[05:40] <pitti> Good morning
[05:42] <Braiam> pitti: but it's still dark
[05:42] <pitti> not here :) (6:42 am)
[05:45] <Braiam> 00:42 here :P
[05:57] <cdbs> Good morning pitti, how was UDS?
[06:30] <pitti> yay oneiric
[06:34] <jasoncwarner> Good Morning, Europeans!
[06:36] <Braiam> jasoncwarner: a localized greeting...
[06:42]  * TheMuso waves.
[06:42] <TheMuso> Hey folks.
[06:42]  * TheMuso is only on for a short while.
[06:44] <jasoncwarner> hey TheMuso....uneventful trip home?
[06:44]  * Braiam gives a power source to TheMuso 
[06:45] <TheMuso> jasoncwarner: Very much so thankfully, unfortunately I think I caught a little something from Robert, although I don't think I got it nearly as bad as he did.
[06:45] <jasoncwarner> TheMuso: I hear ya. I'm not feeling swell today either. oldest has something...I'm being attacked at every turn!
[06:46] <TheMuso> I feel much better today then I did on Saturday, and ven Saturday I didn't feel *that* bad.
[06:46] <TheMuso> I've just had a slight temperature, slightly sore throat, and a slight cough, the first 2 having now been thrown off.
[06:46] <TheMuso> A couple of good nights of sleep should help kill the rest.
[06:48] <pitti> hey jasoncwarner, hey TheMuso
[06:48] <TheMuso> Hey pitti.
[06:48] <pitti> jasoncwarner: it'll get better with each UDS
[06:49] <pitti> after 5 or so of those, your immune system should be trained a lot better against germs from other parts of the world :)
[06:49] <jasoncwarner> morning pitti...you mean my immune system will get stronger? Strong enough to fight off this ubuflu I keep hearing about?
[06:50] <pitti> I used to bring home Ubuflu pretty much each time, but seems I survived three in a row now (plus sprints)
[06:50] <pitti> get well soon, guys!
[06:50] <jasoncwarner> Ok...new meta-goal for 14.04: no desktop team member comes home sick!
[06:50] <jasoncwarner> pie in the face goal?
[06:50] <jasoncwarner> ;)
[06:51] <pitti> deal!
[06:52] <TheMuso> I'm usually one who can survive the week without getting something, however I don't think I got enough sleep, period, making me vulnarable.
[06:53] <TheMuso> vulnerable
[07:15] <chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
[07:15] <chrisccoulson> TheMuso, oh, you've had ubuflu too?
[07:30] <pitti> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
[07:30] <chrisccoulson> hi pitti, good thanks (although, i think i'm starting to get ubuflu)
[07:30] <chrisccoulson> how are you?
[07:31] <pitti> meh, ubuflu seems to have hit hard again :/
[07:31] <pitti> I'm quite fine, thanks! just need to get used again to getting up at 6
[07:32] <chrisccoulson> i don't like getting up early ;)
[07:32] <chrisccoulson> although, i was up at 5am this morning
[07:32] <chrisccoulson> my daughter seems to think that when the sun comes up in the morning, it is time to wake up
[07:33] <chrisccoulson> i wish i could tell her that 5am is not a normal time for anybody to get up ;)
[07:33] <pitti> install blinds :)
[07:34] <chrisccoulson> we have a blackout blind in her room already, but she still just seems to wake up when it gets light outside
[07:34] <chrisccoulson> perhaps it's coincidence ;)
[07:42] <TheMuso> chrisccoulson: Not really, I've mostly shaken what I did have however.
[07:54] <didrocks> good morning
[07:56] <pitti> bonjour didrocks, ca va?
[07:57] <didrocks> guten morgen pitti! I'm fine thanks, and you?
[07:57] <pitti> didrocks: I'm great as well; so you didn't catch the ubuflu then?
[07:57] <pitti> great to hear that it didn't affect everyone
[07:58] <didrocks> pitti: no, seems I'm safe after 2 weeks ;) I had to run through all paris airport to catch my second flight ( 6 minutes to run through the whole airport), but I just get my flight
[07:58] <didrocks> pitti: are you affected? :(
[08:05] <pitti> didrocks: I'm not, fortunately
[08:06] <pitti> I had some troubles with the train as well, but in the end it was only 1:15 hours delay, so not too bad
[08:07] <pitti> didrocks: question about the CD size thing: splitting out unused compiz plugins, would that be a WI for smspillaz or for you?
[08:07] <Sweetshark> Good moooorning, desktoppers!
[08:08] <didrocks> pitti: it would be mine, feel free to add it
[08:08] <pitti> didrocks: thanks
[08:08] <didrocks> hey Sweetshark
[08:08] <pitti> hey Sweetshark, good morning!
[08:11] <pitti> Sweetshark: did you catch your flight?
[08:15] <Sweetshark> pitti: Yes, caught my flight.
[08:15] <pitti> jasoncwarner: are you fine with drafting https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-default-apps ? I wasn't in the session, so I'd have some trouble with drafting it
[08:17] <Sweetshark> Flying on row 13 (labeled row 14) on a Friday, 13th while there was a late-game "default apps" session going on at UDS I was certain that at least LibreOffice would be kicked from the CD. What happened?
[08:17] <Sweetshark> ^- pitti
[08:17] <pitti> Sweetshark: I haven't been in the session either
[08:18] <pitti> Sweetshark: but I could certainly envision shipping the full non-crippled LibO on the DVD, and not shipping it at all on the CD; the prerequisite for this is of course to make the DVD actually useful, and promote it more
[08:19] <pitti> Sweetshark: right now the DVD is a 4.2 GB monster, we want to reduce it to ~ 1.5 GB
[08:19] <pitti> but I think this should be considered/discussed carefully, not decided in a knee-jerk reaction
[08:20] <pitti> Right now we have to ship only some parts because we just can't fit the whole LibO on the CD
[08:20] <Sweetshark> pitti: yep, it was funny to see at UDS how the first reaction to that idea was by most devs
[08:20] <pitti> but then again this also makes it quite a compelling sale: "Look, we can provide all this on just one CD"
[08:21] <pitti> and personally I'm quite proud that we managed to keep this rather small limit over the years
[08:21] <Sweetshark> something along the lines of "*blink* you wanna solve our space-issues, by delivering less?"
[08:21] <pitti> while still provinding so much sw
[08:22] <pitti> Sweetshark: what's your feeling about what we should do?
[08:22] <pitti> i. e. do people generally complain about the things that are missing, or do they appreciate having a reduced LibO in the default install?
[08:23] <pitti> Sweetshark: right now https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-cdspace won't include a "drop LibO" WI; we still have lots of other opportunities
[08:25] <Sweetshark> pitti: my feeling is nobody really complains about base missing, but they are annoyed when this breaks stuff in apps that we do ship (like bibliography in writer)
[08:26] <pitti> there's also things like math, clipart, etc?
[08:27] <Sweetshark> personally, I would be sorry for calc vanishing as a starter from the dash in the default installation for example
[08:28] <pitti> I think we already discussed that, and you said that it would create quite some bugs as well
[08:28] <pitti> as these are so tightly integrated
[08:28] <pitti> so I'd rather not break it that way either
[08:29] <Sweetshark> math is heavily integrated and used inside of writer, openclipart is not needed on the CD IMHO (do we ship that? /me checks the deps)
[08:33] <Sweetshark> hmmm "libreoffice suggests openclipart-libreoffice", but that does not include it on the CD right?
[08:34] <pitti> right
[08:36] <Sweetshark> we could drop libreoffice-filters-mobiledev maybe ...
[08:36]  * vish thinks kenvandine made an excellent point; if LibO is on the Live CD, it gives an opportunity for users to actually test the various replacements Ubuntu offers rather than saying 'you can download and install stuff'
[08:37] <pitti> vish: that's why I like it as well
[08:37] <pitti> Sweetshark: that's just 92 kB; if it's not generally useful, we can certainly drop it, but we have bigger fish to fry, I think
[08:37] <pitti> Sweetshark: oh, it's in universe, thus we already don't ship it by default
[08:37] <vish> do we need games on the CD ? if every bit counts, lets remove those.. ;)
[08:38] <pitti> but sudoku! *cough*
[08:38] <vish> install from SC ;)
[08:38] <pitti> vish: in previous cycles we already threw out most of them, but we have some 5 remaining, yes
[08:39] <vish> pitti: Games are ,IMO, something nice to have as an extra, but I dont thing people would be switching to Ubuntu based on the games we provide :)
[08:40] <vish> but, just mentioning if we are in desperate need of space..
[08:40] <pitti> I agree
[08:40]  * Sweetshark loves his littles Starcraft2 on Ubuntu.
[08:51] <chrisccoulson> wow, bug 783307 is useful :/
[08:51] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 783307 in firefox "e mail send goes nowhere" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/783307
[08:53] <pitti> chrisccoulson: i no type passwrod correct
[08:54] <chrisccoulson> pitti - heh, that's what i was thinking ;)
[08:55] <pitti> chrisccoulson: reassign it to emacs -- unlike ffox, that at least has an MUA :)
[08:59] <didrocks> pitti: feel free to add WI for me on https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-loco-cds as well :)
[08:59] <pitti> didrocks: I haven't drafted that one yet, but I'll certainly need your experience there :0
[08:59] <pitti> meh ESMILEY, :)
[08:59] <didrocks> heh
[09:00]  * didrocks adds ESMILEY to the man page ;)
[09:06] <seb128> hey desktopers
[09:06] <didrocks> salut seb128!
[09:06] <pitti> bonjour seb128, ca va?
[09:07] <pitti> ooh, door bell -- my new computer desk is arriving!
[09:07]  * pitti will be glad to stop sitting on the kitchen desk on the laptop
[09:08] <didrocks> oh nice :) Photos will be required! ;)
[09:08] <Sweetshark> pitti: beware! last time i thought my notbook was arriving it was Jahovas wittnesses ...
[09:08] <Sweetshark> exactly: pics or it didnt happen
[09:10] <didrocks> can anyone accept https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-dx-o-compiz for oneiric? (just proposed it, I'll add some WI, but smspillaz will be drafting it)
[09:22] <rodrigo__> morning
[09:23] <didrocks> good morning rodrigo__!
[09:23] <rodrigo__> everyone back at home safely?
[09:23] <rodrigo__> hey didrocks
[09:25] <seb128> hey rodrigo__
[09:27] <rodrigo__> hi seb128
[09:27] <rodrigo__> are you all still exhausted, or is it just me? :)
[09:28] <seb128> it's just you :p
[09:28] <seb128> but I slept 12 hours on saturday night and same this night
[09:28] <rodrigo__> ok, I guess I'm too old
[09:29] <seb128> with a small nap on saturday
[09:29] <seb128> so it's like 25 hours sleep during the weekend ;-)
[09:29] <rodrigo__> ah, you cheater, I haven't slept that much
[09:29] <rodrigo__> just 7/8 hours each night
[09:29] <seb128> that might be why ;-)
[09:29] <rodrigo__> yeah
[09:30] <seb128> didrocks, did you manage to get your flight with less than one hour in paris btw?
[09:31] <didrocks> seb128: yeah \o/ after an heroic sprint to got through the whole cdg airport (from one terminal extreme to the opposite one) in less than 6 minutes
[09:31] <didrocks> seb128: because, of course, we were delayed by 10 minutes
[09:31] <seb128> heh
[09:31] <didrocks> and then, we got to the arrival gate by car (15 minutes)
[09:31] <seb128> didrocks, no security check to do then?
[09:31] <didrocks> security check included :)
[09:31] <didrocks> s/car/bus
[09:32] <didrocks> but I really didn't want to wait for 4 hours for the next plane :)
[09:32] <seb128> didrocks, nothing like a good sprint to catch a plane :p
[09:32] <seb128> I'm sure that woke you up at least ;-)
[09:32] <seb128> hey chrisccoulson
[09:32] <rodrigo__> :)
[09:33] <didrocks> seb128: oh right! then, a lot of clothes on me to avoid catching a cold for the final flight. After stricking to not get the ubuflu after 2 weeks, that would have been a shame :-)
[09:34] <seb128> didrocks, glad that you manage then ;-)
[09:34] <seb128> +d
[09:35] <didrocks> so am I :-)
[09:35] <didrocks> seb128: and you? uneventful flight?
[09:35] <didrocks> (https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-dx-o-bugs-triage-and-workflow ready for getting approval for oneiric)
[09:36] <rodrigo__> yeah, there's been less ubuflu-affected people this time, afaik, did we talk to the OMS to get a vaccine? :)
[09:36] <rodrigo__> OMS or World Health Org I guess is in English
[09:37] <rodrigo__> so, now's a good time to move to oneiric, right?
[09:38] <seb128> didrocks, yeah, we were really early at the airport so we use the lounge card and go breakfast there, and the almost 2 hours in frankfurt was plenty of time, I didn't have to go through security for once so it took only half an hour to go through
[09:38] <seb128> rodrigo__, depends of how advanturous you are, pitti does update around this time usually
[09:38] <seb128> rodrigo__, what I tend to do is add the oneiric source and apt-get install what I need
[09:38] <seb128> rather than dist-upgrading
[09:38] <rodrigo__> seb128, I guess I can just cherry-pick the updates
[09:39] <rodrigo__> yeah, right
[09:39] <chrisccoulson> hi seb128, how are you?
[09:39] <seb128> that sort of give me an oneiric desktop with natty stack
[09:39] <seb128> which is what I need, stable system and cracky desktop
[09:39] <seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, I'm fine, what about you?
[09:40] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i'm not too bad thanks. bit tired after my daughter woke up at 5am though
[09:40] <seb128> hehe
[09:40] <rodrigo__> hi chrisccoulson
[09:40] <chrisccoulson> hi rodrigo__, how are you?
[09:41] <rodrigo__> chrisccoulson, exhausted, but in 1 piece , and you?
[09:41] <chrisccoulson> rodrigo__, yeah, pretty much the same :)
[09:41] <rodrigo__> heh
[09:42] <chrisccoulson> it's nice to be back in my nice comfortable office chair :)
[09:43] <dpm> good morning desktop people, everyone had a nice flight back?
[09:43] <chrisccoulson> hi dpm
[09:43] <dpm> hey chrisccoulson :)
[09:43] <chrisccoulson> i started work on desktop-o-firefox-translations-in-launchpad already this weekend ;)
[09:44] <dpm> yeah, I saw you updated the blueprint \o/
[09:44] <rodrigo__> hey dpm
[09:44] <didrocks> hey chrisccoulson, dpm
[09:44] <chrisccoulson> hi didrocks
[09:45] <dpm> buenas rodrigo__, salut didrocks!
[09:46] <rodrigo__> dpm, so, you were able to wake up early and not miss your flight then? :)
[09:47] <dpm> rodrigo__, yeah, I managed to get 2 hours of sleep and make it in the end ;)
[09:47] <seb128> hey dpm
[09:48] <rodrigo__> dpm, you're a brave man :-)
[09:48] <chrisccoulson> that is hardcore!
[09:48] <chrisccoulson> i think i would struggle to do that on 2 hours sleep
[09:48] <dpm> rodrigo__, not sure about that, but at least I made it for the flight ;)
[09:49] <dpm> bonjour seb128
[09:50] <pitti> hey rodrigo__
[09:50] <rodrigo__> hi pitti
[09:51] <rodrigo__> pitti was the luckiest, afaik, with his 8 hours train home :-)
[09:51] <pitti> seb128, rodrigo__: I upgraded to oneiric this morning; some java package failed to configure, otherwise it went well
[09:51] <rodrigo__> pitti, oh, ok, maybe I'll dist-upgrade then
[09:53] <pitti> rodrigo__: we can pull you out of the swamp if something bad happens :)
[09:53] <rodrigo__> :)
[09:54] <rodrigo__> ok then, trying
[09:55] <seb128> brave you, I will just cherry pick updates for now ;-)
[09:55] <seb128> rodrigo__, btw one of the GNOME3 ppa update screwed my natty GNOME3 vm some days ago, I can pick any session I just get a dialog saying it's not a valid session and it sends me back to the login screen
[09:55] <pitti> seb128: it's really not that different; the main change is the perl transition, which cjwatson by and large completed
[09:56] <rodrigo__> seb128, yes, still some patches disabled in that package, will work on updating g-session in oneiric this week
[09:56] <seb128> rodrigo__, ok, well before that it managed to start the gnome-shell session, now I can't log in any session
[09:57] <seb128> pitti, right, until we get a new xorg stock or a new upstart or whatever and you find that your system doesn't start or xorg doesn't work ;-)
[09:58] <cdbs> didrocks: Hey there, thanks for the reply! Well, Unity in Oneiric is currently (partially) broken, bug #778950 , can you look at the linked branch when you are free? Thanks!
[09:58] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 778950 in unity "Unity in Oneiric should depend on dconf-gsettings-backend" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/778950
[09:58] <seb128> but no point to argue, it's good that we have people dist-upgrading, I will just cherry pick updates desktop updates while I'm on merges
[09:58] <pitti> seb128: oh, and the keyring dialog looking ugly as it's already gtk3 :)
[09:58] <seb128> pitti, not only the keyring I guess, gedit as well :p
[09:58] <seb128> or eog
[09:58] <pitti> seb128: I'm fine being the guinea pig here; I think I'll be able to rescue myself in the bad cases :0
[09:59] <pitti> seb128: gedit seems to be gtk2 here
[09:59] <didrocks> cdbs: I don't think it's unity which should depends on it, but the gsettings binding rather, isn't it?
[09:59]  * pitti -> building new computer table, bbl
[09:59] <seb128> pitti, hum, it's dep-wait indeed
[09:59] <seb128> pitti, have fun
[10:00] <cdbs> didrocks: Gsettings could use gsettings with gconf as well, I suppose. So maybe no
[10:00] <seb128> didrocks, it's anything shipping a schemas I think
[10:00] <seb128> didrocks, same as with gconf
[10:00] <didrocks> seb128: oh ok, not libdconf0 then?
[10:00] <seb128> didrocks, I need to check but I think they added a dh_gsettings which will add that to Depends:misc, but we need rebuilds for that
[10:00] <cdbs> didrocks: we need both libdconf0 and dconf-gsettings-backend
[10:00] <didrocks> seb128: agreed on that plan rather
[10:01] <didrocks> cdbs: see rather adding the misc by the debhelper script ^^
[10:01] <cdbs> :o
[10:01] <didrocks> cdbs: as well, unity is FTBFS right now in oneiric, I'll bundle the patch with dx after next SRU which should come this week
[10:01] <rodrigo__> seb128, oh, no session at all?
[10:02] <seb128> rodrigo__, they just bail out saying that the session is not a valid name
[10:02] <rodrigo__> hmm, ok
[10:02] <didrocks> this is when there is no .session file found
[10:02] <cdbs> didrocks: well yeah, I know about that ftbfs
[10:02] <cdbs> blame GCC 4.6 :(
[10:02] <didrocks> cdbs: we have a patch somewhere
[10:03] <didrocks> not sure it's still applying though
[10:03] <cjwatson> pitti: feel free to fix the remaining desktopy bits of the perl transition :)
[10:03] <cjwatson> (i.e. build failures)
[10:03] <rodrigo__> seb128, do you have gnome-session-common installed?
[10:03] <seb128> hey cjwatson, how are you?
[10:04] <cdbs> cjwatson: you ROCK, considering the fact that you did the transitions during UDS and even during weekends
[10:04] <seb128> rodrigo__, I will have to check, I upgraded using update-manager and I can't log in now and I didn't figure how to switch to a vt in virtualbox
[10:04] <seb128> rodrigo__, ctrl-alt-f<n> are not locked in virtualbox, they switch real vt
[10:04] <rodrigo__> seb128, oh, for that switch to fullscreen and then CTRL-ALT-F? works
[10:05] <seb128> no
[10:05] <rodrigo__> I think that works
[10:05] <seb128> they switch vt on the system
[10:05] <rodrigo__> oh
[10:05] <seb128> rodrigo__, but don't bother, I will just do GNOME3 on oneiric now
[10:05] <seb128> the vm was just to not break my system during UDS
[10:05] <didrocks> cdbs: rejecting your merge for now, will approve if we see that it shouldn't be handle on a higher level (debhelper)
[10:06] <cdbs> seb128: I can't see dh_gsettings in ubuntu (right now), maybe it needs a sync/merge from Debian?
[10:07] <didrocks> cdbs: btw, I think I drafted most of your blueprint, once ready (following https://wiki.ubuntu.com/WorkItemsHowto), think to set it pending approval
[10:08] <seb128> cdbs, could be
[10:08] <cdbs> didrocks: thanks a lot!
[10:08] <didrocks> yw :)
[10:10] <cjwatson> seb128: hey, fine thanks, did you recover from your long-haul flight? ;-)
[10:10] <seb128> cdbs, didrocks: you should add a depends on dconf-gsettings-backend as a workaround maybe until dh_gsettings land, it's in the dh debian git but it might take a bit to land in debian and then ubuntu
[10:10] <cjwatson> cdbs: heh, was just prodding at it by way of something to do :)
[10:11] <didrocks> seb128: well, unity FTBFS right now, so no point to rush that in
[10:11] <seb128> cjwatson, yeah, I managed to get over my jetlag easily this time it seems ;-)
[10:11] <cjwatson> dh_installgsettings is in Debian as of debhelper 8.1.3
[10:11] <cdbs> Right now on my Oneiric system over 30 packages are held back every time I upgrade
[10:11] <cjwatson> which is already in oneiric
[10:12] <cdbs> all because of build failures :(
[10:12] <didrocks> nice, so dh7 maybe doesn't call it
[10:12] <cjwatson> $ grep gsettings /chroot/sid/usr/bin/dh
[10:12] <cjwatson>         dh_installgsettings
[10:12] <cjwatson> does too :-)
[10:12] <didrocks> hum… weird, I'll give it a deeper look
[10:12] <didrocks> thanks cjwatson :)
[10:12] <didrocks> first, focus on second SRU and then fixing the FTBFS this week in oneiric
[10:13] <seb128> cjwatson, oh right, thanks
[10:13] <seb128> cdbs, right, upgrading before the end of UDS is usually not the best idea if you want to avoid issues
[10:14] <cdbs> didrocks: The dconf0 split happened recently, does installgsettings recognize that well? I doubt so, considering the fact that dh hasn't been updated since
[10:14] <seb128> not that you will avoid issues after UDS, but at least now people will be available to fix those
[10:14] <seb128> cdbs, they happened both on in early april in debian
[10:14] <cdbs> seb128: I didn't run into any issues so far, except for a gstreamer corruption one day
[10:14] <didrocks> cdbs: not sure, didn't get time to look at that, I'll after the SRU and other paperwork
[10:14] <vish> Sweetshark: where is the option to turn on the quick starter icon?
[10:14] <seb128> cdbs, it's just that we synced d-conf recently
[10:15] <vish> Sweetshark: btw, /usr/lib/libreoffice/share/config/images_brand.zip , says it is a broken archive (alteast in the ppa for maverick)
[10:15] <cdbs> seb128: hmm, correct
[10:17] <Sweetshark> vish: Tools->Options, LibreOffice->Memory, "Enable Systray Quickstarter"
[10:21] <vish> Sweetshark: weird, that option does not exist in Ubuntu package 1:3.3.2-1ubuntu2~maverick1 , no probs just thought i could check if the quick start icon was fixed too..
[10:22] <seb128> cdbs, btw no need to write a mir for sources already in main with a different name
[10:22] <seb128> cdbs, i.e gnome-desktop3 is just gnome-desktop in a new version
[10:22] <cdbs> seb128: hmm, really?
[10:23] <seb128> yes, the source is already in main and has been reviewed
[10:23] <cdbs> seb128: I thought an MIR was important for everything
[10:23] <cdbs> okie
[10:23] <seb128> no, the purpose of a mir is to get the code reviewed to see if it's fine to get in main
[10:23] <seb128> no need to do it again just because the source got renamed
[10:23] <Sweetshark> vish: hmm, on natty, I have the option, but I still see no systray icon.
[10:24] <seb128> unity blocks systray use if you don't whitelist things in gsettings
[10:24] <vish> Sweetshark: yea, In Unity, notification icons that need to be displayed need  a whitelist,   the reporter is using Classic desktop with gnome panel
[10:25] <seb128> http://askubuntu.com/questions/36898/how-can-i-see-a-list-of-all-the-systray-icons-that-are-not-whitelisted
[10:26] <cjwatson> perl transition> specifically it'd be nice if somebody could fix pidgin's FTBFS
[10:27] <Sweetshark> vish: do you have libreoffice-gnome installed? Without it, I dont have the option either.
[10:28] <seb128> hum, "make[6]: *** No rule to make target `../libgnt.la', needed by `irssi.la'.  Stop."
[10:29] <seb128> cjwatson, I've no real clue what the issue could be or what changed that make it stop to build but I will try to have a look today
[10:30] <vish> Sweetshark: ah ha! yea, that fixed it, had to install -gnome and -gtk , and now I have that option. thx
[10:30] <cjwatson> seb128: thanks, it's certainly not obvious
[10:33] <dpm> hi pitti, good morning! I've just seen https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-loco-cds - do you have something in mind already for the implementation?
[10:52] <pitti> dpm: yes, I just didn't draft it yet
[10:53] <dpm> pitti, ok, no rush, I was just wondering, thanks!
[10:56] <vish> Sweetshark: how does one apply for/get LibO git commit access?
[11:01] <Sweetshark> vish: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Development/NewAccount
[11:01] <vish> thanks!
[11:02] <cdbs> mvo: Hey there, could you also update update-manager in Oneiric from bzr? Right now its broken
[11:03] <Sweetshark> vish: see also http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Git-Artwork-guide-td2844436.html
[11:09] <Sweetshark> vish: please cc me on the bugs with the account request, so I can help moving it along.
[11:10] <vish> Sweetshark: sure, whats your mail id on fdo?
[11:13] <mvo> cdbs: sure, thanks! will do right after lunch :)
[11:18] <Sweetshark> vish: bjoern.michaelsenATcanonical.com
[11:18] <vish> cool!
[11:40] <seb128> hey mterry, how are you?
[11:40] <mterry> seb128, good!
[11:40] <mterry> seb128, already on oneiric
[11:41] <seb128> had a nice flight back? how is your jetlag?
[11:41] <mterry> seems pretty similar so far.  Clearly we need to package more of GNOME 3 until it breaks
[11:41] <seb128> mterry, great ;-)
[11:41] <seb128> right
[11:41] <seb128> speaking of which
[11:41] <mterry> seb128, jetlag is causing me to be up so early, so here I am.  ;)
[11:41] <seb128> mterry, could you review the mirs for libpeas and seed when you have some time?
[11:41] <mterry> seb128, yes, MIR duty is on my TODO today
[11:41] <seb128> great
[11:41] <seb128> that's blocking some of the GNOME3 builds
[11:41] <seb128> i.e eog
[11:44] <ricotz> seb128, hello
[11:44] <seb128> hey ricotz, how are you?
[11:44] <ricotz> just a short question
[11:44] <seb128> sure
[11:44] <ricotz> i am great, i hope you too
[11:45] <seb128> yes, I'm fine thanks
[11:45] <ricotz> is it possible to use libnotify-dev instead of libnotify4-dev
[11:45] <ricotz> meaning to sync more with debian
[11:45] <ricotz> this might some more syncs possible
[11:45] <ricotz> like zenity
[11:46] <seb128> ricotz, yes, we discussed that with pitti at UDS and agree to just sync and deal with the transition this cycle
[11:46] <ricotz> great ;)
[11:47] <ricotz> so have fun all of you
[11:48] <ricotz> bbl
[12:05] <mterry> seb128, what was the link to the etherpad we're using for GNOME3 stuff?
[12:05] <seb128> mterry, cf topic ;-)
[12:05] <mterry> doh
[12:05]  * didrocks -> break
[12:06] <seb128> didrocks, you start eating?! ;-)
[12:06] <seb128> mterry, we should probably move it to the ubuntu pad now that we have one though, I will do that after lunch
[12:06] <didrocks> seb128: no, don't be crazy! :-) I'll just go outside and walk
[12:06] <seb128> didrocks, ok ;-)
[12:06] <didrocks> let see how many days I can keep up with that :-)
[12:06] <seb128> time to eat there, bbl
[12:06] <didrocks> seb128: enjoy
[12:07] <pitti> seb128: I'll check libnotify now
[12:07] <pitti> seb128: in the worst case, we can reintroduce the previous version with a differet source name, but I figure the transition is happening in Debian as well
[12:08] <seb128> pitti, sorry I already synced it and did another upload to get a newer version than the binaries we had
[12:08] <pitti> seb128: ah, so much the better
[12:09] <seb128> jbicha, hey, I'm not sure why debian added that Build-Depends-Package to the .symbols but upgrading seems fine, I will sponsor your update after lunch
[12:10] <apw> anyone know if there is a way in natty to close banshee without the music stopping, is this a known issue if not
[12:23] <pitti> it works with RB; I have never tried it with banshee, I'm afraid
[12:24] <pitti> apw: but it's certainly meant to be working, i. e. a bug
[12:24] <apw> pitti, seems it is a banshee config not turned on, enablign soundmenu integration... seemed to be left off during the upgrade from Maverick
[12:25] <davmor2> apw: works here you have to have the music playing though not paused
[12:25] <davmor2> apw: I did a fresh install
[12:25] <apw> yeah i was missing the extension for soundmenu being enabled within banshee, seems that should have been enabled during upgrade to me
[12:25] <rodrigo__> pitti, ca-certificates-java is the java package that failed to configure for you, right?
[12:26] <pitti> rodrigo__: confirmed
[12:26] <rodrigo__> pitti, ok, so that's the only thing that seemed to fail
[12:36] <rodrigo__> I'd appreciate a review of this: https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/oneiric/gnome-menus/3_0_0_release/+merge/61098 before I upload it, just in case I broke some ubuntu-specific stuff when rebasing from Debian
[12:42] <seb128> rodrigo__, let me have a look to gnome-menus
[12:42] <rodrigo__> seb128, cool, thanks
[12:44] <rodrigo__> hey mterry, how was your long wait at the airport?
[12:44] <seb128> rodrigo__, btw no need to push it on the side, you could merge it directly and ask for a review from trunk
[12:44] <mterry> rodrigo__, :)  Fine.  I drank lots of hot chocoloate
[12:44] <rodrigo__> seb128, yeah, just wanted to make it easy to get a diff for review
[12:45] <rodrigo__> seb128, so, shall I merge it now?
[12:45] <seb128> rodrigo__, your call, I'm reviewing it
[12:46] <rodrigo__> seb128, ok, I'll wait for your review then
[12:46] <seb128> rodrigo__, why did you drop the -dbg?
[12:46] <rodrigo__> seb128, it wasn't in the debian package
[12:46] <seb128> rodrigo__, right, it's something we added in Ubuntu for easier python debugging, do you think it's not useful?
[12:47] <rodrigo__> seb128, no, just that's why I wanted the review, was not sure what was ubuntu-specific, so re-adding it
[12:47] <seb128> rodrigo__, default rule is to keep things if you don't know why they are there ;-)
[12:48] <seb128> usually we don't go through the work of maintaining a delta for no reason
[12:48] <rodrigo__> ok
[12:48] <seb128> rodrigo__, you need the python-xdg Recommends
[12:49] <seb128> update-gnome-menus-cache uses it
[12:49] <rodrigo__> ok, re-adding it then
[12:49] <seb128> recommends -> depends
[12:50] <seb128> well it's listed twice, just restore those
[12:51] <rodrigo__> where is it listed twice?
[12:52] <seb128> it's in a recommends and in a depends in the diff
[12:52] <seb128> urg
[12:52] <seb128> rodrigo__, why did you drop the postinst code which generate the cache?
[12:53] <seb128> same for 24_ubuntu_hide_control_center.patch
[12:53] <seb128> we probably want to keep dropping 01_default_prefix.patch
[12:53] <seb128> we don't namespace those menus gnome- in Ubuntu
[12:54] <rodrigo__> seb128, ok
[12:55] <jbicha> seb128: thanks
[12:56] <seb128> rodrigo__, the admin patch is useful as well
[12:56] <seb128> rodrigo__, ok, so rule is "don't drop something if you don't know why it's there and if you drop something document the rational in the changelog" ;-)
[12:56] <seb128> rodrigo__, does it make sense?
[12:57] <rodrigo__> seb128, yes, sure
[12:57] <rodrigo__> that's why I wanted a review :)
[12:57] <seb128> rodrigo__, thanks, sorry for being picky
[12:57] <rodrigo__> seb128, no, no problem
[12:57] <seb128> lut kinouchou
[12:57] <seb128> kinouchou, bien rentrée ?
[12:58] <seb128> rodrigo__, ok, I think that's the only comments I have for now, I will do another review once you adressed those
[12:58] <kinouchou> bonjour seb128 :)
[12:58] <didrocks> hey kinouchou
[12:58] <rodrigo__> seb128, ok, pushing in a bit, as soon as it builds ok
[12:58] <kinouchou> oui bien rentrée seb128
[12:59] <seb128> rodrigo__, no hurry, you should get some lunch and finish later
[12:59] <rodrigo__> seb128, 24_ubuntu_hide_control_center.patch doesn't apply aymore, there's no settings.menu file in upstream anymore
[12:59] <seb128> hum
[12:59] <seb128> rodrigo__, the idea is to not list admin entries if you don't have right to run those
[12:59] <seb128> so we need a workitem about updating that if you don't do it in the update
[12:59] <seb128> rodrigo__, that should still apply to the control center
[13:00] <rodrigo__> the control center would need to have code to not show those entries
[13:01] <rodrigo__> seb128, so, can you please add the work item?
[13:01] <kinouchou> hello fredp
[13:01] <kinouchou> hi desrt
[13:01] <seb128> rodrigo__, ok
[13:01] <fredp> kinouchou: hey!
[13:01] <seb128> lut fredp
[13:01] <fredp> and hey seb128, didrocks, rodrigo__, and others
[13:01] <rodrigo__> hey fredp, back at home safely?
[13:02] <rodrigo__> seb128, so, do I drop 01_default_prefix.patch? that's debian -specific?
[13:02] <didrocks> re fredp
[13:02] <fredp> a long stop in vienna, but finally got home.
[13:02] <rodrigo__> fredp, cool (to be back home, not the long stop in vienna :-)
[13:02] <fredp> there was free wifi, so it was still ok :)
[13:03] <didrocks> wifi and battery is all we need, isn't it? :)
[13:03] <rodrigo__> :D
[13:04] <seb128> rodrigo__, right, they rename applications.menu to gnome-applications.menus that we don't do
[13:05] <didrocks> pitti: can you accept https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-dx-o-compiz for oneiric? (just proposed it, I'll add some WI, but smspillaz will be drafting it)
[13:05] <didrocks> pitti: same for https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-dx-o-bugs-triage-and-workflow
[13:06] <rodrigo__> seb128, ok, so pushed, will go out for lunch now while it builds, so do another review whenever you want
[13:06] <seb128> rodrigo__, ok, enjoy!
[13:06] <Iormangund> heya, is there a way to change wireless network connection order of preference?
[13:09] <cyphermox> Iormangund: the preferred networks should be those you've connected to previously; however, you should ask question in #ubuntu instead
[13:11] <Iormangund> i will, ty, though i mean choosing what order, ie atmo it keeps connecting to the weak signal one, instead of the strong one
[13:11] <chrisccoulson> how many people have upgraded to oneiric so far?
[13:11] <cyphermox> chrisccoulson: I have
[13:11] <chrisccoulson> cyphermox, any issues?
[13:11] <cyphermox> on my vostro, oopses every once in a while
[13:12] <cyphermox> I haven't made sense of why yet, but it seemed to happen in more cpu-intensive cases, eg. compiling, and possibly only while on battery
[13:12] <chrisccoulson> cyphermox, oh, that's ok. my laptop panicked several times last week anyway (on natty)
[13:12] <cyphermox> ok :)
[13:12] <cyphermox> maybe it was just because of being in another country ;)
[13:27] <pitti> didrocks: sure, done
[13:28] <didrocks> pitti: thanks a lot :)
[13:28] <pitti> de rien
[13:31] <pitti> hey mterry
[13:31] <mterry> pitti, hello!
[13:40] <pitti> seb128: should we move to gtk 3.1.x straight away, or do you think it's better to stay at 3.0 first?
[13:40] <pitti> from the gnome3 session I remember that we want to move to 3.1.x early, but I forgot whether there was an intermediate step
[13:40] <seb128> pitti, no strong opinion, we should go to GNOME 3.0 before 3.1 but for glib and gtk if someone wants to go straight to the new version just do it
[13:41] <pitti> *nod*
[13:41] <Laney> anyone on mir duty? i'd appreciate a look at dbus-sharp
[13:48]  * pitti grabs polkit-gnome
[13:50] <seb128> pitti, there is a merge requestion for it waiting on versions for some weeks
[13:50] <pitti> *nod*
[13:52] <seb128> not sure if you wanted to update or to sponsor the merge but just pointing it ;-)
[13:55] <pitti> the latter
[13:56] <seb128> ok
[13:56] <seb128> pitti, btw debian got gnome-disk-utility 3 if you want to do some GNOME3 updates ;-)
[13:56] <pitti> seb128: yes, I'm eager to get there :)
[13:56] <pitti> seb128: I just thought we should start at the libraries first (gtk, etc.)
[13:57] <pitti> although I guess our GTK is recent enough
[13:57] <seb128> pitti, the libraries should be done, we got most of those updated in natty or when oneiric opened
[13:57] <seb128> well it's the 3.0 not 3.1 stack but that's what we target for the merge round
[14:17] <pitti> there, pk-gnome using GTK 3 now
[14:17]  * pitti grabs gdu then and marks it in the pad
[14:19] <cyphermox> pitti: thx for the merge ;)
[14:19] <pitti> cyphermox: you did it, so thanks to you :)
[14:23] <dpm> hey pitti, I've seen that on the desktop-o-clean-up-language-support blueprint you've unassigned most of the WI from the desktop team. Does this mean no one is going to be working on this, that they are going to be assigned later, or something else?
[14:25] <pitti> dpm: the default assignee is the blueprint assignee, which is me in this case
[14:25] <pitti> just slightly easier to read
[14:25] <pitti> I had to fix some assignee names anyway, so I cleaned up a bit
[14:28] <dpm> pitti, ah, ok, I didn't know it worked that way too, that's good to know, thanks!
[14:33] <seb128> pitti, do you co-maintain gobject-introspection in Debian? seems the only diff we have is a one line for multiarch, do you know what it's the status of getting that into debian?
[14:33] <pitti> seb128: I had an extensive discussion with bigon to get our changes merged
[14:34] <pitti> seb128: http://wiki.debian.org/Multiarch/Bootstrapping still says it's not ready yet
[14:34] <seb128> pitti, ok, thanks
[14:50] <pitti> seb128: g-d-u merge done in bzr, but blocking on libunique-3.0-dev and libavahi-ui-gtk3-dev (these need merges first, I presume)
[14:50] <pitti> I'll put these on my list as well
[14:50] <seb128> pitti, libunique3 can be synced from debian experimental
[14:50] <Laney> 1
[14:51] <seb128> pitti, the avahi one is a newer revision since your merge, should be easy to do
[14:51] <pitti> seb128: ah, we can drop our changes?
[14:51] <Laney> sorry
[14:51] <pitti> right, looks so
[14:53] <seb128> pitti, hum, I need to check for libunique, but the only one we had iirc was deleting an empty pot so should be easy to apply if still needed
[14:53] <pitti> seb128: I'm also syncing libunique3
[14:53] <seb128> pitti, thanks
[14:53] <pitti> seb128: (just checked the diff; dropping gir is alright, as libunique3 now builds it)
[14:55] <pitti> seb128: meh, FTBFS everywhere: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libunique3/2.91.4-1
[14:55]  * pitti checks
[14:56] <pitti> I'll fix, empty pot
[14:56] <kenvandine> hey guys, i'm going to take a little flex time this morning, but will be around this afternoon
[14:56] <seb128> pitti, ok, still the same issue we had
[14:56] <pitti> hey kenvandine
[14:56] <seb128> hey kenvandine
[14:56] <seb128> kenvandine, had a nice flight back?
[14:56]  * kenvandine has knee high grass in the yard... 
[14:56] <kenvandine> not bad, just long :)
[14:57] <kenvandine> going to rain this afternoon, and everyday this week... so my last chance to mow this forest of a lawn i have for the next 5-6 days
[14:57] <seb128> kenvandine, not sure what you plan to work on this week but if you could check with Cimi on GTK3 theming that would be nice, he has something working at UDS it seems and since we start landing GTK3 applications in oneiric we could use a theme
[14:58] <kenvandine> great
[14:58] <seb128> kenvandine, ok, enjoy
[14:58] <kenvandine> that would be a good place to start :)
[14:58] <seb128> ;-)
[14:58] <pitti> the look pretty ugly right now indeed
[14:59] <pitti> seb128: btw, could you please moderate my u-desktop@ email? it hung because of too many CCs
[14:59] <kenvandine> seb128, so i'll look into that first and i want to finish the ido port to gtk3 this week
[14:59]  * pitti wasn't sure whether the entire desktop team was subscribed, so I mailed people individually
[14:59] <kenvandine> and get a libgwibber-gtk build for gtk3
[15:00] <seb128> kenvandine, great
[15:00] <seb128> pitti, ok, will do
[15:00] <kenvandine> ok, i'll be back in a few hours :)
[15:00] <seb128> kenvandine, see you ;-)
[15:12] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - we'll still have a gtk2 theme won't we?
[15:15] <seb128> chrisccoulson, yes, but that doesn't make things using GTK3 look nice though ;-)
[15:21] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - cool, just checking. we don't want gtk2 applications to look bad ;)
[15:51] <mterry> seb128, FYI the seed/libpeas MIRs were examined, though neither is quite ready to hit main yet.
[15:51] <seb128> mterry, is there anything blocking out of security reviews?
[15:52] <mterry> seb128, both need symbols files and libpeas test suite is failing (may be me running it badly, but needs investigation)
[15:53] <seb128> mterry, ok, thanks, do you plan to do the .symbols thing or should I add it to my list?
[15:53] <mterry> seb128, I hadn't, but I can add it to my list
[15:53] <seb128> we have gedit and eog which depwait on those so would be nice to unblock
[15:53]  * mterry adds to TODO
[15:54] <seb128> mterry, thanks
[15:59] <rodrigo__> seb128, did you review my last push?
[16:00] <rodrigo__> seb128, no hurry, just want to know if I can upload it or just wait
[16:00] <seb128> rodrigo__, not yet, I just finish nautilus and will do that
[16:00] <rodrigo__> seb128, ok, as I said, no hurry, just let me know when it's ok
[16:00] <seb128> ok
[16:10] <rodrigo__> seb128, so, I see most debian packages don't use dh-autoreconf, but we do, so should I leave those in our packages?
[16:10] <seb128> yes
[16:10] <rodrigo__> ok
[16:10] <rodrigo__> ditto for gnome-common
[16:10] <seb128> that's usually because we patch configure.ac for launchpad integration and we need to run autoconf to update the configure
[16:10] <rodrigo__> ah, ok
[16:10] <seb128> right, gnome-common is usually needed for autoreconf to work
[18:07] <didrocks> have a nice evening everyone!
[18:18] <braiam> Morning!!
[20:09] <mterry> Anyone here have gtester experience?
[20:18] <pitti> mterry: is that g_test_* API or something else?
[20:18] <mterry> pitti, yeah
[20:19] <mterry> pitti, libpeas's test suite is failing during a test, but I'm not sure what it's about
[20:19] <pitti> mterry: the only known usage to me is upower's test suite
[20:19] <pitti> but it's pretty straightforward, each test just does a fe g_assert()s
[20:20] <pitti> s/fe/few/
[20:20] <mterry> pitti, well, it's dying because something tries to register the same static gtype twice.  Seems like some threading error, as the registration is g_once protected
[20:20] <mterry> pitti, do you know how g_test* handles threading?
[20:20] <pitti> mterry: I don't, sorry
[20:20] <mterry> pitti, thx anyway!  I'll just let that one stew in my brain for a while and do something else I guess
[20:46] <bcurtiswx> which channel do I bug for SRU for natty for telepathy-logger? -motu?
[20:48] <cyphermox> bcurtiswx: #ubuntu-devel should be fine; and technically so is this channel too, pretty much
[20:48] <bcurtiswx> https://code.launchpad.net/~bcurtiswx/ubuntu/natty/telepathy-logger/lp_745803_fix/+merge/60964 Natty SRU request telepathy-logger
[20:50] <bcurtiswx> thanks :)
[20:51] <cyphermox> bcurtiswx: seems to me like the changelog should better describe the changes made to the patch file. I think it´s also not necessary to mention the series file given that AFAICT it´s not touched at all (unless you forgot to bzr add it?)
[20:52] <bcurtiswx> cyphermox, you are correct, i added it here but not bzr.. weeee brb
[20:54] <cyphermox> bcurtiswx: and also, the merge request seems off to me. I´d think it should for ubuntu-sponsors to review, and subscrive ubuntu-sru to the bug report and adjust the description for SRU rationale, impact and test cases as described in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Procedure
[20:54] <bcurtiswx> cyphermox, OK thanks
[20:55] <broder> cyphermox, bcurtiswx: no, i think the procedure is right (one moment while i double check...)
[20:55] <Ampelbein> cyphermox: I recall a change to the sru procedure where it gets uploaded and reviewed from the upload queue.
[20:55] <cyphermox> dunno, just my feeling from the bzr branch, I may be wrong ;)
[20:55] <broder> ok, i see
[20:56] <broder> yeah - the bzr proposal is fine, and it should go through the normal sponsorship process before sru review
[20:56] <broder> but you should update the bug description with the the stuff that the wiki page asks for
[20:56] <broder> (test case is definitely most important)
[20:57] <cyphermox> Ampelbein, broder, then where is this new procedure documented?
[20:57] <Ampelbein> cyphermox: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2010-July/030999.html
[20:57] <cyphermox> thanks
[20:57] <broder> cyphermox: the wiki page is accurate - nominate, subscribe ubuntu-sru, upload (without waiting for sru approval)
[20:58] <broder> "There is no need to wait before uploading"
[20:58] <cyphermox> right
[20:58] <cyphermox> but the issue i was referring to was that the merge request asks for review from ubuntu-sru ;)
[20:59] <Ampelbein> oh, then it was a misunderstanding, sorry.
[21:00] <cyphermox> np; just making sure I´m not missing pieces :)
[21:02] <bcurtiswx> OK, so the review foes to -sponsors
[21:02] <bcurtiswx> goes*
[21:03] <bcurtiswx> and the bug gets SRU subscribed, and I edit the bug desc and such for SRU
[21:03] <bcurtiswx> correct?
[21:03] <cyphermox> bcurtiswx: yeah, sounds right
[21:05] <rickspencer3> reading desktop-devel-list is not too fun these days
[21:07] <jbicha> rickspencer3: you mean ubuntu-devel ?
[21:07] <rickspencer3> jbicha, no, I mean the gnome list
[21:07] <kenvandine> rickspencer3, indeed
[21:07] <rickspencer3> the lesson seems to be "don't try to collaborate upstream"
[21:08] <pitti> rickspencer3: within all the noise and bashing there was finally some constructive result, though
[21:09] <pitti> (for control-center and language-selector)
[21:09] <rickspencer3> pitti, oh? I haven't tgotten there yet for that or lightDM
[21:09] <pitti> rickspencer3: not for that, right
[21:09] <rickspencer3> statements like this, make we wonder:
[21:09] <rickspencer3> You know what I think is selfish? Treating GNOME like it's just a
[21:09] <rickspencer3> factory spitting out technology, at your bidding, that you can put
[21:09] <rickspencer3> together as you see fit. And then not giving any credit or
[21:09] <rickspencer3> contributing your changes back upstream. Think about it.
[21:10] <pitti> anyway, sleep time; good night everyone!
[21:10] <kenvandine> good night pitti
[21:11] <rickspencer3> night pitti
[21:11] <bcurtiswx> nite pitti
[21:12] <bcurtiswx> cyphermox, issue fixed :) thanks
[21:12] <bcurtiswx> kenvandine, was your 100% CPU bug that you mentioned to me before from indicator-weather ?
[21:12] <kenvandine> bcurtiswx, we've seen in for several things
[21:12] <kenvandine> it isn't specific to indicator-weather
[21:13] <bcurtiswx> it's desktopcouch-service
[21:13] <kenvandine> bcurtiswx, i think it is a broken view in couchdb
[21:15] <rickspencer3> hi bcurtiswx
[21:15] <bcurtiswx> hey rickspencer3 :)
[21:30] <bcurtiswx> kenvandine, and you were planning on moving indicator code off of empathy and using telepathy-indicator instead right? were you going to keep that vala or make it pure GTK ?
[21:31] <kenvandine> vala
[21:31] <highvoltage> rickspencer3: did you copy and paste that from somewhere or is it original™ rickspencer3?
[21:32] <highvoltage> (oh, sorry, I read the line above now, d'oh!)
[21:34] <rickspencer3> hi highvoltage
[21:34] <rickspencer3> I was just kind of surprised by how heated some of the threads got
[21:37] <highvoltage> silly humans and their emotions! *wiggling pointy ears*
[21:37] <bcurtiswx> kenvandine, how do I compile tp-indicator?
[21:37] <kenvandine> it won't build for you right now
[21:37] <kenvandine> needs changes i have locally as well as tweaks to the tp-glib vapi file
[21:37] <bcurtiswx> OK, thought I was going something wrong :-x
[21:37] <bcurtiswx> doing*
[21:37] <kenvandine> i'll get it in shape to build in the next couple days :)
[21:38] <bcurtiswx> kenvandine, sounds good :)
[21:43] <rickspencer3> highvoltage, indeed
[22:00] <jbicha> I don't think proposing LightDM for Gnome acceptance now was a good idea, as I think it's more of
[22:00] <jbicha> a proof of concept than actually deployable yet, but maybe that's partly because I couldn't
[22:00] <jbicha> get it working on my Oneiric box, but I don't think accessibility support was added yet
[22:01] <jbicha> it's perhaps a bit like Lennart's pushing Ubuntu to switch to systemd when it's not actually been deployed on a wide scale yet
[22:01] <jbicha> *was not a good idea
[22:03] <micahg> jbicha: someone already commented on that, it's not a fair comparison
[22:08] <jbicha> I don't see how lightdm could be expected to be ready to replace GDM, but it may be totally different after Ubuntu ships it by default and somebody writes a Gnome Shell-like theme
[22:08] <jbicha> so, try again in 6 months :-)
[22:13] <jbicha> I mean I don't like everything in the new GDM but lightdm hasn't realized all of its potential yet either
[22:14] <bcurtiswx> empathy got the same criticism when it became default
[22:14] <bcurtiswx> look where it is now
[22:14] <bcurtiswx> i think something like lightGM can do the same
[22:14] <jbicha> bcurtiswx: I think I can finally use IRC on empathy now, too bad I've switched to irssi from pidgin now :-)
[22:15] <bcurtiswx> lightDM*
[22:16] <bcurtiswx> i can't see my keyboard, so it's all blind typing.. don't get an HP DV7 if you value being able to see the keyboard :P
[22:16] <jbicha> yeah I have confidence that lightdm will be doing ok in a few months but how many people are actually running it now?
[22:16] <bcurtiswx> how many people were running empathy when it was suggested default... same-ish amount i would guess
[22:18] <jbicha> lightdm won't even run for me so it's a bit different :-)
[22:41] <scott-work> if the ubuntu studio team wanted to stay with gnome2, would there be any heartache or grief with package names as they are currently?
[22:42] <scott-work> would we need to revise our seeds for new package names or would any dependcies be newly named?
[22:42]  * scott-work will be leaving work soon but will see any response on ScottL
[22:42] <jbicha> scott-work: it's not going to be possible as gnome 2 won't exist in the archives, but there is a Gnome Panel 3 you may be able to use by default
[22:43] <jbicha> I'm running Gnome Panel 3 on my computer and it mostly works (indicators haven't been ported to it but that will come later this cycle)
[22:44] <scott-work> jbicha: is gnome panel 3 the "compatability" layer within gnome3 or is this something else?
[22:45] <jbicha> yes, it's the fallback mode and looks like an evolved version of the Gnome 2 interface, just a bit tweaked to resemble Gnome Shell a bit more
[22:45] <jbicha> it's in my PPA if you want to play with it, I wouldn't recommend you do it on your primary computer if you depend on
[22:46] <jbicha> your computer working as it normally does
[22:46] <scott-work> jbicha: i have a fedora live gnome3 disc, will it differ drastically?
[22:47] <jbicha> no, it's the same thing
[22:47] <scott-work> jbicha: or should i really use the PPA to get an accurate representation
[22:47] <scott-work> oh, okay
[22:51] <scott-work> jbicha:  some if the ubuntu studio team might want to test, what is your ppa name?
[22:53] <scott-work> jbicha: nevermind, found it :)
[22:57] <jbicha> it's not part of the gnome3 PPA since without indicator support, it breaks the Ubuntu look & feel
[22:57] <jbicha> and any custom applets besides the 20 or so included probably haven't been ported yet either
[22:58] <scott-work> jbicha: mainly we are worried about the workflow for studio work so i think it will give us a fairly good indicator without additional applets
[22:59] <scott-work> jbicha: most on the team feel that without panels it creates a strained work flow
[22:59] <scott-work> just exploring the possibilities
[23:01] <scott-work> jbicha:  just for clarification: are you saying that gnome2 will NOT be in the archives for ocelot?
[23:57] <jbicha> ScottL: the packages names aren't changing, gnome-panel 3 is still named gnome-panel in the repositories, thus there can only be 1 version there
[23:58] <ScottL> jbicha, gotcha!  thanks for the information