[05:44] <pitti_> Good mormorning
[05:45] <pitti> mterry: I don't have an example of defining signals in python, I'm afraid
[07:39] <didrocks> good morning
[07:40] <didrocks> robert_ancell: hey, I've been able to login! nice work :-)
[07:40] <robert_ancell> didrocks, well, that's good news!
[07:41] <didrocks> indeed, I was fearing a little bit choosing lightdm by default yesterday in the debconf screen :-)
[07:41] <didrocks> and was planning to slack for an entire day
[07:41] <didrocks> but again, no excuse then! :-)
[07:46] <pitti> bonjour didrocks
[07:46] <didrocks> guten morgen pitti
[07:47] <didrocks> pitti: thanks for pushing the SRU!
[07:47] <didrocks> IIRC, there was a verification failed bug, I have to find it to retarget for the dx team
[07:50] <pitti> didrocks: bug 750781
[07:50] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 750781 in unity "Opening quicklist with launcher keynav returns focus to previous window" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/750781
[07:50] <pitti> didrocks: I watned to reopen it, but LP keeps timing out
[07:50] <pitti> they had a performance regression in this night's rollout
[07:50] <pitti> I'll keep trying
[07:51] <didrocks> pitti: don't bother, I'll do it. Thanks for the link :-)
[07:51] <didrocks> indeed, timeouting here as well, with the ajax or static method
[07:52] <pitti> didrocks: http://identi.ca/launchpadstatus/all
[07:52] <didrocks> pitti: do you use identica or did they pointed this to you? :)
[07:52] <didrocks> ok, nice to know it's under work
[07:53] <lifeless> pitti: that may be a different issue
[07:54] <lifeless> pitti: the slowdown we have is contention related
[07:54] <pitti> didrocks: lifeless pointed it out
[07:54] <lifeless> Can you get an OOPS code for it ?
[07:54] <didrocks> pitti: oh, you didn't confirm bug #772185 to be fixed?
[07:54] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 772185 in nux "launcher sometimes doesn't hide when there are windows beneath it" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/772185
[07:54] <pitti> lifeless: OOPS-1986B65
[07:54] <ubot2> https://lp-oops.canonical.com/oops.py/?oopsid=1986B65
[07:55] <pitti> didrocks: I'm not running natty-proposed
[07:57] <didrocks> pitti: ok, I think I'll ask for pedro for this (the nux version in oneiric is exactly the same, so at least, for a first confirmation that's fixed)
[07:58] <lifeless> pitti: which task are you trying to reopen ?
[07:58] <pitti> seems I need to get back to oneiric's gdm to get user switching back
[07:58] <pitti> that's all broken with the current gdm3 in bzr
[07:58] <lifeless> the ubuntu one, or natty, or upstream?
[07:58] <pitti> lifeless: ubuntu and natty; I'm not allowed to reopen upstream
[07:58] <pitti> (I would, though)
[07:58] <lifeless> -> triaged? or fix committed ?
[07:58] <didrocks> lifeless: all three should be reopened and the upstream should be remilestoned to sru2
[07:58] <didrocks> (triaged)
[07:59] <didrocks> (3.8.16)
[07:59] <lifeless> so yeah this is our known issue
[07:59] <didrocks> maybe unassigning Manuel as well so that the dx team can focus on this
[07:59] <lifeless> its waiting on a table lock
[08:00] <lifeless> another hour or two and we should have a fix deployed
[08:00] <didrocks> excellent :)
[08:00] <lifeless> code is (hopefully) done, its in test now
[08:15] <didrocks> RAOF: web browser in gdm? really? how was that presented? :-)
[08:16] <RAOF> https://lwn.net/Articles/445831/
[08:17] <RAOF> I don't know :)
[08:17]  * didrocks still have a 4 months backlog on lwn :/
[08:17] <didrocks> oh, changing policykit
[08:17] <RAOF> chrisccoulson was also talking about it last week in here.
[08:18] <didrocks> RAOF: thanks for the link :)
[08:35] <tjaalton> i can't start the unity session in oneiric, compiz is filling my .xsession-errors with "unable to load icon text-x-preview at size 48"
[08:38] <tjaalton> looks like it's bug 794556 (thanks Sarvatt)
[08:38] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 794556 in unity "Unable to load icon text-x-preview at size 48 in a loop" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/794556
[08:38] <didrocks> tjaalton: try to see with the dx team then, they don't really read there
[08:39] <tjaalton> didrocks: I confirmed the bug
[08:40] <didrocks> thanks :)
[08:50] <seb128> hey desktopers
[08:50] <seb128> hey didrocks pitti
[08:50] <didrocks> salut seb128!
[08:50] <pitti> hey seb128
[08:50] <seb128> how are you?
[08:54] <didrocks> I'm fine, thanks, and you?
[08:58] <rodrigo_> morning
[09:00] <seb128> hey rodrigo_
[09:00] <seb128> didrocks, I'm fine as well thanks!
[09:01] <didrocks> hey rodrigo_
[09:24] <mvo> pitti: did anything change in dbus activation with regard to the environment? aptdaemon is dbus activated but it does not get the default system language anymore it seems in natty, that leads to issue with the apt ddtp translations.
[09:32] <cdbs> I can't boot with the latest lightdm in oneiric
[09:34] <jibel> cdbs, same here, looks like a problem with gnome-power-manager crashing and respawning too quickly.
[09:35] <pitti> mvo: not really, no; dbus activated system services have never gotten any environment at all
[09:36] <pitti> mvo: what did change, however, is that gdm now prefers to set $LANGUAGE and $LC_MESSAGES instead of $LANG
[09:39] <mvo> pitti: and we do not set the LANGUAGE in /etc/default/locale anymore on a fresh install I just noticed?
[09:39] <pitti> I'm not sure
[09:40] <seb128> cdbs, open a bug, robert_ancell is not online and he's the only one to have a clue about it at the moment I think
[09:56] <fta> not sure if it's the gdm->lightdm switch, but unity is no longer able to launch stuff not in /usr/bin
[09:57] <alex3f> hi, I'm experiencing #397096 in up-to-date natty, does anyone know something about it?
[09:57] <ogra_> fta, sounds like a PATH issue
[09:58] <seb128> fta, how do you run things?
[09:59] <seb128> alex3f, hi, that's not really a desktopish bug, try #ubuntu-kernel rather
[09:59] <fta> i have a game launcher, it used to work, now it's just spinning and nothing happens. yet, i still have /usr/games in my path
[09:59] <seb128> launcher in unity?
[09:59] <fta> yes
[10:00] <seb128> the launchers use the .desktop so it would probably be the glib update rather than lightdm
[10:00] <seb128> well just as a guess
[10:00] <seb128> does clicking on the .desktop for that game in nautilus work?
[10:00] <alex3f> seb128: thanks
[10:00] <seb128> do you get any error in .xsession-errors?
[10:00] <fta> to confirm it, i symlinked the game in /usr/bin and the launcher restarted to work
[10:01] <fta> no, nothing relevant  in .xsession-errors
[10:01] <seb128> does the .desktop has the path or just the command?
[10:01] <seb128> i.e does it rely on the games dir to be in the path?
[10:01] <chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
[10:01] <fta> just the command
[10:01] <seb128> hey chrisccoulson, how are you today ?
[10:01] <bryceh> heya ho chrisccoulson
[10:01] <fta> (/usr/share/applications/openarena.desktop)
[10:01] <chrisccoulson> hi seb128, i'm good thanks.. how are you?
[10:02] <seb128> fta, ok, could be lightdm I guess
[10:02] <chrisccoulson> hi bryceh
[10:02] <seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm fine thanks
[10:02] <didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
[10:02] <chrisccoulson> hi didrocks
[10:02] <seb128> fta, strings /proc/$(pidof compiz/environ | grep -i path
[10:02] <seb128> fta, strings /proc/$(pidof compiz)/environ | grep -i path
[10:03] <fta> MANDATORY_PATH=/usr/share/gconf/gnome.mandatory.path
[10:03] <fta> DEFAULTS_PATH=/usr/share/gconf/gnome.default.path
[10:03] <fta> PATH=/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/bin:/usr/sbin:/sbin:/bin
[10:03] <seb128> ok, games is not in your path
[10:03] <fta>  echo $PATH
[10:03] <fta> /home/fta/bin:/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/bin:/sbin:/bin:/usr/bin/X11:/usr/games
[10:04] <didrocks> fta: that's because you modify it in you .bashrc, isn't it?
[10:04] <didrocks> your*
[10:04] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, no, /usr/games is there by default
[10:04] <fta> sort of, i use tcsh ;)
[10:04] <chrisccoulson> but i guess compiz inherits its environment from lightdm
[10:04] <bryceh> fta, *shudder*
[10:04] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: right
[10:04] <chrisccoulson> so it's entirely possible it has a different path
[10:05] <chrisccoulson> **compiz and anything else started by gnome-session
[10:05] <seb128> fta, open a bug on lightdm
[10:05] <didrocks> interesting, lightdm doesn't read /etc/environment ?
[10:05] <didrocks> or just ignore latest :var maybe :)
[10:06] <seb128> it doesn't open the profile either
[10:06] <seb128> bug #794315
[10:06] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 794315 in lightdm "lightdm forgets to source /etc/profile and ~/.profile" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/794315
[10:06] <seb128> but robert_ancell admitted he was not sure what all those shell scripts etc were still useful for
[10:06] <seb128> it's a bit of a mess to try to figure what is useful or legacy and to try to clean it
[10:10] <fta> seb128, seems a wider problem. my login shell is tcsh and my ~/.login has a path with /usr/games in it, it doesn't work either
[10:10] <seb128> ?
[10:10] <seb128> well tcsh is supposed to source itself its config files
[10:11] <seb128> it has nothing to do with the xorg session
[10:11] <seb128> you could as well log into a vt
[10:11] <seb128> games not being in the path is likely a dm issue though
[10:11] <seb128> it's probably just not sourcing some configs that it should source
[10:11] <seb128> speaking of dm
[10:11] <seb128> pitti, how is gdm going?
[10:11] <seb128> pitti, is it just blocked on this race on user loading issue?
[10:12] <pitti> slowly
[10:12] <fta> seb128, n-m, wrong machine
[10:12] <pitti> I still have the redraw issue, and the plymouth integration is also broken
[10:12] <pitti> and of course it also breaks user switching, but that needs to be fixed in the indicator, I think
[10:12] <pitti> but I got sucked into other things yesterday; I hope I can continue on it today
[10:13] <seb128> pitti, do you still have 16_gdmserver_user_manager in the serie or did comment or drop it?
[10:14] <pitti> seb128: ah, I dropped it, as this should really be in accountsservice now
[10:14] <pitti> same for lightdm
[10:14] <seb128> pitti, that's what the indicator use for user switching
[10:15] <seb128> well it defines the methods the indicator need
[10:15] <seb128> that's why it's broken I guess
[10:15] <pitti> *nod*
[10:15] <seb128> well I wouldn't block on the issues you listed
[10:16] <seb128> especially if lightdm is default
[10:16] <pitti> right
[10:16] <pitti> but I'll at least try to update the plymouth patch from fedora
[10:16] <pitti> right now it's really quite hideous
[10:16] <pitti> oh, btw -- http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/20110609/ !
[10:17]  * pitti dances happily
[10:17] <pitti> of course RAOF and chrisccoulson will ruin it all over again :)
[10:17] <seb128> \o/
[10:17] <seb128> so we have a 5 to 6mb margin
[10:18] <seb128> it would be enough for the old tb
[10:18] <chrisccoulson> wha? what did i do? :)
[10:18] <seb128> chrisccoulson, you want to replace our nice integrated email client by yours ;-)
[10:18] <chrisccoulson> lol
[10:18] <chrisccoulson> is anyone here using desktopcouch atm?
[10:18] <pitti> seb128: 699 -> 703 is more like 4 by my school of maths :)
[10:19] <chrisccoulson> i need it to work just so i can use it to test my lernid port to webkit
[10:19] <pitti> I have a couch besides me, but I prefer the chair for working
[10:19] <pitti> (SCNR)
[10:19] <chrisccoulson> but it totally fails on me the one time i want to use it
[10:19] <chrisccoulson> pitti - heh ;)
[10:19] <seb128> pitti, doh, I looked at the first which is 697
[10:19] <seb128> but that's amd64mac
[10:20] <seb128> chrisccoulson, check with the u1 guys I guess
[10:20] <seb128> chrisccoulson, well "using", I've indicator-weather running which use it
[10:20] <seb128> but I don't know anything about how to deal with it manually
[10:21] <seb128> I can try things for you though
[10:31] <RAOF> pitti: I've even shaved an extra ~4 MiB off mesa locally :).
[10:31] <pitti> RAOF: impressive! will that be enough for llvm?
[10:32] <RAOF> No.
[10:32] <pitti> RAOF: more static linking duplicate removal?
[10:32] <RAOF> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 19M 2011-05-27 19:49 /usr/lib/libLLVM-2.9.so.1 :(
[10:32] <RAOF> Yeah, now with added galliumness.
[10:32] <pitti> RAOF: gzip -cd /usr/lib/libLLVM-2.9.so.1 | wc -c
[10:32] <pitti> ?
[10:33] <pitti> sorry, gzip -c of course
[10:33] <RAOF> 6661795
[10:33] <pitti> so +6.6 and -4
[10:33] <pitti> well, that's not too bad
[10:34] <pitti> RAOF: can we use jpeg compression? :-)
[10:34] <RAOF> Heh.
[10:34]  * RAOF heads to dinner.
[10:34] <pitti> that'll only cause bugs that are imperceptible anyway, right?
[10:38] <chrisccoulson> pitti - i reckon nss/nspr/sqlite take up about 1.5MB in each of firefox and thunderbird
[10:38] <chrisccoulson> so i coud probably get us 3MB by not shipping those ;)
[10:39] <pitti> yummy!
[10:39] <chrisccoulson> but i would like to only do that for the CD though, as they frequently bump the requirement of those libs
[10:39] <chrisccoulson> especially nss/nspr
[10:40] <ogra_> seb128, fyi i filed bug 794938 for the login issues i see
[10:40] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 794938 in lightdm "lightdm dies with "Failed to fork: Cannot allocate memory" on login" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/794938
[10:40] <seb128> ok
[10:41] <seb128> try talking to robert_ancell as well when he's online maybe as well
[10:41] <ogra_> is robert on vacation atm ?
[10:41] <pitti> no, just on the other side of the planet
[10:41] <ogra_> sisnce he doesnt seem to be around since a week or so
[10:41] <ogra_> ah, k
[10:41] <seb128> he is
[10:41] <pitti> I usually see him in the morning
[10:41] <seb128> he's just quiet on IRC
[10:41] <ogra_> k
[10:41] <seb128> he leaves between 9 and 10 european time usually
[10:42] <ogra_> i'll try to catch him then
[10:42] <seb128> but he doesn't say anything if you don't talk to him ;-)
[10:42] <ogra_> ah, bad time for me, i usually dont start my day before 10
[10:42] <seb128> didrocks, did he reply to your comment earlier?
[10:42] <seb128> ogra_, emails usually work fine with him though ;-)
[10:43] <ogra_> well, my bug should have caused a mail for him now :)
[10:43] <seb128> also I'm not sure how much working on a logging manager and keeping a graphical IRC client work together :p
[10:43] <ogra_> thats why we have VMs :)
[10:43] <didrocks> seb128: he replied, yeah
[10:43] <seb128> ok
[10:45] <seb128> pitti, rodrigo_: ok, glib 2.29 is in oneiric, looking at gtk 3.1 next
[10:45] <pitti> cheers!
[10:45] <pitti> yay for gdbus-codegen
[10:45] <seb128> ;-)
[10:46]  * ogra_ shudders after his oneiric screensaver locked the screen once again ...
[10:46] <ogra_> centered panel clocks are sooo 80s
[10:46] <seb128> pitti, nice, debian merged some of our dbus diff
[10:47] <chrisccoulson> seb128, btw, mike conley upgraded to oneiric last night. he gets the gnome-session fail screen immediately after log in now ;)
[10:47] <seb128> weird
[10:47] <seb128> what session did he pick?
[10:47] <pitti> seb128: indeed -- multiarch patches can go to Debian now
[10:47] <chrisccoulson> he's using unity-2d
[10:47] <ogra_> do you guys plan to redo the screensaver UI ?
[10:47] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - it looks like metacity aborts
[10:47] <seb128> pitti, they merged that and some other bits
[10:47] <pitti> seb128: so we can commit some of our delta to Debian's svn, which also helps them
[10:47] <ogra_> or will we have to live with what gnome gives us
[10:48] <rodrigo_> seb128, ok, cool
[10:48] <seb128> doh, wrong focus
[10:48] <pitti> ogra_: I certainly hope we can get a better screensaver
[10:48] <ogra_> pitti, ++
[10:49] <ogra_> we should probably reconsider xscreensaver ;)
[10:49] <seb128> pitti, btw do you have an opinion about what dbus serie we should track or do you know who to ask about the 1.5 schedule?
[10:50] <seb128> pitti, we should probably update to either 1.4.10 (debian unstable) or 1.5.2 (experimental)
[10:50] <seb128> chrisccoulson agreed to work on gnome-screensaver to bring back the hacks support
[10:50] <chrisccoulson> yep :)
[10:50] <pitti> seb128: I'm not really involved in dbus development, so I don't have a good answer, I'm afraid
[10:50] <seb128> pitti, ok no worry, I will ping the debian guys
[10:50] <pitti> seb128: personally I lean towards tracking unstable
[10:51] <pitti> seb128: as long as we don't have a particular reason to go to the 1.5 version
[10:51] <pitti> we've got enough disruptions already :)
[10:52] <seb128> well the reason would be "it's in unstable serie leading to 1.6 but 1.6 will be after oneiric"
[10:52] <seb128> I will check if I can figure their schedule
[10:55] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - your criteria for deciding something like that should be based on that of comment 6 in https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=656277 ;)
[10:55] <ubot2> Mozilla bug 656277 in Canvas: WebGL "Prevent loading WebGL textures from cross-domain images" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
[10:55] <chrisccoulson> "can i still play angry birds?"
[10:55] <chrisccoulson> :)
[10:56] <seb128> bah, angry birds in firefox sucks, I played it recently
[10:56] <seb128> no sound and it's slugish in hd, I had to play in sd
[10:57] <seb128> on a i5 cpu and a recent laptop config
[10:57] <chrisccoulson> intel driver?
[10:57] <seb128> yes
[10:58] <chrisccoulson> yeah, accelaration is disabled because it just crashes
[10:58] <chrisccoulson> it's only enabled for nvidia users
[10:58] <didrocks> and doesn't work with every sites :)
[10:58] <chrisccoulson> b'ah, g-s-d just decided to reconfigure my screen layout for no reason
[10:58] <chrisccoulson> that happened yesterday too
[10:59] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh btw, I have to sent the bug # to Pascal about this nvidia issue (we had a fight at the party at each unity bugs he was bothering me with, I was sending a firefox one ;)). But I couldn't find that one which is the prio #1 for preventing me using firefox
[11:04] <seb128> pitti, ok, I asked smcv, he said there is no schedule for 1.6, it's mainly blocked on some review and on lennart and keybuk to agree on how activation should work
[11:04] <seb128> "<smcv> at the moment we have systemd support merged, upstart support in an unmerged branch, and lennart saying "neither of these is actually the right approach" without suggesting what the right approach is"
[11:04] <seb128> "<smcv> seb128: if you can arrange for lennart and keybuk to be locked in a room until they agree on how activation should work, that would accelerate 1.6 :-)"
[11:04] <seb128> pitti, let's stay on 1.4 for now I guess ;-)
[11:04] <pitti> heh
[11:04] <pitti> seb128: yes, I agree
[11:05] <pitti> as long as our huge dbus patches still apply, that should be ok
[11:06] <seb128> well .8 to .10 is only bug fixes
[11:06] <seb128> I might have a go to update it but that will be next week, I want to do gtk 3.1 first
[11:17] <seb128> chrisccoulson, so do you want me to test your lernid update?
[11:18] <chrisccoulson> seb128, it also doesn't build ;)
[11:18] <seb128> ok, well lernid runs there
[11:18] <seb128> so I can test your port once it builds if you want
[11:19] <chrisccoulson> seb128, you're on oneiric aren't you?
[11:19] <seb128> yes
[11:19] <pitti> chrisccoulson: please cofirm: new natty langpacks should NOT ship the ffox search plugins any more
[11:20] <chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, that's right. they're all in the firefox 5 beta language packs
[11:20] <pitti> Package: language-pack-de-base
[11:20] <pitti> Recommends: firefox-locale-de
[11:20] <chrisccoulson> pitti - are you ready to build those?
[11:20] <pitti> chrisccoulson: I just did
[11:20] <pitti> but I noticed that I still have the searchplugins
[11:21] <pitti> but I can just rm them, no need to rebuild again
[11:21] <chrisccoulson> pitti - oh,  you used what is in the firefox-next PPA?
[11:21] <pitti> I also removed them from langpack-o-matic
[11:21] <pitti> chrisccoulson: yes
[11:21] <pitti> chrisccoulson: wasn't that the plan?
[11:21] <chrisccoulson> cool, thanks
[11:21] <pitti> to unblock langpack builds
[11:21] <pitti> but once we upload them, we should actually get ffox into -proposed as well
[11:21] <chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, although i thought you were going to use the firefox build in proposed
[11:21] <pitti> oh, we have one?
[11:22] <pitti> there's nothing in natty-proposed
[11:22] <chrisccoulson> pitti - so, we should probably get firefox in to proposed first, so people don't lose their translations
[11:22] <chrisccoulson> yeah, it's not uploaded yet :)
[11:22] <pitti> ah
[11:22] <pitti> right, that's what I mean
[11:22] <chrisccoulson> pitti - can you copy packages from https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mozilla-security/+archive/ppa in to natty-proposed?
[11:23] <pitti> s/edge.// :)
[11:23] <pitti> chrisccoulson: if it had firefox, then yes
[11:23] <pitti> that's what we usually do
[11:23] <chrisccoulson> i discussed briefly with micah, and we decided we should build firefox here before we copy to -proposed (as we're treating it as a security update, so we don't want to build firefox with -updates)
[11:23] <pitti> chrisccoulson: I can also copy source only from any other PPA
[11:23] <pitti> right, makes sense
[11:24] <chrisccoulson> ok, so i can get firefox uploaded there
[11:24] <pitti> chrisccoulson: I'll locally build the German langpacks for testing before I upload the lot
[11:24] <pitti> chrisccoulson: shall I build a language for you as well?
[11:24] <chrisccoulson> pitti - yes please :)
[11:24] <pitti> chrisccoulson: any preference?
[11:25] <chrisccoulson> pitti - i don't mind. i can test any language really
[11:25] <pitti> French it is then!
[11:25] <pitti> :)
[11:25] <pitti> and the English one
[11:25] <chrisccoulson> pitti - it seems that mozilla have started the final beta build for firefox 5 - http://hg.mozilla.org/releases/mozilla-beta/rev/7056b773830d
[11:26] <chrisccoulson> i'll wait until those guys are awake before uploading, just to check if they've found any show-stopper issues
[11:32] <seb128> pitti, french is a good choice! can I help by testing?
[11:33] <pitti> please
[11:33] <pitti> binary debdiffs look good to me
[11:34] <seb128> pitti, so I should take a natty box, add the ~ubuntu-mozilla-security ppa and upgrade firefox and see if it's still working fine and in french?
[11:37] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - we're going to put the packages in -proposed, so you can test it without adding that PPA
[11:37] <chrisccoulson> unless you want to test before it goes in to proposed ;)
[11:37] <seb128> well did you need testing before it goes in proposed?
[11:37] <pitti> chrisccoulson, seb128: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/tmp/lp/
[11:37] <chrisccoulson> it might be a good idea :)
[11:37] <seb128> I can, I've a box which I just use for testing
[11:38] <pitti> note that I don't want to upload the langpacks until firefox is in -proposed
[11:38] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: have you seen my previous question about the nvidia issue?
[11:38] <seb128> ok, so I add the mozilla security ppa, upgrade and install the langpacks from pitti?
[11:38] <pitti> as otherwise the recommends: firefox-locale-XX will not work, and the upgrade won't pull in the firefox translations
[11:38] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - you can actually test the build that is in the firefox-next PPA (https://launchpad.net/~mozillateam/+archive/firefox-next)
[11:38] <pitti> seb128: it should work to add https://launchpad.net/~mozillateam/+archive/firefox-next
[11:38] <chrisccoulson> yeah :)
[11:38] <seb128> ok, doing that
[11:38] <pitti> add this, then install the .debs
[11:39] <chrisccoulson> that's basically what will go in to proposed
[11:39] <pitti> note that a dpkg -i also won't pull in the recommends
[11:39] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, one second
[11:39] <pitti> seb128: ^ so you need to install that manually
[11:39] <seb128> ok
[11:39] <pitti> chrisccoulson: do you think we can get it into -proposed today or tomorrow?
[11:39] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, oh, you just want the bug number?
[11:40] <chrisccoulson> pitti - sure, that won't be a problem
[11:40] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: yeah :)
[11:40] <pitti> so that the translation testers can get going over the weekend?
[11:42] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, hmm, i can't find it now ;)
[11:43] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: no worry, I couldn't find it as well
[11:43] <chrisccoulson> i wonder if launchpad has helpfully expired it
[11:44] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, there is bug 605567, which is the same issue
[11:44] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 605567 in firefox "Extremely slow painting of launchpad.net bug details page with nvidia driver" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/605567
[11:44] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, thanks a lot! :)
[11:44] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, who is Pascal btw?
[11:45] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: french mozilla community coordinator
[11:45] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, ah, ok
[11:51] <chrisccoulson> dpm - did you see my question last night about the en-AU translations we seem to have for firefox?
[11:52] <chrisccoulson> dpm - https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=609857
[11:52] <ubot2> Mozilla bug 609857 in plugins.mozilla.org "Find Updates for plug-ins can lead to the wrong page." [Major,New: ]
[11:52] <lifeless> didrocks: that bug can be edited now
[11:53] <dpm> chrisccoulson, I did, sorry, but much later on and I forgot to answer this morning. So this is probably a case of translations done in Launchpad which haven't made it upstream
[11:53] <dpm> let me check...
[11:53] <didrocks> lifeless: excellent! doing it now then :) thanks for the notice
[11:55] <dpm> chrisccoulson, yeah, translations were done in LP, but not in upstream:
[11:55] <dpm> * https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/firefox/+pots/firefox/en_AU/+details
[11:56] <dpm> * http://hg.mozilla.org/l10n-central/
[11:56] <dpm> So that's another team translating in LP
[11:56] <chrisccoulson> dpm - ah, ok. thanks
[12:07] <chrisccoulson> b'ah, i just created the new tarball for firefox and forgot to update the translations
[12:07] <chrisccoulson> i should add a hook to do that automatically ;)
[12:17] <seb128> mvo, hey, I think I asked you before but do we still need synaptic on the default installation?
[12:19] <seb128> grrrr update-manager
[12:19] <seb128> so adding ppa:mozillateam/firefox-next leads to update-manager saying the packages are not authentificated and it refuses to install those
[12:20] <seb128> mvo, help me ;-)
[12:22] <seb128> mvo, I did add "ppa:mozillateam/firefox-next" in software-properties (natty) why does it refuses to install packages from it?
[12:23] <ogra_> missed apt-get update ?
[12:23] <mvo> seb128: does apt-key list list the signing key for the ppa?
[12:23] <seb128> ogra_, I hitted refresh in update-manager 3 times so I guess it did it
[12:23] <ogra_> yeah
[12:23] <seb128> mvo, dunno, how do I know what it the key for the ppa?
[12:23] <ogra_> i have seen key issues too in the past
[12:24] <ogra_> but not regulary reproducable
[12:24] <seb128> mvo, sorry to have dump questions :p
[12:24] <ogra_> seb128, the key is on the ppa page
[12:24] <seb128> ogra_, I see those every second time I add a ppa and update-manager doesn't even let you an "install anyway" option :-(
[12:24] <ogra_> wow, thats bad
[12:25] <ogra_> i saw them on two ppa out of like 10 i used last cycle
[12:25] <ogra_> and the errors were gone if i removed and added it again
[12:25] <ogra_> seems somethinmes the apt-key run doesnt happen
[12:26] <seb128> mvo, no it doesn't
[12:29] <seb128> ok, let's remove the ppa lines in software-properties and add it again
[12:29] <seb128> that worked, go figure
[12:29] <seb128> ogra_, mvo: thanks ;-)
[12:30] <ogra_> :)
[12:30] <ogra_> doesnt solve the core issue indeed
[12:30] <seb128> desactivating and activating the ppa line in software-properties or doing a refresh in update-manager didn't fix it, I had to remove the lines and add the ppa again
[12:30] <seb128> ogra_, right but that will do for today so that's ok ;-)
[12:30] <ogra_> btw, i always use the cmdline method
[12:31] <ogra_> so its not u-m but one of the backend tools
[12:31] <seb128> right, I know how to add a key, I just try to stick to what our user experience should be
[12:31] <ogra_> yep
[12:32] <ogra_> it could also be LPs fault indeed ... i'm seeing lots and lots of timouts today
[12:32] <seb128> there is a bug which makes keys not added in some cases and update-manager which let you select the upgrades and click install to return a dialog saying it can't because they are not authentification without having an install anyway option is the issue
[12:32] <ogra_> which is correct behavior
[12:33] <seb128> no it's not
[12:33] <ogra_> sure, u-m should complain if packages cant be authenticated
[12:33] <seb128> it should not let check those in the list to start and write in red "not authentificated" or something
[12:33] <seb128> or if it does let you check them it should let you do the "install anyway" thing
[12:33] <ogra_> you mean it should just ignore the entries it cant authenticate ?
[12:33] <ogra_> but then you will never know that this ppa doesnt actually work
[12:34] <seb128> no, I mean either it should not let you select them if they can't be installed or it should let you ignore the issue if it let you select them
[12:34] <ogra_> ah, now i understand, yeah
[12:34] <seb128> well it could write in the upgrade list "can"t be installed due to authentification issue"
[12:34] <seb128> the same way it doesn't let you select things that bring new depends or have conflicts on others
[12:35] <seb128> (out of the fact it doesn't give you the reason why those can't be selected)
[12:35] <ogra_> agreed
[12:35] <seb128> it's just that letting me select 25 updates and click on install to display a "can't install" dialog and send me back to the list with my selection resetted is annoying
[12:35] <seb128> it means I spent a minutes selecting what I want to upgrade to get say "no" and to get my work wasted
[12:36] <ogra_> yep
[12:38] <seb128> chrisccoulson, pitti: ok, firefox upgrade and langpack worked well, I get firefox5 in french
[12:39] <chrisccoulson> seb128, and you get french search plugins? (and no duplicates)
[12:39] <seb128> chrisccoulson, it seems to have dropped my bookmark though (I went to google.fr and click the star in the url bar before the update and the bookmark is not there now, it still shows in recently bookmarked though)
[12:39] <seb128> chrisccoulson, define "search plugin" ;-)
[12:39] <seb128> how do I test that?
[12:39] <seb128> the start page is an ubuntu google one in french
[12:40] <chrisccoulson> seb128, next do the search box on the addressbar, there is a dropdown to let you select a search engine other than google
[12:40] <seb128> yeah, it's in french
[12:40] <seb128> it has wikipédia (fr)
[12:40] <seb128> no duplicate
[12:40] <seb128> it has also google, yahoo, etc
[12:40] <seb128> with google default
[12:41] <chrisccoulson> that's weird about the bookmarks. did it only lose the one that you recently bookmarked?
[12:41] <seb128> it's a test box, I've no bookmark
[12:41] <seb128> I just did one before the upgrade to test if they would be kept
[12:41] <chrisccoulson> ah, ok
[12:41] <chrisccoulson> was the browser still open whilst you upgraded?
[12:41] <seb128> no
[12:42] <chrisccoulson> hmmm
[12:42] <chrisccoulson> and it closed ok?
[12:42] <seb128> I restarted the box in between and reconnected to the ppa authentification issues in update-manager
[12:42] <seb128> yes
[12:43] <mvo> seb128: hm, good point, u-m actually knows if they are authenticated or not, it could display that
[12:43] <chrisccoulson> that's odd. i'll see if i get the same issue here
[12:43] <seb128> mvo, one thing it would be nice also is that if you select 60 updates and 1 has authentification issues it could still install the 59 remaining ones ;-)
[12:44] <seb128> chrisccoulson, well maybe that's a local issue, don't bother
[12:44] <seb128> chrisccoulson, I will downgrade and try again to see what happens
[12:44]  * ogra_ thinks it should just hide them and tell you that the "ppa <blah>" is missing the key
[12:44] <ogra_> *before* you can select anything
[12:44] <chrisccoulson> seb128, it didn't happen on your main install did it? (that has already gone through this upgrade)
[12:44] <seb128> chrisccoulson, no, but that  one is on oneiric
[12:45] <seb128> I still have my bookmarks there ;-)
[12:45] <chrisccoulson> ok, that's good i suppose ;)
[12:45] <seb128> chrisccoulson, but yeah, I added just one bookmark, closed, restarted and upgraded, it could have vanished before the upgrade :p
[12:45] <seb128> chrisccoulson, it's still show up in the "recently bookmarked" though
[12:45] <chrisccoulson> yeah, that's really weird :)
[12:46] <seb128> chrisccoulson, the start is yellow when I go on google.fr as well
[12:46] <seb128> so it thinks it's bookmarked, it's just not showing up in the menu
[12:47] <seb128> not showing up in firefox4 either after downgrading
[12:47] <chrisccoulson> seb128, oh
[12:47] <chrisccoulson> i bet it went in to "Unsorted bookmarks" ;)
[12:47] <chrisccoulson> if you click on the star again, it will tell you where it is
[12:47] <seb128> right, it did
[12:47] <chrisccoulson> the unsorted bookmarks don't show in the menu
[12:47] <seb128> where is that categorie displayed?
[12:48] <seb128> there is no "unsorted bookmarks" sub menu either
[12:48] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - there should be an "Unsorted bookmarks" item in the bookmark menu, which will open a separate window
[12:48] <seb128> chrisccoulson, no, there is not
[12:48] <chrisccoulson> hmmm
[12:48] <chrisccoulson> i'm using firefox 7 here, so it might be different
[12:49] <seb128> I'm pretty sure it was in the bookmark menu when I added it before restarting
[12:49] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - oh, you're right. there is no menu item for unsorted bookmarks in the old firefox ;)
[12:49] <seb128> so they are bookmarks with no way to access those out of typing the awesome bar?
[12:50] <seb128> weird user experience ;-)
[12:50] <chrisccoulson> if you go to bookmarks -> Show all bookmarks, it will open the bookmark editor
[12:50] <chrisccoulson> you should be able to see it there ;)
[12:50] <seb128> indeed
[12:50] <seb128> the "checking for updates" dialog on first start is not translated in french btw
[12:50] <seb128> not sure if that's a bug in the translation or firefox
[12:50] <chrisccoulson> that's probably just missing translations
[12:50] <seb128> well out of those 2 issues firefox works fine and in french
[12:51] <chrisccoulson> has that always been the case?
[12:51] <seb128> I think so
[12:51] <seb128> I noticed it on natty after upgrading some boxes
[12:51] <chrisccoulson> ah, ok. that's ok then :)
[12:51] <seb128> I meant to check but I never did
[12:51] <seb128> is the "unsorted bookmark" thing new? it's a bit confusing
[12:52] <seb128> I think I usually use ctrl-d rather than clicking on the start, that does the right thing
[12:52] <seb128> well ignore me then ;-)
[12:52] <seb128> chrisccoulson, pitti: great work on the update, worked fine for my natty test box ;-)
[12:53] <chrisccoulson> seb128, i'm not sure. you can choose to put your bookmark in the bookmark menu rather than in the unsorted section
[12:53] <chrisccoulson> and then i think it remembers your selection after that
[12:53] <seb128> well that's a test box, I never bookmarked anything before
[12:53] <chrisccoulson> but in firefox 7, the unsorted bookmarks are exposed in the menu anyway
[12:53] <seb128> ok, so let's say it's a bug and firefox in the new version ;-)
[12:56] <pitti> seb128: nice, thanks!
[12:56] <seb128> yw
[12:57] <seb128> mvo, btw did you see the synaptic question? seems apturl and software-properties still depend on it, do you think that can be solved this cycle?
[12:57] <mvo> seb128: I'm currently hunting a bug in apt that prevents translated package descriptons from properly showing, do you see that on your french oneiric machine too? i.e. are the long descriptions french in s-c?
[12:57] <mvo> seb128: I saw it, I think its solvable
[12:58] <seb128> mvo, they are in french in apt-cache show, is that different from s-c?
[12:59] <mvo> seb128: yeah, there is a issue with aptdaemon rebuilding the cache apparently as it runs in a LANG=C environment
[13:04] <seb128> mvo, seems to work fine for me
[13:04] <seb128> in update-manager as well
[13:05] <seb128> mvo, but it might depends on some /etc/environment or something which is correctly set for me from old versions
[13:07] <mvo> seb128: ok, thanks! indeed /etc/environment maybe the missing clue and the reason why I had trouble reproducing this
[13:16] <pedro_> hello folks
[13:16] <pedro_> smspillaz, are you around?
[13:17] <pedro_> smspillaz, i'm trying to verify bug 771391 , you're pointing to a test case program there but the link seems broken , can you point me to the right one so i can verify that fix? thanks!
[13:17] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 771391 in compiz "Unity launcher gets visible while screensaver is active" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/771391
[13:19] <didrocks> hey pedro_!
[13:19] <didrocks> pedro_: don't forget nux as well which is in the unity land :)
[13:19] <didrocks> and thanks for the unity fix confirmation yesterday btw ;)
[13:19] <pedro_> salut didrocks, do you know anything about that bug?
[13:19] <pedro_> didrocks, ok i'll have a look to it today
[13:20] <didrocks> pedro_: well, I asked for a test case to smspillaz, maybe better to wait on him for getting a working link
[13:21] <pedro_> ok!
[13:21] <smspillaz> hang on a minute
[13:25] <chrisccoulson> pitti - ok, firefox is uploading now
[13:25]  * rodrigo_ lunch
[13:27] <ricotz> chrisccoulson, hi, are you using the thunderbird 5.0?
[13:28] <chrisccoulson> ricotz, yeah
[13:28] <ricotz> chrisccoulson, do you consider it stable enough for productive usage?
[13:29]  * ricotz isnt brave enough to use it yet since it is quite sensetive
[13:29] <chrisccoulson> ricotz, i'm not sure. i don't expect it's going to change much before release, so i don't think you'll have any issues with it
[13:29] <chrisccoulson> do you use any extensions?
[13:30] <ricotz> chrisccoulson, hmm, i see -- i use enigmail and lightning
[13:30] <chrisccoulson> ricotz, heh. those are the worst ones for me ;)
[13:30] <chrisccoulson> you're not on oneiric yet?
[13:31] <ricotz> chrisccoulson, hehe, yes i am
[13:31] <ricotz> on oneiric
[13:31] <chrisccoulson> oh, ok. so you should be able to get a working enigmail and lightning, but i've not tested those much
[13:31] <chrisccoulson> and enigmail is based on the latest crack from upstream ;)
[13:32] <ricotz> hmm, sounds adventurous ;)
[13:33] <ricotz> i am using local installs of these extension, so no packaged ones
[13:33] <ricotz> i will investigate the current compatibility status of them and might try it ;)
[13:33] <chrisccoulson> oh, you might have more difficulty then, as there's no new releases to support the latest version of thunderbird yet
[13:33] <ricotz> chrisccoulson, thanks
[13:34] <ricotz> yeah, that might be a problem
[13:38] <pitti> chrisccoulson: thanks!
[13:58] <pitti> chrisccoulson: still not in https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+queue?queue_state=1 -- did something go wrong?
[13:58] <pitti> chrisccoulson: oh, nevermind -- the security PPA, I presume
[13:59] <pitti> yep, it's building there
[14:06] <chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah :) (sorry, just went to grab a coffee)
[14:28] <chrisccoulson> pitti - your gnome-icon-theme split causes metacity to assert() on startup ;)
[14:28] <chrisccoulson> (because of a missing gtk-missing-image icon)
[14:28] <m_conley> yeah, I just got bit by this one.
[14:29] <chrisccoulson> there's not a copy of that in hicolor, but it is shipped in the gnome theme (and is in gnome-icon-theme-full)
[14:30] <chrisccoulson> pitti - metacity:ERROR:ui/ui.c:754:meta_ui_get_default_window_icon: assertion failed: (default_icon)
[14:30] <chrisccoulson> that's what m_conley sees by default when he tries to start a 2D session
[14:30] <pitti> chrisccoulson: argh; I'll move it to g-i-t then
[14:30] <chrisccoulson> awesome, thanks :)
[14:31] <m_conley> pitti: thanks!
[14:31] <pitti> chrisccoulson, m_conley: is there a bug report about it already which I shoulc close?
[14:32] <chrisccoulson> pitti - no, we just debugged it over IRC
[14:32] <pitti> ok, then I'll just upload
[14:32] <chrisccoulson> thanks
[14:36] <pitti> m_conley, chrisccoulson: uploaded; sorry for the hassle
[14:37] <m_conley> pitti: not a problem - thanks!
[14:45] <alex3f> mvo: ping :-)
[14:46] <mvo> hey alex3f :)
[14:46] <alex3f> mvo: I know you're busy, I just wanted to ask if you had the time to look at my emails
[14:47] <mvo> alex3f: yeah, sorry for not replying yet, I have a look next, definitely today!
[14:47] <alex3f> mvo: that's great, thank you :D
[14:47] <mvo> your welcome
[15:17] <seb128> re
[15:20] <mterry> Is anyone else having network troubles on oneiric?
[15:21] <rodrigo_> mterry, a lot, although I was thinking it was my router
[15:22] <rodrigo_> mterry, disconnections and such?
[15:22] <seb128> hey mterry, what sort? the indicator applet keeps doing the wifi animation there but I'm on eth and that works
[15:22] <seb128> not sure if the wifi is functional though
[15:22] <kinouchou> hello seb128
[15:22] <seb128> lut kinouchou, ca va ?
[15:23] <mterry> rodrigo_, yes.  seb128, For the past few days, I've been seeing "silent" disconnections that make it seem like wifi is still connected even though no packets get through.  Have to restart NM.  Now, I can't even connect via wifi or eth0
[15:23] <cyphermox> mterry: I get this every once in a while, think it's wpasupplicant
[15:23] <kinouchou> yep seb128
[15:23] <pitti> soo - http://status.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-oneiric/canonical-desktop-team-oneiric-alpha-2.html
[15:23] <pitti> http://status.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-oneiric/
[15:23] <cyphermox> but I also get issues with my wifi router
[15:24] <rodrigo_> mterry, for me, it disconnects a lot, but had never to restart NM, it just connects again on its own
[15:25] <cyphermox> pitti: cool
[15:30] <cyphermox> mterry: rodrigo_, care to share at least /var/log/syslog if you see disconnections again, just in case there's something I can figure from it? (or open bugs)
[15:30] <rodrigo_> cyphermox, yes, sure
[15:30] <mterry> cyphermox, k.  right now the behavior I see is as if it never finds any devices, so never connects at all
[15:30] <cyphermox> mterry: ah, doesn't see devices?
[15:31] <cyphermox> hold on a second
[15:31] <cyphermox> almost everything is greyed out and it says "No devices availa
[15:31] <cyphermox> ?
[15:33] <mterry> cyphermox, hrm...  let me open it back up to see exact ui
[15:34] <Daviey> Hi, is Oneiric Unity desktop currently known to be broken?
[15:34] <cyphermox> mterry: ok... because I see exactly this on one system here
[15:34] <cyphermox> on my laptop everything is a-ok, though
[15:34] <Daviey> as in, currently when i login i get the wallpaper and mouse pointer.. no panels or icons.
[15:35] <mterry> cyphermox, so first, nm-applet appears as a one-pixel indicator until I restart network-manager
[15:35] <seb128> pitti, great work, who did that?
[15:35] <cyphermox> mterry: arf
[15:35] <seb128> pitti, is that the linaro thing they showed up at UDS?
[15:36] <mterry> cyphermox, once restarted, it appears.  But everything is grayed out (including switches to enable networking).  It doesn't say "No devices available" but rather "Disconnected"
[15:36] <cyphermox> right
[15:37] <cyphermox> mterry: let me see something, looks like there's some kind of issue between NM and things speaking to it
[15:37] <stgraber> tjaalton: just wondering, did you find a workaround for bug 794556 ? I've been trying to get a working X session for 30 minutes and haven't found anything that works (metacity crashes, compiz crashes even failsafe xterm doesn't seem to work ...)
[15:37] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 794556 in unity "Unable to load icon text-x-preview at size 48 in a loop" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/794556
[15:37] <mterry> stgraber, install gnome-icon-theme-full
[15:38] <mterry> stgraber, are you using gnome-themes-standard?
[15:38] <mterry> I think it's missing a depends
[15:38]  * Daviey tries that
[15:38] <stgraber> mterry: no gnome-themes-standard installed here. Installing gnome-icon-theme-full now for testing
[15:39] <tjaalton> oh, I'll try that too
[15:39] <mterry> stgraber, hmm, well, we should figure out what is silently depending on it then and add the Depends
[15:40] <stgraber> mterry: it works! just installed gnome-icon-theme-full and everything starts now
[15:40] <stgraber> mterry: thanks!
[15:40] <seb128> we should rather move the icon in the standard icon set
[15:40] <seb128> pitti, ^
[15:40]  * stgraber updates bug report with the workaround
[15:40]  * Daviey reboots as he went on a kill frenzy
[15:41] <mterry> seb128, sure, if these machines don't have any non-default apps.  But I'm not sure who was actually requesting that file.  Probably unity now that I think of it
[15:41] <tjaalton> yep, installing g-i-t-f worked for me too
[15:41] <kinouchou> seb128: You come for the RMLL?
[15:41] <seb128> kinouchou, dunno yet
[15:42] <seb128> mterry, IconTexture.cpp:#define DEFAULT_ICON "text-x-preview"
[15:42] <seb128> in unity
[15:43] <mterry> there ya go  :)
[15:43] <stgraber> metacity was also immediately crashing for me with an assert saying it couldn't find some default theme
[15:43] <stgraber> might be the same issue (or not)
[15:44]  * Daviey confirms that workaroud
[15:44] <seb128> softwares should handle missing icons
[15:44] <seb128> then we should figure what icons should be in the default set
[15:44] <chrisccoulson> stgraber, pitti fixed the metacity issue already (see the scrollback)
[15:45] <stgraber> chrisccoulson: cool!
[15:46] <chrisccoulson> stgraber, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-icon-theme/3.0.0-2ubuntu2
[15:48] <seb128> mterry, is the "backup" icon in the oneiric control-center a deja-dup one?
[15:48] <mterry> seb128, yes
[15:48] <seb128> mterry, can I complain about people using switch button instead of checkboxes? ;-)
[15:49] <seb128> I though the switch button where of devices on,off only?
[15:49] <mterry> seb128, you mean for deja-dup?  That's an approved HIG use :)
[15:49] <seb128> mterry, nice work otherwise ;-)
[15:49] <mterry> seb128, also for capital-F Features.  Things like daemons or whatnot
[15:50] <seb128> ok
[15:50] <seb128> dunno why but I keep being confused by those, I never know why state is on or off
[15:50] <chrisccoulson> ditto
[15:50] <chrisccoulson> maybe it's a theming issue, but i really hate them
[15:50] <mterry> seb128, yeah...  hopefully our theme will make it awesomely clear
[15:50] <chrisccoulson> :)
[15:50] <chrisccoulson> i hope so
[15:50] <Daviey> gnome-appearance-properties been dropped?
[15:51] <chrisccoulson> yes
[15:51] <cyphermox> yeah :/
[15:51] <Daviey> chrisccoulson: and replaced with? :)
[15:51] <mvo> what are the buttons called by apple?
[15:51] <chrisccoulson> Daviey, nothing. but you can install gnome-tweak-tool
[15:51] <Daviey> chrisccoulson: nothing long term?
[15:51] <chrisccoulson> Daviey, yeah, i think so
[15:52] <Daviey> crikey.
[15:53] <tuhina082> hey!
[15:53] <tuhina082> i had gnome 3
[15:53] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm wondering how we are meant to handle people upgrading from older releases with a non-default theme selected
[15:53] <chrisccoulson> there's not really an obvious way for them to reset that now
[15:53] <seb128> chrisccoulson, upstream way would be to reset theme and wallpaper to the default GNOME3 ones
[15:54] <tuhina082> i had gnome3 then after some upgrade it never logged, failed to load session gnome
[15:54] <seb128> tuhina082, hi, try #ubuntu for user questions
[15:54] <tuhina082> failed to load session ubuntu
[15:54] <tuhina082> oh ok
[15:54] <chrisccoulson> seb128, do you think we should do that too? (reset users theme on upgrade)
[15:55] <chrisccoulson> (if we're not doing that already)
[15:55] <cyphermox> mterry: ok, so something got upgraded in the last few days that broke NM
[15:55] <cyphermox> mterry: I'm tracking it down now, got a few ideas
[15:56] <chrisccoulson> seb128, especially seeing as most people upgrading from natty with a customized theme won't have a gtk3 version of that theme
[15:56] <mterry> cyphermox, awesome
[15:56] <chrisccoulson> or is that something that's been considered already?
[15:56] <seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm thinking about it, ideally if the user has one of the 2 light themes we should keep it
[15:56] <seb128> otherwise we can reset it
[15:56] <chrisccoulson> yeah, makes sense
[15:57] <seb128> but we can't use the .convert thing if we need to have logic in the conversion
[15:57] <chrisccoulson> i definitely think we should reset it to one of the defaults (ambiance or radiance). being left with no gtk3 theme after the upgrade from natty is not going to be very nice
[15:57] <chrisccoulson> especially with no way to configure it ;)
[15:58] <seb128> right, I'm just wondering if it's worth the effort to keep the specific light theme selected
[15:58] <seb128> rather than just resetting the default
[15:59] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm not sure
[15:59] <tuhina082> http://paste.ubuntu.com/622635/
[15:59] <seb128> tuhina082, -> #ubuntu
[15:59] <tuhina082> this is desktop
[15:59] <didrocks> seb128: I still think it's important when possible, as it's such details which makes the difference
[16:00] <seb128> chrisccoulson, we can default to simply reset and if somebody wants to come with a solution to stay on an another theme if available they can send a patch for it
[16:00] <chrisccoulson> seb128, so, i guess the easiest way to reset would be to just drop the entries from the .convert file for the schema wouldn't it?
[16:00] <seb128> the other way would be to migrate the key and to set the fallback if the theme is invalid to be the default ubuntu theme
[16:01] <didrocks> seb128: +1 on that
[16:01] <cyphermox> mterry: libglib.
[16:01] <seb128> chrisccoulson, right
[16:02] <cyphermox> mterry: try downgrading to libglib 2.29.4-0ubuntu1, see if you get farther. it seems a *little* more happy on my system
[16:02] <mterry> cyphermox, :-/ I believe it, but ideally such upgrades wouldn't kill NM
[16:02] <cyphermox> mterry: totally agree
[16:03] <cyphermox> I'll bring it back to the right version now and try if rebuilding NM makes it work properly
[16:03] <seb128> if there is a bug in glib somebody should report it to the glib bugzilla, ideally with a testcase or a patch
[16:03] <cyphermox> yeah
[16:03] <seb128> when did your issues start?
[16:03] <cyphermox> just don't know what breaks
[16:03] <seb128> glib only landed yesterday and mterry said he has issue for some days
[16:04] <cyphermox> I know, but it's definitely not helping
[16:05] <cyphermox> AFAICT here, I jumped from 2.28.6-0ubuntu1 to 2.29.6-0ubuntu1 and it stopped working properly (or at least, the menu doesn't display right at all, and even nmcli fails, though that gets built from the network-manager source package
[16:06] <cyphermox> I think the greyed out items are due to something else
[16:06] <seb128> 2.29.4 was in yesterday, 2.29.6 today
[16:07] <cyphermox> aye
[16:07] <seb128> well there the indicator keeps doing the animation thing and none of the eth or wifi connections are checked
[16:08] <cyphermox> yeah, I was seeing there same
[16:09]  * cyphermox is testing the rebuild now
[16:09] <seb128> hum, and I get no bluetooth indicator
[16:09] <seb128> not sure if that's the same issue though
[16:09] <cyphermox> oh
[16:09] <cyphermox> neither do I, but Iḿ not sure if it was showing up before
[16:09] <chrisccoulson> i have no bt indicator either, but bluetooth hasn't worked at all since i upgraded to oneiric
[16:10] <cyphermox> ah, bluetooth-applet just wasn't started here
[16:10] <seb128> I'm pretty sure the bluetooth indicator was still there earlier this week, I used it to turn on a device for a member call
[16:11] <cyphermox> i'll test that now too
[16:11] <seb128> running bluetooth-applet on a command line leads to no indicator to be displayed for me
[16:12] <cyphermox> oh
[16:12] <didrocks> seb128: I confirm now that you tell it
[16:13] <didrocks> didn't notice, but it's not there anymore, it was last week as I'm sure I turned it on for my headset
[16:14] <cyphermox> ah, it works fine for me, and bluetooth is functional, i just sent a picture to my phone
[16:14] <seb128> you downgraded your glib right?
[16:14] <cyphermox> no, that was with the new glib
[16:15] <cyphermox> I have two laptops in front of me
[16:18] <seb128> other indicators work
[16:18] <seb128> it's a bit weird, several issues there
[16:19] <seb128> it's not an unity issue at least
[16:19] <cyphermox> seems to really be NM, not the indicators
[16:26] <cyphermox> hrm... rebuilt doesn't seem to change a thing
[16:26] <seb128> which makes sense
[16:26] <seb128> the library is dynamically loaded
[16:26] <seb128> likely a bug in glib
[16:27] <seb128> is it broken in 2.29.4?
[16:27] <seb128> they rewrote the g_atomic functions in 2.29.6
[16:27] <cyphermox> no, afaict it works properly there
[16:27] <seb128> since it's a rewrite it might be buggy
[16:27] <seb128> http://ftp.acc.umu.se/pub/GNOME/sources/glib/2.29/glib-2.29.6.news
[16:27] <cyphermox> let me make sure, plus I think nm-connection-editor crashes, so maybe it will show up there
[16:28] <cyphermox> nevermind
[16:29] <seb128> ?
[16:29] <seb128> would be worth to maybe try glib trunk
[16:29] <cyphermox> ok
[16:31] <seb128> hum
[16:31] <seb128> should I be able to run nm-applet on a command line?
[16:31] <cyphermox> yes, if it's not already running
[16:31] <seb128> ** (nm-applet:3848): WARNING **: <WARN>  request_name(): Could not acquire the NetworkManagerUserSettings service.
[16:31] <seb128>   Error: (9) Connection ":1.68" is not allowed to own the service "org.freedesktop.NetworkManagerUserSettings" due to security policies in the configuration file
[16:31] <seb128> bah
[16:31] <cyphermox> is NM running?
[16:32] <seb128> yes
[16:32] <cyphermox> anyway, the quickest test is to run "nmcli con" currently is hangs
[16:32] <seb128> indeed
[16:32] <cyphermox> with 2.29.4 is displays its output pretty fast
[16:33] <seb128> cyphermox, can you test a glib git build?
[16:33] <seb128> or do you want me to do it?
[16:33] <cyphermox> oh, I can test it
[16:33] <seb128> cyphermox, check maybe with dan if there is a known issue?
[16:34] <cyphermox> I just looking in git
[16:34] <cyphermox> damn, I can't type today
[16:34] <seb128> git is quite active it's hard to say what commit could fix what issue
[16:35] <cyphermox> I meant NM git
[16:35] <cyphermox> I'll prepare an updated package for glib and test that
[16:37] <seb128> no need to use a package I think
[16:38] <seb128> just do a git build and use LD_LIBRARY_PATH to run nm with the git version
[16:38] <cyphermox> ok
[16:38] <seb128> if you want to do a package one hint is to comment the make check line in the rules
[16:38] <seb128> half of the glib built is spent on the testsuit
[16:39] <seb128> you can also comment the udeb and static build flavor and empty the corresponding .install
[16:39] <seb128> so it builds once instead of 3 times
[16:39] <cyphermox> bah, I'll just use LD...
[16:39] <seb128> ;-)
[16:39] <cyphermox> was going to see with git blame first too ;)
[16:40] <seb128> that's easier, I'm just telling about the other ones because after a few glib or gtk builds you have enough to build the things 3 times and run the testsuite ;-)
[16:40] <cyphermox> hehe
[16:40] <cyphermox> thanks
[16:44] <cyphermox> not sure it will fix things if it's really because of gatomic
[16:44] <seb128> well it was a random guess
[16:44] <cyphermox> ok
[16:45] <seb128> did you try to ask dan if he knows about an issue?
[16:45] <cyphermox> seb128: I did, he doesn't
[16:46] <cyphermox> he's still using 2.28.6
[16:47] <jibel> is there a way to disable the "Oh no! something has gone wrong" window and just let the desktop crash ?
[16:47] <seb128> chrisccoulson, ^
[16:47] <seb128> dunno I never saw that error there
[16:48] <chrisccoulson> no, it comes from gnome-session directly
[16:48] <seb128> we should just patch it out
[16:48] <seb128> let's blame it on vuntz ;-)
[16:48] <chrisccoulson> yeah, it's annoying. it made it unnecessarily difficult to figure out what was wrong with m_conley's session too ;)
[16:49] <seb128> what was wrong?
[16:49] <chrisccoulson> if it wasn't there, it would have been obvious right away that the window manager was crashing
[16:49] <chrisccoulson> seb128, metacity was aborting at startup because of a missing icon
[16:49] <seb128> oh that bug
[16:49] <seb128> ok
[16:49] <jibel> It makes troubleshooting quite difficult with this window on the way.
[16:49] <seb128> yeah, we should just patch it out
[16:49] <chrisccoulson> indeed. and the only way to get rid of it is to kill gnome-session, and then it's game over anyway
[16:49] <seb128> session restart brb
[16:51] <vuntz> chrisccoulson: tss, you can cheat
[16:52] <chrisccoulson> vuntz, ??
[16:52] <vuntz> chrisccoulson: alt+right-click on the window, minimize
[16:52] <vuntz> but don't repeat it, it's a secret :-)
[16:52] <chrisccoulson> vuntz - if the window manager is crashing? ;)
[16:52] <vuntz> chrisccoulson: restart it from a console first?
[16:53] <vuntz> chrisccoulson: you'd be stuck without that window too anyway
[16:53] <chrisccoulson> vuntz, i guess so. the problem in this case though was that the window manager wouldn't run at all ;)
[16:55] <cyphermox> seb128: seems to work with a git snapshot
[17:02] <seb128> re
[17:02] <seb128> bah, didn't work as I wanted, the session didn't want to close I had to restart and got a disk check
[17:03] <seb128> ok, so I get the bluetooth-applet working again but I've to run it by hand for some reason
[17:08] <chrisccoulson> seb128, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-session/ubuntu/revision/168 ;)
[17:08] <chrisccoulson> just testing it now
[17:08] <seb128> \o/
[17:14] <pitti> good night everyone
[17:14] <cyphermox> night pitti
[17:14] <didrocks> good night pitti
[17:15] <pitti> chrisccoulson: hm, firefox still building
[17:15] <pitti> chrisccoulson: after it is built, do you want to give it another round of testing, or want me to copy to -proposed?
[17:16] <seb128> 'night pitti
[17:17] <chrisccoulson> pitti - i'd like to try it out first
[17:17] <chrisccoulson> although, i need to actually set up a natty VM
[17:17] <chrisccoulson> does anyone else have a natty install? ;)
[17:17] <pitti> chrisccoulson: ok; please let me know in scrollback, then I can do the copying tomorrow early morning and start uploading the langpacks
[17:17] <chrisccoulson> thanks
[17:26] <seb128> lol
[17:26] <seb128> "      N.B. no whales were actually harmed during the creation of this patch"
[17:26] <seb128> chrisccoulson, ;-)
[17:36] <didrocks> nobody never notice when I play on words in my changelog, will try to make jokes more obvious in the future :-)
[17:36] <cyphermox> heh ;)
[17:37] <chrisccoulson> seb128, heh :)
[17:37] <cyphermox> seb128: in case you missed my message before, glib from git works; I'm trying to figure out what is breaking now
[17:37] <chrisccoulson> i thought i would add a bit of humour to oneiric-changes ;)
[17:37] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: shouldn't that be depending on session?
[17:37] <seb128> re
[17:37] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, how come?
[17:37] <seb128> didrocks, do you plan on words?
[17:37] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: like, in the gnome-shell session let's have the traditional behavior?
[17:37] <didrocks> seb128: play* (wasn't what I wrote?)
[17:38] <didrocks> I plan as well, but generally not on words :)
[17:38] <seb128> didrocks, yeah, typo from my side, I read it correctly, I just never noticed jokes in your changelogs ;-)
[17:38] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, i don't think so. i just stopped the dialog from appearing entirely, because it's disruptive regardless of the session you're running ;)
[17:39] <didrocks> seb128: oh, there are some, but I wasn't making them obvious to stay serious :-)
[17:39] <didrocks> but ok, I'll go crazy sometimes now : )
[17:39] <seb128> ;-)
[17:39] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: well, we can let the upstream behavior for those who wants to :-)
[17:39] <seb128> didrocks, you are welcome to work on that if you want :p
[17:40] <seb128> but I would better let a chance to users to use apport and debug than to lock their session with a close button
[17:40] <seb128> cyphermox, ok, thanks
[17:40] <didrocks> will have a look
[17:45] <cyphermox> seb128: already breaking in nm_client_new()
[18:03] <cyphermox> seb128: any idea what breaking in glib would make nm not answer to things over dbus?
[18:04] <seb128> cyphermox, not really, is n-m using gdbus?
[18:04] <seb128> you said trunk is working but not 2.29.6?
[18:04] <cyphermox> yeah
[18:04] <cyphermox> is gdbus == dbus_g_**
[18:05] <seb128> no, that's dbus-glib
[18:05] <seb128> g_dbus which is in gio is gdbus
[18:05] <cyphermox> right, that's what i thought
[18:06] <cyphermox> well, NM uses dbus-glib
[18:06] <seb128> cyphermox, thanks for checking that, I will have a look there if I spot something and let you know
[18:06] <cyphermox> ok
[18:06]  * cyphermox runs out to get lunch
[18:06] <cyphermox> I'll be back in 5-10 minutes
[18:06] <seb128> cyphermox, no need to spend time on that for now you can work on something else, I will let you know if I need help on it later
[18:06] <seb128> cyphermox, enjoy
[18:06] <seb128> cyphermox, heh, take time to eat ;-)
[18:07] <cyphermox> heh, it's just getting the food back here
[18:11] <cnd> seb128, I'm trying to run oneiric, but metacity is failing
[18:11] <cnd> http://paste.ubuntu.com/622714/
[18:11] <cnd> any ideas?
[18:11] <seb128> cnd, upgrade gnome-icon-theme
[18:12] <cnd> I've got the latest
[18:12] <seb128> dunno then
[18:12] <cnd> 3.0.0-2ubuntu1
[18:12] <seb128> it's fixed in 2ubuntu2
[18:12] <seb128> upgrade
[18:12] <cnd> oh
[18:12] <cnd> updating now :)
[18:12] <seb128> brb gtk testing
[18:12] <cnd> heh
[18:45] <chrisccoulson> hah, my daughter is crazy
[18:46] <rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, did she just patch the firefox javascript engine to make it faster?
[18:46] <chrisccoulson> lol
[18:46] <rickspencer3> oh, that would be "brilliant", I guess ;)
[18:46] <chrisccoulson> she's not quite that crazy ;)
[18:47] <rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, did she recommend thunderbird as the default mail client for 11.10?
[18:47] <chrisccoulson> yeah, it was all her idea :)
[18:47] <highvoltage> the only thing crazy about that is that it's been proposed for like, 5 UDSs with the same result :)
[18:49] <rickspencer3> haha
[18:51] <evmar> do you guys have any numbers on how popular native mail clients are?
[18:51] <evmar> i feel like i haven't seen anyone use one of those in years, but i admittedly live in a bubble (san francisco)
[18:53] <chrisccoulson> evmar, good question. i think the thunderbird guys would be interested in that sort of information too
[18:55] <evmar> it's a hard thing to evaluate from feedback, because i suspect the sort of person who doesn't use webmail is the sort of person who's more likely to participate in mailing list / bug tracker discussions
[18:59] <chrisccoulson> yeah, that's probably true. i'm not sure how we'd gather that sort of information in a balanced way
[19:00] <chrisccoulson> perhaps if we had a way of gathering how much people used particular applications on their machine, we could work out whether they use a mail client
[19:01] <chrisccoulson> (and i think applications launches are already logged in zeitgeist, as the number of times they are used is displayed in software-center)
[19:03] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, that number looks inaccurate. software-center tells me i've launched my browser 36 times, which sounds wrong ;)
[19:03] <chrisccoulson> (unless that's 36 times this week)
[19:08] <chrisccoulson> "Test Editor - Used: over 100 times". that's probably correct ;)
[19:56] <seb128> re
[19:56] <seb128> cyphermox, ok, I backported http://git.gnome.org/browse/glib/patch/?id=c91720255261222d7be685f3a8f039706f04cce5 and uploaded to oneiric
[19:56] <seb128> it fixes the issue for me
[20:01] <cyphermox> ah, thought it could be the issue :)
[20:02] <cyphermox> thanks
[20:03] <seb128> yw
[20:03] <seb128> thanks for trying to git build and confirming it fixed the issue, it made easier to figure where the issue was and to backport a commit
[20:04] <cyphermox> sure. it was fun, too ;)
[20:05] <cyphermox> not everyday you get to start NM with LD_LIBRARY_PATH or LD_PRELOAD bits of libnm-glib to debug stuff :D
[20:05] <seb128> right! ;-)
[20:06] <cyphermox> seb128: is the stuff on versions still needing merging/updating, e.g. does it need to be done throughout the release or are we mostly on track?
[20:07] <seb128> cyphermox, everything which is red or orange ;-)
[20:07] <cyphermox> good
[20:08] <seb128> cyphermox, if you want to do updates from the list the ones that need work: gnome-user-docs (could be worth checking with mdke or the documeantion team), xscreensaver, yelp, that's about it from the default list
[20:09] <cyphermox> ok
[20:10] <cyphermox> btw, I'm finishing up a merge proposal for libappindicator, then with some small changes in nm-applet I'm theoretically able to reduce the memory use and leaking by some more :)
[20:10] <seb128> cyphermox, otherwise on the non default list: liferea gnumeric gdl  bug-buddy anjuta gegl?
[20:10] <cyphermox> yeah
[20:10] <seb128> nice!
[20:10] <seb128> cyphermox, if you want to do merges or updates today feel free
[20:10] <seb128> didrocks and kenvandine are on sponsoring duties tomorrow so they should be able to clean any desktop merge request waiting
[20:11] <cyphermox> ok
[20:11] <seb128> we are done with most updates so I will try to be better at sponsoring in the next weeks as well
[20:11] <cyphermox> I'll do this and get back to indicator-network or usb-modeswitch tomorrow
[20:11] <seb128> ok
[20:12] <seb128> is indicator-network still getting work?
[20:12] <cyphermox> well I kind of mentioned it in two sessions, I'm trying to have it speak to NM, but it's starting to be more trouble than I feel it's worth
[20:13] <cyphermox> nm-applet already works ;)
[20:15] <cyphermox> (and rewriting usb-modeswitch-dispatcher in C is non-trivial)
[20:16] <seb128> you did settle in C for it?
[20:16] <cyphermox> yeah
[20:16] <seb128> well nm-applet works but the design guys think the indicator layout is much nicer
[20:16] <seb128> so it's worth spending some time on it if you can get it work
[20:16] <cyphermox> right
[20:17] <seb128> not to mention that it would mean you wouldn't need to keep maintaining a nm-applet patch which is probably non trivial
[20:17] <cyphermox> the nm-applet patch is getting simpler and simpler ;)
[20:18] <cyphermox> but yeah, indicator-network: it's in progress, there's a fair amount done already, but I have no idea if it will work. I think there's still lots to do before I can try to compile it
[20:18] <seb128> well it's a nice to have not a blocker in any case
[20:18] <seb128> try maybe to focus on the usb-modeswitch-dispatcher, it would allow to drop tcl from the cd right?
[20:18] <cyphermox> yup
[20:19] <seb128> you would prorbably get a free beer from chrisccoulson if you win CD space ;-)
[20:19] <cyphermox> hahah
[20:19] <cyphermox> I don't think it's going to be that much space ;)
[20:21] <seb128> tcl835 is 1mb
[20:21] <seb128> tcl8.5 is 1mb
[20:21] <cyphermox> oh
[20:22] <seb128> that's not to be neglected
[20:22] <cyphermox> indeed
[20:22] <seb128> old tb needed 6mb over evo and there is like 3-4mb space today
[20:23] <seb128> so it's getting close if they can go back to that number
[20:23] <seb128> (seems like the new version is eating a bit extra space)
[20:23] <cyphermox> do you know how much extra?
[20:23] <cyphermox> is it already on the cd?
[20:24] <cyphermox> ah, doesn't seem to be
[20:25] <seb128> tb? no it's pending on work to be done and on cd space
[20:25] <seb128> the old version needed an extra 6mb over evo, the new one is around 11mb it seems
[20:26] <seb128> so chrisccoulson has work items to see if we can bring it back to the old value, then we should be close to have the space
[20:26] <cyphermox> ok
[20:26] <cyphermox> are the other ifs already taken care of?
[20:30] <seb128> cyphermox, to get cd space? we got quite some work done already, it was 9mb over the limit until recently we are back under it
[20:30] <seb128> but it's getting difficult to find space
[20:30] <seb128> cleaning tcl would be welcome ;-)
[20:30] <cyphermox> no, i meant are the other conditions for tb met?
[20:31] <cyphermox> seb128: worry less, I'm working on usb-modeswitch
[20:35] <seb128> cyphermox, oh, yeah a few upstream things, like integration in e-d-s or better ubuntu theming
[20:35] <seb128> those seem to be in track though
[20:35] <seb128> the issue is rather on finding CD space for it
[20:37] <cyphermox> yeah
[21:01] <jcastro> kenvandine_: are you on 11.10?
[21:01] <kenvandine_> jcastro, yup
[21:02] <jcastro> kenvandine_: I don't see anything about a battery icon in the new g-p-m control panel thing, any idea how to get a battery life icon?
[21:03] <kenvandine> i think it is missing the appindicator stuff
[21:03] <kenvandine> it isn't there now, i haven't really looked
[21:07] <cyphermox> ah
[21:19] <rickspencer3> hmm
[21:20] <rickspencer3> does not appear that gtk webkit easily handles cookies for me :/
[21:20]  * rickspencer3 watches hopes gets dashed on rocks
[21:27] <rickspencer3> why am I not surprised to find this API to be terribly documented?
[21:28] <evmar> gtk webkit has like 2.5 people working on it, which feels like barely enough to just keep up with webkit trunk
[21:30] <chrisccoulson> heh, don't say that. i'm currently porting everything in our archive using gtkmozembed to using webkitgtk instead ;)
[21:31] <ogra_> ubuntu had like 18 people working on it for teh first few years, which feels like barely enough to just keep up with debian unstable
[21:31] <ogra_> :)
[21:32] <chrisccoulson> lol
[21:56] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, weird - http://people.canonical.com/~chrisccoulson/appmenu-bug.png
[21:56] <chrisccoulson> i can see the tops of the characters on the menubar that's meant to be hidden ;)
[21:57] <ogra_> chrisccoulson, ever tried to type LS on people.c.c ?
[21:58]  * ogra_ just typed that accidentially 
[21:58] <ogra_> (entertaining)
[21:58] <chrisccoulson> LS? not ls?
[21:58] <ogra_> yep
[21:59] <chrisccoulson> what's going to happen if i run that?
[21:59] <broder> nothing harmful
[21:59] <chrisccoulson> lol
[21:59] <chrisccoulson> awesome!
[21:59] <ogra_> :)
[21:59] <broder> the details must be experienced for oneself
[21:59] <chrisccoulson> that's pretty sweet
[21:59] <ogra_> yeah
[22:00] <ogra_> nice way to tell you you have capslock on :)
[22:00] <chrisccoulson> lol
[22:00] <chrisccoulson> it even has a manpage
[22:01] <ogra_> LOL
[22:01] <highvoltage> heh, I thought I was the only one evil enough to install sl :)
[22:01] <broder> i have aliases in my standard dotfiles specifically to protect me from any sysadmin dastardly enough to install it
[22:02] <chrisccoulson> i can't believe i'd never seen that before. i haven't lived!
[22:03] <highvoltage> next think you'll say that you haven't seen apt-get moo yet!
[22:04] <chrisccoulson> oh, i've definitely seen that :)
[22:04] <highvoltage> yeah but have you seen http://people.ubuntu.com/~jonathan/moo/ yet!
[22:04] <chrisccoulson> lol
[22:05] <ajmitch> ogra_: now you've got me curious about what the result of LS is
[22:05] <ogra_> just install sl :)
[22:06] <ajmitch> heh
[22:06] <ajmitch> ok, now we need this on the default install
[22:06] <chrisccoulson> noooooooooooooooooooooo. we need to save every last kb for thunderbird ;)
[22:06] <highvoltage> chrisccoulson: have you seen about:robots in firefox?
[22:06] <chrisccoulson> highvoltage, yeah
[22:08] <mdeslaur> ogra_, chrisccoulson: you know what's even more evil than "sl"? The fact that command-not-found suggests to install it if it's not already installed :)
[22:08] <chrisccoulson> heh :)
[22:09] <ogra_> hah
[22:39] <rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, do you know much about gtk webkit?
[22:39] <chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, i've not used it that much. what question do you have?
[22:39] <rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, well, it doesn't seem there is a built in way to tell it ot handle cookies for you
[22:39] <rickspencer3> I find that hard to believe
[22:40] <rickspencer3> but, you may be shocked to hear that the documentation isn't great
[22:40] <chrisccoulson> yeah, the documentation is pretty bad :)
[22:40] <chrisccoulson> i'm not sure about the cookies thing though. the first place i would have a look would be in epiphany though
[22:41] <chrisccoulson> that might have some clues :)
[22:50] <chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, so, you need to get the SoupSession from webkit, with webkit_get_default_session
[22:50] <rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, ok, I need to figure out how to do that in python
[22:50] <chrisccoulson> then you need to add a SoupCookieJar with soup_session_add_feature
[22:50] <chrisccoulson> yeah :)
[22:51] <chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, http://developer.gnome.org/libsoup/stable/SoupCookieJarSqlite.html
[22:51] <chrisccoulson> i think that's what you want :)
[22:51] <rickspencer3> thanks chrisccoulson
[22:51] <chrisccoulson> i just had a look at what epiphany does :)
[23:29] <TheMuso> I thought libsoup was GObject, and therefore coul dbe used with gobject introspectino/pygi.