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[16:45] <jledbetter> How do I get on the ops list for my loco channel? I'm leader of #ubuntu-us-va and need to keep poking others to change the topic.
[16:48] <Unit193> jledbetter: I would think you talk to stalcup or tarvid
[16:50] <jledbetter> Unit193, I'd have to get him to log on. Not sure who stalcup is.
[16:50] <jledbetter> Unit193, Is that the only way?
[16:50] <Unit193> User seen  : Jun 17 20:51:58 2011 (5 weeks, 1 day, 19:58:38 ago)
[16:51] <jtatum> jledbetter is the new team leader for virginia (elected)
[16:51] <jledbetter> Thank you for letting me know he logged in?
[16:51] <Tm_T> jledbetter: /msg chanserv access #channel list
[16:52] <jtatum> Tm_T: can't the council just change this?
[16:52] <Tm_T> change what?
[16:52] <jtatum> Tm_T: the access list for a channel.
[16:52] <jtatum> the folks that have +f are inactive
[16:52] <Tm_T> not just change it, that would be very rude
[16:53] <jtatum> pardon? jledbetter is the leader of the loco
[16:53] <jtatum> so… seems to me she should be able to request and get ops
[16:53] <jledbetter> It's alright. I'll email him and ask him to do whatever he needs to do. I just like to change the topic after meetings.
[16:53] <jtatum> check launchpad
[16:54] <Tm_T> hmm, does irc council have +f in the channel?
[16:54] <Tm_T> if not, there's not much the council itself can do
[16:54] <jtatum> ubuntu irc folks have chanserv privs to all #ubuntu- namespace channels
[16:55] <Tm_T> jtatum: elaborate?
[16:56] <jtatum> it's an officially registered namespace. folks that are designated can adjust access to anything in the namespace.
[16:56] <jtatum> "rude" or not :)
[16:56] <Tm_T> well, they can't unless they have +f, otherwise it needs freenode staff assisting (:
[16:58] <jtatum> no offense, Tm_T, but you frankly don't know what you're talking about heere
[16:59] <Tm_T> jtatum: hmmm, like to inform me then? I'm always eager to learn
[16:59] <jtatum> sure. read freenode policies on groups.
[16:59] <Tm_T> yes
[16:59] <Tm_T> I know
[16:59] <jtatum> http://freenode.net/group_registration.shtml
[17:00] <jledbetter> I've been struggling with this since I got the position. I'll email them again. /shrug
[17:00] <jtatum> see under "group registration provides"
[17:00] <Tm_T> but just like with irc cloaks, it needs freenode staff to do the actual work (:)
[17:00] <jtatum> only a group contact can get freenode staff to "do the actual work"
[17:00] <jtatum> hence… why asking here
[17:00] <Tm_T> jledbetter: as being a longtime ubuntu irc op and now loco leader: the request of loco leader (with possible support from the community, like quick asking in some medium if it's ok to proceed) would suffice to irc council to proceed on the matter (:
[17:00] <Tm_T> jtatum: I know (:
[17:01] <jtatum> if you know, why are you arguing that the loco leader can't get +f in the channel?
[17:01] <jtatum> and to ask freenode staff?
[17:01] <Tm_T> 1) I didn't know that was the case
[17:01] <Tm_T> 2) I'm not arguing against it (:
[17:03] <Tm_T> I think I'm just unnecessarily stucking to small details that don't really matter, a bad habit of mine
[17:04] <jtatum> no worries. this issue is a little frustrating to me personally. i've been trying to get jledbetter ops in the channel for a very long time.
[17:04] <Tm_T> aye, can undestand the issue very well
[17:04] <Tm_T> had several channels without ops for years, wasn't fun
[17:04] <jledbetter> I'll get it in time for my term to be over ;) /cackle
[17:05] <nhandler> jledbetter: I'm still seeing tarvid listed as the owner on LP. Is there anything to show that you are the actual leader?
[17:06] <jledbetter> nhandler, I was supposed to have owner switched? Hrm.
[17:06] <jledbetter> Hm... let me see if I can find the thread.
[17:06] <nhandler> jledbetter: That is typically what happens.
[17:07] <jledbetter> nhandler, That's what we get when we have two folks that don't know ;)
[17:08] <jledbetter> nhandler, Will this do? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/VirginiaTeam/MeetingMinutes  April 4 and log attached.
[17:22] <nhandler> jledbetter: It really isn't up to me on this particular issue (I'm not a GC). Essentially, you are trying to convince one of the GCs on the IRCC (who don't know the team) that you are the true leader. Once they are convinced, they can get staff to set you up with access (or you could simply get stalcup, tarvid (he can get you +F), panickedthumb, dwidmann, or panicked|eee to give you access
[17:23] <jledbetter> nhandler, Alright. I'll email again. I'm not sure who stalcup is but I have tarvid and panickedthumb's email addresses at least.
[17:23] <jledbetter> Thank you.
[17:23] <jtatum> is there a good way to contact the ircc?
[17:24] <nhandler> stalcup is Steve Stalcup (aka vorian). Not quite sure why he is on the access list (maybe with his ubuntu-us hat).
[17:24] <jledbetter> Ah ok
[17:25] <nhandler> jtatum: For this sort of thing, you can usually just request in here. We also have #ubuntu-irc-council if it is something private/confidential
[17:25] <jtatum> ok… consider it requested her
[17:25] <jtatum> e
[17:26] <nhandler> jussi, tsimpson, topyli, elky: ^ (jledbetter claims to be the new leader and wants access in #ubuntu-us-va . Linked to a meeting log posted on the wiki showing this.)
[17:26] <jtatum> jledbetter is the only active leader in -us-va. i can tell she is getting pretty frustrated by the terrible handover process. the old owner (tarvid) is a good guy but either doesn't know how or doesn't care to hand the reins over properly.
[17:27] <jledbetter> I've already emailed him and panickedthumb. Let's give them a chance. Maybe it was missed last few times.
[17:27] <jtatum> long story short - getting things changed (forums, irc, lp, mailing list) has been like pulling teeth. in fact so far none of those things have happened. not sure why it's so hard, as far as i can tell the result is going to be driving away the only active leadership in virginia
[17:28] <jledbetter> jtatum, Will give me time for other stuff ;)
[17:28] <nhandler> Usually, if you get the LP team transfered at the time of the leadership change, it makes getting the other things changed much easier.
[17:29] <jtatum> she got team admin, and it was believed that was enough
[17:29] <jledbetter> Is there a checklist of stuff? I didn't know and don't want the next person to go through this.
[17:29]  * popey notes that it's not compulsory that the team admin _is_ op of the irc channel
[17:29] <popey> or indeed the forums, launchpad or whatever else
[17:30] <jtatum> popey: of course not. but as it stands, she has to ask me to change the topic to indicate the next meeting time. i don't even live in virginia
[17:30] <popey> some teams like to have the leader be the "owner" of all resources, but it's not set in stone that it has to be the case
[17:30] <popey> heh, sure, that's sub-optimal
[17:30] <jtatum> none of the people who have access to any of these resources are active in the team
[17:30] <jtatum> so.. i'd say that's worse than sub-optimal
[17:31] <jtatum> for some of them, i doubt the admin is really needed. forums? probably never needed. i guess we could also clear the irc topic
[17:32] <jtatum> although that seems like a lame workaround to a problem that shouldn't be happening
[17:32] <jledbetter> I want to unsticky old topics and sticky new so forums is needed. I don't go there often but some do
[17:50] <nhandler> jledbetter: You should be all set
[17:51] <jledbetter> nhandler, With topic changing powers?
[17:51] <nhandler> 1311529895 12:51:35 -ChanServ(ChanServ@services.)- jledbetter has flags +votsriRfAF in #ubuntu-us-va because they are logged in as jledbetter.
[17:51] <tsimpson> all powers
[17:52] <jledbetter> nhandler, Thank you :) Yay! I really appreciate that. And I'm sure jtatum does too so I don't keep bugging him about changing the topic.
[17:53] <nhandler> jledbetter: This also means that you can clean up the access list for the channel. Might I suggest adding entries of *!*@freenode/staff/* and UbuntuIrcCouncil with flags of +votiA (that will let freenode staff and the IRCC help out in emergencies when no OPs are around)
[17:54] <jledbetter> nhandler, Alright, I'll do that.
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