astraljavaWas there a meeting today?16:29
astraljavaAhh... nevermind, thought I'd hit the wiki instead. :D16:29
astraljava...which seems dead for a change...16:30
astraljavaSo, 1700 UTC?16:31
holsteinastraljava: yeah16:34
holsteinan hour and a half away16:35
holstein*in theory16:35
holsteinits a holiday weekend in the states16:35
holsteinScottL: are you around today for the meeting16:38
holsteinhey ailo_ :)16:42
astraljavaholstein: Right, yeah everybody's out in Mexico getting robbed.16:53
astraljavaAnd no, I don't mean everybody gets robbed while in Mexico. I am pointing to the headlines which said a drug cartel was specifically aiming for American tourists this weekend.16:54
holstein*due to the holidays, the ubuntustudio meeting scheduled for 15 minutes ago will be cancelled18:15
holsteinwe'll catch up next time :)18:15
astraljavaOkay. :)18:22
ailo_postpone it a week?18:33
holsteinailo_: i was just about to talk with shnatsel about that18:34
holsteinailo_: we can18:34
holsteinalso, shnatsel posted https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-studio-devel/2011-June/003391.html18:34
holsteinshnatsel: COOL.. you're an elementaryOS dev?18:35
shnatselholstein: yes18:35
shnatselholstein: I'm one of the packagers, but my main role is maintaining the ISO and integrating our stuff into Ubuntu base18:36
shnatseland lots of other miscellaneous work we all get now and then18:37
shnatselI used to maintain a small artistic Ubuntu spin for 2 years, that's when I learned lots of things that led me to being elementary OS dev :)18:38
holsteinshnatsel: glad you are here18:38
holsteinwe are actually focused quite heavily on audio18:38
holsteinit would be great to have someone more aware of graphics18:39
shnatselholstein: well, that might be me18:39
shnatselUbuntu seriously lacks painterly software18:40
holsteinwhen i saw that post, i personally dont know enough about graphics to respond18:40
holsteinand, when folks come in with new audio apps, i see they are usually directed to get them in upstream18:41
holsteinhowever, it didnt look like those are totally differnt apps18:41
holsteinso it might be something we can implement18:41
holsteinshnatsel: how official is elemetaryOS ??18:41
holsteinseems we are quite bound to the buntu base in a way that can actually keep us from implementing some features18:42
shnatselholstein: absolutely official for our project, not related to canonical18:42
shnatselholstein: these apps are not related to elementary OS anyway18:43
holsteini guess my gerneral concern is, if these are *not* in the repos18:43
holsteinwe really cant implement it18:43
holsteinwe needed a proper kernel for 11.0418:44
holsteinit didnt get worked into the repos18:44
holsteinso, we just dont have a proper kernel18:44
holsteinfor realtime audio18:44
shnatselholstein: yeah, I know, trademark and such18:44
shnatselholstein: no, they are not in the repos, some of them weren't even packaged. It would be nice if somebody pushed them there, though.18:44
holsteinare these things you can push to debian?18:45
shnatselI'm an absolute noob at all the paperwork related to it and I've never did it18:45
holsteinim pretty sure that is the quickest way to get something in ubuntu18:45
shnatselholstein: Debian seems to use systems so ancient that I couldn't even report a bug about it18:45
shnatselI spent 15 minutes but then gave it up18:46
holsteinshnatsel: we'll talk to ScottL about it more when he's around18:46
shnatselholstein: thanks!18:46
holsteinScottL is the team lead18:46
shnatselit obviously was not a problem to put all that in an unofficial spin18:47
holsteinyeah... thats the issue though, we cant stray to far it seems18:48
astraljavashnatsel: If you could list them in wiki somewhere, we could start working on packaging them, and pushing to debian.18:48
shnatselastraljava: they're already packaged18:49
shnatselastraljava: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-studio-devel/2011-June/003391.html18:49
astraljavashnatsel: Ahh... okay cool. Right, so all that's needed is to check they conform to debian policies, then file ITP and RFP bugs, and find sponsors for uploading.18:50
shnatselastraljava: I really suck at paperwork18:51
astraljavashnatsel: Oh that's what you were referring to. :)18:51
shnatselastraljava: would somebody else do it? Please?18:51
astraljavashnatsel: Sure. I'm in the middle of moving, so I don't have my testing env etc. with me at the moment. But if no-one else will, I'll do that in August.18:52
shnatselastraljava: thanks!18:52
shnatselhmm, in August you'll have to request an Ubuntu import for those packages, too...18:53
astraljavashnatsel: No prob. Thank _you_ for contributing! :)18:53
astraljavashnatsel: True, if you want them in for Oneiric, you might wanna find someone to do it faster than that.18:54
holsteinastraljava: if you can point some things in my direction that i can handle, i'll do them18:54
astraljavaholstein: Well, for myself to feel comfortable with uploading a package, I'd test it in a real debian environment. I'm not sure it's required, though. So just get it building against a debian sid chroot, and test that it installs there, that might suffice.18:56
astraljavas/uploading/asking someone to upload/18:57
kubotuastraljava meant: "holstein: Well, for myself to feel comfortable with asking someone to upload a package, I'd test it in a real debian environment. I'm not sure it's required, though. So just get it building against a debian sid chroot, and test that it installs there, that might suffice."18:57
holsteinastraljava: yeah, i cant handle that though18:57
holsteinnot in a timely manner, thats for sure18:57
astraljavaholstein: To cut some corners, I could do the chroot thingie faster, of course. Depends then on the sponsor whether or not [s]he will upload.18:58
shnatselif there are issues with those packages and I'm not here, you can always find me at #elementary or at shnatsel@gmail.com (except August)18:58
astraljavaTo be honest, I don't really know whether they test their packages in a real system before uploading. :)18:58
astraljavaJust I assume it would be a good thing to do.18:59
astraljavashnatsel: Gotcha, thanks!19:00
shnatselastraljava: those packages are well-tested on Ubuntu systems already, I've shipped them with my spin and discovered several bugs related to installing on a blank system etc, so now it should work just perfectly fine19:01
shnatselastraljava: got your heads-up :)19:02
astraljavashnatsel: Good. :)19:03
shnatselAlso, I hear you're moving to XFCE base, why?19:03
astraljavashnatsel: So that gives me confidence in getting them somewhere where the devs can upload.19:03
astraljavashnatsel: Because the team felt that GNOME3 doesn't suit our workflow, and GNOME2 is going away for Oneiric.19:04
astraljavaXFCE was the closest.19:04
shnatselin elementary we considered using XFCE as base, we ended up having both GNOME daemons and XFCE daemons if we use some real-life apps, and some GNOME systems are greatly superior to XFCE equivalents, e.g. dconf/GSettings is far superior to xfconf19:06
shnatselBut, I haven't seen your apps and workflow, XFCE might suit you better indeed19:11
shnatselOk, gotta go hack something :)19:16
shnatselGood luck and have fun19:16

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