks: I was just concerned that it is a regression, but it's not
[08:36] <didrocks> thanks pitti :)
[08:36] <pitti> thanks to you!
[08:50] <rodrigo_> morning
[08:52] <pitti> hey rodrigo_
[08:53] <rodrigo_> hi pitti
[08:54] <didrocks> hey rodrigo_
[08:55] <rodrigo_> hi didrocks
[09:00] <didrocks> pitti: ok, so it will be a very ugly workaround, not sure why compiz sent the mouse event with x/y=0:0 3 times at startup :/
[09:01] <pitti> didrocks: so that's the problem? compiz sending out false coordinates when I drag the window to a different position?
[09:01] <didrocks> pitti: no, false coordinates at startup only
[09:01] <didrocks> pitti: so, it's the last state we register
[09:01] <rodrigo_> didrocks, that looks that $DISPLAY, not a coordinate, right?
[09:01] <didrocks> and we really believe the mouse is above the bfb
[09:01] <pitti> didrocks: as I said, it's not urgent at all, as it's not a regression; if we reassign it to compiz, and it takes a little longer to fix, no problem
[09:02] <didrocks> rodrigo_: no, it's just me telling 0x0 ;)
[09:02] <rodrigo_> ah
[09:02] <didrocks> pitti: not sure we should fix that before O "the right way". Everytime we touch the small tiniest thing in compiz…
[09:02] <didrocks> pitti: but yeah, let's workaround it for SRU 1
[09:03] <pitti> didrocks: fixing in oneiric sounds fine; it doesn't seem to bite a lot of people
[09:03] <pitti> and it's easy to make it go away again
[09:04] <didrocks> pitti: you are the first one to report it. The bug is there for weeks :-)
[09:04] <pitti> didrocks: so, oneiric then :)
[09:04] <didrocks> pitti: but an easy workaround is still possible to "polish and finish" in a SRU 1 (no need to reset the SRU 0 timer)
[09:08] <seb128> hey desktopers
[09:09] <mvo> hey seb128
[09:09] <pitti> bonjour seb128
[09:09] <pitti> guten Morgen mvo
[09:09] <seb128> hey mvo, how are you? had a nice weekend?
[09:10] <seb128> weekend -> week maybe ;-)
[09:10] <seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
[09:11] <pitti> seb128: looking forward to the release!
[09:11] <mvo> seb128, pitti: heh :) yeah, had a *long* weekend, was pretty nice
[09:11] <seb128> oh? I find it old news, I'm looking forward oneiric opening and landing GNOME3 :p
[09:11] <mvo> yipieee
[09:12] <seb128> mvo, did the weather turned from summer back to rain for you as well?
[09:12] <mvo> seb128: yeah, wonderful easter weekend, but tue, wed was rainy and windy and miserable
[09:12] <seb128> mvo, that's because those days were supposed to be work days ;-)
[09:13] <mvo> haha
[09:13] <mvo> I checked mail three times a day to make sure the sky is not falling, but all was good
[09:13] <seb128> dobey was looking for you
[09:14] <seb128> seems he followed my advice and changed the recommends to a depends
[09:14]  * Sweetshark hopes for some rain to wash away all the tree stuff that I am allergic against.
[09:16] <pitti> Sweetshark: there was plenty of rain yesterday here; not in Hamburg?
[09:17] <glatzor> morning pitti seb128 and mvo!
[09:17] <Sweetshark> pitti: not yet.
[09:17] <pitti> hey glatzor!
[09:17] <seb128> hey glatzor
[09:18] <glatzor> mvo, dbus exceptions and encodings are a nightmare!
[09:19] <mvo> hey glatzor
[09:19] <mvo> glatzor: more issue :/ ?
[09:20] <mvo> and yeah, I agree very much with that statement!
[09:20] <ajf_> pitti: thanks for looking at my json-glib bug, I was away for a few days but put some test code on the bug last night.
[09:21] <pitti> ajf_: I saw, thanks! it's verified now, so it's all good
[09:21] <glatzor> mvo, check out revision 654. I added a show case :)
[09:21] <ajf_> :D
[09:25] <glatzor> mvo, the test_dbus_exception in tests/test_unicodedecoding.py will fail. The ErrorMessage in the end is taken from dbus _reply_error_method
[09:25] <mvo> glatzor: let me try
[09:27] <seb128> so seems like pitti hates unity and want to fail verification the sru? ;-)
[09:28] <pitti> fvwm FTW!
[09:30] <didrocks> seb128: yeah, false regression in addition! we include bugs from the start us! :-)
[09:31] <seb128> ;-)
[09:31] <seb128> well the thing is that he really has to try with some scripts at session startup to try to find a bug
[09:31] <seb128> that's not even fair testing :p
[09:31] <seb128> just for the record I've no issue with the new unity since yesterday
[09:32] <didrocks> seb128: well, in fact, you get it if you try to hide the launcher before putting the mouse over the bfb or launcher
[09:32] <didrocks> but yeah, not the common case at all :)
[09:32] <pitti> yes, it's running quite fine here
[09:33] <didrocks> seb128: I think pitti wants me to have a heart attack :-)
[09:33] <pitti> and I want to keep it that way, so I'm freaking out on possible regressions, sorry :)
[09:33] <didrocks> pitti: no worry, nice to have feedbacks! :-)
[09:34] <glatzor> mvo, i added some comments to the test
[09:35] <glatzor> mvo, I am now at the point to just call repr(msg) and ignore non ascii chars at all :)
[09:36] <mvo> glatzor: hrm, hrm, yeah, I just played with it and it seem that whatever is done its wrong
[09:36] <mvo> glatzor: or double escaping them or some crazyness like this
[09:37] <chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
[09:38] <Sweetshark> how do I become member of https://launchpad.net/~lo-menubar-team ?
[09:40] <seb128> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
[09:40] <seb128> Sweetshark, you ask one admin of the team, i.e dbarth or maybe didrocks can do it
[09:42] <didrocks> Sweetshark: done! :-)
[09:43] <chrisccoulson> hi seb128, i'm good thanks. how are you?
[09:43] <seb128> I'm fine thanks
[09:47] <Sweetshark> didrocks: thanks!
[09:47] <dbarth> didrocks: thanks didrocks, you beat me to that
[09:48] <dbarth> Sweetshark: welcome to the great team of lo-menubar developers
[09:49] <Sweetshark> dbarth: I just want to get the fix to bug 754562 into the branch. ;)
[09:49] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 754562 in libreoffice "soffice.bin crashed with SIGSEGV in g_hash_table_lookup()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/754562
[09:50]  * Sweetshark waves: "Hi lo-menubar devs, I am the new guy."
[09:53] <fagan> Hey I removed the gnome 3 ppa from my install of ubuntu and now im getting no sessions to select at login
[09:54] <fagan> any way I can ask gdm to readd unity to the list
[09:55] <fagan> like at the moment the session selection box is empty and doesnt give me any options when I click it
[09:55] <rodrigo_> fagan, did you remove gnome-session* packages?
[09:56] <didrocks> ok, need to do some errands bb in a couple of horus
[09:56] <fagan> rodrigo_: well gnome-session is installed I checked that first
[09:56] <mvo> didrocks: bug #765664 is not really a bug, right? we just removed the setting from the control center and use gdm for this now?
[09:56] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 765664 in compiz "compiz not working after upgrade" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/765664
[09:56] <didrocks> mvo: exactly
[09:56] <rodrigo_> fagan, which version?
[09:57] <fagan> rodrigo_: give me 10 secs and ill find out
[09:59] <fagan> rodrigo_: ok now its after getting weird, according to apt its not installed but when I say gnome-session in commandline it responds
[09:59] <rodrigo_> hmm
[10:00] <fagan> rodrigo_: ok I think im after fixing it with apt now
[10:00] <fagan> ill see if it actually works though
[10:00] <dbarth> Sweetshark: wow, there's a lot of formating changes in the patch
[10:01] <dbarth> Sweetshark: and you've committed directly on the branch: was the code code-reviewed upstream already?
[10:01] <mvo> thanks didrocks
[10:02] <seb128> hey rodrigo_
[10:02] <rodrigo_> hi seb128
[10:02] <fagan> ok worked
[10:02] <seb128> rodrigo_, i've assigned you another "can't delete couchdb contacts" bug but it's from 10.10
[10:03] <Sweetshark> dbarth: yes, it is quite a lot of formatting change as I upstreamed the code to LibreOffice and had to change some formatting to fit the LO code conventions (and to get a warning-free compile in the LibreOffice build).
[10:03] <seb128> rodrigo_, how are you today btw? ;-)
[10:03] <rodrigo_> fagan, yes, I guess you told apt to remove all packages from the ppa, so I'm sure there are others you'll be missing
[10:03] <rodrigo_> seb128, yes, just saw it
[10:03] <rodrigo_> seb128, I'm fine, and you? :)
[10:03] <seb128> chrisccoulson_, do you still plan to work on bug #765736? you could perhaps assign it to you?
[10:03] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 765736 in bamf "Thunderbird won't stay in launcher and no quicklist" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/765736
[10:03] <fagan> rodrigo_: well I did a ppa-purge so it just didnt reinstall everything it seems
[10:03] <seb128> rodrigo_, I'm fine thanks
[10:04] <rodrigo_> fagan, right, it removed all gnome3 versions, and didn't install the 2.32 one I guess
[10:04] <rodrigo_> that's what ppa-purge does, right?
[10:04] <chrisccoulson_> seb128 - i left a comment on there, i was just waiting on feedback really
[10:04] <Sweetshark> dbarth: you can see the diff without most of the formatting changes at http://cgit.freedesktop.org/libreoffice/libs-core/commit/?id=45799b46a56f6da88817ef768dbb8364c3bf93b5
[10:05] <fagan> rodrigo_: ppa-purge is supposed to downgrade to anything in the repo and remove anything that isnt
[10:05] <seb128> chrisccoulson_, ok
[10:05] <seb128> chrisccoulson_, I just noticed users keep commenting on it
[10:05] <rodrigo_> fagan, ah, but gnome-session 2.32 has an extra package than the 3.0 version, I guess it just didn't install that extra package, so removed it
[10:06] <fagan> rodrigo_: probably
[10:07] <Sweetshark> dbarth: although I should not have mixed in the constness changes. That was unfortunate.
[10:08] <glatzor> mvo, by the way http://farmdev.com/talks/unicode/
[10:09] <rodrigo_> seb128, pitti: a friend of mine who works at a university is looking for projects/companies to get students from a free software degree to participate in free software projects (like google soc), so would we be interested in getting some student to help?
[10:09] <seb128> rodrigo_, I don't know, I think usually we don't do internship out of some special cases, maybe check with jasoncwarner rather
[10:10] <rodrigo_> ok
[10:11] <mvo> thanks glatzor
[10:18] <tkamppeter> jasoncwarner, hi
[10:19] <glatzor> mvo, the default python Exception also doesn't accept any unicode string. that is sad
[10:25] <glatzor> mvo, I think I found a solution. I just overwrite the get_dbus_message method in AptDaemonError to avoid the Exception.__str__ call
[10:27] <pitti> rodrigo_: as part of the existing community involvement for sure
[10:27] <pitti> rodrigo_: we have had some internships in Canonical, but I don't know the procedures there
[10:27] <mvo> glatzor: oh, nice idea
[10:29] <mvo> rodrigo_: I currently "mentor" juliank as a intern and that works great, so +1 from me for a initiative like this
[10:42] <didrocks> mvo: you're welcome ;)
[10:42] <didrocks> mvo: btw, I subscribed you at the oneconf blueprint secretely during your holidays! ;)
[10:42] <hyperair> is it too late for a samba fix?
[10:43] <didrocks> mvo: not sure it worths a session, but at least, if we can discuss that around a beer and see how we can bind it in the software center review server
[10:43] <hyperair> there's this annoying crasher with libnss_wins.so with gethostbyname() which affects a crapton of packages
[10:43] <rodrigo_> mvo, pitti, seb128: I just sent a mail to jason, so let's see what he says
[10:43] <seb128> rodrigo_, ok, let me know
[10:44] <mvo> didrocks: I saw that :)
[10:44] <mvo> didrocks: beer++
[10:44] <didrocks> mvo: excellent, let's plan that then! :-) thanks ;)
[11:04] <glatzor> mvo, I committed the fix
[11:05]  * mvo HUGS glatzor
[11:40] <didrocks> pitti: TBH, that's maybe a regression from the new nux :)
[11:40] <didrocks> let me see the commits
[11:40] <seb128> didrocks, he found another bug?
[11:40] <didrocks> seb128: no, the first one
[11:40] <seb128> ok
[11:49] <pitti> didrocks: sorry, which bug?
[11:50] <didrocks> pitti: the launcher not wanted to hide one
[11:50] <pitti> didrocks: oh, I see
[11:52] <seb128> hum, libreoffice-writer corner grab handle behaves weirdly there sometimes
[11:53] <seb128> like it displays some compiz orange selection over the scrollbar and open a context menu
[11:54] <seb128> context menus or what looks like the file menu docked next to the dialog
[11:54] <seb128> quite weird
[11:54] <seb128> does anybody else get that?
[11:57] <jasoncwarner> morning everyone....
[11:58] <seb128> hey jasoncwarner
[11:58] <seb128> how are you?
[11:58] <didrocks> hey jasoncwarner!
[11:58] <jasoncwarner> hey seb128, pretty good...just trying to put the finishing touches on my talk for budapest....
[11:58] <jasoncwarner> hey didrocks! morning...
[11:59] <seb128> jasoncwarner, what are you going to talk about there? ;-)
[11:59] <jasoncwarner> so how is release day going? everyone feeling pretty good?
[11:59] <jasoncwarner> seb128: mostly how awesome desktop team is
[11:59] <seb128> it does feel pretty good indeed!
[11:59] <didrocks> feel… released! :-)
[11:59] <seb128> I'm still positively surprised by the unity bug reports
[12:00] <seb128> there is not a lot of complains and mostly small issues
[12:00] <Sweetshark> jasoncwarner: as didrocks says ;)
[12:00] <jasoncwarner> seb128: but seriously, mostly about where ubuntu is on the path to mass adoption, what we can do better and what we will do better....
[12:00] <jasoncwarner> you know..."the year of the linux desktop" ;)
[12:00] <seb128> never read about that one before ;-)
[12:00] <jasoncwarner> seb128: :)
[12:00] <didrocks> yeah, most of complains are design choice
[12:00] <didrocks> so no last bug "OMG" bugs ;)
[12:01] <jasoncwarner> I got to tell you, I love using my desktop day in and day out...
[12:01] <pitti> hey jasoncwarner
[12:01]  * pitti toddles off for lunch, bbl
[12:01] <didrocks> I think the generic answer for "the year of the linux desktop" is "next year", that always work :-)
[12:01] <seb128> pitti, have fun
[12:01] <seb128> hum, lunch...
[12:01] <jasoncwarner> (still, I did choose to use faenza icons... don't shoot me!)
[12:01] <seb128> I should start looking in the fridge for something to eat
[12:01] <seb128> jasoncwarner, how dare you!? ;-)
[12:02] <seb128> (I'm pondering going back to classic scrollbars for my part, the new ones are hard to use on screen borders)
[12:02] <didrocks> jasoncwarner: and "comic sans serif" for the font?
[12:02] <jasoncwarner> they go so well in the launcher! It's like they were designed that way ;)
[12:02] <jasoncwarner> didrocks: oh man, that's low
[12:02] <didrocks> :-)
[12:03] <didrocks> coudln't resist, sorry ;)
[12:03] <jasoncwarner> well, after what you guys did this cycle, I can take as much ribbing as you guys want to dish out... ;)
[12:03] <didrocks> heh
[12:06] <Sweetshark> There is nothing that starts a flamewar as easy as linux desktop themes (well, except "vi vs. emacs" and "lets have ribbon toolbars in LibreOffice")
[12:07] <jasoncwarner> Sweetshark: I'm going to stop writing my email to you right now then...
[12:07]  * jasoncwarner deletes email about ribbon toolbars...makes note
[12:07] <Sweetshark> hehe
[12:07] <Sweetshark> jasoncwarner: Flamewars are not always a bad thing though ;)
[12:08] <jasoncwarner> true...
[12:08] <jasoncwarner> I was joking about ribbon toolbars...I just want _less_ toolbars ;) too much choice is a bad thing at times!
[12:10] <Sweetshark> jasoncwarner: very true.
[12:14] <chrisccoulson> jasoncwarner, those faenza icons are pretty nice. i just installed them here :)
[12:22] <seb128> jasoncwarner, toolbars are nice for common actions though, especially when you menus are at the other side of the screen
[12:22] <seb128> your
[12:25] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, you do that? I'm switching to chromium
[12:25] <didrocks> oh… wait! :-)
[12:25] <chrisccoulson> lol
[12:26] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, you should be switching to epiphany
[12:26] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: heh, I'm considering lynx. I heard good things of it with nvidia + launchpad :-)
[12:27] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, well, i already decided on lynx for the default browser for next cycle
[12:27] <chrisccoulson> after all, it's pretty feature stable, and users like that
[12:27] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: +1, no need for sessino then? :-)
[12:27] <didrocks> session*
[12:27] <chrisccoulson> indeed :)
[12:28] <chrisccoulson> micahg, there we go - default browser is decided. we can cancel the session now ;)
[12:28] <didrocks> then mutt for the email client
[12:28] <chrisccoulson> lol
[12:28] <didrocks> and let's start on tty1
[12:28] <didrocks> fast boot, no driver issue…
[12:28] <chrisccoulson> that would be awesome
[12:28] <didrocks> right! :-)
[12:43] <seb128> yeah, natty is out \o/
[12:43] <seb128> well done everybody, great milestone ;-)
[12:46]  * Sweetshark thinks lynx has way too much chrome and proposes netcat as default browser.
[12:50] <chrisccoulson> it's a shame we're all spread out so far, else i would suggest it is time to go for a beer now
[12:51] <seb128> hum; beer!
[12:51] <mvo> tea!
[12:51] <Laney> 10 days :-)
[12:51] <didrocks> beer… interesting, should have bought one first ;)
[12:52] <seb128> they should have postponed until 5pm
[12:52] <seb128> lunch is not really a perfect beer time if you want to still get work done ;-)
[12:52] <didrocks> w…what? :-)
[12:53] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, save your money for budapest, you can invite us there to all the beers we want :)
[12:53] <Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: I can go for a beer, the kitchen is not far. I can even pick one up for you too, if you pickit up frm my office.
[12:53] <didrocks> pitti: in case you didn't see, the nux issue is fixed, I'm waiting for Jason to ack on it (not really happy about the workaround if we can get that more clean)
[12:53] <chrisccoulson> heh :)
[12:53] <pitti> *sigh*, I missed the release!
[12:53] <pitti> didrocks: just saw in mail, merci beaucoup!
[12:53] <didrocks> pitti: mais de rien :-)
[12:54] <pitti> didrocks: you know how happy I am that you guys have time to fix corner cases like this?
[12:54] <pitti> means that unity must be in a really good state!
[12:54]  * pitti huds didrocks, DBO, njpatel, and the rest of the gang
[12:54]  * didrocks hugs pitti back!
[12:55] <rodrigo_> so, where's the list of bugs for natty's srus?
[12:56]  * Sweetshark is looking forward to party around erzsebet ter soon ...
[12:56] <seb128> rodrigo_, things already uploaded or things that need to be fixed there?
[12:56] <rodrigo_> seb128, things that need to be fixed
[12:57] <chrisccoulson> pitti - i have a big CD space win for oneiric already - http://paste.ubuntu.com/600233/ \o/
[12:58] <seb128> rodrigo_, there is no real list, you can watch for bugs which are marked as affecting natty
[12:58] <rodrigo_> seb128, ok
[12:58] <pitti> chrisccoulson: haha!
[12:58] <chrisccoulson> want me to propose a merge? ;)
[12:58] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: seems you want to loose your job? :p
[12:58] <seb128> rodrigo_, but usually watch for incoming bugs on things you care about and sru fixes you think are worth it, or wait for bugs to be assigned to you by qa or other people
[12:58] <chrisccoulson> lol
[12:58] <pitti> chrisccoulson: have you considered using the HURD kernel? this linux thing is huuuge!
[12:58] <Sweetshark> seb128: are there tags to make bugs SRU candidates?
[12:58] <seb128> rodrigo_, if you have none of those start working on oneiric merges
[12:58] <chrisccoulson> pitti - heh, i hadn't thought of that ;)
[12:59] <pitti> chrisccoulson: and linux doesn't support indicators or GL
[12:59] <seb128> Sweetshark, do "also affect natty" so the bug table get a natty line
[12:59] <seb128> Sweetshark, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
[12:59] <seb128> worth reading on the stable update topic if you are not used to those
[13:00] <Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: please also consider replacing LibreOffice with GNU nano.
[13:00] <chrisccoulson> Sweetshark, yeah, that would be a pretty big win there :)
[13:00] <Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: and it would make l10n so much easier.
[13:06] <rodrigo_> seb128, oh, ok, was just looking for some easy bugs to fix in idle times (= when I'm fed up of debugging my current bugs, which are weird)
[13:06] <rodrigo_> seb128, so, oneiric merges = gnome3 merges from the ppa?
[13:07] <seb128> rodrigo_, well, merges are usually "take the current debian version, review the diff with current ubuntu, summarize what changes we need to keep, send to Debian or upstream the ones that should and upload"
[13:07] <seb128> well "summarize and apply the ubuntu diff" rather
[13:07] <seb128> i.e rebase our diff on the current debian
[13:07] <seb128> and use the opportunity to review what we carry on
[13:07] <rodrigo_> seb128, ok, that's mostly what is needed for most packages in the gnome3 ppa
[13:08] <rodrigo_> also, we need to re-enable several patches, so yes, will start working on some of those
[13:08] <rodrigo_> seb128, so, we use the ~ubuntu-desktop branches for oneiric now, right?
[13:08] <seb128> yes
[13:08] <rodrigo_> ok
[13:09] <pitti> rodrigo_, seb128: Robert requested an UDS session about our bzr usage, but for now I'd continue using the current branches, yes
[13:10] <rodrigo_> pitti, right
[13:12] <didrocks> this is the 3rd time we will have this discussion, isn't it? ;)
[13:12] <seb128> rodrigo_, ok sounds great, I will bounce some bugs your way when I spot some worth fixing in SRUs but I don't have any of those yet
[13:12] <rodrigo_> seb128, ok
[13:13] <seb128> didrocks, right, seems we could do better to document how we work though
[13:14] <seb128> seems like some people don't take advantage of bzr-builddeb as they could because they are not used to it
[13:14] <didrocks> seb128: we should first look at the wiki page. Last time I checked was when I edited it… 2 years ago maybe?
[13:15] <didrocks> so should be quite deprecated
[13:20] <rodrigo_> yes, at 1st I didn't like the package only branches, but with bzr-builddeb it's very easy, much easier than having to deal with the whole upstream source code
[13:20] <rodrigo_> which makes diffs very big, when updating to a new release
[13:24] <seb128> rodrigo_, btw, in case you don't know about it, https://merges.ubuntu.com/main.html
[13:24] <rodrigo_> hmm, btw, I've seen some .pc files in /usr/lib/x86_64/pkgconfig, isn't that an incorrect place, as they are arch-independent?
[13:25] <rodrigo_> seb128, oh ok, thanks!
[13:25] <seb128> rodrigo_, are they? the lib path is different on the different archs
[13:25] <rodrigo_> oh, it's done that way so that you can 32 and 64 bits of the same -dev package?
[13:25] <seb128> rodrigo_, that list is everything that needs to be merged, quite a lot, it also give you easy diffs
[13:25] <seb128> rodrigo_, right
[13:26] <rodrigo_> seb128, but it's that possible? there's only one -dev package, so I don't see how it can have 2 versions installed?
[13:26] <seb128> rodrigo_, http://wiki.debian.org/Multiarch/
[13:26] <seb128> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MultiarchSpec
[13:27] <seb128> rodrigo_, you could have an i386 source on your amd64 install
[13:27] <rodrigo_> oh, ok
[13:27] <nessita> hello everyone!
[13:27] <seb128> that's not common though
[13:27] <seb128> hey nessita, happy natty naty ;-)
[13:28] <nessita> :-D
[13:28] <nessita> congratulations everyone!
[13:28] <seb128> nessita, great work, I like the u1 control panel and file syncing works great for me ;-)
[13:29] <nessita> seb128: that's is amazing to read ;-) thanks for sharing
[13:29] <nessita> seb128: did you get any chance to ping pitti?
[13:29] <pitti> nessita: I read it in scrollback
[13:29] <seb128> no, I've to admit I forgot
[13:29] <nessita> seb128: OMG! :-o
[13:29] <pitti> nessita: you don't need to wait for an ack, just upload it
[13:29] <seb128> but pitti is always on top of things ;-)
[13:30] <pitti> nessita: and there were several ubuntuone related SRU uploads last night/this morning, so chances are it already happened?
[13:30] <seb128> pitti, well the sru has an ui freeze break part
[13:30] <seb128> pitti, no, that's a 10.10 sru
[13:30] <pitti> ah
[13:30] <pitti> the thing with showing the name?
[13:30] <seb128> pitti, still the one about displaying that field that was hidden because the server side was not ready
[13:30] <rodrigo_> hey nessita, so how do you feel being 'released' as 11.04? :-)
[13:30] <nessita> pitti: and I don't have upload rights, so in order to ask for sponsorship I will need your stamp somewhere
[13:30] <nessita> pitti: yes
[13:30] <didrocks> hey nessita! great work on u1 ;)
[13:31] <pitti> nessita: which bug was that?
[13:31] <nessita> didrocks: thanks! great work on unity ;-)
[13:31] <didrocks> nessita: thanks :-)
[13:31] <seb128> nessita, pitti: I'm fine sponsoring the upload but it was just not clear if the uif question was sorted or not
[13:31] <nessita> pitti: merge proposal with linked bug is: https://code.launchpad.net/~nataliabidart/ubuntu/maverick/ubuntu-sso-client/ubuntu-sso-client-1.0.9/+merge/57380
[13:32] <nessita> I also have this SRU for natty ("trivial") awaiting for approval: https://code.launchpad.net/~nataliabidart/ubuntu/natty/ubuntu-sso-client/add-gnome-keyring/+merge/59050
[13:32] <seb128> nessita, I can upload that
[13:32] <nessita> seb128: great!
[13:34] <pitti> nessita: TBH, the gtkbuilder file change is hard to review, and there's a lot of other noise in that MP, so I'm trying to understand the bug description
[13:35] <nessita> pitti: can I help you somehow?
[13:35] <pitti> nessita: this shows the user name in the client side dialog for sharing a folder; does it introduce any additional strings? any other behaviour changes? e. g. the gtkbuilder change seems to reorder buttons
[13:37] <nessita> pitti: this is for the SSO registration dialog (is not specific to Ubuntu One). It un-hides a text entry so the user enters his "display name" when creating a new account in SSO. We need this becasue otherwise, new accounts end up with an empty blank name in SSO, and later, in Ubuntu One, when that user creates a share, the "from" field can't be filled with some human readable info (since in SSO, the username is a openid url).
[13:37] <pitti> nessita: right, but does that only show the name, or also additional strings?
[13:38]  * rodrigo_ -> lunch
[13:38] <nessita> pitti: the XML change does reorder the buttons, but only to make room for the restored name text  entry so the original height of the dialog is not changed. There are no new strings added to the source code (they were already defined but never used)
[13:38] <pitti> ah, thanks
[13:39] <nessita> pitti: thank you!
[13:39] <nessita> pitti: want instructions to run it?
[13:39] <pitti> nessita: so that won't change e. g. the name of shared folders
[13:40] <nessita> nopes, this will only "affect" (help!) to newly created SSO accounts
[13:40] <pitti> ack
[13:41] <pitti> nessita: added my rubber stamp to the bug
[13:41] <nessita> pitti: thanks!!!
[13:41] <pitti> thanks to you :)
[13:41] <seb128> nessita, I will sponsor that one as well
[13:42] <nessita> seb128: you rock. Twice.
[13:42] <nessita> :-)
[13:42] <seb128> ;-)
[13:42] <seb128> pedro_, ola! happy natty day to you ;-)
[13:42] <seb128> pedro_, thanks for the desktop sru verifications!
[13:42] <pedro_> hola seb128! happy release day to you as well!
[13:42]  * pedro_ hugs seb128
[13:43] <didrocks> pedro_: happy release day!
[13:43]  * seb128 hugs pedro_
[13:43]  * seb128 hugs didrocks
[13:43] <pedro_> wondering about a papyon bug though, there's no test case
[13:43]  * didrocks hugs seb128
[13:43]  * pedro_ hugs didrocks
[13:43]  * didrocks hugs pedro_
[13:43] <kenvandine> indeed, happy release day!
[13:43] <pedro_> didrocks, happy release day dude!
[13:43]  * pedro_ hugs all the desktop channel
[13:43] <seb128> pedro_, you can maybe ask for one of the bug, or defaulting that let's wait a week and play the "didn't notice any issue during the week testing it"
[13:43] <pedro_> bug 768974 that'd be nice to have a test case
[13:43] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 768974 in papyon "papyon doesn't answer server's pings" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/768974
[13:44] <seb128> hey kenvandine! feeling better?
[13:44] <kenvandine> yup
[13:44] <kenvandine> pedro_, well no real way to test that
[13:44] <pedro_> kenvandine, oki doki so regression testing then ;-)
[13:44] <kenvandine> pedro_, basically you would get disconnected randomly after some period of time being idle
[13:45] <pedro_> ok i'll install and keep an eye on it for a few days
[13:45] <kenvandine> pedro_, i am extremely confident there won't be any regressions there... :)
[13:45] <kenvandine> it was the same method defined twice, which only happened in a bad merge
[13:45] <kenvandine> and wasn't in the previous release
[13:45] <kenvandine> very low risk
[13:46] <pedro_> ok
[13:46] <kenvandine> just sad it made it into their release tarball
[13:58] <dobey> pitti: none of us on u1 has upload privs for ubuntu-sso-client. so for the bug #709494 SRU, someone has to approve/merge nessita's branch, and upload it for us.
[13:58] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 709494 in ubuntu-sso-client "[SRU] Missing user's name field" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/709494
[13:59] <seb128> dobey, I said I was going to upload that when we discussed it before
[14:00] <dobey> seb128: ok. i just saw pitti's comment in my /awaylog :)
[14:00] <nessita> dobey: is all being taken care of :-)
[14:01] <dobey> ok
[14:01] <dobey> i am just responding to the hilighted messages from my awaylog :)
[14:22] <seb128> nessita, ignore the failed upload emails if you get any, I tried to upload the 1.0.9 update to natty by error and that failed ;-)
[14:22] <nessita> seb128: thank god it failed! :-)
[14:22] <seb128> ;-)
[14:23] <seb128> nessita, https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/maverick/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text=
[14:23] <chrisccoulson> time to try and get the new scrollbars working in firefox :)
[14:23] <seb128> the correct upload made it there so you are fine no worry ;-)
[14:23]  * nessita dances
[14:23] <seb128> chrisccoulson, you will make the sabdfl happy by doing that I guess ;-)
[14:24] <sabdfl> "even happier" ;-)
[14:24] <seb128> :-)
[14:24] <chrisccoulson> heh :)
[14:24] <seb128> though I've to admit I'm glad firefox doesn't get those for now
[14:24] <seb128> they are not usuable against a screen corner and my firefox has those against a screen border
[14:25] <seb128> corner -> edge
[14:25] <chrisccoulson> unfortunately, i can't make the scrollbars work using an extension and jsctypes ;)
[14:32] <seb128> nessita, can you set https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~nataliabidart/ubuntu/natty/ubuntu-sso-client/add-gnome-keyring/+merge/59050 to merge or delete it? it was against the natty which is locked, I uploaded to natty-proposed but I can't set the request to merge then
[14:33] <nessita> seb128: is "Needs Review" for me
[14:33] <nessita> seb128: and the bug is Fix Committed
[14:33] <seb128> nessita, well I don't have access to change the status
[14:33] <seb128> nessita, it's uploaded so it should be merged or deleted
[14:34] <seb128> nessita, the merge request was for natty not natty-proposed so I couldn't push it where it was supposed to land or set it to merged
[14:34] <seb128> nessita, if you see what I mean
[14:35] <seb128> nessita, well launchpad stupidity but since you filed the request please set it to merge if you can or delete it so it's not listed on the sponsoring queue, it has been hanlded
[14:35] <nessita> seb128: I set the merge proposal to Merged
[14:35] <seb128> nessita, thanks
[14:35] <nessita> ;-)
[14:36] <seb128> oh, pitti was piloting yesterday, I missed that, I would have sent a few reviews his way ;-)
[15:00] <seb128> do you guys have a preference on where, how we should share notes about work to do for oneiric, at least merges, patches to update, etc?
[15:00] <seb128> didrocks, pitti, kenvandine, rodrigo_, mterry: ^
[15:01] <didrocks> seb128: hum, wiki/etherpad? share note on u1?
[15:01] <mterry> seb128, you mean stuff smaller than workitems?
[15:01] <didrocks> not a shared* note
[15:01] <rodrigo_> seb128, hmm, not sure, what you used before?
[15:01] <rodrigo_> a wiki seems to be the best
[15:01] <didrocks> or as before, bugs linked to versions page
[15:01] <mterry> wiki or blueprints are fine
[15:01] <didrocks> that was nice to work with
[15:01] <seb128> didrocks, etherpad ...shared not on u1.
[15:02] <seb128> mterry, well it's not so much workitems, but like the merges, we have a decent team now and I would like to avoid that we duplicate work
[15:02] <seb128> so a place where we could dump a "I'm working on that"
[15:02] <kenvandine> seb128, bugs?
[15:02] <seb128> and where someone could write a "be careful about that patch because..." next to it if needed
[15:03] <didrocks> versions.py -> bug associated and people write on bugs if they have recommendation for the people assigned to it?
[15:03] <seb128> hum
[15:04] <didrocks> that's how we were working before, it was fine, but if you have better ideas, I don't really care :)
[15:04] <seb128> what I don't like much in wiki and bugs is that they it's somewhat paperwork
[15:04] <seb128> well we never really used bugs for merges
[15:04] <seb128> even for updates we did tend to use IRC rather
[15:05] <mterry> seb128, status.net?
[15:05] <didrocks> hum, we did sometimes IIRC, but yeah…
[15:05] <chrisccoulson> bugs for merges would be a pain ;)
[15:05] <didrocks> wiki is not really nice for multiediting
[15:05] <chrisccoulson> i hardly ever check bugs anyway
[15:05] <kenvandine> i would vote for status.net actually, and we can easily script pulling data out of it
[15:05] <seb128> it's also slow and annoying to use (wiki)
[15:05] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: if they are linked to one page (version.py) as for updates…
[15:05] <seb128> I need to learn about status.net I think :p
[15:05] <kenvandine> i use bugs@gwibber.status.net for tracking incoming gwibber bugs now
[15:05] <kenvandine> my triaging has gotten much better :)
[15:06] <kenvandine> seb128, it might make you want to use gwibber :-D
[15:06] <seb128> lol
[15:06] <seb128> is that a good thing? ;-)
[15:06] <didrocks> is status.net available to everyone?
[15:06] <kenvandine> yup :D
[15:06] <mterry> seb128, we have an internal instance, but better to use some public one for desktop work i assume
[15:06] <kenvandine> didrocks, yes
[15:06] <kenvandine> didrocks, not the internal one
[15:06] <didrocks> as long as there is a didrocks on twitter…
[15:06] <didrocks> kenvandine: so, which one?
[15:06] <seb128> I was leaning toward etherpad which is sort of wiki without locks and slownees
[15:07] <kenvandine> didrocks, they have temporarily closed creating new free instances, but i know those guys
[15:07] <didrocks> seb128: we can use ubuntu-fr etherpad if needed :)
[15:07] <mterry> didrocks, identi.ca is common public one, but you can run it anywhere?
[15:07] <mterry> no question mark there.  :)
[15:07] <seb128> are those twitting sort of things?
[15:07] <kenvandine> seb128, yes
[15:07] <didrocks> yeah, I guess so… not good for looking for history
[15:07] <seb128> sorry I still live in a web1 age :p
[15:08] <didrocks> like "who took gnome-session"
[15:08] <kenvandine> seb128, we can easily fetch json feeds from it and do anything with the data
[15:08] <didrocks> etherpad sounds fine to me
[15:08] <didrocks> we can report progress, people can comment on something and we can search
[15:09] <seb128> ok, I think we should better use bugs or etherpad for the first merge round, especially for non trivial ones which update to GNOME3 as well
[15:09] <seb128> but I've to admit I never used status.net so I can't really judge how well that would work
[15:09] <seb128> I just feel like that without a place to keep status of what we are doing we will duplicate work
[15:10] <didrocks> agreed
[15:10] <rodrigo_> yes
[15:12] <rodrigo_> status.net looks like a twitter thing, is it?
[15:12]  * rodrigo_ has never used it
[15:12] <mterry> rodrigo_, yes
[15:12] <rodrigo_> what about using gobby? we already have a running server, right?
[15:13] <seb128> rodrigo_, etherpad is the equivalent in a web browser
[15:13] <rodrigo_> ah
[15:13] <seb128> no need of a decidated client and it has the history of what got edited
[15:13] <didrocks> so less more light in the feeling, not launching an app…
[15:13] <chrisccoulson> and web browsers are cool
[15:13] <seb128> ok
[15:13] <rodrigo_> :)
[15:13] <chrisccoulson> kenvandine loves web browsers
[15:13] <seb128> who would be happy with an etherpad?
[15:13] <didrocks> o/
[15:14] <seb128> it's just for the initial merge round, let's see how it works
[15:14] <chrisccoulson> \o
[15:14]  * kenvandine ignores chrisccoulson
[15:14] <rodrigo_> yes, sounds good
[15:14] <chrisccoulson> lol
[15:15] <seb128> ok
[15:15] <seb128> didrocks, where is that french etherpad of yours? ;-)
[15:16] <didrocks> seb128: let me see if we can contact it with the release (the servers have hard life right now ;))
[15:16] <rodrigo_> ah, if it's a French etherpad, I don't want it!! :-)
[15:16] <seb128> lol
[15:16]  * kenvandine noticed launchpad was actually functional this morning
[15:17] <micahg> chrisccoulson: lol
[15:18] <davmor2> kenvandine: slow though and the rss planet feeds are in meltdown  "site= slow death by release"
[15:19] <mterry> etherpad seems fine
[15:20] <seb128> ok, let's go for an etherpad try then
[15:21] <didrocks> seb128: ok, the french one is quite in a bad state with the release (iso download of your own respin + documentation), but we can take the framasoft one :)
[15:22] <didrocks> seb128: it has backup and I can hit the administrator just 15 minutes away from home :)
[15:22] <didrocks> http://pad.framasoft.org/
[15:23] <seb128> didrocks, ok, we should hit hard on it, it's still a small team and few editing
[15:23] <didrocks> shouldn't* isn't it? :)
[15:23] <seb128> http://pad.framasoft.org/oneiric-desktop
[15:23] <seb128> ^
[15:23] <didrocks> no worry, we have a big load with www.enventelibre.org on the same server, but the server still stands :)
[15:23] <didrocks> nice!
[15:24] <rodrigo_> ah, no need to register a user
[15:25] <didrocks> seb128: welcome message is nicer :p
[15:25] <seb128> ;-à
[15:25] <seb128> ;-)
[15:29] <rodrigo_> didrocks, and you said there was a public API to retrieve info for etherpad, or was that status.net?
[15:29] <seb128> didrocks, what is the normal ubuntu-fr etherpad url? pad.ubuntu-fr.org?
[15:30] <didrocks> rodrigo_: well, if we want to have the info, I can access the server. Not sure about the API :)
[15:30] <rodrigo_> didrocks, no, was just wondering what it could be done
[15:30] <didrocks> seb128: those servers are common between framasoft and ubuntu-fr, we didn't make a sking for ubuntu-fr though
[15:30] <chrisccoulson> it seems that you're all using chrome except for me and seb128 ;)
[15:30] <rodrigo_> no need for it really
[15:30] <didrocks> skin*
[15:31] <seb128> chrisccoulson, how do you know that? ;-)
[15:31] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: same question :-)
[15:31] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - hover over the names in the user list ;)
[15:31] <chrisccoulson> it tells you the browser and IP address ;)
[15:31] <didrocks> never noticed!
[15:31] <seb128> didrocks, it's just that it's a bit nicer to have ubuntu in the name, I'm pondering using http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/ instead which works fine as well
[15:31] <chrisccoulson> and it's in english ;)
[15:32] <didrocks> seb128: well, I don't really care, if you prefer that, we can also use make a skin :)
[15:32] <pitti> chrisccoulson, kenvandine, seb128: sorry, as away for a bit; I think it's easiest to just announce it here in the channel; as we work in chunks of an hour (per commit, at least), that ought to work?
[15:32] <didrocks> seb128: just that we have access to the server to that one in case of issue, if someone know ubuntu-uk, thats fine
[15:32] <seb128> ok, let's use http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/oneiric-desktop for now
[15:33] <seb128_> hum
[15:33] <seb128_> doing ctrl-R in IRC not such a great thing ;-)
[15:34] <didrocks> seb128_: can you change your color?
[15:34] <seb128> bah
[15:34] <didrocks> it hurts my eyes :)
[15:34] <seb128> didrocks, done
[15:34] <didrocks> thanks ;)
[15:35] <pitti> seb128: pad> sure, bookmarking this
[15:35] <seb128> pitti, "I think it's easiest to just announce it here in the channel;" > well we can still do that but having a place where we can dump comments doesn't hurt and can be useful
[15:36] <seb128> it's not adding extra constrains but it can be useful for people living in opposite tz
[15:36] <seb128> like "if someone works on that be careful about that"
[15:36] <seb128> just as a note
[15:40] <seb128> chrisccoulson, hum, but ping seemed to suit you well! ;-)
[15:40] <chrisccoulson> lol
[15:40] <chrisccoulson> a lot of people tell me that
[15:40] <seb128> ;-)
[15:41] <seb128> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-gtk3-gnome3
[15:41] <seb128> if people have GNOME3 workitems as well btw
[15:51] <chrisccoulson> oubiwann, network issues? ;)
[15:53] <Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: either that, or oubiwann s cat is fond of playing with the power switch of his router.
[16:02] <seb128> mvo, hey
[16:02] <mvo> hey seb128
[16:02] <seb128> mvo, is there any plan to port the software-properties to modern authentification methods next cycle? it seems it's the only .desktop still using gksu with synaptic ;-)
[16:04] <seb128> rodrigo_, do you know who did the avahi gtk3 build update? is that ricotz?
[16:05] <mvo> seb128: there is a plan to port it to aptdaemon, that would solve some other problems as well
[16:05] <seb128> mvo, does that need UDS discussion or design or anything or is that a "jdi" thing?
[16:06] <rodrigo_> seb128, hmm, let me check
[16:06] <mvo> its mostly jdi, but having a session might attract contributors
[16:06] <seb128> rodrigo_, do you know also why cups-pk-helper is in the ppa? is g-c-c needing it?
[16:06] <rodrigo_> seb128, it was ricotz, yes
[16:06] <seb128> mvo, ok, I might add one if the schedule is not over busy, thanks
[16:06] <rodrigo_> seb128, yes, I think so
[16:07] <seb128> rodrigo_, ok, adding a work item to https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-gtk3-gnome3 about reviewing that and filling a mir if needed
[16:08] <rodrigo_> ok
[16:11] <mvo> thanks seb128!
[16:11] <seb128> mvo, thank you! ;-)
[16:21] <seb128> ok, upgrading my new natty vm to GNOME3 is a fail
[16:25] <seb128> ok, worked after a restart, I had no user first on the gdm screen
[16:31] <kenvandine> seb128, telepathy-glib bug fix release is OK for an SRU right?
[16:31] <seb128> kenvandine, guess so, I didn't check the diff or if it was worth getting
[16:32] <seb128> but bug fixes updates are fine for sru usually, better if they fix launchpad bugs
[16:32] <kenvandine> there is a crash fix and some other bug fixes
[16:32] <kenvandine> but also some doc fixes which makes the diff kind of big
[16:38] <seb128> kenvandine, well your call, I tend to just do updates when they fix a common issue or a bug report in launchpad
[16:58] <seb128> pitti, I've added the avahi ddeb thing to https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-reduce-number-patches-packages
[16:59] <seb128> I will add things I spot that we carry for a while as a diff and should sort to the workitems there
[16:59] <pitti> seb128: ah, thanks
[17:01] <seb128> kenvandine, do you know if bug #730528 should be kept on the natty-updates list of dropped to oneiric?
[17:01] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 730528 in libappindicator "Impossible to inherit a class from AppIndicator*.Indicator in Python (gir)" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/730528
[17:07] <cyphermox> seb128, pitti , I'll add a WI to https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-reduce-number-patches-packages for the work that needs to be done to re-sync NetworkManager with Debian as much as possible
[17:14] <kenvandine> seb128, drop for natty
[17:15] <kenvandine> seb128, i added an overrides for that and then it causes a segfault
[17:15] <kenvandine> clearly needs more work
[17:48] <seb128> hum, somewhat the archive feels slower
[17:48] <seb128> do we have people downloading things today? ;-)
[17:49] <didrocks> seb128: probably images…
[17:49] <didrocks> (png/svg of course)
[17:49] <seb128> I see ;-)
[17:50] <seb128> bah, seems oneiric isn't available yet
[17:50] <seb128> I get a 404 when adding a source for it
[17:50] <didrocks> what do the developer do?
[17:50] <didrocks> they are slacking!!! :-)
[17:56] <seb128> didrocks, well I don't mind it to not be open to uploads yet, but it's open on launchpad and frozen, they copied natty over, I though it would be available for sources
[17:56] <seb128> I was trying to get versions pointing to it already
[17:58] <highvoltage> buxy:/win 15
[17:58] <highvoltage> (sorry)
[18:01] <mterry> seb128, pitti: btw, I'll be gone all next week on vacation, just FYI
[18:01] <seb128> mterry, oh, right, I noticed that when I looked who was away after eastern, enjoy!
[18:02] <seb128> didrocks and I will be with dx next week also for the record
[18:03] <seb128> but I guess we will be part time online during the week though likely less responsive
[18:08] <pitti> mterry: enjoy! see you in Budapest then!
[18:09] <kenvandine> mterry, have a great vacation
[18:09] <kenvandine> i'll be traveling on Wednesday and arriving Thursday morning in budapest for the DX sprint
[18:11] <didrocks> mterry: enjoy indeed!
[18:11] <pitti> pedro_: thanks muchly for all the verifications!
[18:11] <pedro_> pitti, you're welcome!
[18:16] <seb128> ok, time for sport, see you later!
[18:25] <zyga> hmm, what is the meaning of the bluish corner in the left-top corner of unity?
[18:26]  * mterry has seeded 9 GiB so far
[18:26] <didrocks> zyga: it's because you have an application asking for your attention
[18:26] <mterry> zyga, that means one of the apps in the launcher wants your attention.  The app should also have a blue arrow
[18:26] <didrocks> and a blue glow around it as well :)
[18:26] <zyga> oh
[18:26]  * zyga needs to pay close attention
[18:27] <zyga> right
[18:27] <didrocks> zyga: the triangle is there to tell "you need to reveal the launcher"
[18:27] <zyga> the color difference is very subtle :-)
[18:27] <didrocks> right :)
[18:27] <zyga> didrocks, I switched the launcher to never hide
[18:27] <imachine> hello
[18:27] <imachine> is it possible to have the unity menu operate with different mouse acctions than default?
[18:27] <didrocks> zyga: hum, that's an overlook then, we shouldn't display that in that case :)
[18:27] <imachine> somewhere in gconf perhaphs?
[18:27] <imachine> gsettings ?
[18:27] <imachine> usettings? :P
[18:28] <zyga> didrocks, if you want I could file a bug
[18:28] <mterry> imachine, ccsm might be what you're looking for.  It lets you change some unity interaction behavior
[18:28] <didrocks> zyga: well, the action will be revisted for next cycle
[18:28] <imachine> I basically want it to work in such a way that when I left click the icon in the bar on the left in Unity, it opens the application, but if it's clicked when the app is already open, it minimises/maximises the window
[18:28] <imachine> mterry, could that be possible with ccsm ?
[18:29] <mterry> imachine, ah, no.  It doesn't give that much control
[18:29]  * zyga cannot wait to see unity in O
[18:29] <mterry> imachine, we call that bar on the left the "launcher"
[18:29] <imachine> mterry, well, it would be easier for me to manage the windows ;d
[18:29] <imachine> mterry, can it be done, in general, at some point?
[18:30] <mterry> imachine, doesn't hurt to file a wishlist bug against unity and see what the devs say
[18:30] <imachine> mterry, on another note, what about informational widgets in Unity, maybe you know something about that? I used to have gnome show me the temperatures etc :-)
[18:30] <imachine> oh ok gonn do that :-)
[18:30] <didrocks> mterry: imachine better to discuss that on the ayatana mailing list
[18:30] <didrocks> than opening a bug
[18:30] <mterry> imachine, ah, you probably want more indicators.  there is a weather indicator (indicator-weather)
[18:30] <mterry> imachine, listen to didrocks, not me  :)
[18:30] <imachine> mterry, l
[18:31] <didrocks> imachine: http://unity.ubuntu.com/getinvolved/, see "Design" :-)
[18:31]  * mterry is always secretly trying to throw more bugs at didrocks
[18:31] <didrocks> mterry: I will force you to triage unity bugs either way!!! :-)
[18:31] <didrocks> mterry: I see that
[18:31] <didrocks> mterry: I have a fun activity for your holidays next week, you know… ;-)
[18:31]  * mterry sets up a bot in #ubuntu that redirects all questions to unity bugform
[18:32]  * didrocks removes the deja-dup package :p
[18:32] <didrocks> and add to the debian sync blacklist ;)
[18:32] <mterry> QQ
[18:33] <didrocks> ;)
[18:38] <rickspencer3> Laney, is that a picture of you with that cast on your leg?
[18:38] <Laney> rickspencer3: sure is
[18:38] <rickspencer3> dang man
[18:38] <Laney> I didn't mean to spam planet with it twice
[18:38] <rickspencer3> hah
[18:38] <rickspencer3> I only saw it once
[18:38] <Laney> it was an old blog post from december
[18:38] <Laney> healed now :-)
[18:38] <rickspencer3> ah, you changed a tag
[18:38] <rickspencer3> phew
[18:38] <Laney> I can show you the gnarly scar
[18:38] <rickspencer3> I was wondering why you didn't mention budapest
[18:39] <rickspencer3> Laney, errrr
[18:39] <Laney> :P
[18:39] <Laney> it happened about 2 weeks after orlando
[18:39] <rickspencer3> well, glad you're better now, then
[18:40] <rickspencer3> see you in 2 weeks in budapest, right?
[18:40] <Laney> you sure will
[18:40] <rickspencer3> sweet
[18:41] <Laney> looking forward to it! the place looks awesome
[18:41] <rickspencer3> yeah
[18:41]  * rickspencer3 places bathing suit into suitcase
[18:41] <Laney> sprinting beforehand?
[18:42] <rickspencer3> Laney, not me
[18:42] <rickspencer3> there will be a Dx sprint
[18:42] <rickspencer3> but I will be at something called the "Summit", but that's a Canonical even, not directly Ubuntu related
[18:42] <rickspencer3> so, no jetjag for me by Monday
[18:47] <dobey> jcastro: why do the "microblogging" things on http://summit.ubuntu.com/ not link to the entries/profiles on twitter/identica? boo.
[18:51] <jcastro> dobey: lp:summit, patches welcome! *snicker*
[18:51] <jcastro> dobey: that might be a widget they reuse all over the place, if you file a bug in summit I'll ask someone to triage it to the right place
[18:53] <dobey> meh
[19:08] <pitti> kenvandine: did you ever work on generating documentation from a .gir file, or know someone who did? kamstrup maybe?
[19:08] <kenvandine> pitti, kamstrup did
[19:08] <kenvandine> created a tool named giraffe
[19:09] <kenvandine> the docs on developer.ubuntu.com come from it
[19:09] <kenvandine> pitti, i have to run out to my son's school, bbiab
[19:09] <kenvandine> lp:giraffe
[19:09] <kenvandine> i think
[19:09] <dobey> pitti: i think valadoc might be able to do that too
[19:10] <kenvandine> dobey, i don't think so
[19:10] <kenvandine> anyway, i really need to run
[19:10]  * kenvandine waves!
[19:10] <kenvandine> :)
[19:29] <chrisccoulson> pitti - i can't believe how easy it is to create language pack xpi's from the firefox source ;)
[19:29] <chrisccoulson> make langpack-en-GB
[19:29] <chrisccoulson> done ;)
[19:30] <chrisccoulson> (after i point it to my local l10n repo)
[20:07] <pitti> chrisccoulson: wow
[20:07] <pitti> chrisccoulson: what does it take as input?
[20:10] <chrisccoulson> pitti - it just takes the source from http://hg.mozilla.org/l10n-central
[20:10] <chrisccoulson> i just grabbed all the repos and stuck them in my source tree
[20:11] <pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, from the properties files?
[20:11] <pitti> structurally these are very different from po files, though
[20:11] <chrisccoulson> yeah, they are quite different
[20:12] <chrisccoulson> but building them like this is easier than messing around with po2xpi :)
[20:12] <chrisccoulson> brb, need to undock and move downstairds
[20:12] <chrisccoulson> **downstaits
[20:12] <chrisccoulson> d'oh
[20:13] <chrisccoulson> i'll get there eventually ;)
[20:14]  * didrocks waves goodnight
[20:14] <pitti> night didrocks
[20:14] <didrocks> good night pitti, see you tomorrow :)
[21:41] <Laney> I thought we agreed at uds to include tomboy in the default quicklist
[21:47] <chrisccoulson> ooh, http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-beta/rev/82330af0d679
[21:51] <micahg> is that PGO?
[21:53] <micahg> oh, hmm...beta...
[21:54] <micahg> that's weird, merge to beta isn't supposed to be until next month
[22:58] <pitti> good night everyone!
[23:45] <mala85> What is the safest way to get a stable Gnome-Shell installation for 11.04? Is it better to start with Kubuntu CD, to avoid conflicts with Gnome 2?