[06:56] wow, hd 6770m is one unhappy camper at the moment, all kinds of crashy in stock natty and compiz doesn't work with edgers [06:57] well this is a firepro m5950 in a precision m4600, same GPU though [06:58] Heh. If only I had such problems :) [07:01] 240w power brick for it is bigger than a netbook :) [07:04] Sorry, *what* ? That's a 240W power brick for a *laptop* ? [07:04] Or should I say “portable”? :) [07:06] 10.4lbs with 2 little strips of foam in the box :) [07:07] 4.7 kg? That's pretty heavy. [07:08] the laptops only 2.8 of that [07:08] rest is power brick [07:08] ... [07:08] Does the laptop not actually have a battery? [07:08] :) [07:10] it's got the 6 cell option, 2 hours :) [07:10] "option".. [07:10] yeah vs the heavier 9 cell for an extra 20 minutes [07:10] ah [07:11] How much power does it draw under full load? [07:15] i'll let ya know tomorrow when it's working again and not 2 am, needs to sit without a battery for another hour or so to be able to power back on after what I did to it :) [07:16] How have you been mistreating the poor box! [07:16] ran unity on it, obviously [07:16] or tried to [07:25] the GPU is only 25W TDP [07:25] think they just grabbed a brick from a m6600 and sent that [07:28] Well, at least it can charge the battery under full load! [07:37] sarvatt, D: [07:37] i was about to get one [07:37] *the 6770m [08:21] bryceh: I'll merge xorg and drop the drivers that were discussed on the list [08:21] from -video-all [08:22] tjaalton, great [08:25] probably need to drop the doc-building stuff from build-deps, unless they are all in main [08:25] which I doubt [08:29] hum, it's only asciidoc now, and it's in main [08:35] tjaalton, btw I trimmed down the arm drivers a while back; if there's other architectures we care enough about, might want to do similarly for them [08:39] bryceh: looks like powerpc is supported, I'll check that one too [08:40] and i think -vesa is useless on arm? [08:41] That matches my understanding. [08:42] VESA only works where there's a video bios, and since arm boards don't have bioses… [08:42] right [08:49] tjaalton, yeah I left it only because I couldn't pin down an absolute, "Yes it's definitely not needed on arm" from anyone, and since it's such a trivially tiny driver just left it [08:49] bryceh: indeed it is [08:50] bryceh. fallback in a nutshell: gnome-panel as manual fallback or automatic for gnome-shell. unity-2d as manual and automatic fallback for unity. [08:51] according to didrocks from ayatna/desktop [08:51] gnome-shell pulls in all requisite packages. [08:52] automatic applies to all 3d-less scenarios. failsafex is our judgment call. [08:53] https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-desktop/2011-June/003079.html [09:01] I've also replied to that; I think that whatever fallback session would normally kick in is the right thing to use. [09:11] traditionally we've not bothered to fire up a WM at all. Since we only need to run a single app we just run that as the root application [09:11] however nothing says we can't revisit that design [09:12] the one trade off is the more things we depend on the less failsafey we become [09:12] Yeah. [09:13] aren't we mixing two things here? the one fallback is if the hw can't handle full 3d-unity/gnome-shell, the other is where the normal gdm/lightdm startup failed and so we use some defaults [09:13] Hm. We might be able to kill two birds with one stone. [09:14] Since we'd want FailsafeX to *say* it's failsafe, we could pop up, say ‘Failsafe mode ENGAGE!’ and offer a minimal or full session. [09:14] so the other fallback is for the system, the other for the user session [09:17] tjaalton, yeah two separate things conceptually [09:18] My conception of FailsafeX is that we want to end up with it kicking in when the recovery boot is activated, right? [09:23] in situations where the recovery boot is needed due to a graphics failure, that's correct [09:24] gdm/lightdm failing to start X would be another situation (probably rare) where failsafex should be popped up [09:25] there may be one or two other situations where we might want to tie it in [09:25] where I'm a bit fuzzy is if in the recovery boot should xdiagnose or whatever pop itself up, or just be provided as a clickable icon or some such [09:26] "clickable icon" sounds like something that needs X :) [09:28] hmm forgot that it's not just failsafex [10:05] a flowchart from grub to unity, covering all the possible scenarios would be nice :) [10:07] tjaalton, ...and as soon as you finish drawing it, someone would immediately introduce a change to render it obsolete ;-) [10:07] actually, there is a good description of the sequence listed with one of the kernel troubleshooting docs [10:08] Sarvatt: meh. X segfaults. =( [10:08] Sarvatt: i guess it's to be expected from an ABI-incompatible X. [10:10] tjaalton, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Troubleshooting/BlankScreen [10:11] hm, not much of a flow chart [10:12] bryceh: well, one covering the boot-up from X's perspective, that shouldn't change too often :) [10:52] Hi, I have a new Acer Aspire 5736Z laptop that I am having problems upgrading to 11.04 on. Have tried upgrading via the Update Manager, fresh install, alternative cd fresh isntall, and I get to reboot and as soon as the screen comes after clicking on the kernal option, the screen goes black, there is no backlight. There is a bug number #759104, has anybody any idea if this will get fixed? I cant upgrade otherwise. Funny thing though, I have [10:52] an Acer Aspire One netbook, and it works ok on there. [11:08] scoundrel50a: try installing 2.6.39-oneiric from here http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/ [11:19] oh hello, just noticed this now. Thank you. Will see how far I get. Can that be installed over the top, or on another partition? [11:20] One thing I forgot, I am using 64bit, is there a 64bit version? [11:20] http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/v2.6.39-oneiric/ [11:20] yes [11:20] grab the amd64.deb and install it [11:22] linux headers, or linux image? [11:22] image [11:22] ok, will give it a go, be back soon [11:23] thank you [11:26] do I just install as I would a normal .deb package, not done it this way before. [11:26] dpkg -i ...deb [11:27] ok, will give it a try [11:29] daft question I know, but should I close everything down before starting the installation, will be going offline if I do [11:29] will trying logging in again on a different pc [11:30] um no [11:30] you can install it from a running session.. then reboot [11:30] ok, well, I am about to install [11:30] though if you just have a black screen then you can't install it, right? [11:31] it gets to the end of the installation, I click on the kernal and the screen goes blac [11:31] too late now its going through it again [11:31] ok, installation finished, what do I do now? [11:32] reboot? [11:32] how did you install it? [11:32] using the command you gave, dpkg -i ....deb [11:33] I can see its added an extra kernal [11:33] you said it had a black screen, so I gave you bad advice [11:33] ah [11:33] well, as its installed, I will try to boot that up, see if anything has changed, one sec [11:34] brb [11:34] have another pc so will log in with that one [11:36] ok,on different oc [11:36] going to reboot other one now, [11:38] rebooting, same thing happened, backlight not working, can just see the log in screen, but can not log in as I cant see curser [11:39] tried using ctrl+alt+ > not working either [11:40] scoundrel50a_: "same thing.." that's not the same you described earlier, getting a black screen and nothing else [11:43] um, sorry, I thought I mentioned the backlight didnt work [11:44] so what login screen are you talking about? [11:44] and are you saying it hasn't changed with the new kernel [11:45] the log in box, where it has the logo and choice to pick users, no it hasnt changed, still no backlight [11:46] and you installed the .39 kernel when you had booted using the one from maverick? [11:46] if you check the bug I posted, it should tell you there, and it gives you the xorg and old xorg files [11:47] no, havent installed fromMaverick since the day 11.04 came out, as I got this same problem [11:47] no they don't tell me how you installed the kernel [11:47] I'm just trying to make sure you actually are running it [11:48] on the bug you said that the way to boot natty was to use the previous kernel (=maverick) [11:48] yes [11:48] I could do it that way [11:48] but it looked like windows 98 on a very old machine [11:49] then you could try the 3.0-rc1 kernel from the same url i gave you [11:50] ok, need to reboot again [11:50] how can I uninstall that version? as I dont want loads of kernals showing [11:51] dpkg --purge linux-image-2.6.39-020639-generic [11:51] ok, [11:52] (and it's kernel) [11:52] oh sorry using a netbook, 10 inch, and got big fingers [11:56] purging now [11:59] um, I dont have the url, it went when I rebooted and changed pc, can you give it to me again [12:01] http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/v3.0-rc1-oneiric/ [12:01] ok, will try that one, thank you [12:03] ok, about to install this version [12:10] about to reboot [12:12] exactly the same, once you chosse the kernel, it starts to boot, the backlight turns off, and that is it, [12:13] brb, [12:13] # [12:13] then it would be nice to get the dmesg output of the broken kernel [12:13] attached to the bug [12:15] how do I do that? [12:15] install openssh-server on the system, and log in remotely with ssh [12:16] have to start up, have to tell you, I cant even boot up the rescue bit, that has the same problem, no backlight [12:17] ok, will see if i can do that [12:20] ok, I'm on my netbook, on 11.04, my laptop do I need to boot up to the new kernel, the try to connect from netbook? [12:20] do you have ssh-access to the laptop? [12:21] well openssh-server is installed on both machines [12:21] how do I connect? [12:21] so that the networking works without the user session running.. [12:21] ssh uid@foo [12:22] ok, not done this before, the uid is the id of the laptop yes? What is foo? [12:22] no, username@machinename [12:23] or ip instead of the name [12:23] how do I find out the ip address? and see if both machines are viewable on the network? [12:23] i give up [12:24] sorry [12:24] ok, I'm sorry too [12:25] upstream might be interested, but they need the dmesg output [12:25] though, you can probably parse it from /var/log/kern.log too [12:26] which you can get to with the maverick kernel [12:26] but I cant get that till I can find out if I can get into other machine, thank you anyway, [12:27] no, you use the same method to get it as you used to install the test kernels.. [12:31] I'll see if I can work it out, and find out the ip address adn connect [12:32] easier to find the kern.log* which has the information from the bad boot.. [12:33] how do I do that then? [12:33] oh just saw [12:33] will go check [12:34] just rebooting other machine [12:37] I found kern.log, would you like to see a copy? See if you find out? [12:38] are there many of them? kern.log.1 etc [12:38] locate the one that has the info about the 3.0-rc1 kernel [12:39] kern.log and kern.log.1 [12:40] and I think it is just kern.log that shows the kernels you want, shall I pastebin it? [12:40] for instance [12:40] you know the 'pastebinit' command? [12:41] need to install the package first [12:41] can I do it via ubuntu pastebin it, can copy it [12:41] give you the url [12:42] no, apt-get install pastebinit, then run 'pastebinit /var/log/kern.log' [12:42] then give me the url [12:47] http://paste.ubuntu.com/619840/ sorry took so long, netbook at its limit [12:49] brb [12:53] you could try adding 'GRUB_GFXPAYLOAD_LINUX=text' to /etc/default/grub, then run update-grub [12:55] ok, will give it a go, is that done in Maverick? [12:55] no, it's a new feature in natty [12:56] so how do I GET INTO IT THEN? [12:56] huh? [12:56] oops sorry didnt know I had caps lock on till I sent sorry [12:56] you edit the file, and add that line.. [12:56] ok [12:56] then run update-grub, and reboot [12:59] ok, do I need to add the inverted commers or leave them out [13:03] ok, going to reboot into 11.04, after updating [13:04] inverted commers? [13:05] things at beginning and end of text you gave me, dont know what they call them here [13:05] and left them out, ran update rebooted and nothing [13:05] backlight turned off again [13:06] it actually turns off just before the log in page appears, and the drums sound [13:06] why should it turn the light off [13:07] can you ctrl-alt-F1 [13:07] to change to the virtual console [13:07] I dont know, tried but no backlight, cant see anything [13:09] I treid to get into recovery mode, a load of script went up the page, then the screen went black and now I cant see anything [13:09] something is turning the light off [13:11] probably when the i915 module is loaded [13:12] is there a way around it? I just tried to log on blind, clicked enter, then entered my password and I get logged in, but no light [13:13] I have to use the on off button to turn off then [13:13] it is loading [13:13] what is? [13:13] Ubuntu [13:14] I get the music [13:14] but black screen [13:14] the backlight needs to turn on [13:15] I wish there was a way foryou to see what was happening [13:15] I honestly think it is as simple as finding out what is turning the backlight off [13:16] if this little netbook, Acer Aspire One can work on 11.04 I dont understand why my Lsptop which is the same make cant work either [13:16] you can blacklist the i915 kernel module, but you'd have a "crippled" system then [13:17] "the same make" != "the same hw" [13:17] but if I have a crippled system that isnt worth using then [13:17] i bet the netbook doesn't have intel GM45 on it [13:17] then stick with maverick [13:17] dont know [13:17] or lucid [13:17] which is lts [13:18] I think I am going to have to. Its Maverick [13:18] thank you I really appreciate the help [13:18] I hope they manage to find out why it keeps turning the backlight off [13:19] an upstream bugreport might help.. [13:19] how can I do that? [13:20] sign in on bugs.freedesktop.org and file it under xorg, driver/intel [13:22] ok, not seen that before, will try set up an account an file a report, thank you [13:24] actually, use product DRI and component DRM/Intel [13:29] what version? [13:30] and should I add an attatchment of anything? [13:31] leave the version [13:33] you could boot with adding 'drm.debug=0x02' to the kernel options [13:34] RAOF: Is http://wstaw.org/m/2011/06/06/plasma-desktopcs1575.jpg what's supposed to happen when someone reports a bug on xserver-xorg-video-intel? [13:34] either by editing the grub boot entry when selecting the kernel, or add it to GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX="" in /etc/default/grub [13:36] tjaalton: ok, will try adding that to the grub file, just finishing the bug report [13:36] ScottK: In Natty, or in Oneiric? It is in natty, because the bugs filed post-release are generally of very low quality. [13:37] It was natty. [13:38] Bryce added that to the apport hook for natty post-release; a lot of the bugs that we get post-release for X *are* support requests, and so aren't well-handled on launchpad. [13:38] a non-question with a question mark and yes/no answers? [13:38] One of our more technical users was a bit put off by it, but was cool with it once I explained. [13:38] In fact, there he is now. [13:39] * ScottK waves to jussi. [13:39] heya ScottK [13:39] jcristau: Hm. Now that I *read* it more thoroughly, it could do with a bit of a reword :) [13:39] I've started using 'convert to a question' more, but you're right, that doesn't really solve the problem. [13:40] It went through a couple of revisions; at first it pointed more directly at askubuntu.com, and that resulted in a lot of poor quality questions there :/ [13:41] That sounds like progress at least. [13:41] Poor quality questions in the place for questions beats poor quality questions on the bug tracker. [13:44] I think it may be useful to reword the second option to include something like "Im sure its a bug" or something, rather than the only options being that it started after an update or I talked to people already. It doesnt leave much room for "I understand what Im doing, I want to report the bug" [13:45] The problem is everyone thinks they know what they are doing. [13:45] Heh. [13:46] Hrm [13:47] I think it could do with a re-wording, and we'll likely do the same thing once 11.10 ships. Would you consider sending a mail to ubuntu-x? [13:47] RAOF: of course I can do that - ubuntu-x@l.u.c? [13:48] Yup. [13:50] Ok, Ill try send it this afternoon. If you get a chance, please take a look at bug 793487 :) (and scream at me for all the things Ive missed telling you). [13:50] Launchpad bug 793487 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu) "Kubuntu does not shut down when external monitor attached through displayport (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/793487 [13:59] tjaalton: hi I entered a bug, its #37986 [13:59] RAOF: sent. Hope that isnt too log'sy. [14:03] scoundrel50a_: ok, now add the drm.debug=0x02 to the kernel options so the kern.log gets debugging info about the state [14:04] so how do I do that? Would not have a clue [14:05] bryceh: looks like my message got caught in moderation or rejected. do I need to resend now Im subscribed or can you just accept it? [14:07] scoundrel50a_: scroll back.. [14:11] bryceh: never mind, I resent. [14:16] tjaaltonnow you lsot me, if I add that to /etc/default/grub how do I add it to the bug report? I have no clue, sorry, I have not entered a bug report before. [14:18] scoundrel50a_: add it to /etc/default/grub, run update-grub, boot with the bad kernel, then boot with the good one and edit kern.log to only have the bootlog from the bad kernel, attach that to the bugreport... [14:18] that=the edited log [14:20] ok, I know you are going to kill me when I ask this, but how do I edit kern.log to only have bootlog from bad kernel......as I said this is completely new to me.......I am really sorry. :( [14:20] so you have a program you use to edit /etc/default/grub... [14:20] now copy kern.log somewhere and edit it [14:21] .. [14:22] it's big, but you'll find the new stuff at the end [14:23] or just attach the whole file, but remember to mark it as text/plain [14:25] ok, added drm.debug=0x02 to /etc/default/grub ran update-grub and got this error /etc/default/grub: 13: drm.debug=0x02: not found.......it wont update now [14:26] ok, added drm.debug=0x02 to /etc/default/grub ran update-grub and got this error /etc/default/grub: 13: drm.debug=0x02: not found.......it wont update now [14:27] oh, sorry about that, dont know why it posted twice [14:27] you need to add it inside the double quotes in GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX=""... [14:27] ohhh [14:29] updating now, [14:31] ok done that, now I have opened the kern.log what do I add, to the log? [14:34] not add, delete the stuff that aren't interesting [14:35] which kernel did you boot? [14:35] the broken one, now i am booting the old one, Maverick [14:36] which broken one, natty or 3.0-rc1 [14:36] ? [14:36] I see what you mean about editing, if I can work out what we need [14:37] so you can skip everything else, just take what was generated by the previous boot, and why not the current one that's with the known good kernel [14:38] +also [14:40] I dont have natty, I only have 3.0-rc1 I am looking through now, but cant work out when it started from booting to 3.0-rc1, I found something that talks about backlight, trying to look through [14:41] sure you do [14:41] check the timestamps [14:42] and the version string [14:42] even found something about status failed, timestamps are what I found [14:43] /aw [14:43] oops [14:43] "Linux version 3.0.0-0300rc1-generic", search for that [14:44] ok, completely lost, can I give you the file in pastebin, so you edit it? I honestly dont know what I am looking for. [14:44] no [14:45] if you can't edit it, then attach the whole file as text/plain mimetype [14:46] I think I will have to do that, as I cant see what I am looking for...... [14:46] you can't search for a string? [14:46] what editor are you using? [14:53] sorry I havent got back to you, trying to add the file, but getting an error saying its too big, even though I set it to plain text.....have to pastebin it, by the looks of things. [14:54] it won't stay there forever [14:55] Its times like this I wish I was younger and went to college to learn about computers [14:55] or buy machines that are certified ;) [15:06] kern.log added, edited, but not sure if it is in the right place [15:06] added the kern.log as attachment [15:09] yeah, looks good [15:10] ok, I have to say, that was the most difficult thign i have done in ages, I love Ubuntu, but sometimes it is really confusing using it and the things associated with it. [15:10] Thank you for your help, I really appreciate it [15:27] scoundrel50a_: can you see a blinking cursor or the "ubuntu" splash-screen when the machine is booting up, and does the backlight turn off right when the login screen appears? [15:32] scoundrel50a_: also, you could try editing /etc/modprobe.d/local.conf, and add a line that says "blacklist acer_wmi", then try booting the 3.0-rc1 kernel [15:33] could be that it's conflicting with the i915 graphics module, both fighting for the acpi backlight control [15:44] at least that's something not loaded with the maverick kernel, so maybe blacklisting it will fix the issue [15:49] scoundrel50a_: I added that to the bug too, update it with what you find out [15:49] gotta run -> === ara_ is now known as ara [17:24] its booting up now [18:07] scoundrel50a_: booting up, as in working fine or not? [18:11] not working [18:12] is the latest log with the acer_wmi module blacklisted? [18:13] yes [18:13] and still doesnt work [18:13] no, sorry, just got what you meant, i WILL HAVE TO POST THAT NOW. sORRY [18:14] sorry about caps [18:14] thanks :) [18:14] on netbook [18:41] tjaalton: have added the kern.log hope its worked properly [18:56] scoundrel50a_: ok, add to the upstream bug that this was with the acer_wmi module blacklisted [20:25] ricotz, have you noticed anything weird about the numlock key in gnome 3? Mine is chaotic. the key needs to be off for the numpad to work, or something === yofel_ is now known as yofel [21:13] bjsnider, havent noticed this, works for me as expected