| jkakar | lifeless: Yeah, I switched them over when I was working as an advisor. | 01:00 |
|---|---|---|
| jkakar | lifeless: I haven't found anything better than Launchpad for supporting a process that involves code reviews (which is also something I introduced while I was an advisor). | 01:00 |
| jkakar | lifeless: In general, I think LP is a great tool for teams. | 01:01 |
| jkakar | lifeless: I think GitHub has a bit of an advantage for developer-to-developer collaboration, because it's UI is really focused on that problem. | 01:01 |
| LPCIBot | Project windmill-db-devel build #247: STILL FAILING in 1 hr 8 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill-db-devel/247/ | 01:06 |
| lifeless | jkakar: I'd like us to improve on d2d | 01:55 |
| lifeless | not sure how | 01:55 |
| jkakar | lifeless: Yeah, it's a tricky problem. I think the answer lies in UI. | 01:56 |
| wgrant | Argh. | 01:56 |
| wgrant | UnparsableDependencies again :( | 01:57 |
| jkakar | lifeless: I think the pieces (bugs, reviews, etc.) are all in place... the Launchpad UI needs to make them more powerful. | 01:57 |
| jkakar | lifeless: I think Launchpad is a bit hamstrung by Ubuntu. Ubuntu has all kinds of weird and particular requirements that no one else cares about, and that take a lot of energy to maintain... | 01:57 |
| wgrant | s/maintain/ignore/ | 01:58 |
| wgrant | *cough* Blueprints | 01:58 |
| jkakar | lifeless: If we didn't have to deal with those problems we'd be able to focus our energy on problems that are more widely felt by users. | 01:58 |
| jkakar | wgrant: Perhaps, yes. | 01:58 |
| wgrant | But yes. | 01:58 |
| jkakar | And I'm not discounting the power of Launchpad in terms of the Ubuntu project. | 01:59 |
| jkakar | I think it's clear that Ubuntu could exist without Launchpad... | 01:59 |
| wgrant | Nobody before has tried to combine a distribution and open source project and commercial project everything-tracker, I don't think. | 01:59 |
| wgrant | And it sort of shows :/ | 01:59 |
| jkakar | But it means that the folks that who use GitHub look at Launchpad and see it as not solving their problem. | 01:59 |
| jkakar | wgrant: Yeah, it's a tricky problem, for sure. | 01:59 |
| jkakar | wgrant: I think a big problem is that (and maybe I'm completely wrong here, I hope I am) there is no UI designer focused on Launchpad, focused on making it coherent, and with enough manpower behind them to make real change. | 02:00 |
| jkakar | wgrant: Launchpad's UI has been getting steadily getting better, but it is also very confusing and could do with a lot of polish/love. | 02:01 |
| jkakar | I sometimes think we're too driven by technological problems and not enough by user problems. I guess that's a reality of having a lot of technical debt, which I know Launchpad has and I also know that a tremendous effort has been put in to reducing it. | 02:02 |
| wgrant | We are now actually in a position where we can reduce it, and we are doing so. | 02:02 |
| jkakar | It does feel like we're getting to a point where we'll be seeing the benefits of that investment, though. | 02:02 |
| wgrant | lifeless has saved the world, again. | 02:02 |
| jkakar | wgrant: Yeah, that's my sense too. | 02:02 |
| jkakar | wgrant: It's a tricky problem and I think the team has done an excellent job in tackling it head on. | 02:03 |
| jkakar | That said, systems like GitHub, which I guess don't have that same problem, seem to be moving forward quickly. | 02:03 |
| wgrant | GitHub doesn't have massive tech debt and design flaws from 2004 :( | 02:03 |
| jkakar | In Fluidinfo, for example, we use Launchpad but we're talking about doing some interesting things and I see people saying, "In order for this to work we'd have to ditch Launchpad... because the crowds are at GitHub." | 02:04 |
| jkakar | wgrant: Yep. | 02:04 |
| wgrant | They also do a lot less. | 02:04 |
| jkakar | Yep. | 02:04 |
| wgrant | But they do most of it well, or at least shinily. | 02:04 |
| jkakar | But also, Launchpad does much more than most people care about. | 02:04 |
| jkakar | And the things that most people care about, it doesn't do amazingly well. | 02:04 |
| jkakar | I still think Launchpad is the best collaboration tool for teams... but I don't feel confident saying that for individuals. | 02:05 |
| jkakar | It's tricky business having a large and varied audience to cater to. | 02:05 |
| jkakar | Okay, bedtime here. Thanks for being awesome, folks. :) | 02:06 |
| LPCIBot | Project windmill-devel build #47: STILL FAILING in 1 hr 7 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill-devel/47/ | 02:23 |
| LPCIBot | Yippie, build fixed! | 04:34 |
| LPCIBot | Project db-devel build #524: FIXED in 5 hr 12 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/db-devel/524/ | 04:34 |
| LPCIBot | Project windmill-db-devel build #248: STILL FAILING in 1 hr 7 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill-db-devel/248/ | 05:20 |
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| === al-maisan is now known as almaisan-away | ||
| === almaisan-away is now known as al-maisan | ||
| LPCIBot | Project windmill-db-devel build #249: STILL FAILING in 1 hr 7 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/windmill-db-devel/249/ | 09:36 |
| LPCIBot | Project db-devel build #525: FAILURE in 5 hr 13 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/db-devel/525/ | 09:47 |
| poolie | lifeless, hi? | 10:50 |
| poolie | is there a global acl on dev.l.n? | 11:11 |
| poolie | skaet doesn't seem able to edit anything | 11:11 |
| === al-maisan is now known as almaisan-away | ||
| === almaisan-away is now known as al-maisan | ||
| LPCIBot | Yippie, build fixed! | 14:59 |
| LPCIBot | Project db-devel build #526: FIXED in 5 hr 11 min: https://lpci.wedontsleep.org/job/db-devel/526/ | 14:59 |
| jml | poolie: on https://code.launchpad.net/~mbp/launchpad/feature-install-cleanup/+merge/60279, should you be using u'on' rather than 'on'? | 16:17 |
| * jml doesn't know | 16:17 | |
| jml | but the old code did. | 16:17 |
| jml | <jml> poolie: on https://code.launchpad.net/~mbp/launchpad/feature-install-cleanup/+merge/60279, should you be using u'on' rather than 'on'? | 16:39 |
| poolie | hi jml | 16:43 |
| poolie | good question | 16:43 |
| jml | the old code did. I don't really know the answer myself. | 16:44 |
| poolie | the names and values are unicode | 16:44 |
| poolie | the code using it would have to be being unusually pedantic to notice, but it's possible | 16:44 |
| poolie | i'll fix it | 16:44 |
| jml | poolie: thanks. | 16:57 |
| jml | poolie: can you land branches, or should I land it for you? | 16:57 |
| poolie | i can! | 16:58 |
| poolie | it took a few attempts but i'm pretty sure it will work now | 16:58 |
| jml | poolie: sweet. | 16:58 |
| poolie | indeed | 17:03 |
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| poolie | thanks for the speedy review | 17:06 |
| === al-maisan is now known as almaisan-away | ||
| lifeless_ | poolie: storm and pythons postgresql driver are unusually pedantic | 21:11 |
| poolie | hi | 21:12 |
| poolie | it probably wouldn't be comparing that string, and if the test passes i guess it's not rejecting it from the update | 21:12 |
| poolie | statement | 21:12 |
| poolie | but i changed it anyhow | 21:12 |
| === lifeless_ is now known as lifeless | ||
| poolie | my attempt to land was blocked by https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/750274 | 21:16 |
| _mup_ | Bug #750274: librarian.txt fails sometimes <build-infrastructure> <librarian> <spurious-test-failure> <Launchpad itself:Triaged> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/750274 > | 21:16 |
| lifeless | poolie: I haven't looked at the diff; was just letting you know | 21:16 |
| poolie | hopefully it will pass on a second attempt | 21:16 |
| poolie | thansk | 21:16 |
| lifeless | jml: hi | 21:17 |
| lifeless | jml: are we going to try to complete that catchup before the ensemble call; I think it has bearing on how to try to do it | 21:17 |
| lifeless | jml: e.g. can we do it on monday morning | 21:18 |
| lifeless | poolie: I'm having trouble finding skaet online ; if she would like to chat she can ping me anytime | 21:18 |
| lifeless | poolie: also yes there is an acl on help.lp.net; spammers love that site | 21:19 |
| lifeless | poolie: do you know here lp username ? | 21:20 |
| poolie | skaet | 21:20 |
| poolie | but perhaps oh i don't know | 21:20 |
| poolie | ~canonical could be added or something? | 21:20 |
| lifeless | I don't know the history | 21:21 |
| lifeless | I'll add her now | 21:21 |
| lifeless | and probably talk to flacoste / mrevell when I see them about ~canonical | 21:21 |
| lifeless | wgrant: how big is the supportted archive, do you know? | 22:49 |
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