[02:39] <kenvandine> TheMuso, i dropped that service now
[02:39] <kenvandine> TheMuso, you can just build and run the client
[02:47] <TheMuso> kenvandine: oh ok.
[03:03] <kenvandine> TheMuso, so have you checked it out yet?
[03:03] <TheMuso> kenvandine: Yeah but haven't got it to pull my twitter feed yet.
[05:55] <vish> kenvandine: hi, around?
[06:05] <pitti> Good morning
[06:10] <RAOF> Good morning!
[06:12] <TheMuso> Morning pitti.
[06:15] <TheMuso> robert_ancell: Seems you jumped ovev 0.4.0-0ubuntu1 in your recent upload...
[06:15] <TheMuso> over
[06:15] <robert_ancell> TheMuso, yeah, it FTB in the PPA, so I just bumped the version
[06:15] <micahg> robert_ancell: in the future, you can collapse the changelog for the archive upload
[06:17] <robert_ancell> pitti, I finally got the regression tests to work in my pbuilder, but then they fail on the buildd!  So frustrating...
[06:17] <micahg> the archive has separate source records, so you can upload the same version to the archive after it goes to a PPA (at least for the moment)
[06:24] <robert_ancell> micahg, can I upload the older version?
[06:24] <pitti> robert_ancell: oh, looking
[06:27] <micahg> robert_ancell: well, before you uploaded ubuntu2, you could've  uploaded an ubuntu1 with a collapsed changelog, at this point, it doesn't make sense, just something to keep in mind
[06:27] <pitti> robert_ancell: 0.3.7-0ubuntu2 didn't run the test suite on build yet then?
[06:27] <pitti> robert_ancell: for some reason there isn't a 0.4.0-0ubuntu1
[06:27] <robert_ancell> pitti, no, I disabled it
[06:27] <pitti> robert_ancell: so it failed in a PPA then?
[06:27] <robert_ancell> pitti, yeah, in the lightdm PPA
[06:27] <pitti> as I don't see a failure in an ubuntu build
[06:27] <pitti> ah
[06:28] <pitti> https://launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/+archive/lightdm/+packages -> uh, maverick only
[06:28] <robert_ancell> pitti, no that one's obsolete, see the comment
[06:29] <pitti> ok, so there's no build log
[06:29] <pitti> robert_ancell: did it only fail some particular test, or all of them (i. e. some problem with dbus setup)?
[06:30] <robert_ancell> pitti, all of them failed, but I don't have enough info to work out why
[06:30] <robert_ancell> pitti, any debugging tips to work it out?
[06:31] <pitti> robert_ancell: didn't it give you an exception or g_critical or anythign that points out why?
[06:32] <robert_ancell> pitti, one of the child processes in the test failed I think.  I'll have to upload a modifed package with debugging enabled to see why.  I was going to see if I can log into the buildds somehow and test before trying that
[06:32] <pitti> robert_ancell: no, that's not possible
[06:32] <robert_ancell> it's going to be really slow constantly uploading to a PPA to work out why it's failing
[06:32] <pitti> you can only add some echos/printf()s, and keep throwing stuff into the PPA
[06:32] <pitti> or try to reproduce locally, of course
[06:33] <pitti> which kind of services does it try to talk to?
[06:33] <pitti> you could try stopping X.org, ConsoleKit, system dbus, stop your network connection, and build in vt1
[06:34] <pitti> pbuilder should already shield away the system bus, though
[06:34] <pitti> so the most common causes for this are (1) no internet connection from buildds, and (2) the local host name can't be resolved
[06:35] <robert_ancell> it seems to be failing when I run the fake xserver, it starts, but the SIGHUP never gets received from the test runner.  There will be a log on the disk somewhere, but I don't dump it out
[06:41] <pitti> ah, the SIGHUP is sent by X.org to its parent to notify that it's ready
[06:42] <pitti> robert_ancell: but it does work on real iron, i. e. lightdm sets up the signal correctly in general?
[06:42] <robert_ancell> pitti, yeah, it works running as a service, in test mode, in a pbuilder, but not in a buildd
[07:12] <robert_ancell> RAOF, can you decode this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/628286/.  It's from the GDM Xsession file.  I think it's obsolete and will always be ignored on Ubuntu
[07:16] <RAOF> robert_ancell: It looks like it's trying to propagate the xkb symbols from XF86Config (which we don't have) in the case that /etc/X11/X isn't a symlink (which it is) and /etc/X11/X contains some sort of Sun string.
[07:16] <RAOF> In short - that's not going to be run on Ubuntu.
[07:16] <robert_ancell> yay! dropped
[07:17] <robert_ancell> RAOF, one more, here is my sane Xsession that I'm going to use for LightDM http://paste.ubuntu.com/628288/.  Does it look like it makes sense?  Is the xmodmap stuff still applicable?
[07:18] <RAOF> That looks fairly sane to me.
[07:19] <RAOF> I think that there's still stuff that xmodmap does that no other tool does, so it's probably still applicable.
[07:22] <pitti> please keep it
[07:22] <pitti> breaking people's ~/.xmodmap files wouldn't be nice
[07:22] <pitti> and it's a no-op for people who don't have it
[07:23] <pitti> although mine is called ~/.xmodmaprc
[07:23] <pitti> I'm not sure which part reads that, maybe something in g-settings-daemon
[07:25] <robert_ancell> pitti, will do
[08:19] <robert_ancell> pitti, I am away next week, can you and others keep an eye out for any major lightdm issues that crop up today and send to my gmail address.  I'll drop in tomorrow if it's important
[08:20] <pitti> robert_ancell: can do, yes; enjoy your holiday!
[08:21] <robert_ancell> pitti, thanks
[08:48] <seb128> hey
[08:51] <pitti> it's a Seb!
[08:52] <pitti> chrisccoulson: can I annoy you with https://code.launchpad.net/~pitti/ubufox/default-homepage-override/+merge/63121 again?
[08:53] <seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
[08:53] <seb128> is the new unity working for people who upgraded?
[08:54] <pitti> I didn't notice a difference so far
[08:54] <pitti> so I guess that's a "yes" :)
[08:56] <seb128> pitti, it's the new SRU candidate version I uploaded to oneiric, it's only bug fixes, you shouldn't notice a difference ;-)
[08:56] <seb128> pitti, I did find a bug in the autohide though so I didn't upload as a SRU, waiting for a fix
[08:58] <chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
[08:58] <chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, will do that in a minute, sorry :)
[08:59] <pitti> hey chrisccoulson, good morning
[08:59] <pitti> thanks!
[09:01] <seb128> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
[09:01] <chrisccoulson> seb128, good thanks, how are you?
[09:02] <seb128> I'm fine thanks
[09:03] <rodrigo_> morning
[09:09] <pitti> hey rodrigo_
[09:11] <seb128> can everybody makes sure you update unity if you run oneiric and restart it?
[09:11] <seb128> I would like to make sure there is no other bug before doing the sru ;-)
[09:12] <mvo> dobey: hi! I will request a sync for pyinotify, you did a init_errno.patch for this that raises a proper OSError() if the init fails. this is done by upstream now as well, but the string is slightly different (but contains the same information, i.e. the errno and os.strerror). just FYI in case you need to update your code
[09:12] <zyga> stgraber, ping
[09:14] <mvo> zyga: he is most likely still sleeping, in the middle of the night for his TZ
[09:14] <zyga> mvo, canada?
[09:14] <mvo> yeah
[09:14] <zyga> mvo, aww, ok
[09:14] <zyga> mvo, perhaps you know how his sandboxing wrapper is called?
[09:14] <mvo> arkose
[09:14] <zyga> mvo, I want to isolate processes from internet
[09:14] <zyga> awesome, thanks
[09:14] <mvo> yw
[10:33] <bigon> kenvandine: you have stolen the -1 revision of empathy package :(
[10:35] <seb128> bigon, it's not like we could sync anyway
[10:36] <rodrigo_> seb128, oh, btw, just saw on my todo list the grepping for system-wide gsettings we talked about, for the gconf plugin in g-s-d, did you do it?
[10:36] <rodrigo_> s/gsettings/gconf
[10:36] <seb128> rodrigo_, not yet
[10:37] <seb128> but seems low priority anyway?
[10:37] <seb128> there is still quite some gconf rdepends
[10:37] <rodrigo_> seb128, yes, no hurry, the plugin should be working ok now
[10:37] <seb128> I'm about to build a list of gconf and gtk2 rdepends
[10:37] <seb128> on the CD I mean
[10:37] <bigon> seb128: yeah I know, but for the telepahy ppa that's annoying
[10:37] <rodrigo_> seb128, yes, just wanted to know what was using desktop-wide settings, that would confirm the need to have the gconf plugin
[10:38] <seb128> rodrigo_, I will have a look to that next
[10:40] <rodrigo_> seb128, as I said, no hurry :)
[10:40] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, around?
[10:42] <seb128> rodrigo_, seems like libedataserver so evolution still use it
[10:42] <seb128> rodrigo_, pidgin as well
[10:42] <seb128> just to list 2 popular ones I've installed
[10:42] <seb128> they use the http_proxy values
[10:42] <rodrigo_> ugh, right, evolution
[10:42] <seb128> rodrigo_, those alone are enough to justify needing it
[10:42] <rodrigo_> we probably need to push evo port to gsettings
[10:42] <rodrigo_> seb128, yes, evo itself is enough
[10:51] <rodrigo_> omg, what have I done to deserve this toothache :(
[10:52] <seb128> rodrigo_, still having tooth issues?
[10:52] <pitti> rodrigo_: what did they do to your teeth?
[10:53] <pitti> sounds like they blew it?
[10:53] <pitti> after treating cavities they should feel good again after a day..
[10:54] <rodrigo_> pitti, they removed it, and put some stuff to fill the hole
[10:54] <rodrigo_> and the 1st week I was perfect, but pain is getting worse every day
[10:54] <rodrigo_> so not sure why I went to the dentist in the 1st place really :(
[10:55] <pitti> maybe they forgot some pieces of the caries?
[10:55] <rodrigo_> there was no caries, they removed a fake tooth I had which had broken and created some infection
[10:56] <rodrigo_> so yeah, not sure what's up, I am supposed to have nothing infectable there
[10:56] <rodrigo_> anyway, it's not too painful for now, let's hope it doesn't get worst
[10:59] <cdbs> seb128: Wasn't 3.8.16 expected to get into -proposed?
[10:59] <cdbs> of Unity, I mean
[11:00] <seb128> cdbs, no
[11:00] <cdbs> seb128: Its written as "SRU2" here: https://launchpad.net/unity/3.0/3.8.16
[11:00] <cdbs> though that may be wrong
[11:00] <seb128> cdbs, bug #798318 needs to be fixed first
[11:00] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 798318 in unity "launcher autohidding is failing with 3.8.16" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/798318
[11:01] <seb128> cdbs, no point to push something which we know will not let in because it has a new bug
[11:01] <cdbs> seb128: And I also noticed another regression, the window control buttons on the panel, occasionally get faded away under randomly occuring black boxes
[11:01] <seb128> njpatel, ^
[11:02] <cdbs> seb128, njpatel: I'm not sure, it may be an isolated case with me, and an upstream driver mess since I use the xorg-edgers PPA
[11:02] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, hi
[11:02] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, hi
[11:02] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, I have been looking at embedding system-config-printer in the new g-c-c, as we discussed at UDS
[11:02] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, and the s-c-p window inside g-c-c will look horrible
[11:03] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, so I was thinking about patching the printer panel in g-c-c to call s-c-p for adding printers and setting options
[11:03] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, but s-c-p doesn't have any argument at all to be able to do that
[11:03] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, that is -> s-c-p --add-printer or s-c-p --config "HP PhotoSmart"...
[11:05] <njpatel> cdbs, it sounds like it (I've been running since yesterday and haven't seen it)
[11:05] <cdbs> njpatel: http://imgur.com/f7FE0&RQJPw
[11:05] <cdbs> njpatel: click the 'second picture' link to see the second one
[11:06] <njpatel> cdbs, yeah, that's graphics corruption  fwict
[11:06] <cdbs> njpatel: in the first pic, look at the window buttons. In the second one, look at the bfb
[11:06] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, would it be possible to add that?
[11:06] <njpatel> cdbs, I don't think this update causes that, but I can't be sure, of course, thanks to drivers being crap
[11:07] <cdbs> njpatel: I'm running an Intel GPU, which one are you running btw?
[11:07] <njpatel> cdbs, both intel and nvidia
[11:07] <cdbs> probably its isolated to only the Intel driver?
[11:07] <njpatel> cdbs, but on natty
[11:07] <cdbs> njpatel: by both you mean optimus?
[11:07] <njpatel> cdbs, no, I mean two systems, sorry
[11:07] <njpatel> cdbs, running on fully updated natty, no PPAs
[11:08] <njpatel> well, no important PPAs ;)
[11:08]  * cdbs thought he found another friend who is dealing with the optimus mess
[11:08] <njpatel> cdbs, heh
[11:11] <rodrigo_> oh, got an answer from mkestner about https://github.com/mono/gtk-sharp: "Usable in a few known ports which are proceeding.  Unreleased as yet."
[11:11] <rodrigo_> so at least now we know the status of the gtk# port
[11:11] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, s-c-p can be called for adding printers via D-Bus, but probably only if a printer ID is supplied. Probably the best is patching s-c-p. Also newprinter.py has some debug command line calls to open an add-printer dialog. Perhaps you could get in contact with Tim Waugh and offer him patches to call the add-printer wizard and the properties dialogs separately, either by moving parts of s-c-p into a new Python library or by addin
[11:11] <tkamppeter> g command line arguments to the s-c-p call, or by adding new calls to the D-Bus interface, like add printer without device ID, so that the wizard starts with the printer discovery, whatever is most convenient to you (probably the D-Bus thingy is the best and easiest.
[11:12] <rodrigo_> the dbus interface might work, although if it doesn't have what we need, it'd be better to just add the command line args
[11:12]  * rodrigo_ checks d-feet
[11:14] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, all types of interfaces need work on s-c-p ... So choose the most convenient for your purposes.
[11:15] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, to contact Tim: twaugh at redhat dot com, please CC me.
[11:18] <rodrigo_> ok, s-c-p service has NewPrinterDialog and PrinterPropertiesDialog calls, although they seem to crash scp-dbus-service
[11:19] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, that must be a bug, patches welcome, best is to contact Tim.
[11:31] <seb128> stupid question, but if I loop mount an image and chroot into it, can I mount a directory outside the chroot in some way?
[11:31] <seb128> would be handy to write logs for my rdepends calls :-)
[11:32] <seb128> I could use unsquashfs to unpack the livecd also but that's quite slow
[11:42] <pitti> seb128: not this way around, but you can bind-mount a dir into the chroto
[11:42] <pitti> e. g. /tmp/
[11:42] <ogra_> seb128, you should be able to mount from another terminal
[11:42] <ogra_> i.e. outside the chroot
[11:42] <pitti> /tmp            /home/dchroot/lucid/tmp          none    bind    0 0
[11:42] <pitti> ^ example from my fstab
[11:42] <seb128> hum, when I tried it told me the mount was read only
[11:42] <pitti> seb128: then /tmp/ in the chroot is exactly the same, you can even run X programs, etc.
[11:43] <pitti> seb128: with bind mounting?
[11:44] <seb128> hum
[11:44] <pitti> sudo mount -o bind /tmp /your/chroot/path/tmp
[11:44] <pitti> ought to be as easy as that
[11:46] <seb128> pitti, indeed thanks, dunno what I did before
[11:47] <seb128> pitti, I think I tried to create a log dir but it didn't let me mkdir since the mount is ro
[11:47] <seb128> and it wouldn't mount to a non existant dir
[11:47] <seb128> but using tmp works for what I've to do
[11:47] <pitti> I generally find it very comfortable to do so, as this allows you to run X stuff
[11:47] <pitti> i. e. I can test gnome stuff in my sid or lucid chroots
[11:50]  * pitti lunch &
[11:50] <seb128> coffee here
[11:50] <seb128> restarting with the new unity and lightdm as well
[11:58] <ogra_> bah, no robert ancell ...
[11:59]  * ogra_ finally has lightdm to not die on login ....
[11:59] <ogra_> saldy i now have to start it manually after boot :P
[12:13] <seb128> re
[12:13] <seb128> pitti, when you are back from lunch I would appreciate a SRU review from the new unity ;-)
[12:41] <cjwatson> anyone mind if I upload lightdm to actually install its autologin PAM file?
[12:41]  * cjwatson is working on making it work right on the live CD again
[12:48] <seb128> cjwatson, go for it
[12:48] <seb128> cjwatson, thanks for working on that ;-)
[12:48] <cjwatson> thanks - just got it working
[12:54] <pitti> seb128: sure
[12:56] <seb128> pitti, danke
[12:56] <seb128> ok, so I've a script that give me daily iso rdepends for any binary in one command
[12:57] <seb128> current iso has 63 libgconf2-4 rdepends
[12:57] <seb128> 89 libgtk2.0-0 ones
[12:57] <seb128> (binary rdepends)
[12:58] <seb128> how do you guys prefer those lists to be maintained? copy in the etherpad? vcs? static list on a people url?
[12:58] <seb128> or tagged bugs all the sources that need porting before the lts?
[12:59] <seb128> I would lean toward using the etherpad or tagged bugs
[13:07] <pitti> tagged bugs are better for long-term tracking, but harder to create
[13:07] <pitti> I think for now an etherpad would do
[13:09] <pitti> mvo: oh, merge-o-mania today? :-)
[13:12] <seb128> pitti, \o/ danke for the SRU
[13:13] <mvo> pitti: I was a bit lazy with merges so I thought I should make up for it today :)
[13:14] <seb128> pitti, ok, I will probably dump the lists as it on the etherpad and start filing some tagged bugs for things that will need work
[13:14] <mvo> lots of sync as well
[13:14] <seb128> mvo, \o/
[13:14] <mvo> *hint* *hint* ;)
[13:14] <mvo> I can't wait for the day when LP lets me do it finally
[13:15] <pitti> I thought I read on -devel that this might be next week already
[13:15] <pitti> back in ~ 1.5 hours
[13:15] <seb128> pitti, mvo: yeah, on the "diff with debian" discussion they said it will win a sync button next week
[13:35]  * rodrigo_ -> lunch
[14:23] <kenvandine> pitti, my empathy is doing the same thing now... after i rebooted last night
[14:36] <davmor2> kenvandine: is that not theme and really slow typing rate?
[14:37] <davmor2> s/not/no
[14:41] <pitti> kenvandine: even with 3.1.2?
[14:41] <pitti> kenvandine: I upgraded to that now, but since then nobody spoke to me on jabber
[14:44] <kenvandine> davmor2, what do you mean?
[14:45] <kenvandine> pitti, let me IM you :)
[14:45] <seb128> ok
[14:45] <seb128> see the bottom of the etherpad for a first gconf rdepends list
[14:45] <seb128> is the format working for everybody?
[14:45] <pitti> kenvandine: still the same problem apparently
[14:45] <pitti> kenvandine: I got a notification, I click on your nick, I get an empty chat window
[14:46] <davmor2> kenvandine: I upgraded to oneiric on my netbook, empathy is unusable,  the theme doesn't show up in the chat window and text input is really slow
[14:46] <pitti> kenvandine: I blindly typed "hello", but neither see your text, nor mine
[14:46] <kenvandine> ah
[14:46] <kenvandine> ok
[14:46] <pitti> now the window grayed out
[14:46] <kenvandine> davmor2, so you are seeing it too
[14:46] <davmor2> kenvandine: indeed reported it last night
[14:46] <kenvandine> ok, pitti was seeing it yesterday but i wasn't
[14:47] <kenvandine> i had updated and restarted empathy, and all was fine until i rebooted
[14:47] <davmor2> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/empathy/+bug/798440
[14:47] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 798440 in empathy "empathy chat is ridiculously slow and shows no text on the default theme" [Undecided,New]
[14:47] <fta> is there a way to put evolution(3) offline/online from a script?
[14:47] <davmor2> pitti: try changing the theme to blue
[14:48] <davmor2> that shows the text then it's still slow as hell though
[14:48] <seb128> fta, no idea, ask on #evolution on irc.gnome.org
[14:48] <pitti> davmor2: slightly better, but still hanging
[14:48] <pitti> right
[14:49] <davmor2> pitti: right but you do see things in the chat window then
[14:49] <seb128> pitti, when did that start?
[14:49] <davmor2> seb128: I clocked it last night
[14:49] <kenvandine> it is pegging my CPU
[14:49] <seb128> kenvandine, when did that start for you?
[14:49] <kenvandine> it started for me after i rebooted last night, it was fine even with new empathy until i restarted my session
[14:49] <seb128> could one of you try downgrading gtk3 to 3.1.4 and try again?
[14:50] <kenvandine> i killed empathy and everything telepathy related after pitti mentioned it yesterday
[14:50] <davmor2> kenvandine: on my netbook it causes the fan to go crazy so it is possibly doing the same thing to my system cpu too
[14:50] <kenvandine> and started them back up and all seemed fine
[14:50] <seb128> deja-dup has speed issues as well since recently
[14:50] <seb128> seems gtk geometry computation slowness or something
[14:50] <kenvandine> seb128, i'll try that
[14:50] <seb128> thanks
[14:50] <pitti> seb128: a couple of days ago, not sure
[14:50] <seb128> pitti, can you try with gtk3.1.4?
[14:50] <pitti> seb128: sure
[14:50] <seb128> danke
[14:51] <seb128> pitti, btw http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/oneiric-desktop  see the bottom
[14:51] <seb128> pitti, I will start filing tagged bugs for things I think we should do active work on
[14:51] <pitti> seb128: splendid
[14:52] <seb128> pitti, I will start filing tagged bugs for things I think we should do active work on
[14:52] <seb128> ups
[14:52] <seb128> wrong focus
[14:52] <seb128> pitti, same list for gtk2 coming next
[14:54] <kenvandine> seb128, gtk 3.1.4 seemed to have fixed it
[14:54] <pitti> kenvandine: much better from my end with 3.1.4
[14:54] <pitti> seb128: ^
[14:54] <seb128> ok, what I though
[14:54] <seb128> it's likely the same issue mterry has with deja-dup
[14:54] <pitti> I just downgraded libgtk-3-0
[14:54] <seb128> there is something slow in gtk 3.1.6
[14:54] <pitti> not the other gtk+3.0 binaries
[14:54] <seb128> let me check upstream bugs and git
[14:55] <pitti> I'll try with git head
[15:02] <Laney> what is the difference between indicator-applet and indicator-application? I cannot tell from the descriptions
[15:02] <seb128> pitti, I asked on #gnome-hackers, not really a known issue
[15:02] <seb128> Laney, one is an applet, i.e a gnome-panel loader
[15:03] <pitti> seb128: I check git head then, and bisect
[15:03] <seb128> Laney, the other one is an indicator
[15:03] <seb128> pitti, thanks
[15:03] <Laney> an indicator to display indicators?
[15:03] <seb128> Laney, indicator-applet or unity are "loaders", they render indicators
[15:04] <seb128> Laney, indicator-application is what render libappindicator clients, it's an indicator like the session, messages, etc ones
[15:04] <seb128> Laney, the applet is a container if you prefer
[15:05] <Laney> I get applet, it's application that is more confusing
[15:05] <seb128> it's just an indicator which render libappindicators client icons
[15:06] <seb128> pitti, can you join #gnome-hackers?
[15:06] <seb128> pitti, will be easier than to split the discussion
[15:06] <pitti> sure
[15:08] <seb128> Laney, it could called indicator-newsystray :p
[15:08] <seb128> be
[15:08] <seb128> Laney, it's basically the indicator equivalent of the systray applet
[15:09] <Laney> i thought thats what indicator-applet or unity were
[15:09] <seb128> Laney, we have one extra layer compared to the systray in some way
[15:10] <Laney> I guess I don't understand what an indicator to render indicators is
[15:10] <seb128> Laney, the indicators render icons and those icons are packed in the applet
[15:10] <Laney> how does this first indicator get rendered?!?!!?
[15:10]  * Laney 's head spins around a bit
[15:11] <seb128> Laney, each indicator render icons, all the indicators are packed in the panel by the applet
[15:11] <Laney> hmm ok
[15:11] <seb128> Laney, you could have one applet for indicator-application if you want, one for indicator-session, etc
[15:11] <seb128> Laney, in the past we have 2 groups, session and me in one applet and the applications in another
[15:11] <Laney> so it collates all of the app indicators into one place
[15:11] <seb128> right
[15:11] <seb128> well all or a defined set
[15:11] <seb128> we have different applets
[15:12] <seb128> -session, -complete
[15:12] <seb128> but the one we use nowadays pack all the indicators
[15:12] <Laney> but you still need something else to actually render the indicators
[15:12] <seb128> that's indicator-*
[15:12] <Laney> got it
[15:12] <seb128> indicator-application is what renders the systray equivalents
[15:13] <seb128> then it's packed in the panel by the applet
[15:14] <seb128> Laney, you can install libindicator-tools if you want
[15:14] <seb128> Laney, it has a standalone loader which load an indicator .so and display it on screen
[15:14] <Laney> cool
[15:15] <Laney> I only ask because I'm maintaining sparkleshare which has an indicator
[15:15] <Laney> and I'd like to understand how it works (and maybe have it in Debian ... but GNOME 3)
[15:17] <seb128> Laney, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopExperienceTeam/ApplicationIndicators btw
[15:17] <seb128> that can be useful to read
[15:17] <seb128> Laney, there is a pkg-ayatana team in debian packaging that stack
[15:17] <seb128> they didn't do gtk3 builds yet though
[15:17] <Laney> saw that, but it didn't exaplin all the different parts clealy to me
[15:17] <Laney> yep
[15:17] <Laney> needs those for the new libappindicator apparently
[15:18] <Laney> looks like gtk3 in unstable is new enough now though?
[15:18] <chrisccoulson> somebody needs to rename the indicator stack, it's too confusing ;)
[15:18] <Laney> heh
[15:18] <seb128> Laney, yes, there is no specific gtk3 version required, not sure why the pkg-ayatana guys dropped the gtk3 builds
[15:18] <Laney> better long descriptions would have been ok
[15:18] <seb128> they basically merge on ubuntu
[15:18] <Laney> seb128: it was only in exp when they did it I think
[15:18] <seb128> ok
[15:19] <Laney> only got to sid on 2011-04-10
[15:19] <seb128> so yeah, somebody should tell them to bring that back ;-)
[15:19] <Laney> is anyone working on indicators in gnome 3?
[15:19] <fta> seems there's a typo in evolution.desktop, last line (from debian/patches/10_desktop_shortcuts.patch)
[15:21] <mterry> Laney, for gtk3, yes.  for gnome3, no
[15:22] <seb128> Laney, define gnome3? gnome-shell?
[15:22] <Laney> yeah
[15:22] <Laney> like porting indicator-applet i guess?
[15:22] <seb128> Laney, we aim at having GTK3 builds for the stack at the end of the month
[15:22] <Laney> that will bring gnome shell support?
[15:22] <seb128> no
[15:22] <seb128> but I guess it would easy to write a .js loader
[15:23] <Laney> but it's a prerequisite, right :-)
[15:23] <seb128> that will make those work in gnome-panel3 though
[15:23] <seb128> Laney, yes
[15:23] <seb128> Laney, I guess it would be easy to write some .js for g-s to load indicators if you want to
[15:23] <Laney> cool
[15:24] <Laney> but if i'm just caring about myself then the panel is sufficient... *cough*
[15:24] <Laney> oh, look at this: gnoe bug 652122
[15:25] <Laney> gnome bug 652122
[15:25] <ubot2> Gnome bug 652122 in message-tray "AppIndicator support in the message tray" [Normal,New] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=652122
[15:26] <mterry> pitti, how easy is it to push a lower version to natty-proposed than has been pushed to it so far (i.e. for deja-dup, to not push the latest stable release with its broken help files and instead push a targeted patch on top of previous version)?
[15:27] <seb128> mterry, you can't downgrade
[15:27] <seb128> mterry, I guess you want nextstable-1~ppa1
[15:27] <mterry> hmm, I may release an actual new stable then
[15:27] <pitti> mterry: it hasn't been accepted into natty-proposed
[15:27] <seb128> ups, ppa -> sru
[15:27] <pitti> mterry: I didn't accept it because it looked fishy
[15:27] <mterry> pitti, oh right!  brilliant
[15:27] <pitti> mterry: if it's indeed wrong, I can reject it, and you can upload a fixed version
[15:28] <pitti> want me to?
[15:28] <mterry> pitti, yeah, I'm still confused by the help translation regression.  I'm looking into it and have some ideas why, but easier to just do a targeted patch for now
[15:29] <pitti> mterry: rejected
[15:30] <seb128> mterry, in case you didn't read the channel or the discussion a bit earlier the deja-dup slowness issue is a gtk bug
[15:32] <mterry> seb128, yeah I was watching that go by; makes sense
[16:00] <seb128> ok
[16:01] <seb128> so the etherpad has a list of gtk2 and gconf users on the liveCD
[16:02] <seb128> I will add references and file some bugs for things that need porting
[16:02] <chrisccoulson> b'ah, i can't build firefox locally any more
[16:02] <chrisccoulson> the kernel versioning change has broken the nss build
[16:13] <pitti> Laney: do you now if it's possible to add some radio stations to banshee by default?
[16:13] <pitti> similar to /usr/lib/rhythmbox/plugins/iradio/iradio-initial.xspf ?
[16:13] <pitti> or a gconf schema, etc.
[16:13] <pitti> so far I just see them in .config/banshee-1/banshee.db, but I can't pre-create this obviously
[16:15] <pitti> hmm, gnome bug 548197, seems to be missing ATM
[16:15] <ubot2> Gnome bug 548197 in Internet Radio "no radio stations provided by default" [Enhancement,New] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=548197
[16:15] <Laney> there's code to migrate from an xspf playlist
[16:15] <Laney> that could probably be used to provide a default list
[16:16] <pitti> oh, interesting
[16:16] <pitti> I'll check that
[16:16] <pitti> ubuntu-defaults-builder is creating an xspf one anyway
[16:16] <Laney> when initialising the plugin for the first time → populate from some default path
[16:19] <pitti> Laney: thanks!
[16:20] <Laney> no worries
[16:25] <seb128> mterry, hey, how busy are you today?
[16:25] <mterry> seb128, I can take something; just working on non-urgent deja-dup stuff
[16:25] <seb128> mterry, that's non urgent as well but njpatel is just rolling a new bamf tarball with gtk3 support
[16:25] <seb128> mterry, do you want to package it and make it dual build gtk2 and gtk3 libs?
[16:26] <pitti> Laney: ah, bummer, it only checks in ~/.config/banshee/plugins/stations/, not in any /usr path
[16:26] <seb128> mterry, feel free to say no if you don't, I'm just checking because it's getting late european time but that can wait monday
[16:26] <mterry> seb128, oh yeah.  I already have packaging changes for a number of the libraries I ported (for testing)
[16:26] <mterry> just sitting on my machine
[16:26] <seb128> mterry, ok great, it's yours then ;-)
[16:26] <pitti> Laney: but I guess we might patch it to look in /usr/share/banshee/stations/default.xspf?
[16:26]  * pitti follows up in above GNOME bug report
[16:28] <Laney> pitti: yeah, some API for that (importing aribtary xspfs) would be reasonable
[16:28] <Laney> then you could even give a UI for it
[16:28] <Laney> pitti: wouldn't MigrateXspf work?
[16:29] <pitti> Laney: I guess so, but we need to make it look in /usr/share/banshee/ by default; that's what I'm proposing in teh bug report
[16:29] <Laney> ah, extending Migrate() to do that, right
[16:29] <Laney> would be rather simple indeed
[16:30] <Laney> if it read every xspf file in some directory then distributors could customise the lists without having to modify banshee
[16:30] <pitti> followed up
[16:30] <Laney> nice
[16:31] <pitti> if they agree to that, I'll cook up a patch
[16:31] <pitti> but I'll give some days for a reply, in case upstream wants it to be done slightly differently
[16:31] <njpatel> seb128, mterry https://launchpad.net/bamf/0.2/0.2.92
[16:31] <seb128> njpatel, \o/
[16:32] <mterry> njpatel, awesome, after I grab lunch, I'll uplod
[16:32] <mterry> upload even
[16:32] <njpatel> shweet
[17:00] <pitti> oh, llvm has landed
[17:09] <mpt> mvo, hi, if you're still around: Did you see my suggestion on the unattended-upgrades blueprint?
[17:14] <mvo> mpt: yes, i have seen it
[17:15] <mpt> mvo, do you think it's reasonable? :-)
[17:18] <mvo> mpt: well, it makes a valid point, but it would still be nice to know where the new "install in the background" element would fit into the spec even if the spec is not implented yet
[17:19] <seb128> dobey, is evolution-webcal still useful nowadays?
[17:23] <mpt> mvo, ok, I'll sketch some possibilities. But I'll be quite frustrated if one of them gets implemented without any of the specced simplifications being implemented. ;-)
[17:24] <mvo> mpt: fair enough. its not that its not important to us, its really a matter of finding time or someone doing the dbus backend work
[17:24] <mpt> mvo, right. I think you told me that and471 had done the GUI but didn't know the dbus?
[17:25] <mvo> yeah
[17:25] <hex-code> hi all
[17:25] <hex-code> hi mvo
[17:25] <mvo> hey hex-code
[17:25] <hex-code> can you help me with Glib 2.28 upgrade on ubuntu 10.10
[17:26] <hex-code> synaptic doesn't show any new upgrade beyond  Glib 2.26.1, and i need some help with manual installation
[17:26] <hex-code> i have compiled 2.28 manually but dont know how to replace old Glib 2.26.1
[17:26] <seb128> hex-code, try #ubuntu for user questions
[17:27] <hex-code> actually i am doing this for dev packages
[17:31] <pitti> good night everyone, have a nice weekend!
[17:33] <seb128> 'night pitti
[17:57] <dobey> seb128: i think so, but i'm not maintaining it any more
[17:58] <seb128> dobey, what was,is it doing exactly? calling evolution when you click on an url?
[18:00] <dobey> seb128: no, it pops up a dialog to subscribe to a calendar and set the poll rate and color of the calendar in e-d-s, when you click on a webcal:// url. doesn't actually open, or require, the evolution gui itself
[18:00] <seb128> dobey, ok thanks
[18:13] <cyphermox> mterry: how ready is libido3?
[18:13] <cyphermox> I really wish I could open the indicator-datetime-preferences ;)
[18:14] <mterry> cyphermox, oh, the port for indicator-datetime is ready, just unmerged I think
[18:14] <cyphermox> oh cool :)
[18:15] <mterry> cyphermox, oh, hm, so is ido3 (unmerged).  Blame DX  ;)
[18:15] <cyphermox> yeah, I was looking at it ;)
[18:22] <seb128> mterry, you or kenvandine should deal with ido, it has no maintainer in dx since bratsche left
[18:22] <mterry> seb128, ick
[18:22] <seb128> yeah..
[18:23] <seb128> let's get that update out in a distro way and talk about ido maintainship at the rally
[18:23] <mterry> seb128, is there a reason DX hasn't assigned someone else?
[18:23] <mterry> seb128, ok
[18:24] <seb128> mterry, out of "everybody is busy and nobody made a move to claim extra work"?
[18:24]  * mterry reboots
[18:24] <seb128> mterry, no, I just think nobody raised it as an issue
[18:25] <seb128> they might not have realised work was needed
[18:28] <seb128> mterry, wb
[18:28] <mterry> :)
[18:28] <mterry> latest kernel works!
[18:28] <seb128> mterry, not sure if you read my "no, I just think nobody raised it as an issue, they might not have realised work was needed"
[18:29] <mterry> seb128, yeah, just as I shut down, thanks
[18:29] <seb128> mterry, we will sort it at the rally
[18:29] <seb128> mterry, brave man, I still didn't update my kernel nor xorg this week ;-)
[18:29] <seb128> I should probably do that before the rally to make sure I fix issues if there is any before travelling
[18:29] <mterry> seb128, as you know, we must dogfood!  ;)
[18:30] <seb128> I dogfood desktop :p
[18:30] <seb128> no, forget that, it's lame
[18:30] <seb128> mterry, I dogfood partial upgrades because others don't! ;-)
[18:30] <seb128> (that's better)
[18:30] <mterry> heh
[18:35] <cyphermox> that's partly why I was asking about daily images yesterday, reinstalling my "travel laptop" to have a clean slate for the rally
[18:36] <seb128> reinstalling?! ;-)
[18:36] <seb128> chrisccoulson, can firefox stop using gconf?
[18:37] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - oh, i thought it had stopped using it
[18:37] <seb128> chrisccoulson, the firefox-gnome-support binary depends on libgconf2-4 on the current oneiric iso
[18:37] <chrisccoulson> oh, actually, gconf support is compiled in when turning on the gnome support
[18:38] <chrisccoulson> it actually uses gsettings when available
[18:38] <chrisccoulson> but i will need to distro patch the gconf bits out then
[18:38] <seb128> can we drop the depends on libgconf2-4? ;-)
[18:38] <seb128> like put the file in the shlibs exclude list or something
[18:38] <seb128> or would that break things?
[18:39] <seb128> chrisccoulson, well don't bother yet, we still have some 65 sources to clean
[18:39] <seb128> but you're on the list!
[18:39] <chrisccoulson> yeah, libmozgnome.so wouldn't load
[18:39] <chrisccoulson> and you'd lose gio, gsettings and libnotify then ;)
[18:39] <seb128> when we get down to a few we will need to clean
[18:39] <seb128> that might be next cycle though
[18:39] <seb128> so don't bother for now
[18:45] <mterry> Guh, I'm being a bonehead, but I can't see how.  The following compile line for a test app is giving me undefined symbol errors for all the gtk calls: gcc `pkg-config --libs --cflags gtk+-2.0` test.c -o ./test
[18:45] <mterry> Any ideas?
[18:45] <mterry> (linker errors, not compile ones)
[18:46] <fta> pitti, http://people.ubuntu.com/~fta/apport-bug-duplicated-entries.png  ???
[18:47] <seb128> mterry, what does "pkg-config --libs --cflags gtk+-2.0" give you?
[18:47] <chrisccoulson> mterry, try putting the "-o ./test" before the linker flags
[18:48] <seb128> oh
[18:48] <mterry> -pthread -I/usr/include/atk-1.0 -I/usr/include/cairo -I/usr/include/gdk-pixbuf-2.0 -I/usr/include/pango-1.0 -I/usr/include/gio-unix-2.0/ -I/usr/include/glib-2.0 -I/usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/glib-2.0/include -I/usr/include/pixman-1 -I/usr/include/freetype2 -I/usr/include/libpng12 -I/usr/include/libdrm -I/usr/include/gtk-2.0 -I/usr/lib/gtk-2.0/include  -pthread -lgtk-x11-2.0 -lgdk-x11-2.0 -latk-1.0 -lgio-2.0 -lpangoft2-1.0 -lpangocairo-1.0 -lgdk_pix
[18:48] <mterry> buf-2.0 -lm -lcairo -lpango-1.0 -lfreetype -lfontconfig -lgobject-2.0 -lgmodule-2.0 -lgthread-2.0 -lrt -lglib-2.0
[18:48] <mterry> chrisccoulson, no help
[18:48] <mterry> chrisccoulson, oh!
[18:48] <seb128> mterry, try with gcc-4.5?
[18:48] <mterry> chrisccoulson, but if I put the test.c in front, it does help
[18:48] <seb128> mterry, it seems like a --as-needed thing
[18:48] <seb128> right
[18:49] <mterry> I didn't know order of source files mattered like that
[18:49] <mterry> seb128, chrisccoulson: thanks!
[18:49] <seb128> it does since --as-needed
[18:49] <seb128> that's annoying
[18:49] <mterry> I see...
[18:57] <mterry> Does Ubuntu have test armel machines to log into?  I want to test a build for reals...