[00:28] <brousch> geez, the crazy stuff people do to get django to run http://www.defuze.org/archives/262-hosting-a-django-application-on-a-cherrypy-server.html
[02:01] <snap-l> Good evening
[02:01] <_stink_> yo
[02:02] <rick_h_> party
[02:02] <snap-l> http://loco.ubuntu.com/meetings/team/78/detail/
[02:02] <rick_h_> good to know
[02:02] <snap-l> I think this is logging, but not sure.
[02:03] <snap-l> Yep, tape is rolling. :)
[02:03] <snap-l> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/06/06/%23ubuntu-us-mi.html#t01:00 <- Logs for the meeting
[02:03] <snap-l> greg-g: Are you free?
[02:03] <brousch> figures. i was just about to get some actual stuff done ;)
[02:03] <rick_h_> that says monday though
[02:03] <snap-l> brousch: We run this channel like a business
[02:03] <rick_h_> oh, damn time conversion
[02:04] <snap-l> rick_h_: Welcome to UTC
[02:04] <snap-l> brousch: As soon as someone gets into the groove, it's meeting time.
[02:06] <brousch> ut oh, feerless leader is absent?
[02:06] <snap-l> Not sure
[02:07] <brousch> snap-l: take command
[02:07] <brousch> carpe gregum
[02:07] <snap-l> OK, since I'm the only person with a name that rhymes with Greg, I think we'll get started.
[02:08] <snap-l> I'm sure he'll have an "oh crap" moment shortly.
[02:08] <snap-l> Agenda item #1: We're up for reapproval
[02:09] <snap-l> I know greg-g sent out some notices to the mailing list about the re-approval
[02:09] <snap-l> He had a section in there on how to help out
[02:10] <snap-l> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MichiganTeam/TeamReports
[02:10] <snap-l> We need to have the reports of the various events, so that the loco council knows that we're an active and vibrant team
[02:11] <snap-l> Which, we are, but we need to show it.
[02:11] <snap-l> So, if you have some spare cycles, please help fill these out
[02:11] <brousch> link to call for help https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-us-mi/2011-May/001412.html
[02:11] <snap-l> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MichiganTeam/TeamReports
[02:11] <snap-l> Thanks, brousch
[02:12] <snap-l> http://www.lczajkowski.com/2011/05/18/re-approvals-for-o-cycle-rules-and-overview/
[02:12] <snap-l> We need to have our application in before the release of Oneiric
[02:12] <snap-l> (onomatopaeia)
[02:12] <snap-l> We'll likely need to meet about this next meeting.
[02:13] <brousch> how far back are we going?
[02:13] <snap-l> Team was last approved in 2007, iirc.
[02:13] <brousch> i don't think west existed before 2009
[02:13] <snap-l> So I'd assume everything that's happened between now and then
[02:13] <snap-l> brousch: If you'd take charge of putting the formation of the west side, and any events, that would be great.
[02:14] <brousch> yep
[02:14] <snap-l> Awesome.
[02:14] <snap-l> Any questions about the re-approval?
[02:14] <snap-l> 3...
[02:14] <snap-l> 2....
[02:14] <snap-l> 1......
[02:15] <snap-l> OK, moving on, then
[02:15] <snap-l> MUG Meeting on June 14th
[02:15] <snap-l> Spoke with Jim McQuillan about this. He'd like to get something up on the MUG site tomorrow at the latest.
[02:15] <snap-l> so, what events do we have planned?
[02:16] <snap-l> rick_h_: I believe you're on the hook for PPAs, correct?
[02:16] <brousch> I hope someone else is actually here right now, because I haven't a clue
[02:16] <rick_h_> snap-l: yep, I'll have a talk on that ready
[02:16] <snap-l> rick_h_: Awesome.
[02:16] <brousch> ppas, good idea
[02:17] <snap-l> Did anyone else have something to talk about for the MUG meeting?
[02:17] <rick_h_> other than that, calling out a bunch of bumms :P
[02:17] <snap-l> rick_h_: Yeah
[02:17] <brousch> wish i could make it for video editing
[02:17] <snap-l> Blazeix, widox, waldo323_ ?
[02:17] <snap-l> I proposed talking about Natty if we needed some talks
[02:18] <snap-l> mostly Unity, though
[02:18] <snap-l> Speak now, or get drafted. ;)
[02:18] <brousch> audio editing, but i think you did last mug meeting
[02:18] <snap-l> brousch: A few meetings ago
[02:19] <brousch> a tour of the various spin-offs would be good: kubuntu, xubuntu, lubuntu, edubuntu, ubuntu studio
[02:20] <snap-l> OK, putting greg-g down for explaining why he's the model of a modern major general.
[02:20] <snap-l> He'll be singing the entire song, verbatim. ;)
[02:21] <snap-l> Reference: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zSGWoXDFM64
[02:22] <snap-l> OK, a better question would be who all os going to be at the MUG meeting on June 14th?
[02:22] <snap-l> o/
[02:24] <brousch> It feels lonely today
[02:24] <snap-l> Yeeah
[02:25] <snap-l> Maybe tonight isn't the best night for this?
[02:28] <brousch> :(
[02:28] <brousch> what's left?
[02:30] <snap-l> Last thing on the agenda is decommissioning the Google Calendar.
[02:30] <snap-l> And I know Wolfger had a dog in this
[02:30] <brousch> rename it the east michigan open source events calendar
[02:30] <snap-l> UNfortunately, he's in Germany right now
[02:31] <snap-l> That would make sense
[02:31] <snap-l> and then use the Ubuntu loco calendar for just loco events.
[02:31] <brousch> where's the loco calendar we should subscribe to?
[02:31] <snap-l> one sec.
[02:32] <brousch> http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/ubuntu-michigan/ical ?
[02:32] <snap-l> http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/ubuntu-michigan/ical
[02:32] <snap-l> Yep, that's the one
[02:33] <snap-l> First off, if anyone has any issues with that calendar, please let us know
[02:33] <brousch> ok, i subscribed
[02:34] <brousch> i have no idea if anyone else outside of detroiland is actually subscribed to that calendar
[02:35] <snap-l> Check with greg-g to see if you have access to create events on that calendar
[02:35] <brousch> i can make loco events
[02:35] <snap-l> or rather, to get access if you don't have access to create...
[02:35] <snap-l> OK
[02:36] <snap-l> Anything else?
[02:37] <snap-l> I'm going to leave the meeting open, just in case someone else shows up
[02:37] <brousch> we need to vote on the punishment for missing the meeting
[02:41] <snap-l> heh
[03:06] <snap-l> OK, calling the meeting adjourned.
[03:06] <snap-l> Thanks everyone for coming out that did come out
[03:07] <snap-l> I'm pretty sure we'll be talking about some of these things tomorrow.
[03:07] <rick_h_> night
[03:26] <greg-g> my apologies all, I was in a canoe, and it tipped, slowing our return home :/
[03:28] <snap-l> Ouch, sorry to hear that
[03:28] <snap-l> You OK?
[03:29] <snap-l> I mean, other than the obvious that you're able to be on IRC> :)
[03:29] <greg-g> yeah, all good.
[03:29] <greg-g> I hate swimming through lake weeds though, I freak out a bit
[03:29] <greg-g> :/
[03:29] <greg-g> lemme read the scrollback in a minute
[03:30] <snap-l> greg-g: Feeling things between your legs in murky water is always a bit freaky
[03:30] <snap-l> even if a minnow is just nibbling at your toes, it feels like you're being eaten alive.
[03:37] <greg-g> weeds are the worst, feels like you are being grabbed onto/pulled down
[03:37]  * greg-g shudders
[03:39] <greg-g> so yeah, I'll be at MUG
[03:39] <snap-l> greg-g: Cool.
[03:39] <greg-g> what could i talk about.... any requests?
[03:39] <greg-g> other than signing a song
[03:39] <greg-g> ;)
[03:40] <snap-l> Oh, you're still on the hook for that
[03:40] <greg-g> hah
[03:40] <snap-l> don't think just because you tipped a canoe means you're scott-free.
[03:41] <snap-l> What would you be willing to talk about?
[03:42] <snap-l> Governance?
[03:42] <snap-l> Figured we could talk a little about what the loco teams do
[03:42] <greg-g> hmmm, yeah
[03:43] <greg-g> I could do a little "Who we are/what we do/why we do it"
[03:43] <snap-l> How we fit in the grand scheme of loco-dom?
[03:44] <greg-g> yep yep
[03:44] <snap-l> That would be awesome. :)
[03:45] <greg-g> cool, I'll work on that :)
[03:45] <snap-l> So that's three things
[03:46] <snap-l> I'm wondering if we can get some other folks to participate.
[03:47] <greg-g> I hope so :/
[03:47] <greg-g> s/hope/hoped/
[03:47] <snap-l> Yeah, no kidding. :)
[03:48] <greg-g> ;)
[03:48] <snap-l> Well, we can still ask around tomorrow morning
[03:48] <greg-g> I hoped Amy's message to the list would have spurred some more response
[03:48] <greg-g> yeah, def
[03:48] <snap-l> and if something comes up and someone feels the need to help out, we can always fit them in
[03:48] <greg-g> poke _stink_ smoser waldo323_ to talk at MUG :)
[03:49] <snap-l> I was wondering if we could get JOhn Gruber to talk about Lernid, but I'm not sure he's a loco member.
[03:49] <snap-l> John S. Gruber
[03:49] <greg-g> he's on the mailing list, but not LP
[03:49] <snap-l> hurm
[03:49] <greg-g> counts for me :)
[03:49] <snap-l> Want to ask him if he'd be interested?
[03:50] <snap-l> I see LErnid as being one of those loco-ish things.
[03:56] <greg-g> oh, definitely, and yeah, I can
[03:56] <snap-l> Awesome. Thank you.
[03:56] <greg-g> I'm back to using taskwarrior, so I should remember to do it tomorrow :)
[03:56] <snap-l> Heh
[03:57] <_stink_> i love to talk at MUG... but Tuesday are simply a no-go for me.
[03:57] <_stink_> er
[03:57] <_stink_> i'd
[03:57] <snap-l> _stink_: That's OK, just cancel your previous engagement
[03:57] <snap-l> we'll understand
[03:57] <_stink_> shove the kid back up there
[03:57] <greg-g> no hard feelings here if you have to cancel on others
[03:57] <greg-g> ;)
[03:57] <snap-l> They might not, but they're not your real friends.
[03:58] <_stink_> :P
[04:04] <greg-g> alright, time for bed
[04:04] <greg-g> long day tomorrow
[04:04] <greg-g> g'night all!
[04:05] <greg-g> and thanks much, snap-l, for taking the reigns
[04:05] <snap-l> np, glad I cold help out.
[04:05] <greg-g> reins, I guess
[04:05] <snap-l> Nah, reign is fine. ;)
[04:05] <greg-g> ;)
[04:05] <snap-l> king for an hour
[04:11] <snap-l> Good night!
[04:11] <greg-g> snap-l: you might appreciate this. I cooked up this weekly status report thingy: http://grossmeier.net/taskreports/daily.html
[12:14] <rick_h_> morning party people
[12:15] <rick_h_> so can someone do me a favor and pull the internt plug for the day?
[12:15] <rick_h_> at least until the apple beer goggles fade off
[12:23] <greg-g> oh, today is WWDC?
[12:23] <rick_h_> yea
[12:23] <greg-g> ugh
[12:23] <rick_h_> and E3 starting
[12:23] <greg-g> yep, closing gwibber soon then, I guess
[12:23] <rick_h_> my poor google reader is shaking in a corner
[12:23] <greg-g> haha
[12:24] <rick_h_> yea, it's totally unprepared for the flood of "magic" coming its way
[12:32] <rick_h_> man, starting off the day blown away http://www.infoq.com/news/2010/01/rest-api-authentication-schemes
[12:33] <rick_h_> one of those "duh! that's brilliant, and I'd never thought of that"
[12:33] <rick_h_> or maybe I'm just easily impressed on a monday morning
[12:33] <rick_h_> snap-l: http://broadcast.oreilly.com/2011/06/the-good-the-bad-the-ugly-of-rest-apis.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+oreilly%2Fnews+%28O%27Reilly+News+and+Commentary%29
[12:33] <rick_h_> api fun for a monday
[13:33] <snap-l> http://adamjury.com/2011/ignite-slides-from-pepcon/ <- A short run-down of a presentation given to the Print and ePublishing 2011 conference.
[13:33] <snap-l> If even a handful of  publishers get this right, I think it could be remarkable.
[13:35] <rick_h_> awesome
[13:35] <snap-l> handful that don't already get it, rather.
[13:39] <greg-g> that was a good preso, thanks, snap-l
[13:48] <brousch> there's the slackjaw greg-g
[13:52] <greg-g> brousch: you missed my excuse!
[13:53] <greg-g> I was canoeing with Carrie and we, well, uh, tipped, and that kind of slowed down our return back home.
[13:54] <brousch> tipped? is that what we're calling it now?
[13:54] <greg-g> capsized
[13:55] <brousch> at least it was for fun reasons
[13:56] <greg-g> yeah, even though I *hate* swimming through lake weeds/lillies. Those things scare the crap out of me.
[13:56] <brousch> scare?
[13:56] <brousch> i find them unpleasant, but not scary
[13:56] <rick_h_> my wife hates lakes
[13:56] <rick_h_> just for that, "it's slimy OMG!!!!"
[13:56] <rick_h_> ummm, we're not exactly riddled with beaches around here that aren't lakes dear
[13:57] <brousch> i'll take a lake over the ocean
[13:57] <rick_h_> oh forget that, love me some ocean
[13:58] <brousch> salty, shark-infested, way too big
[13:58] <rick_h_> best thing of my cancun trip was getting a snorkel set during a trip
[13:58] <rick_h_> used that stuff all week just swimming off the resort beach
[13:58] <brousch> sharks
[13:59] <snap-l> Yeah, the lakes you just have perceived dangers (slimy weeds)
[13:59] <rick_h_> though did catch myself out a bit farther than I thought I should be a couple of times
[13:59] <greg-g> brousch: yeah, I'm abnormally afraid of it when I swim through it. Freaks the hell out of me.
[13:59] <snap-l> the ocean has things like jellyfish
[13:59] <rick_h_> oh mean, I wonder if I still have that picture
[13:59] <rick_h_> I got stung by a little jelly
[13:59] <brousch> i am not comfortable around any wild animal that is large enough to kill me
[13:59] <brousch> uncivilized
[14:00] <greg-g> brousch: I blame it on the fact that I drowned as a kid (in our pool in Texas, when I was around 5, fell with my tricycle into the pool. Heart stopped beating/breathed in water. Luckily mom is a nurse and dad worked in an ER)
[14:00] <rick_h_> greg-g: ouch man
[14:00] <snap-l> greg-g: That'll do it
[14:00] <brousch> greg-g: but that's a pool!
[14:00] <snap-l> brousch: That's unadulterated fear
[14:00] <snap-l> no child is ready for that.
[14:00] <brousch> true
[14:00] <greg-g> yeah, and I'm a-ok with pools now, because I can see everything/everyone/the bottom. But lakes kinda freak me out
[14:00] <brousch> scarred for life
[14:01] <greg-g> yep
[14:01] <snap-l> I remember diving into a wave pool without any life preserver
[14:01] <rick_h_> that'd suck, I love the water
[14:01] <brousch> i was always afraid of giant snapper turtles in our lake
[14:01] <snap-l> or tube.
[14:01] <rick_h_> I can't imagine being afraid of it
[14:01] <greg-g> I hope not to pass the fear on to my kids
[14:01] <brousch> greg-g: are you trying to tell us something?
[14:01] <rick_h_> greg-g: yea, we've been taking our little guy to the lake for swim lessons. Awesome to see an 18mo just fearless
[14:01] <snap-l> the alternating goung under water / getting a gulp of air before getting duked again was not pleasent.
[14:01] <greg-g> snap-l: ugh, that sucks. you feel so powerless
[14:02] <greg-g> brousch: well...
[14:02] <rick_h_> greg-g: so the dunking last night wasn't fun eh?
[14:02] <rick_h_> was it canoe/kayak?
[14:02] <snap-l> greg-g: Yeah, though luckily after a while I could touch bottom
[14:03] <snap-l> and eventualy I made it to shallower water
[14:03] <greg-g> brb, one sec
[14:03] <snap-l> had a splitting headache, though, from all of the adrenaline
[14:03] <brousch> my son dislikes lake michigan because the waves are so loud
[14:03] <brousch> oh man, i just realized we get to go swimming this year without a diaper or swimmy diaper
[14:04] <rick_h_> woo!
[14:04] <jjesse> looking forward to that
[14:04] <snap-l> W00t
[14:04] <rick_h_> that's the biggest thing, right now I need a sherpa to pack up and go to the beach
[14:04] <snap-l> jjesse: You still swim with a diaper? :)
[14:04] <jjesse> hahah
[14:04] <jjesse> for our little guy
[14:04] <jjesse> we got him a suit w/ floaties built into it for vacation
[14:04] <rick_h_> awesome
[14:09] <greg-g> back to your question, brousch, yes, we're expecting :)
[14:09] <greg-g> rick_h_: canoe
[14:09] <brousch> ohmy
[14:09] <greg-g> December-ish
[14:09] <brousch> congrats!
[14:09] <rick_h_> what?!
[14:09] <greg-g> thankya :)
[14:10] <rick_h_> what did I miss here?
[14:10] <brousch> you missed his subtle hint
[14:10] <rick_h_> well that reads like joking
[14:10] <rick_h_> for realz greg-g ?
[14:10] <greg-g> yep, we're about 13 weeks in
[14:10] <rick_h_> DUDE! congrats!
[14:11] <greg-g> thanks! :)
[14:11] <rick_h_> man, everyone it these days it seems
[14:11] <rick_h_> you kids :P
[14:11] <greg-g> we've been slowly telling people
[14:11] <greg-g> hah
[14:11] <jjesse> congrats greg-g
[14:11] <rick_h_> greg-g: definitely understand. That waiting to make sure all was cool was killer
[14:12] <rick_h_> let me know when you guys want to practice, I'll bring the boy over :P
[14:13] <snap-l> greg-g: That's awesome! Congratulations!
[14:14] <widox> greg-g: nice, congrats!
[14:15] <snap-l> http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/msg06464.html
[14:15] <snap-l> Apparently since the Apache OOo announcement, people are donating much more to the Document Foundation
[14:16] <greg-g> rick_h_: that, actually, would be fun
[14:16] <greg-g> thanks snap-l widox :)
[14:16] <rick_h_> Soon we'll have UH:CHC with BabyHackerSpace
[14:16] <greg-g> BbabyHackerSpace!
[14:16] <ColonelPanic001> why are we congratulating greg-g?
[14:16] <rick_h_> we'll bring in all the kids and let them go
[14:16] <ColonelPanic001> I missed it in the backlog
[14:17] <jjesse> ColonelPanic001 they are expecting
[14:17] <greg-g> ColonelPanic001: there's going to be a little-greg running around (well, crawling) in December
[14:17] <ColonelPanic001> I'll hold my congrats until it's confirmed he's born with an awesome beard.
[14:17] <jjesse> probablly not doing much in decembmer except eating, sleeping and pooping
[14:17] <ColonelPanic001> I kid. Congrats, greg.
[14:17] <ColonelPanic001> (lol "kid")
[14:18] <greg-g> jjesse: good point
[14:18] <greg-g> ColonelPanic001: thanks buddy
[14:20] <brousch> lots and lots of pooping
[14:20] <jjesse> can you imagine if the kid comes w/ greg-g beard?
[14:21] <jjesse> that would be awesome
[14:21] <ColonelPanic001> I'm hoping
[14:25] <brousch> i had to resent my droid. now it's trying to download 50 programs simultaneously
[14:25] <brousch> this won't end well
[14:26] <greg-g> so, the old wives tales, and Carrie's mom, who knew Carrie was pregnant before we told her we were trying (and before we knew), says it is a girl
[14:27] <rick_h_> greg-g: so I had 3 brothers, dad had 3 sisters
[14:27] <rick_h_> so I thought I was doomed, the rule was I was allowed to call it a "he" until we knew otherwise
[14:27] <rick_h_> everyone make girl jokes through the first several months
[14:27] <rick_h_> ended up a boy :)
[14:27] <greg-g> :)
[14:27] <rick_h_> so I say, think happy thoughts, talk to the little guy and let him know he's a he...and hope for the best
[14:27] <greg-g> haha
[14:28] <rick_h_> don't know about you, but I don't know how to do girls, my mom wore a dress twice in her life
[14:28] <rick_h_> so I was deathly afraid
[14:28] <greg-g> jjesse: oh, man, I missed your congrats, and didn't say thank you. Thanks buddy!
[14:28] <brousch> we're gonna need a playpen at the next ubuntu michigan meeting
[14:28] <greg-g> rick_h_: hah. I can be ok with them. WHen I was a camp counselor I most lead the girl groups
[14:29] <smoser> greg-g, i can talk about something... tomorrow. planning on attending. but dont want to sign up for more than 10-15 minutes.
[14:30] <rick_h_> smoser: that'd rock. I think we're just doing loco hosted lightning talks kind of thing
[14:30] <rick_h_> so that'd be perfect, just eat some time
[14:30] <smoser> whats the rest of the meeting ?
[14:30] <smoser> is there other stuff ?
[14:31] <rick_h_> no, Ubuntu Loco take over
[14:31] <rick_h_> we're sponsoring the meeting and just presenting from the group, so some natty stuff, I'll cover some PPA stuff
[14:32] <rick_h_> doesn't have to be ubuntu, just the general idea was for the loco to raise the $$ to fund and take over a meeting
[14:32] <smoser> yes, i knew that.
[14:33] <smoser> i can talk a bit on what Ubuntu Server is doing this cycle.
[14:34] <greg-g> smoser: yeah, 10-15 is perfect
[14:34] <greg-g> that topic would be great, smoser, thanks
[14:38] <snap-l> THank you, smoser
[14:38] <snap-l> BTW: it's the 14th, not tomorrow. :)
[14:39] <smoser> oh.
[14:39] <smoser> wow.
[14:39] <smoser> i would have been there otmorrow
[14:39] <smoser> :)
[14:39] <snap-l> smoser: YOu would have, and we would have missed your talk. ;)
[14:40] <snap-l> OTOH, someone else would have had a great talk on Ubuntu Server this cycle
[14:40] <snap-l> And I'm sure that the automotive engineers of tomorrow meeting would have been that much better for it
[14:40] <smoser> s/great/"great"/
[14:40] <snap-l> (or whatever they have that evening)
[14:40] <snap-l> No quotes needed.
[14:41] <greg-g> (emailed the Lernid guy about presenting at MUG)
[14:42] <rick_h_> greg-g: awesome
[14:43] <snap-l> Thanks, greg-g
[14:44] <greg-g> thank you, taskwarrior :)
[14:45] <snap-l> I'm going to send the MUG board a list of what'll be presented.
[14:45] <snap-l> (that which is already confirmed)
[14:47] <greg-g> snap-l: I have PPA:rick, Server:Scott, Unity:You, LoCo:Me
[14:47] <snap-l> Yep.
[14:49] <brousch> no jcastro? but he's our rock star!
[14:50] <rick_h_> http://www.androidcentral.com/using-google-music-manager-ubuntu-made-easy ok that's kind of cool
[14:52] <_stink_> greg-g: congrats!!
[14:53] <jcastro> no I am doing washlug this month already!
[14:53] <jcastro> I get a bye!
[14:53] <rick_h_> _stink_: we had our first case of me getting in trouble for bringing home the boy too dirty: https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/AvBuA3IBaPnebjWcdSHkuA?feat=directlink
[14:53] <rick_h_> evidently there are limits when she puts the boy in a shite shirt
[14:54] <_stink_> gah, the chance to sit in a huge tire trumps wardrobe
[14:54] <_stink_> rick_h_: so you guys are doing swim lessons?
[14:55] <rick_h_> _stink_: yea, we did them last year and just signed up for this year
[14:55] <_stink_> ah, cool
[14:55] <rick_h_> there's a pub beach just up the street that does them as part of the community program stuff
[14:55] <_stink_> we did that for a 6 week deal - it was ok... the water was friggin' freezing
[14:56] <_stink_> ah nice
[14:56] <rick_h_> yea, we went on mem. day and it was chilly
[14:56] <rick_h_> https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/OdUmPhPc_IJGzx6qjcbctw?feat=directlink
[14:57] <rick_h_> but sometimes you don't need to go in the water for fun
[14:57] <snap-l> jcastro: No bye. no bye
[14:57] <snap-l> you come, give presentation
[15:01] <jcastro> how long does it have to be?
[15:01] <jcastro> do I have to do unity?
[15:01] <rick_h_> snap-l:  is doing unity :P
[15:01] <snap-l> http://paste.mitechie.com/show/2ngaXSXdVRipSfzdqvEP/
[15:01] <greg-g> _stink_: thanks, buddy! :)
[15:01] <snap-l> jcastro: Yeah, I'll take care of Unity / Natty
[15:02] <rick_h_> jcastro: do some ubuntu one stuff, you've been chatting about that recently
[15:02] <rick_h_> show off something using the api?
[15:02] <snap-l> jcastro: I know you're probably burned out already.
[15:02] <jcastro> so what should I do?
[15:02] <rick_h_> photo app, etc
[15:02] <jcastro> oh, U1 would be good
[15:02] <jcastro> yeah
[15:02] <jcastro> I can do that
[15:02] <jcastro> sign me up for that
[15:02] <rick_h_> yea, easy, demo, and can be impressive
[15:02] <snap-l> OK, awesome.
[15:03] <rick_h_> and we can try to get some loco renewal points for showing off relevent "talk points" for this cycle :)
[15:03] <snap-l> Ubuntu One, Mark 2. ;)
[15:03] <greg-g> jcastro: doesn't have to be long, we're looking at 15ish minutes
[15:03] <greg-g> rick_h_: heh :)
[15:03] <rick_h_> greg-g: we all know we're part marketing arm heh
[15:03] <greg-g> 'tis true
[15:04] <brousch> snap-l: the mud meeting info on the calendar does not have a location
[15:04] <jcastro> it's not marketing, it's enablement!
[15:04] <jcastro> :)
[15:05] <jcastro> "hello, my name is rick, and today I will be going over vim and window management with vim."
[15:05] <snap-l> brousch: Yes, it does
[15:05] <snap-l> on the event itself, it does.
[15:05] <brousch> hm, must not transfer to the ical
[15:05] <snap-l> Unfortunately it's not in ical.
[15:05] <snap-l> *sigh*
[15:05] <rick_h_> jcastro: come on, I'm doing PPA's and I don't even use them any more so :P
[15:06] <snap-l> filing a bug
[15:06] <brousch> and no link to the event page
[15:06] <jcastro> how's that arch working out?
[15:06] <rick_h_> jcastro: sticking with it so far
[15:06] <jcastro> it was the buzz of UDS
[15:06] <rick_h_> it's give/take. Enough good I'm going forward
[15:06] <jcastro> everytime someone said somethign you didn't like in a session
[15:06] <rick_h_> has it's downside for sure
[15:06] <jcastro> you went "that's it, I AM SWITCHING TO ARCH!"
[15:07] <rick_h_> hah, awesome
[15:07] <rick_h_> I just want to be woo'd by my distro :P
[15:07] <rick_h_> Ubuntu doesn't open the door for me any more, it's a stale relationship
[15:07] <jcastro> why not debian?
[15:07] <jcastro> you feel more debianish to me
[15:07] <greg-g> rick_h_: stale is also stable :)
[15:08] <greg-g> yeah, that's what I would have thought as well
[15:08] <rick_h_> because I need some newer packages I used to get from PPA's
[15:08] <greg-g> rick == debian
[15:08] <greg-g> ah
[15:08] <rick_h_> and so it's a bit trickier to add
[15:08] <rick_h_> though debian was a full option if this arch thing blew up
[15:08] <rick_h_> I think that's the path, ubuntu->arch->debian->ubuntu
[15:08] <rick_h_> figure I'll be back in 3 releases
[15:09] <_stink_> haha
[15:09] <_stink_> i love that the failure map is already drawn
[15:09] <brousch> the meeting ends at 9pm? is that when people go home or when they head out to the afterparty?
[15:09] <jcastro> rick_h_: you should flav-style
[15:09] <jcastro> LTS only baby
[15:09] <jrwren> jcastro: i pulled a pint glass out of my cupboard last night and I realized that you've been married for a year last week. Happy Aniversary.
[15:09] <jcastro> jrwren: heh thanks
[15:09] <snap-l> https://bugs.launchpad.net/loco-directory/+bug/793557
[15:09] <rick_h_> jcastro: I was doing that, ran lucid up until my upgrades borked
[15:10] <snap-l> Can I get some "Amens" on that link?
[15:10] <rick_h_> brousch: we go out to 'dinner' after the meeting
[15:10] <rick_h_> man, making me launch launchpad ugh
[15:10] <rick_h_> ok, "Amen"'d
[15:10] <brousch> so you go out to eat at 9pm?
[15:10] <rick_h_> brousch: yes
[15:11] <jrwren> snap-l: may the force be with you
[15:11] <snap-l> and also with you.
[15:12] <greg-g> jcastro: oh dang yeah, happy 1 year!
[15:23] <snap-l> greg-g: I missed the taskwarrior report earlier. That's pretty cool.
[15:29] <greg-g> snap-l: yeah, basically a script that outputs the stuff into both RST and plain text files, emails the plain texts, and build html pages and copies those to my webspace for me.
[15:30] <greg-g> it is pretty specific/hardcoded for me, but it'd be cool to generalize it and share it with others
[16:46] <snap-l> http://tech.slashdot.org/story/11/06/06/1435259/Usenet-With-a-30-Year-Lag
[16:47] <snap-l> This looks awesome. Unfortunately it doesn't appear to be keeping up with reality.
[16:47] <snap-l> reality = slashdotting. ;)
[16:56] <greg-g> snap-l: yeah, I thought that was a neat idea
[17:01] <snap-l> Hanging out on twit.tv for their announcements.
[17:01] <snap-l> E3, Apple, etc.
[17:01] <snap-l> Should be an interesting day.
[17:02] <brousch> i'm following a twitter feed that publishes darwin's beagle diary 176 years from when he wrote them
[17:02] <snap-l> Heh
[17:08] <greg-g> brousch: are they associated with http://twhistory.org/ ?
[17:16] <brousch> i don't think so
[17:23] <snap-l> I just bought an air filter from Amazon.
[17:23] <snap-l> for my car
[17:24] <_stink_> that's not a book.
[17:24] <snap-l> because Meijer doesn't stock my filter.
[17:24] <snap-l> That is because I am living in the future.
[17:24] <jrwren> what kind of car?
[17:24] <snap-l> Dodge Caliber
[17:25] <jrwren> figures.
[17:27] <snap-l> And O'Reilly Auto Parts doesn't carry anything that doesn't start with Honda or Toyota
[17:30] <jrwren> Murrays?
[17:33] <snap-l> Oreilly bought Murrays
[17:39] <jrwren> oh
[17:39] <jrwren> napa?
[17:40] <snap-l> That's just it... one click, and I don't have to care
[17:41] <jrwren> but you have to wait.
[17:41] <jrwren> i'm a same day auto maintenance kidn of guy.
[17:41] <rick_h_> is the filter on fire?
[17:41] <jrwren> i go buy air filter, oil filter, oil and drive home and change it all.
[17:42]  * krondor snap-l reminds me I need a new air filter
[17:42] <krondor> places never have mine either :|
[17:43] <jrwren> krondor: what do you drive?
[17:43] <snap-l> I'm watching this Call of Duty XBox thing
[17:43] <snap-l> and frankly, I don't undertstand the allure of modern warfare games
[17:45] <snap-l> jrwren: I am too, but I'm not a fan of driving all over town just to get an air filter.
[17:45] <krondor> jrwren:  jag x-type
[17:45] <snap-l> And I'm not a fan of paying $15 for someone to drop it into my car at the oil change place.
[17:45] <jrwren> isn't jag x-type just a fancy taurus?
[17:45] <snap-l> ouch
[17:45] <krondor> jrwren: no it's a ford modeo
[17:45] <krondor> mondeo or whatever
[17:46] <jrwren> i'm not a fan of paying the oil change place
[17:46] <rick_h_> I'm not a fan of dealing with disposal, so I pay hte oil change guy
[17:46] <snap-l> rick_h_: ++
[17:47] <jrwren> Washtenaw County FTW, I guess.
[17:47] <jrwren> just go to AA recycle center and drop it off
[17:47] <_stink_> air filters are well worth doing yourself
[17:47] <_stink_> oil... not so sure.
[17:48] <jrwren> oil... I drop Mobil 1 in for about eh same price  you pay at a change place. Well worth it to me.
[17:48] <rick_h_> I do mobile 1 now, just pay throgh the nose for it
[17:48] <jrwren> It doesn't help that oil places always try to scam.
[17:48] <rick_h_> yea, always love the wipe blades and such upsel
[17:48] <jrwren> their upsell tactics disgust me.
[17:48] <rick_h_> sell
[17:49] <snap-l> Yeah, we noticed a bug on your windshield. For $80 we can replace your windshield for you.
[17:49] <jrwren> oh, and one time a place trashed my mom's engine. Didn't put the drain plug in well enough... new engine for her. fail.
[17:49] <rick_h_> yea, I had that happen :/
[17:49] <rick_h_> thankfully they've got insurance
[17:50] <krondor> jrwren anyway the mondeo wasn't sold here only EU so i'm not sure if that was why it's not a common filter size
[17:51] <snap-l> krondor: That would likely be part of it
[17:51] <snap-l> that and I think the Jag X-Type was more common here because of the ludicrous Ford lease deals.
[17:52] <krondor> yeah I got a good deal on it 2 years used, drives great and i like the AWD
[18:10] <snap-l> What the fuck
[18:10] <snap-l> Is everything now going fullscreen?
[18:11] <rick_h_> lol
[18:11] <rick_h_> only you'll be able to tile from time to time :P
[18:11] <snap-l> Seriously, we're going back to the DOS era because apparently the windowed environment is too ADD for people.
[18:11] <snap-l> Mission Control is what they're calling Spaces now.
[18:12] <snap-l> Oh hell no
[18:12] <snap-l> No scroll bars.
[18:13] <snap-l> I believe 201x is the era where the designers won, and we all get screwed. ;)
[18:13] <snap-l> I swear, if the next thing they talk about are TSRs, I'll spit fire.
[18:14] <rick_h_> yea, and 202x is where the doctors get to treat all the finger trauma caused by 10 years of trying to 4 finger cha-cha on your laptop
[18:14] <snap-l> rick_h_: ++
[18:14] <rick_h_> "all you have to do, is find this completely undiscoverable set of methods to input"
[18:14] <snap-l> Yeah, that's really annoying as hell
[18:15] <snap-l> I wonder if they're going to have a little card that you can use, like a "quick reference"
[18:15] <rick_h_> ooh, apps should have a "walkthrough"
[18:15] <rick_h_> it's so much better than trying to figure it out yourself
[18:15] <rick_h_> you can spend hours going through short video clips
[18:15] <rick_h_> on how to use things
[18:16] <_stink_> "the right way"
[18:16] <snap-l> https://identi.ca/notice/75568867
[18:17] <snap-l> I'm also not terribly a fan of the page-flip thing (though it's essentially alt-tab)
[18:18] <snap-l> (although I'm thinking that I'm a bit of a hypocrite, since keyboard gestures are not discoverable either)
[18:20] <snap-l> Apparently Unity is forward thinking. ;)
[18:20] <rick_h_> by 3wk
[18:28] <snap-l> jrwren: Watching live.twit.tv
[18:28] <snap-l> They're at least engaging.
[18:28] <jrwren> meh.
[18:29] <snap-l> They had a little bit of the feed until the person tho was feeding got yanked.
[18:29] <jrwren> twit.tv is like morning talk show radio. they just talk and talk and talk about nothing.
[18:29] <snap-l> Well, they're broadcasters
[18:29] <snap-l> though it's not that bad
[18:29] <snap-l> you don't have to pay too much attention
[18:34] <jrwren> tru
[18:35] <snap-l> Man, it's getting a little warm, but I'm loving this breeze.
[18:36] <rick_h_> I was tempted to move outside earlier
[18:36] <rick_h_> that's the downside of the smaller laptop though, giving up a lot of real estate to work outside
[18:38] <snap-l> Yeah
[18:38] <snap-l> Wondering if I should close up the house, or not
[18:38] <rick_h_> when out AC went that was the trick
[18:38] <rick_h_> open all the windows over night/first thing inthe morning
[18:39] <rick_h_> and then by 10am close up, shut the shades, etc
[18:39] <snap-l> Yeah
[19:02] <brousch> my phone is no longer downloading updates. all i get is download unsuccessful for the last 2 weeks. cleared caches, formatted sd card, reinstalled CM 6 rom. no luck
[19:05] <brousch> no i can get 1/4 apps to download only if i do it over 3g, not wifi
[19:06] <krondor> brousch:  which cache?  app caches or when you reinstalled rom did you wipe data and dalvik cache?
[19:06] <snap-l> brousch: Lovely.
[19:06] <brousch> krondor: wiped all caches, data and dalvik
[19:07] <krondor> brousch: hmm, are you behind a proxy when on wifi?  proxy gives me all kinds of fun issues with android.  Doesn't explain the 3/4 on 3g that don't download though I guess..
[19:08] <krondor> maybe an excuse to goto CM7
[19:08] <brousch> i am behind a proxy, but never had problems
[19:08] <brousch> but you know what, work and home are both using comcast internet now
[19:08] <brousch> could comcast be blocking this?
[19:10] <krondor> I would be really surprised if they were, I don't use comcast though ... are you using comcast dns?
[19:11] <brousch> hm, yeah
[19:12] <brousch> very strange
[19:13] <krondor> I'd try using google's dns and check your logcat to see why it says the download fails
[19:17] <brousch> logcat?
[19:24] <krondor> android has a circular syslog called logcat, you can just run logcat from a shell and get the output, there's apps to track it too or adb
[19:25] <brousch> now if only i could install an app ;)
[19:25] <brousch> gonna try CM7
[19:28] <brousch> krondor: btw, how is the detroit android group going?
[19:29] <brousch> at least rom manager and clockwork mod recovery work for me now
[19:34] <krondor> not bad, last meeting had about 9 people.  The first two were just kind of unstructured with no topic.  looks like the next one will have a topic (setting up the android dev environment(s))
[19:34] <snap-l> Man, I'd like to upgrade to Natty, but I'm not sure what'll break in the process. :)
[19:35] <rick_h_> when/where is this krondor?
[19:35] <snap-l> I guess you don't know how deep the water is until you jump in
[19:38] <krondor> rick_h_:  It's been the 4th tuesday of each month, probably will stay there though there was some discussion of moving it to thursday.  It's at i3Detroit in Ferndale so far.
[19:39] <brousch> krondor: i'm going to see what mobile monday michigan has to offer before starting the android gr group
[19:39] <krondor> i3detroit -- http://bit.ly/kxrqhe
[19:39] <krondor> brousch:  yeah I saw that link you sent me, had an interesting topic.  I need to make it out that way sometime too
[19:46] <krondor> stupid corporate proxy.  blogspot.com ban was bad enough and now tumblr.com.. yet exploit-db.com is totally fine
[19:48] <brousch> krondor: it looks like CM7 is working
[19:48] <krondor> nice and now you have CM7 too sounds like a win
[19:48] <brousch> strange that 6 would just stop like that
[19:49] <brousch> well, i tried cm7 a few months ago and it had some weirdness for me. the camera and flash were out of sync
[19:49] <krondor> what phone?
[19:52] <brousch> droid1
[20:06] <krondor> I love these password habit breakdowns off of hacks http://www.troyhunt.com/2011/06/brief-sony-password-analysis.html
[20:25] <rick_h_> yea, just frightening isn't it
[20:25] <rick_h_> 99% no non-alphanum
[20:25] <rick_h_> so single best password rule "pick something that's not a-z09 buddy"
[20:29] <jrwren> and longer than 10 characters.
[20:29] <jrwren> longer than 14 characters if windows is going to hash it
[20:30] <jrwren> because... http://www.golubev.com/files/ighashgpu/readme.htm
[20:33] <krondor> jrwren:++ rainbowcrack has had a gpu option I'm not sure how that ighashgpu proggie is different/better.  I haven't looked at that in a bit, but the pre-built 14 character ntlm hash has been around for awhile now
[20:35] <jrwren> ighashgpu isn't even rainbow tables and they are cracking 8char [A-Za-z0-9`~!@#$%^&*()-_=+[]{}\|;',./<>?] paswords in hrs.
[20:35] <krondor> ah ok
[20:35] <jrwren> just brute force.
[20:37] <_stink_> damn, including special chars
[20:37] <jrwren> yup
[20:37] <jrwren> GPUs are FAST
[20:37] <jrwren> and this is on 1 system with 1 gpu.
[20:38] <jrwren> they ahve numbers for 4 GPU
[20:38] <jrwren> and imagine a small cluster each node with a couple GPU
[20:38] <jrwren> or a larger cluster on EC2 with the GPU nodes.
[20:38] <jrwren> you could tear through a huge password file in very short time.
[20:38] <_stink_> so here's a question i suspect is stupid, and if i thought about it would be more obvious, but you guys are smart
[20:39] <jrwren> yes, women are beautiful.
[20:39] <jrwren> wrong question?  oops
[20:39] <_stink_> i need to think about that one more
[20:39] <_stink_> if hashed passwords aren't as safe as i might have thought, what are ways other than a security breach somewhere that hashed passwords would be exposed?
[20:40] <_stink_> that is, if i hear that there is a breack somewhere where i have an account, i need to change all reuses of that password everywhere else *anyway*
[20:40] <_stink_> and i don't really care whether they hashed it or not
[20:40] <_stink_> unless i'm overlooking some other way the hash would be exposed.
[20:40] <jrwren> i don't even know what you just said.
[20:40] <_stink_> hmm
[20:41] <_stink_> ok
[20:41] <jrwren> salted hashes are still pretty secure AFAIK
[20:41] <_stink_> why do i care whether hashed passwords can be reversed quickly?
[20:41] <jrwren> oh, i guess you don't have to care.
[20:41] <jrwren> the harder part is still getting the password file
[20:41] <_stink_> right, ok.
[20:41] <_stink_> i'm with you.
[20:41] <greg-g> oh, snap-l's not here, but damn, his dents, that sucks
[20:41] <krondor> _stink_:  if you're going on the premise that you will 'know' the place has been compromised and you will need to change that password everywhere else you re-use it.  You don't need to care.
[20:42] <krondor> but you're assuming you'll know
[20:42] <_stink_> yeah, i can grant that
[20:42] <_stink_> ultimately the problem with reuse.
[20:43] <jrwren> my concern is more as a developer i need to know this crap when i write apps.
[20:43] <jrwren> because md5(password) is almost always the wrong thing these days
[20:44] <krondor> failed login lockouts need to happen in more places.  There are so many things that let you try whatever password over and over again sometimes with a slight delay.
[20:44] <jrwren> and actually.. i guess salted passwords are just as vulnerable since its NOT a rainbow attack
[20:44] <jrwren> exponential backoff delay has proven to work pretty well.
[20:44] <jrwren> i'm not aware of too many compromises that have occurred against such an implementation
[20:45] <krondor> definitely it does, I suppose.  It just seems better to slam the door in someone's face then tell them try again in 30 seconds.  Probably more user issues then legitimately that are annoying though.
[20:46] <krondor> I think more of these hacks come from sql injection or 0day whatever then brute force though, but still not an excuse to not countermeasure it
[20:48] <krondor> wwdc looks like apple assuming android features (notifications bar, widgets (well that's a bit different), split keyboard).  oh well good ideas a good idea *copy/paste*
[20:48] <jcastro> OH MY GOD. IF I BUY THE SONG I DONT HAVE TO SYNC ANYTHING?
[20:48] <brousch> so what should i do instead of md5(password)?
[20:50] <rick_h_> bcrypt is one way
[20:50] <rick_h_> I do sha256 of a salted password
[20:50] <rick_h_> where each salt is unique per user
[20:51] <rick_h_> but things like login throttling, https for all auth, and account lock outs are important
[20:51] <rick_h_> but annoying at times
[20:52] <snap-l> Oh, I am not a happy camper
[20:53] <brousch> that's why i prefer a hotel
[20:53] <snap-l> Bluetooth: Screwed
[20:53] <snap-l> ATI drivers: screwed (won't install)
[20:53] <snap-l> my /var/storage directory, which contained things like backups, and my entire, ripped CD collection in FLAC format: erased.
[20:53] <brousch> natty loves you
[20:54] <brousch> that's odd
[20:54] <snap-l> It's bullshit.
[20:54] <snap-l> It mounted it, and then figured since it was under /var, it should be completely obliterated
[20:55] <greg-g> fucking eh, man, that sucks
[20:55] <snap-l> Also not present after upgrade: irssi, postgresql
[20:55] <rick_h_> postgresql gets moved because it does side by side support
[20:55] <snap-l> I'm not sure why we offer an upgrade, because frankly it doesn't fucking work.
[20:55] <rick_h_> so it doesn't "upgrade" it should side by side 8 and 9
[20:55] <snap-l> rick_h_: No, it didn't even let me do psql
[20:56] <rick_h_> ah, not sure then
[20:56] <rick_h_> agree though, I never upgrade and my one time trying it with natty ended in fail
[20:57] <snap-l> Well, I didn't expect it to mount a drive, only to delete the contents of it
[20:57] <jrwren> krondor: you understand "exponential backoff" right?
[20:57] <snap-l> But, that does expose a chink in my armor, which is I never backed that up because it was too big
[20:58] <rick_h_> yea, +1 for cloud because I've gotten sick of getting a bigger and bigger drive every year
[20:58] <jrwren> brousch: definitely use a salt.  and yeah... sha256(saltedpassword)
[20:58] <krondor> jrwren:  yeah, you're delaying login longer with each failure on some exponential growth curve right
[20:59] <rick_h_> I want to check out bcrypt sometime just because of that work load factor built in
[20:59] <snap-l> I love too that "development is completed on Natty", which means "we don't want to hear about your stupid problems".
[21:00] <snap-l> And I'm done.
[21:00] <rick_h_> http://www.mindrot.org/projects/py-bcrypt/
[21:00] <rick_h_> done being angry? or done in another way?
[21:00] <krondor> can I go home yet? This day is dragging
[21:01] <jrwren> blowfish?
[21:01] <rick_h_> yea, you get to put a 'work' factor into the password gen
[21:01] <jrwren> interesting call :)
[21:01] <snap-l> Well, I'm going to run the upgrades to see if something might have been fixed along the way
[21:02] <snap-l> but if not, I'm dropping back to LTS.
[21:02] <snap-l> or maybe something else. I'm not sure
[21:02] <snap-l> am rather hurt right now
[21:02]  * greg-g hugs snap-l 
[21:03] <brousch> so it mounted your drive and then deleted it?
[21:03] <_stink_> there's another topic for MUG!
[21:03] <greg-g> there should be some way to get the data back, I mean, it didn't write over it, did it?
[21:03] <_stink_> but really, that totally sucks and i would be livid.
[21:03] <greg-g> yeah, ditto
[21:03] <snap-l> No, but I'm not sure what condition the data will be in once recovered
[21:03] <greg-g> depends
[21:03] <snap-l> and yes, it mounted it, and then deleted it
[21:03] <greg-g> I mean, some of those data recovery tools aren't too bad
[21:04] <snap-l> I'm going to copy off the hidden directory that was on there to another drive
[21:04] <snap-l> and then see what I can do to get the data off of it
[21:04] <snap-l> Never thought making a hidden directory would save my ass
[21:04] <krondor> extundelete may work (assuming it was ext3 or 4)
[21:04] <snap-l> it's ext4
[21:05] <snap-l> And that'll teach me to mount something as /var/storage. ;)
[21:05] <rick_h_> yea, I always mount as a subdir in /home/rharding
[21:06] <greg-g> alright, ehading home time
[21:06] <greg-g> laters
[21:06] <rick_h_> even my sdcards and such I manually mount to /home/rharding/tmp
[21:06] <snap-l> laterness
[21:06] <rick_h_> have fun greg-g, good day for a ride it looks like
[21:06] <snap-l> I'd love to know why fglrx isn't working on this machine
[21:06] <brousch> i mount stuff in /media or /mnt
[21:09] <jrwren> /var/storage was something special?
[21:10] <snap-l> it was, and not anymore.
[21:11] <brousch> it was his cloud
[21:12] <brousch> and a narwhal ate it
[21:12] <brousch> and he is left with nappy narwhal farts
[21:18] <jrwren> I'm still not clear on how having a /var/SOMETHING mount screwed an upgrade.
[21:21] <snap-l> jrwren: It didn't screw up the upgrade, the upgrade deleted the contents of the directory
[21:21] <jrwren> how the hell did it do that?
[21:21] <jrwren> that sounds super fucked.
[21:22] <snap-l> I would love to know, personally.
[21:26] <snap-l> What a mess
[21:27] <brousch> someone buy snap-l a drink
[21:37] <snap-l> And shotwell decided to try and import every graphic on my hard drive
[21:38] <snap-l> Not sure why, it just decided to.
[21:38] <snap-l> I swear, this versionof Ubuntu is going to drive me to a Mac.
[21:44] <snap-l> And Banshee is haging
[21:44] <brousch> apple has ubuntuone now
[21:44] <brousch> appleone
[21:44] <brousch> ut oh
[21:45] <krondor> why stream your music when you can push copies of it to all your devices, just make sure you buy that 64 gb iphoneX t house it.
[21:48] <brousch> i need to give ampache a try. it has android clients
[22:48] <jrwren> apple has had mobile me for years.
[22:50] <brousch> but no one uses it
[22:50] <jrwren> only mac heads.
[22:50] <jrwren> which i suspect will be true of the new stuff too
[22:50] <brousch> i'm about 1/3 of the way moved back to linux from osx
[22:51] <brousch> has snap-l returned yet?
[23:14] <snap-l> Who is the patron saint of lost causes?
[23:15] <snap-l> Because I thnk I need an intercession
[23:19] <brousch> it is Nay
[23:20] <brousch> she is an old nag
[23:21] <snap-l> And JoDee just burned three pork chops
[23:22] <snap-l> Technology can go fuck itself.
[23:24] <greg-g> :(
[23:24] <brousch> not good
[23:25] <brousch> greg-g: is that what you said when your canoe flipped?
[23:25] <greg-g> that was more "oh sh!t!!"
[23:25] <greg-g> and then "I'm sorry I'm sorry I'm sorry"
[23:25] <greg-g> (yeah, it was my fautl)
[23:26] <brousch> and then, "ewewewewewewe"
[23:27] <greg-g> yep
[23:27] <greg-g> :)