/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/05/24/#ubuntu-uk.txt

AlanBelldogmatic69_: also throw in power consumption and upgradeability to your calculations00:01
dogmatic69_upgradeabillity?00:04
dogmatic69_power not an issue really00:04
dogmatic69_got a 800w(ish) power supply00:04
BigRedSif you just want speed, rather than buying twice the number of disks, just get a faster one00:05
AlanBellI guess with SSDs the power doesn't change when they are being used or not used00:06
dogmatic69_some redundancy is also good00:06
AlanBellwith spinning disks in a raid they can't really spin down00:06
dogmatic69_but i wonder how much its needed if the ~/ is in something like synology00:06
BigRedSyeah, but I'd rather 1 fast disk, 1 slow disk and a nightly rsync to two slow disks in raid00:06
BigRedSassumign you can cope with losing everything since the last rsync n the event of disk failure00:07
BigRedSbut a raid will faithfully duplicate Bad Things anyway, so even with raid you'll have a backup00:07
dogmatic69_hmm, so need backups even with a synology box00:10
dogmatic69_backups for the backups :S00:10
BigRedSwell 'need' is perhaps a bit strong, but raid isn't backup00:10
BigRedSraid is redundancy00:10
BigRedSif you accidentally delete half the contents of your raid, it's instantly deleted. That's what backups are for00:11
BigRedSRaid is for when a disk fails but you need the system to stay up00:11
BigRedSraid *mostly* fulfils the criteria for backup in the event of hardware failure, but user error is way more common00:12
dogmatic69_ah, right00:13
dogmatic69_so im on the correct path, as ive read that SSD's die for nothing00:13
dogmatic69_well, all the time i mean00:13
BigRedSeither way, though, you're never going to completely make everything safe, so you need to just pick sme amount of backup/redundancy that you want00:14
BigRedSyeah, I've heard they tend to go without warning00:14
dogmatic69_and it would just be a pita to reinstall everything every few months (read about 11 months is the average)00:14
* dogmatic69_ has never had backups00:14
BigRedSmm, I'd be surprised if it's not gone up more recently00:15
BigRedSI gather they're gaining reliability at quite a pace00:15
BigRedSISTR there's two flavours, too, a cheap way of doing it and a reliable way. the cheap way is in all the consumer kit, the reliable way is about twice the cost and sold to server people00:15
dogmatic69_so is there something similar to that mac backup thingy00:17
BigRedStime machine?00:17
dogmatic69_ye, thats it00:17
dogmatic69_cd / && git init00:17
dogmatic69_:D00:17
BigRedSLVM snapshotting is teh closest I can think of, or version control00:18
BigRedShaha, yeah00:18
dogmatic69_lol, people do that?00:18
BigRedSversion control? yeah. of /etc/ and /home isn't uncommon00:18
BigRedSOh. Time machine is just a cronned backup00:19
dogmatic69_crontab -e -> 59 23 * * * cd /&& git add . -m `date...`00:19
BigRedSruns hourly, creating hardlinks for existing files etc.00:19
dogmatic69_and push obviously :P00:19
BigRedSso any backup app should do that00:19
dogmatic69_ye, but it does only changes, keeps hourly for the day, daily for the last week, weekly for the last month and monthly till the backup drive is full00:20
BigRedSyeah, that's not an uncommon way for a backup thing to work00:21
BigRedSespecially something user-friendly00:21
BigRedSi don't know of any off the top of my head, though00:21
BigRedSand I've just noticed the time; I should be asleep by now really00:22
dogmatic69_k00:22
dogmatic69_would be awesome if it was time machine compatible as that synology thing just works out the box for time machine00:22
dogmatic69_think i will def get one of them, the one at work is awesome00:23
dogmatic69_4x 3TB drives for 9TB00:23
dogmatic69_you can mix and match with the hybrid RAID they do00:23
BigRedSyeah, didn't drobo do similar?00:23
dogmatic69_and it apparently as an 'apt-get' type repository00:24
dogmatic69_ye, but i think they are more web2.0 for the cool kids00:24
BigRedSoh for installing add-ons?00:24
BigRedShaha00:24
BigRedSoh yeah, there's an 'apps' bit of their site00:24
BigRedSvery 2.000:24
dogmatic69_ye, it runs a slim version of *nix00:24
dogmatic69_the synology one that is00:25
dogmatic69_and the web GUI is very awesome, mad cgi skills00:25
BigRedSyeah, I assume pretty much everything's running a linux kernel these days00:25
BigRedSI'm normally right :)00:25
dogmatic69_hehe00:25
dogmatic69_at least its not in a JAVA vm :S00:26
BigRedShaha00:26
dogmatic69_binned the android last week00:26
BigRedSwhat've you replaced it with/00:27
dogmatic69_iPhone4 :D00:28
dogmatic69_<300:28
BigRedShaha00:28
dogmatic69_sooo much better00:28
dogmatic69_and it goes nicely with my ipad :P00:28
BigRedSthere's some BSD in there :)00:28
* dogmatic69_ checks on the mac mini update00:28
dogmatic69_but... ubuntu stays ;)00:29
BigRedShaha00:29
BigRedSAnyway, sleep. that's what I need to do :)00:29
BigRedSI keep getting distracted...00:29
dogmatic69_same00:30
dogmatic69_almost 1am00:30
BigRedSeek00:30
BigRedSrighto, I'm actually off now00:31
dogmatic69_tx for the help00:31
BigRedSpft, no probs00:31
ali1234ever since i put 16gb in my computer ubuntu just flies02:54
ali1234it's great02:54
ali1234it never ever goes slow02:54
ali1234especially firefox really shows a difference02:55
ali1234the difference between 4gb and 16gb is like night and day02:55
gingreally? what do you run on it?02:56
ali1234oh you know02:56
ali1234ubuntu02:56
ali1234firefox02:56
ali1234pidgin02:56
ali1234that's about it02:56
gingdoes it have several gigs of cached memory?02:56
ali1234sure02:56
ali123411GB02:56
gingthats crazy02:57
ali1234i know02:57
ali1234i suspect the large part of the problem is the way firefox caches everything in ram and in disk02:57
ali1234as i explained before02:57
ali1234i suspect that means that everything in firefox's disk cache ends up in ram due to filesystem caching02:58
ali1234and then firefox's ram cache gets swapped out due to swappiness02:58
gingthere is 11gigs of stuff going in in your computer which you have no idea about02:58
ali1234no, it's filesystem cache02:58
gingyour computer is plotting against you in there, any day now it will figure away to reroute mains into your keyboard02:59
ali1234only 3.5gb is really used02:59
ali1234http://pastebin.com/2jZndW2502:59
ali12348gb would probably be enough03:00
ali1234but sometimes i like to run VMs as well03:00
ali1234that stuff about ddr using 15w/gb is completely false btw03:00
gingyou have 32gig of swap?03:01
ali1234yes03:01
gingi think the rule of thumb for having 2x as much swap as memory went out the window when pcs started to get memory in gigabytes03:02
ali1234when i had 4gb03:03
ali1234i quite often saw up to 12gb and more of swap in use03:03
ali1234due to badly written programs03:03
ali1234that's why i have 32gb03:03
ali1234and it's why i know have 16gb ram too03:03
ali1234my next project will be to build a quiet cooling system for my new uber video card, on the cheap03:05
ali1234i'm thinking removing the onboard fan, replace with 2x 120mm case fans, some ducting, and a t piece03:06
gingi just cleared half my ram by killing hardware monitor03:09
ali1234haha03:09
ali1234yes, on maverick?03:09
ali1234gnome-system-monitor?03:09
gingno it's lucid03:12
ali1234ah even worse03:13
gingand it was system monitor 1.4.203:13
ali1234i got that bug fixed upstream03:13
ali1234it's fixed in natty03:13
ali1234g-s-m polls a lot of dbus calls03:13
ali1234and then never frees the responses it gets, ever03:13
ali1234the filesystems tab is particularly bad03:13
ali1234*polled03:14
gingwell it did when i killed it03:14
ali1234&was03:14
ali1234etc03:14
ali1234it's fixed now03:14
ali1234yeah killing it will free the memory of course :)03:14
gingfor ages i had been wondering why my memory seemed to get worse over time03:14
gingeveryone telling me no linux doesnt need to be restarted it should run forever without problems, well mine kept slowing down after a week or 203:15
ali1234yeah that doesn't apply to gnome03:16
gingnow how do i get it to drop it's swap back into memory?03:17
ali1234turn off all swap partition :)03:18
ali1234i'm looking at air conditioning stuff on b&q03:26
ali1234it's amazing, idk why people don't use it to cool computers more03:26
ali1234a lot of it is the perfect size for computer bays03:27
gingi see no things of such size03:59
gingwhen i own my own house aircondition is going to be high on my list of things to get installed04:00
gingpeople who say oh it's never that hot in this country we dont need it mah mah mah mah mah, should try living a day in august as a ginger04:01
ali1234i have to leave my windows open and heating off pretty much all year because of computers04:26
MartijnVdSmorning all06:45
AlanBello/07:00
popeymorning all07:35
AlanBello/07:36
awilkinsAnyone know where I can get recordings of the video streams of yesterdays Public Accounts Committee on the NHS IT programme?08:00
awilkinsDidn't find out it was going on until I was trapped on a train.08:00
AlanBellawilkins: yes08:02
AlanBellI downloaded the whole thing it is an epic08:02
awilkinsSo I heard (disclaimer ; I work for NPfIT)08:03
AlanBellhttp://www.twofourdigital.net/UKParliament/Archive/0000016153.wmv.asx08:03
AlanBellparticularly enjoyed the BT bloke blaming the existence of facebook and twitter for their management failure08:04
awilkinsAha Aha Aha.08:04
awilkinsDoes it start off silent? Or do I just not have the right codecs for Totem?08:04
AlanBell3 minutes of silence08:05
awilkinsI shall change players and dump the stream to disk anyway, methinks08:05
AlanBellI used vlc08:05
AlanBellin act 2 they explain how it was a total disaster from the start, they have billions left to spend and it would be cheaper to spend the billions than cancel the contract08:06
AlanBellbecause CSC and BT don't think they are in breach of contract so might sue the NHS if they cancel08:06
* awilkins thinks it's all utterly mental08:08
diplomorning all08:08
awilkinsThe NHS are large enough as an entity to create any kind of enterprise they require for support from scratch, so why go to a profit-seeking contractor...08:09
AlanBellthey deployed 130+ interim systems that were previously declared unfit for purpose, because they couldn't build the one they were contracted to build08:09
awilkinsOoooh, it's *already* really good.08:16
awilkinsTotal squirming by this bloke when told "Back in 2003, as professionals you might have taken the view that this was undeliverable"08:17
awilkinsIt's like the Apprentice, but I give a toss08:17
AlanBellthe bloke is BT, the American lady is CSC08:17
AlanBellgreat bit at about 1 hour 20 when they stumble onto the subject of security claims over patient records08:20
awilkinsI have an interest there... I've got what I think is a partially workable design that might sort-of-work08:23
AlanBellthey explain that the clinician will ask the patient for permission to access the medical records08:23
AlanBell"what if the paitent says no"08:24
AlanBellerrr . . . . errr . . . .08:24
awilkinsIn my system, if the patient says no, the doctor doesn't get access to their medical record08:25
AlanBellhow does the patient enforce that?08:25
awilkinsAnd that's enforced cryptographically08:25
AlanBellso does the patient have a PIN or smartcard or something?08:26
awilkinsSmartcard, I would think08:26
MartijnVdSHow does the patient enforce that if he's dying after being hit by a bus?08:26
MartijnVdSand his smartcard was crushed08:26
AlanBellok, that is basically the question the PAC asked, if the patient has no portion of the key they can't say no08:26
awilkinsMartijnVdS, Well, I think that position is an extreme anyway... but this sort of question is useful08:26
AlanBellpersonally I think the GP should hold the keys08:27
awilkinsMartijnVdS, Really, in the "card crushed by a bus" scenario you are no worse off than default08:27
MartijnVdSawilkins: It's the most important one. I want people to know my medical history if they want to revive me after an accident :)08:27
awilkinsMartijnVdS, Then you would not be one of the people withholding all your medical records from doctors, presumably08:28
MartijnVdSawilkins: Maybe in non-accident circumstances, I would be08:28
awilkinsMartijnVdS, My system does provide for differential access levels (again, crypto enforced)08:28
awilkinsSo you could have a summary sheet that detailed things people need to know if you're hit by a bus (allergies, etc) but keep the details of your infatuation with goats locked in your psych records08:29
MartijnVdSsure08:29
MartijnVdSbut what if I'm hit by a bus while .. exercising .. my infatuation with a goat ;)08:30
awilkinsI think the goat will just have to pray that his BUPA premiums are up to date08:30
TheOpenSourcererMorning earthlings.08:31
MartijnVdS\o TheOpenSourcerer08:31
scumbagAfternoon08:32
awilkinsAlanBell, I agree with keyholders only being parties with what's called a "Legitimate Relationship" (LR) in the trade.08:32
awilkinsAlanBell, Specifically, by default, you naturally have a key to any record you create, and the patient and the record creator initially negotiate on how open their record will be (keys signed by GP practice, keys signed by trust, etc)08:33
* TheOpenSourcerer fires up his WinXP and OS X VMs to test a new Joomla! module he wrote last night.08:35
* TheOpenSourcerer grumbles about having to have a Win 7 VM soon so he can test with IE 9 & beyond... He reminds AlanBell about the licenses we have.08:39
TheAshManHow much of a pain in the arse is it to install Ubuntu on a iMac?08:39
TheOpenSourcererTheAshMan: Dunno popey will probably know though.08:40
TheAshManI imagine it wouldn't be too bad, being *nix an'all08:40
DJonesI seem to remember reading that there can be some major problems with certain mac's08:41
TheAshManhmm :/08:41
awilkinsTry a LiveThumb and see what the hardware support is like08:42
TheAshManawilkins: Good idea!08:43
diploAny one know who wrote a blog post about using Quicklists with ssh ? I read it a week or two ago but can't seem to find it atm08:44
awilkinshttp://castrojo.tumblr.com/post/4536294249/more-quicklists  ?08:45
diplolooking now ta08:45
diploMy google foo seems to have taken a tumble recently08:45
diplothat's the one, cheers awilkins08:46
diplo!08:46
TheOpenSourcererIt takes all sorts... http://www.massterra.com/08:48
DJonesTheOpenSourcerer: From a quick companies house search "The 30.06.10 accounts indicate that the company is either dormant or no longer08:49
DJonestrades.trades08:49
TheOpenSourcererI can't say I am surprised... Bet he didn't get many cheques.08:49
TheOpenSourcererIt would cost £1,680,000 to send me into space at his prices. :-D08:50
TheOpenSourcererEx. VAT I assume.08:50
DJonesNo, looks as though its never traded08:51
=== OmNomDeBonBon is now known as RaycisCharles
DJonesIt might depend, a lot of public transport costs are vat exempt, ferrys etc, is there any difference to this?08:51
AlanBell"other bodily fluids" um, eww!08:52
DJones How you will be involved in space travel will be explained once you have completed a confidentiality agreement which you must sign and return to us by post.08:53
MooDoohello08:56
popeymoo08:57
MooDoo:D08:58
popeyOoo, next version of the Linux Kernel might be 2.8.0 or 3.009:09
DJonesAh well, that'll be nvidia not working for about 12 months :)09:10
BigRedSmm. and there's (again) talk of 2011.x.y and the like09:12
MartijnVdSwhat is this? Gentoo?09:12
BigRedSwhich I'm not sure I like, but I don't know why. I think I just can't see the kernel *not* being 2.x.x09:12
popeymorning kazade09:16
TheAshManOooo, popey, I've been told you're the person to ask about install ubuntu on an iMac09:16
popeyO RLY09:16
popey!mac09:16
lubotu3For help on installing and using Ubuntu on a mac, see: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MactelSupportTeam/CommunityHelpPages09:17
TheAshManlol09:17
TheAshManTa!09:17
kazademorning popey09:17
wintellect:(  Installed Kubuntu on a spare box - but I get a blank screen every time I logout. The cli or KDM never return :'(09:30
wintellectGot a Radeon X30009:30
wintellectI'm assuming it's an X issue09:30
oimontry alt-sysrq-K09:30
DJoneshttp://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/05/24/twitter_tweetdeck/ Shame they don't mention any source for the story09:31
wintellectoimon: which key is "sysrq"?09:31
MartijnVdSwintellect: print screen (read the key :))09:31
oimonwintellect: it's near/on print screen09:31
wintellectMartijnVdS: and oimon:  Ahhh09:31
gordhttp://blog.jitbit.com/2011/05/what-if-drivers-were-hired-like.html ¬_¬09:32
wintellectoimon: presumably that's a "lowercase" K and not a shift-k, right?09:32
oimonwintellect: don't try it until yuo experience the problem or it will kill your current X session09:32
oimonyep09:32
wintellectok09:32
wintellectwill try at lunchtime - much appreciated09:32
wintellectOOC - what does that key combination do? Reset X?09:33
MartijnVdSwintellect: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic_SysRq_key09:33
wintellectthanks MartijnVdS09:33
oimonyes, effectively, kills all processes on the virtual console, so you should get a gdm/kdm /login09:33
MartijnVdSI had a different issue today09:34
oimonwioll prob need to do ctrl-alt-sysrq-k actually09:34
MartijnVdSMoved my mouse to get the screen to turn back on.. and it turned back on09:34
MartijnVdSbut it was black, all I could see was my mouse pointer (which changed shape as I moved over the different windows)09:34
MartijnVdSCtrl+Alt+F1 -> still worked09:34
bigcalmGood morning peeps :)09:34
MartijnVdS\o bigcalm09:34
bigcalmHi MartijnVdS09:35
czajkowskiAloha09:35
bigcalmczajkowski: *hugs* :)09:35
* MooDoo prods czajkowski just because he's not done it in awile 09:38
bigcalmWould that be a cattle prod?09:38
* czajkowski stabs MooDoo 09:38
* MooDoo hugs czajkowski 09:38
MooDoo:D09:38
wintellectoimon: if that key combination fixes it - os there anything I can do to resolve my issue - or is that key combination the "fix" until a new release of X?09:38
wintellects/os/is09:38
oimonwintellect: dunno, i was just offering a workaround until the helpful #kubuntu or #radeon people can help you :D09:39
oimonis #radeon even a room?09:39
wintellectapparently, it is09:40
DJonesWhy when I use a machine and the gui update manager to check for updates does it say there are no updates, but when I ssh into the same machine it says there are 86 updates?10:13
bigcalmDJones: you could have a stale /etc/motd10:16
DJonesPossibly, been doing it for about a week, but just used vnc & ssh to check for updates and seems to have cured it10:17
bigcalmGoodo10:17
dogmatic69DJones: i just use terminal update now, also have issues with the gui10:19
DJonesdogmatic69: If it does it again, I'll have to try that10:20
dogmatic69DJones: i have issues with jenkins, would not update in gui because the repo was not trusted or something10:21
dogmatic69in terminal it has a 'are you sure' question which the gui does not handle10:21
dogmatic69so it just stops everything, then you got to scroll through the list, untick it and go again :/10:22
DJonesuntrusted repo is normally that it doesn't have a ppa's key etc, but I gues if a specific repo doesn't have a key it can never get one10:23
=== denny- is now known as denny
AlanBellawilkins: enjoy the rest of it?10:25
awilkinsAlanBell, Still watching, in fits and starts, but it's very amusing so far10:27
awilkinsI think the government suffers from the habit of going with big industry because that's what works for procurements which produce material objects10:30
awilkinsThey need to get the hang of the idea that you can just conjure software out of the aether so you don't need people with huge capital to produce it (and that may actually work against them).10:31
awilkinsI mean, what huge software company has actually innovated in a way that didn't involve buying some smart startup (or being a smart startup in the first place)?10:31
AlanBelltotally true10:32
awilkinsInfrastructure - yes. But TBH, the infrastructure is bobbins10:32
kazadeAHA! Just bought a Sega Master System 2 on Ebay :D10:32
awilkinsN3 (the NHS segregated network) has a total of 30Mbit/s symmetric as a gateway to the greater internet (AFAIK). Utterly inadequate.10:33
AlanBelland you can see them in the PAC talking about Rio and saying it is perfectly reasonable to pay 1M/hospital for it, they are questioning why it cost 8.9M/hospital10:33
awilkinsyes, just got to that bit10:33
awilkinsNHS Mail - they moved from Samsung Contact to Exchange10:34
gordkazade, my megadrive is *superior* to your sega master system!10:34
gordsorry, i got flashes of being 10 years old again10:34
awilkinsSo we went from being able to read out mail over IMAP to either using Outlook or the crappy web portal10:34
awilkinsAnd you have a 200MB mailbox limit and the search blows chunks10:34
awilkinsWhy why why, if Google can give me free gratis for nothing, 8GB of mail space and a search that goes -pchow!- , for nothing but the privilege of data mining my loathsome ramblings for adverts I never view... why wouldn't you just bung them £50 a year per user and have a million-man email system that actually works well....10:36
awilkinsAnd Office - we chucked the NHS-wide enterprise contract for Office licenses10:36
AlanBellthe cabinet office chucked that10:36
AlanBellit was on the wrong budget10:37
awilkinsPresumably Office costs us in excess of 10s of millions of quid a year in licensing.10:37
AlanBellyup10:37
awilkinsFor a few percent of that you could hire several full time C++ developers to work on LibreOffice.10:37
awilkinsAnd a few more Pythonistas to migrate horrific old VBA macros to Python10:38
AlanBellyup10:38
oimonawilkins: " And Office - we chucked the NHS-wide enterprise contract for Office licenses"10:55
oimonwhat do you mean? you got rid of office? or paid microsoft for a site licence thingy10:55
awilkinsoimon, We had an agreement that covered enterprise-wide use of MS Office in the NHS10:56
awilkinsoimon, This was cancelled and now trusts have to negotiate their own licenses10:56
brobostigongood morning everyone.10:56
oimonoh i see10:56
awilkinsoimon, Also, NHS staff were previously allowed Office to use at home at Cost of Media as a perk - this is no longer the case10:57
oimonawilkins: my Uni is going the opposite way - about to pay MS for a campus agreement every year...10:57
oimonthe problem is, 70% or more of my dept use openoffice rather than MS products,10:57
awilkinsoimon, MS loves that kind of thing10:57
oimonthey are microsftising the whole campus against the staff wishes10:58
awilkinsoimon, As does any corporate entity - they love getting their brand and products into educational settings10:58
BigRedSyeah, get people to learn your thing while they still want to learn something, see if you can have them not bother to learn anybody else's10:58
BigRedSdidn't Adobe almost publicly state that their market share is grounded in students pirating their software?10:59
awilkinsI'm sure it is10:59
DJonesHow does this seem spec & prcie wise, I know its not offering android 3.0, but seems reasonable http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/10-2-Android-2-1-EPAD-TABLET-PC-ZT-180-e-reader-UK-/12065602121510:59
BigRedSActually, this was pre-macromedia-purchase. I suspect Flash on its own gets them a lot of CS license sales10:59
awilkinsIf they made their DRM scheme actually hard to break, two things would happen i) Students wouldn't use it as much ii) Much more work would be done on the OSS products in the same niche11:00
awilkinsFrom an educational POV, I think proprietary products have so much less utility for learning because you can't poke around in their innards11:00
BigRedSyeah. And if students stop falling out of uni fluent in Adobe, their employers will use whatever it is that the students found to replace for free11:01
davmor2morning ubuntu-ukers11:01
awilkinsI can understand it in trade schools, because you can successfully argue that these products are what they will use at work11:01
mrwarmthmorning11:01
* davmor2 prods czajkowski 11:01
DJonesMorning mrwarmth11:01
BigRedSawilkins: I think that's true for compting students, but I'm not sure there's much an art student will gain specifically from the freedom of Inkscape/GIMP/whatever over the prop. equivalents11:01
BigRedSfor example11:01
* czajkowski puts davmor2 on the step, shhhh 11:02
BigRedS(except being able to have their own copy with no issues, which is a *massive* win at uni(11:02
davmor2czajkowski: no :P11:02
oimonhere's how it went at my employer: consultant says this is what you need, although i don't know anything about how the university works. uni boss says OK.11:02
BigRedSyeah, that's unis trying to emulate business :(11:02
awilkinsBigRedS, Possibly not ; the flipside is that Inkscape/GIMP/Whatever would gain massively from having the input of a whole bunch of art students, even if it's just constructive criticism11:02
awilkinsPossibly helping them to eclipse the commercial products11:03
oimonDJones: lacking in RAM methinks11:03
BigRedSawilkins: yeah, that's partly why I want more unis to use free software11:04
BigRedS'cause I want ranty students filing bug reports that make it better11:04
BigRedSbut I don't think it's easy to explain the direct benefits to the students. Especially the ones who don't want to rant about software11:05
DJonesoimon: Yes, but seems upgradable with sd cards (At least thats what the "TF card" seems to be, although never heard of TF card before11:05
oimonalso, "Extended: TF card, U disk" - not sure what this means, but external storage is crucial too11:05
awilkinsTiny Flash ?  :-)11:06
DJonesoimon: TF = Transflash11:06
DJonesOriginal name for MicroSD from what I can read11:06
oimonlol11:07
oimonglad they changed the name11:07
mrwarmthI'm calling them that from now on11:08
FND_g'day all - my new laptop has a Sandy Bridge CPU, which apparently isn't fully supported yet in 11.04 (noisy fan, plus Ubuntu froze on me just now)11:19
FND_what's the easiest way to get the latest kernel (2.6.39)?11:20
popeyhttp://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/11:20
BigRedSoooh. that *is* easy11:20
FND_thanks - I remember looking into that PPA a while ago, but it didn't work as I'd expected11:21
FND_I guess I should use rc4-natty rather than rc7-oneiric?11:23
BigRedSelse, I suspect that the 'debian way' will work just as well under Ubuntu11:23
FND_oh right, I remember why that PPA wasn't good enough - it doesn't provide PAE kernels11:24
FND_BigRedS: what's the Debian way - compiling it manually?11:24
BigRedSnah, it's in-between that and a PPA11:25
BigRedSyou use kernel-package to make a .deb out of your source11:25
BigRedSoh, but it requires that the source package for the version you want be in the repo11:26
BigRedSwhich isn't what you want11:26
BigRedSI forget we're not all luddites :)11:26
FND_so ... basically, there is no easy way then?11:26
BigRedSwell, building your own isn't that hard11:27
BigRedSyou could, presumably, get the source from that ppa and build it the debian way from that?11:27
BigRedSassuming they provide sources11:27
DJonesHeh, a work colleague has just said that her daughter was given a spelling test at school yesterday...the list of words they had to spell was given to them typed on a sheet of paper11:27
FND_do you have a link that describes the procedure, BigRedS?11:27
mrwarmthDJones, lol11:28
BigRedSFND_: http://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/notes/debian/kernel-build.html looks about right11:28
FND_thank you11:29
mrwarmthBigRedS, would adding this ppa work? https://launchpad.net/~kernel-ppa/+archive/ppa11:29
mrwarmthI did something similar a while ago but I can't remember properly, but it worked11:30
BigRedSOoh, that expects vanilla kernels. I suppose there's no reason to need the repo ones, you just don't get the Debian/Ubuntu patches that way. But there's no way to get debian/ubuntu patches on .39 yet11:30
FND_are those patches significant?11:30
FND_mrwarmth: that PPA doesn't provide PAE kernels AFAICT11:30
FND_also, it only goes up to RC4 for Natty11:31
selinuxiumHi all   o/11:31
BigRedSFND_: Occasionally :) I've lost track, I've not felt the need for a non-repo kernel in a long while11:31
FND_I guess I'll look into building the kernel from scratch - grub should make it easy to revert to the official one if needed11:31
=== FND_ is now known as FND
BigRedSyeah, just boot from the other one11:32
FNDactually11:32
FNDI might as well try the Natty RC4 one before I go off building my own11:33
FNDit might be Good Enough until Oneiric is released11:33
BigRedSFND: what are you actually setting out to acheive?11:33
FNDa) quiet the fan b) not have another freeze like before11:34
BigRedSIs this a learning excercise/just wanting new shiny things, or is there something particilar in the new kernels that you want?11:34
selinuxiumHi guys... I keep losing the task bar icon for my internet/wireless connection..11:34
selinuxiumWhat process is this?11:34
FNDthe 2.6.39 has proper support for Sandy Bridge CPUs, BigRedS - so I expect things will be more smooth there11:35
DJonesselinuxium: Isn't it nm-applet11:36
mrwarmthselinuxium, do you mean the applet in the tray? I *think* it's nm-applet11:36
selinuxiumcheers guys11:36
BigRedSFND: Ahh, well, it's worth a try I suppose, but I'd expect the ubuntu/debian patched kernels to be more stable11:40
=== selinuxium_ is now known as selinuxium
selinuxiumnm-applet still buggy for me..11:41
selinuxiumconnection made then loose icon...11:41
oimonFND which processor do you have?11:41
BigRedStry restarting network-manager?11:41
FNDBigRedS: I'm just about to install http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/v2.6.39-rc4-natty/11:41
BigRedS/etc/init.d/network-manager restart11:41
BigRedSfixes so many network problems for me11:41
BigRedS(short term)11:41
selinuxiumnetwork working, icon keeps failing..11:41
BigRedSFND: aha, that looks suitable11:42
FNDoimon: Intel Core i7-2620M 2,7GHz11:42
BigRedSselinuxium: hm, bit more peculiar. You can start nm-applet in an xterm and see what it says when it exits?11:42
oimonFND: is the processor basically supported but not th egraphics ?11:42
FNDoimon: I don't know - I have read though that Sandy Bridge chips are much better supported in 2.6.3911:43
FNDFWIW, I don't have a dedicated GPU, just the integrated Intel GMA HD300011:44
oimoni'm about to buy a load of sandy bridge machines...looks like i'll need to do some serious testing on an initial device first then11:44
FNDwell, everything works fine - it's just that the fan control appears suboptimal, plus the freezing I mentioned (happened twice in two days, but that might just be Ubuntu being shit ;) )11:46
oimonFND: i'll be using them with RHEL/SL linux so i think i have to wait until SL 6.1 is out11:46
FNDwell, good luck11:48
oimonyeah ..centos 6.0 is not even out yet!11:48
FNDrebooting to test this kernel, brb11:49
BigRedSin Firefox, if I type abcd:efghij it assumes that 'abcd' is a protocol with which to access efghij. Shouldn't it check for a :// rather than a : ?11:49
AlanBellno11:49
AlanBellhttp is the about the only protocol that has // at the start, I have no idea why it does11:50
BigRedSOh, I thought that was something of a de-facto 'standard' that HTTP started and everybody followed11:51
BigRedSbah11:51
AlanBellhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/URI_scheme11:51
kazadegord, I've got a MD2 and Dreamcast... just need a Saturn to complete the set :)11:52
* BigRedS resigns himself to copying "Error:....." search terms into teh actual search box :(11:52
oimonctrl-K jumps to the search box on firefox & chromium11:52
BigRedSyeah11:53
AlanBellok, so some start with // and some don't. Possibly to do with whether they are hierachical11:53
BigRedSbut ctrl-L is heavily ingrained in my muscle memory11:53
gordkazade, md2? eww11:53
BigRedS(and ctrl-t leaves you with the address bar focused)11:53
dogmatic69BigRedS: that gets me all the time too, chrome is a bit more smart about that though11:53
Laneyyes it indicates that the path is hierarchical11:53
BigRedSI'm just looking to see if there's a way to explicitly set all the protocols I want Firefox to think it can handle11:54
BigRedSand if it can't handle, say 'error:', just search for it11:54
BigRedSwell, the former's done, it's the latter I'd like to be possible11:54
dogmatic69sudo apt-get install googlechrome :)11:54
DJonesdogmatic69: s/googlechrome/chromium-browser :)11:55
BigRedSbut I want my add-ons! :)11:56
FNDwell, everything still seems to work - except the bluetooth mouse, which isn't tragic11:57
oimoni wonder how many minecraft inspired games we'll get over the next 5 years? http://www.terraria.org/ <<11:58
DJonesThat reminds me more of Lemmings11:59
gordinspired is a generous word to use ;)11:59
oimonlooking at the oggcamp list...there's a whole lot of people going11:59
bigcalmNow all they need are some people to speak12:00
BigRedSoh yeah, that'd probably help...12:03
oimonstill haven't seen the vids from oggcamp2010..12:05
AlanBellvids from oggcamp 2011 will be up *fast*12:05
oimon:D12:05
kazadegord, I'm rebuilding my childhood collection, I'm buying the exact same versions of everything I had when I was a kid (before I foolishly sold them off!)12:07
mrwarmthDJones, does chromium-browser do bookmark syncing like google-chrome?12:07
kazadegord, So, SMS2, MD2, Saturn, Dreamcast (only missing the Saturn now)12:08
DJonesmrwarmth: yes it does12:08
mrwarmthDJones, I'm switching now!12:08
DJonesmrwarmth: I use it rather than installing the 3rd party repo for the official google chrome12:08
mrwarmthDJones, yes I don't like doing that either, plus all the chrome store stuff is kind of annoying12:09
screen-xGood afternoon ubuntu-uk people :)12:17
brobostigonafternoonings screen-x12:19
mrwarmthafternoon, screen-x12:20
dogmatic69o/12:26
* oimon wonders why the 80 or so superinjunctions aren't listed on wikileaks?13:00
MooDoooimon: who cares lol13:01
oimonMooDoo: i would have thought wikileaks would since it's about censorship of the press13:01
AlanBellif the press would stop printing celebrity shagging stories and printed news instead they wouldn't end up being censored13:07
MooDooi like they assume anyone gives a monkeys13:09
BigRedSpeople do13:09
BigRedSif people didn't, they wouldn't sell papers13:09
AlanBellthey get confused by stuff that is "in the public interest" and stuff that "interests the public"13:09
MooDoosigh13:11
popeyhttp://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/QB/2011/1232.html is an interesting read13:11
popeyabout the Giggs story13:11
=== arsham is now known as arsham666
BigRedSAlanBell: Nah, I think they're just under the impression they're a business, not a public service13:12
oimonpopey: interesting site13:38
gordwhoever invented the gtk progressbar that just goes back and forward needs to be shot13:47
hamitrongord: "I really have no clue how long it will take"13:48
hamitron;)13:48
MartijnVdS"But I'm still working on it!"13:48
hamitron:D13:48
BigRedShaha, yeah, I love that13:50
oimonguys, i've got a laptop in front of me running lucid and ati radeon express 1250  with bad screen flicker - what should i do? lsmod shows radeon module loaded13:51
MartijnVdSwhat kind of screen flicker?13:51
davmor2gord: wasn't it you?13:51
oimonMartijnVdS: occasionally when moving windows or similar , i see thin horizontal black lines flicker in several places across the screen13:52
oimonespecially when closing or creating windows - seems like a driver bug. no experience with ati drivers tho13:53
MartijnVdSoimon: sounds like a 3D bug.. does it happen in classic mode?13:54
gordMartijnVdS, lucid :)13:55
oimonlooks like bug 31832513:55
lubotu3Launchpad bug 318325 in xserver-xorg-video-ati (Ubuntu) "[X1100] flickering after resume from ram " [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/31832513:55
MartijnVdSah13:55
MartijnVdSupgrade to natty?13:55
oimonstill in natty too :( just ned to remember not to suspend th elaptop13:56
MartijnVdSget a proper new one ;)13:56
MartijnVdSwith INTEL graphics, that WORK13:56
MartijnVdS*ahem*13:56
oimonit's a work laptop :(13:56
* MartijnVdS convinced work to buy an intel laptop :)13:56
oimonbought before i was here13:56
oimon:)13:56
oimonotherwise a nice machine13:56
oimonexcept for horrible placement of certain keys on the beyboard13:57
gordintel does not mean works13:58
gordseriously13:58
MartijnVdSgord: when doesn't it?13:58
MartijnVdSgord: if it's old (pre-core) intel, sure.. but new intel Works®13:58
gordMartijnVdS, their gl support sucks, this HD 3000 i'm running has graphical glitches all over the place13:59
hamitron:/13:59
MartijnVdSgord: At least it's not nvidia, with no support at all for RANDR13:59
hamitronwhy do i now feel I've been stupid getting an i3 :/13:59
MartijnVdShamitron: i3 is good.13:59
DJoneshamitron: I like my i313:59
hamitronI like mine too14:00
hamitronrunnign widnws 7 atm on it though14:00
hamitron:)14:00
hamitronrunning windows 7 atm on it though14:00
davmor2I like mine too and the battery meter doesn't lie any more either14:00
hamitronusing it for games for a while, will then use in a SFF PC with linux14:01
hamitron:)14:01
hamitronthat is the plan anyway14:01
ali1234it's very simple14:09
mrwarmthDoes anyone know if Xubuntu uses GDM?14:09
davmor2mrwarmth: I believe it does although it may be heavily modified and not all options may work if the backend apps are missing14:10
ali1234if you want fast 2d and low power usage, go intel14:10
ali1234if you want to play games, get nvidia14:10
brobostigon!info xdm14:11
ali1234if you want to do gpu computing get ati14:11
lubotu3xdm (source: xdm): X display manager. In component universe, is optional. Version 1:1.1.10-3ubuntu1 (natty), package size 150 kB, installed size 880 kB14:11
mrwarmththanks, davmor214:11
ali1234xubuntu does use gdm14:12
davmor2brobostigon: xdm isn't xfce it's X fullstop14:12
ali1234in fact xfce is little more than an alternative shell and apps for gnome14:12
ali1234(and not a particularly good one of that)14:13
brobostigondavmor2: yes, i know, i wasjust curious.14:13
ali1234xdm is a old old display manager from prehistory14:13
davmor2brobostigon: ah okay14:13
hamitronali1234: for the functionality, I certainly found it rather heavy on resources14:13
ali1234xfce is basically in the state that gnome was in 5 years ago14:14
ali1234people say xfce is really light, but so was gnome before they added all the features we now take for granted14:15
ali1234like the ability to configure monitors14:15
mrwarmthali1234, thank you. I tend to use dwm instead of gnome and figured xubuntu might be a better starting point rather than full ubuntu/gnome. xfce is nice too though :)14:15
ali1234so i'm now addicted to mechanical turk14:18
ali1234i've earned about $20 in the last three days14:19
oimonali1234: oh dear, whose fault was that?14:21
ali1234i dunno whoever was talking about it the other day14:21
* oimon hides14:21
oimonwhat are you doing? transcriptions?14:22
ali1234yeah14:22
ali1234and "draw a box around the thing"14:22
awilkins$20 for how much work though14:22
oimon3 days :P14:22
ali1234about 2 hours a day14:22
awilkinsAnd is it less than $20 worth of effort to extract it from Amazon14:23
ali1234dunno, it looks like they just give it to you as amazon gift cards14:23
ali1234if you are outside USA that is14:23
oimonthere must be easier ways to get ££14:23
oimonmarket research, mystery shopping14:23
ali1234finding 2 hours of work/day on a regular basis is surprisingly difficult14:24
popeysome of them are just ad-clicking14:25
ali1234i don't do the spammy ones14:25
* mrwarmth googles mechanical turk14:25
oimonali1234: you could babysit people's farmville plots for them. :)14:25
ali1234i pick them based on how interesting they are14:25
ali1234like yesterday there was one "upload images from all the different cameras you have"14:25
ali1234someone wants to analyse jpeg compression to discover what camera took a photo, if the exif is stripped14:26
ali1234$0.25 per image14:26
oimoninssider fails on my lucid machine :(14:26
ali1234yeah, i'll happily 'play' farmville for you for $2/hour14:27
ali1234(if i have nothing better to do lol)14:27
oimoncan you trade stuff in minecraft?14:27
ali1234if you want to14:28
ali1234just drop it on the ground14:28
ali1234there's no trading system except in mods14:28
wintellectoimon: tried the ctrl-alt-sysrq-k thing, and it brought back KDM. thanks for the tip14:28
DJonesali1234: $2/hour for playing facebook, I should get my wife doing that, she'd make a fortune doing what she does anyway14:28
oimonwintellect: sweet :)14:28
DJoness/facebook/farmville14:29
screen-xsadly noone wants to pay me to play osmos14:29
=== coco is now known as coco2
=== coco2 is now known as cocoliso
oimonam i misremembering or didn't ubuntu installer used to offer a side-by-side install if you already had XP and ubuntu already on your machine?15:12
BigRedSSo install a third OS, leaving the other ubuntu and the windows?15:16
BigRedSIt definitely did (still does?) do that when there's another not-ubuntu15:16
BigRedSbut I don't think I've ever needed to notice what it does when there's already a ubuntu there15:17
oimonnatty installer offers now to trash everything, upgrade the LTS, or "other"..and the other is somewhat manual.15:18
oimoni remember it was a lot nicer and allowed a gparted type partition resizer etc15:18
awilkinsI like the "other"15:23
Azelphurpopey: 2.7ghash :)15:23
Azelphurweeeeee.15:24
* hamitron sniffles at his 0.8ghash15:24
hamitron:\15:24
Azelphurhehe15:24
awilkinsI like "other" because my standard partition preference is to have /home on a partition that isn't root.15:24
popeyAzelphur: why do you keep telling me this?15:25
BigRedSI got bored of multi-partitioned desktops/laptops a while ago15:25
Azelphurpopey: thought you was interested, sorry15:25
popeyheh15:25
awilkinsBlech, Dr Pepper is not nearly as nice when flat15:26
awilkinsDoesn't work as a jingle15:26
oimondo they still advertise fizzy drinks on tv?15:27
awilkinsThey do.15:28
hamitronpopey: buys comparing their "toys" ;)15:28
hamitronboys*15:28
awilkinsThe Ubuntu installer WAS smart enough this time around to work out that when I gave it an old /home with existing folders, that it didn't need to make a new one for my user15:29
=== david is now known as Guest45313
Twinkletoeswhat is the most up-to-date or best version of ddrescue... "ddrescue", "dd_rescue" or "gddrescue"?16:20
screen-xgddrescue \o/ thats the package name, I think the binary might not have the g.16:27
screen-xTwinkletoes: yah, gddrescue contains /sbin/ddrescue16:27
screen-xand is rather awesome16:28
* screen-x is disappointed by https://splendidbacon.com16:28
Twinkletoesscreen-x: Yeah - it seems dd_rescue is rather old, too16:29
Twinkletoesscreen-x: It's confusing because ddrescue is 1.14-1 and gddrescue is 1.11-116:30
screen-xTwinkletoes: did you hear about kernel 2.6.40 possibly being 2.8.0, due to "the voices in my head"?16:34
bigcalmo.O16:34
* Twinkletoes is all confuzzled16:35
screen-xhttp://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.kernel.mm/6358916:35
screen-xjust a statement on the arbitrary-ness of version numbers16:35
gordas long as the version numbers are going up, its all good16:37
AlanBelldo you think popey is truly inspirational?16:39
Twinkletoesscreen-x: Point taken, but still confusing :)16:40
popeyo_O16:40
AlanBelldo you think popey always strives to do his best?16:40
AlanBelldo you think it would be funny to make him run a mile carrying a torch?16:40
AlanBellhttp://www.london2012.com/games/olympic-torch-relay/carrying-the-olympic-flame/16:40
popeyuh oh16:41
davmor2last one16:41
gordi think he would drop it =\16:43
davmor2gord: harsh, you would drop it would you popey16:44
bigcalmAren't we meant to be making David Tennant run with the tourch?16:44
davmor2isn't that the entrance into the stadium though?16:44
AlanBellwell they are looking for 8000 people16:44
davmor2AlanBell: so we vote for David Tenant and popey right?16:45
popeyI vote sladen16:45
popeyon his brompton16:45
davmor2popey: he'd set fire to his hair, now stop trying to squirm out of it16:46
screen-xwill there be a list of people to vote on? or are they relying on the number of duplicate nominations?16:47
AlanBellyou have 1500 characters to put on the nomination form16:49
oimonwe could get nick griffin to do the bit through whitechapel...sure that would go down well16:49
oimonhe might not make it through alive16:49
popey\o/ home time16:51
bigcalmo.O16:51
popeyPodcast tonight ☺16:53
brobostigon:)16:53
AlanBellit is only 300 meters each actually16:57
davmor2AlanBell: meh that's not far enough to make popey suffer so no point now ;)16:59
DJonesI know of one guy that is being nominated by a lot of rugby league supporters16:59
davmor2might be fun to have David Attenborough run 300 meters :D17:00
screen-xis running a requirement?17:04
DJonesMaybe this bloke http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1343911/Broken-heart-worlds-fattest-man-Paul-Mason-70-stone-cost-taxpayer-1m.html WARNING YOU MAY WANT TO POKE YOUR EYES OUT AFTER SEEING THE PICTURE17:04
daysaverlist17:04
* screen-x decides against following DJones' link17:04
jpdsDJones: Now, they told us we were safe from anything Fukashima like.17:05
DJonesHeh17:06
DJonesAh well 7 minutes past 5pm, done the payroll, sent it to the bank for payment, time to relax17:08
Laneypenguin cafe orchestra ♥17:09
daysaver#17:26
daysaver#17:26
screen-xdaysaver: you ok there? :)17:27
daysaverdon't know how to use irc17:28
screen-xdaysaver: welcome! I'm no expert... but what are you trying to do?17:28
daysaverI want to chat with programmers17:29
MooDoolater all :D17:29
screen-xnight MooDoo17:29
daysaverhow do you use join?17:29
MooDoodaysaver: /join #<channel name>17:29
MooDoooh i'm using irssi :)17:29
daysaverhow do you find channel names?17:29
marxjohnsondaysaver: /list I think17:30
daysaverthanks17:30
screen-xdaysaver: are you looking for a particular languague or project?17:30
daysaverc++17:31
screen-xdaysaver: ##c++ seems to be the channel for that17:32
an0keyeven a thank you ;)17:41
etneghi17:46
etnegim in a ubuntu  VM and host machine is win717:46
etnegit keeps dropping my download connections half way through17:46
etnegon the same network it works just fine on xp though17:47
etnegany hints what could be going wrong17:47
etnegusing a microlink connection that doesn't use the wan port of the router instead uses the LAN port17:47
BigRedSwhat're you using for the virtualization?17:47
BigRedSwhen teh download fails in ubuntu, does all networking stop working?17:48
etnegwell even without ubuntu in VM, the connection keeps dropping my downloads17:48
etnegim downloading from win717:48
etnegim getting a little confused, first the xp box is off,second ive tried without the vm same affect, third its a slower connection here17:48
etnegbut im getting about up to 200kbs17:48
etnegit's shared17:48
dogmatic69so your windows host box drops connect?17:49
etnegthe win7 box17:49
etnegnot the xp one17:49
screen-xetneg: you have a win7 host with an xp vm and an ubuntu vm?17:49
etnega win7 box with a ubuntu vm17:49
dogmatic69and win7 drops connections?17:49
etnegyep17:49
dogmatic69bah17:49
etnegwell im downloading anything of say over 100mbs then all off a sudden the status bar will speed to the end and cut the download short17:50
etnegnow if i try to downloading via ubuntu, well im still trying to now on the same file, but adobe is being a pain17:50
etnegdownload*17:51
screen-xetneg: did the ubuntu iso download ok?17:51
etnegthis isnt about the iso17:51
kaushalhi17:52
screen-xhi kaushal17:52
kaushalhow do i erase the hard disk running older ubuntu versions ?17:52
screen-xetneg: you mentioned that you had trouble downloading large files, so I thought an ISO would be a good test17:52
etnegit's downloading now, so may take a while to faulter17:52
etnegbut it does the same on you tube bigger than 100mbs17:53
etnegscreen-x: any file larger than 100mbs it cuts short off half way through17:53
screen-xetneg: going through a proxy?17:53
etnegscreen-x: no17:54
screen-xetneg: check with something like http://whatismyipaddress.com/proxy-check17:54
etnegscreen-x: im not using a proxy on the win7 box17:54
screen-xetneg: so whats sniping your downloads?17:54
etnegif i knew i wouldnt be here!:P17:55
screen-x:)17:55
etnegif i have a limited mac table in the router could this happen?17:55
etnegstill doesnt explain why it works fine over xp17:55
screen-xkaushal: boot from live cd, run something distructive17:56
kaushalscreen-x: like ?17:56
screen-xetneg: you have two computers, one win7 also vm host, one xp, both connected to the same router, win7 box has download prob, winxp box doesnt?17:56
etnegright17:56
screen-xkaushal: actualy, easiest way is probably to download a dban iso, and boot that.17:57
kaushalok17:57
screen-xkaushal: have to be careful with that though, as it will obliterate all data on all disks..17:57
kaushalscreen-x: but it does take lot of time17:58
kaushalcan it made quicker ?17:58
screen-xkaushal: dban has a few settings depending on how paranoid you are..17:58
davmor2kaushal: days if you do the wrong settings,  hours if you get the right ones17:58
kaushalok17:58
davmor2kaushal: depends on the size of the disk of course :)17:59
screen-xkaushal: if you aren't worried about making the data irecoverable, you can just delete the partition table with cfdisk -z17:59
kaushalok17:59
kaushalscreen-x: so no data can be recovered using cfdisk -z ?18:00
screen-xkaushal: no... if you use that, all the data could be recovered.18:00
kaushalthen it is bad18:00
kaushalI dont want anyone to recover my data18:01
screen-xkaushal: dban is the way to go if you want to make sure the data is totally gone18:01
kaushalok18:01
screen-xetneg: I don't know enough about windows to know why that would be happening. Could try booting the win7 box with an ubuntu live cd and see if the problem persists. That isolates windows, and suggests its a hardware or router issue.18:02
etnegwell it cant be a router issue since it works on xp18:02
kaushalcan i use quick erase method using dban ?18:02
etnegand also the win7 box worked fine before i moved18:02
etnegi moved to a new place and now its not working right18:03
etnegif it downloads right via the ubuntu vm o win7 then clearly it's a win7 issue but i cant tell yet since im still downloading the file18:03
screen-xkaushal: you can choose different numbers of passes over the disk. Total time depends on how big the disk is * number of passes. The more passes you do, the less chance of data being recoverable.18:03
kaushalok18:03
kaushalso i will use dban18:03
kaushaland let you know18:03
kaushalThanks screen-x18:03
etnegok the download stopped prematurely18:05
etnegat 141 of 45118:05
screen-xetneg: which browser are you using for downloads? have you tried ff/chrome?18:06
etnegyeah18:06
etnegtried all18:06
etnegyou think chrome is obstructing something?18:07
etnegor firefox18:07
screen-xetneg: things I would try next: 1) boot from an ubuntu live cd and retry the download 2) log packets with wireshark, to determine which end closes the connection.18:08
etnegwel i looked at the event logs on win7 and it reads18:08
etnegevent id 1001 dhcp client18:08
screen-xetneg: was that event at the time the download failed?18:10
etnegscreen-x: ye18:11
screen-xetneg: maybe give your win7 pc a static IP, and retry, to ensure it isn't a dhcp renewal issue.18:12
etnegif it was about renewal, then it would start a download at all would it?18:13
screen-xetneg: unless the dhcp renewal process occured during the download and interupted it. That is unlikely, I'm just guessing.18:14
etnegwell i see this in the error logs too kernal event tracing id 218:14
screen-xetneg: maybe best to find a windows related channel18:15
etnegna theyb usually suck18:15
screen-xI haven't used windows for years, so can't be very helpful on windows issues..18:15
etnegin all honesty linux channels know more lol18:15
etnegit's weird18:15
screen-xodd18:15
AlanBelletneg: are you behind a transparent proxy?18:16
etnegAlanBell: nope18:16
jacobwdid anyone watch "all watched over by machines of loving grace" last night?18:44
jacobwbbc2, 9pm18:44
=== seeker_ is now known as seeker
advancedbraindamhi i have a problrm with my cd burner it doesnt work every time i try the error message pop out18:54
brobostigoncan you provide us with the error message please, and use a pastebin please.18:55
brobostigon!pastebin18:55
lubotu3For posting multi-line texts into the channel, please use http://paste.ubuntu.com | To post !screenshots use http://imagebin.org/?page=add | !pastebinit to paste directly from command line | Make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the channel topic.18:55
advancedbraindamhttp://pastebin.com/LYyXy11T18:55
advancedbraindamthe save log18:55
advancedbraindamthanks guys hope that will help you to figure it out18:56
AlanBell"ID CRC OR ECC ERROR" is what the specs say19:01
AlanBellhttp://www.t10.org/lists/asc-num.htm#ASC_1019:01
AlanBell"SCSI error on write(8896,16): See MMC specs: Sense Key 3 "Medium error", ASC 10 ASCQ 00"19:01
advancedbraindamwhat does it mean dude?19:02
AlanBelladvancedbraindam: sounds like a bad disk, but you have tried several I guess19:02
advancedbraindamohh yeah19:02
advancedbraindamdvd s and cds19:02
advancedbraindamits the same regardless19:02
AlanBellit is talking about CRC (cyclic redundancy check) and ECC (error correcting code) errors19:02
AlanBellas if the data it reads back doesn't match the data it just wrote19:03
advancedbraindami did reinstall the system few weeks back and i know there was some error during the installation19:03
advancedbraindami have a picture of the error message let me type few lines for you19:04
AlanBellnot sure I have any advice to offer really, the error message basically just says it didn't work19:04
advancedbraindam{ 35553,424938} end_request: i/o error, dev sr0, sector 553484819:06
advancedbraindamhere is one of the lines after the install19:06
advancedbraindamit might be this what cause it19:07
advancedbraindam??19:07
MartijnVdSDid you remove the CD-ROM before it asked you to?19:07
AlanBellthat happened when installing from live cd in that same drive?19:07
MartijnVdSIf not, this is normal19:07
AlanBellit might be a dodgy drive causing both issues19:08
advancedbraindamim not sure 100% but i wouldn`t eject the cd before the installation is complete19:08
advancedbraindami was thinking about too that the drive could be the couse19:08
advancedbraindamhowever it work before the reinstall19:09
advancedbraindamnever have any problems with it19:09
advancedbraindamis there a software to check the hardware status etc ???19:11
KrisWillisHey19:19
KrisWillisDoes anyone know how to launch an application on the desktop, but via SSH?19:19
KrisWillisFor example, XBMC just crashed on my HTPC, I just killed it via SSH, but can't figure out how to start it again19:19
gordKrisWillis, DISPLAY=:0 xbmc19:23
KrisWillisgord: Thanks, that was one thing I tried, but if I disconnect my SSH session, it kills xbmc19:24
* KrisWillis stops being lazy and plugs a mouse into it to fire it up19:27
BigRedSnohup?19:28
DJonesssh -X ?19:28
KrisWillisBigRedS / DJones : I'll have a play with them shortly, thanks - Just about to pop out19:30
=== thecoda is now known as LargeBillyGoatGr
=== LargeBillyGoatGr is now known as LargeBillyGoat
=== LargeBillyGoat is now known as thecoda
* popey points out http://podcast.ubuntu-uk.org/live/20:25
popeyand #ubuntu-uk-podcast20:25
shaunono ustream this time?20:26
MartijnVdSNO U STREAM20:26
MartijnVdS(or: Y U NO STREAM)20:27
shauno:)20:27
shaunothought it worked pretty well last time.  if they could get it to use the same audio as the podcast feed does, it'd have been perfect20:28
jacobwi haven't listed to episode 6 yet :o20:31
popeyshauno: sadly tony has rubbish bandwidth20:41
popeyshauno: whereas I have excellent upstream20:41
bigcalm:D20:41
bigcalmSpeaking of which20:42
bigcalmMust sign and return that contract20:42
gordo_O firefox just offered to upgrade to 5.0 beta20:43
gordhow times change20:43
* suprengr wonders if http://www.wired.com/autopia/2011/05/automotive-black-boxes/ will use Linux ;)20:44
czajkowskiTREllis: ALOHA20:45
TREllisczajkowski: howdy20:45
TREllisczajkowski: happy now?20:45
TREllisczajkowski: :)20:46
* TREllis hands czajkowski some peanut butter M&M's20:46
czajkowskiTREllis: so wrong20:46
czajkowskipeanubutter on toast20:46
czajkowskiwith a bucket of tea!20:46
czajkowskionly plain choclate M&Ms20:46
TREllisczajkowski: noooooo! they rock, have you tried them?20:46
czajkowskiTREllis: I'm easily pleased what can I say20:46
czajkowskino20:47
czajkowskitis wrong20:47
gordi tried peanut butter m&ms, i was not impressed20:47
czajkowskisee and gord is wise about his food choices most of the time20:47
brobostigonuupc live is running in chromium, as if it was html5, but has a clear .mp3 extension.20:49
popeyfeel free to join us in #ubuntu-uk-podcast ☺20:49
livingdaylightwho are we listening to on the podcast?21:05
brobostigonlivingdaylight: jono.21:06
brobostigonauth.log scares me sometimes, :(21:59
shaunothere shouldn't be anything scary in there?22:09
SamJ190494is the right kinda place to throw up an idea?22:10
brobostigonshauno: it feelslike it, likesomephraseslike, potential breakin attempt, and the like.22:10
shaunoah .. random chinese people trying to guess a valid username?22:12
brobostigonshauno: that also, i have sw, that auto puts those weird ip's, into hosts.deny.22:12
shaunoyeah, I do something similar with fail2ban22:13
shaunoaltho it's almost entirely cosmetic.  they can keep guessing usernames, they're not going to guess a valid key :)  it just makes them disappear from the logs when they fail hard enough22:14
brobostigon:( eeeekkk22:15
shaunomaybe badly worded .. they disappear because they're added to iptables, so they never show up on ssh .. not just removed from the logs.  they just never get far enough to appear in logs anymore22:18
brobostigonshauno: what i would rather it do, is stick every ipv4&v6 addr that falsely tries to login, into something, that locks that ip entirly out from everything, and "ufw deny" that ip, at the sametime.22:19
shaunoI prefer to make sure the service itself is secured.  things like denyhosts and fail2ban stop them coming back.  but key-only logins stop them having a chance in the first place22:20
brobostigonshauno: inclusive ofhttp and anything else.22:20
brobostigonshauno: i have those lockeddownaswell, but i woulslike something to coordinate alittlemore,22:21
shaunoto be honest, I wish it was easier to simply blackhole entire countries :/22:21
brobostigoni would rrather notstricktly do that,22:22
shaunowell, mine's mostly a personal machine.  I've a small number of known users, none of them outside the EU22:22
shaunoso if I could block asia completely, it'd be fairly sensible.  for most public machines, that wouldn't be a smart move22:23
brobostigonforthatm yes,22:23
shaunodoesn't solve much, but there's several countries that keep showing up, where the signal to noise ration is an absolute zero  :/22:24
brobostigonhmmm,22:24
shaunoI shouldn't say chinese people.  it's chinese connections.  I've one theory that the high priracy rates there mean a lot more machines running without updates. which'd make it botnet heaven22:27
brobostigonshauno: although, i have probebly done as much as i can, and lcokked down iptables asmuch as possible, and things likeapache, i reckon.22:28
brobostigonlocked*22:28
shaunodoes denyhosts specifically block them from ssh?22:29
brobostigonaswell, i think so, yes,22:29
shaunoif the lines it's adding to hosts.deny read "ALL: address", they may already be blocked from apache22:29
brobostigonshauno: sshd: only.22:30
shaunolooks like that can be set in /etc/denyhosts.conf22:35
shaunolook for 'BLOCK_SERVICE'.  if that's set to ALL instead of 'sshd', that's what the lines in hosts.deny will have22:35
shaunothat'd remove them from anything that's built with tcp-wrappers, atleast22:36
brobostigonok, let melook.22:36
ujjainWhat is a good price to compare hardware prices in the UK? (External hard disk)22:36
shaunonot sure off-hand whether apache uses wrappers tho22:38
brobostigonshauno: found it,22:40
brobostigonshauno: good question,22:41
jacobw!ping22:41
lubotu3Here I am, brain the size of a planet and they ask me to respond to factoid requests. Call that job satisfaction? Because I don't.22:41
brobostigonlol22:42
shaunoapparently it doesn't.  you have to launch it from inetd to use wrappers, which makes it incredibly slow22:42
brobostigonhmmm.22:42
shaunoI think I'd fall back to "you might wanna look at fail2ban sometime".  it's a bit messier than denyhosts, but it'll work with a lot more services.  and one of the options for actions is iptables-multiport, which simply drops that IP dead22:46
shaunoyou'd want to play with it on a local machine sometime first (automatically adding yourself to iptables sucks), but if you want to drop offenders site-side, it'll do that22:47
brobostigonok, thank you shauno. i will look at that, can both run-side-by-side22:47
brobostigon?22:47
shaunoI can't see why not, but I haven't tried22:48
brobostigonok, i will find some way of trying.22:48
Azelphurwhat can I use on Ubuntu to give me reminders of upcoming events?23:24
shaunogoogle calendar :)23:24
Azelphurhow would that give me a reminder?23:25
shaunoit sends me text messages reminding me when my rent's due23:25
Azelphurfor free?23:26
shaunoI don't know if evolution is a sane option.  it used to plug into the clock applet via e-d-s, but I've no idea if that's still true for natty23:27
shaunoyeah for free.  I'm not giving google money.  they have enough already.23:27
Azelphurawesome :P23:27
Azelphurshauno: wonder if it can do XMPP notifications23:27
shaunohttp://www.google.com/support/calendar/bin/answer.py?&answer=37242  says email, sms, or popups on the webpage :/23:28
Azelphurcool23:29
shaunothat's all I actually use their calendar for.  one sms on payday, another when rent goes out23:29
shaunothinking about it, someone has to have done an email to xmpp gateway23:31
Azelphurhehe23:31
shauno!info sendxmpp23:32
lubotu3sendxmpp (source: sendxmpp): commandline XMPP (jabber) utility. In component universe, is optional. Version 1.20-1 (natty), package size 14 kB, installed size 88 kB23:32
shaunothat + procmail.  sorted :)23:32
Azelphurshauno: could just use cron to send direct to xmpp on that basis xD23:34
shaunowhoops23:38
shaunoxmpp plugin for irssi looked interesting, but exploded on connect :/23:45

Generated by irclog2html.py 2.7 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!