=== jjohansen is now known as jj-afk
=== doko_ is now known as doko
=== yofel_ is now known as yofel
=== Quintasan is now known as Quintasan_
=== Quintasan_ is now known as Quintasan
=== Quintasan is now known as Quintasan_
=== Quintasan_ is now known as Quintasan
=== Quintasan is now known as Quintasan_
=== Quintasan_ is now known as Quintasan
=== coalwater_ is now known as coalwater
=== czajkows1i is now known as czajkowski
=== Pendulum_ is now known as Pendulum
barryhi everyone.  if i'm not mistaken, it's time once again for our bi-weekly udd stakeholders meeting12:01
MootBotMeeting started at 07:01. The chair is barry.12:01
MootBotCommands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]12:01
jelmerhi barry!12:01
barryjelmer: hi!12:01
pooliehi barry, jelmer12:01
barryhi poolie12:01
barrydo you know if anyone else is joining us today?12:01
barrywell, anyway, let's get started12:02
barry[TOPIC] agenda12:02
MootBotNew Topic:  agenda12:02
barry[LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DistributedDevelopment/2011071312:02
MootBotLINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DistributedDevelopment/2011071312:02
barry[TOPIC] action items12:03
MootBotNew Topic:  action items12:03
barry   * jelmer to study the feasibility of merge helper ([[https://bugs.launchpad.net/bzr-builddeb/+bug/608675|bug 608675]]) as an intermediate step for quilt support12:03
barry 12:03
ubottuUbuntu bug 608675 in bzr-builddeb "merge-package should have support for manipulating quilt v3 patch stacks" [High,In progress]12:03
jelmerI've been away for the last week so haven't spent any time on this since12:04
jelmerat the last meeting (at the rally) we discussed it, and my conclusions there were that it seems feasible and I've started working on implementing it.12:04
barryjelmer: awesome.  we'll just keep it on for next time12:05
pooliethat's great12:05
barry   * jelmer to look into [[https://bugs.launchpad.net/udd/+bug/609187|bug 609187]] (warn when package import is out of date)12:05
ubottuUbuntu bug 609187 in Ubuntu Distributed Development "users are not warned when branching ubuntu:foo (or lp:ubuntu/foo) and the package import of foo is out of date" [High,Triaged]12:05
pooliethere was some discussion recently of this being useful even for non-quilt branches12:05
poolieor, more generally, of being able to merge both the patched and unpatched forms12:05
jelmerjam mentioned on IRC earlier that he's working on bug 60918712:06
pooliebarry, i think jam and others worked on that12:06
poolieoh, and maxb in london12:06
barryvery nice.  so, in progress?12:06
jelmershould perhaps be owned by jam though?12:06
maxbjam has taken my proof of concept "How to talk to LP without launchpadlib" and is pursuing it12:07
barrysure, i can update that.12:07
pooliehi maxb12:07
barryhi maxb12:07
barrymaxb: do you just make straight up http calls?12:07
pooliethe point of avoiding lplib is that it's much faster to just make the single call we care about12:08
barrymakes sense12:08
maxbMinimizing roundtrips and costly WADL downloads really matters if we're going to do this interactively12:08
barry   * Riddell to file bug saying that packaging branch pages on code.lp.net should be better labeled12:09
barryanybody know if the bug has been filed?12:09
poolieistr that he did12:09
jelmer... and fixed the bug :)12:09
poolieand, perhaps he worked on it at the rally12:09
barrydo you happen to have the bug #?12:10
pooliebug 79768812:11
ubottuLaunchpad bug 797688 in Launchpad itself "Ubuntu Packaging Branches Should be Labeled Clearer" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/79768812:11
barrythanks (you're quicker at searching than me at this hour :)12:11
pooliei have kanban fu12:11
MootBotLINK received:  http://people.canonical.com/~mbp/kanban/jr-kanban.html12:11
pooliescan down the right hand column until you find it12:11
barryah, nice!12:11
pooliei like it12:12
barryi didn't realize each person had their own kanban12:12
barry[TOPIC] package importer progress12:13
MootBotNew Topic:  package importer progress12:13
poolieyes, there's one aggregated per team and one per person12:13
poolielet's see12:13
pooliei think max said some new things started failing12:13
maxbThere does seem to have been a small uptick in the count12:13
pooliehm, so it stepped down a bit, but now has drifted up12:13
maxbBesides the append-revisions-only stuff, which I'm taking account of12:13
poolieback from 400 to 425?12:13
pooliesome of these are AppendRevisionsOnlyViolation which is a recent regression12:14
poolieso i'm proposing to make this rather more of a priority for the canonical bzr team12:14
maxbThe append-revisions-only stuff accounts for ~25, but I've fixed about ~20 imports in the last 48 hours, which is why were are back at around 40012:14
poolieputting it at the top of our quarterly planning commitments, and trying to get it below 200 by the start of october12:14
pooliewhich would be much faster than our current trend12:15
pooliethanks max12:15
barrypoolie: that would be amazing12:15
jelmerI've made some progress on support for multiple upstream tarballs, which isn't finished yet but should help a bit too.12:15
poolieoh, that's great12:15
maxbOne thing is that there seems to be a gradual uptick in the number of packages using multiple upstream tarballs. That's also the top single failure cause at the moment12:15
maxbAnother thing to consider is that quite a number of the failures are failures during the generation of merge preview diffs - *not* the import itself12:16
maxbA subcategory of those are, I believe, being addressed by a bugfix of vila's12:16
pooliewhy does it generate merge preview diffs?12:17
maxbI'm guessing because james_w thought it would be useful?12:17
maxbI doubt many people know they exist.12:17
MootBotLINK received:  http://package-import.ubuntu.com/merges/12:17
james_wI started generating them as a test12:18
pooliehi james12:18
james_wbut never followed it through to be the replacement for merges.ubuntu.com12:18
barryjames_w: hi.  i didn't know that existed either12:18
poolieso, what shall we do12:18
poolieperhaps we should move it out of line so that it doesn't cause failure of the actual package import?12:19
maxbI estimate ~44 failures are in the merge generation. They are probably legitimate bzrlib bugs12:19
maxbI think we should be mindful of that possibility, but see how many of the failures are cleared up by vila's NoFinalPath bugfix before investing time12:20
james_wthat seems to be a fair number of them12:20
jelmerMerges are one of the goals of the UDD branches, so it seems useful to keep it in.12:21
james_wgiven no-one is using the output currently it wouldn't really cost anything to delete the code12:21
barryor maybe comment it out for now?12:21
poolieok, well, now i know it's there :)12:22
pooliei agree with max, let's see how it goes with current in progress work landed, and then we can think about pruning it12:22
poolieor, alternatively, at least linking to ti12:22
barryso, not really on the agenda, but i see lp and bzr got updated last night?  how'd that go?12:23
poolieit was a bit bumpy12:23
barrybut everything worked out?12:23
pooliesince we went several revisions forward, and there were some bad interactions between changes in bzr and in bzr-svn when importing large branches12:23
pooliewe are having a postmortem thread at the moment12:24
poolieto try to understand what happened12:24
pooliebut i think it will be ok12:24
barrycool.  i'm on the mlist so i'll follow along12:24
pooliewe will make it safer to deploy and roll back, and then deploy more often12:24
pooliesimilar to the approach being taken with other bits of lp12:24
poolieand speaking of which, can i just say how much i'm looking forward to their new shorter upgrade windows12:25
poolie(https://lists.launchpad.net/launchpad-dev/msg07623.html but it's a bit offtopic)12:25
pooliejelmer, can you tell us about what this is likely to change with imports?12:25
jelmerpoolie: Can you rephrase that, do you mean the vcs imports?12:26
barryalso, what are the top-level user visible changes we'll see in bzr/udd/codehosting now?12:27
pooliewe can hope to see more of them succeed after the lp upgrade?12:27
jelmerpoolie: What was the recent lp upgrade from last night barry was referring to exactly?12:28
pooliethere should be a big new feature in lp which is showing diffs inline in the branch pages12:28
poolielp had an upgrade outage today (australian time)12:28
poolieperhaps we should get our story straight offline :)12:28
barrythat will be *awesome*12:28
poolieand then post something on the lp blog about user visible changes, if any12:28
barrypoolie: +1, can i give you that action?12:29
poolieactually could i put that on jelmer, since he landed the change iirc12:29
pooliethe inline content feature is http://people.canonical.com/~andrew/Inline-diff-screenshot.png12:30
poolienot landed yet12:30
barry[ACTION] jelmer to post summary of user visible changes with lp rollout12:30
MootBotACTION received:  jelmer to post summary of user visible changes with lp rollout12:30
jelmerI haven't caught up on all that email yet, but I'd be happy to take an action item about the post-morten analysis12:30
jampoolie: that specific screenshot is for merge proposal pages12:30
jamdanilo's change was for Branch pages, which I certainly don't see, but I don't know whether or not his expander code has landed.12:30
pooliei think the code changes proposed now may only touch mp pages but we should be able to follow through and show stuff on the branch too12:30
pooliejelmer so i guess there's two things to follow on, one is the postmortem (what went wrong) and the other is the feature announcement, if any (what will go right)12:31
pooliei had the idea that the updated bzr-git etc are going to help a lot more branch imports complete12:31
poolieam i confused?12:31
jelmerI haven't landed anything related to the expander code12:32
jelmerI do have a fix for having bzr-svn deal with tags better (not use so much memory), but IIRC I haven't proposed that for landing on lp yet12:32
pooliedidn't you land several updates into lp when we were at the rally?12:33
poolieperhaps we should move on; this isn't really udd specific12:35
maxbI have something I'd like people to have a think about: What are we going to do about developer-maintained package branches, which don't use upstream-* tags because they merge directly from upstream's bzr, and thus the UDD importer always fails on currently? I'm thinking of, e.g. apport12:35
jelmer(sorry, looking through the revision log atm..)12:35
barrypoolie: okay12:35
barry[TOPIC]  * Get rid of `bzr mark-uploaded` ?12:35
MootBotNew Topic:   * Get rid of `bzr mark-uploaded` ?12:35
jelmertaking that offline (in the post-mortem thread perhaps?) might indeed be better12:35
Riddellhi, sorry I'm late12:36
barryso, if i'm not mistaken, mark-uploaded is more or less unnecessary now, right?12:36
jelmersomewhat; debcommit -r will tag too and "bzr tag" without argument can also behave the same way as mark-uploaded12:37
Riddellhmm, I was hoping to get away from using debcommit12:37
barryjelmer: what does mark-uploaded do that bzr tag or debcommit doesn't?12:37
barryi guess there are two things leading these questions: whether to change the udd documentation to just use bzr tag, and whether to actually deprecate or get rid of the command?12:38
jelmerbarry: I don't think there's anything it does that bzr tag doesn't, other than perhaps being a bit more clearly named12:38
barryjelmer: cool.  any objections to me changing the udd docs to use tag instead?12:39
pooliejames_w ^?12:39
barryRiddell: i'd like to get away from recommending debcommit too12:39
james_wnot really12:39
pooliei wonder if bzr builddeb could instead hook into the tag command (through adding a hook, not in some gross way) to give people policy checks?12:40
james_wprobably worth a note that if bzr says that they have to give a tag name they need a newer bzr/bzr-builddeb, or their bzr-builddeb is incorrectly installed12:40
poolieif those checks are seen as useful12:40
barryjames_w: good idea12:41
barry[ACTION] barry to update udd docs to use `bzr tag` instead of `bzr mark-uploaded`12:41
MootBotACTION received:  barry to update udd docs to use `bzr tag` instead of `bzr mark-uploaded`12:41
pooliebarry i suggested Riddell might put his packaging background to use in working on the packaging guide with yourself and daniel12:41
Riddellyes, I'm working my way through it fixing things and working out what's missing or not clear12:42
barryRiddell: fantastic.  you can add me as a reviewer for any mp12:42
poolieshall we talk about max's question?12:42
barryRiddell: do you want to take the above action instead of me?12:42
ScottKRiddell: Does that include non-UDD packaging?12:42
Riddellbarry: yes can do12:42
pooliehi scott12:43
barry[ACTION] Riddell to update udd docs to use `bzr tag` instead of `bzr mark-uploaded`12:43
MootBotACTION received:  Riddell to update udd docs to use `bzr tag` instead of `bzr mark-uploaded`12:43
barrypoolie: yes, let's take up maxb's question12:43
maxb<maxb> I have something I'd like people to have a think about: What are we going to do about developer-maintained package branches, which don't use upstream-* tags because they merge directly from upstream's bzr, and thus the UDD importer always fails on currently? I'm thinking of, e.g. apport12:43
RiddellScottK: I'd like to discuss that with dholbach, it needs quite a lot of changes to include non-UDD bits and I don't know if he has thought about how to do that (but essentially i'm working on it from a bzr developer perspective so no)12:43
ScottKThat's one of the guide's biggest problems at the moment.12:44
RiddellScottK: but the guide should either be renamed or fixed for that12:44
barryScottK: yep12:44
jelmermaxb: It would seem reasonable to just directly tag the upstream versions with upstream-X if they have the same contents12:44
poolieby detecting there's a revision identical to the orig.tgz?12:46
jelmereither by detecting or having some place where the upstream tag algorithm is specified12:47
maxbSo perhaps the way forward is to discuss with the packagers of those packages how much they are willing to tweak their workflow for UDD compatibility12:47
pooliecan we do something towards recognizing the actual tag in the upstream branch?12:47
pooliethere very likely is one, istm12:47
jelmerbzr-builddeb already has a config variable export-upstream-revision which can be set to the tag pattern for finding upstream versions12:47
pooliemaxb, what kind of tweaks?12:48
jelmere.g. "export-upstream-revision = tag:bzr-svn-$UPSTREAM_VERSION" as bzr-svn's tagging algorithm uses the tag name "bzr-svn-1.0a" for version "1.0a"12:49
jelmerThe proper place to store that sort of information would be in Launchpad's release information I think12:50
pooliethat would be useful in other places12:50
pooliefor instance automatically presenting the releases in the ui and ws12:50
maxbAs in, potentially making use of "bzr merge-upstream", or setting tags manually12:50
barryit's getting late, so let's move on12:52
barry[TOPIC] bugs of interest12:52
MootBotNew Topic:  bugs of interest12:52
barry[LINK] http://people.canonical.com/~mbp/kanban/canonical-bazaar-kanban.html12:52
MootBotLINK received:  http://people.canonical.com/~mbp/kanban/canonical-bazaar-kanban.html12:52
pooliegood idea12:52
barryanything in particular to point out?12:52
pooliei plan to stop the package importer pretending to be james tomorrow12:53
barrynice :)12:53
poolielots of bugs there12:53
pooliemoving across12:53
pooliejelmer it looks like you should do a bzr-svn release12:54
pooliebarry, james, maxb, is there anything especially biting you, or that you think especially needs attention?12:54
jambarry: [LINK] lp:///~jameinel/bzr/2.2-is-up-to-date12:54
jelmerpoolie: I agree; the tags memory usage issue is the main thing that's blocking that at the moment.12:54
jam[LINK] lp:///~jameinel/bzr/2.2-is-up-to-date12:54
MootBotLINK received:  lp:///~jameinel/bzr/2.2-is-up-to-date12:54
pooliejam, what is that?12:55
jamI just added a "Branch.open" hook12:55
jamso that doing "bzr info lp:ubuntu/bzr" tells you if the branch is up-to-date12:55
poolieoh i see12:55
barrypoolie: atm, nope. things are going well12:55
pooliewe need to try again with a 2.3.4 sru into natty12:55
poolieit's getting late here for sure12:55
MootBotLINK received:  http://paste.ubuntu.com/643225/12:56
barry[TOPIC] aob12:56
MootBotNew Topic:  aob12:56
barryjust one small note: poolie the meeting 2 weeks from now is at the wrong time i think12:56
jambarry: I think that goes with the earlier action item (that I missed), for checking if import branches are up-to-date12:56
poolieyes, it does, that's nice12:56
barryjam: thanks12:57
barryjam: that looks great12:57
poolieso we're going to keep it at the same time as today?12:57
barrypoolie: if that worked for you guys.  it was much better for me ;)12:57
jamwfm, poolie is the one most impacted by it12:58
pooliethanks everyone for coming, especially maxb12:58
barryokay, with that...12:58
MootBotMeeting finished at 07:59.12:59
barrythanks everyone12:59
jelmerthanks barry :)12:59
=== Guest60391 is now known as Zic
* slangasek waves15:04
cjwatson..-. .. ... ....15:04
MootBotMeeting started at 10:05. The chair is slangasek.15:05
MootBotCommands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]15:05
slangasek[TOPIC] lightning round15:05
MootBotNew Topic:  lightning round15:05
slangasek$ echo $(shuf -e cjwatson barry doko csurbhi stgraber jhunt mvo ev vorlon bdmurray)15:05
slangasekand... go15:05
slangasekbdmurray ev jhunt barry csurbhi stgraber cjwatson vorlon doko mvo15:05
mvolast again!15:05
bdmurraybug work15:05
bdmurraybug triage of ubiquity bug reports with SQUASHFS errors, fsys-tarfile-error apport package bug report cleanup, incompletion of ubiquity    install failures due to oom, FTBFS bug report modifications, added bug reporting guidelines for ubuntu-meta, crichton function to deal     with package-install-segfault bug reports, wrote a bug pattern for update-initramfs failures on Live Media and wrote a wiki page to point  people at15:05
bdmurraycommunity stuff/work15:06
bdmurrayreview and approval of 2 new Ubuntu Bug Control members, added in iso-testing bug reports to the package status pages, udw class prep and  presentation regarding working with apport bugs15:06
bdmurraydevelopment work15:06
bdmurrayupdate-manager apport hook SRU update and new merge proposal for oneiric, branch adding casper version to apport bug reports from live     media, updated ubiquity apport package hook to ask permission before adding debug log and block SQUASHFS error bug reports, patch pilot    day (fixed pm-utils failed to inhibit suspend bug, 665651 which revealed a bug in toshset which caused suspend to fail), bzr branch for    unattended-upgrades and messag15:06
* slangasek waves to psurbhi 15:06
mvo\o/ for u-m15:06
ev- More fighting over desk space. Now resolved! I'm officially a Millbank-based15:08
ev  employee from here on out. Yay.15:08
ev- integrating Wubi builds into cdimage. Should be working just as soon as15:08
ev  LP: #807974 gets fixed.15:08
ev- Further work on the IronPython Wubi test. I now have an executable bundle15:08
ev  that displays a WebKit view (of the people.ubuntu.com slideshow).15:08
ev  It's 8,751 KB, but I think I can further trim that down some. It's roughly:15:08
ev  7-zip's SFX header, a small configuration file, and an LZMA archive15:08
ev  concatenated together.  In the LZMA archive is the IronPython DLLs (3.3215:08
ev  MB), the Chromium Embedded Framework DLLs (25.7 MB), CefSharp DLLs (293 KB),15:08
ev  and the application bytecode (.NET) and libraries (12.6 KB). I'm going to15:08
ev  stick an address bar on this and deliver it to The Team to use for Wubi15:08
ev  slideshow development.15:08
ev- Looking into writing a small C++ wrapper around the front of our .NET15:08
ev  application to download and install the .NET 2.5 runtime when it's not15:08
ev  present on the system, rather than just letting Windows throw up an obtuse15:08
ev  error dialog.15:08
ev- Trying to target an IronPython build for .NET 2/3.5.15:08
ev- Developer Experience Community of Practice call.15:08
ev- Stuck recovering my work from home laptop using the black magic of grub2's15:08
ev  loop mounting code (hooray for having a spare ISO lying around in /home).15:08
ev  Any thoughts on writing a copy of the installation ISO to the filesystem15:08
ev  during installation and wiring it into grub such that if everything goes to15:08
ev  hell, the user has something to boot into. Or should we do the ChromiumOS15:08
ev  A and B boot branch thing instead?15:08
ev- Finished the PyGI port of SegmentedBar and nearly done with the timezone15:09
ev  map. Ran headfirst into GdkPixbuf.get_pixels() being hideously broken in15:09
ev  PyGI, blocking the finishing of the timezone port. Spent a lot of time15:09
ev  digging through the PyGI source looking for the best way to solve this in15:09
ev  this brave new world, proposed an approach to tomeu, and may have a solution15:09
ev  soon.15:09
ev- Helped the web team again with the Launchpad API, further modifying the15:09
ev  script I wrote for them to generate reports of what bugs they fixed to work15:09
ev  with date ranges.15:09
ev- Call with Steve on the plan for Wubi, and the hiring of a Windows developer.15:09
ev- Chat with Francis on our plans for the crash database. He's going to circle15:09
ev  back with Rob and then presumably continue the discussion on the existing15:09
ev  mail thread.15:09
ev- Started writing unit tests for gtkwidgets in ubiquity and a harness that15:09
ev  plays nice with the GTK main loop and the weird fact that PyGI raises15:09
ev  exceptions in a different thread of execution, thus they don't bubble up15:09
ev  around Gtk.main. I know, awesome, right?15:09
ev- Had to do some running around and paperwork for signing up to Canonical's15:09
ev  implementation of the cycle to work scheme.15:09
ev- More work on the wireless page for ubiquity. Implemented passphrase15:09
ev  handling.15:09
slangasekbdmurray: I think your line truncated; "unattended-upgrades and messag[...]"15:09
ev- Objectives. Eep.15:09
ev- Get hardware expensed for ubiquity testing in the datacenter.15:09
dokoev: how much are charged for the desk? ;p15:09
bdmurray"bzr branch for unattended-upgrades and messages during shutdown, apt branch blocking of fsys tarfile error package install failures"15:10
jhunt_Raised MP to revert dokos gcc+armel change for libnih. Worked with15:10
jhunt_hallyn to find a resolution for bug 495394. Reviewed marrusl's15:10
jhunt_material for UDw. Some progress on Upstart disabling jobs feature.15:10
jhunt_Reviewed documentation changes for psurbhi's Upstart initramfs branch.15:10
jhunt_Worked through initramfs setup steps for Upstart and discussed with15:10
ubottuLaunchpad bug 495394 in libvirt (Ubuntu Natty) "autostart almost always fails on boot time host" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/49539415:10
jhunt_psurbhi. Started to look at bug 436936 (again). Made some good15:10
ubottuLaunchpad bug 436936 in gdm (Ubuntu Natty) "gdm upstart job checks /proc/cmdline for single user mode, won't start on post-boot runlevel change" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/43693615:10
jhunt_progress but then switched to bug 807293 which I am currently looking15:10
ubottuLaunchpad bug 807293 in upstart "user jobs cause kernel panic" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/80729315:10
evdoko: I think you pay cvd in endless thank yous and one appears15:10
barryrebuilding main dev machine (still need to restore pbuilder/sbuild/vms) - been filing bugs like mad; bug 806661 (python-imaging needs to be multiarch aware); bug 806744 (lazr.smtptest testing); looked at bug 212370 (coretemp kernel module) but need to come back to it; pep382 lively discussion on mlist and code reviews; patch pilot (see ubuntu-devel@); developer experience CoP; lead UDW session on dh_python2; UDD stakeholders meeting;15:10
barrythis week: work on lts ppa, continue on bug 788514; done.15:10
barry 15:10
ubottuLaunchpad bug 806661 in python-imaging (Ubuntu) "[oneiric] python-imaging needs to be multiarch-aware" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/80666115:10
ubottuLaunchpad bug 806744 in Launchpad itself "lazr.smtptest increases fragility of Launchpad appserver layer tests" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/80674415:10
ubottuLaunchpad bug 212370 in linux (Ubuntu) "Have to modprobe coretemp manually in order to get CPU temperatures on MacBook Pro" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/21237015:10
ubottuLaunchpad bug 788514 in Ubuntu Oneiric "python packages on the CDs not using dh_python2" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/78851415:10
slangasekbarry: sorry I missed the UDD stakeholders meeting yet again; it's creeping towards the time of day that I can make it, but I had an 11pm call last night so 5am was going to be a little rough :)15:13
slangasekpsurbhi: your turn15:13
barryslangasek: no worries ;)15:13
psurbhi*) working on making a ppa of initramfs, upstart and mountall - testing the install scripts, updated mkinitramfs and update-initramfs.15:13
psurbhi*) done.15:13
slangasekand learning about the evils of NSS in initramfses...15:14
slangasekstgraber is on vacation this week15:14
psurbhi:) yeah !15:14
* stgraber waves15:15
stgraberand gets back to doing non Ubuntu stuff :)15:15
cjwatsonhah, yeah, I remember discovering the fun of NSS in reduced systems when doing openssh-server-udeb a while back15:15
cjwatsonSpent most of this week so far working on Launchpad, with mvo's help from the apt/python-apt side:15:15
cjwatson * My dpkg-xz-support branch from last year will be ready to go once apt and python-apt SRUs land in lucid-updates.15:15
cjwatson * My multiarch-translations branch probably still needs a bit more code review, but it's had a DB review and I believe the necessary apt change is due to go in as an SRU.  Unfortunately, I think the Launchpad downtime schedule is such that this may not actually land in production until a day or two after feature freeze.  Perhaps we should go ahead with the installer change to activate multiarch anyway, since the ...15:15
cjwatson... Launchpad work is "only" a bandwidth reduction exercise?15:15
cjwatson * Good news: it only took about half a day to set up a Launchpad development VM, and most of that was waiting for downloads.  It's not as hard as I remember it being.15:15
cjwatsonWorking on mountall for /run transition, with Steve.  Will review Surbhi's stop-timer branch again once that transition is unstuck.15:16
cjwatsonKicked off preliminary CD building for
cjwatsonWorking on apt-setup error handling in the case of a non-downloadable local repository key (bug 728710).15:16
ubottuLaunchpad bug 728710 in apt-setup (Ubuntu) "d-i apt-setup/local0/repository not working" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/72871015:16
cjwatsonLaunchpad branch to add Lubuntu tasks has landed, so I'll be working on getting Lubuntu CDs going once we can debootstrap again.15:16
cjwatsonAlmost done with home plumbing problems saga of doom, at long last \o/15:16
psurbhicjwatson, thanks !15:16
psurbhii am waiting for the mountall review !15:16
cjwatsonsorry that's taken so long :-/15:16
slangasekactivate multiarch anyway> that seems fair to do now and give a bandwidth hit since it only affects those using the dev release15:16
slangasekas long as we're confident we'll have it really really fixed by beta :)15:16
cjwatsonyeah, the branch is not that painful15:17
cjwatsonalthough I don't actually have figures for how much it cuts15:17
cjwatsonI should work on that15:17
cjwatsonOK then, I'll pull the switch in the installer if I can say you told me to do it :-)15:17
mvowhat could possible go wrong?15:18
* slangasek gets the asbestos longjohns out of storage15:18
cjwatsonyou had them in storage?15:18
slangasekglobal warming15:18
cjwatsonyou've been away from platform too long15:18
slangasekmy turn15:18
slangasekthis week has pretty much been eaten up with bug #807974, development-wise15:18
ubottuLaunchpad bug 807974 in eglibc (Ubuntu Oneiric) "debootstrap fails to install libc6 installing oneiric from natty" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/80797415:18
slangasekstarted my long heart-to-heart with the initscripts merge on Friday... been working on it since15:19
slangasekshould actually be in a position to upload initscripts+mountall later today15:19
slangasekif someone were to have a look at debianutils and see whether we should merge it from unstable, that would knock one prereq off my list15:19
cjwatsonI can do that15:20
slangasekthanks :)15:20
slangaseknothing else to report here15:20
doko- updates and merges: binutils, gcc-4.6, gcc-4.5, gcc-4.4, gcj-4.515:21
doko- python 3.2.1 release15:21
doko- openjdk-7 and openjdk-6 updates, build fixes for powerpc and armel (and sparc)15:21
doko- some other merges and syncs15:21
doko- just one MIR15:21
doko- new installation on a toshiba ac100 (armel)15:21
doko- integrated some GCC patches upstream15:21
doko- GCC bug triage15:21
dokorebuild test not yet launched15:21
mvosoftware-center: debug/fix hang in piston helper, fix pyflakes issues, SRU for maverick/natty to obstrufucate private PPA details from the log, add some gtk3 specific tests15:22
mvoapt/python-apt: signature verification work, improve support for compression in python-apt and avoid code duplicatoin, lucid-proposed backport of long-description splitout and xz-compression,15:22
mvodebdelta: setup prototype for securty deltas on macaroni, waiting for IS for a role-account and a final place, send some patches to debdelta upstream15:22
mvosoftware-properties: work on dbus/polkit backend code based on apacheloggers branch, add tests for all the dbus methods (backend now mostly there)15:22
mvoupdate-manager: merge gtk3/pygi/gsettings branch, fix tests and upload15:22
mvomisc: debug/fix upgrade issue with doc-base  (#781076), debug/fix lp-extract-changelogs hang, apt-btrfs-snapshot: fix crash when fstab misses some entries, upload new version, merged gparted, played with livebuild as replacement for ubuntu-vm-builder that the server team wants to deprecate15:22
mvocjwatson: what do you reckon would it take to write a wrapper that has a similar "ui" as ubuntu-vm-builder, i.e. "ubuntu-vm-builder-using-live-build kvm lucid" and it would build a minimal qcow2 image? or does that not make much sesne at all?15:23
cjwatsonmvo: it's not too hard, make an auto directory and symlink canned config/build/clean scripts into it the way livecd-rootfs does, then call lb config and lb build15:24
cjwatsonmvo: and either patch live-build to add facilities you need (and forward them to Debian, please) or else add hooks in your build wrapper15:24
mvocjwatson: that sounds encouraging, I assume I can make it output a raw image that I can then covert to qcow2? or does it do qcow2 natively?15:25
cjwatsonmvo: no native support.  there are various image output options, you should be able to bodge one of them into a useful form yes15:26
cjwatson'man lb config'15:26
mvogreat, thanks15:26
slangasek[TOPIC] Oneiric bugz15:27
MootBotNew Topic:  Oneiric bugz15:27
slangaseknew topic!15:27
cjwatsonyou can probably just use '--binary-images none' or something and do it by hand15:28
bdmurrayI just wanted to mention a couple of bugs that have come to light in the past week15:28
slangasekbdmurray and I were talking this past week about bug tracking for the release, and the conclusion was that it would be useful to have a slot during the weekly meeting to talk about the status of any bugs that might be lingering15:28
* slangasek yields the floor to bdmurray :)15:28
bdmurraybug 807636 was found while isotesting15:29
ubottuLaunchpad bug 807636 in ubiquity (Ubuntu Oneiric) "[Oneiric Alpha] ubiquity doesn't show console when clicking in detailed view" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/80763615:29
cjwatsonI wondered why you assigned that to mvo15:29
cjwatsonthough I don't mind if mvo wants it :)15:29
bdmurraycjwatson: I think it was rather early for me15:29
cjwatsonah, yeah, you undid that latere15:29
bdmurraybug 806574 is a regression and targetted to Oneiric15:30
ubottuLaunchpad bug 806574 in computer-janitor (Ubuntu Oneiric) "computer-janitor-gtk crashed with AttributeError in reorder(): 'ListStore' object has no attribute 'reorder'" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/80657415:30
mvo*puhhh* for a moment I was scared ;)15:30
barrybdmurray: i'll take that one15:30
bdmurraybarry: great, thanks15:31
bdmurrayand then bug 806543 also found during iso testing15:31
ubottuLaunchpad bug 806543 in Linaro-Ubuntu "left over cruft in images" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/80654315:31
bdmurrayer 80645315:31
bdmurraybug 80645315:31
ubottuLaunchpad bug 806453 in udev (Ubuntu) "udevd fails with error creating queue file, instance fails to boot" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/80645315:31
slangasekbdmurray: that's a duplicate of the bug pitti just uploaded for15:32
slangasektied to the /run transition15:32
slangasekbug #80730615:32
ubottuLaunchpad bug 807306 in mountall (Ubuntu Oneiric) "[oneiric] Keyboard & mouse not working in X - incomplete migration to /run" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/80730615:32
bdmurrayslangasek: okay great15:33
bdmurraywhat about bug 791134? should it be fixed with pitti's upload too?15:34
ubottuLaunchpad bug 791134 in sbuild (Ubuntu) "Debian/sid and oneiric based builds fail" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/79113415:34
slangasekthat bug number looks wrong for it to be a duplicate15:34
slangasektoo old, this issue was just introduced last Thursday15:34
slangasekoh, wait15:35
slangasekDebian/sid - so that was the same bug, but in Debian :)15:35
cjwatson  * Compatibility symbolic links are relative, not absolute.  e.g.15:35
cjwatson    /var/lock is ../run/lock rather than /run/lock.  This means that if15:35
cjwatson    you're using a chroot from the host system, you'll always be using15:35
cjwatson    locations in the chroot, rather than the host, when following the15:35
cjwatson    links.15:35
bdmurrayright and I just (yesterday) ran into it with oneiric15:35
cjwatsonsysvinit 2.88dsf-13.515:35
cjwatsonhm, except:15:36
cjwatson        # Create absolute symlink if not already present.  This is to15:36
cjwatson        # upgrade from older versions which created relative links,15:36
cjwatson        # which are not permitted in policy between top-level15:36
cjwatson        # directories.15:36
cjwatsonso I'm confused15:36
cjwatsonah yes15:36
cjwatson  * Revert to using absolute paths in compatibility symlinks in order15:36
cjwatson    to comply with Policy ยง10.5 symlink rules. (Closes: #626263)15:36
cjwatsonI guess sbuild needs to cope then?15:36
slangasekah, fun15:37
slangasekI had assumed rleigh knew what he was doing and was going to stick with the not-quite-policy symlinks on purpose15:37
MootBotLINK received:  http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=62682615:37
ubottuDebian bug 626826 in sbuild "sbuild: /var/lock being absolute symlink -> "Another sbuild process (...) is currently using the build chroot"" [Normal,Fixed]15:37
cjwatsonso we should either merge sbuild, or cherry-pick that change15:38
slangasekany volunteers to take that merge?15:39
cjwatsonmaybe somebody who uses sbuild could do that?15:39
* cjwatson doesn't15:39
barryi do15:39
barryslangasek: fsvo15:39
barryis there an lp bug for that?15:40
bdmurrayokay those 3 bugs were all I had for this week - the sbuild one was just something I happened to remember15:40
bdmurraybarry: bug 79113415:40
ubottuLaunchpad bug 791134 in sbuild (Ubuntu Oneiric) "Debian/sid and oneiric based builds fail" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/79113415:40
slangasekbarry: assigned to you, summary comment added15:40
slangasekbarry: ideally we would SRU this as well, for the benefit of anyone who might actually want to use sbuild for building in chroots for a different release than the one they're running :)15:41
cjwatsonev: could you take the ubiquity console expander bug bdmurray pointed out?15:41
barryi'll be rebuilding my sbuild environment today, so it'll be a good time to look at it ;/15:41
slangasekbarry: ah, then you'll have ample opportunity to confirm the bug :-)15:41
evthough I wont touch it until FF. It's not a critical bug, as far as I can tell15:42
cjwatsonno, medium (I think correctly)15:42
* slangasek eyes the daily dist-upgrade, getting wedged on sun-java downloads that don't want to complete15:42
slangasekbdmurray: that all the bugs?15:43
slangasekum.  worse than "don't want to complete", I just saw the download counter roll backwards15:43
slangasekmvo: I think I have an update-manager bug to report ;)15:43
bdmurrayslangasek: well not *all* the bugs but the ones that appeared on my radar this week15:43
slangasekbdmurray: :)15:44
slangasek[TOPIC] AOB15:44
MootBotNew Topic:  AOB15:44
evslangasek: so, out of random curiosity, what are your thoughts on using the Windows NT PAM module in, say, Wubi?15:44
mvoslangasek: *ick* it rolls *backwards* ?15:44
* ev ducks15:44
slangasekmvo: yes, it went from 'Downloaded 25.1 MB of 28.7 MB' to 'Dowloaded 24.8 MB of 28.7 MB'15:44
slangasekmvo: it is now at 'Downloaded 33.1 MB of 28.7 MB' :)15:44
slangasek33.4 ... 33.5 ... 33.6 ... 33.5....15:45
mvohahaa, woah15:45
slangaseknow it's finally decided it's finished :-)15:45
mvothat is on a amd64, right?15:45
slangasekev: so, ah, I would defer to the security team on this15:45
slangasekmvo: yep15:45
evslangasek: well played15:45
evit's seemingly the only thing standing between me and single click wubi installations.15:46
evso I'm just toying around with the idea15:46
slangasekev: there should be an analysis of whether the default hashes used by Windows there are as strong as what we get by default with pam_smbpasswd, which we *do* pull in by default whenever filesharing is turned on15:46
ev(see: not for oneiric)15:46
evto be clear, is there just the one that comes from Microsoft's Services for UNIX, or is there an open source implementation kicking about?15:47
slangasekev: however, *I* am not opposed to the idea in principle; I did, after all, implement pam_smbpasswd with its 'migrate' option15:47
evyay, that I like to hear15:47
slangasekoh, I don't know if there's an open source one15:47
slangasekI thought you had one in mind15:47
slangasekpam_smbpasswd could do it, if samba were wired up to support reading directly from the Windows database15:48
slangasekbut I don't know the database format15:48
slangasekI think the person to talk to about this is probably Simo Sorce at Red Hat15:48
slangasek(Samba Team member)15:48
evmind you, I'm not opposed to using Microsoft's15:49
evif they wrote it, chances are it works15:49
slangasekbut I'm guessing its license isn't GPL-compatible :-)15:50
evpish tosh15:50
evneither is Broadcom's15:50
slangasekbut PAM modules we configure by default get intentionally loaded into memory by every authentication-using application on the system, many of which are GPL15:51
evah, damn15:51
* ev shakes his fist at Stallman15:51
MootBotMeeting finished at 10:53.15:53
slangasekthanks, everyone!15:53
=== Andre_Go` is now known as Andre_Gondim
jibelhggdh, patrickmw pedro_ bdmurray Ursinha charlie-tca meeting time ?17:01
jibelhello pedro_17:01
* patrickmw waves17:01
bdmurrayoh hai17:01
* pgraner waves17:02
jibelhggdh, you're chairing today17:02
jibelyou volunteered, remember ?17:02
patdk-wkoh, wrong channel :)17:02
jibelI'll do, hggdh to chair next meeting17:04
MootBotMeeting started at 12:04. The chair is jibel.17:04
MootBotCommands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]17:04
jibel[topic] Previous Actions17:04
MootBotNew Topic:  Previous Actions17:04
jibelno actions from previous meeting.17:04
jibel[topic] Community Efforts/Testing17:05
MootBotNew Topic:  Community Efforts/Testing17:05
pgranerjibel, question, I saw a bug day announcement go out with no test in the body of the email, might need a resend?17:05
pgranerpedro_, sent it out I think17:06
jibelpedro_ resent it.17:06
jibelthere is a bug in evolution17:06
pedro_pgraner, it was re sent already, is an evolution bug17:06
bdmurrayI don't thnk the resend went to ubuntu-devel-announce17:06
pedro_its sending empty body messages...17:06
pgranerpedro_, cool then it hasn't made it to me yet17:06
jibelpedro_, did you resent to ubuntu-devel-announce ?17:06
pedro_jibel, yes17:07
jibelpedro_, thanks.17:07
pedro_it was re sent to the same mailing lists17:07
pedro_looks like evolution really want me to switch to thunderbird :-P17:07
bdmurrayI'll check the moderation queue then17:08
jibelLast week was Oneiric Alpha217:08
jibelYou'll find the results at [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/ReleaseReports/OneiricAlpha2TestReport17:08
jibelnot much to add, please read the results and if you have questions just ask.17:09
pgranerOne quick note, I  have had several developers contact me with good words about the testing this cycle17:09
pgraner* No critical issues requiring a late respin17:09
pgraner* No installer issues17:09
pgranerdue to the automated testing17:09
pgranerall were caught and fixed prior17:10
pgranerGreat work!17:10
pedro_awesome \o/17:10
jibelyay, that's good to see the result of our testing effort \o/17:11
jibelNext week, we will test 10.04.3 and there will be no automation.17:12
jibelthere are still some SRUs to verify http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/pending-sru.html17:12
jibelpatrickmw, ?17:12
jibelpatrickmw, We are all ears17:13
patrickmwI'm glad you mentioned the lack of testing.17:13
patrickmwDo we have older lucid tests?17:13
jibelthe automated test doesn't run on Lucid and we estimated that it was a lot of work to backport them to lucid for 2 point releases only17:15
patrickmwthe reason I ask is that we will be adding kernel sru tests for LTS.  just wondering if I could add things while I was at it17:15
patrickmwok, fair enough17:15
jibelkernel SRU is a different thing, it has to be done on a very regular basis, next week we'll be testing ISOs that happens every 6 months for an LTS17:16
jibelskaet, ?17:17
skaetwould just like to encourage any one with the right hardware and spare cycles to help with the verification.17:17
skaetThere are some old bugs that seem to be lingering in the pending-sru.html list that would be good to get fixed and out with 10.04.317:18
jibelindeed. If you're willing to help the first images of 10.04.3 landed today on cdimage.u.c17:18
jibelonly powerpc is available at the moment.17:19
jibelSo keep monitoring http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/lucid/ for other images.17:19
jibelAnd to second what skaet said, you don't need to wait next week to start smoketesting the images.17:19
jibelStill on community testing, but another area: nVidia/ATI proprietary drivers testing.17:20
jibelWe sent a call for testing proprietary graphics driver today.https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Testing/ProprietaryDrivers/Oneiric/VideoDrivers17:20
jibelIf you have an nVidia (GeForce 6 or higher) or ATI (R600 or higher) graphics card you can help with testing the drivers in Oneiric and report rthe results to the tracker http://xorg.qa.ubuntu.com17:20
jibelAny question or comment ?17:22
jibel[topic] Automated/Systems Testing17:23
MootBotNew Topic:  Automated/Systems Testing17:23
jibelpatrickmw, the floor is yours17:23
patrickmw= QA Lab =17:23
patrickmw* Albali is configured as an additional Jenkins slave17:23
patrickmw* Naartjie is next.  Need access to Remote KVM (appears to be locked.)  I've been in contact with IS about the issue.17:23
patrickmw 17:23
patrickmw= Kernel SRU =17:23
patrickmw* Proposed branch for merge to allow -proposed update testing17:23
patrickmw* add QRT tests when ppa is complete17:23
patrickmw* add lucid (updates and proposed)17:23
patrickmw 17:23
patrickmw= Ubiquity Testing =17:23
patrickmw* Pending status on Evan. I've contacted him this week.17:23
patrickmw 17:23
patrickmw= Upgrade Testing =17:23
patrickmw* Albali is ready for Michael to migrate the update test framework.  He is aware and will inform me when he's ready.17:23
patrickmw 17:23
patrickmw= DX Testing =17:23
patrickmw* Alex provided a list of packages with build-time tests.17:23
patrickmw* We will be having a further discussion on tests with specific graphics hardware requirements17:23
patrickmw 17:23
patrickmw= IPv6 Testing =17:24
patrickmw* Working with Foundations team.  Test plan is complete.17:24
patrickmw* Stefane is completing work on the framework.17:24
patrickmw 17:24
patrickmw= Other projects =17:24
patrickmw* Wubu - jibel is the owner17:24
patrickmw* Boot metrics - pending17:24
patrickmw* Ubuntu packages - pending17:24
patrickmw 17:24
hggdhI have a merge to propose for the server mail test; will do it today17:25
* hggdh begs pardon, had a bit of an emergency at home17:25
jibelno question, moving on17:26
jibel[topic] Engineering Team Bug Status  pedro_ bdmurray Ursinha17:26
MootBotNew Topic:  Engineering Team Bug Status  pedro_ bdmurray Ursinha17:26
pedro_As you might know already we're having a bug day for the GNOME Control Center  tomorrow https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay/2011071417:26
pedro_the purpose of that bug day is to triage + fix bugs on the new control center17:27
pedro_rodrigo who is the maintainer in both Ubuntu and at the upstream project is going to be around to help17:27
pedro_so if you have questions just ask those at #ubuntu-bugs or #ubuntu-desktop17:27
pedro_remember, the whole day tomorrow your timezone17:28
bdmurrayadded bug reporting guidelines for ubuntu-meta17:28
bdmurrayfsys-tarfile-error apport package bug report cleanup17:28
bdmurrayapt branch blocking of fsys tarfile error package install failures17:29
bdmurrayupdated ubiquity apport package hook to ask permission before adding debug log and block SQUASHFS error bug reports17:29
bdmurrayreview and approval of 2 new Ubuntu Bug Control members17:29
bdmurrayadded in iso-testing bug reports to the package status pages17:29
bdmurrayudw class prep and  presentation regarding working with apport bugs17:29
bdmurrayI also fixed a bug in pm-utils that was preventing things from inhibiting suspend - bug 66565117:30
ubottuLaunchpad bug 665651 in pm-utils "pm-utils does not follow requests to inhibit suspend/hibernate from scripts in /etc/pm/sleep.d" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/66565117:30
bdmurrayHowever, this means that some things like a script in toshset would inhibit suspend all the time17:31
bdmurraySo I fixed that too17:31
bdmurrayPoint being if you see any weird suspend regression bugs let me know17:31
UrsinhaI've been basically boostraping in the ubuntu server team17:32
Ursinhaam working to give them the basics, such as an SRU report for the packages we care about17:32
Ursinhareading what we already have, and modifying for us17:33
Ursinhabtw, if any of you are using scripts to generate reports that aren't in the BugSquad page, please, let me know17:34
jibelDo you reused this report http://people.canonical.com/~chucks/SRUTracker/ to tracker server SRUs?17:35
Ursinhajibel: it's not working, just fixed what was stopping that from producing the reports17:35
jibelok thanks17:36
jibelany other question ?17:36
Ursinhathanks for pointing that anyway, jibel17:36
jibel[topic] Other Topics17:37
MootBotNew Topic:  Other Topics17:37
jibelany other topic you'd like to talk about ?17:37
jibellast topic then17:38
jibel[topic] Chair Selection17:38
MootBotNew Topic:  Chair Selection17:38
jibelhggdh you volunteer again ?17:38
hggdhjibel: yes, I do :-)17:38
jibelThanks hggdh , I'll be prepared next time then!17:39
* charlie-tca made it, finally17:39
jibelcharlie-tca, want to add a word before ending the meeting ?17:39
charlie-tcaCan't think of anything, other than we all know desktop images for oneiric are broken for a week now, right?17:40
jibelYes all desktop images are broken for a week. I don't remember the package that causes this though.17:41
jibelThanks all for attending17:41
MootBotMeeting finished at 12:41.17:41
charlie-tcajibel: that /run/udev thingy17:41
charlie-tcaI think17:41
jibelcharlie-tca, oh yeah the /run transition17:41
jibelit's part of it.17:42
charlie-tcaI just keep seeing people surprised to know they have been broken for so long, when they should have known already17:42
Ursinhacharlie-tca: what do you mean by broken? not installing? borked X?17:45
charlie-tcaThere has not been a new image since july 517:45
charlie-tcaas in, none17:45
charlie-tcaThey can't even create one17:46
jibelUrsinha, and users who upgraded their system ended up with no keyboard and mouse. pitti fixed it on monday17:48
Ursinhajibel: I proved that bug myself :)17:48
Ursinhalast update fixed that though17:48
charlie-tcaBut we still have no desktop images17:48
Ursinhahm, that's weird17:49
rsalvetithis is related with the bootstrap issue17:49
rsalvetibut still not yet applied :-(17:49
Ursinhathat's really bad17:49
Ursinhajibel: is this the bug preventing images to be generated?17:50
Ursinhaif so, I wonder why the fix wasn't applied yet17:50
rsalvetiprobably waiting slangasek to get the proper fix at the sysvinit package17:51
rsalvetibut still, we should fix it asap so we can at least generate images again17:51
slangasekI expect to land this all today17:51
slangasekjust have a few finishing touches to add17:51
slangaseknot being able to bootstrap is messy; not understanding what we've done and having bugs drag out until post-release would be worse :)17:52
UrsinhaI thought the problem was well known, so as the workaround proposed by the merge17:53
rsalvetithat was the quick workaround, until the proper transition changes were in place17:53
slangasekit's well *known*, but it's difficult to understand all the implications17:53
slangasekso since the migration has been Real Soon Now<tm> for 2 days, no one was willing to upload the workaround :)17:54
slangasek(i.e., cjwatson declined when I nudged him, which is sufficient justification for me to not try to talk anyone else into it ;)17:54
* Kreative` is away: Away19:17
=== yofel_ is now known as yofel
=== Quintasan_ is now known as Quintasan
=== arun__ is now known as arun_

Generated by irclog2html.py 2.7 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!