[00:02] <pook1e> Here it is, thanks RAOF. http://paste.ubuntu.com/649562/
[00:06] <RAOF> pook1e: Ah.  Apparently because the .pc has been renamed to indicator-0.4.pc, so the configure.ac check is now incorrect.
[00:07] <infinity> Because changing the name of your package every minor revision is a surefire way to make pkg-config useful.
[00:09] <pook1e> RAOF: The .pc of libindicator? So is there something I need to change in configure.ac of indicator-network?
[00:09] <RAOF> Yes.
[00:09] <infinity> Probably want to make indicator-network look in both locations (preferring the new one), for ease of backporting.
[00:16] <pook1e> Where would I change the name of the .pc file for libindicator then?
[00:17] <poolie> pook1e: i guess configure.ac has a pkgconfig line saying what packages it needs or wants
[00:17] <poolie> i don't think you refer to the name of the file directly
[00:19] <pook1e> I was looking at "PKG_CHECK_MODULES([INDICATOR], [indicator >= $INDICATOR_REQUIRED_VERSION])"
[00:20] <pook1e> Then there's also an indicator section where INDICATORDIR and INDICATORINCONSDIR are set.
[00:29] <RAOF> pook1e: “PKG_CHECK_MODULES([INDICATOR], [indicator >= $INDICATOR_REQUIRED_VERSION])” is (at least one of) the bit you want to edit.  A simple fix would be indicator→indicator-0.4; a better fix would be to add a 3rd parameter to the check so that PKG_CHECK_MODULES doesn't abort when it dosen't find the module and you can keep the existing checker as a fallback.
[00:34] <pook1e> ROAF: Ah I see, got it. Thanks everyone for your help, much appreciated!
[01:21] <pook1e> RAOF: I changed indicator -> indicator-0.4 in the configure.ac file and it still didn't work, stopped at the same place as last time. Any other ideas?
[01:24] <pook1e> Do I need to change indicatordir as well? I tried but that didn't seem to fix anything.
[01:30] <infinity> Hrm.  What happened to apt-listchanges and update-manager playing nicely? :/
[01:30] <infinity> (Or, rather, playing nicely even when output is set to pager...)
[03:36] <smoser> hallyn, http://package-import.ubuntu.com/status/
[03:59] <pitti> Good morning
[04:17] <poolie> o/ pitti
[04:17] <pitti> hey poolie, how are you?
[04:17] <poolie> great thanks
[04:20] <poolie> just qa'd https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/813349 so per-revision diffs will start appearing in merge proposal pages
[04:20] <poolie> (not deployed yet)
[04:20] <poolie> and then hopefully later other places
[04:28] <pitti> wow, it was hard? I just used to click on the revision numbers in the "unmerged revisions" on the MP pages
[04:29] <pitti> oh, inline
[04:34] <poolie> well, perhaps not impossibly hard :)
[04:34] <poolie> but, i think it's cooler this way
[04:34] <poolie> will be more so if we can start showing them in more places, and also file content
[05:19] <didrocks> good morning
[06:39] <Quintasan> Good morning.
[06:52] <RAOF> Are there any DDs here who'd like to review (and potentially sponsor) colord from alioth?
[06:54] <persia> RAOF, If you don't get a response in a while, #debian-ubuntu@OFTC tends to contain a few such willing sponsors.
[06:58] <RAOF> persia: Ta.
[07:03] <pitti> ♩ ♫ where have all the (PPA) buildds gone, long time passing ♫
[07:03] <pitti> ♬ when will they ever build ♭ ♩
[07:04] <RAOF> pitti: chrisccoulson hasn't woken up and firefoxed them to death? :)
[07:04] <pitti> RAOF: amd64 are being fta'ed actually
[07:04] <pitti> and the few remaining i386 are building a variety of things with 558 more jobs in the queue
[07:04] <RAOF> Whee!
[07:25] <chrisccoulson> hey RAOF!
[07:25] <chrisccoulson> i can run the firefox daily builds now if you like ;)
[07:26] <pitti> chrisccoulson: no, you can't, as they won't actually start today :)
[07:27] <chrisccoulson> oh, fantastic. they've all disappeared again :(
[07:27] <chrisccoulson> i need to think of a more reliable way of providing our daily builds. this seems to be a bi-weekly occurrence now
[07:28] <pitti> would biweekly builds of firefox and chromium perhaps suffice?
[07:28] <pitti> especially for releases like maverick which few, if any developer use any more?
[07:29] <micahg> those builds are for users as well, not just devs
[07:30] <pitti> yes, but the kind of people running lucid today are certainly not the kind who want to live on the bleeding edge?
[07:30] <pitti> just asking whether two updates a week might suffice for these
[07:31] <chrisccoulson> i think fta got some numbers somehow, which indicated that the number of people using chromium daily builds on lucid was actually still quite high
[07:31] <chrisccoulson> not sure how he figured that out
[07:31] <chrisccoulson> but it was a 5 figure number anyway
[07:31] <micahg> he used the launchpad PPA stats
[07:31] <chrisccoulson> and we have people from mozilla using our daily builds too (and they tend to stick with older ubuntu releases)
[07:31] <persia> Do these people want "daily", or just "rather updated"?
[07:32] <pitti> just considering that building firefox and chromium every day for four releases pretty much takes about two buildds fulltime
[07:32] <micahg> pitti: and as long as I'm distracted, I'd be ok with doing a maverick jump to Firefox 6 the week of aug 21
[07:32] <micahg> at least through -proposed/-updates
[07:33] <persia> (as a side note, "biweekly" usually means once a fortnight)
[07:33] <pitti> ah, I meant "semiweekly" then
[07:33] <persia> Indeed you did :)
[07:33] <pitti> persia: thanks
[07:33] <pitti> heck -- "every three days"
[07:34] <persia> I suspect most lucid users would prefer semiweekly, as "every three days" tends to wander over the week, making it unpredictable in practice if one isn't paying careful attention.
[07:34] <persia> chrisccoulson, While tens of thousands of daily PPA users seems reasonable: how many of them actually update every day?
[07:35] <chrisccoulson> in any case, i'd rather not provide builds at all than provide them twice per week. things change so frequently on trunk that having people running a build that's 2 days out-of-date isn't really all that useful (to us or mozilla). they need to run the latest code before reporting any bugs for example
[07:35] <chrisccoulson> (and it's the first thing they'll be asked to do)
[07:35] <chrisccoulson> persia, see my last comment :)
[07:35] <Daviey> persia: You know biweekly definition is widely disputed?
[07:35] <chrisccoulson> people shouldn't be running daily builds if they aren't updating daily IMO
[07:36] <chrisccoulson> they should use something like beta instead
[07:36] <persia> Daviey, I'm a grammarian.  Experimental linguistics is doing it wrong.
[07:36] <persia> chrisccoulson, Makes sense.  How many of the tens of thousands of users appear to be submitting useful bugs that affect daily/lucid?
[07:36] <micahg> pitti: did you catch my comment about Firefox 6 for maverick? (in response to the langpack query yesterday)
[07:37] <pitti> micahg: yes, I did; thanks
[07:37] <chrisccoulson> persia, good question ;)
[07:37] <persia> chrisccoulson, To ask it differently: how many of those submitted bugs are ones you care about enough to do something with them?
[07:37] <dholbach> good morning
[07:38] <persia> It may be exceedingly hard to track the users, but it ought be relatively easy to track the effect of those users on your workflow.
[07:38] <chrisccoulson> persia, i generally care about any bug submitted against the daily and aurora builds, as that's the correct time for people to report bugs (before the packages end up in the distro)
[07:38] <persia> If they are a major contributor of useful-work-to-be-done, then they should be kept.  If they aren't, you might wonder if you want the extra bug traffic.
[07:39] <persia> chrisccoulson, Running on which platform?  All?
[07:39] <chrisccoulson> persia - i'm not sure. our apport hook is broken for the daily builds, so i don't have that information
[07:40] <persia> Oh, nevermind then.  I suspect that with current information, it's undecidable.
[07:41] <micahg> chrisccoulson: we never figured out what to do with that since a config file that points to the same project needs to be shipped in multiple source packages
[07:47] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, i guess i'll figure that out at some point, when i get some time
[07:49] <brendand> i have a newly installed system which is being tested automatically and i want to use nm to connect to a pre-specified AP - does anyone know which file the config needs to go in?
[07:49] <micahg> chrisccoulson: there's an open bug in the ppa-bugs project assigned to me, feel free to grab it
[07:53] <micahg> can I get someone to accept the tasks for me on bug 814464 please?
[07:56] <RAOF> micahg: Done.
[07:56] <micahg> RAOF: thanks!
[08:17] <Riddell> Hobbsee: happy birthday
[08:34] <dholbach> Hobbsee, happy birthday! :)
[08:36] <dholbach> Riddell, why do the branches in your MPs for u-p-g depend on each other? like the one on chroots?
[08:36] <geser> Hobbsee: happy birthday
[08:37] <dholbach> Riddell, I'd love to review and merge a few of them, but I'd prefer if somebody like barry, jelmer or james_w could check out the UDD-specific bits
[08:37] <Riddell> dholbach: the first few needed to depend on each other, then it just became a habit
[08:37] <dholbach> ok
[08:38] <dholbach> you know what - I'll see what I can review, add my comment and you can merge them in one go if one of the others reviewed the UDD bits
[09:05] <poolie> dholbach: wow nice post about "what i like least"
[09:05] <poolie> hooray for actually making use of gathered data
[09:06] <dholbach> poolie, diwic asked the question :)
[09:33] <jelmer> pitti: hi
[09:33] <pitti> hey jelmer
[09:33] <jelmer> pitti: should I be setting verification-done for bugs in bzr SRUs? The wiki page says it will be done by the SRU team.
[09:33] <pitti> jelmer: if you test it, sure
[09:33] <jelmer> pitti: Ok - thanks!
[09:44] <ohsix> christ the 9 series compiz is not good; touching anything in ccsm is usually a crash and it's very hard to get it to go back to the settings you had just before you clicked on said thing
[10:28] <Amoz> dholbach, merge merge
[10:43] <dholbach> ehy Amoz
[10:46] <Amoz> dholbach, you want me to delete the javascript stuff?
[10:47] <dholbach> Amoz, yeah, I think that'd be good
[10:47] <dholbach> I'can we disable search somehow completely?
[10:47] <Amoz> whyyyy
[10:48] <Amoz> sure can, but why? :P
[10:51] <Amoz> dholbach, I mean, isn't it good to have a search function? :P
[10:51] <dholbach> if it doesn't work? :)
[10:52] <Amoz> dholbach, it worked with the basic theme, so it's just a small thing somewhere
[10:52] <Amoz> dholbach, we just need to ask the sphinx devs for how to update the searchindex.js or something
[10:52] <Amoz> developers make stuff work ;D
[10:53] <dholbach> http://people.canonical.com/~dholbach/packaging-guide/html/search.html?q=something&check_keywords=yes&area=default looks a bit funny :)
[10:55] <Amoz> sure does,  but it works
[10:57] <Amoz> and hopefully that's a bug being fixed upstreams sooner or later, so why remove the search function if it (kind of) works... you're not Steve Jobs now ;)
[10:57] <Amoz> but that's just me
[10:58] <Amoz> very easy to put a visibility:none; property on the search box
[10:58] <Amoz> and remove it when/if we get it to work
[10:58] <dholbach> I just thought that it'd be the easiest work-around for now because 1) it doesn't work, 2) it duplicates jquery.js and other pieces which are part of other packages already
[10:59] <dholbach> if we want to get it into the archive at some stage it'd be good not to duplicate those
[11:01] <Amoz> dholbach, you're thinking about distributing the html-version as a package?
[11:02] <dholbach> Amoz, it's already in a PPA
[11:03] <Amoz> dholbach, yeah but do one have to generate it manually?
[11:03] <dholbach> hm?
[11:03] <dholbach> you just have to install the package
[11:04] <dholbach> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-packaging-guide-team/+archive
[11:04] <Amoz> and then isn't the PDF better to use for offline usage? but still you have a point with the jquery stuff anyway
[11:07] <Amoz> so you want to remove the jquery and the search box for now?
[11:07] <Amoz> then the layout should be fine again
[11:07] <Amoz> dholbach, anything else before the merge?
[11:07] <dholbach> I'd be happy - I'll talk to tumbleweed and Laney before again
[11:08] <dholbach> when you're done, can you hit "resubmit proposal"?
[11:08] <Amoz> sure
[11:09] <dholbach> great, thanks Amoz!
[11:22] <Amoz> dholbach, I made the ToC box static in width, so the layout won't bug out sometimes
[11:25] <Amoz> dholbach, proposed!
[11:26] <tumbleweed> dholbach, Amoz: I'm about to hop on a plane to debconf, but I was pretty happy with it
[11:26] <tumbleweed> biggest issue I see is the double copyright footer
[11:26] <Amoz> ah
[11:26] <Amoz> which one should be there then?
[11:27] <Amoz> Ubuntu devs, or canonical?
[11:27] <tumbleweed> probably just the sphinx-generated one
[11:27] <tumbleweed> Ubuntu devs, yes
[11:29] <Amoz> hmm
[11:30] <Amoz> looks ugly
[11:34] <Amoz> dholbach, now check it!
[11:35] <Amoz> I did some border-radius on the ToC
[11:36] <Amoz> maybe it's not allowed to change the styling just like that, dunno how strict it is. but looks nico imo
[11:37]  * Amoz goes lunching
[11:37] <dholbach> Amoz, enjoy - I'll have a look and comment on it - do you know if any of the javascript stuff is necessary right now?
[11:38] <dholbach> nevermind, I'll comment on the merge proposal
[11:50] <Amoz> dholbach, the whole js import loop should be uncommented
[11:50] <Amoz> so no js at all
[11:50] <dholbach> Amoz, but they're still in the branch
[11:50] <Amoz> ah
[11:50] <Amoz> yeah
[11:50] <Amoz> true
[11:50] <dholbach> and every file we add needs to be documented in terms of copyright and license
[11:50] <Amoz> I just remove the
[11:50] <Amoz> codeeee
[11:51] <Amoz> ah yeah, I might have added those manually ..
[11:51] <dholbach> cool
[11:51] <Amoz> I'll remove the jquery then
[11:52] <Amoz> but the rest should be there if we want to start using the js again. I think there's a lot of other stuff using js actually
[11:52] <dholbach> really?
[11:53] <Amoz> dholbach, looks like it yeah
[11:53] <Amoz> see the doctools.js
[11:53] <Amoz> but it's depending on jquery I guess
[11:55] <dholbach> ok, I need to go - I'll be back later
[12:12] <Hobbsee> Riddell, dholbach, geser: Thanks!  :)
[12:24] <Amoz> dholbach, I guess we could make it a child theme to the basic theme, just keeping the modifier layout.html, and so on
[12:31] <dholbach> Amoz, that sounds interesting
[12:47] <Amoz> dholbach, is there a way to diff all files in a given dir with another dir?
[12:47] <dholbach> Amoz, diff -ruN dir1 dir2
[12:48] <Amoz> no r
[12:48] <Amoz> don't want the underdirs
[12:52] <apw> pitti, did modem-manager get subsumed by somethign
[12:52] <apw> pitti, ignore me, found it
[12:53] <Amoz> dholbach, there
[12:53] <Amoz> dholbach, check it
[12:54] <smoser> @pilot in
[13:09] <pitti> apw: no, it still exists
[13:09] <apw> pitti, yeah i was being a 'tard
[13:11] <tseliot> ogra_: ping
[13:12] <slangasek> jelmer: so the bzr-svn packge branch FTBFS for me, but it doesn't look like a segfault; am I looking in the right place?
[13:14] <jelmer> slangasek: how does it FTBFS for you, and what are you building on?
[13:19] <slangasek> jelmer: oneiric clean chroot, hand-build with bzr bd, fails with http://paste.ubuntu.com/649954/
[13:23] <barry> dholbach, Riddell i'll do some branch reviews this morning
[13:23] <jelmer> slangasek: it builds fine outside of a chroot here on oneiric too, but I get the segfault on sid
[13:23] <dholbach> barry, awesome!
[13:23]  * dholbach hugs smoser
[13:23] <dholbach> Amoz, looking
[13:23] <jelmer> slangasek: that particular failure appears related to some upstream svn changes
[13:23] <slangasek> jelmer: oh, so the segfault is sid-only? ok
[13:24] <slangasek> jelmer: what about the build failure I *am* seeing in oneiric chroot?
[13:24] <jelmer> slangasek: that particular failure appears related to some upstream svn changes
[13:24] <slangasek> oh
[13:24] <slangasek> well, hmm
[13:25]  * jelmer ponders uploading to oneiric or figuring out what the issue is on sid
[13:26] <slangasek> well, an upload to oneiric would be helpful to me in the meantime
[13:26] <slangasek> my home build server has helpfully just gone offline so I need to cook another sid chroot locally before I can look at the other issue
[13:32] <Amoz> i *hate* it when that happens.. home server offline -> not able to seed the new 10.04.3 release :(
[13:48] <hallyn> hm, qemu-kvm in lucid-updates is at 0.12.3+noroms-0ubuntu9.12, but when i tried to push 0.12.3+noroms-0ubuntu9.13 to lucid-proposed it said that exists.  I take it that would be because such a version failed testing at some point?
[14:02] <Daviey> hallyn: erm, you uploaded .13
[14:03] <Daviey> hallyn: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+source/qemu-kvm/0.12.3+noroms-0ubuntu9.13
[14:03] <Daviey> "moved to -updates" seems to have not happend.
[14:04] <Amoz> dholbach, here again
[14:05] <hallyn> Daviey: wtf?
[14:05] <hallyn> Daviey: i was going on rmadison output and https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+queue?queue_state=4&queue_text=qemu-kvm.
[14:05] <hallyn> Daviey: so how does that go wrong in the first place, and how do we fix it?
[14:08] <Daviey> hallyn: I'd check with pitti, it looks like it wasn't copied to -updates, but just deleted
[14:09] <pitti> hm?
[14:10] <Daviey> pitti: see above ^^
[14:10] <pitti> in a bit
[14:33] <pitti> skaet: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Oneiric/LocalizedCDImageTools
[14:55] <pitti> hallyn, Daviey: (sorry, got caught into a meeting) hm, very strange indeed; but the associated bug 790145 doesn't actually have any testing results
[14:56] <pitti> so it shouldn't have gone into -updats
[14:56] <pitti> aah
[14:56] <pitti> Daviey, hallyn: I think it got superseded by the security  update, and the "packages to clean up" portion just got confused, so it was removed with a misleading comment
[14:57] <hallyn> pitti: but security update is 9.12, this is 9.13
[14:57]  * pitti sets the lucid task back to triaged, as it's not in -proposed
[14:58] <pitti> hm; I have absolutely no idea then
[14:58] <pitti> probably easiest to just reupload as .14, and then we accept it into -proposed
[14:58] <hallyn> pitti: lucid got testing results, maverick didn't.  That wouldn't hold it up right?
[14:58] <Amoz> dholbach, merged your branch now, and pushed
[14:58] <pitti> hallyn: no, the reporter said he tested 9.12, which was the security update; it didn't actually have the fix
[14:59] <hallyn> oh, i see
[14:59] <dholbach> Amoz, awesome - can you resubmit the proposal? I'll try to get others to review it as well :)
[14:59] <dholbach> then we can go and file bugs for all the stuff that needs changing
[14:59] <dholbach> but this is awesome :)
[14:59] <hallyn> pitti: ok, i'll resubmit as 9.14, but i will feel bad about the poor testers :)
[14:59] <dholbach> thanks again Amoz
[14:59] <jdstrand> pitti, hallyn: fyi, I have another security update I would like to get out. if you are re-uploading and restarting the 7 days, maybe hold off til I get my update published next week?
[15:00] <hallyn> jdstrand: for qemu-kvm?
[15:00] <jdstrand> hallyn: oh, I thought this was libvirt. forgive me. nothing planned here for qemu-kvm
[15:00] <hallyn> jdstrand: cool, thanks.
[15:01] <hallyn> pitti: do you mind then if i combine the fixes for bugs 790145 and 524447 into one -proposed upload?
[15:01] <pitti> hyperair: no, not at alal
[15:01] <pitti> "all"
[15:01] <pitti> bah, TGIF
[15:01] <pitti> hallyn: no, not at all
[15:01] <smoser> slangasek, or pitti could you take a look at my comment at https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/oneiric/mountall/oneiric-201106072111/+merge/63765
[15:01] <pitti> hyperair: ignore me, -ETAB
[15:02] <smoser> it looks like we can reasonably kill or merge that branch and kill it's entry in the sponsorship queue.
[15:02] <hallyn> pitti: thx, on it
[15:03] <Amoz> dholbach, proposed like a boss
[15:03]  * dholbach hugs Amoz
[15:03] <barry> Riddell, dholbach i've reviewed your mps.  really great work, thanks.  a few are marked 'needs fixing' just to address a couple of minor issues, but the others are approved.  Riddell can you land them yourself?
[15:03] <Amoz> what is a mps? :)
[15:03] <dholbach> barry, Riddell: awesome!
[15:03] <dholbach> great work!
[15:04] <dholbach> Amoz, mp = merge proposal
[15:04] <Amoz> lol, ofc
[15:04] <barry> Amoz: what's lol ofc?  (jk! :)
[15:05] <Amoz> barry, I'm sure you heard about google  ;D
[15:05] <Amoz> you've
[15:05] <barry> Amoz: i heard that's some kind of social network thing?  :)
[15:05] <Amoz> :D
[15:06] <jdstrand> seb128: hey, so what is the status of evolution in oneiric? I've heard it was horribly broken not too long ago
[15:06] <dholbach> Amoz, there's small conflict in your index.rst (because of changes that happened in lp:ubuntu-packaging-guide in the meantime, but I'll go and fix it)
[15:06] <Amoz> barry, I thought that was called basefook?
[15:06] <dholbach> tumbleweed was generally happy with it as well, so that should be good enough to land it
[15:07] <Amoz> aaw
[15:07] <barry> Amoz: i preferr bassfunk :)
[15:07] <dholbach> daker did a review of the theme stuff some days ago and said that apart from a few nitpicks he was happy as well
[15:07] <seb128> jdstrand, hi, it's working fine but calendar is slow (which is not new in oneiric if you are already on that serie) and has issue rendering some gpg signed emails (but doing a "view source" let you read those as a workaround)
[15:07] <Amoz> barry, bookface
[15:07] <barry> :)
[15:07] <seb128> jdstrand, i.e the gpg issue is a rendering one, the email is actually fine and you can ctrl-u on those and read the source
[15:07] <jdstrand> seb128: thanks
[15:08] <Amoz> barry, I can't help but think of Poland when I see your name
[15:08] <barry> Amoz: me too!  long twisted family history, there :)
[15:08] <jdstrand> seb128: I see. I've got some concerns about evo maintenance if/when we move to tbird since we always seem to have evo bugs during devel. what is your take on this?
[15:09] <jdstrand> (iirc, it won't drop from main because we have too many users)
[15:09] <dholbach> Amoz, bug fixed! good work!
[15:10] <seb128> jdstrand, I'm not sure to understand the question sorry, usually bugs and fixes are coming from upstream, we will keep follow the upstream updates as it's part of GNOME so I don't think the default choice makes any difference on how well it's maintained
[15:11] <Amoz> dholbach, très bien
[15:11] <Amoz> does this mean it's merging into the trunk now?
[15:11] <jdstrand> seb128: that actually answered my question. my concern is that if we spent resources on maintaining evo beyond what you just said, those would be diverted to tbird and evo would not be in as good of shape
[15:12] <jdstrand> s/concern is/concern was/
[15:12] <dholbach> Amoz, bon travail, mon ami!
[15:12] <Amoz> ^^
[15:12] <Amoz> sehr gut!
[15:13] <Amoz> dholbach, so.. what's next? :)
[15:14] <dholbach> ok, line up every one, Amoz wants a new project to work on!
[15:14]  * Amoz sneaks away..
[15:14] <seb128> jdstrand, ok ;-)
[15:15] <seb128> jdstrand, well, we do spend some time doing the evolution updates, forwarding bugs upstream and fixing some issues when needed but I think we will keep doing that as part of the GNOME work, I don't see the GNOME maintainers we have work on tb
[15:15] <seb128> out of chrisccoulson
[15:16] <seb128> so I don't think tb by default divert efforts from evo, the low amount of work we put in it will probably remain about the same
[15:16] <jdstrand> seb128: thanks. that is reassuring :)
[15:16] <chrisccoulson> i wouldn't say no to any help with thunderbird maintenance though :P
[15:16] <seb128> yw ;-)
[15:17] <seb128> chrisccoulson, and I wouldn't say no to a million dollars
[15:17] <tgardner> slangasek, cjwatson: is xen hypervisor installation on your radar for 11.10 ?
[15:17] <chrisccoulson> lol
[15:17] <seb128> ;-)
[15:17] <chrisccoulson> firefox and thunderbird are a beast, and i feel like i'm the only person maintaining them ;)
[15:17] <seb128> we are lucky to have you ;-)
[15:18] <chrisccoulson> heh :)
[15:22] <pitti> ogasawara: wrt to the kernel release, can you please ensure that a kernel is NEWed before you uploaded the -meta?
[15:22] <pitti> it rendered the CDs and kernel uninstallable yesterday
[15:22] <ogasawara> pitti: will do
[15:22] <slangasek> smoser: followed up on the merge request
[15:22] <pitti> I binNEWed it then, but it's easy to avoid; just poke any archive admin
[15:22] <pitti> ogasawara: thanks!
[15:22] <slangasek> tgardner: xen> not on my radar, at least
[15:24] <smoser> slangasek, thanks. now, just curious, what sets perms on /run/lock ?
[15:24] <smb> tgardner, You sort of just install server and then the xen hypervisor and utils
[15:24] <slangasek> smoser: the kernel - tmpfs is 1777 by default when mounted
[15:24] <smoser> ah. wonder why keybuk added that mkdir -m then.
[15:25] <smoser> and you dont think 'nodev' is useful on /run ?
[15:26] <Amoz> this channel is english, no? why you speak chinese then?
[15:27] <slangasek> Amoz: this channel is for Ubuntu development; if you're bothered by technical discussions, this is probably not the channel you want to be on :)
[15:28] <Amoz> slangasek, so I guess this is serious friday? :(
[15:28] <slangasek> smoser: according to the original diff, he added the mkdir because he *wasn't* mounting /run/lock as a separate filesystem; but that's something we need to do to ensure !root users can't DoS /run
[15:28] <ScottK> mvo: Now that mpt has done his design work for https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-o-backports-ui I thought I'd check in with you and see what the chances of you having time to work on it soon are?
[15:28] <slangasek> (because tmpfs has no reserved blocks or quota handling)
[15:28] <slangasek> Amoz: casual, but serious
[15:28]  * mpt hides from mvo
[15:29] <smoser> slangasek, right.
[15:29] <ScottK> mpt: Thanks for taking care of it.
[15:29] <smoser> slangasek, so i cannot push to lp:ubuntu/mountall, or I would.  Do you want to do that, and then end that merge proposal with 'merged' ?
[15:32] <smoser> i'm willing to submit a merge proposal, but that ends up just making more work, not less.
[15:32] <ioport> ubuntu shut
[15:32] <ioport> shit
[15:33] <infinity> Classy.
[15:36] <tgardner> smb, do you remember how Hardy worked for Xen? Someone will have to add the dom0 choice back into the menu and twiddle the grub line appropriately.
[15:37] <smb> tgardner, At least the way I set it up was: do a server install and then install ubuntu-xen-server
[15:37] <tgardner> smb, so we don't have to do it at install time?
[15:37] <smb> tgardner, The grub line is already done in oneiric too
[15:38] <tgardner> I guess that makes 11.10 a bit easier
[15:38] <smb> tgardner, nope
[15:38] <smb> tgardner, After installing the hypervisor and tools in oneiric, you also get a xen dom0 grub section automatically
[15:38] <tgardner> smb, good. that makes life much simpler
[15:39] <smb> Yep, only small difference there is that in hardy it went to the top of selections while on oneiric its not. And on hardy we had an extra xen kernel while in oneiric its even simpler and just the server kernel
[15:41] <slangasek> smoser: yep, done!
[15:41] <smb> I just need to talk to zul next week about a possible tweak for the grub package. As I found it useful to have the option of having seperate commandlines for normal kernel boots and dom0 kernels
[16:09] <mvo> ScottK: lets see, its not that hard, but there are some gaps i nthe spec, I will talk to mpt about that
[16:10] <ScottK> mvo: Thanks.
[16:19] <Amoz> cjwatson, I heard you're good at ubiquity, maybe you could give me a hint how to solve the Orca bug, it reads out "Try $RELEASE".
[16:21] <pitti> good bye everyone, see you in two weeks!
[16:22] <nigelb> happy vacation pitti :)
[16:23] <pitti> thanks!
[16:37] <bdmurray> smoser: Could you sponsor my debdiff in bug 813282?
[16:38] <smoser> bdmurray, no.
[16:38] <smoser> but not because i dont want to. i dont have acl [yet].
[16:38] <bdmurray> smoser: ah, didn't know
[16:42] <dtchen> bdmurray: I'll look at it
[16:42] <bdmurray> dtchen: thanks!
[16:45] <jml> I've got two keys in my keyring with my email address. How does debuild decide which one to use by default?
[16:46] <infinity> jml: The first one it finds with "gpg --list-secret-keys email@address.com"
[16:46] <jelmer> jml: I think it just uses the first one, unless you set DEBSIGN_KEYID as environment variable or in ~/.devscripts
[16:46] <infinity> jml: You can specify "-k$ID" on the command line to pick one.
[16:46] <infinity> jml: Or set the variable, yes.
[16:47] <infinity> (I have to do this anyway, as my key doesn't actually have half the IDs I use in changelogs)
[16:48] <jono> folks, Mark Shuttleworth is doing a quick Q+A in #ubuntu-classroom on Freenode - ask questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat - go and ask him your questions!
[16:49] <jml> jelmer, infinity: thanks
[16:49] <jml> jelmer: I'm ashamed to say that ~/.devscripts doesn't exist on my system.
[16:49] <infinity> jml: It doesn't on mine either.
[16:49] <infinity> jml: I just export DEB* variables in my profile.
[16:49] <jelmer> jml: I only have one line there either. It says DEBSIGN_KEYID=1EEF5276
[16:49] <jml> jelmer: hah
[17:05] <Amoz> wow
[17:06] <Amoz> oh god
[17:06] <bdmurray> Where does the SRU team hang out?
[17:06] <Amoz> did I miss the Q+A with Mark =(
[17:07] <jelmer> bdmurray: I don't think they have their own channel, I usually just ping them in here.
[17:08] <ScottK> bdmurray: pitti is on vacation, so pinging SpamapS is probably your best bet.
[17:13] <SpamapS> bdmurray: sup?
[17:15] <bdmurray> SpamapS: I wasn't sure whether nor not to have a bug per patch / fix for an SRU.  However, since the test cases are different I decided to have a bug for each one.
[17:17] <SpamapS> bdmurray: that is the best way really. I'd rather we are slow getting an update out, but know when a regression was introduced, than have them all jumbled together.
[17:18] <bdmurray> SpamapS: okay thanks
[17:20] <smoser> @pilot out
[17:31] <jml> g'night all
[18:50] <SpamapS> seems like Xorg has been at 25 - 30 % CPU all day, even when idle..
[18:50] <SpamapS> fan has not turned off at all.. :-/
[19:01] <tkamppeter> It seems that the last update has switched thunderbird from 5 to 6 and now I cannot see my mail folders any more.
[19:02] <tkamppeter> Is this known?
[19:18] <Ampelbein> tkamppeter: I can't reproduce, tried imap with a courier-imapd and a dovecot-imapd, as well as local mail folders.
[19:23] <seb128> slangasek, there?
[19:23] <tkamppeter> Ampelbein, chrisccoulson has already helped me on #ubuntu-desktop. Thanks.
[19:36] <slangasek> seb128: heya
[19:43] <seb128> slangasek, mbiebl was wondering why you dropped the libgail-utils.la in gtk's multiarch patch but not ubuntu's upload
[19:46] <slangasek> seb128: because I did the Ubuntu upload first and further refined before submitting to Debian
[19:46] <slangasek> :)
[19:46] <seb128> mbiebl, ^
[19:47] <seb128> slangasek, that's ok, we were just discussing why there is the diff and why you didn't drop the gdk and gtk ones as well
[19:47] <seb128> since they were dependency_libs cleaned for a while they should be ok to drop in the upload
[19:49] <jdstrand> Daviey, hallyn: hey. was curious what happened with the libvirt verification?
[19:54] <slangasek> seb128: oh, well I have no idea why I didn't drop them all
[19:54] <slangasek> *that* would just be sloppiness on my part
[19:54] <seb128> slangasek, that's fine, we were just wondering if there was a reason we should know about ;-)
[19:55] <mbiebl> seb128, slangasek: as said, if the list of rdeps doesn't look to scary, I'll remove them all
[19:56] <slangasek> mbiebl: so in general, if the .la file is changing directories anyway, the dependency_libs revdeps are already broken by the change
[19:56] <Daviey> jdstrand: i sucked at testing it, i didn't get as far as finding the fault.  Seems i was using lxc wrong.
[19:56] <mbiebl> well, we could fix that up via a symlink
[19:56] <mbiebl> I remember us discussing that :-)
[19:57] <Daviey> jdstrand: I will strive to have another look over the weekend.
[19:57] <Daviey> (hallyn gave me updated instructions)
[19:58] <slangasek> mbiebl: ah, well, I've had that conversation a few times, don't remember who all with :)
[19:58] <jdstrand> Daviey: thanks
[20:00] <slangasek> mbiebl: the revdep lists for glib2.0 and gtk+2.0 are long enough that it's probably best to provide some compatibility
[20:00] <mbiebl> slangasek: I'm currently checking the list for library packages
[20:01] <slangasek> mbiebl: are you not just checking against http://release.debian.org/~aba/la/current.txt ?
[20:02] <mbiebl> I do, but not all of them build library packages
[20:02] <mbiebl> and only -dev packages are interesting, right
[20:03] <slangasek> mbiebl: yeah
[20:05] <mbiebl> slangasek: I'll just request a couple of binNMUs if the list is not to long and the packages are in a buildable state
[20:05] <mbiebl> too long, even
[20:05] <slangasek> ack
[20:09] <mbiebl> wow, sugar-toolkit is even worse the libdb
[20:09] <mbiebl> -84, -86, -88, -90, -92 ...
[20:10] <ScottK> Yup.
[20:10] <ScottK> lfaraone: ^^^
[20:11] <lfaraone> mbiebl: :D I apologize.
[20:11] <lfaraone> I stopped paying attention to Sugar last August and it probably is in a sorry state right now.
[20:12] <ScottK> Please at least clean things up.
[20:24] <SpamapS> Hrm.. OpenOffice is dying at a rapid pace for me. :(
[20:25]  * SpamapS is considering buying a new laptop that he can put Natty on, just so he can get actual work done.
[20:28] <SpamapS> oh cool.. when I strace it, it doesn't crash
[20:40] <Daviey> SpamapS: if you are struggling on disk io, like i am - i found the same experience with thunderbird.
[20:41] <mbiebl> slangasek, seb128: this seems to be the complete list of affected packages
[20:41] <mbiebl> http://paste.debian.net/123817/
[20:41] <mbiebl> all but two are currently ftbfs
[20:42] <SpamapS> Daviey: I'm struggling with almost every single piece of the system at this point. I also can't boot w/o booting to recovery console first.
[20:42] <seb128> mbiebl, doesn't seem worth keeping the .la
[20:42] <mbiebl> those packages look pretty unmaintained
[20:42] <Daviey> SpamapS: is this your mbp?
[20:42] <slangasek> mbiebl: hah, nice
[20:42] <SpamapS> Daviey: yes, its the only computer I own.
[20:43] <mbiebl> seb128: yeah, I won't fiddle around with symlinks
[20:43] <Daviey> SpamapS: yeah, i think there is a regression.. i'm getting dire disk io on mine.. although i think have different hardware versions.
[20:43] <SpamapS> unless you can't my "backup" desktop machine.. which is basically just an old G5 mac. :-/
[20:43] <SpamapS> Daviey: mine is a 5,1
[20:44] <mbiebl> seb128: that amount of breakage is acceptable imho
[20:44] <Daviey> SpamapS: 7,1 .. i would be suprised if it is related then.. but something isn't right.
[20:44] <seb128> mbiebl, yeah, I think so
[20:44] <SpamapS> Daviey: my only actual hardware problem is that nvidia twinview does not work in Unity.
[20:44] <Daviey> SpamapS: fancy swapping then? :)
[20:45] <SpamapS> Sure, I'll just drop it in the mail.
[20:46] <SpamapS> Anyway, I'm kind of freaking out now because LibreOffice is completely unusable and I have a presentation in < 1 week.
[20:46]  * SpamapS wonders if ratpoison will work.....
[20:50] <ScottK> SpamapS: Don't buy a new laptop, just get a spare hard drive and swap it out.
[20:51] <SpamapS> ScottK: I have been eyeing SSD's .....
[20:51] <ScottK> Once you go SSD, you'll never go back.
[20:51] <SpamapS> So, bug number 9 for me to discover/report this week is that Libreoffice only crashes in KDE
[20:51] <Laney> S5 is alright for presenting
[20:51] <ScottK> Hmmm.
[20:51] <SpamapS> I've gone to XFCE .. which seems to work w/ my multi monitor and not crash libreoffice.. :-P
[20:52] <Laney> if you don't want to use beamer, which is clearly the best ;-)
[20:52]  * SpamapS would use console presenter if dot's ascii graph generation were better. ;)
[20:52] <ScottK> Upload the preso to some cloud thingy.
[20:53] <SpamapS> Actually that might be a nice theme since my presentation is about a cli tool.. :)
[20:54] <SpamapS> I'm still confused why only the 'Ubuntu' session automatically starts ssh-agent
[20:55] <Laney> is it not provided by seahorse, a part of gnome?
[20:55] <SpamapS> Or is it that its the only one that actually tells it what ssh-askpass to use?
[20:55] <SpamapS> the agents are running, but not in the environment
[20:56] <SpamapS> weird..
[20:56]  * SpamapS plans a trip to Fry's to buy a new SSD tomorrow
[21:01] <SpamapS> ahh interesting.. neither xfce nor kde sets SSH_ASKPASS
[21:01] <Daviey> SpamapS: i'm not convinced having a faster disk will resolve this.  It's like putting more wood on the fire, without shutting the door :)
[21:01] <SpamapS> Daviey: Oh I'm not doing SSD to go faster. I'm doing it to go back to Natty.
[21:02] <Daviey> ah
[21:02] <Daviey> fair nuff
[21:02] <SpamapS> It saddens me to say it, but its costing me quite a bit more than 1 hour a week.
[21:10] <hallyn> SpamapS: i'd get an ssd, but all the horror stories leave me feeling like i'll just get one of the duds anyway, and i don't have time to research which ones are actually ok :)
[21:14] <SpamapS> I'll just get the 2nd most expensive one. :-P
[21:18] <SpamapS> Hrm, seems like there should be an svg to ascii converter
[22:09] <Amoz> SSD <3
[22:10] <Amoz> libreoffice will start in a flash
[22:10] <aroman> hi, what's the Mac version about? http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/oneiric/alpha-2/