[00:01] MrCurious: serial port ? [00:02] yes [00:02] a bluetooth serial port [00:04] http://www.satistronics.com/serial-port-bluetooth-module-masterslave-hc05_p2863.html [00:04] works fine with Mac [00:07] they are very nice modules for connecting serial devices wirelessly [00:08] like AVR's, MSP's [00:09] do you think that's a problem specific to ubuntu arm on the device ? [00:14] well, i imagine first step would be checking the os for the os prescribed method of associating [00:15] then drop to the device to see if its wired wrong. [00:15] wouldn't you agree? [00:20] MrCurious: I fear I am not following [00:20] i am saying wouldnt you look to how something is done in the os before declaring the motherboard at fault? [00:21] in otherwords, until i learn how ubuntu would associate with a bluetooth serial device, there is no sense pointing fault at the hardware [00:21] if the answer is ubuntu has no concept of bluetooth then i can move on [00:24] dcordes: never mind, i think there is a language translation issue at play here, and i dont wish to frustrate you [00:27] MrCurious: oh sorry, I didn't mean to say it is a hardware problem. let me restate: did you try that serial connection in a different environment ? [00:28] MrCurious: or: did you ever have a working bluetooth connection on your pandora board in ubuntu ? [00:28] (maybe something more trivial like blueooth hid device [00:29] the module has been tested working with mac osx [00:29] discoverable, pairable, and serial communications tested working [00:30] yes, so the only unknowns are ubuntu on pandaboard [00:30] all else tested previously working [00:30] apologies for not stating that or stating it clearer :) i am juggling too many things [00:34] * persia points at irclogs.ubuntu.com for logs of this channel [00:34] persia: ok thanks [00:34] persia: maybe orga can put a reference in the topic [00:34] dcordes, I don't know where the bug needs to be filed, but my recommendation would be to dig through the library docs, and find out what is supposed to check the environment variable: make sure that is loaded. [00:34] MrCurious: unfortunately I am not very familiar with bluetooth at all, just trying to check if you have a working test environemnt and are narrowing down the error === persia changed the topic of #ubuntu-arm to: Ubuntu ARM Discussion & Development | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ARM | Submit a Bug? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+filebug | Get Natty while it's hot ! http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/11.04/release/ | Logs at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ [00:35] thats fine. i was just asking to see if anyone knew how to get the bluetooth associate with device dialog up [00:35] MrCurious, I'm certain that ubuntu-11.04-preinstalled-netbook-armel+omap4.img.gz isn't corrupt, as I used it to install a panda :) [00:35] * MrCurious nudges someone to remove the 11.04 omap4 image, its broked [00:36] i tried it on multiple sd's [00:36] multiple machines to burn it, multiple procedures [00:36] Did you check the checksums of your download? [00:36] It really worked for me. [00:36] doesnt TCP guarantee error free transmission [00:36] persia: nice [00:36] Theoretically. In practice, not so much. [00:37] persia: http://doc.qt.nokia.com/main-snapshot/qapplication.html#setGraphicsSystem found this [00:37] i could try it again. [00:37] but it seems many are having issues [00:37] dcordes, That looks like a good place to start. [00:37] from the mail lists [00:37] As you like. It worked for me. [00:38] persia: worst case I could grep the unity-2d-* code for setGraphicsSystem and default to native [00:38] dcordes, I very strongly disbelieve that the unity-2d-* code has anything to do with that: it's very likely to be something with Qt [00:40] I may be wrong though :) [00:40] persia: the thing that makes be believe they should take the QT_GRAPHICSSYSTEM env var is that they do read the -graphicssystem switch [00:41] persia: while i am re-downloading it, do you by chance have any experience with bluetooth devices in ubuntu :) [00:41] Do you think that is being done by unoty-2d, or automatically because unity-2d instantiates qapplication? [00:41] e.g. "unity-2d-launcher -graphicssystem=native" will give me native graphicssystem while "QT_GRAPHICSSYSTEM=native unity-2d-laucnerh" will not [00:41] MrCurious, Far too much, sadly. I have no idea if the bluetooth device the panda claims to have works (I think there's no antenna, and I haven't played with it). [00:42] it has a onboard ceramic [00:42] i can turn on bluetooth [00:43] but i dont know where to go to get the list of bluetooth devices to pair with [00:43] Use any of the bluetooth management tools. What's your environment? [00:44] If it's the netbook environment you're currently downloading, you'll get a bluetooth indicator when bluetooth is available, and can launch the discovery widgets from there. [00:44] persia: I don't know. I will download the code [00:44] dcordes, Makes sense. Someone might have overridden the default to force 2D, although that seems unfortunate to me. [00:45] dcordes, But if you don't find it, don't be discouraged: it may be something about how qapplication is instantiated, etc. [00:45] persia: not sure what qapplication is [00:45] persia: I will just stupidly grep for the setGraphicsSystem [00:46] QApplication: http://doc.qt.nokia.com/main-snapshot/qapplication.html : the parent class for most Qt applications. [00:46] (you may already have this page open) [00:47] ah right :) [00:54] persia: why do you think it's unfortunate ? [00:54] persia: at least they had a reason for it : [00:54] /* Forcing graphics system to 'raster' instead of the default 'native' [00:54] which on X11 is 'XRender'. [00:54] 'XRender' defaults to using a TrueColor visual. We do _not_ mimick that [00:54] behaviour with 'raster' by calling QApplication::setColorSpec because [00:54] of a bug where black rectangular artifacts were appearing randomly: [00:55] That would be unfortunate because of a choice to work around a bug rather than fixing it. [00:56] oh that makes sense [00:56] The more so because it causes other problems (like the one you are experiencing) [00:56] well it seems they fixed that bug already because running with the native works just fine on my device [00:56] We have no idea. There's no documentation of the bug, nor the environment in which it was produced. [00:57] maybe I should let them know via https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-2d/+bug/734143 [00:57] Ubuntu bug 734143 in unity-2d "Black rectangular artifacts appearing when opening a few launcher contextual menus" [High,Fix released] [00:57] the url is from above comment [00:57] Oh, there was a URL! Excellent. That's doing it right. [00:58] status: In Progress → Fix Committed [00:58] I'd recommend getting someone to try it on a macbook pro 7.1 with -gtgraphicssystem=native [00:58] Maybe it's something unique to that hardware, or something in that render path, etc. [00:58] I wonder if by fix fboucault means the default raster [00:59] The "fix" is http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~fboucault/unity-2d/dont_set_colorspec/revision/447 [01:00] ok [01:00] The missing part is the investigation of the render path on the hardware showing the bug to find the underlying bug. [01:00] so what about s/raster/native/ ? [01:00] So, unity-2d is "fixed" with the workaround. [01:00] *but* the underlying bug still remains, and needs investigation. [01:00] If that is fixed, the workaround may be removed from unity-2d [01:00] Which then solves your issue. [01:01] I strongly suspect that use of "native" on the hardware reported in 734143 will continue to show the issue. [01:01] ok [01:01] So it's not safe to just randomly assign it to "native", unless you want to carry a fork for some time. [01:02] Depends on your goal, really. If you want Ubuntu 11.10 to just work on your device, you'll want to fix the issue with the MacBook Pro. [01:02] If you want Ubuntu 11.04 to work on your device *now*, you'll fork the code. [01:03] (yes, fixing a MacBook Pro to help make an ARM handheld work better seems counter-intuitive, but it's all in the spirit of collaboration :) ) [01:03] persia: my suggestion: switch back to native and work around on the macbook pro. according to bill filler, unity-2d is supposed to provide support for devices with no hardware accelerated graphics, especially ARM devices [01:03] Why not just fix the macbook pro issue? [01:04] Then nobody needs any workarounds. [01:04] that would be best [01:05] I'd probably start by finding someone with the hardware, and having them test (we know kaleo has such an environment: others may). [01:05] a) I don't have a macbook b) I have the impression that I have the smaller lobby, with only one person reporting raster problems. [01:05] my two issues with that [01:05] which forbid moving the process on [01:05] Try to make a simpler test-case, which can then be given to the X team, who may be able to sort the rendering path issue. [01:06] a) doesn't matter: there are lots of other people with the hardware. Just find one. [01:06] b) Who cares if it's just you reporting an issue: 734143 was also just one person. [01:06] if I prepare such a well working natty image for easy install t housands will download it in short time [01:06] and use it on that device [01:07] That's not interesting in terms of bugfixing (although interesting in other ways). [01:07] What's interesting in terms of bugfixing is the investigation of the issue. [01:08] So, you'll want to find someone with the hardware (I gave you one name: randomly asking in #ubuntu+1 or #ubuntu-testers will probably get you some more) [01:08] Then you'll want to work with them to find out precisely when the black rectangles occur [01:08] Then you'll want to prepare a minimal program that generates the black rectangles [01:08] Then you'll want to submit that to the rendering folk (as a new bug), who will likely sort it. [01:08] ok [01:09] maybe the potential testers can even help a bit with that [01:09] If Kaleo has time to help, he'll probably be glad to help make the minimal program (he's the reporter of 734143) [01:09] I am not a good programmer :) [01:09] Yet :) [01:09] any idea which device would be the bluetooth radio? [01:10] But seriously, 99% of this is just a matter of tracking down who can reproduce, and who understands the rendering path, and getting them to discuss/test the issue. [01:11] MrCurious, When you say "which device", what do you mean? (as I doubt answering with the chip model will help you) [01:11] trying to get a lead on the bluetooth modem. working with hcitool now [01:12] trying to give myself a bluetooth clue [01:12] its not going as fast as i would like :( [01:12] hcitool is *very* low level. [01:12] (and incredibly hard to use, in my experience) [01:12] What's your high-level goal? [01:12] got a better tool that i can explore [01:12] want to see devices that i can pair with (for the purpose of a serial port) [01:13] i have tested bluetooth serial port modules [01:13] work with mac [01:13] wanting to get them working with linux now [01:13] persia: I see. So the problem is basically that the workaround situation satisfies most and potential problems are not being noticed [01:13] dcordes, That's my opinion, yes. [01:14] dcordes, And further that you've exposed one of the problems, so they aren't just "potential" [01:14] MrCurious, So, if you boot to the desktop, do you have a bluetooth icon on the indicator? [01:14] persia: Ok then, thanks a lot [01:15] yes [01:15] currently it shows as turned on [01:16] i know teh mac address of the serial port bluetooth device 20:11:02:17:10:97 [01:16] OK. Now, choose "Set up new device..." [01:16] where do i find set up new device? [01:16] Should be in the indicator menu [01:16] persia: hope I can catch kaleo around tomorrow. need to take a nap now. good night ! [01:16] it has turn off, and preferences [01:16] preferences has a recieve files button [01:16] and a big turn on button [01:17] Press the "Turn on" button [01:17] i did [01:17] the bluetooth drop down remains un changed [01:17] Hrm. For me, the indicator menu has "Set up new device..." and the preferences window has a "Set up new device..." button. [01:18] You're running Ubuntu 11.04? [01:18] 10.10 upgraded to 11.04 [01:18] That shouldn't make a difference. [01:18] thinking its time to do the re-download, re-install thing [01:18] That's typically pointless, unless you want to change filesystems for some reason. [01:18] If it's not pointless, that's a bug. [01:20] So, you're looking for something that looks like http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-bluetooth/stable/figures/bluetooth-properties.png.en [01:20] Is this very different from the bluetooth preferences dialog you see? [01:20] (ignore the language differences) [01:20] persia: this command similar to what you used? zcat ubuntu-11.04-preinstalled-netbook-armel+omap4.img.gz | dd of=/dev/sda bs=16M [01:21] I verified the checksums, ran gunzip, and then (separately) ran `dd if=... of=/dev/sdg bs=4M` [01:21] Shouldn't matter that much though. [01:22] Did you make sure that /dev/sda is not mounted? [01:23] did NOW :D [01:24] could swear it wasnt mounted when i started [01:24] The automounter is kinda aggressive :) [01:24] doing it on a chumby [01:24] because its stable-ish [01:24] and has a not-used sd slot [01:25] although since i switched to a USB SSD for rootfs, the panda has been rock solid [01:25] something about SD cards i just dont trust [01:26] Unfortunately the panda cannot function without one [01:26] (although one doesn't really need it post-boot, if one configures everything just so) [01:27] that i did, but then i turned the SD card into SWAP [01:27] seemed tolerable once there was no FS on it compeeting for bandwidth [01:27] That will give it a nice short lifetime ) [01:27] persia: this 16g 20mb/s card has offended me by constantly corrupting with the 11.04 image [01:28] persia: i might point out to you that the ubuntu image's have swap on the ssd enabled by default [01:28] so seems short lives are not a concern in these parts ;) [01:28] see the file in the root directory [01:28] SWAP.swap [01:28] and check your free, its turned on [01:31] Oh, I know. First thing I turn off. The issue is that some folk want to be able to run with 256MB, which simply cannot work without swap: the swapfile was turned on to avoid OOM issues on first-boot. [01:34] ahhh [01:34] so in future, it will self-disable after resize? [01:34] Not soon, no. [01:35] It doesn't turn on until after resize. [01:35] thats what i mean [01:35] i think it stayed on well into first boot [01:35] possibly second boot [01:35] And it's likely to remain until the vast majority of available devices work well without swap. [01:35] It stays on forever unless manually disabled or removed. [01:36] i dont feel so bad about swapping to sd now :D [01:36] but i think i will move over to swapping to spinning disk soon [01:37] That should get you expanded SD life. [01:38] Although if you really want speed, you want to swap to battery-backed RAM or similar. [01:38] (which is designed for the sort of random-access treatment swapping needs) [01:40] does battery backed ram exist? [01:41] Yes. [01:42] I haven't seen any in the shops in a couple years, but it used to be common with PATA and PCI interfaces. [01:42] pata... [01:42] I suspect someone has put together some SATA or USB devices like this, although they may only be available by special order. [01:44] Ah, The Acord ANS-9010 apparently goes up to 64GB. You can't use this for real memory, but it makes for decent swap, if you have that sort of performance requirement (gamers, heavily-loaded servers, etc.) [01:44] for now, i have a 4gig CF spinning disk with a usb attachment [01:44] that will work for swap [01:45] hitachi 4g microdrive [01:45] Depends on the disk. Some of the early microdrives were *really* slow. [01:45] how about that instead. wee bit less expensive [01:46] Oh, once Hitachi had the "microdrive" brand, most were fairly good. [01:46] thats the one i have [01:47] uave a virgin 11.04 image now [01:48] And did you ever get the bluetooth dialog similar to the one I posted? [01:49] just getting ready to try the image [01:49] had to burn it first [01:50] seems like the ubuntu shutdown from the upper right ui turned into a logoff user [01:50] had to logback in, get shell and shutdown manually [01:52] persia: are you on a pandaboard [01:52] and seeing bluetooth options? [01:57] My panda is currently headless. [01:58] I did see bluetooth on it back when it was connected to KVM [01:58] I didn't test it, as I thought there was no antenna (failed to see the obvious antenna on the board) [02:11] i didnt see it. had to ask [03:13] persia: i have reinstalled a fresh 11.04, and i get no such options in my bluetooth menu :( [03:29] nope. no bt menu like the help pages infer. guess there is a issue with pandaboard === Lopi is now known as Lopi|idle [07:29] morning [07:50] sigh, ubuntu cant find the package ubuntu-omap4-extras === ericm|ubuntu is now known as ericm-afk [07:56] ah hah! http://omappedia.org/wiki/Ubuntu_PPA [11:37] janimo, are you already working on lightspark ? [11:37] woglinde seems to have probs building it [11:38] ogra_, yes, I am looking at it on and off but did not build on ARM yet. I'll have a look [11:38] I just know it takes a lot of time to build [11:38] yes, and takes a lot of ram too apparently [11:38] ogra_, btw I put two merge request related to the SD alignment BP [11:39] janimo you need a machine with 1 gig [11:39] woglinde, ok I have a Panda [11:39] with 1G [11:39] the amf3_parser file needs it [11:39] woglinde, cant be since it built on the buildds [11:39] unless thats something very new [11:39] the ac100 with 512 and swap isnt working [11:39] I gave up after 1 1/2 hours [11:39] the babbage boards we use as buildds are [11:39] compiling this file [11:40] woglinde, try booting with nosmp ;) [11:40] ogra its not compiled with -j [11:40] 2 [11:40] its a boost or gcc error [11:40] no, but memory management in kernel is different [11:41] all i know is that it builds fine on the build machines [11:41] and they only have 512M [11:41] woglinde, I'll do a build on oneiric - that is our target now [11:41] but they are also UP machines [11:41] janimo I tried with latest boost [11:41] still the same problem === kernellogger is now known as apachelogger [11:42] you need to add armel in the control file [11:42] shouldnt be needed in ubuntu [11:42] but I think you are clever enough to find it our yourself [11:42] i thing that was already patched [11:42] *think [11:42] I tried latest bazaar [11:42] and its really only the amf3_parser [11:42] all other files compiling [11:43] you should have tried the latest packaging branch [11:43] I wanted 0.4.8 [11:43] *g* [11:44] you should have tried the latest packaging branch with a new upstream tarball :) [11:44] ogra I doubt it changed something on the amf3_parser [11:44] https://code.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/lightspark is the most recent packaging branch [11:45] 0.4.6.1 [11:45] to old [11:45] woglinde, no, but you dont need to care about hacking the control file etc [11:45] ?? [11:45] dch -i will make it 0.4.8 [11:45] woglinde, the AMF parser was just rewritten yesterday upstream :) [11:46] ogra why care= [11:46] janimo lol [11:46] okay [11:46] you get the tarball, unpack it, cd into the dir, bzr branch the debian dir, type dch -i and fire off a build [11:46] I will take look [11:46] woglinde, but we are only packaging git master and ,ater for oneiric [11:46] why I am always to early [11:46] via debian sync most likely [11:47] woglinde, but good that you reminded me, I'll do a git master build on ARM to see if anything broke lately [11:50] hm I will try it too [11:51] looks like the rewrite dont will fail [11:55] woglinde, are you trying to run latestt lightspark on natty? === tsenyk_ is now known as tsenyk === hrww is now known as hrw [12:06] janimo yes [12:06] woglinde, it may be the case that even x86 fails to build on natty [12:07] did not check recently [12:07] janimo as I said it was only the amf3 parser [12:07] all other files compiled [12:07] so its only linking left [12:07] ok [12:07] but I will see it in a few minutes [12:08] I will try it against the boost libs from oneiric [12:15] so now lets see whats happen [12:18] lool: hi. is there any tool that i can use to parse a 'local PPA' and process the associate data e.g. list of packages (src, bin), dependencies, versions, .... ideally I think I am looking for a parse of files Packages and Sources... [12:18] ndec look into apt-get code? [12:20] ndec, grep-dctrl [12:20] woglinde: thx ;-) i was looking at a tool more 'ready to use'... [12:20] with the Packages.gz file in /var/cache/apt [12:22] ndec: Yes, launchpadlib [12:23] ndec: http://paste.ubuntu.com/619829/ list-ppa-dsc.py [12:23] yeah, lp-lib for remote stuff ... [12:24] lool: ogra_: thx! it looks like grep-dctrl might be want i need... i will dig into this. [12:25] ndec: BTW I got the script from a Launchpad developer, it's not my writing [12:25] you just dont want to be blamed for bugs ... :P [12:41] *sigh* [12:43] woglinde, FWIW I successfully built LS HEAD on ARM/Oneiric without issues [12:43] janimo I am fighting with scripting/abc.cpp [12:44] maybee I should switch to a usbdisk [12:45] instead of the sdcard [12:45] woglinde, most definitely [12:45] but all other files compiles [12:45] It did not even occur to me you use SD [12:45] I have enough [12:45] enough if one large file needs swapping [12:46] if SD is used that is becoming very slow [12:46] yes [12:46] I know [12:46] ;) [12:46] I gave up on SD cards except for testing our images [12:47] and for boot partition [12:58] good move [12:58] so now lets see with external harddisk [13:41] its linking [15:56] In 5 min we'll start the linaro public plan review [15:56] https://wiki.linaro.org/Cycles/1111/PublicPlanReview [15:56] today presenting the Android and Dev Platform teams [15:56] Dev Platform is the one also working with Ubuntu on ARM [15:56] so folks here can probably be interested in hearing it [16:32] once one installs the omap4 add ons, is there a step after that to get them working ? (sound, bluetooth) [17:39] rsalveti: do you know what it takes to get a linux-linaro-2.x kernel work with an ubuntu userland? [17:40] ppisati: should work just fine, we have the packages for that available at the repo, but if you want to grab from sources, just use the same config used by the packages [17:40] and should be fine [17:40] rsalveti: uh... i'll try again, but it hanged at boot [17:40] ppisati: which kernel? [17:40] could be that the kernel is broken also ;-) [17:40] if you got 39 [17:41] i tried 39 for sure [17:41] don't remember if i tried .38 too [17:41] anyway, i'll do that [17:41] and i'll use the .config from linux-linaro-natty [18:01] does anyone here have a pandaboard with latest ubuntu, working sound, and a bluetooth menu that has more than just on/off? If so, can I discuss the install procedure with you to work out what i missed? [18:04] MrCurious_: just the same conversation as minutes before, rsalveti said that those can be found as readymade packages at the repo [18:05] someone with an irc-shell should make a public log [18:06] i don't have enough diskspace on salaliitto.com to do that, as i already log more than one big channel [18:06] MrCurious_: There is a known issue with audio and a workaround. See bug 746023 comment 45. [18:06] Launchpad bug 746023 in alsa-utils "No sound on omap4" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/746023 [18:07] I will be testing bluetooth with a BT keyboard here shortly. Just finally got one in. [18:19] gruemaster: can you ping me when you do that, i cant work out how to get my bluetooth to scan for devices, or be findable by another computer. i have installed the omap4 ubuntu add-ons, but still, it doesn't work like it appears in the help pages [18:20] Ok. Just imaged my new 16G class 10 SD so I can kill two birds as it were. :P [18:21] i got significantly better performance by moving root to a USB drive [18:21] Well, duh. :P [18:21] and the SD's stopped getting corrupted [18:21] i have weak sd's [18:21] SD is horribly slow on every system I have seen (not just panda). [18:22] my robot design depends on being able to do bluetooth serial ports. [18:25] Just curious, but what are you using for a controller? [18:27] you mean as the main computer, or to control the motors/servo's [18:27] Motor controls. [18:27] to control the motors, the plan is to use bluetooth modules + atmega328 + 754410 + some passives [18:28] that way i can easily pair the subsystems with other pieces, like a lego brick approach, but wireless for all but power [18:29] Do you have a link to a supplier or are you building this out of components & making your own boards? [18:31] designing my own board [18:31] ah. [18:31] but i can send you a link for the $10 serial bluetooth modules if you want [18:33] I have a ProXR 410 serial relay from http://controlanything.com that I plan on using for test automation. [18:33] Having "fun" relearning how to program the serial port in C, especially since they only have examples in VB6 and .net. [18:45] grue: http://www.satistronics.com/serial-port-bluetooth-module-masterslave-hc05_p2863.html 3.3v ttl serial port, any speed. very easy to configure and work with [18:45] documentation is only slightly errored. just ignore everything above the command set, and you will be fine [18:46] Cool [18:49] Heh. FAQ on their website: Can I trust Satistronics? [18:53] i tried a look alike module from elsewhere, and it was locked into 9600 8n1 [18:53] and a lame name [18:53] but the satistronics ones are completely unlicked [18:55] unlicked? Reminds me of my test lab back at Intel. We put "Do not lick" stickers on our high output powersupplies to appease the safety managers. [18:56] un locked [18:56] sorry [18:56] heh [18:57] Heh, I understood what you meant. The typo just triggered a flashback. [18:59] Ok, install went semi-smooth on my class 10. oem-config restarted once but kicked through on second retry. Not sure why, but I have seen that issue sporadically. [19:03] my class 10, 16g 20m/s SD corrupts every install. [19:05] Very odd. Have you been able to get any logs from this? [19:08] i just see write errors, then it remounts ro [19:08] i believe it to be a bad sd, or that the SD timings are not compatible with the pandaboard [19:09] You could try flashing the image to it then resizing the partition manually (if you have a linux desktop/laptop). [19:12] Hmmm. Massive disk i/o waits just running update manager. [19:21] i can live my life happy believing that one SD card is evil [19:22] i am more interested in working out how to verify i have all the omap4 proprietary drivers installed correctly [19:22] Getting there. :P [20:25] MrCurious_: I seem to remember something about bluetooth support being added in the kernel after Natty release. I'll check with the kernel guy in the am (he's in Italy). [20:26] rsalveti: Does that sound right? BT in kernel update? [20:27] it is in, but userspace doesn't support it properly [20:27] you still need to do some hacks to make it work [20:27]