[07:34] <nigelb> Morning
[07:49] <dholbach> good morning
[07:51] <nigelb> hello dh	
[07:52] <nigelb> erm
[07:52] <nigelb> hello dholbach
[07:53] <dholbach> hi nigelb
[08:28] <kim0> Morning fellas
[08:29] <jussi> kim0: you arent saying morning to the ladies in the channel?
[08:31] <kim0> morning ladies :)
[08:31] <kim0> wasn't really sure fellas is a men only thing
[08:32] <kim0> jussi: how's it going
[08:39] <kim0> silence is king today
[08:44]  * kim0 needs to grab some coffee
[08:46] <nigelb> morning kim0
[08:46] <nigelb> ahoy jussi
[08:49] <jussi> Heya kim0 :)
[08:49] <jussi> and nigelb
[08:49] <jussi> Had to run from desk for a few
[09:14] <kim0> nigelb: jussi yow
[09:14] <kim0> such a great morning over here
[09:29] <nigelb> ok, bitlbee just rocks, just saying :-)
[09:29] <nigelb> I'm logged into my IM accounts on IRC. What could rock more than that ;)
[09:33] <kim0> hehe
[09:33] <kim0> I'm on irssi .. what's the point of replacing pidgin with an irc client
[09:36] <nigelb> no
[09:36] <nigelb> I'm on irssi
[09:37] <nigelb> kim0: I can talk to all my IM contacts on irssi now ;)
[09:37] <kim0> bitlbee is like some account proxy ?
[09:40] <jussi> kim0: it basically starts an ircd of its own, and gateways that to your IM provides
[09:40] <jussi> providers
[09:40] <nigelb> kim0: yeah, its a transport of sorts
[09:41] <kim0> a ah .. makes sense
[10:03] <topyli> if pidgin is a good IM client and so-and-so irc client, you can compromise the other way and have so-and-so IM in a good irc client! :)
[10:28] <nigelb> topyli: exactly!
[11:13] <cjohnston> uggh
[11:15] <nigelb> cjohnston: woke up on the wrong side of the bed?
[11:15] <cjohnston> woke up would be a better answer
[11:22] <jussi> awww
[13:54] <mhall119> lol
[13:54] <mhall119> good morning sunshine
[13:54] <Pendulum> morning mhall119
[13:54] <nigelb> morning mhall119, Pendulum
[13:54]  * nigelb did morn<TAB>
[13:57] <mhall119> been there, done that
[15:00] <topyli> i keep trying to tab complete "tickles" and "cuddles" in -offtopic
[15:02] <jcastro> dholbach: LOOK AT THAT AMAZING BURN DOWN
[15:15] <dholbach> :)
[15:19] <mhall119> jcastro: status.ubuntu.com?
[15:19] <jcastro> yeah
[15:21] <mhall119> we need to deploy summit and loco-directory some some of ours get moved to DONE
[15:46] <nigelb> I feel old :| http://imgur.com/gallery/dffpt
[15:48] <popey> funny you should mention that nigelb
[15:48] <popey> http://www.threadless.com/product/2791/Nostalgia/tab,guys/style,shirt
[15:48] <popey> I have that t-shirt
[15:49] <nigelb> popey: oooooh, I should get it too!
[15:49] <popey> :D
[15:50] <nigelb> popey: The other one I'd like to see is "Why doesn't my partition start with A:/"
[15:51] <popey> heh
[16:01] <jono> kim0, all set?
[16:01]  * kim0 grabbing mic
[16:03] <jono> kim0, brb, sound problems
[16:06] <kim0> jono: ready
[16:06] <jono> kim0, :-)
[16:06] <kim0> :)
[16:10] <dholbach> hey jono
[16:11] <jono> hey dholbach
[16:16] <jcastro> heya AlanBell
[16:16] <jcastro> so wiki.u.c seems way less sucky now
[16:18] <nigelb> once you eventually login :P
[16:18] <nigelb> </snary comments>
[16:18] <nigelb> *snarky
[16:20]  * popey clicks "log me in" and starts the timer
[16:20] <popey> Time passes...
[16:20] <popey> "Waiting for login.ubuntu.com..."
[16:22] <popey> Time passes...
[16:27] <czajkowski> same comments on most channels all weekend and today
[16:28] <popey> STOP THE CLOCK!
[16:29] <nigelb> Got logged in?
[16:29] <popey> I assume this has been reported to IS?
[16:29] <popey> no, silly!
[16:29] <nigelb> Yes
[16:29] <popey> "Proxy Error
[16:29] <popey> "
[16:29] <nigelb> drat
[16:29] <nigelb> I pinged IS almost a few hours after the new wiki was up.
[16:29] <nigelb> It improved then, but still not normal.
[16:31] <Pendulum> I wonder if this relates to charlie-tca having trouble logging in. He thought it was because his theme was not set to the light theme
[16:33] <nigelb> Possibly.
[16:36] <AlanBell> popey: bradm is apparently looking into it
[16:56] <czajkowski> nobody in -ie can log in
[16:58] <mhall119> popey, nigelb: thanks for the nostalgia
[16:58] <jono> dholbach, can we start our call earlier today, in the next 10 mins or so?
[16:58] <dholbach> jono, sure, ~10 mins sounds good - still finishing something real quick :)
[16:58] <jono> thanks dholbach
[17:01] <nigelb> mhall119: heh, happy to be of service ;-)
[17:03] <daker> Pendulum, me too
[17:04] <daker> now having : Internal Server Error
[17:15] <dholbach> jono, I'm ready - just call whenever
[17:17] <jono> dholbach, sorry otp, wont be long
[17:17] <dholbach> sure
[17:44] <dholbach> have a great rest of your day - see you all tomorrow
[17:59] <paultag> Dang. I'm bummed. FB called and said they'd not be making an offer.
[18:08] <paultag> who's hiring? :)
[18:08]  * nigelb hugs paultag 
[18:10] <pleia2> paultag: wikimedia
[18:11] <pleia2> http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Job_openings
[18:11] <pleia2> I was just talking with one of their community people on saturday, she was trying to get me to apply
[18:11]  * paultag hugs nigelb 
[18:11] <paultag> pleia2: humm
[18:12] <paultag> pleia2: I think I might try to stick around BOS now
[18:12]  * pleia2 nods
[18:12] <popey> right, who do I file this against? http://twitpic.com/5edipf
[18:13] <popey> favicon for planet.ubuntu.com and the one for loco.ubuntu.com are not the same shade of orange
[18:13] <nigelb> popey: cjohnston!
[18:13]  * popey pokes cjohnston with a colo{u}r picker
[18:16] <pleia2> I usually try very hard to defend canonical IS, but the wiki has unusable for days and ubuntu-news.org is broken, news team is hard enough without all our tools being broken
[18:16]  * pleia2 is not having a good day so far :\
[18:17]  * nigelb hugs pleia2 
[18:17]  * pleia2 hugs
[18:34] <popey> whats up with ubuntu-news pleia2 ?
[18:34] <popey> oh, i see
[18:34] <pleia2> yeah
[18:35] <pleia2> since yesterday it's been giving either a database error or a "no content from server" error
[18:35] <popey> er
[18:35] <pleia2> sometimes it loads, but I haven't seen it load in a while
[18:35] <popey> it just loaded for me
[18:35] <popey> with a significant delay
[18:36] <pleia2> ah, finally loaded for me this time too
[18:36] <pleia2> first time today!
[18:37] <popey> admin seems spritely now
[18:37] <popey> ish
[18:39] <paultag> jcastro: if I apply to canonical, will it be a waste of my time, realistically?
[18:39] <jcastro> paultag: we don't take tiling window manager guys.
[18:39] <jcastro> j/k
[18:39] <paultag> hahaha
[18:40] <jcastro> no clue, I am not a hiring person
[18:40] <Pici> heh
[18:40] <jcastro> and I have no way to judge your technical skills
[18:40] <jcastro> but, what's to lose?
[18:40] <paultag> jcastro: yeah I know, but you've got to have a feel for the process
[18:40] <paultag> jcastro: more interviews that drain the life out of me
[18:40] <jcastro> not really, other than it's important to reach out to the hiring manager along with the form
[18:40] <jcastro> if you fill out the form on the website it just goes into a pile
[18:41] <jcastro> you need to fill that out + talk to the team lead
[18:41] <paultag> jcastro: cheers
[18:44] <jcastro> but other than that, all I have is "good luck"
[18:44] <paultag> jcastro: I don't even know that I'll apply just yet :P
[18:45] <jcastro> I know in the past we used to mess up applicants, but the past cycle or  so they have someone at HR that has all that stuff sorted now
[18:45] <paultag> jcastro: yeah, HR really lamed out. Took them over 7 months to get back to me last time I applied.
[18:45] <jcastro> when was that?
[18:45] <nigelb> paultag: Also, adding to jcastro's isntructions, Please don't stab yourself or break your keyboard head-desking when you try to apply via Taleo. It sucks. Everyone knows.
[18:46] <paultag> jcastro: I can't even remember it's been so long. I sent Jane an email about it, and she seemed to have taken my whining to heart
[18:46] <paultag> which is nice
[18:49] <mhall119> paultag: I told you, you're just too awesome for Facebook
[18:50] <paultag> mhall119: dude, I dunno. That sucks. I wish they said it was some BS issue with this or that. It sucks to hear I was not up to their standards.
[18:51] <mhall119> paultag: especially given the number of problems I see on Facebook as a user, I wonder what their standards actually are
[18:52] <paultag> heh
[18:52] <jcastro> hggdh: any thoughts on my debian ~ubuntu-bugcontrol proposal?
[18:52] <nigelb> paultag: I think its becuase you didn't facebook from the interview ;)
[18:52] <mhall119> but he did!
[18:52] <mhall119> at least from the waiting room
[18:52] <nigelb> Did you check your self into Facebook HQ?
[18:52] <nigelb> "Not addicted yet, lets try the next guy"
[18:53] <hggdh> jcastro: I am absolutely not against (note how carefully written this is!)
[18:53] <jcastro> heh
[18:53] <mhall119> paultag: if you want to move to Tampa, I can hook you up with a former employer looking for python guys
[18:53] <hggdh> jcastro: I think Debian is a special case
[18:53] <paultag> mhall119: word,  thanks
[18:54] <nigelb> hggdh: We need new rules :-)
[18:54] <nigelb> hggdh: To fit the special case that is Debian Developers.
[18:54] <hggdh> jcastro: since we depend on Debian, I see no reason DDs cannot be given -control access, as long as they accept to use it under our rules (as we accept filing bugs under Debian rules)
[18:54] <mhall119> paultag: unfortunately it's a hospital, and they refuse to allow remote work due to potential HIPPA violations
[18:55] <nigelb> I never thought I'd hear HIPPA ever in my life again.
[18:55] <hggdh> nigelb: the risk is loss of control
[18:55] <paultag> mhall119: aye. I did have background training in medical informatics at the Cleveland Clinic
[18:55] <paultag> mhall119: it's such teidium
[18:55] <nigelb> hggdh: But the benefit is DD's encouraged to work downstream.
[18:55] <mhall119> yes
[18:55] <paultag> HL7 can suck it
[18:55] <mhall119> oh God yes
[18:55] <nigelb> mhall119: But there is no problem outsourcing work to Indi/Philipines to transcribe the reports ;)
[18:56] <mhall119> nigelb: I don't think they did that
[18:56]  * nigelb used to be a transcriptionst a few years back
[18:56] <mhall119> but they did bring in a lot of guys from India on visas to work there
[18:56] <hggdh> nigelb: I understand, and agree they should be given access. But I do not want to see, on our bugs, the same lack of courtesy that has plaged Debian for quite a long time
[18:57] <nigelb> hggdh: That's a good point.
[18:57] <hggdh> jcastro: will you be at Dublin next week?
[18:57] <nigelb> jcastro: ^^
[18:57] <paultag> hggdh: you can still comment on the bugs. Why not just revoke if they start marking stuff OPINION on things that are not
[18:57] <paultag> hggdh: just do it per-user or something. I dunno.
[18:57] <nigelb> paultag: It is per user now. jcastro sugggested to improve that.
[18:57] <paultag> Oh. Humm.
[18:57] <jcastro> hggdh: I will, if you want to discuss it then that would be swell
[18:58] <paultag> Yeah, I'm not sure that's a good idea
[18:58] <mhall119> improving is always a good idea, as long as it's actually improving
[18:58] <paultag> unless LP can get a "ban" type feature in there (all group except N)
[18:58] <hggdh> jcastro: yes, certainly I would like to expand it.
[18:58]  * jcastro nods
[18:58] <mhall119> paultag: file a bug against LP to add that
[18:58] <mhall119> so we can all mark it as OPINION
[18:58] <paultag> mhall119: I'm not convinced it's a good idea
[18:58] <paultag> hehehe
[18:59] <jcastro> well, I for one only really see DDs who care about it to apply to the debian team on LP anyway
[18:59] <paultag> that is true
[18:59] <jcastro> allowing that team doesn't automatically mean every DD has bugcontrol
[18:59] <jcastro> it would be people who apply there
[18:59] <paultag> and the ubuntu-hating ones would stay out of LP, I guess
[18:59] <jcastro> and then we just have people who are Ubuntu/DD folk curate that team
[18:59] <jcastro> right
[18:59] <jcastro> if they hate ubuntu they're not going through LP anyway
[18:59] <hggdh> folks, how would we add somebody as a DD -- they would be in a group, and the group authorised to -control
[18:59] <nigelb> jcastro: ah, so folks who ask you for permission gets added to the team and they get bug control?
[18:59] <jcastro> hggdh: right
[18:59] <hggdh> so we would pretty much just be passign the buck a bit down
[19:00] <jcastro> we tell people, if you're a DD and care about bugs, apply for this team
[19:00] <nigelb> jcastro: Could you clarify on the m/l who are the people of this team then?
[19:00] <hggdh> benefit is we know how is a DD; direct ingress to -control loses this bit
[19:00] <jcastro> "I am a DD/DM and I would like to curate my bugs in LP" "Ok dude, here read this, and that, do you agree?" "Yes" "Done."
[19:00] <jcastro> just like how we do for upstreams
[19:01] <hggdh> s/know how/know who/
[19:01] <nigelb> jcastro: Your initial mail sounded like all DDs would get BC.
[19:01] <nigelb> automatically.
[19:01] <jcastro> maybe I should clarify that
[19:02] <nigelb> Yes!
[19:02] <hggdh> yeah, just in case
[19:02] <hggdh> jcastro: but I think we should allow
[19:02] <hggdh> again, Debian is a special case
[19:02] <nigelb> and a special upstream :)
[19:03] <hggdh> yes
[20:12] <cjohnston> popey: pong
[20:31] <czajkowski> listening to paultag play guitre on skype
[20:31] <czajkowski> is bloody weird
[20:36] <paultag> I was just doodling, I'm not good on Guitar :P
[21:56] <AlanBell> http://twitter.com/#!/undacuvabrutha/status/82913839141748736 something gone wrong?
[21:57] <czajkowski> hmm did somsone not get membership?
[21:57] <maco> DMB meeting just happened where we got stuck on a split vote
[21:57] <maco> the vote is being continued via email
[21:57] <czajkowski> he did this the last time a canonical employee didnt get it
[21:57] <maco> however the split vote was on a canonical employee
[21:57] <czajkowski> again
[21:58] <maco> votes are so often unanimous that when it's +3, +0, -1, we all go "uh...wait...majority of quorum is met, but not majority of board...does that count?" and then debate a while. im going to start a thread as soon as i find the right mailing list, and then make sure it gets documented
[21:59] <czajkowski> maco: we go 4/6 on the LC
[21:59] <czajkowski> so half plus 1
[21:59] <maco> we have 7 people on RMB, quorum is 4
[21:59] <maco> so when it's +4, we all know it passed
[21:59] <czajkowski> aye we do too
[21:59] <maco> but when it's 3/5, its not majority of the board so then we argue
[22:00] <maco> even though its majority of those present
[22:00] <czajkowski> no they you say come back again
[22:00] <czajkowski> as there isn't enough to vote
[22:00] <JanC> well, or discuss on the ML
[22:00] <maco> well there's 5 people, so its quorum, so that IS enough to vote
[22:01] <jcastro> are the notes from stgraber incomplete?
[22:01] <maco> and if there are 4 +1s in that group of 5, then its a clear majority all ways around
[22:01] <czajkowski> indeed
[22:01] <maco> jcastro: hmm?
[22:01] <jcastro> his mail doesn't mention other votes
[22:01] <maco> jcastro: are you referring to his mail about 2 weeks ago?
[22:01] <czajkowski> just I find it a bit odd this only comes up when it's a canonical employee is at question
[22:01] <jcastro> about three hours ago
[22:01] <maco> jcastro: today's meeting ended 20 minutes ago
[22:02] <maco> jcastro: so yeah, you're looking at some very late notes for 2 weeks ago
[22:05] <JanC> czajkowski: or maybe a friend/colleague (people tend to get less-objective in such a case)
[22:08] <JanC> I mean, it's often difficult to see things objectively when a friend or colleague is involved--maybe somebody (who knows him) talking to Robbie about it might help
[22:14] <JanC> anyway, the vote will be continued on the ML, so it's just postponed?
[22:16] <akgraner> I think from the meetings I've seen @canonical people tend to get treated more hostile when they apply
[22:17] <maco> JanC: yeah
[22:17] <akgraner> and tend to get nit-picky questions that regular community people wouldn't get asked
[22:18] <AlanBell> regular community people get nit-picky questions too
[22:18] <akgraner> or asked to "prove" that they will do more that their 60 + hours at times they spend working on Ubuntu
[22:18] <akgraner> but that's just my 2 cents
[22:19] <AlanBell> I think some canonical candidates need more assistance in properly documenting their contributions
[22:19] <AlanBell> and need to show that someone who isn't at canonical has actually heard of them!
[22:20] <maco> IME, the question the RMB asks that is most likely to hurt a canonical employee's application is "so...been to any LoCo events?"
[22:20] <JanC> :P
[22:20] <akgraner> maco if an @canonical person travels every other week the chances of that being a no a high
[22:21] <JanC> having been to loco events is not always possible/easy
[22:21] <akgraner> as who wants to go to a loco event if they have a chance to be home with their family fro a weekend
[22:21] <JanC> akgraner: travelling might make it easier too  ;)
[22:21] <maco> canonical's not the only company that has employees who have to travel
[22:21] <JanC> e.g. somebody who's living in a remote area
[22:21] <akgraner> to go a loco event ....don't see how so  - for the people I know who travel
[22:22] <JanC> but even collaboration on the local loco list/irc might be useful
[22:22] <akgraner> how an you say that someone who spends 60+ hours working to make Ubuntu better doesn't contribute..and who cares if they get paid for it or not...
[22:23] <AlanBell> I don't think anyone is saying that
[22:23] <akgraner> ok so you spend that much time on something are you going to want to spend 10 to 20 more hours on it as well
[22:23] <maco> if you're working on the platform team its very likely that non-canonifolk know you too, at least if you've been around a while (like a cycle or so)
[22:24] <akgraner> i think the community is asking to burn out some canonical people by demanding they give even more time
[22:24] <JanC> it's also not always clear who works on Ubuntu and who works on other Canonical projects
[22:24] <jcastro> I want to hear no complaining about how hard membership is. My membership review was with mdz, mako, cjwatson, pitti, and like 2 other people
[22:24] <jcastro> :p
[22:24] <akgraner> jcastro, :-P
[22:24] <JanC> hehe
[22:25] <akgraner> you always hold the trump card don't you
[22:25] <pleia2> yeah, sabdfl asked me questions and I was the most scared I'd ever been in my life :)
[22:25] <JanC> and this person wasn't turned down yet anyway
[22:25] <jcastro> yes, sabdfl used to grill people on membership too
[22:25] <jcastro> man, that was brutal
[22:25] <JanC> he was told the vote would continue on the ML
[22:25] <jcastro> when you walked to LoCo meetings uphills, BOTH WAYS!
[22:25] <pleia2> hehe
[22:25] <akgraner> in the snow for 5 miles barefoot
[22:25] <akgraner> yeah yeah
[22:26] <akgraner> :-)
[22:26] <paultag> you hear that, everyone? jcastro goes both ways!
[22:26] <paultag> typical Michigan-ite
[22:26] <maco> jcastro: haha i had the same CC set when i went up for UM
[22:26] <maco> i do think the bar has been getting higher :-/
[22:26] <paultag> maco: you think?
[22:26] <jcastro> IMO 90% of the problems are applications suck
[22:27] <JanC> if I'm right this candidate he got a -1 vote, one +0, and three +1, with 2 other people still having to vote
[22:27] <jcastro> but example applications suck too
[22:27] <jcastro> so if you say "oh here, here's a good application, check it out."
[22:27] <maco> when i applied for UM, i had helped staff a booth at an event and was in the middle of organising an installfest at my school
[22:27] <jcastro> then you see someone's application and you're like "wow, I'll never be good enough to do that."
[22:27] <maco> jcastro: yeah
[22:28] <maco> people see these stellar applications then wait til they're wayyy over the line before applying
[22:28] <jcastro> right
[22:28] <pleia2> we had a canonical employee at our last meeting who was under NDA for pretty much all his canonical work, we couldn't approve him
[22:28] <paultag> pleia2: canonical work != ubuntu work
[22:28] <pleia2> but he was eager to do more open community stuff, so I'm hopeful that we'll see him back
[22:28] <jcastro> like when you see what the LoCo in Vancouver is doing and you're like "wow, we'll be lucky to get reapproved! Let alone do all that!"
[22:28] <maco> paultag: oem team
[22:28] <pleia2> paultag: some of it is, but we couldn't make a determination
[22:28] <paultag> jcastro: truth
[22:28] <paultag> pleia2: aye
[22:28] <paultag> maco: ah, humm.
[22:29] <maco> he said once the hardware shipped he'd be able to say "i worked on THAT *point*"
[22:29] <jcastro> yeah
[22:29] <jcastro> but that's sort of an easy thing to fix, you could always tell one of us to explain that to OEM people
[22:30] <pleia2> I thought you knew that OEM people were notoriously community clueless :)
[22:30] <JanC> taht they should apply after hardware is shipped?  ☺
[22:30] <pleia2> one of my friends from the pennsylvania loco just joined OEM though, so I went out with drinks with some of them at UDS
[22:30] <JanC> and after they bribed the RMB with said hardware?  :P
[22:32] <akgraner> SO we educated OEM people but not discriminate against them b/c they are bound by an NDA agreement
[22:32] <pleia2> akgraner: it's not discrimination, if they can't tell us what they're working on we can't make an assessment
[22:33] <pleia2> we can't just approve people as ubuntu members just because they get a canonical paycheck
[22:33] <maco> i'm a person who does stuff!
[22:33] <maco> pleia2: though we do have a tendency to be accused of it
[22:33] <pleia2> maco: yep :(
[22:34] <akgraner> they can tell in a way that doesn't break agreement or you have something worked out with other someone who knows what they are working on who can say yes or no to their contributions without harming or leaking information
[22:34] <pleia2> right, so they need to write a better application, it's not our fault
[22:34] <akgraner> there are ways around that if we find a way to work with the OEM side of things
[22:34] <pleia2> see, we get accused of rubberstamping canonical employees AND for being hard on them, we can't win
[22:35] <akgraner> I didn't say it was your fault - I think its just broken
[22:35]  * pleia2 sighs
[22:35] <maco> pleia2: i said "#ubuntu membership for canonifolk goes like this:  "wahh you hate canonical employees" and "wahh you rubberstamp canonical employee" pick 1!" on twitter and rockstar replied that he just waited a while before applying so he'd have the merit
[22:36]  * pleia2 nods
[22:36] <maco> a lot of the time is just waiting a little longer for more people to get to know ya
[22:36] <pleia2> yeah
[22:36] <pleia2> and it's not like we're mean to them when they don't get membership, we tell them what we're looking for
[22:37] <pleia2> I think every time we've had one come back we approved them that next time
[22:37] <maco> like when kate was told she hadn't been around long enough
[22:38] <maco> she came back 3 months later and by then everyone knew her from her release team work
[22:38] <pleia2> yeah, I thanked her at UDS for being patient with the process :) all was good
[22:38] <pleia2> that's the one robbie yelled at us about
[22:38] <akgraner> I mean if a canonical employee who is already a member and is aware of what a person working under NDA is doing and can say - this person is doing a lot for the community right now and we/I concur on their contribution and when it is possible their contributions will become public the board will become informed
[22:39] <maco> akgraner: a testimonial? yes, we totally take testimonials into account
[22:40] <akgraner> I was just giving my 2 cents....I'm not mad at anyone just discussing what I've seen happen....that's all
[22:40]  * maco still thinks the "how to apply" pages should say testimonials are mandatory since approving without them is a pita
[22:40] <maco> (testimonials in whatever language you want, though we might have trouble with an Elvish translator)
[22:41]  * maco fully expects a testimonial in Qenyan next round
[22:41] <pleia2> akgraner: you called us hostile and nit-picky :\
[22:41] <JanC> but testimonials can't be the only thing either
[22:41] <paultag> that's my job >:(
[22:42] <pleia2> hehe
[22:42] <pleia2> some better example testimonials would be good
[22:43] <pleia2> err, applications
[22:43] <maco> JanC: if you have no testimonials at all, i think you're more likely to get a no than a yes
[22:43] <maco> we can push and ask what you've done, but...
[22:43] <JanC> unless you can show a lot of actual work, of course
[22:43] <maco> if there's nobody else to say "yeah ive seen them doing that great stuff"...
[22:44] <JanC> or if people know your work, because it's obvious
[22:44] <maco> right so, your LP page will be poked at more thoroughly if you lack testimonials, for example
[22:44] <JanC> but testimonials never hurt  ;)
[22:45] <maco> i remember lfaraone asking me to photo him at an event as proof to show he staffed a table, to show the RMB
[22:45] <JanC> ☺
[22:45] <pleia2> :)
[22:45] <maco> (obviously before i was on it! :P)
[22:45] <JanC> maco: about languages, in practice, the ubuntu-nl locoteam offers "translation services" for candidate members who need help with English
[22:46] <pleia2> nice!
[22:46] <JanC> I guess most locoteams can help with that
[22:46] <maco> in the americas, mostly its just english and spanish we have to worry about. a little portuges
[22:46] <pleia2> the south american teams have been good about supporting each other, we've had a couple applicants who brought translators to meetings
[22:46] <maco> and it also turned out that while not all of us can ask questions in spanish, we can all read the answers reasonably
[22:46] <paultag> and all that translation work is great for their LoCo
[22:47] <maco> (though i should get more practice at it....hey south americans! more applications please!)
[22:47] <paultag> maco: I had to do that with German once :)
[22:47] <AlanChicken> It is not a job interview! They are not interested in your background, technical or otherwise. You are not being interviewed to decide whether you are *allowed* to join the community, you are being interviewed to see if you have *already* joined the community.
[22:47] <paultag> it was great
[22:48] <pleia2> AlanChicken: that's a good way to put it
[22:48] <pleia2> (hehe, chicken)
[22:48] <AlanChicken> that was quoting me on akgraner's blog
[22:48] <pleia2> ah, good :)
[22:48] <maco> akgraner: btw, i think the oem person was teh same one who told us he decided to apply for membership because he thought it was a good starting point to get involved, and we told him that was backwards: get involved, THEN apply
[22:49] <AlanBell> http://akgraner.com/?p=184
[22:50] <pleia2> maco: yeah
[22:52] <JanC> AlanBell: in 2009, no less!  you borrowed GvR's time machine?  :P
[22:53] <jcastro> <--- EOD
[22:53] <AlanBell> I borrowed the doctor's. Who is GvR?
[22:56] <maco> guido van rossum?
[22:57] <AlanBell> http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/G/Guido.html so it would seem
[23:00] <Pendulum> maco: it was. he kept talking about wanting membership so he could be part of the community