[03:09] <hajour> goodnight all its 4:09 in night so i need some sleep to.
[12:10] <webczat> Hey.
[12:15] <webczat> Is there java-atk-wrapper in ubuntu?
[17:16] <hajour> great ubuntu-beginners forum is going to test out accessibility on the test forum
[17:17] <hajour> charlie-tca, cprofitt maco TheMuso ^
[17:17] <hajour> and everyone else
[17:18] <hajour> need to help cooking now just wanted to let you all know
[17:22] <hajour> and JanC  see above :)
[17:27] <charlie-tca> very good
[17:35] <JanC> nice
[18:22] <hajour> ok back
[18:23] <webczat> hey
[18:23] <hajour> good news thought testing accessibility now on ubuntu test forum
[18:24] <hajour> webczat, ^
[18:26] <webczat> :
[18:26] <hajour> and only because i had complained about it .i am a little surprised by that
[18:27] <webczat> What happens with java-access-bridge on ubuntu-10.10 and 11? it's deprecated and doesn't work due to some orbit errors whh...
[18:29] <webczat> errors on 2 screens of a terminal
[18:29] <hajour> i don't no charlie-tca  do you now about that ^ ?
[18:31] <hajour> charlie-tca,  will response but have multiple channels webczat 
[18:31] <webczat> I have 6 :d had 12
[18:31] <hajour> if he not know it he probably will now who do know it webczat 
[18:32] <webczat> mhm
[18:32] <webczat> Actually the non-deprecated thing is java-atk-wrapper.
[18:34] <hajour> i am not a programmer or something webczat  i hope soon there is a usable read write program for me to learn more
[18:34] <hajour> i have size 18 fonts on irc chat
[18:35]  * webczat is totally and irrecoverably blind :d
[18:35] <hajour> a witch program you use webczat ?
[18:36] <hajour> i have been blind several times webczat 
[18:36] <webczat> What?
[18:36] <webczat> ah
[18:37] <hajour> i need a program what read out loud with understandable voice.i got dislectic to most with reading
[18:37] <hajour> webczat, 
[18:37] <webczat> mmmm
[18:37] <webczat> Is orca seen to you as understandable?
[18:37] <webczat> I mean espeak
[18:37] <webczat> Because orca isn't a synthesizer
[18:38] <hajour> orca is mechanical voice not yet have get prudence voice get working with open mary webczat 
[18:38] <hajour> orca do hurt my ears webczat 
[18:39] <webczat> it's espeak. if you have a synth, you can probably use it with orca if it has speech-dispatcher module.
[18:39] <webczat> if i understand that correctly
[18:39] <hajour> i now we just have get with help from AlanBell  libopenmary get working webczat 
[18:40] <webczat> I use orca and occassionally speakup.
[18:40] <hajour> i am team leader from speechcontrol webczat 
[18:40] <AlanBell> afternoon all
[18:40] <hajour> we gor people in the team who have worked on espeak
[18:40] <hajour> gor=got
[18:41] <webczat> mhm
[18:41] <hajour> and TheMuso  also is in our team webczat 
[18:41] <webczat> Actually I now don't want to change espeak to anything else. after few months...
[18:42] <webczat> Or actually... I remember I didn't need to wait few months for me to promptly use it
[18:42] <hajour> speechcontrol is read write program with voicecommand webczat 
[18:42] <hajour> it need to be usable to for light weight programs webczat 
[18:43] <hajour> a AlanBell 
[18:43] <hajour> maybe you can help webczat 
[18:43] <webczat> depends in what
[18:43] <AlanBell> yeah, just looking back for a question to answer :)
[18:44] <AlanBell> java atk stuff
[18:44] <hajour> also if webczat  is helped i would have get some help with trying to install a speechprogram on this laptop from my daughter AlanBell 
[18:45] <AlanBell> hajour: I think you need to learn to use orca
[18:45] <AlanBell> I do too, it is a big thing to learn
[18:45] <webczat> yeah
[18:45] <hajour> i think on this laptop it will be possible to put a speechprogram on it
[18:45] <AlanBell> I can get the openmary synth working with orca for you
[18:45] <webczat> use orca
[18:45] <hajour> it was not possible to put it on my old eeepc
[18:45] <AlanBell> and you can use my remote openmary install, or a local one on your laptop
[18:45] <webczat> AlanBell: coding the module or wtf?
[18:46] <AlanBell> webczat: I have a generic module that works
[18:46] <hajour> wanted to try openmary AlanBell 
[18:46] <hajour> but we cant get prudence voice working
[18:46] <AlanBell> a speech dispatcher module using the generic driver that is
[18:46] <hajour> a you mean libopenmary AlanBell ?
[18:46] <AlanBell> nope
[18:47] <AlanBell> I have no idea what libopenmary is supposed to do
[18:47] <AlanBell> even having read the source code
[18:47] <hajour> or was it not usable?
[18:47] <webczat> AlanBell: what about java awt thing?
[18:48] <hajour> UndiFineD,  can explain it to you or JackyAlcine  AlanBell 
[18:48] <hajour> JackyAlcine,  ping
[18:48] <AlanBell> webczat: not sure about java atk stuff
[18:48] <webczat> or about jab legacy?
[18:48] <webczat> I someday tested the atk thingy and it worked, but ubuntu still has this deprecated jab. and it even does not work.
[18:50] <webczat> because of orbit errors. that also prevents using it after upgrading to at-spi2 if ever done
[18:50] <AlanBell> !info libaccess-bridge-java
[18:51] <hajour> have pinged JackyAlcine  in pm for you AlanBell 
[18:51] <AlanBell> webczat: ok, I see what that is supposed to do
[18:52] <AlanBell> webczat: I will have a go with that later
[18:52] <AlanBell> if that one is deprecated where is the upstream we should be using?
[18:53] <webczat> java-atk-wrapper
[18:53] <hajour> not yet have get respond AlanBell 
[18:53] <hajour> from JackyAlcine 
[18:55] <AlanBell> webczat: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=537779
[18:55] <ubot2> Debian bug 537779 in wnpp "RFP: java-atk-wrapper -- An ATK implementation for Java using JNI" [Wishlist,Open]
[18:55] <AlanBell> looks like it is not yet packaged in debian :(
[18:57] <AlanBell> I will have more of a play later, that is probably something we could bring up at UDS and get someone to package it and get it in Debian
[18:57] <AlanBell> hajour: I will help you get openmary working with speech dispatcher on your laptop later
[18:58] <hajour> ok AlanBell 
[18:58] <AlanBell> hajour: does orca work right now for you?
[18:58] <hajour> AlanBell,  danielo108 will explain it to you
[18:58] <AlanBell> as in, you run orca and it talks?
[18:58] <hajour> i not get a understandable voice AlanBell 
[18:58] <AlanBell> yeah, that is fine
[18:59] <hajour> it sounds better but it mmm looking for the right english word now
[18:59] <AlanBell> but if you run it now it should say "welcome to orca" and "orca screen reader slash magnifier frame preferences button"
[18:59] <hajour> going translate brb
[19:00] <AlanBell> don't care if it sounds horrible, just want to know if it works
[19:00] <JackyAlcine> lol
[19:00]  * JackyAlcine was pinged; can't determine what exactly for.
[19:00] <hajour> orca falters
[19:01] <hajour> JackyAlcine,  AlanBell  wants to no where libopenmary is for to use
[19:01] <AlanBell> actually I am off out to water plants now
[19:01] <JackyAlcine> Lol
[19:01] <hajour> so its falters then repeat the font over the next font AlanBell 
[19:02] <JackyAlcine> But yeah, libopenmary was originally designed to be used the same way libespeak is.
[19:02] <hajour> and then its not understandable
[19:02] <hajour> AlanBell, 
[19:02] <JackyAlcine> But as AlanBell brought to the team's attention; it can also be used to create a plugin to speechd to support MARY.
[19:02] <hajour> needed time to explain in english
[19:03] <hajour> yes i heard JackyAlcine 
[19:03] <hajour> we need to organize a meeting soon again JackyAlcine 
[19:04] <JackyAlcine> Indeed; as soon as I can get my home system more stabilized..
[19:04] <hajour> i am switching often from pc at the moment JackyAlcine 
[19:04] <hajour> i not have a own pc anymore
[19:04] <JackyAlcine> But meetings would be more easier for me to attend on the weekend, as school's coming to a close and I have to please my college.
[19:05] <hajour> i understand but saterday i need to go sleep early as i have to stand up at 6:00 in morning on sunday to get my plain to uds JackyAlcine 
[19:06] <JackyAlcine> Oh man! UDS!
[19:06] <hajour> yes
[19:07] <JackyAlcine> lol, keep forgetting about that
[19:07] <hajour> thats next week JackyAlcine 
[19:16]  * webczat says re
[19:25] <charlie-tca> I went to lunch and last minute shopping for travel
[19:29] <hajour> brb need to get my kids to bed so
[19:30] <webczat> charlie-tca: do you know something about java-atk-wrapper or jab?
[19:31] <charlie-tca> no, I don't really. I have seen a couple of bug reports about java-bridge not working
[19:31] <charlie-tca> but that is the extent of it.
[19:33] <webczat> yeah. jab is deprecated, right?
[19:33] <webczat> I heart it's replaced by java-atk-wrapper
[19:33] <charlie-tca> yeah, to the best of my knowledge, jab is deprecated. Didn't know about the replacement.
[19:34] <webczat> yes, there is :)
[19:34] <webczat> I remember me testing it one time
[19:35] <webczat> I think ubuntu needs to replace jab with java-atk-wrapper, I heart that it's currently completed but some things need fixing. that's better than something that doesn't work at all because of some corba things.
[19:36] <webczat> It at least does not crash the whole java thing.
[19:36] <charlie-tca> I defer to TheMuso for that kind of stuff. I do the testing and wiki updates when I can, but I am not a developer.
[19:36] <webczat> But there's a cool and understandable error message with a backtrace. :)
[19:37] <webczat> And I don't understand it cause I don't know corba.
[19:39] <charlie-tca> Like I say, I have to let developers put everything together. I can test things and tell what does and what does not work, but I don't understand all the application interaction
[19:41] <webczat> mhm
[20:02] <Daniel0108> hi
[20:02] <webczat> hi
[20:22] <JanC> webczat: is there and Ubuntu bug about java-atk-wrapper ?
[20:22] <webczat> JanC: I am not really sure.
[20:25] <JanC> or maybe a bug about the one that doesn't work  ;)
[20:27] <webczat> Probably there is. I didn't check bugs, I just like asked for advice.
[20:28] <webczat> or info
[20:32] <AlanBell> webczat: I don't think there is an Ubuntu bug about it, if there is somewhere then it will just be a pointer to the debian request to package bug
[20:32] <webczat> I want to program in swing
[20:33] <JanC> AlanBell: a bug that links to the debian one would be useful though
[20:33] <AlanBell> what would it be filed against though?
[20:33] <AlanBell> debian bug 537779
[20:33] <JanC> probably against the old one?
[20:33] <ubot2> Debian bug 537779 in wnpp "RFP: java-atk-wrapper -- An ATK implementation for Java using JNI" [Wishlist,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/537779
[20:33] <JanC> the old library, I mean
[20:34] <AlanBell> ok
[20:35] <JanC> seems like it's in the libaccess-bridge-java / libaccess-bridge-java-jni packages
[20:35] <AlanBell> bug 429296
[20:35] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 429296 in java-access-bridge "Does not work!" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429296
[20:36] <AlanBell> that bug has the corba error webczat mentioned I think
[20:38] <AlanBell> why do we think java-access-bridge is deprecated?
[20:38] <JanC> I wonder how it's using Corba though?
[20:38] <JanC> in Natty I mean
[20:38] <AlanBell> at-spi stuff probably, doesn't really matter
[20:40] <AlanBell> just want to file a bug against it for being deprecated
[20:40] <JanC> what I mean is that it doesn't seem to use any CORBA library
[20:42] <JanC> some Java stdlib implementation maybe
[20:44] <AlanBell> can't find any reference to it being deprecated so I am not filing a bug against it for that
[20:44] <JanC> well, maybe it's not deprecated but just not maintained...
[20:47] <AlanBell> yeah, well it has the "doesn't work" bug already
[20:49] <JanC> didn't Oracle tell most Sun a11y developers to find another job?  :-/
[20:51] <JanC> well, and some by Sun itself and IBM before that apparently...  :-/
[20:54] <AlanBell> pretty much, yes
[20:54] <JanC> mayeb we need to remind them about http://www.oracle.com/us/corporate/profit/features/070609-community-143624.html  :P
[20:56] <AlanBell> http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-o/meeting/community-o-accessibility-team/
[20:56]  * AlanBell added it to the discussion notes for UDS
[20:57] <webczat> AlanBell: jab is probably deprecated because it uses at-spi, not atk
[20:57] <webczat> and it's at-spi1
[20:58] <webczat> ubuntu has at-spi1 but at-spi1 is actually being replaced with version 2.
[20:58] <webczat> Hmm, does oracle do something with java accessibility?
[20:59] <AlanBell> webczat: I can't find a link to something saying it is deprecated
[21:00] <webczat> Masaybe. I'm sure that it's, but it's better to first be sure
[21:00] <JanC> well, it's still needed for systems that use ATK 1.x (with bonobo)
[21:00] <AlanBell> I do understand that is uses at-spi1 and corba and thus must be deprecated, but I need something to link to if I am filing a bug against it
[21:00] <JanC> which includes many LTS-style distros
[21:01] <AlanBell> yeah, still might be deprecated
[21:01] <AlanBell> doesn't mean it can't be used, just marks it as a strategic dead end
[21:01] <webczat> yes. so at least make it work :/
[21:01] <JanC> AlanBell: the lack of any developers working on it might mean nobody can mark it as deprecated of course
[21:01] <webczat> It was to devs as a whole actually :d
[21:02] <JanC> officially 
[21:02] <webczat> If jab will be there but will work I won't care.
[21:14] <JanC> webczat: you might be able to get it to work with http://rdfintrospector2.blogspot.com/2009/09/bonobo-crazy-monkeys-java-at-api.html
[21:15] <JanC> but that's only a temporary solution for as long as at-spi API v1 is still supported  :-/ 
[21:28] <webczat> page not found
[21:32] <AlanBell> works for me
[21:32] <webczat> but not for me ugh
[21:33] <webczat> hmm now it doea
[21:33] <webczat> s/does
[21:42] <webczat> No solution there.
[22:15] <hajour> sorry i had a long pm 
[22:53] <MrBadWiki> Aloha ka po'e apau
[23:12] <webczat> Re.
[23:13] <MrChrisDruif> Re.?
[23:16] <webczat> :))
[23:17] <hajour> also already wondering what re meant
[23:39] <webczat> Hmm, going to sleep, good night all!
[23:56] <hajour> still not know what Re means
[23:57] <MrChrisDruif> hajour: Might be return