/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/06/20/#xubuntu-devel.txt

charlie-tcahttps://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2011-June/000859.html00:00
charlie-tcaTOPIC - Any Other Business00:00
charlie-tcaAnything else to be discussed today?00:00
charlie-tcaI will get this written up and out via email. The wiki will not be updated until they let me login again00:01
charlie-tcaThanks, everyone, for your participation!00:01
GridCube:D00:01
charlie-tcaIt is great to have people getting involved in this great project.00:01
charlie-tcaand now, 00:02
charlie-tcaEnjoy your day today! 00:02
GridCube:) lately lots of new installers have ended up on the channel00:02
charlie-tcaENDMEETING00:02
GridCube:D00:02
charlie-tcayes, they have. It is a good thing to see many new people coming to Xubuntu.00:02
micahgmr_pouit: I'll try to get libnotify1 off the CD by alpha200:02
charlie-tcaOh, and for the people that don' t already know, to subscribe to the xubuntu-devel mailing list, go to00:03
charlie-tcahttps://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/xubuntu-devel00:03
charlie-tcaand sign up00:03
charlie-tcaThat's our official ML to discuss what we do with Xubuntu00:04
mr_pouitmicahg: feel free to file removal requests for plugins that are not really maintained upstream, and not in debian00:04
micahgmr_pouit: only 4 rdepends left after your round of syncs00:04
micahgmr_pouit: k, already filed for thunar-thumbnailers00:04
micahgmr_pouit: probably won't get to much xubuntu stuff until wed, I have a round of Mozilla updates00:05
GridCubeoh, ochosi, this is just me being silly, but what if xubuntu came whit Screenlets preinstalled whit some weather or stuff like that preconfigured by locale?00:05
GridCubejust saying00:05
GridCubegotta go00:05
micahgcharlie-tca: ah, forgot to mention that thunderbird 3.1.11 is coming this week00:05
GridCube:D00:05
mr_pouitheh, firefox 5.000:05
mr_pouitanyway, it's 1 am here, so good night ;>00:05
micahgmr_pouit: yeah, plus the firefox/xulrunner updates for lucid/maverick and thunderbird for all stable releases00:06
xrdodrxFF 5.0 is running with no problems here00:06
xrdodrxI had to set extensions.checkCompatibility.5.0 to false to get some of my addons to work, but that's not an ubuntu bug00:07
micahgxrdodrx: as long as they're not from the archive (and none should be in natty), yes00:08
charlie-tcaThanks, mr_pouit 00:08
charlie-tcamicahg: let us know when it hits, we will get testers 00:08
micahgcharlie-tca: it's in the mozilla-security PPA00:09
micahg*ubuntu-mozilla-security00:09
charlie-tcaokay. We will try to grab it00:09
micahgthe minor  bumps I usually don't do too much fanfare about, but testers always welcome00:10
charlie-tcaIf we got people willing, we can use them.00:10
charlie-tcaYou want me to include thunderbird in today's minutes?00:11
micahgcharlie-tca: nah, I'd rather have the focus on Firefox 5, you can add a note that planned release is June 2100:14
charlie-tcaokay, I will do that00:14
micahgI'll give more notice for the Lucid/Maverick transitions, this was a mess since this was the first time with the new schedule and upstream is still tweaking processes00:15
ochosicharlie-tca: do you have time to talk to me about a few things in greybird?00:19
charlie-tcasure00:20
charlie-tcaochosi: yu00:20
charlie-tcawell, that is a yes, actually00:20
ochosik :)00:21
ochosii changed the highlight color again now00:21
ochosiit's a bit more like it was00:21
ochosibut the blue bg is brighter than before00:21
ochosiwith white font on it00:21
ochosii think it's more readable than before00:22
ochosiin treeviews and lists00:22
charlie-tcaThat is a hard thing to make work00:22
ochosi(even though i liked the last thing we had)00:22
ochosithe progressbars should be fine now00:22
charlie-tcaIt takes so little to make it good or bad. 00:22
ochosii made a new scrollbar-style that i really really like00:22
charlie-tcaokay, I will pull it and take a look. 00:23
ochosii'm not sure you will, but please give it a few days or ideally a week of testing00:23
ochosii mean i'm not sure you will like it00:23
charlie-tcaI can do that. 00:23
ochosiknome didn't like it at first sight/try, but i think he at least changed his mind a bit00:23
charlie-tcaI have three new trackballs/mice on the way, that I will also be testing for my own use.00:23
ochosikewl00:23
charlie-tcaI got a fortune tied up in mice and keyboards here, trying to find what works the best for me00:24
ochosiright, that sounds like a good time for testing scrollbars :)00:25
ochosicurrently the checkboxes and radioboxes don't really have a final look00:26
ochosihaven't gotten around to those yet00:27
ochosicharlie-tca: so that's that. ping me when you have an opinion00:27
ochosiwe can also talk earlier then in a week ;)00:27
ochosi(but i don't want to throw the new design away earler than that)00:28
charlie-tcano problem. I will try it for a week, unless it really kills me00:28
ochosi:)00:28
charlie-tcaI downloaded it, just now00:28
ochosik00:28
charlie-tcapanels are darker?00:31
charlie-tcaUnless I did something wrong, I really like the scrollbar00:32
ochosithe panel didn't change since we last discussed it00:32
charlie-tcabut it still has arrows00:32
ochosioh00:32
ochosiit shouldn't00:33
ochosithen something went wrong i guess?00:33
ochosiscreenshot?00:33
charlie-tcahm, what did I get00:33
charlie-tcahttp://imagebin.org/15909000:35
charlie-tcaDid I grab the wrong file again? I took the .zip under downloads00:35
charlie-tcahm, took it a minute to change, for some reason. arrows are gone00:36
ochosithat is something very odd there00:36
ochosimaybe you have to restart ff00:36
charlie-tcaI can't scroll firefox horizontally now00:37
ochosisome apps need a restart after a theme-change00:37
charlie-tcaIt changed in claws-mail and terminal and liferea too 00:37
charlie-tcarestarting firefox00:38
ochosiit should look different than in your screenshot00:38
charlie-tcaIt lost the arrows00:38
ochosiand definitely without arrows (as you suggested)00:38
ochosii have to say that i like it without arrows now00:38
ochosiwasn't sure about it before00:39
ochosibut testing it a few days kinda convinced me00:39
charlie-tcaI like it without the arrows00:41
charlie-tcaIt is different then the screenshot, but I like it00:41
ochosiok nice00:42
charlie-tcaIt is easier for me to use, at least00:42
ochosithat sounds promising i have to say00:42
ochosibecause that was/is a big concern for me00:42
ochosii really don't want to decrease usability00:42
charlie-tcaOkay, I will run this one for a week and see what happens00:43
ochosiok cool00:43
ochosiactually i should go to bed now00:43
ochosiit's already 2am00:43
ochosi(here)00:43
charlie-tcaIt is not glaring white at me, and I can use it00:43
ochosiyeah, the glaring white got reduced/dealt with00:43
charlie-tcagood night. Get some rest. and thank you!00:43
ochosithanks, you too!00:43
micahgcharlie-tca: wiki appears to be fixed02:38
astraljavaOoh, that's great news!02:50
pleia2so there is an outstanding bug for xubuntu.org about translations, I'm not sure how we want to handle it02:59
pleia2I like GridCube's FAQ proposal though, if someone wants to write a FAQ we can certainly put it on the site02:59
charlie-tcapleia2: what bug number?03:04
pleia2#79760003:04
charlie-tcaOh, that one03:08
charlie-tcaI don' t think we can do anything with it until we get the website rebuilt03:08
charlie-tcaIf he wants it now, he will have to do it himself.03:08
pleia2oh sure, I figured the FAQ proposal would have to wait until we have a new site too03:11
charlie-tcaOh, I hadn't thought that far yet, but that does make sense, huh?03:14
charlie-tcahm, they may have fixed something, but apparently logging in after you change from light theme is still not allowed03:30
charlie-tcaI get an error 500 instead of 502 and 503 now03:31
=== Unit193BeGone is now known as Unit193
pleia2the wiki is being horrible in general03:33
pleia2yay, .net and .com work again \o/03:44
charlie-tcaNice work on that!04:24
charlie-tcaI am supposing that the wiki should get fixed tomorrow or tuesday. It is hard to get things done over the weekend04:24
* charlie-tca is still really, really, really upset with the wiki, though04:24
charlie-tcaTired now, going to bed again04:30
pleia2charlie-tca: re: wiki, yeah, one of the sysadmins woke up a few hours ago and has been trying some things, I'm very much hoping for a fix soon too04:47
astraljavaAww crap, the meeting was yesterday now?! Damnit, I need to pay more attention.04:49
charlie-tcaand a very good meeting it was, too :)04:51
charlie-tcaThanks, pleia2 04:51
astraljavacharlie-tca: That's good. Sorry for bailing out.04:55
charlie-tcano problem; we all miss one now and again04:59
* pleia2 had all her computers unplugged and all over her living room during it05:01
pleia2today was spring cleaning day :)05:01
astraljavaHaha. :)05:01
astraljavaBtw. I figured out the reason for my network outages/problems.05:01
astraljavaI will be moving soon, so I synced a whole lot of Spotify playlists for offline use, in case of not being networked for a while in the new town.05:02
astraljavaThe university network has daily quotas.05:02
astraljavaIt cuts off at 3GB. :D05:02
pleia2oops :)05:02
astraljavaAfter that it's closer to 56k modem speeds. :D05:03
astraljavaAnd since I use heavily different kinds of network-related apps, I was maxed-out all the time. :)05:03
pleia2well, I'm glad the solution was that easy05:04
astraljavaYeah. I was just worried, as the day I started syncing, they had made upgrades to the core network. For a while was convinced they had f***ed up something.05:05
Unit193Is this one fine to do the FF5 testing? http://ppa.launchpad.net/mozillateam/firefox-next/ubuntu natty main (I would guess not...)06:07
micahgUnit193: not official testing, unofficially, yes06:07
micahgUnit193: the idea is to test the binaries we'll release on tuesday of which the ones in that PPA are not06:08
xrdodrxmicahg, Seems really solid to me, believe me, I've tried to make it crash :P06:08
Unit193micahg: Thanks. I guess I can downgrade...06:09
micahgxrdodrx: good to hear, I believe that to be the case as well, but other use cases are always welcome06:09
micahgUnit193: downgrade?06:09
Unit193s/downgrade/switch ppas/06:10
micahgUnit193: ok, be forewarned that using the ubuntu mozilla security PPA will fail on anything language pack related06:10
micahgunless you've manually installed the language pack06:11
Unit193micahg: Yep, I'm goind with proposed06:11
micahgUnit193: k, as long as you're comfortable with all the other untested updates :)06:11
Unit193I, er, already enabled it... (Just randomly noticed that I was running FF%)06:13
micahgheh, so -proposed is higher than firefox-next ATM actually :)06:13
Unit193Almost offtopic, when they were talking about a FAQ, this is the one I thought of (Not what you're looking for) https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Lubuntu/Documentation/FAQ06:20
GridCubeUnit193, thats pretty much what i meant :D but more xubuntu related and whit simplier/silly tasks you and me might do instinctively but someone comming from other OS might find rather new, like installing restricted extras06:28
Unit193GridCube: That's the Lubuntu IRC FAQs, close, but not quite what you're looking todo. Make sure to link to the other parts of the Ubuntu wiki?06:30
GridCubewhat?06:32
mr_pouitbah, brainstorm.ubuntu.com sucks11:59
mr_pouitI keep reporting xubuntu related ideas as implemented, and a few months later, they are still marked as new11:59
plantoschkahi :)13:02
plantoschkaok greybird-git is in my vm running oneiric13:23
plantoschkalike the darker panel13:25
ochosiplantoschka: feel free to ping me for greybird-feedback (that's what i meant with directing feedback directly to me yesterday)13:31
plantoschkawill do that :) 13:32
ochosity13:33
plantoschkais the chromium/chrome theme also done by you?13:33
ochosimhm13:33
ochosiat least the one that is included13:33
plantoschkahttps://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/djhdibfheaidnhfnhhnmdngcmjpicpkn13:34
ochosithere is also an addon-theme (obviously you don't need that if you use greybird), that was done by someone else (can't remember who now)13:34
ochosiyeah, that was done by someone else13:34
plantoschkawhen i install chromium it uses the default greybird theme. when i installed chrome it didn't13:35
ochosioh ok13:35
ochosii only tested it with chromium tbh13:35
plantoschkawith the addon from the chromestore it works fine13:36
ochosisry, don't know enough about the differences between chrome and chromium to be of help13:36
plantoschkado you plan to make a chrome extension that brings the default greybird scrollbars into chrome/ium ? :-)13:37
plantoschkabtw i like the new scrollbars without arrows13:37
ochosithx13:37
ochosihm, that#s hard i guess13:37
ochosinot sure i'll have time to spend on that13:37
ochosithere are a lot of things to be done for the next release13:37
ochosi(e.g. a decent gtk3 implementation of the theme)13:37
ochosiif you could do that feel free to step up13:38
ochosii mean the chrome-theme13:38
plantoschkawell chrome is not that important, there are several scrollbars that fit good13:38
plantoschkaand like i said definitely like the darker panel13:39
plantoschkagtk3 theme looks better than the default fallback but i'm sure you make that even better :-D13:40
plantoschka<plantoschka> when i install chromium it uses the default greybird theme. when i installed chrome it didn't13:41
plantoschkaforget this. just installed a fresh chrome in VM and it uses greybird skin13:41
ochosiok :)13:41
ochosigood to know13:41
plantoschkahttp://imagebin.org/15915213:44
plantoschkadefault scrollbar is really ugly ;)13:44
ochosithere's not much  you can do about that unfortunately13:46
ochosiat least not without designing a specific chrome/ium theme13:46
plantoschkayeah i know.. ;) just use firefox :-D13:48
plantoschkaor a scrollbar extensions for chrome ;)13:49
ochosior use midori13:49
plantoschkamidori is great too13:56
plantoschkawill bluebird also get gtk3?13:58
ochosidepends on my free time/energy13:58
plantoschka:)13:58
plantoschkayou also work on gmusicbrowser?14:00
charlie-tcaw00t!14:28
charlie-tcawiki is working again14:29
plantoschkagreat14:29
ochosiplantoschka: yes14:29
davmor2morning charlie-tca 14:29
plantoschka<-subscribed to mailing list :-D14:30
charlie-tcaHello davmor2 14:30
charlie-tcaMeeting minutes are poted to the wiki.14:42
davmor2charlie-tca: wow you can play golf on the wiki?14:44
charlie-tcahttp://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Meetings14:44
* astraljava waves at the channel14:44
astraljavaHow're our images today doing?14:44
charlie-tcayup14:44
charlie-tcadavmor2: lol; updated last week!14:45
charlie-tcaImages today should be usable, I have not had time to install yet14:45
davmor2charlie-tca: :D  couldn't resist sorry :D14:45
charlie-tcaI could see that :)14:46
astraljavaAlright cool, will check this evening.14:54
mr_pouitI guess you'll have a black screen instead of lightdm starting ;>15:32
charlie-tcaon the live environment only, right?15:33
charlie-tcaOr is that going to affect all installs now?15:34
mr_pouitI don't know, on the live environment only I think15:41
charlie-tcaWorks for now, then15:42
mr_pouitbecause I'm afraid lightdm will try to autologin into the gnome session, which doesn't exist :}15:42
charlie-tcaIs that what is happening? It has been doing that since Ubuntu switched to lightdm15:42
mr_pouitI think that is what happening, I tried quickly in a vm, and it did that15:43
charlie-tcayup. Installs have been working from the cd menu only. We can't get a live desktop15:44
cody-somervilleHey Folks. How are things?17:39
charlie-tcaCould be worse. We no longer have a live desktop because lightdm points only to gnome17:40
cody-somervilleBrilliant.17:40
cody-somervilleHas that been escalated?17:40
charlie-tcabut the installs work; we get a xfce session only, since xubuntu is no longer a valid session17:40
charlie-tcamr_pouit has been trying to get something done17:40
cody-somervilleRobert should be receptive to helping fix that ASAP. I'll shoot off an e-mail to him to remind him.17:41
charlie-tcaand, with the wiki.ubuntu.com update, that is pretty much broken now17:42
cody-somervillewiki.ubuntu.com is broken?17:42
charlie-tcalol, at least it is getting faster17:42
charlie-tcacan't login for a lot of people17:42
cody-somervillefaster is good :)17:42
cody-somervilleah17:42
cody-somervilleyea, I can't login either17:43
charlie-tcawhich kind of makes updating difficult17:43
cody-somervilleDo you know if there is an RT ticket open for that?17:43
charlie-tcaI opened one 17:43
charlie-tcabut then it worked17:43
charlie-tcaI don' t know if it is still open now17:43
charlie-tcart.ubuntu.com #1730617:44
cody-somervillecharlie-tca, I think you just have to try twice and it'll work17:44
charlie-tcaheh17:44
charlie-tcamaybe17:44
charlie-tcaYou got something there17:45
cody-somervillecharlie-tca, ah, now its timing out on me17:46
charlie-tcaMy updates did not give me an error after I got logged in this morning, so there is still hope17:46
cody-somervillecharlie-tca, I've escalated this to the vanguard.17:46
charlie-tcaIt's kind of in and out again17:46
charlie-tcaI seem to be in again17:47
Unit193I'm logged in as well...17:48
charlie-tcaI did send a few messages in over the weekend, but that didn't seem to help at all17:50
cody-somervillecharlie-tca, Whats the bug # re: lightdm issue? I'll escalate that too.17:50
pleia2same, I'm still having trouble hitting preview when I make edits17:50
cody-somervillepleia2, I'll ask if thats a known issue.17:51
pleia2cody-somerville: I've been in the sysadmin channel all weekend, they keep doing tweaks to make it better, not much luck so far17:51
cody-somervilleah. :(17:51
pleia2but at least the wiki loads, which is an improvement over yesterday morning17:52
charlie-tcatrue17:52
charlie-tcacody-somerville: http://pad.lv/79923817:53
ubottuLaunchpad bug 799238 in casper (Ubuntu) "Xubuntu amd64 20110618 xserver abort" [Medium,Triaged]17:53
charlie-tcaand17:53
charlie-tcahttp://pad.lv/79557517:53
ubottuLaunchpad bug 795575 in xubuntu-default-settings (Ubuntu) "xubuntu-session unavailable for Oneiric" [High,Triaged]17:53
charlie-tcaand I got one more, if I can find it17:53
charlie-tcaBug 79975417:54
ubottuLaunchpad bug 799754 in lightdm (Ubuntu) "Please register lightdm.conf in the alternatives system" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/79975417:54
charlie-tcaThat's the ones I know of17:54
charlie-tcaWe just keep trying... 17:56
charlie-tcacody-somerville: I am adding these three to the release team tracker, too, this week17:57
charlie-tcaoh, by the way, we are now included in the release team meetings17:57
cody-somerville\o/17:58
charlie-tcaWe really are making a few gains, huh?17:59
cody-somervilleYes, sir.17:59
micahgcharlie-tca: I have a xubuntu session just fine on my oneiric laptop, so it's not lightdm18:03
charlie-tcamicahg: it is lightdm on new installations18:06
charlie-tcaupgrades and adding lightdm works, but a new install will not because of the changes made 18:07
charlie-tcaOur images were fine until Ubuntu made the changes and added lightdm to theirs. 18:08
charlie-tcaWe have not been able to get a live desktop since then18:09
micahgwell, I don't think the fault is lightdm itself, but rather the live system and the way it uses the display manager18:09
=== _Hyper__ is now known as _Hyper_
GridCubecharlie-tca, want me to do some testings today?20:24
charlie-tcasure20:37
charlie-tcaEverybody likes the idea of the FAQ page, so let's get the discussion about what fits going.20:38
GridCube:) 20:46
GridCubeyesterday Unit193 show me this page https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Lubuntu/Documentation/FAQ20:47
GridCubei think it could be something like a guide20:47
GridCubei think it will be better if we focus on things people that comes from other OSs might care to have working pretty fast, thats why i said "how to listen music?" as my primary example20:48
charlie-tcaThat's what your message to the Mailing list should say, then. also any other topics you think would be good. Want me to start it, and you can then reply?20:50
GridCubeoh i could send the mail i think20:51
GridCubewill topic it "Top 10 FAQ for the Xubuntu site"20:52
charlie-tcagreat!20:52
charlie-tcaThat fits perfect20:52
Unit193I was pointing that out as it's another FAQ (I didn't think he was planning on that as it's run by the IRC support people) 20:52
charlie-tcaHow to turn sound on? How to listen to music? How to install video drivers?20:52
GridCubethose are pretty great20:53
GridCubemaybe "how to enable compiz" that is asked a lot20:53
charlie-tcayes!20:53
Unit193How to play DVDs?20:53
charlie-tcagood one20:53
charlie-tcadvd/music the same?20:53
ochosiidea: maybe combine them with appropriate icons on the website, so that people can easily spot what they're looking for (instead of just a long list of text)20:53
charlie-tcaand we let it run about a month, to see what the most asked stuff is in #xubuntu?20:54
charlie-tcaWe just need someone to keep on eye on the channel and send the stuff to the ML20:54
charlie-tcaA really good reason for people to visit the website: Rotating FAQ's20:55
Unit193This is also going to be keeping the english ones up too I would assume20:58
GridCubeoh, im forgeting about the translation thing21:00
charlie-tcawhich english ones?21:00
GridCubeadding that up to the mail21:00
charlie-tcathat's correct, I think. 21:01
charlie-tcaSince we have none now, we would be maintaining them in English and ???21:01
GridCubespaƱish?21:06
GridCubesended21:06
GridCube:D21:06
charlie-tcaThanks21:07
GridCubecharlie-tca, i will do the "alternate, disk encryption" test now21:08
GridCubedo you want me to do anything else?21:08
charlie-tcaany you can do will be great21:11
GridCubeoh, why does it says my full name on the ML? XD 21:12
GridCube:P not that it really bothers me21:13
charlie-tcaShould be the name you used for the subscription21:13
GridCubeoh i think it takes the name i use on gmail21:14
charlie-tcamaybe21:14
GridCubewhat kind of test is the one for firefox?21:15
micahgGridCube: just use it and see if it breaks21:16
GridCubeokay21:16
micahgthe more extreme your daily use is, the better the test :)21:16
* GridCube will take his tests to THE EXTREME21:17
Unit193This seems to be the only time where the more tabs you have, the better it is :P21:44
GridCubei wonder what would happen if i open 100 youtube videos at the same time21:46
Unit193GridCube: I have had 130+ tabs open on more than one occasion (About 160 has been my max...)21:49
GridCube:P when i read my webcomics on the mornign i autoopen 40+ pages at once21:49
GridCubeXD21:49
GridCubecharlie-tca, the installation freezed23:11
charlie-tcaprobably a kernel panic. Do the caps-lock and num-lock buttons make the lights turn on/off?23:20
charlie-tcaIs that a test or your used installation?23:21
GridCubecharlie-tca, thats for me?23:24
charlie-tcayeah, but I answered you already in #xubuntu23:25
GridCubeok in the other  topic,  the installation of the virtualmachine died at "downloading 2 o f 6"23:33
charlie-tcaThat's a FAIL23:51
charlie-tcaSeems to be a problem with the kernel today, maybe tomorrow it will all be there23:51
GridCubeok23:56

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