[07:46] <rye> mornings!
[07:49] <OomElvis> what about them?
[07:49] <OomElvis> :-P
[07:54] <mandel> morning all
[08:01] <ralsina> morning mandel
[08:07] <Apacheuk> morning everybody, quick question if I may
[08:07] <Apacheuk> is there a way to make a directory only sync one way? I want to have a backup directory, but don't want it to sync back to all my other machines?
[08:16] <duanedesign> hello Apacheuk
[08:17] <Apacheuk> hello
[08:17] <ehw> Apacheuk: in newer clients (natty) you can specify which folders you want to sync on that machine
[08:18] <ehw> Apacheuk: sync it on one machine and make sure it stays disconnected on the others, should work
[08:18] <Apacheuk> ehw: OK, I'll try tah
[08:18] <duanedesign> but what you remove from that machinr will be removed from the cloud
[08:19] <duanedesign> Ubuntu One and other sync services like deopbox do not make very good bavk up options IHMO
[08:20] <Apacheuk> duanedesign: thats want I want it for, it'll nearly do want I want....
[08:20] <Apacheuk> is there a way to suggest this feature to the devs?
[08:38] <ralsina> it's probably a better idea to backup *into* the ubuntu one folder and sync the backup
[08:38] <ralsina> You could backup using rdiff-backup for example.
[08:49] <Apacheuk> ralsina: thats what I'm doing now, but don't want that backup file to then get sync'd down to my other machines, I want a folder within ubuntu one that isn't sync'd down
[08:49] <ralsina> Apacheuk: then sync another folder and don't subscribe to it.
[08:50] <ralsina> I think that was the advice you got so I agree with it :-)
[08:51] <Apacheuk> ok, I'm going to try that today, my only other question would be what would happen if I lose that machine, would I be able to retrieve my files from another machine?
[08:51] <ralsina> At UDS there was an interesting session about Deja Dup as default backup tool, and I am really interested on having it integrate with ubuntu one the right way.
[08:51] <ralsina> Apacheuk: sure, they are in the web, and all you have to do is subscribe to that folder from  the machine you want to use for restore
[08:53] <Apacheuk> ralsina: cool, sounds like I have my solution.... cheers everyone
[08:53] <ralsina> Apacheuk: have fun, let us know if you run into any problems!
[08:53] <Apacheuk> ralsina: also cheers for the heads on DejaDup, hadn't seen that one
[08:54] <ralsina> I hae not tried yet (I am a long time rdiff-backup user) but it does look cool
[09:54] <czajkowski> mandel: boo
[09:55] <mandel> czajkowski: hi
[10:41] <ralsina> out to lunch!
[11:00] <fagan> crap morning
[11:00]  * fagan dosed off waiting to start
[11:00] <rye> has anybody already written the CLI tool for file upload/download using the REST/API?
[11:00] <rye> s/\///
[11:01] <rye> s/REST\/API/REST API/
[11:01] <rye> otherwise that would have created uploaddownload word
[11:10] <karni> rye: jdo has a Python implementation, which is ridiculously easly to use. I think you could use that.
[11:10] <karni> fagan: you don't have to wait to start, you can start earlier - can't you :)?
[11:10] <karni> rye: it's called u1-rest, I'm looking it up
[11:10] <fagan> karni: this was like 7 am
[11:10] <karni> fagan: :D
[11:10] <karni> fagan: you'd be free at 3PM :D
[11:11] <karni> rye: https://code.launchpad.net/~jdobrien/restful-u1/trunk
[11:12] <karni> rye: he renamed it ;)
[11:12] <fagan> karni: but it would make my times off like id be working at weird times then
[11:12] <karni> fagan: I see.
[11:25] <fagan> mandel: have any merges for me
[11:25] <mandel> fagan: I dont think so, let me look
[11:26] <fagan> cool
[11:27] <mandel> fagan: does not look like
[11:27] <mandel> ralsina: ping
[11:27] <ralsina> mandel: pong
[11:27] <mandel> ralsina: could you review this crazy branch: https://code.launchpad.net/~mandel/ubuntuone-client/provide_windows_vm_helper/+merge/60586
[11:27] <ralsina> mandel: sure!
[11:28] <mandel> thx
[11:28] <ralsina> mandel: going to take a while (long branch)
[11:28] <ralsina> mandel: but I'm on it
[11:28] <mandel> ralsina: that's why a said crazy ;)
[11:29] <mandel> it kept growing and growing til I realized the size...
[11:29] <mandel> sorry
[11:29] <fagan> ralsina: im going to have a pretty quiet day im still feeling under the weather (have the flu or something else horrible)
[11:29] <ralsina> fagan: get a doctor's permit and take the day off
[11:30]  * ralsina is not sure permit is the right word, you know what it should say there
[11:30] <Chipaca> mandel: that's what she said!
[11:30] <fagan> ralsina: na no need not that bad
[11:30] <mandel> hehehe
[11:31] <ralsina> fagan: well, it's the right thing to do
[11:31] <ralsina> there's too much uds hangover around anyway
[11:31] <Chipaca> ubuflu
[11:32] <fagan> ralsina: yeah its just the docs are across town so dont want to walk it, its not like ill be programming rockets all day or anything anyway :)
[11:34] <ralsina> fagan: doctor's don't do house calls over there?
[11:34] <fagan> ralsina: yeah but that sounds like a load of effort for the back end of the flu
[11:37] <fagan> im just one of those people that unless im half dying here I dont call the doctor
[11:37]  * fagan is a country boy 
[11:37] <ralsina> fagan: ok, but for next time, here's how it works. If you feel sick enough that you shouldn't work, then get a doctor to say so. If you don't, you are supposed to feel ok-ish. Keeps everything clear for everyone.
[11:38] <fagan> ralsina: cool well im ok to work im just going to be a bit sluggish
[11:38] <ralsina> fagan: cool
[11:40] <mandel> ralsina: there are other 2 branches missing that I'd appreciate a review with
[11:41] <ralsina> mandel: before this one or after this one?
[11:41] <mandel> ralsina: before, but that is not a problem because I did the dependencies and in the diff you just get what I changed
[11:41] <mandel> so you can finish that and then we can move to the others
[11:42] <ralsina> mandel: I meant if you want me to do them before or after. Ok, this one first.
[11:48] <ralsina> mandel: Ja! options.im_ok_with_being_root_pretty_please_let_me_be_root
[11:49] <ralsina> and a +1
[11:49]  * ralsina goes back to the older branches
[11:49] <mandel> ralsina: yeah, thats a funny option :)
[11:50] <fagan> mandel: doesnt that name break some convention?
[11:50] <mandel> fagan: maybe, but that was there already and there is no reason to change it
[11:50] <mandel> ralsina: please take a look at https://code.launchpad.net/~mandel/ubuntuone-client/provide_windows_ipc_interface/+merge/59923
[11:51] <mandel> ralsina: the other one is just 100 lines, dont worry :)
[11:51] <ralsina> it's like totally PEP8-compliant, too
[11:51] <fagan> mandel: hah well it reminds me of that thing with C that it only technically recognises the first 25 chars in a var
[11:51] <ralsina> shane, did you run the last branch manuel mentiond on linux and windows?
[11:52] <fagan> ralsina: just windows
[11:52] <ralsina> fagan: the first 31 characters
[11:52] <fagan> ahhh I remembered it was some number around that
[11:53] <fagan> 25 must have been for something else
[11:53] <ralsina> 25 just doesn't sound right because it fits no way to store data :-)
[11:53] <ralsina> That's why I googled it, (I had no idea!)
[11:54] <fagan> ralsina: its one of those things they say to you in programming and everyone laughs and forgets about it later
[11:55] <fagan> but still they probably wouldnt mention it if people didnt try it at some stage
[11:55] <ralsina> if someone has two variable names that differ on the 32th character, he deserves any problems he gets.
[11:57] <fagan> ralsina: yeah thats a good way to look at that
[11:58] <ralsina> mandel: what time is good for the mumble about the installer wireframes?
[11:58] <mandel> ralsina: best for me is just after the stand up, is that good for you?
[11:59] <ralsina> I am at GMT+3 so that is... 2 hours from now?
[11:59]  * fagan though ar time was later than that 
[11:59] <fagan> *thought
[11:59]  * ralsina is a long way away from .ar
[12:00] <fagan> ahhh ok
[12:00] <ralsina> mandel: will try to set it up for that time
[12:00] <ralsina> fagan: I am in asia at the moment. Ok, about 2km inside asia, but still, asia!
[12:01] <ralsina> mandel: confirmed, right after standup
[12:01] <fagan> ralsina: wow nice
[12:01] <mandel> cool
[12:02] <ralsina> fagan: office window view: http://picplz.com/rmJ0
[12:02] <ralsina> aaaaaand back to reviewing code.
[12:14] <nigelb> ralsina: where in asia is that?
[12:15] <ralsina> nigelb: outskirts of istambul
[12:16] <nigelb> ralsina: nice, you headed there post-UDS?
[12:16] <ralsina> nigelb: yes, will stay here until our full team sprint in london in 3 weeks.
[12:17] <nigelb> ralsina: oh, nice. I guess I missed meeting you at UDS
[12:17] <ralsina> nigelb: uds was really crowded and I am not all that social
[12:18] <ralsina> and I was there for summit before, so around wednesday I was pretty much burned out already
[12:18] <nigelb> ralsina: also doesn't help that I hardly know ubuntu one folks apart from aquarius
[12:18] <nigelb> (I did get an awesome picture of aquarius with the hat)
[12:19] <fagan> nigelb: you know me :)
[12:19] <ralsina> well, aquarius is the recognizable one ;-)
[12:19] <nigelb> fagan: ah, you too :)
[12:20] <nigelb> fagan: but you were in UDS in spirit, not in person
[12:20] <fagan> nigelb: yeah but I was at the lucid one if you were about then
[12:20] <nigelb> fagan: Nope, this was my first
[12:20] <fagan> ah ok
[12:20] <fagan> :)
[12:25] <ralsina> mandel: +1 on provide_windows_ipc_interface
[12:29] <mandel> ralsina: cool let me get you the last one
[12:30] <mandel> ralsina: there yo go: https://code.launchpad.net/~mandel/ubuntuone-client/fix_signal_emition/+merge/59941
[12:30] <ralsina> mandel: ok, on it!
[12:31] <mandel> thx!
[12:32] <mandel> one question for a more normal person than me, if you get bitten by a dog, and the wound is big enough that you see the fat layer of your screen, do you need to go to a doctor?
[12:32] <mandel> the wound has started to bother me a little and is not close, yet I'm not bleeding badly
[12:34]  * mandel pains tolerance is quite high usually
[12:35] <ralsina> mandel: if you are bitten by a dog, yes you should see a doctor because of infection risk
[12:36] <ralsina> specially if they broke the skin
[12:36] <ralsina> not to mention rabies shots if it were a stray dog
[12:36] <mandel> oh, really??
[12:37] <mandel> hmmmm I might have to look into it later then...
[12:37] <ralsina> imagine rubbing raw meat in your wound. Would you consider that risky behaviour? ;-)
[12:37] <ralsina> now imagine that raw meat has been rotting inside a dog's mouth for a week or so
[12:39] <mandel> ralsina: well, I would really not think that it must be bad, I always expect the inmune system to take care of it, but I just at the wound, and is not looking as a normal one… he, I'm really prone to accidents :P
[12:39] <mandel> ralsina: by the one, if you've seen the pict, the scale is 1:1
[12:40] <ralsina> mandel: it's really dangerous. I usually let my immune system handle that kind of thing too, but...
[12:40] <ralsina> where did it bite you?
[12:42] <mandel> ralsina: chest
[12:42] <ralsina> wow
[12:42] <mandel> ralsina: si, un perro me ha mordido una teta, hehehe
[12:43] <ralsina> jajaja
[12:43] <ralsina> parece el remate de un chiste "y el jodío perro me ha mordido la teta!" ;-)
[12:43] <mandel> yes, it does, hehe
[12:43] <mandel> not the best 'weekend' ever
[12:44] <ralsina> if I were you I would see a doctor, even if just to know it's nothing
[12:44] <ralsina> mandel: yep :-(
[12:44] <mandel> ralsina: we do the meeting with design, and will decide later then
[12:44] <ralsina> ok
[12:45] <mandel> need to go to walk the dog again, wish me luck, I might be eaten by a cocrodrile  this time
[12:45]  * mandel walks the dog, but this time carries a gun
[12:45] <ralsina> mandel: good luck!
[12:47] <ralsina> ok, there's a freaking crow 5 feet away from me (I am working in a balcony).
[12:48]  * ralsina googles for anti-crow measures
[12:49] <fagan> slingshot is good
[12:50] <ralsina> It looks exactly like this one and is about 35cm tall: http://www.flickr.com/photos/eob/4227171018/
[12:54] <duanedesign> ralsina: wow that is a neat looking crow
[12:55] <ralsina> ok, it escaped when I tried to take a picture. Chicken crow!
[12:55] <duanedesign> at least neat compared to the crows indigenous to my neck of the woods
[12:56] <nigelb> ralsina: now you have a new way to scare them off
[12:56] <nigelb> ralsina: throwing laptop at it might work :p
[12:56] <ralsina> nigelb: I fear throwing the notebook may hurt my estimates.
[12:57] <nigelb> hehe
[12:59] <aquarius> ralsina, hey, I'm not that recognisable :)
[12:59] <ralsina> aquarius: yes you are!
[12:59] <ralsina> you are the blonde guy shouting "By George!" ;-)
[12:59] <fagan> aquarius: its your voice man
[13:00] <nigelb> aquarius: Yeah, with a black dress and a hat, of course not.
[13:00] <nigelb> s/dress/suit
[13:01]  * Chipaca just pictured aquarius in a black evening dress
[13:01] <Chipaca> nigelb: i hate you :(
[13:01] <nigelb> Chipaca: hahaha
[13:01] <fagan> Chipaca: dont do that to yourself
[13:01] <duanedesign> ugh /me shudders
[13:02] <nigelb> that vision is going to give me nightmares
[13:02] <ralsina> Sequins!
[13:02] <duanedesign> picked the wrong time to join and read the scroll back
[13:02] <nigelb> hah
[13:02]  * Chipaca goes to forage for food
[13:02] <Chipaca> as opposed to foraging for internets
[13:03] <duanedesign> on a serious note. Their was talk about PayPal support for Ubuntu one does anyone know where this stands. I have a user requesting an update on this
[13:04] <Chipaca> duanedesign: it's been pushed back into the second half of the (fiscal) year
[13:05] <duanedesign> Chipaca: thank you kind sir
[13:11] <Chipaca> mandel: ralsina: was it to you i mentioned something about training crows to find coins? http://www.ted.com/talks/joshua_klein_on_the_intelligence_of_crows.html
[13:11] <ralsina> Chipaca: yes it was
[13:13] <ralsina> "... so I spent the next 10 years reading about crows on my spare time". I feel so identified already ;-)
[13:14] <Chipaca> yeah :) I love the (was it tacit?) "as you do"
[13:15] <ralsina> I mean, not crows, but...
[13:15] <ralsina> really, there are some things I have spent 20 years on.
[13:15] <ralsina> like, college ;-)
[13:16] <nigelb> I thought college was supposed to be 4 :p
[13:16] <ralsina> nigelb: actually 5 for my degree. And I stopped a few months too early, 18 years ago
[13:17] <nigelb> heh
[13:18] <ralsina> but in a general manner, I have been reading and writing open source code in my spare time for 15 or 16 years
[13:19] <fagan> ralsina: ive been doing the same for like 3
[13:20] <fagan> but not writing as much as reading
[13:20] <ralsina> I think I will switch to crows now, though. That video is way cooler than what I do ;-)
[13:20] <ralsina> oh, wait, I live in the only place other than antartica where there are no crows
[13:21] <nigelb> heh
[13:45] <fagan> need to head to the shop real quick might just about miss the standup but will do it when I get back
[13:46] <ralsina> fagan: ok
[13:56] <mandel> ralsina, fagan: when I started in spain, my degree was 6 years :P
[13:57] <ralsina> mandel: well, my degree was a simple licenciatura, not an ingeniería
[13:57] <mandel> ahh
[13:57] <mandel> well, I did not finish that one :P
[13:57] <ralsina> mandel: anyway, standup would involve just we, and I think we know what we have been doing
[13:57] <ralsina> mandel: I didn't finish mine either ;-)
[13:58] <ralsina> mandel: I have a problem with the mumble thingie. My mic broke on the trip
[13:58] <mandel> ralsina: I did finish a degree thoug, but in the UK and was 4 years :)
[13:58] <ralsina> and the notebook's mic is just crap
[13:59] <ralsina> so I can type but I can't lead the call
[13:59] <mandel> ralsina: oh! what do you propose to do?
[13:59] <mandel> ralsina: I can lead the call, but would be nice to hear you speaking, I would be surprise if people read in mumble
[13:59] <ralsina> mandel: well, we need to have it, but mostly it's about the wireframes not having crazy stuff
[13:59] <ralsina> Ok, I will speak and we'll see how it goes
[14:00] <ralsina> at least I will make robot noises
[14:01] <ralsina> mandel: BTW: I +1d the last branch
[14:02] <mandel> ralsina: cool, I'm on mumble right now in the windos channel
[14:02] <mandel> we have no standup, rigth?
[14:03] <JamesTait> mandel: You can stand up if you want to. Or you can just tell everyone you're standing up, but stay sat down, no-one will know. ;)
[14:03] <ralsina> mandel: no point today
[14:03] <ralsina> I mean you have been coding, and I have been reviewing your code. Standup finished ;-)
[14:04] <ralsina> mandel: we have a windows channel on mumble?
[14:04] <mandel> ralsina: yep
[14:04] <mandel> ralsina: online services/windows
[14:15] <fagan> oh so I didnt miss anything
[14:15] <fagan> sweet im going back to what I was doing before I left (writing up my blog posts for college)
[14:16] <ralsina> fagan: ok, cool
[14:16] <fagan> missing 2 so need to spend some time on it
[14:33] <ralsina> manuel: you still on mumble?
[14:50] <ralsina> Ok, taking a short break now since I have been here 7 hours. Will be back later.
[15:28]  * fagan takes a break
[15:52] <etherealg> hey everyone, wanted to check if anyone knows of work being done on a mac client, and if so where I could get a look at the code
[16:01] <beuno> etherealgg, no work has started yet, no. It's on our roadmap, but it could be 9-12 months away
[16:02] <etherealgg> cool, if I were interested in getting one up started, would it be ok to start hacking on something using the API, or do you think it's better to try do things more "low level" like a shared lib between the linux and mac version?
[16:03] <beuno> etherealgg, anything you want to start off would be awesome, even if we need to change things later on
[16:04] <beuno> etherealgg, I do think that if you started making the syncdaemon library work on OSX, we'd be more likely to all work on the same code base
[16:08]  * fagan back 
[16:08] <etherealgg> sounds good, I'll start there if I do :)
[16:09] <etherealgg> I'm gonna be horribly lazy and ask instead of going to search for it, where do you guys keep your source for it?
[16:10] <beuno> etherealgg, yes, but maybe facundobatista or Chipaca can give you some tips on what to look at
[16:10] <etherealgg> cool, just found the source on http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntuone-control-tower/ubuntuone-client/trunk/files/head:/libsyncdaemon/ , is that the right place?
[16:11] <facundobatista> etherealgg, best you can do is branch the code, and try to run the tests, to see how them go, and even try to start the client from there
[16:12] <fagan> etherealgg: nope
[16:12] <fagan> oh it is
[16:12] <etherealgg> heh, cool :)
[16:12] <etherealgg> I'll maybe have a hack at getting it running on osx tonight, thanks guys
[16:12] <facundobatista> etherealgg, the file syncronization client (we call it "syncdaemon") is here: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntuone-control-tower/ubuntuone-client/trunk/files/head:/ubuntuone/syncdaemon/
[16:12]  * fagan wonders why its under control tower
[16:13] <facundobatista> etherealgg, feel free to ask me anything about it!
[16:13] <etherealgg> cool, thanks
[16:13] <fagan> etherealgg: the best place to start would be just trying to run the code and see what heppens id say
[16:13] <fagan> *happens
[16:13] <etherealgg> sounds like a good idea, I see that part is python
[16:14] <etherealgg> hopefully that means relative ease in getting things working cross-platform
[16:14] <fagan> etherealgg: well mac is a lot easier to port to than windows which is what we are doing at the moment
[16:15] <fagan> so some things may or may not work easily :)
[16:15] <fagan> porting is a funny process that way
[16:16] <etherealgg> I've seen, tbh I've never even tried it on ubuntu, but in the mac world the incumbent is dropbox, which has quite a few... shall we say... "issues". I was thinking of trying a more open alternative, when I saw ubuntu one wasn't available on mac thought I might see about hacking it together.
[16:16] <Chipaca> etherealgg: the main parts are in python; libsyncdaemon is for integrating with some things that are in C or vala or such
[16:17] <fagan> Chipaca: isnt the vala just for the tests?
[16:17] <fagan> I was trying to get my head around the code base and didnt see much vala there
[16:19] <etherealgg> well, I'm off for now, thanks for all the info guys. I'll keep you posted if I get anything working
[16:19] <etherealgg> laters
[16:53] <fagan> ok im taking another quick break to get some food and all will be back around 8 to finish the day off and publish those posts and all
[19:12] <jo-erlend> people... I've been writing some really cool stuff in LibreOffice in 11.04 today and I decided to store it in my Ubuntu One folder because I'm using several laptops and very mobile at the moment. Now, Ubuntu One keeps uploading and downloading the file periodically, even though I haven't changed those files.
[19:12] <jo-erlend> that file.
[19:14] <jo-erlend> the original file is gone, and I'm stuck with files named firstname.odt.u1conflict and firstname.odt.u1conflict.1 and .u2conflict.2
[19:14] <jo-erlend> what is going on? And I seriously hope those files actually contain my document?
[19:16] <jo-erlend> yes, the contents are safe. But this is fairly annoying. I worked in LibreOffice Writer and saved directly to my Ubuntu One folder. Is it possible that LibreOffice's autosave feature has caused some kind of syncloop?
[19:18] <jo-erlend> I was told that the file was synced, and it does appear on Ubuntu One on the web, but it's 0 bytes. This ain't good.
[19:24] <fagan> jo-erlend: when u1 conflict happens there are 2 different versions and it doesnt know which one is the right one
[19:24] <fagan> so they are like versions of the file
[19:24] <Ian_Corne> I'm getting Value could not be retrieved. (Unauthorized: ('unauthorized', 'Authentication required.'))
[19:25] <Ian_Corne> any quick fix?
[19:25] <fagan> jo-erlend: so open the files in libre office and check which one is the most complete and delete the others
[19:26] <fagan> jo-erlend: but your files are ok :)
[19:26] <fagan> Ian_Corne: where are you getting the error?
[19:26] <Ian_Corne> in the ubuntu-one interface
[19:26] <Ian_Corne> Ubuntu One Control Panel
[19:26] <fagan> Ian_Corne: what version of ubuntu are you on?
[19:26] <fagan> oh so natty then
[19:26] <Ian_Corne> in the services tab
[19:26] <Ian_Corne> yes
[19:26] <Ian_Corne> And i'm about to go the 11.10
[19:26] <fagan> give me a sec I need to check the bug list
[19:26] <Ian_Corne> but i wanted to sync some files first :)
[19:27] <Ian_Corne> ok :)
[19:27] <fagan> Ian_Corne: well there isnt much of a reason to go to 11.10 yet
[19:28] <Ian_Corne> I know
[19:28] <Ian_Corne> but I can't wait :D
[19:28] <fagan> Ian_Corne: well there arent any changes in there yet either :)
[19:28] <Ian_Corne> I know i should wait to alpha one..
[19:29] <Ian_Corne> or at least till the gnome3 packages are uploaded
[19:29] <fagan> Ian_Corne: I couldnt find any bug that explains that error are you on a clean natty install or do you have gnome 3 installed or something?
[19:29] <jo-erlend> fagan, in other words, you must never save files directly into Ubuntu One? That isn't good enough. :(
[19:30] <fagan> jo-erlend: I save over stuff all the time
[19:30] <fagan> jo-erlend: were you working on more than 1 computer or something?
[19:31]  * fagan cant remember if there was a problem with saving to files on a computer
[19:31] <fagan> (but it never caused me any issues)
[19:31] <jo-erlend> fagan, no, only one. I wrote something in LibreOffice Writer. It keeps autosaving the document, and I saved manually from time to time as well. My internet connection is somewhat variable in speed because of bad reception.
[19:31] <fagan> jo-erlend: ahh thats probably it
[19:32] <Ian_Corne> fagan: pretty clean install
[19:32] <Ian_Corne> and music syncing has worked
[19:32] <fagan> Ian_Corne: well then it might be that weird issue that I thought was fixed before release
[19:32] <jo-erlend> fagan, still can't recommend it if it depends on what application you use and what kind of internet connection, or the reception.
[19:33] <Ian_Corne> It seems to work now
[19:33] <fagan> Ian_Corne: it should be fine anyway
[19:33] <Ian_Corne> well
[19:33] <Ian_Corne> at least a bit
[19:33] <Ian_Corne> it says file sync in progress now
[19:33] <Ian_Corne> but the error message lingers
[19:34] <fagan> Ian_Corne: well the error seems to not be a problem but I cant reproduce it on my machine so I dont really know what to do
[19:35] <jo-erlend> I don't understand why new services keeps being added before the basic stuff actually works.
[19:35] <fagan> jo-erlend: well it just didnt know what to do with the different version of the file that was uploaded since it was trying to upload it so many times
[19:35] <fagan> jo-erlend: im sure there is a bug somewhere about it
[19:35] <Ian_Corne> I tried deleteing the folders as described here http://askubuntu.com/questions/39912/how-to-completely-reset-desktopcouch
[19:36] <Ian_Corne> aha i just go a notification that 2K files are being uploaded
[19:36] <Ian_Corne> But the connection seems flaky at best
[19:36] <fagan> Ian_Corne: cool so its working then
[19:36] <fagan> well there is a performence problem at the moment I think
[19:36] <jo-erlend> yes, I've tried Ubuntu One so many times, with great enthusiasm... I've _never_ been able to use it properly for any longer periods of time than an hour or two. Never. Such a shame.
[19:36] <Ian_Corne> maybe that's it
[19:37] <fagan> jo-erlend: well we try pretty hard to improve it release on release but its not perfect so all we can do it try our best to give the best service possable
[19:38] <fagan> jo-erlend: all I can suggest is copying the file to your share after your done with a version
[19:38] <fagan> (when working with an autosaving application
[19:38] <fagan> )
[19:39] <fagan> oh the performace problem is fixed
[19:39] <fagan> so it might be just your connection Ian_Corne
[19:40]  * fagan gets back to what he was doing
[19:45] <jo-erlend> I seriously hope it's time to stop adding new features to u1 soon, so we can get a cycle to harden it before 12.04 is released. Otherwise, I think it has to be removed from the default install unless Ubuntu really wants to destroy its own reputation. Being told that a file has been saved, when in fact nothing has been saved, can really have some quite destructive consequences.
[19:49] <fagan> jo-erlend: we are always hardening there are a lot less bugs and its a lot faster than it used to be. We do want to make it the best cloud platform around and that is a big goal
[19:49] <fagan> jo-erlend: the only thing I can say is we are working on it and hopefully it will get better in the future
[19:51] <jo-erlend> yes, but if it sometimes deletes -- or doesn't save -- your documents, then it doesn't really matter how fast it is. And stuff like that can kill a reputation. It doesn't matter much if Unity is nice if you can't trust that your files will be available. But it really _has to_ be perfect by 12.04.
[19:51] <jo-erlend> I'll see if I can find a good bug report, or file one. And I'll see if I can reproduce it in other instances too.
[19:53] <fagan> jo-erlend: well it did save them it just created copies because the one on the machine diverged from the one on your computer
[19:53] <fagan> since it was so slow to upload
[19:53] <jo-erlend> it saved the filename, but none of the content.
[19:53] <jo-erlend> 0 bytes.
[19:54] <jo-erlend> an instance like that could've gotten me fired if this was a business context.
[19:55] <fagan> jo-erlend: but there were versions with the content right?
[19:55] <jo-erlend> it seems to have refused any further updates after the initial save that gave it the filename, because the file already existed.
[19:55] <jo-erlend> fagan, none that were uploaded, no. Only the filename.
[19:55] <jo-erlend> it didn't delete stuff from my home computer. But the point is that it told me that it had uploaded new revisions onto my personal cloud and it hadn't. And I didn't get any error messages at all.
[19:56] <fagan> jo-erlend: but it did sync the proper version
[19:56] <fagan> ?
[19:56] <fagan> Go to the web interface and check if the file was actually uploaded
[19:57] <jo-erlend> actually... I wondered about that while I was writing. There was only one file in my Ubuntu One folder on my home computer. But as I wrote, I was told it synked 2 files, 3 files, etc. However, none of those conflict-files were uploaded.
[19:57] <jo-erlend> fagan, I have. There is only one file there, and it's 0 bytes.
[19:58] <jo-erlend> so... "Ubuntu lied to me" :)
[19:58] <jo-erlend> "My Ubuntu ate my paper!"
[19:58] <fagan> jo-erlend: oh so I think I know whats going on. You changed the file so many times it tried to reupload repeatedly and thats why there are so many versions
[19:59] <fagan> so every time it changed it stopped uploading and tried to upload the next version
[19:59] <jo-erlend> fagan, that's the default in Ubuntu, though, so that shouldn't happen.
[19:59] <jo-erlend> why doesn't Ubuntu One use bzr?
[19:59] <fagan> until it got confused :D
[19:59] <fagan> jo-erlend: it wouldnt make much sense to use bzr
[19:59] <jo-erlend> how come?
[20:00] <fagan> jo-erlend: well it would create a lot of overhead but there is something being done from what I remember of last weeks UDS sessions
[20:01] <fagan> I dont remember the details though
[20:01] <jo-erlend> fagan, but it did say it was sync-ing and it did confirm that it had been synced. If there are conflicts, then at least it should notify the user.
[20:02] <fagan> jo-erlend: it says syncing when it is doing it. Then it gives confirmation that its finished
[20:02] <jo-erlend> right.
[20:02] <jo-erlend> and it confirmed something that didn't happen.
[20:03] <fagan> jo-erlend: well it did finish but it started again because it needed to reupload because of the changes
[20:04] <fagan> jo-erlend: id say if the upload worked faster it wouldnt have happened id say
[20:04] <fagan> jo-erlend: sorry about the problem though
[20:05] <jo-erlend> fagan, then the u1 client only relies on inotify or something like that?
[20:05] <jo-erlend> hmm. Or maybe LibreOffice Writer actually does change the document with each autosave, even if the document haven't been changed in any way since the last autosave?
[20:06] <jo-erlend> in that case, I'd say that's probably a bug in LibreOffice as well?
[20:06] <fagan> jo-erlend: yeah it watches the folders and waits for changes and if there is a write it uploads
[20:06] <fagan> jo-erlend: id say it is just the two having issues with each other, libreoffice doing the autoupdate probably did the entire thing
[20:07] <fagan> jo-erlend: if you could make it save after longer periods it would fix it I think
[20:08] <jo-erlend> yes, but I'm concerned about less experienced users. I don't really recommend tweens for those, but still.
[20:10] <fagan> jo-erlend: well maybe we can fiddle with the default config of open office and turn down the duration a bit just in case people are on slower internet connections?
[20:11] <fagan> Ill look into it tomorrow and see what can be done
[20:11] <jo-erlend> fagan, any idea why LibreOffice should autosave a document that hasn't been changed since the last save?
[20:11] <jo-erlend> because if that is the issue, then the way I'd fix it, is to prevent LO from doing that. Seems pointless to me.
[20:11] <fagan> jo-erlend: it works on time not revisions I suppose
[20:13] <jo-erlend> fagan, yes, but that timeloop could check to see if the document has been changed in any way since the last save? I mean... That seems like a natural thing to do in any case. What if you store directly to a memory card and then go away for a week? When you come back, the card will have been overwritten so many times, it's no longer functional :)
[20:14] <fagan> jo-erlend: yeah id say LO could do it better so if you can fix it that would be awesome :)
[20:15] <jo-erlend> that is beyond my capabilities, I'm afraid. But I'm really good at nagging on about stuff, so I can give it a go in #documentfoundation :>
[20:15]  * rye is reading jo-erlend story...
[20:15] <jo-erlend> for all I know, there is a valid reason for it acting that way.
[20:16] <rye> file is not saved but notification says otherwise? hmmmm
[20:16] <fagan> rye is the perfect one to answer this jo-erlend
[20:17] <jo-erlend> nice!
[20:17]  * fagan is just applying his month and a half experience with u1 stuff :)
[20:18] <jo-erlend> fagan, oh. :)
[20:18] <fagan> jo-erlend: im an intern I was just presuming that everyone else was finished for the day so wanted to give an answer
[20:19] <kamusin> sorry for ask this folks but have any body seen to nessita?
[20:19] <jo-erlend> fagan, I appreciate it! :)
[20:19] <rye> bug #741165
[20:19] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 741165 in ubuntuone-client "Bubble notification states "successful upload" even if the file upload failed (affects: 1) (heat: 14)" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/741165
[20:20] <fagan> kamusin: she was at UDS but I presume there is some ubuflu going around so not here today
[20:20] <rye> jo-erlend, ^ that is the first part of the problem you have experienced
[20:20] <jo-erlend> rye, that's one of the issues.
[20:20] <jo-erlend> right.
[20:20] <jo-erlend> rye, did you get the other one?
[20:20]  * rye continues reading
[20:21] <kamusin> fagan, yeah.. I saw her at budapest..
[20:22] <fagan> kamusin: yeah id say check back tomorrow around 3PM UTC
[20:22] <fagan> kamusin: hopefully she will be around then :)
[20:23] <kamusin> excelent, by the way I have some bad user experiences with banshee and ubuntu one extension that really need atention, so if any u1 developer can help me I really appreciated
[20:23] <rye> jo-erlend, the other one was that the uploaded content was of size 0?
[20:24] <Ian_Corne> fagan: It's upto 80K files now
[20:24] <Ian_Corne> I guess it's just taking ages to look locate all the files
[20:24] <jo-erlend> rye, yes, that was the net result. None of the conflict files were made available.
[20:24] <Ian_Corne> evethough I have an ssd so it should be pretty fast
[20:24] <rye> jo-erlend, the .u1conflict files and folders are completely ignored by syncdaemon and they will not be uploaded
[20:25] <rye> jo-erlend, you are using 11.04 version, right?
[20:26] <fagan> kamusin: id say you should be talking to dobey instead then
[20:26] <rye> jo-erlend, are you now on the machine that had the files moved to *.u1conflict ?
[20:26] <jo-erlend> rye, in this case, I was actually considering just picking up my laptop and just leave the house, since I knew it was saved and uploaded onto u1, and I was told that everything was fine. In this case, that would just be extremely annoying, but in a business context... You can't tell your boss that your computer ate your homework. :)
[20:26] <fagan> nessita doesnt handle the banshee plugin
[20:26] <jo-erlend> rye, I am using 11.04, yes. And all updates are installed. And I am on that computer, yes.
[20:26] <fagan> Ian_Corne: it should have no issue finding the files
[20:26] <rye> jo-erlend, eeexactly, raising the priority and will start poking thisfred about this (Eric)
[20:27] <Ian_Corne> fagan: issues as in, doing it slowly :p
[20:27] <Ian_Corne> or maybe it's just failing every seconds and restarting and that's why it's taking so long
[20:27] <Ian_Corne> I don't know :)
[20:27] <fagan> rye: any idea what Ian_Corne's problem is?
[20:27] <Ian_Corne> is there a special log i could check?
[20:28] <kamusin> fagan, I see, any way I need to talk with her ;)
[20:28] <Ian_Corne> I'm on a pretty backbone unfirewalled connection
[20:28] <fagan> kamusin: cool anyway :D
[20:29] <rye> Ian_Corne, the log is at ~/.cache/ubuntuone/log/syncdaemon.log
[20:29] <rye> jo-erlend, could you please grep the ~/.cache/ubuntuone/log/*.log* for the name of the file and whether there are related DOES_NOT_EXIST entries?
[20:30] <jo-erlend> rye, you mean the document name? There is no log file for it.
[20:31] <jo-erlend> oh...I actually deleted those conflict-files and replaced it with the final version.
[20:31] <jo-erlend> what I can do, though, is to recreate it. That's useful in any case.
[20:32] <rye> jo-erlend, basically you were editing a file and it kept generating the conflicts, right?
[20:32] <jo-erlend> rye, right.
[20:32] <rye> jo-erlend, this bug #718924 was about this type of behavior
[20:32] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 718924 in ubuntuone-client (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "self conflict while saving the same file a lot (affects: 3) (dups: 2) (heat: 112)" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/718924
[20:33] <fagan> nice see this is why rye is so much better to ask questions to :D
[20:34] <jo-erlend> oh... Is u1 written in Python?
[20:34] <fagan> jo-erlend: yep
[20:34] <fagan> and a bit in C
[20:34] <jo-erlend> perhaps I can be of some use anyway then. :)
[20:34] <fagan> and a bit in Vala
[20:35] <fagan> I think im about done for the day :)
[20:35] <jo-erlend> ok, I need a break and then I'll try to recreate it.
[20:35] <fagan> ralsina: if you see my pm ill get back to you tomorrow about it
[22:25] <Ian_Corne> It's upto 120K files discovered already :)
[22:25] <Ian_Corne> It's also using 60% of my ram...
[22:25] <Ian_Corne> and 100% cpu
[22:26] <Ian_Corne> rye: if you're something with this information ^
[22:59] <jo-erlend> firefox bookmark sync still doesn't seem to be working?